Iowa Supreme ct upholds dental asst firing...wow

[Soonerjeepman]

apparently a dental hygienist was fired for being too attractive. The dentist said she posed a threat to his marriage, he might have an affair with her. She had work for 10 yrs, not for sure if for him...but as a hygienist.

what's worse...the frickin court (9 males) upheld the decision...just wow...

[Curly Bill]

My thinking is if it's his business he ought to be able to hire and fire whomever he wants for whatever reason he wants. And yeah I know...in Merica these days it usually doesn't work like that.

[olevetonahill]

My thinking is if it's his business he ought to be able to hire and fire whomever he wants for whatever reason he wants. And yeah I know...in Merica these days it usually doesn't work like that.

Surprised me she dint Sue him for sexual harassment.

[yermom]

Surprised me she dint Sue him for sexual harassment.

that's what i'm thinking. must be more to this story.

[Curly Bill]

Tennessee is an at will state. Don't need a reason to fire someone.

I like it!

[Curly Bill]

Surprised me she dint Sue him for sexual harassment.

tru dat

[Soonerjeepman]

guess I don't have a problem WITH the firing...it's the why and the fact this country is so bent of being political correct that the lower court ruling was upheld. I'm more surprised the women-libs haven't jumped on this. I guess I'm thinking the dude should have more control over his weiner and what he does with it. Just me though.

[rock on sooner]

Well, first, there are 7 males on the court. Second she is HAWT!.
Third, he fired her to keep his wife off his back. Fourth, at least
part of what I read would indicate she has a good case for sexual
harassment..e.g. he mad a comment about how she should be extra
careful if she saw any bulges in HIS clothing. She apparently wore
scrubs on the job and he pointed out the bulges in her clothing.

[badger]

He even once told Nelson that if his pants were bulging, she would know her outfits were too revealing, the lawsuit said. And he quipped about her irregular sex life, saying it was “like having a Lamborghini in the garage and never driving it.”


Sexual harrassment. I'm sure she'll have lawyers offering contingency-pay only work to file suit on her behalf. He is going to end up paying her more than one month's severance.

[olevetonahill]

She should take it like a Man and just go get another job, This time dont ask fer a firing by being sexy

[MsProudSooner]

Hopefully, she sues him for sexual harrassment.

[Turd_Ferguson]

Hopefully, she sues him for sexual harrassment.

I hope she does...and I hope she loses.

[olevetonahill]

I hope she does...and I hope she loses.

He shoulda just slapped the **** out of her and told her to make him a sammich

[Turd_Ferguson]

He shoulda just slapped the **** out of her and told her to make him a sammich

and then said, your services are no longer needed...now get the **** out.

[olevetonahill]

and then said, your services are no longer needed...now get the **** out, Bitch.

FIFY

[Midtowner]

At will means at will. You have civil rights protections for certain categories like race, whether you are or intend to become pregnant, religion and national origin. Some places even include sexual orientation. Aside from those things, an employer gets to choose who works for them. I find it difficult to be sympathetic with the Plaintiff here. In the jobs market, being physically attractive has been linked to higher pay, quicker promotions and making it through initial selection. In this case, for once, being attractive worked against the Plaintiff and she sued. Employers certainly have wide discretion in deciding which employees will represent them and certainly, if this dentist thought this woman was more of an anchor than a sail for his business, he was right to fire her. It may not seem fair. Hell.. it isn't fair. The law isn't about what's fair, its' about what's legal.

[KantoSooner]

Of any thread in history, this is the one that needs to have said:

THIS THREAD IS USELESS WITHOUT PICS.

[Midtowner]

http://www.nation.com.pk/print_images/480/2012-12-24/-employers-can-fire-attractive-workers-1356375220-8112.jpg

[Turd_Ferguson]

Big tit's and a fake blonde...who'd have thunk it...

[Midtowner]

I'll say it again, I really don't get this woman's idea that she had a case. Please excuse some seemingly chauvinist language, but I swear this is backed up by research. Those tig 'ol bitties have very likely opened a lot of doors for this woman in her life. Her appearance has ensured that her parents and others were more affectionate and positive with her. Her appearance doubtless meant she had a much easier time growing up and had more social opportunities. Assuming she's in the dental field and not married, there's a very good chance she'll end up a dentist's wife, (which her former employer was concerned about) and from there, she'll be set.

Had she been more homely? She'd probably have a career as a dental assistant and make meh money.

[badger]

Assuming she's in the dental field and not married, there's a very good chance she'll end up a dentist's wife, (which her former employer was concerned about) and from there, she'll be set.
she's already married and is a mom.

i am not sure how anyone cannot define his comments and his firing action as anything but sexual harassment, when you consider the official definition of it:

From the equal employment opportunity commish site (http://www.eeoc.gov/laws/types/sexual_harassment.cfm):


It is unlawful to harass a person (an applicant or employee) because of that person’s sex. Harassment can include “sexual harassment” or unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical harassment of a sexual nature.

Harassment does not have to be of a sexual nature, however, and can include offensive remarks about a person’s sex. For example, it is illegal to harass a woman by making offensive comments about women in general.

Both victim and the harasser can be either a woman or a man, and the victim and harasser can be the same sex.

Although the law doesn’t prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that are not very serious, harassment is illegal when it is so frequent or severe that it creates a hostile or offensive work environment or when it results in an adverse employment decision (such as the victim being fired or demoted).

The harasser can be the victim's supervisor, a supervisor in another area, a co-worker, or someone who is not an employee of the employer, such as a client or customer.

[Midtowner]

Hadn't read that about her being married, etc.

Back to the law, apparently, the two had never so much as openly flirted. The dentist had on a couple of occasions admonished the Plaintiff for wearing clothing which was distracting, revealing, etc. I'd say an employer has every right to critique an employee's appearance. Especially when that appearance can affect the work environment.

The dentist apparently fired her because his wife demanded it. That's not harassment. It may be discrimination, but not all discrimination is illegal. I wouldn't hire a receptionist with gauged out ears or facial tattoos because I believe first impressions are important. The case boiled down to this: "Whether an employee who has not engaged in flirtatious conduct may be lawfully terminated simply because the boss views the employee as an irresistible attraction.”

Fair enough, she wasn't fired because of her gender (all of the employees at the office are female) but because the dentist's wife thought she was attractive and saw her as a threat to the marriage. I've had some fairly attractive assistants in the past. If my wife ever said "them or me," that assistant would be out the door.

[rock on sooner]

Mid, don't have a problem with the "them or me". The issue is, imo,
the remarks about bulges in scrubs, both his and hers. There is no
way that his remarks could be construed as anything other than
sexual. I think any decent attorney could make a case for it, at will
notwithstanding.

[badger]

There is something that might be on the dentist's side though: Did his office have 15 or more employees? If it didn't, she might not have a case (due to the law only applying to places with 15 or more).

[badger]

I just realized that nobody on this thread linked this story anywhere. Here you go. (http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headlines/2012/12/melissa-nelson-dental-assistant-fired-for-being-irresistible-is-devastated/)

another note not mentioned:


The messages were mostly mundane, but Nelson recalled one text she received from her boss asking “how often she experienced an orgasm.”

Once again, if this is an office with at least 15 employees, I don't see how it isn't sexual harassment.

[KantoSooner]

Well, I doubt she has any problem getting another job. Worst case, she waits until June, targets the dweebiest guy in this year's dental school class at IU or ISU and she's either 'Mrs. Dentist' or cleaning no fewer than 2 sets of teeth a day by fall.

[cleller]

Once again, if this is an office with at least 15 employees, I don't see how it isn't sexual harassment.

That's the factor, I imagine the office has fewer than 15 employees and is exempt from some of the big labor rules. Most people probably don't know that the smaller businesses can fire people for reasons larger companies could not get away with.

[Soonerjeepman]

Mid, I agree, that her "attractiveness" probably has served her well. Unless she had cancer, her fake boobs are for LOOKS and therefore she knew she was using them to her advantage. I was just more amazed the liberal woman's rights groups haven't gone crazy.

The one pic I saw on the news she wasn't looking like the pic here...she looked def more of a "normal" mom. Heck my dentist asst that works on me is a young hawt girl...and I don't mind. lol.

[olevetonahill]

Mid, I agree, that her "attractiveness" probably has served her well. Unless she had cancer, her fake boobs are for LOOKS and therefore she knew she was using them to her advantage. I was just more amazed the liberal woman's rights groups haven't gone crazy.

The one pic I saw on the news she wasn't looking like the pic here...she looked def more of a "normal" mom. Heck my dentist asst that works on me is a young hawt girl...and I don't mind. lol.

Heh, Im going in fer a Cleaning on the 2nd, My Dental assistant is Hot and I hope I get some Ear Boob.

[Soonerjeepman]

Heh, Im going in fer a Cleaning on the 2nd, My Dental assistant is Hot and I hope I get some Ear Boob.

lol...yup...I always do!

[badger]

That's the factor, I imagine the office has fewer than 15 employees and is exempt from some of the big labor rules. Most people probably don't know that the smaller businesses can fire people for reasons larger companies could not get away with.

yeah, but then why didn't the supreme court say that in their decision? hmmm... very strange. i guess that's why it made national headlines though.

[rock on sooner]

You "dirty ol men" ought to have my dental hygienist...she's
late 40'ish, her kids are teenagers and her stomach growls in
my ears...I swear, every time!:highly_amused:

[olevetonahill]

yeah, but then why didn't the supreme court say that in their decision? hmmm... very strange. i guess that's why it made national headlines though.

Aint you needed in the Kitchen?

[olevetonahill]

You "dirty ol men" ought to have my dental hygienist...she's
late 40'ish, her kids are teenagers and her stomach growls in
my ears...I swear, every time!:highly_amused:

What? You cant go to someone else?

[rock on sooner]

yeah, but then why didn't the supreme court say that in their decision? hmmm... very strange. i guess that's why it made national headlines though.

Never was an issue, otherwise wouldn't have gone all the distance
that it did...

[rock on sooner]

What? You cant go to someone else?

Her boss is on wife's insurance plan and is conveniently located.

[Midtowner]

yeah, but then why didn't the supreme court say that in their decision? hmmm... very strange. i guess that's why it made national headlines though.

Probably because harassment wasn't part of the lawsuit or the appeal.

[olevetonahill]

Her boss is on wife's insurance plan and is conveniently located.

So? Once a Year Pay fer a cleanin and get ya some HOT Ear Boob action .

[Soonerjeepman]

Her boss is on wife's insurance plan and is conveniently located.
sorry for you~ lol

[SicEmBaylor]

Why should you even need a reason to fire someone?

You shouldn't. This is, supposedly, a free country. That man owns his own business and he ought to be able to fire anyone for any reason at any time regardless of the reason. If he does it for ********* reasons then he may only be hurting his business but that's his problem and concern...nobody else's.

[SicEmBaylor]

guess I don't have a problem WITH the firing...it's the why and the fact this country is so bent of being political correct that the lower court ruling was upheld. I'm more surprised the women-libs haven't jumped on this. I guess I'm thinking the dude should have more control over his weiner and what he does with it. Just me though.
Now you're covering because you were caught 'in the wrong.'

[Soonerjeepman]

Now you're covering because you were caught 'in the wrong.'

what? not sure what or if you are referring to me personally or the situation...I could care less...I was saying I'm surprised it got upheld due to the PC of this country..which I disagree with. Believe what ya want. Not "covering" or whatever you think. Honestly don't give a rat's *** what you think either.

[SicEmBaylor]

what? not sure what or if you are referring to me personally or the situation...I could care less...I was saying I'm surprised it got upheld due to the PC of this country..which I disagree with. Believe what ya want. Not "covering" or whatever you think. Honestly don't give a rat's *** what you think either.
I suspect you didn't think she should have got fired because she is attractive and failed to consider the fact that the dentist has every right to do so which is why you added:
what's worse...the frickin court (9 males) upheld the decision...just wow... there at the end.

[badger]

I'm not upset by the decision. Like I said before, I think she's entitled to damages from the dentist due to what appears to be textbook sexual harassment.The only thing that might prevent it from being an immediate settlement out of court is if his business is less than 15 employees, and even then, the harassment itself could be a civil, non-employment related suit.

If you ever disagree with a court decision, consider that OJ was and is still being punished despite an initial "win" in court. The glove didn't fit so the jury did acquit, but the civil suit screwed him in the end (and continues to any time it is publicly announced that he's got some assets, heh).

[SicEmBaylor]

I'm not upset by the decision. Like I said before, I think she's entitled to damages from the dentist due to what appears to be textbook sexual harassment.The only thing that might prevent it from being an immediate settlement out of court is if his business is less than 15 employees, and even then, the harassment itself could be a civil, non-employment related suit.

If you ever disagree with a court decision, consider that OJ was and is still being punished despite an initial "win" in court. The glove didn't fit so the jury did acquit, but the civil suit screwed him in the end (and continues to any time it is publicly announced that he's got some assets, heh).

Sexual harassment lawsuits are also a load of bull****. Again, if you're a ********* and sexually harass your employees then I have to think your reputation will precede you and your business will suffer as a result. But if you don't like it then just quit your damned job and go some place where you're respected.

Suing someone over that is a load of ****.

[Midtowner]

Sexual harassment lawsuits are also a load of bull****. Again, if you're a ********* and sexually harass your employees then I have to think your reputation will precede you and your business will suffer as a result. But if you don't like it then just quit your damned job and go some place where you're respected.

Suing someone over that is a load of ****.

Having the threat of a lawsuit has promoted business environments where we have to treat employees with dignity and respect. I think folks should have a right not to be subjected to quid pro quo sorts of situations where promotions and raises are contingent on sexual performance. But yeah, that's just crazy talk.

[yermom]

Sexual harassment lawsuits are also a load of bull****. Again, if you're a ********* and sexually harass your employees then I have to think your reputation will precede you and your business will suffer as a result. But if you don't like it then just quit your damned job and go some place where you're respected.

Suing someone over that is a load of ****.

people that have bills to pay and decent jobs can't just up and leave one. i know those concepts are hard for you ;)

[SicEmBaylor]

people that have bills to pay and decent jobs can't just up and leave one. i know those concepts are hard for you ;)

Then suck it up and deal with it. If I want to sexually harass my employees then that should be my business and my business alone.

Now, shut your whore mouth and bring me a coffee.

[Turd_Ferguson]

Then suck it up and deal with it. If I want to sexually harass my employees then that should be my business and my business alone.

Now, shut your whore mouth and bring me a Zima.

FIFY

[BigTip]

Heh, Im going in fer a Cleaning on the 2nd, My Dental assistant is Hot and I hope I get some Ear Boob.

Exactly. That's the reason I go to the dentist that I do...hot teeth cleaning gal.

[MsProudSooner]

Then suck it up and deal with it. If I want to sexually harass my employees then that should be my business and my business alone.

Now, shut your whore mouth and bring me a coffee.

Be sure to doctor that coffee with whatever additives please you - from exlax to cyanide.

[olevetonahill]

Be sure to doctor that coffee with whatever additives please you - from exlax to cyanide.

With an Attitude like that you gonna be a Ms fer a long time.

[Soonerjeepman]

I suspect you didn't think she should have got fired because she is attractive and failed to consider the fact that the dentist has every right to do so which is why you added: there at the end.

really? lol,,,where did I say I thought she shouldn't have gotten fired for being attractive? all I said was I was surprised the women's libbers didn't jump on it and the PC courts of this country upheld it...especially because the court was all male. Like I said before I could care less why she got fired or if she sues and wins...NEVER said the dentist didn't have the right to fire her as well...you read way too much into it.