Why was Clay in the game?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Instead of Whaley or Finch? It doesn't ever make any sense to me. Clay is the last guy we should have in there as running back or kick/punt receiver. Phantom holding call, unneccesarily downing received balls in the end zone, running into people, and dropping a certain touchdown pass. Whenever we have Whaley in there he performs well, at least as a runner.

[soonercastor]

Yeah I didn't get it either.
FWIW that dropped passed you're referring to wouldn't have resulted in a TD but yeah you have to catch the ball.

[SoonerorLater]

If I were to speculate I would say they feel Clay is the best combination of running, blocking and receiving they have to back up Williams. When they run the hurry-up they can't be deficient in any area.

[Soonerus]

I think must be a really good practice player with a great attitude. Otherwise, I do not understand it either...

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I think must be a really good practice player with a great attitude. Otherwise, I do not understand it either...If logical, they could put him in for blocking, at least at times, if he's that dependable, but HE SHOULD NOT TOUCH THE FOOTBALL!

[EatLeadCommie]

Pretty obvious that Whaley got in the doghouse early this year for something. Not sure what. Fumbles? Something else?

Clay is solid, though. Reminds me of Chris Brown.

[TexasIsOUsBtch]

I agree that Clay should never be on the field, let alone touch the football! He is clearly NOT the 2nd best back on the team but they refuse to play Finch. I've heard the coaches problem is that he doesn't work hard enough in practice. So the hell what? Do you think Nick Saban cares about how hard his stars practice? Hell, he probably could care less if they show up to practice as long as the make it to the stadium by kickoff on Saturday! It's ridiculous! Cale Gundy is supposedly the one who decides the running back that goes in the game.. Fire him! He's worthless! He was hired in 1999 as running backs coach, and in 2012 IS STILL IN THAT SAME JOB! If I was hired at McDonald's as a fry guy in 1999 and 13 years later was still dropping fries in the hot oil, I would have to think that either me or my boss would be smart enough to come to the conclusion that I'm not cut out for this line of work! While we're talking about people who shouldn't be in the game.. Javon Harris, seriously? By my estimation he was "out of position", a phrase commonly used in the Venables era, on both the long plays ND popped us with. And, how about Tom Wort? He can't keep up with the tight ends and receivers that just blow right past him. Yes he can knock the F out of someone when they're barely moving, but c'mon! Why is Shannon not getting more PT? Sorry for the long rant, just sick and tired of this same old crap year after year after year!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Pretty obvious that Whaley got in the doghouse early this year for something. Not sure what. Fumbles? Something else?

Clay is solid, though. Reminds me of Chris Brown.Clay is NOT solid. he has been ineffective at running forever, or at least all of his time at OU. Whaley has always done very well, and should be right behing Williams. Maybe start now, since Williams could be hampered.

[SoonerorLater]

I think Clay is solid. I'm not sure what everybody is talking about. He has averaged 7.2 yards per carry which is better than Williams, Whaley or Millard. Finch has averaged about 10 yards per carry (on 6 attempts) but can't block a lick.

[EatLeadCommie]

Clay is NOT solid. he has been ineffective at running forever, or at least all of his time at OU. Whaley has always done very well, and should be right behing Williams. Maybe start now, since Williams could be hampered.

I think he's solid. I think Whaley is the better RUNNING back, but that doesn't mean Clay sucks. Clearly, Clay must be doing something better in practice or as a whole (running and blocking and not making mental errors) on the field. Maybe they played him because his ability to protect Landry is better than Whaley's. I have no idea. Maybe they just played him because he slobs Bob's knob. Beats me.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Two things to remember:

(1) Bob lets the offensive coaches run their side of the ball, and
(2) Bob lets the offensive coaches run their side of the ball.

Got questions about any of it?

Proven runners sitting out pretty much whole games?
Offense tempo ruined during drives with screwed up substitution packages that cause timeouts?

Do we just not questions Gundy, Huepel, Norvell, Patton, and the lawyer/preacher/ old Stoops friend guy?

[8timechamps]

C'mon guys, Clay averages 7.2 ypc. He's good at picking up the blitz, and usually has good hands.

I really don't get the Clay hate.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

C'mon guys, Clay averages 7.2 ypc. He's good at picking up the blitz, and usually has good hands.

I really don't get the Clay hate.Nobody hates him. He just doesn't play as well as Whaley or Finch, and really muffed big in this very important game. He dropped 2 critical passes, ran when he shouldn't have on kickoffs, and didn't run when he should have on kickoff returns.

[swardboy]

Clay didn't beat out Whaley for the job last year! For the life of me I don't understand the disappearance of Whaley from the offense. He runs tough, he runs fast, he blocks well. He was on his way to superstar until the ankle got broken by a lineman rolling up on him from behind as he was making a great block.

To say the offensive decisions leave me scratching my head is an understatement.

[OUmillenium]

Nobody hates him. He just doesn't play as well as Whaley or Finch, and really muffed big in this very important game. He dropped 2 critical passes, ran when he shouldn't have on kickoffs, and didn't run when he should have on kickoff returns.


Bingo (cousin Eddie)

[kevpks]

I also find it odd that Finch and Whaley aren't out there more. However, Clay has been great on kickoff returns this year. Am I wrong? I was under the impression that we had one of the best kick return averages in the nation with him and Finch back there.

I'm not sure I get the Cale Gundy criticism either. Has he not recruited and/or coached some of the best running backs (Griffin, Peterson, Murray) in the history of a school with no shortage of great running backs? Who cares if he is in the same role he was in '99. I think he's damn good at it.

[cleller]

To defend Cale Gundy, we've discussed before that he evidently enjoys the position he has, and does not want to move up the ladder. That's good enough for me. I've got no quarrel with him. Put a Mangino working that Oline in front of his guys, or a Jonathon Hayes working the TEs, he'll look like a genius.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Clay isn't averaging 7.2 yards per carry against opposing first team defenses though.

[jkjsooner]

Nobody hates him. He just doesn't play as well as Whaley or Finch, and really muffed big in this very important game. He dropped 2 critical passes, ran when he shouldn't have on kickoffs, and didn't run when he should have on kickoff returns.

Agree with all of this. He had critical drops and the one time he paused and then decided to run out of the endzone. If you you have to think about it you down the ball. This is D1 football and teams will make you pay if you momentarily pause before returning the kickoff.

[I Am Right]

That was asked at Stoops Press conference on Monday, Stoops said that the plays they were going to run favored Clay

[odontia]

So do you wish we would play Bird/Ripkowski as full back and Millard as tailback exclusively?

[goingoneight]

Honestly, outside of AD and DM, I don't see any of OUr guys doing much better than Clay and Williams did against ND. It's been said numerous times, though... you don't get on the field because of a small handful of highlight reel plays from two years ago. Clay has been apparently the second-best all-purpose guy on the team. If you're angry about that, take it up with guys like Finch and Whaley for whatever it is they're not doing.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

When Clay is in against a first team defense, OU ends up punting on that series. Not a good stat.

[8timechamps]

Clay isn't averaging 7.2 yards per carry against opposing first team defenses though.

Do you know how many stats you would have to alter if you're going to start looking at first team defense vs. back-ups? That's kind of an absurd point.

[8timechamps]

Nobody hates him. He just doesn't play as well as Whaley or Finch, and really muffed big in this very important game. He dropped 2 critical passes, ran when he shouldn't have on kickoffs, and didn't run when he should have on kickoff returns.

There is a difference in hating a player, and hating on a player. I should have clarified.

There is a reason Whaley is down on the depth chart. We don't see everyone, everyday in practice. We don't know how he looks. I know that the few times he's played this season, he didn't look anything like last year.

As for Finch, be mad at Finch. Roy is the reason Roy's not on the field more.

"ran when he shouldn't have on kickoffs, and didn't run when he should have on kickoff returns." - Have you ever returned a kickoff? Trust me, it looks a **** load easier on TV or in the stands. I can't criticize a player for choosing to (or not to) return a kick off.

The dropped passes I'll give you. He should have caught those. There's no excuse for any player to drop a pass that touches their hands (or body).

I think Finch is a guy we need, and should be ahead of Clay, but that isn't happening. Williams is our best RB, but he can't be in on every play, and he was clearly banged up. Clay is a serviceable back. Not the best, but not a slouch either.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Do you know how many stats you would have to alter if you're going to start looking at first team defense vs. back-ups? That's kind of an absurd point.

The point is Clay's 7.2 average has largely been built AFTER the game is at hand. The point wasn't absurd at all.

[OkieThunderLion]

The point is Clay's 7.2 average has largely been built AFTER the game is at hand. The point wasn't absurd at all.

Yeah, especially after OU was up on FAMU and Texas, but it wasn't like it was mostly against back-ups or anything. For the most part he was rotating in against the same competition Williams was running against.

[zeke]

Its amazing that OU's coaching staff doesnt come here to figure out who should & shouldnt play.

Hell, why is Clay, L Jones, Wort and various others even on the team. Kick em off they are horrible

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Its amazing that OU's coaching staff doesnt come here to figure out who should & shouldnt play.

Hell, why is Clay, L Jones, Wort and various others even on the team. Kick em off they are horrible

Hm, let's review:

- Message board minions stated that White should start over Hybl. It happened.

- Message board minions stated that A.D. should start over Kejuan Jones. It happened.

- Message board minions stated Ryan Reynolds should be pulled against predominant passing teams even one year before Brent Venables finally did it in the 2009 OU/TX game. McCoy and Shipley have the worst game of their combined careers and Venables continued to pull Reynolds when necessary.

- Message board minions stated that Williams should be starting over Whaley. It happened.


Message board minions > Bob Stoops and co.

[BoulderSooner79]

...
- Message board minions stated that A.D. should start over Kejuan Jones. It happened.
...


That one sure required a collective super-brain to figure out.

[OkieThunderLion]

- Message board minions stated that A.D. should start over Kejuan Jones. It happened.
As soon as he learned the blitz pick-ups! What was it, 3 games or so?

[Seamus]

Do you think Nick Saban cares about how hard his stars practice?

Yes.

[8timechamps]

The point is Clay's 7.2 average has largely been built AFTER the game is at hand. The point wasn't absurd at all.

Okay, maybe absurd was the wrong word, but you have to admit that relying on who played when (when it comes to stats) it's an exercise in futility. Clay has played against more than second team defenses, and you can't just ignore his APC stat.

In any event, Stoops thinks he's good enough to play, so I'm not questioning his opinion of the kid. While I love the back and forth message boards provide, I don't think anyone here is in a better position to make that call.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Hm, let's review:

- Message board minions stated that White should start over Hybl. It happened.

- Message board minions stated that A.D. should start over Kejuan Jones. It happened.

- Message board minions stated Ryan Reynolds should be pulled against predominant passing teams even one year before Brent Venables finally did it in the 2009 OU/TX game. McCoy and Shipley have the worst game of their combined careers and Venables continued to pull Reynolds when necessary.

- Message board minions stated that Williams should be starting over Whaley. It happened.


Message board minions > Bob Stoops and co.AS IF one should not express his/her opinion on a fans' message board. It couldn't hurt for the coaches to look at this thing.

[8timechamps]

AS IF one should not express his/her opinion on a fans' message board. It couldn't hurt for the coaches to look at this thing.

That's why message boards are fun. But, no, coaches don't and wouldn't look here. We love to talk football and analyze the games, but we don't know 1/2 of what they do about football/the personnel/the team.

[Curly Bill]

That's why message boards are fun. But, no, coaches don't and wouldn't look here. We love to talk football and analyze the games, but we don't know 1/2 of what they do about football/the personnel/the team.

Speak for yourself! :)

[8timechamps]

Speak for yourself! :)

Actually, I was referring to all of you...I am at a much higher level mentally. You are all morons.

[Curly Bill]

Actually, I was referring to all of you...I am at a much higher level mentally. You are all morons.

There are a lot of morons posting here, but so then are there lots of them everywhere I go. It's so distasteful to be in and amongst the peasantry.

[StoopTroup]

C'mon guys, Clay averages 7.2 ypc. He's good at picking up the blitz, and usually has good hands.

I really don't get the Clay hate.

Me either. He's as qualified as any guy on the field. Williams was doing great and then came off limping. ND players were grabbing ankles and softening them up every chance they got. There was one play where once the play was over...the ND Defensive Player pulled our guy back a yard or so to try and get a better spot. Did it hurt one of our players? I have no idea but they weren't liking how we came right out in the first drive and marched down the field. Had we not had the bad snap.....that drive would have at least gone on to score a FG if not a TD. It gave them momentum and proof that they could stop us...even though we basically stopped ourselves.

Finch got hurt and never really was the same the next Season. Same for Whaley. We all hope that these guys can come back and be even better but most times it doesn't happen. We have seen two great players with Collarbone injuries (AD and Bradford) overcome those injuries and go on to the Pros. The RBs? Not so much. Stoops never announces how bad injuries are and he seems very good at keeping all injuries from being discussed outside the Team. I know this frustrates Fans who want to know why a certain player is in instead of a player who might be their favorite or they had high hopes that that player might be the next AD or Bradford but any idea that Stoops and the Staff aren't playing the best they have seems a bit like sour grapes especially when we lose a game and a big game that we all know....we should have won.

I like Clay. He's not my favorite Sooner RB but he's had some great plays and is someone I think we can count on but not use every down like we did DeMarco Murray. Clay is one of the very good RBs in our stable and when we have them all available and healthy...I think we are very hard to stop. That said....we didn't have a great rushing game against Kansas so I don't know why anyone would think we would do better against ND unless we had every RB healthy and available....which we did not.

[StoopTroup]

Hm, let's review:

- Message board minions stated that White should start over Hybl. It happened.

I still wonder if message board minions had convinced Bob to start Hybl instead of White against Nebraska in Lincoln....would we have won that game or would the lose have been worse? The thing is....would Jason have not blown out his knee and gone on to have a Pro Career? Would Hybl have gained in confidence by winning that game and Jason have never played again?


- Message board minions stated that A.D. should start over Kejuan Jones. It happened.

That was one hell of a dream you had there.


- Message board minions stated Ryan Reynolds should be pulled against predominant passing teams even one year before Brent Venables finally did it in the 2009 OU/TX game. McCoy and Shipley have the worst game of their combined careers and Venables continued to pull Reynolds when necessary.

Everyone knows Reynolds was injured and came out when he felt he was hurting the Team. He was a heck of a Leader. You don't know what you are talking about at all.


- Message board minions stated that Williams should be starting over Whaley. It happened. Of course Whaley being hurt the year before and nearly ending his football career had nothing to do with Williams being brought in early. You are wrong again and if you consider yourself a minion don't. I'd go with more of a rotten onion describing you and your opinions on this board.


Message board minions > Bob Stoops and co.

You should go cash that check the University sent you. Maybe even have a bigger House than Bob's built. You and the minions you are in contact with should built it yourself. It will hold up for about 2 seconds....which is a little longer than your opinions.

[soonercastor]

He read this thread. You pissed him off! :encouragement:

[StoopTroup]

I believe this thread is dead now.

WTG CLAY ! ! !

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

When Clay is in against a first team defense, OU ends up punting on that series. Not a good stat.

I think today's game is putting to rest your dream stat without having to even go back and look at previous games. Also of note is that this is the first time in 4 years that I can recall that Jones has answered an opposing score with a score twice in a row.

[StoopTroup]

I think today's game is putting to rest your dream stat without having to even go back and look at previous games. Also of note is that this is the first time in 4 years that I can recall that Jones has answered an opposing score with a score twice in a row.

Very nice way of saying....

STFU Dip****.

Very Nice.

[cvsooner]

OSU two years ago is the only other one I remember.

[Soonerus]

Clay played great, he looked like a new man...

[cleller]

Glad to see it. Great for us. Great for Clay.

I fear Williams may be having trouble with that ankle for awhile.

[kevpks]

Great game for a hard working Sooner. He really helped us win today.

[Curly Bill]

We gave a running back significant carries and he looked like a real running back! Who'd a thunk it?

[8timechamps]

Clay played his *** off today. Just a reminder that "bad" or "mediocre" backs don't get fully scholarships to play football at Oklahoma. I guess that's all I was saying.

In the interest of full disclosure, I know the Clay family. So, that could explain my biased.

[StoopTroup]

Clay played his *** off today. Just a reminder that "bad" or "mediocre" backs don't get fully scholarships to play football at Oklahoma. I guess that's all I was saying.

In the interest of full disclosure, I know the Clay family. So, that could explain my biased.

No reason to claim bias when a kid has a game like he did today. Every Game we have needed someone to have a good game...they have been there except for the two games we lost. All of the games we have won were won as a Team and the two we lost were Team losses. We could very well be undefeated right now but just like Bob and other Coaches say...there isn't a formula for having a perfect Season. They are tough to come by and when they happen....they are pretty darn special.

Just because we have a couple of losses doesn't mean we don't have a good team. We do.

I just sent in my request for Bowl Tickets even though we aren't going to the MNC. I'm not going to give up on this Team. I hated seeing us lose at Home to KSU and ND but it's history and we still have fOUr more games before we go Bowling. Winning OUt is what I am hoping for now.

[FirstandGoal]

Okay, so I wasn't sold on Clay before today, but he looked pretty solid. Whether it was a fluke or not only time will tell.

Anybody have any ideas on the extent of William's injury?

[StoopTroup]

Time will tell?

Our RBs are all hurt or keep getting hurt.

Also....Clay is a junior so I'm not sure how much time you are going to take to decide whatever you think you are going to decide about him but this so far is his best Season at OU.



Season
G-GS
Rush
Yds
Avg
TD
Lg
Rec
Avg
TD
Lg


2010
9-0
36
127
3.5
-
13
3-13
4.3
-
8


2011
11-6
75
274
3.7
1
12
18-104
5.8
-
16


2012
7-0
30
220
7.4
3
41
6-32
5.4
-
14


Career
27-6
141
635
4.5
4
41
27-149
5.5
-
16

[SoonerorLater]

Clay has been good all year. After today's game his YPC actually went down. That is how good he has played this year.

[goingoneight]

Clay is so much like Chris Brown. So is DDW, but he's got the speed CB didn't.

[SoonerMom2]

I don't know the Clay family but I do know that when Brennan Clay is 100% healthy you see the reason he was offered a scholarship at OU. Saw it last year at the Insight Bowl. I was so happy for him today. Nice to see good guys finish first and from his tweets he is a very good guy. Never understood some of the haters.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

He read this thread. You pissed him off! :encouragement:He TRIED to fall down on that touchdown run. He was stumbling/falling forward, but he got over the goal line first!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

No reason to claim bias when a kid has a game like he did today. Every Game we have needed someone to have a good game...they have been there except for the two games we lost. All of the games we have won were won as a Team and the two we lost were Team losses. We could very well be undefeated right now but just like Bob and other Coaches say...there isn't a formula for having a perfect Season. They are tough to come by and when they happen....they are pretty darn special.

Just because we have a couple of losses doesn't mean we don't have a good team. We do.

I just sent in my request for Bowl Tickets even though we aren't going to the MNC. I'm not going to give up on this Team. I hated seeing us lose at Home to KSU and ND but it's history and we still have fOUr more games before we go Bowling. Winning OUt is what I am hoping for now.Hey yeah! Maybe we can win out and play LSU or FU , UGA or South Carolina in the Cotton Bowl!