why America is going to miss the bush tax cuts

[jk the sooner fan]

you lefties might learn something from this

http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2012/12/06/why-america-is-going-to-miss-the-bush-tax-cuts/

[Soonerjeepman]

yup....but they'll still blame the Republicans. Most folks that actually understand this article didn't vote for obama.

[badger]

Obama’s ploy of blaming all of this on the Republicans will not work this time. The public knows the Bush tax cuts were adopted into law by the Republicans, with complete Republican control of Congress and the White House at the time. It will be too obvious that it took President Obama and his new neo-Marxist Democrat Party to let them expire.

Enjoy the new Obama recession. You and your neighbors voted for it.

While I agree that blaming Bush will not work forever, blaming Obama and Democrats alone for the expiration of all Bush tax cuts will also not work, because Republicans control the House.

If the tax cuts all expire, it will be a failure among Democrats, Republicans and Obama together, equally.

Do I expect voters to hold elected officials accountable if we go over the fiscal cliff? Hard to say. While national voters re-elected a Democrat Senate, Republican House and Obama presidency, they are increasingly voting Republican majorities in state representation (as evidenced by Meat chicken's right-to-work passage). It creates an interesting political climate... interesting, but probably not too helpful to Joe Q Taxpayer

[TheHumanAlphabet]

While I agree that blaming Bush will not work forever, blaming Obama and Democrats alone for the expiration of all Bush tax cuts will also not work, because Republicans control the House.

If the tax cuts all expire, it will be a failure among Democrats, Republicans and Obama together, equally.



Nope Badj...I will blame EVERYTHING about the fiscal cliff (sad note, many in Congress, i.e. dims - think it is a physical cliff... I would like to push the lot of them over one!) on The Socialist. He wants your money BAD! He will bring everything down to get it. He wants to control everyone;s life and have them be on welfare...then he and the progressives can control your life.

Nope, all of this on The Socialist, he ain't even negotiating...

[Midtowner]

The article is political hackery.


The proof is in the pudding over the Bush tax cuts. They were followed by a record 52 straight months of job creation, producing 8 million new jobs, with the unemployment rate falling to 4.4%. Business investment spending, which had declined for 9 straight quarters, reversed and increased 6.7% per quarter, producing all those new jobs.

Of course, we'll just ignore the whole 2007 thing which happened despite the Bush tax cuts.

And of course that's his strategy. He's going to be able to paint the Republicans as the villains here. He'll be able to turn around and offer only the tax cuts he wants to happen and then watch Republicans stop those to protect 2% of the American people. It's a dang good strategy and the Speaker is going to have to come to the table and make some big concessions, or this will happen.

[JohnnyMack]

The crash of '08 was caused by overregulation?

Hmmmm......

[yermom]

it's Bush's fault for making them expire. Obama already extended them further than Bush intended them once.

[BermudaSooner]

The crash of '08 was caused by overregulation?

Hmmmm......

Actually the crash was caused by Barney Frank, Clinton and Bush. It was caused by too much government in business. Fannie, Freddie and Bush's goal to get 50% homeownership. Too much government giveaways...to much gov't in business.

[badger]

it's Bush's fault for making them expire. Obama already extended them further than Bush intended them once.

Oh man... I hope nobody thinks of that to further the "blame bus" bus. Maybe we can push said bus off the "fiscal cliff," hehehehehehe

[BermudaSooner]

it's Bush's fault for making them expire. Obama already extended them further than Bush intended them once.

Actually, Bush didn't have the votes to make them permanent...one guess as to which party opposed them.

http://taxfoundation.org/article/why-are-bush-tax-cuts-expiring

[yermom]

man, remember how horrible things were before those tax cuts. i'm not sure how anyone survived.

all that growth after the tax cuts was just that bubble growing to burst, and not really based on anything. it just came back to reality with the crash. i've yet to see anything proposed that's acutally looking to address the real problems here

[TheHumanAlphabet]

The bubble was happening LONG before any tax cuts, thanks to dim meddling (i.e., we need poor people home loans, never mind they can't afford them...) in Sallie and Fannie Mae...

[BermudaSooner]

man, remember how horrible things were before those tax cuts. i'm not sure how anyone survived.

all that growth after the tax cuts was just that bubble growing to burst, and not really based on anything. it just came back to reality with the crash. i've yet to see anything proposed that's acutally looking to address the real problems here

It is sometimes sad to see the outlook of liberals. Anything good that happens has to be followed up by something bad to get back to status quo. Seems very dismal.

[diverdog]

you lefties might learn something from this

http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2012/12/06/why-america-is-going-to-miss-the-bush-tax-cuts/

Well he sure as **** left a whole lot out of that article. The rise in tax revenues was from the housing bubble. When that popped all of those 8 million jobs disappeared. I guess he forgot to mention the war was off budget. Then again that never bothered Republicans. I could go on.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Yes Diver, you also conveniently forget what the dims did to the loan industry and forced the bankers hands into offering poor *** loans...

[yermom]

The bubble was happening LONG before any tax cuts, thanks to dim meddling (i.e., we need poor people home loans, never mind they can't afford them...) in Sallie and Fannie Mae...

the banks making a quick buck on worthless loans had absolutely nothing to do with it

[diverdog]

Yes Diver, you also conveniently forget what the dims did to the loan industry and forced the bankers hands into offering poor *** loans...

When in the hell will you Republicans accept any sort of responsibilty for the mess you created? Never I suppose. And your thesis on the housing problem is incorrect.

[yermom]

It is sometimes sad to see the outlook of liberals. Anything good that happens has to be followed up by something bad to get back to status quo. Seems very dismal.

as opposed the conservative fantasy land where all you have to do is work hard and you'll never have to worry about anything ever again. eventually you will be the 1%, so be sure to protect their tax rate at all costs.

seriously though, you might try reading things a little more slowly or something, because you obviously missed the point of my statement

[JohnnyMack]

Actually the crash was caused by Barney Frank, Clinton and Bush. It was caused by too much government in business. Fannie, Freddie and Bush's goal to get 50% homeownership. Too much government giveaways...to much gov't in business.

Heh. OK. If you say so.

[JohnnyMack]

Speculative bubbles have been created, nursed along and popped for generations. It's not a D or an R thing, rather it's something banks do. If any of you think that the housing bubble that collapsed in 08 is the fault of the Democrats in Washington, you're out to lunch. The amount of wreckless gambling taking place by these Wall Street investment banks in the form of CDS' and Derivatives trading is so far beyond what some Washington DC politician could grasp its absurd to lay the blame at the feet of a notion such as overregulation. It wasn't Washington DC holding a gun to the head of Wall Street, it was the other way around. Wall Street is the one who was allowed to combine commercial and investment banks and then used the collateral they had tied up in ****ty bets as ammunition to receive their bailouts. They knew if they didn't get what they wanted, they could just burn the whole fcuking house down.

[diverdog]

Speculative bubbles have been created, nursed along and popped for generations. It's not a D or an R thing, rather it's something banks do. If any of you think that the housing bubble that collapsed in 08 is the fault of the Democrats in Washington, you're out to lunch. The amount of wreckless gambling taking place by these Wall Street investment banks in the form of CDS' and Derivatives trading is so far beyond what some Washington DC politician could grasp its absurd to lay the blame at the feet of a notion such as overregulation. It wasn't Washington DC holding a gun to the head of Wall Street, it was the other way around. Wall Street is the one who was allowed to combine commercial and investment banks and then used the collateral they had tied up in ****ty bets as ammunition to receive their bailouts. They knew if they didn't get what they wanted, they could just burn the whole fcuking house down.

Thank you.

[FaninAma]

Speculative bubbles have been created, nursed along and popped for generations. It's not a D or an R thing, rather it's something banks do. If any of you think that the housing bubble that collapsed in 08 is the fault of the Democrats in Washington, you're out to lunch. The amount of wreckless gambling taking place by these Wall Street investment banks in the form of CDS' and Derivatives trading is so far beyond what some Washington DC politician could grasp its absurd to lay the blame at the feet of a notion such as overregulation. It wasn't Washington DC holding a gun to the head of Wall Street, it was the other way around. Wall Street is the one who was allowed to combine commercial and investment banks and then used the collateral they had tied up in ****ty bets as ammunition to receive their bailouts. They knew if they didn't get what they wanted, they could just burn the whole fcuking house down.

So you're saying that both political parties are paid whores for the big banks? I concur.

[pphilfran]

Speculative bubbles have been created, nursed along and popped for generations. It's not a D or an R thing, rather it's something banks do. If any of you think that the housing bubble that collapsed in 08 is the fault of the Democrats in Washington, you're out to lunch. The amount of wreckless gambling taking place by these Wall Street investment banks in the form of CDS' and Derivatives trading is so far beyond what some Washington DC politician could grasp its absurd to lay the blame at the feet of a notion such as overregulation. It wasn't Washington DC holding a gun to the head of Wall Street, it was the other way around. Wall Street is the one who was allowed to combine commercial and investment banks and then used the collateral they had tied up in ****ty bets as ammunition to receive their bailouts. They knew if they didn't get what they wanted, they could just burn the whole fcuking house down.

Brooksley Born agrees...

[MR2-Sooner86]

Bunch of Keynesian mother f*ckers in here.

[Soonerjeepman]

So you're saying that both political parties are paid whores for the big banks? I concur.

yup...at least the pubs admit it...lol dems are oh no NOT US...

[diverdog]

The bubble was happening LONG before any tax cuts, thanks to dim meddling (i.e., we need poor people home loans, never mind they can't afford them...) in Sallie and Fannie Mae...

The poor did not cause this crash. Sorry but you are flat wrong.

[Midtowner]

The poor did not cause this crash. Sorry but you are flat wrong.

You are wrong! The poor flooded the real estate market with credit by creating mortgage-backed securities and creating a climate whereby credit unworthy people were extended credit despite unworthiness based on the presumption that real estate was a safe double-digit gain every single year and the unworthy would become worthy by refinancing in the future. This is a climate the poor people created! They met at the poor people meeting and said "hey, we're going to screw ourselves, ruin our credit and lose our life savings based on poor speculative investment and we understand this because we understand money better than those silly banking types."

They practically forced companies like Magnetar to sell mortgage backed securities which the poor people made companies like AIG rate AAA when they later became completely worthless. Those damned poor people...

[TheHumanAlphabet]

When in the hell will you Republicans accept any sort of responsibilty for the mess you created? Never I suppose. And your thesis on the housing problem is incorrect.


No its not! The bust was from the bubble of the housing boom caused by poor loans fueled by the dims wanting poeple who can't afford homes to have homes. Since it passed Congress, I accept that the repubs had a hand in it, but they didn't initiate it.

[JohnnyMack]

yup...at least the pubs admit it...lol dems are oh no NOT US...

Your error is that you want to make this a D vs. R problem when it's actually a Wall Street vs. The Rest of America problem.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

That I can agree with...

[Midtowner]

No its not! The bust was from the bubble of the housing boom caused by poor loans fueled by the dims wanting people who can't afford homes to have homes. Since it passed Congress, I accept that the repubs had a hand in it, but they didn't initiate it.

Objectively false. We've been over this, I've seen diver school you. Stop ignoring objective fact.

[diverdog]

No its not! The bust was from the bubble of the housing boom caused by poor loans fueled by the dims wanting poeple who can't afford homes to have homes. Since it passed Congress, I accept that the repubs had a hand in it, but they didn't initiate it.

Read this:

http://m.minneapolisfed.org/article.cfm?id=4136

[diverdog]

Your error is that you want to make this a D vs. R problem when it's actually a Wall Street vs. The Rest of America problem.

We were subject to the biggest heist in history amd no one got punished. It was leverage that caused this mess. People could make billions without having skin in the game. All this was done in the name of market liquidity.