I think Landry Jones is the most underrated Sooner of all time.

[LakeRat]

That is all.

[colleyvillesooner]

This will go well...

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I was guessing Jarrod Reese.

[goingoneight]

OU managed to win 10 games without a legit run game or a defense. Hmm... I wonder how they did that the last few years? LJ was never OU's problem. And if we have any struggle next year in LJ's place, people are going to dramatically realize how valuable he was.

[Curly Bill]

He wasn't OU's biggest problem this year by a long shot. But most underrated? LOL...if I'd had a drink of anything I'd have spit it all over my puter screen!

[stoops the eternal pimp]

It's a good thing we have a new thread to repeat ourselves in!

[Curly Bill]

It's a good thing we have a new thread to repeat ourselves in!

:D

[thecrimsoncrusader]

I think he is the most overrated. OU would have lots of all-time OU passing leaders in the Bob Stoops era if the QB played all 4 years. And the most winningest QB? He was also the most losingest QB. I won't realize how valuable Jones was next season after Blake Bell doesn't dive short of first downs, doesn't run out of bounds way too early, doesn't throw the ball away when he has 5 yards he can run for and still not make contact with an opposing player, etc. There is a golden rule in the game of football, never trust a QB that doesn't cuss!!! :devilish:

[Fraggle145]

http://media.247sports.com/Uploads/Boards/651/4651/357482.gif

[stoops the eternal pimp]

http://www.animated-gifs.eu/leisure-dance-men/0169.gif

[sooneredaco]

There is a golden rule in the game of football, never trust a QB that doesn't cuss!!! :devilish:

Kinda like my rule... Never trust someone who's first words out of their mouth when you meet them are "I'm a Christian"

[PLaw]

I think Landry Jones is the most under-appreciated Sooner of all time.

FIFY

BOOMER

[Breadburner]

Bait...!!!

[TUSooner]

OU managed to win 10 games without a legit run game or a defense. Hmm... I wonder how they did that the last few years? LJ was never OU's problem. And if we have any struggle next year in LJ's place, people are going to dramatically realize how valuable he was.

I will probably be one of them. I spent some time bithcing about LJ's shortcomings (being the QB expert that I am). But we would have been absolute zilch without all those supposedly bloated passing stats. Let's hope we can man up next year without him.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

http://www.gifsoup.com/view4/1303408/fish-slap-o.gif

[SoonerorLater]

That is all.

Who is he rated under that you feel he should be rated over and who developed these ratings of which you speak?

[Breadburner]

http://www.gifsoup.com/view4/1303408/fish-slap-o.gif

Haha....!!!

[8timechamps]

Why does Eric Bross always get overlooked for this award?!!!!1!11!1one!

[I Am Right]

System QB

[MyT Oklahoma]

I dunno. I've always thought that Jimmy Harris and Steve Davis both never got very much credit for leading OU to 2 National Championships each.

P.S. Screw passing records. Show me your National Championship baby.

[LakeRat]

I dunno. I've always thought that Jimmy Harris and Steve Davis both never got very much credit for leading OU to 2 National Championships each.

P.S. Screw passing records. Show me your National Championship baby.

How many times did those two have defenses that gave up 40+?

[Jacie]

I dunno. I've always thought that Jimmy Harris and Steve Davis both never got very much credit for leading OU to 2 National Championships each.

You must not have been on campus when Steve Davis played. There were girls at the BSU who would've had his babies . . .

[HateTheWhorns]

I think I will reserve my most overrated QB (or OU player) of all-time for Steve Davis. He entered the 1973 season as a 3rd string QB (as Switzer was expecting Kerry Jackson or Mark Harmon (1972 JUCO verbal commit that went to UCLA) to be in the starting role by then. All Davis did was go 32-1-1 over the next three seasons and led OU to two NCs (which should have been a 3rd NC save and except for the K. Jackson fiasco). The only game he lost was against KU in 1975 and OU went on to beat Meatchiken in the Orange Bowl to clinch another NC.

There are others that could make a legitimate claim for this title, but Davis is the one that stands out in my mind. Not sure L. Jones is not even in my top 5. He's a great kid, but circumstances and the current system had much to do with where he ended up statistically.

[jk the sooner fan]

i've read some interesting standards to judge Jones success on this board

the most frequent is "he'll never play a down in the NFL"......well neither did Heupel, or Jason White, or a whole host of other QB's considered on the all time great list......in fact, really only two have played a down - Sam Bradford and Nate Hybl (spent 3 years in the league)

then i hear "well he never won a National Championship"......well, neither did Sam Bradford, or Jack Mildren, or Jason White....i could go on and on with names of OU greats that didn't win a MNC

then i hear how he didnt make the right facial expressions to suit some fans - he lacks emotion or a "fire/passion"...which makes no sense whatsoever considering you simply dont get to that level of talent without some fire/passion......ok so he doesnt wear his emotions on his sleeve......meh

kid was a damn fine quarterback - he made mistakes - but so do all the rest of them....Peyton Manning threw an interception this past weekend and ended any hopes of his team going to the Super Bowl - you'd think a quarterback of his level and talent wouldnt make those freshman mistakes in his senior year.....


i think that about sums it up

[colleyvillesooner]

Quit using logic and reason, JK. it has no place in a Landry conversation.

[TXBOOMER]

Since the modern OU Passing QB I would rank LJ after Bradford, White, Hueple, Hybl. He has great stats and a ton of wins as you would expect a QB that plays in this system for this team that started for four years in the league with the worst defenses in the conference since it was formed. He was a good QB. LJ was not loved by fans because he didn't play physical when he had to. He typically made mistakes against good teams that could pressure the QB such as he did against K State and Notre Dame this year.

[70sooner]

The only game he lost was against KU in 1975

Steve didn't lose that game. It was a total team effort, LOL!


worst game I ever went to in Norman.....

[colleyvillesooner]

Putting him behind Hybl is a joke. Switch Hybl and Landry and what is our record this year? Putting Hybls skills with this O and this D? I'd say 8-5 or 7-6.

Put Landry and his arm on this 2001 and 2002 teams with those D's. Landry would have killed for one of those D's.

[jk the sooner fan]

Landry after Hybl? lol......lordy

[C&CDean]

The retards in our fanbase never cease to amaze and amuse. Sheesh.

[Lott's Bandana]

You must not have been on campus when Steve Davis played. There were girls at the BSU who would've had his babies . . .



Interesting comparison since Steve was a preacher too.

[jk the sooner fan]

Interesting comparison since Steve was a preacher too.

well in all fairness, they would have been christian babies ;)

[Jacie]

Interesting comparison since Steve was a preacher too.

I know. I met him at bible study when they showed the 75 highlight film.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Kinda like my rule... Never trust someone who's first words out of their mouth when you meet them are "I'm a Christian"I just always wondered why he was talking about being a cleric, instead of conquering defenses. Just seemed to me he might not be as motivated for football success as I would like to see at OU.

[BoomerSoonerTexasscks]

Hybl wasn't that bad when he wasn't lying flat on his back and his brain wasn't rattling around in his skull. Talk about concussions! With the hits he took in 01' I think he may still have one. Landry would have loved a D like the ones Hybl had but with the offensive lines they had Jones would have been the same place Hybl was, on the bench trying to count how many fingers the trainers were holding up.

[Jason White's Third Knee]

JK

Thanks for saying what I was thinking. My brain hurts anyway.

[MyT Oklahoma]

I meant no disrepect to LJ because I am glad he is a Sooner. But I have always thought that neither Harris or Davis got enough credit for quarterbacking two National Championship teams each.

Neither of them won any major awards that I can recall. But Harris never lost a game and Davis only lost one plus the one tie.

And yes I know that 1975 KU game was a "team" effort and that numerous women wanted to have his (Davis) babies.

[texaspokieokie]

I think I will reserve my most overrated QB (or OU player) of all-time for Steve Davis. He entered the 1973 season as a 3rd string QB (as Switzer was expecting Kerry Jackson or Mark Harmon (1972 JUCO verbal commit that went to UCLA) to be in the starting role by then. All Davis did was go 32-1-1 over the next three seasons and led OU to two NCs (which should have been a 3rd NC save and except for the K. Jackson fiasco). The only game he lost was against KU in 1975 and OU went on to beat Meatchiken in the Orange Bowl to clinch another NC.

There are others that could make a legitimate claim for this title, but Davis is the one that stands out in my mind. Not sure L. Jones is not even in my top 5. He's a great kid, but circumstances and the current system had much to do with where he ended up statistically.

How did the "K.Jackson fiasco" cost the Sooners a NC ??

[Sooner70]

Nate Hybl was one tough dude. I guess he had to be. Reminded me of Colin Klein in a way, as he'd get bumped, mashed & bruised & kept coming back for more.

How about Bobby Warmack? Skinny kid from Ada who let the Sooners to an Orange Bowl win over mighty Tennessee in the 1968 (or 1969?) & Dewey Warren & Co. That was an era when about all the headlines OU had was Steve Davis & some tough as nails players, but OU FB wasn't top of the heap.

[texaspokieokie]

I remember that tennessee game. I think 1 jan 68.
Bobby Warmack was prezz of "Sooners of Dallas" club when we joined.

[Ton Loc]

The retards in our fanbase never cease to amaze and amuse. Sheesh.

Quite an accomplishment considering its the same group of retards over and over. Their ability to consistently stick to their retarded logic in the face of ever increasing evidence that they are wrong is amazing.

[Lott's Bandana]

How did the "K.Jackson fiasco" cost the Sooners a NC ??

Perhaps because OU wasn't on TV or played in a bowl game because of that probation and the year we tied the mighty condoms in LA we would have gone to a bowl game and likely cleaned up, undefeated with a tie.


The team was led by three All-Americans: Rod Shoate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rod_Shoate) (Oklahoma's second three-time All-American)[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-AARC-4) the oldest of the Selmon brothers, Lucious (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucious_Selmon),[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-AALS-5) and Eddie Foster (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Eddie_Foster_(American_football)&action=edit&redlink=1).[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-AALS-5) The Selmon brothers Lucious, Lee Roy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Roy_Selmon) and Dewey (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dewey_Selmon) started on the defensive line (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defensive_line).[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-6) The team went undefeated on a schedule that included seven ranked opponents (In order, #1 USC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_USC_Trojans_football_team), #17 Miami (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_Hurricanes_football), #13 Texas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Texas_Longhorns_football_team), #13 Colorado (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_Buffaloes_football), #10 Missouri (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Tigers_football), #18 Kansas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_Jayhawks_football), and #10 Nebraska (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Nebraska_Cornhuskers_football_team)).


I will always believe if the country could have seen Little Joe play, he would have been our 3rd Heisman...going away.

[texaspokieokie]

Perhaps because OU wasn't on TV or played in a bowl game because of that probation and the year we tied the mighty condoms in LA we would have gone to a bowl game and likely cleaned up, undefeated with a tie.


The team was led by three All-Americans: Rod Shoate (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rod_Shoate) (Oklahoma's second three-time All-American)[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-AARC-4) the oldest of the Selmon brothers, Lucious (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucious_Selmon),[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-AALS-5) and Eddie Foster (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Eddie_Foster_(American_football)&action=edit&redlink=1).[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-AALS-5) The Selmon brothers Lucious, Lee Roy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Roy_Selmon) and Dewey (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dewey_Selmon) started on the defensive line (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defensive_line).[6] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oklahoma_Sooners_football_team#cite_note-6) The team went undefeated on a schedule that included seven ranked opponents (In order, #1 USC (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_USC_Trojans_football_team), #17 Miami (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_Hurricanes_football), #13 Texas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Texas_Longhorns_football_team), #13 Colorado (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_Buffaloes_football), #10 Missouri (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missouri_Tigers_football), #18 Kansas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_Jayhawks_football), and #10 Nebraska (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Nebraska_Cornhuskers_football_team)).


I will always believe if the country could have seen Little Joe play, he would have been our 3rd Heisman...going away.

Same situation in 74 & won (half) a NC. They did it without a bowl game.

Little Joe was on tv in 72 & 73. OU was on tv in 73.

[Lott's Bandana]

Same situation in 74 & won (half) a NC. They did it without a bowl game.

Little Joe was on tv in 72 & 73. OU was on tv in 73.


I beg to differ. The probation was '73 / '74. OU was banned from TV and bowl games and the UPI pole those years. The USC game was not televised, nor were all those other ranked team's games.

Barry took over after Chuck left and inherited the probation and promptly went undefeated until that damnass Kansas game I left in the third quarter. (I was 13)

[texaspokieokie]

73 was on tv, i clearly remember the tx game. Contracts were already signed so they were on tv. Remember, there wasn't much tv then, if you got 2 games plus a bowl game,you had done well.

Then the "no tv" was moved to 74 & 75. Techinally, OU wasn't on probation in 75, that's why they got a bowl game. (against michigan)

Also, Barry took over in 73.
KS loss was in 75.

[Lott's Bandana]

73 was on tv, i clearly remember the tx game. Contracts were already signed so they were on tv. Remember, there wasn't much tv then, if you got 2 games plus a bowl game,you had done well.

Then the "no tv" was moved to 74 & 75. Techinally, OU wasn't on probation in 75, that's why they got a bowl game. (against michigan)

Also, Barry took over in 73.
KS loss was in 75.

We're saying the same thing. Yes, Barry took over in '73 inheriting the probation and then didn't lose a game until '75...again, I was there.

The original question was how did K Jackson cost OU a MNC?

There is no doubt that the AP voters were likely swayed by OU's probation and forfeiting of games in '72, otherwise they would have possibly been at the top of the AP pole after such a great season (finished 10-0-1 and #3) AND a bowl victory. (should they have won)

The sticking point in that statement is that Domer and Bama were also undefeated and played for the MNC that year. It would have been hard for OU to have ended up on top, especially in those days, even after beating all those ranked teams and tying in LA.

[texaspokieokie]

yeah, but OU was on tv (& probation) in 73.

You can speculate that OU would've won NC that year.

They could've been on top of both poles, the probation rule didn't apply till 74.

[King Crimson]

i was at the 75 KU game. first time i ever saw OU lose. we fumbled a lot and Nolan Cromwell beat us.

horrible stuff. i don't worry about 73 much....the year we were the best team and didn't win was 78.

sims, overstreet, king, watts....get the F out.

we beat Nebraska and Dr. Tom a bunch of times when we had no chance....but that one Sims fumble cost us the MNC. i still cringe. he puts a helluva move on the first guy and then drops it. outside the hoops loss to KU in 88, my most painful sports moment....ever. we beat them DOWN in the Orange Bowl....they score on the last minute to make it seem close. no question who the better team is...and as many teams as Barry stole it from Dr. Tom in Lincoln...they got us there.


billy sims is one play away from winning the heisman twice. charles white, please.

[King Crimson]

anyway, i think the most underrated Sooner of all-time is Steve Rhodes.


edit: thomas lott was the 78 qb, not jc.

[HateTheWhorns]

How did the "K.Jackson fiasco" cost the Sooners a NC ??

Because it led to the probation that went into effect in 1973. It was fresh in every voters mind and we were punished in the voting for it that season. OU's only blemish was an "on-the-road" tie with "then #1" USC and we finished 3rd in the poll at 10-0-1 with Alabama winning it all at 11-1 & ND finishing #2. The Big 8 had one of the strongest conferences that year with 4 teams in the top 17. In my opinion, neither UA or ND could have taken the Sooners that year......we were rolling.

That is how the K. Jackson fiasco cost the Sooners a NC.

[Salt City Sooner]

Because it led to the probation that went into effect in 1973. It was fresh in every voters mind and we were punished in the voting for it that season. OU's only blemish was an "on-the-road" tie with "then #1" USC and we finished 3rd in the poll at 10-0-1 with Alabama winning it all at 11-1 & ND finishing #2. The Big 8 had one of the strongest conferences that year with 4 teams in the top 17. In my opinion, neither UA or ND could have taken the Sooners that year......we were rolling.

That is how the K. Jackson fiasco cost the Sooners a NC.
Well, maybe I can help you sleep just a little better tonight ( ;) ) because you've got things mixed up just a bit re; '73. Bama & Notre Dame split the title that year, & the only reason they did so was because the coaches poll (which Bama won, they were 11-0 at the time it was released) was released prior to the bowls being played. Notre Dame won the AP due to having beaten Bama by a point in the Sugar Bowl, & the AP waiting to name their champion until after the bowls were played. The next year, the coaches decided to follow the AP's lead & started waiting until after the bowls to release their final poll.

[Lott's Bandana]

anyway, i think the most underrated Sooner of all-time is Steve Rhodes.


edit: thomas lott was the 78 qb, not jc.

Yep.

[texaspokieokie]

I would say the K.Jackson cost the Sooners a chance to PLAY for the MNC. In a bowl game, who knows who
would've won ???

[SoonerSpock]

i've read some interesting standards to judge Jones success on this board

the most frequent is "he'll never play a down in the NFL"......well neither did Heupel, or Jason White, or a whole host of other QB's considered on the all time great list......in fact, really only two have played a down - Sam Bradford and Nate Hybl (spent 3 years in the league)

then i hear "well he never won a National Championship"......well, neither did Sam Bradford, or Jack Mildren, or Jason White....i could go on and on with names of OU greats that didn't win a MNC

then i hear how he didnt make the right facial expressions to suit some fans - he lacks emotion or a "fire/passion"...which makes no sense whatsoever considering you simply dont get to that level of talent without some fire/passion......ok so he doesnt wear his emotions on his sleeve......meh

kid was a damn fine quarterback - he made mistakes - but so do all the rest of them....Peyton Manning threw an interception this past weekend and ended any hopes of his team going to the Super Bowl - you'd think a quarterback of his level and talent wouldnt make those freshman mistakes in his senior year.....


i think that about sums it up

Very valid assessment considering the source who set the standards by which they evaluate Landry. I think there is no question that LJ lacks the massive leadership skills necessary to place a team on his shoulders and will them to victory. But what other OU QB had those leadership skills. Perhaps Steve Davis and Jimmy Harris.

It is a statistical fact the Landry had twice as many 4th quarter comebacks for victory than did Josh, Jason and Sam in their six seasons combined. Perhaps LJ was better than perceived. Hell Dean Blevins had as many late comebacksas Jason, Josh and Sam jointly had (Think Ohio State).

For certain Landry is one of the top 7-10 all time QB's trailing for only Steve Davis, Jimmie Harris, Josh Heupel, Jason White, Sam Bradford, Jack Mildren, Jamelle Holiway and perhaps a couple or three from the list of Thomas Lott, J.C. Watts, Claude Arnold, Gene Calame, Bobby Warmack, Cale Gundy, Eddie Crowder, Bobby Boyd, Danny Bradley and Charles Thomson. Being on the level or above those just listed is very select company.

For certain many OU fans do not see Landry in the same light as they see other great OU QB's and he definitely is extremely underrated by too many based on his accomplishments on the field. Fortunately history a decade or two down the line will elevate Landry to the stature he he desires among his QB peers. Remember only Claude Arnold, Jimmie Harris, Steve Davis, Jamelle Holieway and Josh Heupel led the Sooners to a national championship. All the other shot themselves in the foot too.

[HateTheWhorns]

Well, maybe I can help you sleep just a little better tonight ( ;) ) because you've got things mixed up just a bit re; '73. Bama & Notre Dame split the title that year, & the only reason they did so was because the coaches poll (which Bama won, they were 11-0 at the time it was released) was released prior to the bowls being played. Notre Dame won the AP due to having beaten Bama by a point in the Sugar Bowl, & the AP waiting to name their champion until after the bowls were played. The next year, the coaches decided to follow the AP's lead & started waiting until after the bowls to release their final poll.

My response was about why OU did not win the 1973 NC. In 1973 they were only eligible to win the AP vote, so my comment about Alabama #1 and ND #2 was only in relation to the AP poll. Sorry I wasn't more clear on that.

[goingoneight]

God Bless Nate Hybl... but he would have been buried on the OU depth chart today. He played when he did because A: he was neck-and-neck with Jason White coming into 2001 and on-the-field results clearly separated the two and B: because we needed him when we had nobody else (see Paul Thompson's redshirt pulled in 2002). Same for if Paul Thompson was on the team last year. If there's anything we've done exceptionally well, it's continuing to advance OUr QB depth and quality. I honestly don't know if Nate would beat out either Nichol or LJ for the emergency backup role in 2008.

I'm not bashing Hybl... I'd feel the same way if someone asked me where Tom Wort would fit in with Calmus, Marshall, Lofton and Mitchell on the depth chart. Jones carried teams with bad defenses with the exception of 2009-- in which he actually had a pretty good year for a normal freshman (throw out your Johnny Football and Sam Bradford exceptions to the freshman rule).

[Salt City Sooner]

My response was about why OU did not win the 1973 NC. In 1973 they were only eligible to win the AP vote, so my comment about Alabama #1 and ND #2 was only in relation to the AP poll. Sorry I wasn't more clear on that.
Yeah, the Bama half was pretty much irrelevant due to our probation. I'm just saying that despite OU entering the bowl season #2 in the AP, you'd have had to pick me up off the ground if they hadn't vaulted an undefeated, untied Notre Dame, who had just beaten an undefeated, untied 'Bama over us in their final poll (exactly what they did), esp. w/ our lone blemish coming against a team who lost 2 other games in addition to tying OU.

[HateTheWhorns]

You are right about why ND won, but I still believe without the probation, OU is there at the end. 7 of OU's 11 games were against teams ranked in the top 18 (at the time they played them). ND played 3 ranked teams. The difference ovbiously was that they beat USC at home by 9 and then went on to beat Alabama by 1. Had OU been able to showcase their team in a bowl game against a top 5 team and not have had to deal with AP voters that refused to vote OU #1 simply because of the probation (which was well documented at the time), then the outcome could very well have been different. I find it amazing that OU was even ranked #3 the last several weeks of the season and #2 in the final week given the factors involved.

[MyT Oklahoma]

Yes we definately got shafted in 1973. However, it's a go look in the mirror situation in that one of our coaches knowingly signed Kerry Jackson and Mike Phillips when he knew their high school transcripts had been changed. How stupid was that?

What's done is done of course. Our 1973 team was great but we will never know how great.

[Texas Golfer]

Landry is good and will do fine in the NFL.

[texaspokieokie]

Ou was ranked in both polls in 73. They didn't come up with the rule pertaining to probation till74.
As noted above, 2 guys transcripts were changed, funny thing was, it turned out Phillips didn't need it. Also he got to play in other years but Jackson didn't after 72. The thing was, everybody that cared (like Darrell Royal) knew about Jackson's grades.