Stoops has a reputation

[landrun]

He chokes... I disagree. I just think he's over rated because of a team he coached over a decade ago.

We didn't choke against aTm - they were just a better coached team.

http://www.secrant.com/rant/p/39020915/At-What-Point-Will-Miles-Become-The-Stoops-Of-The-SEC.aspx

[yermom]

i don't think it was the coaching as much as talent/depth on the lines

[olevetonahill]

i don't think it was the coaching as much as talent/depth on the lines

I think Coach cut Landrun off in traffic er somepun

[Texas Golfer]

Big Game Bob needs to get his mojo back.

[prrriiide]

i don't think it was the coaching as much as talent/depth on the lines

^^^^THIS^^^^

X1,000,000,000

[S.PadreIsl.Sooner]

Yup. We do need some more McCoys on the line and Teddy Lehmans at LB.

And we have too many players quitting. It's almost like being on probation.

[TXBOOMER]

Depth, talent and development of both are a huge part of coaching folks.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

The only difference between the old Bob and the new Bob is when the old Bob was hired, he had to bring in assistants for the first time and they were all quality assistants. It was a necessity. Since that time, he's promoted from within and while that worked for awhile, that is no longer working. He needs to get back to his roots of asking the questions of "is that offense hard to stop and how did it do against the better defenses on the schedule" and ask a similar question on defense in terms of how well it did against the better offenses on the schedule. The day he acknowledges this (probably never), is the day he gets better again.

[Socrefbek]

15 years is about the shelf life even for a successful coach. Name college FB coaches at a program past 15 years that won NC. IMO it is time for Bob ad OU to part ways. It will be good for both in long run. Start identifying the next Urban Myer or Nick Saban

[Midtowner]

The only difference between the old Bob and the new Bob is when the old Bob was hired, he had to bring in assistants for the first time and they were all quality assistants. It was a necessity. Since that time, he's promoted from within and while that worked for awhile, that is no longer working. He needs to get back to his roots of asking the questions of "is that offense hard to stop and how did it do against the better defenses on the schedule" and ask a similar question on defense in terms of how well it did against the better offenses on the schedule. The day he acknowledges this (probably never), is the day he gets better again.

It's the Peter Principle at work, i.e., in organizations which promote from within, people will tend to be promoted until they reach a position where they're incompetent. I like the Mike Stoops hire because he was a competent DC, but an incompetent HC. I don't know about Heupel, but him and Norvell seem to be doing a good job with the talent they've managed to recruit. They're receiver heavy and have a weak line and a really good FB and RB set, so the schemes they have are the best suited to the personnel we've recruited. If we could get some really talented linemen, I think they'd be running different schemes. That's just not the case though.

They really have to do something to rehab the Big XII's image, or at least OU's, or we're going to continue to whiff on the good recruits.

[Mac94]

When did Stoops start hiring mainly within? I don;t follow the staff stuff ... don;t hear about it here in Austin ... but he was quick to hire Sumlin back in the day and Sumlin had no tires to OU.

[sooneron]

I think the hiring within line of thought is pretty overblown. If you look at the staff, Josh is the only one (currently) that has been promoted to a coord position from within without ever having been a coord somewhere else. Everyone else was a coord at one time or another- That is presently a coord.. [edit]

[SoonerKnight]

You do not fire a coach for a 10-3 record. You do not fire a coach for suspending players even if they are your better players. If the players do not folow the rules they need to be suspended til they figure it out. These are kids. I get the opprotunity to train new employees. A lot of the new employees that I train are young and I can say this new generation is of a different mind set. SOFT VERY SOFT! Part of what he is dealing with. Also, you need to have that drive from players. AD had that drive. It is not coached.

So before you think the grass is greener on the other side with another coach take a long deep look in the mirror and then slap yourself silly for thinking that!!

[olevetonahill]

You do not fire a coach for a 10-3 record. You do not fire a coach for suspending players even if they are your better players. If the players do not folow the rules they need to be suspended til they figure it out. These are kids. I get the opprotunity to train new employees. A lot of the new employees that I train are young and I can say this new generation is of a different mind set. SOFT VERY SOFT! Part of what he is dealing with. Also, you need to have that drive from players. AD had that drive. It is not coached.

So before you think the grass is greener on the other side with another coach take a long deep look in the mirror and then slap yourself silly for thinking that!!

:eagerness:

[Curly Bill]

You do not fire a coach for a 10-3 record. You do not fire a coach for suspending players even if they are your better players. If the players do not folow the rules they need to be suspended til they figure it out. These are kids. I get the opprotunity to train new employees. A lot of the new employees that I train are young and I can say this new generation is of a different mind set. SOFT VERY SOFT! Part of what he is dealing with. Also, you need to have that drive from players. AD had that drive. It is not coached.

So before you think the grass is greener on the other side with another coach take a long deep look in the mirror and then slap yourself silly for thinking that!!


I've seen a number of articles recently about everyone from employers to professors talking about how this generation thinks so highly of themselves, and overestimates their importance to the world - an understandable result of the: let' build up their self-esteem and "everyone gets a trophy" philosophy.

[Widescreen]

I don't believe there is any accountability in the Stoops regime and I'm starting to accept that fact. The only things that will cause Stoops to leave is if it's on his terms or if he breaks the law or or is caught significantly violating NCAA rules (see Tressel).

[thecrimsoncrusader]

I think the hiring within line of thought is pretty overblown. If you look at the staff, Josh is the only one (currently) that has been promoted to a coord position from within without ever having been a coord somewhere else. Everyone else was a coord at one time or another- That is presently a coord.. [edit]


Mark Mangino - offensive line coach - promoted to offensive coordinator
Chuck Long - QB coach - promoted to offensive coordinator
Kevin Wilson - offensive line coach - promoted to offensive coordinator
Josh Heupel - QB coach - promoted to co-offensive coordinator and primary play-caller
Jay Norvell - receivers coach - promoted to co-offensive coordinator
Brent Venables - co-defensive coordinator - promoted to full-time defensive play-caller

If Brent Venables wasn't around for so long, we might have seen similar things there as well.

And of course, there is also Bob Stoops hiring his buddy, Bruce Kittle, and also bringing his brother back in Mike Stoops. The latter I am please about IF he can get OU's defensive recruiting back on track.

[MyT Oklahoma]

15 years is about the shelf life even for a successful coach. Name college FB coaches at a program past 15 years that won NC. IMO it is time for Bob ad OU to part ways. It will be good for both in long run. Start identifying the next Urban Myer or Nick Saban

Bear Bryant? Joe Paterno? But young and hungry is much preferred.

[MyT Oklahoma]

I don't believe there is any accountability in the Stoops regime and I'm starting to accept that fact. The only things that will cause Stoops to leave is if it's on his terms or if he breaks the law or or is caught significantly violating NCAA rules (see Tressel).

^^ I agree. I don't like it but I agree with your assessment.

So long as we sell out home games, go to bowl games, sell enough programs, hot dogs and soft drinks, Bob can do no wrong in the eyes of the powers that be. It's all about money and Bob is bringing in enough money to satisfy the administration and the fans be damned (for expecting national championships).

So yes, in other words, the people who control and run our program are pussies.

[Widescreen]

To be clear, I don't want Stoops fired. I want him to get back to his old passionate self, improve and stop making excuses and blowing smoke. Changing coaches is a crap shoot but if Stoops can't/won't change, then the admin needs to make a move.

[yermom]

with all of the dismissals, injuries before the season, what were we expecting this year? were we really that far off?

[Curly Bill]

with all of the dismissals, injuries before the season, what were we expecting this year? were we really that far off?

I think for most people their frustration with Stoops is not just about this year, it's about a continual inability to live up to expectations, continued failures in big games, and just a look or sense that something is missing. This season just adds fuel to the fire.

[aero]

I also do not want to see Stoops gone. But it seems like he does need to change directions somehow. Teams seem to have a style, attitude, etc. year in and year out from one coach to another. KState for example. This years team looked just like Snyders teams of any other year. The qb was a little different but they played the same brand of football. Even some of the players resemble players of years past. The same could be said of Beamers VaTech squads. Or Sabans Bama teams. Pick a coach and team and they seem to look the same year in and year out. What is troubling is what OU's teams are starting to look like year in and year out. Everybody concedes there is talent on the team but the style of play and the players performances seem to be underachieving/under-performing each year. Its not only my perception but a national perception. We don't seem like we were that far off this year as we lost only 3 games and all 3 were to good, top 5 teams. But then again the question could be asked if we shouldn't have done better. I think over the last several years, that same scenario has played out and the same questions could be asked. Personally, I don't like the brand of football that seems the team has been playing. I'd rather see an emphasis on a dominate defense (like we've had almost every year we had a legitimate title contender and like we had in the early 2000's), and change in offensive philosophy. Seems the offense is bogged down by a type of paralysis through analysis. The up tempo is far from it. There's no rhythm, too many wasted time outs. The plays seem disjointed and not real-time game play calling. We have had some great tight ends in the past and need to bring back that part of the offense.

[yermom]

Mike came in this year. how long do you really think it would take for him to change the defense from Venables' defense?

are we just supposed to miracle the next scary good helmet crapping defensive line?

[Seamus]

Mike came in this year. how long do you really think it would take for him to change the defense from Venables' defense?

are we just supposed to miracle the next scary good helmet crapping defensive line?

"If God would have wanted you up there he would have miracled your *** up there by now, wouldn't he?"

[yermom]

indeed, that is where i started using "miracle" as a verb :D

[wishbonesooner]

You do not fire a coach for a 10-3 record. You do not fire a coach for suspending players even if they are your better players. If the players do not folow the rules they need to be suspended til they figure it out. These are kids. I get the opprotunity to train new employees. A lot of the new employees that I train are young and I can say this new generation is of a different mind set. SOFT VERY SOFT! Part of what he is dealing with. Also, you need to have that drive from players. AD had that drive. It is not coached.

So before you think the grass is greener on the other side with another coach take a long deep look in the mirror and then slap yourself silly for thinking that!!

If tthe discussion was about THIS 10-3 alone, you'd be absolutely right. It's talking about his body of work the last ten years or so. Please, please stop talking about Big 12 championships. It's a piece of s**t, watered down conference. If that's all we aspire to win, God help us.

[Soonerjeepman]

I've seen a number of articles recently about everyone from employers to professors talking about how this generation thinks so highly of themselves, and overestimates their importance to the world - an understandable result of the: let' build up their self-esteem and "everyone gets a trophy" philosophy.

it's called the "Trophy Generation"..in education circles...course we are the main culprits. Just had our "awards assembly" yesterday...thinkin EVERYONE got an award for something...UGH~

[SoonerSpock]

You do not fire a coach for a 10-3 record. You do not fire a coach for suspending players even if they are your better players. If the players do not folow the rules they need to be suspended til they figure it out. These are kids. I get the opprotunity to train new employees. A lot of the new employees that I train are young and I can say this new generation is of a different mind set. SOFT VERY SOFT! Part of what he is dealing with. Also, you need to have that drive from players. AD had that drive. It is not coached.

So before you think the grass is greener on the other side with another coach take a long deep look in the mirror and then slap yourself silly for thinking that!!In

Interesting how LSU and Alabama do not appear to have difficulty with soft players. Perhaps is a matter of levels of expectation that are set by the head coach. What OU needs first is success recruiting better talent. Recruiting average players and making good players out of them will not keep up recruiting good players and making great players out of them. Next they need to get a Nick Saban level of expectations entrenched in the players minds and motivating those that won't to move on.

Urban Myers has this level of expectation established and it appears that Kevin Sumlin and Muschamp are doing the same. For certain OU is not a top 5 program at this time and does not appear they will be again in the near future. It is what it is.

[Curly Bill]

it's called the "Trophy Generation"..in education circles...course we are the main culprits. Just had our "awards assembly" yesterday...thinkin EVERYONE got an award for something...UGH~


Been there done that, for academic awards and for athletics too; the ol lets recognize as many kids as we can mantra.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

OU is a Top 5 program at this time, just not a Top 5 team. There is a difference.

[Texas Golfer]

I think our expectations are a little high and we can thank Bob for that. Have we forgotten what it was like before he got here? How many other coaches have averaged 10.4 wins a year? How many other coaches have taken their teams to bowl games every year? That being said, would I like to win more bowl games? Absolutely! But I haven't forgotten what it was like between Switzer and Stoops.

[Scott D]

Seems to me that some of you are more upset that Bob doesn't eat, sleep, drink, and live football 24/7. This has never been a secret that he wasn't going to be that way. He said as much up front when he was hired about how there is time for football, and time for family for him and his coaching staff. Hell, even Urban Meyer has admitted that Bob's approach is better than his previous OCD approach to coaching.

Now the assistant coach thing is amusing too, some of you calling for Bob to basically do the exact same thing you mocked Mack for doing 3 years ago. Truthfully, if there are moves that MAY need to be made, it's definitely evaluations on Shipp and yes, I'll still say an evaluation on Schmidt and whether or not he's actually looking for improved training methods, because truthfully one hasn't really been getting the job done for quite some time, and the other is pretty close to being stone age in his practices. And it honestly doesn't matter who is the OC in any way, shape, or form. You guys are just going to wait for a minimum of 1 offensive play before you'd start slamming the playcalling and philosophy of any OC that was at OU anyway.

Things don't change overnight, seems to me that people forget that Saban wasn't exactly lighting the world on fire when he took both the LSU and Bama jobs, and he's been very fortunate in that he hasn't had a great deal of turnover in the more key positions in his staff despite having quite a few coaches in his career that have moved on to their own head coaching gigs. Easier to lose a guy who is a position coach than a coordinator in that regard.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

^^ I agree. I don't like it but I agree with your assessment.

So long as we sell out home games, go to bowl games, sell enough programs, hot dogs and soft drinks, Bob can do no wrong in the eyes of the powers that be. It's all about money and Bob is bringing in enough money to satisfy the administration and the fans be damned (for expecting national championships).

So yes, in other words, the people who control and run our program are pussies.It will be interesting to see what Bob does with the QB position next yr. Whether he will allow/want the QB to occasionally run when the situation is right. Landry's refusal to run was an obstacle to greater success. Also, the lack of talent on both lines will need to be dealt with, and Mike Stoops has yet to show he can get it done with the defense again. We could be 2 or 3 yrs away from a top tier team again, IF THINGS GO RIGHT.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

with all of the dismissals, injuries before the season, what were we expecting this year? were we really that far off?I was surprised our DL was as poor as it played, but I thought the OL did better than expected. At least they could pass block.