The Dust Bowl on PBS

[cleller]

If you've got a parent or grandparent that lived thru the Dust Bowl in Oklahoma, you'd probably enjoy this. Its airing now, but I'm sure will be repeated. It centers on the Oklahoma panhandle area.
The stories about the dust storms are very familiar. Heard them my whole life. My mom grew up in Lindsay Oklahoma, born in 1922. She's 90 now, and has had problems since childhood due to "dust pneumonia".

Another well done Ken Burns film.

[lexsooner]

I'm watching it now. Heartbreaking.

[olevetonahill]

I lived out there in the mid to late 70s early 80s. Went thru some dust storms . From what I know, what I saw was just an minor inconvenience compared to back then .

That wind will drive ya nuts now , couldnt imagine having to listen to it and put up with the dust the way it was then.

[ouwasp]

Yeah, I'm watchin' it right now......my 81 yr old dad spent much of his childhood in Shawnee, a ways from the true Dust Bowl, but he did see a few of the "Black Rollers" come through.

His family ran a cafe... not far from the train station. Dad still tells stories of men that were riding the rails (going across the country looking for work anywhere), and would come by the cafe...absolutely famished. Grandma would always give them a bowl of stew and a couple pieces of bread. The men would literally wolf the food down, swabbing every bit of the bowl with the bread...

[cleller]

My mom would always tell stories of hanging wet sheets across windows and doors to catch the dust coming in every day. Constant sweeping, black clouds of dust. Scrubbing floors, doing other's ironing, picking cotton, chopping broomcorn. Hard life.

Long after my dad died she remarried a man from the Duncan area. His family had lived in a dugout. Their dad left them, forced to eat possums, sister died after another baby sister dropped a bar of lye soap into their well. Those dust bowl folks are tough stuff.

[badger]

When the dust bowl sent some Oklahomans to California Will Rogers said the average IQ of both states went UP.

You're welcome, Californee :P

[8timechamps]

Okay, I got a chance to watch some of the show. Amazing photographs!

Although I grew up and was educated in Oklahoma, I never really learned much detail about the dust bowl days, other than people leaving in mass. What exactly caused the dust storms, and why have they not occurred (to that magnitude) since?

[rock on sooner]

Glad someone posted this. Hard to imagine the hardships those folks
faced. My family's history is really wrapped up in this...grandparents
from OK to Arkie, back to OK, then to Cali and then back to OK. Got some
family pics that look just like what Burns had in his documentary but no
dates, names, etc. real shame.

[olevetonahill]

Okay, I got a chance to watch some of the show. Amazing photographs!

Although I grew up and was educated in Oklahoma, I never really learned much detail about the dust bowl days, other than people leaving in mass. What exactly caused the dust storms, and why have they not occurred (to that magnitude) since?


Lot of Causes
Drought, the main one , Over plowing, No wind breaks. Lots of little things that added up to one big Dust cloud

[rock on sooner]

Lot of Causes
Drought, the main one , Over plowing, No wind breaks. Lots of little things that added up to one big Dust cloud

Extended drought...8 years worth. Interesting to note that farm land
management brought the land back and even withstood a couple of
two year droughts later. Those dayum dust storms were awesome
to behold...

[olevetonahill]

Extended drought...8 years worth. Interesting to note that farm land
management brought the land back and even withstood a couple of
two year droughts later. Those dayum dust storms were awesome
to behold...

Long assed drought , those Dust storms wernt ALLSOME they were terrible

[jkjsooner]

If we discuss the last hour or so this thread will end up on the political board.

[FaninAma]

Excellent documentary. What is striking is how much our society's attitude regarding government handouts has changed over the past 75 years. Can you imagine the screaming and hollering that would occur if people had to work in a WPA type program before they got any government subsidies? And part of the reason it worked was because tthe family unit was still intact for the most part.

It is interesting that their were actually a lot more immigrant to California from other states than from Oklahoma. The collapse of farm prices had more to do with the mass migration than did the Dust Bowl.

[Petro-Sooner]

Great show. My moms side is from beaver county. Really wish I had ask grandma about the storms before she pasted.

[rock on sooner]

Long assed drought , those Dust storms wernt ALLSOME they were terrible

Vet, meant the storms created an awestruck feeling of helplessness, not
the traditional meaning of awesome...

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Excellent documentary. What is striking is how much our society's attitude regarding government handouts has changed over the past 75 years. Can you imagine the screaming and hollering that would occur if people had to work in a WPA type program before they got any government subsidies? And part of the reason it worked was because tthe family unit was still intact for the most part.

It is interesting that their were actually a lot more immigrant to California from other states than from Oklahoma. The collapse of farm prices had more to do with the mass migration than did the Dust Bowl.Well, on the show, they said most of the exodus from the central plains states was tenant farmers that had no property of their own, and when food prices dropped, those tenant farmers were broke, and owned nearly nothing. Those people came from as far east as Arkanss and missouri, but were all referred to as "Okies". So, the heart of the Dust Bowl only provided a minor percentage of the migrants to California.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Excellent documentary. What is striking is how much our society's attitude regarding government handouts has changed over the past 75 years. Can you imagine the screaming and hollering that would occur if people had to work in a WPA type program before they got any government subsidies? And part of the reason it worked was because tthe family unit was still intact for the most part.

It is interesting that their were actually a lot more immigrant to California from other states than from Oklahoma. The collapse of farm prices had more to do with the mass migration than did the Dust Bowl.Ken Burns really made FDR look good in the Dust Bowl production, as he always does with democrat presidents. of course, he focused on the financial relief that was given to dust bowl area residents, and much less on the lack of knowledge and/or will the farmers had to employ sensible farming methods, to hold the water in the soil, and curtail rapid runoffs.

[rock on sooner]

Ken Burns really made FDR look good in the Dust Bowl production, as he always does with democrat presidents. of course, he focused on the financial relief that was given to dust bowl area residents, and much less on the lack of knowledge and/or will the farmers had to employ sensible farming methods, to hold the water in the soil, and curtail rapid runoffs.

I thought that Burns did a good job of pointing out that H. H. Bennett was
credited with a lot of terraced farming, cover crops and other good land
stewardship. Bennett was the first head of the Soil Conservation Service.

[ouwasp]

The show ended with a rather ominous note... the Ogallala Aquifer is quickly being used up... at present rates it will be gone in 20 yrs...this water table supplies H2O to parts of 8 states, from west Texas up to the Dakotas. the alarmists say it could become sahara-like on down the road...

One of the old-timers said his family was one of the first to begin pumping from the tremendous reservoir; now he regrets this. "In a few years, I won't be around... but someone's not gonna have drinking water... and they're gonna wonder why did those folks use all that water to grow hog feed?" <shakes his head>

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

The show ended with a rather ominous note... the Ogallala Aquifer is quickly being used up... at present rates it will be gone in 20 yrs...this water table supplies H2O to parts of 8 states, from west Texas up to the Dakotas. the alarmists say it could become sahara-like on down the road...

One of the old-timers said his family was one of the first to begin pumping from the tremendous reservoir; now he regrets this. "In a few years, I won't be around... but someone's not gonna have drinking water... and they're gonna wonder why did those folks use all that water to grow hog feed?" <shakes his head>If sensible, proven environment-friendly measures are used, such as contour plowing and terracing where needed, the land should at least be sufficiently green and wet enough to not have massive dirt exposure, and consequently horrid dust storms. That should be the case, even without use of the Ogalallah Aquifer for irrigation.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I thought that Burns did a good job of pointing out that H. H. Bennett was
credited with a lot of terraced farming, cover crops and other good land
stewardship. Bennett was the first head of the Soil Conservation Service.He did that, but went to extra measure to trumpet FDR's welfare to Dust bowl area folks, AS IF a republican or conservative president wouldn't have been willing to provide financial relief to those desparate folks.

Also, Burns presented FDR's brainstorm of destroying livestock as something good, or at least not bad, when it truly was unconscionable.

[diverdog]

Lot of Causes
Drought, the main one , Over plowing, No wind breaks. Lots of little things that added up to one big Dust cloud

They would pulverize the soil back then. Thank god for no till.

[rock on sooner]

He did that, but went to extra measure to trumpet FDR's welfare to Dust bowl area folks, AS IF a republican or conservative president wouldn't have been willing to provide financial relief to those desparate folks.

Also, Burns presented FDR's brainstorm of destroying livestock as something good, or at least not bad, when it truly was unconscionable.

Desparate times call for desparate measures, but I don't necessarily disagree.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Desparate times call for desparate measures, but I don't necessarily disagree.I don't get the part about not using the livestock for food, rather than rounding them up, shooting and burying them.

[cleller]

I don't get the part about not using the livestock for food, rather than rounding them up, shooting and burying them.

My interpretation is that would be allowing the farmers to eat their cake and have it, too.

It sounds harsh and illogical, but people stuck to principles more back then. Then livestock was purchased by the government to bring up the cost of beef by cutting back on the supply. Supply and demand principles. After the farmers sold the livestock, they relinquished their supply, and entered the demand side as a consumer.

To have given them the beef, no matter how logical and sensible it may seem, would have violated one of the tenets of this theory.

[olevetonahill]

I don't get the part about not using the livestock for food, rather than rounding them up, shooting and burying them.

Moren likely , Just MHO. The live stock were so malnourished that they wernt really fit for consumption add in the Lack of modern refrigeration and transportation , I can see it making sense. Especially when they were devouring any and ALL ground cover that was still left to hold the Top soil in place

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Moren likely , Just MHO. The live stock were so malnourished that they wernt really fit for consumption add in the Lack of modern refrigeration and transportation , I can see it making sense. Especially when they were devouring any and ALL ground cover that was still left to hold the Top soil in placeI don't have the inclination to do research on this, but between the Burns' special, and limited accounts I've heard about the situation, I get the impression that a significant amount of that livestock was very useable as food, yet was destroyed rather than used. After all, it was the Depression, and there were LOTS of hungry folks all across the nation.

[olevetonahill]

I don't have the inclination to do research on this, but between the Burns' special, and limited accounts I've heard about the situation, I get the impression that a significant amount of that livestock was very useable as food, yet was destroyed rather than used. After all, it was the Depression, and there were LOTS of hungry folks all across the nation.

No clue really, I were just makin a rational guess.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

No clue really, I were just makin a rational guess.In the tv special Burns did on the liquor prohibition years, he totally glossed over the economic boom years of Coolidge and Harding, then lionized FDR, acting as thogh he did reasonable things during the Depression, with all his programs, instead of taxing less as he should have, to jump-start the economy. Of course, the 3 terms of FDR never did do anything to help America get to building and investing, and economic stagnation was the norm under Roosevelt. It took a World War to motivate people to build and create things.

[olevetonahill]

If you say so bro, I DRGAS, we got enough shatty politicians to worry about today instead of draggin some up from 70-80 years ago.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

If you say so bro, I DRGAS, we got enough shatty politicians to worry about today instead of draggin some up from 70-80 years ago.No intent on feeler hurtin' you. I just get really tired of the portrayal by the media and misinformed individuals of FDR as a good president. He did more to foster socialism amd gain acceptance of it than anyone I can think of, all the while it produced negative effects, and yet, he was STILL CHARACTERIZED AS A GOOD PRESIDENT BY SO MANY. A very ominous reality.

[rock on sooner]

No intent on feeler hurtin' you. I just get really tired of the portrayal by the media and misinformed individuals of FDR as a good president. He did more to foster socialism amd gain acceptance of it than anyone I can think of, all the while it produced negative effects, and yet, he was STILL CHARACTERIZED AS A GOOD PRESIDENT BY SO MANY. A very ominous reality.

No intention here for any kind of argument, but, RLIMC, I think FDR was right
for the times. I can't think of any other approach that would have worked, given
what the country faced. And, I agree with Vet, it IS 80 some years ago....

[olevetonahill]

Yea My feelers aint hurt a bit cause I dont reall GAS about what happened 80 years ago, I didnt have anything to do with it , Cant change it and we got enough dumbassed Politicos to deal with today

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

No intention here for any kind of argument, but, RLIMC, I think FDR was right
for the times. I can't think of any other approach that would have worked, given
what the country faced. And, I agree with Vet, it IS 80 some years ago....He came along and gave handouts to the truly needy. I contend ANY PRESIDENT would have done that.

But, he didn't lower taxes, and instead, had govt. programs that hired people for a while, but didn't provide ongoing jobs, nor induce incentives to grow. The economy stayed n the tank all during the 1930's, and only got moving due to a freakin' World War. FDR established the socialist mentality for all of the nannystate crap we have had from democrat presidents (and weak republicans) since his tenure. now we have socialized medicine, which gives the government more power over its citizens than we even yet realize.

[rock on sooner]

He came along and gave handouts to the truly needy. I contend ANY PRESIDENT would have done that.

But, he didn't lower taxes, and instead, had govt. programs that hired people for a while, but didn't provide ongoing jobs, nor induce incentives to grow. The economy stayed n the tank all during the 1930's, and only got moving due to a freakin' World War. FDR established the socialist mentality for all of the nannystate crap we have had from democrat presidents (and weak republicans) since his tenure. now we have socialized medicine, which gives the government more power over its citizens than we even yet realize.

There IS one theory that FDR knew WWII was coming, where it was coming
from AND could have stopped it, but opted to let it go forward for the exact
reason that you mentioned. I've studied a little of the lead up to Pearl and
the "missed" mini subs, the "delayed" wires alerting the War Dept, the "anxiety"
surrounding the Japanese envoys and some of the other things that happened.
I really dismiss the argument that FDR let WWII happen, but, nonetheless, that
school of thought is there..

As to holding on taxes, well, the gov't did need $$ to function. The jobs created
lasted long enough, the training that accompanied was beneficial. Nannystate?
8 years of Ike, then Nixon/Ford, Reagan/Bush I, Bush II...a lot of opportunity to
shoot that down. Kennedy/Johnson and Carter in between then Clinton and Obama.
40 years of Pubs and 24 years of Dems, with four more to come. I don't see it, plus
we are nowhere near socialized medicine.

[rock on sooner]

Aw, Hell, never mind, it was 80 some years ago...

[olevetonahill]

Aw, Hell, never mind, it was 80 some years ago...

Dint I say that ? You dayum Libs be hard headed mother ****ers.

Why dont Yall go slap the **** out of that dude named hitler next :welcoming:

[rock on sooner]

Dint I say that ? You dayum Libs be hard headed mother ****ers.

Why dont Yall go slap the **** out of that dude named hitler next :welcoming:

We did, werent yew payin tention?