Um Kay Landry....

[sooneredaco]

Well not sure about the rest of you, but I'm ready for a change at the QB position. Yea I know the defense gave up big plays as well. Not saying have Blake Bell in there would have led to a W, but it sure as hale would have created a much needed momentum change. From the television side of things, that stadium was dead. I mean crickets dead. For one of the biggest OU games in recent memory. I guess there just wasn't anything to get to excited about? I guarantee you, Belldozer would have created a significant buzz. Just sayin....

[One4OU]

Blake has the emotion, if he has skills to back it up then Im excited.

[trwxxa]

The change comes next year, be patient ;)

[Okie35]

I'm not sure about you but I'm ready to get a consistent running game.

[soonerinabilene]

Landry was on fire until they reached the 35, then they would slow down and try to run it. He sure didn't do anything to lose the game tonight.

[NorthernIowaSooner]

I think this game cemented Landry's legacy as a good QB that never could win the big ones.

[goingoneight]

I'm not sure about you but I'm ready to get a consistent running game.

This... and only this. Period. End. Of. Thread.

[rainiersooner]

This is a stupid thread...Landry had a fine game. I egress you want him to start tebow-ing or something? He had no vertical options all game and we had no run game. How on earth do you blame this on landry???

[soonercastor]

LOL WTF, how do you out this game on Landry?
That's just how he is, yes the team needs a leader but if the players cant get pumped for this then that's their problem.

[rainiersooner]

I think this game cemented Landry's legacy as a good QB that never could win the big ones.

Good not great, fine. Doesn't mean he lost this game for us.

[MyT Oklahoma]

LJ is the man until Bob says different.

The offensive playcalling left something to be desired but also not my responsibility.

I would love to have a mobile quarterback and next year we will. But it's Bob's team and his call.

I've been disappointed more than once since 1999 but I still support Stoops.

[OU_Sooners75]

I'm not sure about you but I'm ready to get a consistent running game.

Come on. A consistent running game won't happen with the OL recruiters and coaches we have!

[NorthernIowaSooner]

Good not great, fine. Doesn't mean he lost this game for us.

Didn't say he did.

[goingoneight]

Less than 22 yards rushing up against over 300 yards rushing and this is Landry's fault. Right. I believe that.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.

[sooneredaco]

This is a stupid thread...Landry had a fine game. I egress you want him to start tebow-ing or something? He had no vertical options all game and we had no run game. How on earth do you blame this on landry???

I distinctly remember a comment a former tOSU QB said, (Herbie, during the broadcast if you can't catch the hint) "I saw this guy in practice. He can really sling the ball. He can run this offense" or something to that extent. So are you saying have Bell in the game doesn't improve the run game? Because I saw otherwise tonight. Once again... Just sayin....

[Curly Bill]

I'm not putting the loss on LJ, but he has no charisma or leadership. He may not have lost it, but I never had the feeling he was going to win it for us either.

[Gilligan]

Time to BENCH LANDRY for the YEAR and let BELL finish the season... since he will be the QB next year

[picasso]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.
That goal line **** isn't his fault. It's the fact that we can't consistently run the ball when the box is stacked. I've seen him throw some pretty good balls in the red zone.

[Gilligan]

Did you watch the game?

[goingoneight]

I'm not putting the loss on LJ, but he has no charisma or leadership. He may not have lost it, but I never had the feeling he was going to win it for us either.
That's a fair assessment. The whole team coughed it up in the final nine minutes of the game.

[aero]

Was ready last year. Its impossible to not like Landry. Seems like a really good guy and I hope he finds success and happiness at whatever he ends up doing. I think what confounds me the most is that the first time I saw him play he seemed like a pretty good qb and would only get better but in the four years I've watched him it seems like he is the same qb as that first game. I kept thinking he's not too bad and can only get better. The doubt began in 2010 and cemented itself last year. I figured this year we'd just have to endure. But it will be refreshing to me to see a different qb. Of course it could be worse but its its time.

[Boomer.....]

If Bell was as good of a thrower as Landry, he'd be in there.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

That goal line **** isn't his fault. It's the fact that we can't consistently run the ball when the box is stacked. I've seen him throw some pretty good balls in the red zone.

Yes, it is. That's why the Belldozer came about last season. He couldn't execute in the red-zone.

[sooneredaco]

I'm not putting the loss on LJ, but he has no charisma or leadership. He may not have lost it, but I never had the feeling he was going to win it for us either.

Nailed it

[thecrimsoncrusader]

If Bell was as good of a thrower as Landry, he'd be in there.

Kind of like how his coaching staff in the past started Kejuan over AD? Whaley over Williams? Hybl over White? Etc. etc. etc.

[picasso]

Yes, it is. That's why the Belldozer came about last season. He couldn't execute in the red-zone.
You mean Landry couldn't run it in from the five? You're ****ing brilliant.

[winout]

Time to BENCH LANDRY for the YEAR and let BELL finish the season... since he will be the QB next year

Ha, you watch OU football in the last 10 years? He's lucky to see the ball between the 10's in a blowout. Get's maybe 2 minutes.

[BoulderSooner79]

I'm not sure about you but I'm ready to get a consistent running game.

Yes, but we tried enough to convince me it wasn't going to happen in this game. Both Williams and Millard were patient enough and ran hard, but there was nothing there - we couldn't block those guys.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I'm not putting the loss on LJ, but he has no charisma or leadership. He may not have lost it, but I never had the feeling he was going to win it for us either.

Landry has one HUGE flaw that was a big factor in tonight's loss. That flaw is that he has led us on scoring drives after the opponent has some big play (a score or whatever) less than <5% of the time he has been at OU. It is so bad that his backups inherit too (Bell's fumble against KState was right after a KState score). It is what is going to doom him to being a good college QB with good stats.

[rainiersooner]

If Bell was as good of a thrower as Landry, he'd be in there.

No he wouldn't because the coaching staff is stupid!

Didn't you know?

[goingoneight]

Yes, it is. That's why the Belldozer came about last season. He couldn't execute in the red-zone.

Yeah... and Whaley, Murray, Millard and everybody else could just run the ball well in short-yardage situations. :rolleyes:

[One4OU]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.
That goal line **** isn't his fault. It's the fact that we can't consistently run the ball when the box is stacked. I've seen him throw some pretty good balls in the red zone.

Im confused..we cant run it with Landry in their then why cant he pass it?

We run with Bell and he seems to be able to pass, maybe the wrong guy is playing.

[SOONER44EVER]

If Jason White and Sam Bradford played with this group they'd have the same legacy. I just don't get all the hating on Landry.

[Curly Bill]

No he wouldn't because the coaching staff is stupid!

Didn't you know?

Stupid? No

Stubborn as hell? Yes

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Im confused..we cant run it with Landry in their then why cant he pass it?

We run with Bell and he seems to be able to pass, maybe the wrong guy is playing.

Because in order to be able to throw it near the end zone you have to have amazing WRs. Think about TTech under Leach, for years they were great between the 20s but when they got into the red zone...

[picasso]

Im confused..we cant run it with Landry in their then why cant he pass it?

We run with Bell and he seems to be able to pass, maybe the wrong guy is playing.
So right! Maybe Bell should have started instead of Sam Bradford. Just think of those two TD's we could have gotten on Florida...

[sooneredaco]

Im confused..we cant run it with Landry in their then why cant he pass it?

We run with Bell and he seems to be able to pass, maybe the wrong guy is playing.

I like where your going with this!
:cool:

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

If Jason White and Sam Bradford played with this group they'd have the same legacy. I just don't get all the hating on Landry.

White? No. Bradford? Yes.

Words can not say just how good Jason White was in non-title games.

[radio]

Yes, it is. That's why the Belldozer came about last season. He couldn't execute in the red-zone.

So I guess all of the td's Landry threw were outside of the red zone?

Belldozer came after Broyles got hurt and all of the recievers were too fing stoned or stupid to get open. Why they all got the boot.

[jkjsooner]

Landry was on fire until they reached the 35, then they would slow down and try to run it. He sure didn't do anything to lose the game tonight.

This is what I don't get. I understand trying to establish the run but when it isn't working, you're in a passing down and right outside field goal position, it makes little sense to run for a yard. I remember one second and 10 where we killed the drive by attempting a run when it was apparent that it wasn't going to work.

And yes I understand defenses can get more aggressive in passing downs and as you get down the field the defense has less space to cover they never proved they could stop us without ill-timed runs.

[Eielson]

Landry played a great game. This was not his fault.

[kenth68]

most impressive drive was bell getting that 4th down conversion. gutsy plays.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

This is what I don't get. I understand trying to establish the run but when it isn't working, you're in a passing down and right outside field position, it makes little sense to run for a yard. I remember one second and 10 where we killed the drive by attempting a run when it was apparent that it wasn't going to work.

Yep, they did this in the 2nd quarter and it cost us the game. We had ND reeling in the first quarter and then they went meercat and let their defense back in the game. I mean you could almost tell when Josh's scripted plays ran out and he looked down and was like "Now we have to establish the run".

[OUmillenium]

I'm not putting the loss on LJ, but he has no charisma or leadership. He may not have lost it, but I never had the feeling he was going to win it for us either.

How many times over the last 4 years does this comment fit the bill?

Too many

[sooneredaco]

Landry played a great game. This was not his fault.

I'm not really saying it his "fault". Football is a team sport. The loss is on the team. My point is, that team, that stadium, that offense, seemed uninspired. Blake seems to possess some natural leadership raw emotion that seems to be lacking. If he can really sling the ball like Herbie said, if he really has the ability to run this offense, why not give it a shot. Mix sh!t up a bit. Get the crowd on their feet. Put that defense on its hills. Pop the sh!t out of them on their lip. Landy is not capable of that. History doesn't lie

[SOONER44EVER]

How many times over the last 4 years does this comment fit the bill?

Too manyAbout the same amout of times we heard "The D needed a big stop and they let the other team drive right down the field".

[Curly Bill]

How many times over the last 4 years does this comment fit the bill?

Too many

He just doesn't have a single drop of that magical "it" factor.

He seems a good guy, smart, handsome I guess, throws the ball well...he's just not a leader of men, or even in this case young men.

I'm sure none of em would admit it, but down deep I wonder how many of his teamates really believe in this guy?

[OUmillenium]

yep ^

[tulsaoilerfan]

I am not a Landry fan by any means, but this dumb *** offensive meerkat wait till the play clock is winding down strategy is what kills Jones as a QB; i would be willing to bet that if you look at most of his what the **** moments they probably occur when the play clock is about to go to 0; how the hell can you read a defense if you barely get the ball snapped in time?

[sooneredaco]

I'm sure none of em would admit it, but down deep I wonder how many of his teamates really believe in this guy?

I'd love to be a fly on the wall

[aero]

I'm a firm believer that a qb, and for that matter almost any player, can change how a team overall performs. You see it all the time. A running back can't get past the line after repeated attempts. Then a backup comes and makes good gains. The line is the same. The plays are the same. But that back sees the openings different. Or he makes just the right moves to elude tacklers. The qb is unquestionably the most important position and has the most effect on a team. Typically, a good or great team will have an outstanding qb. Not many great teams have mediocre qbs. The Ravens are one exception and Dilfer was a capable qb that didn't make mistakes and let the defense do the job. Yes, a different qb can make the same offense look different. And actually be better.

[picasso]

I am not a Landry fan by any means, but this dumb *** offensive meerkat wait till the play clock is winding down strategy is what kills Jones as a QB; i would be willing to bet that if you look at most of his what the **** moments they probably occur when the play clock is about to go to 0; how the hell can you read a defense if you barely get the ball snapped in time?
Yeah, the last time I can recall that we really did well with that was at oSu in '10.
Remember the good ole days when you lined up and ran a play without seeing what the defense was showing you?

[jkjsooner]

Kind of like how his coaching staff in the past started Kejuan over AD? Whaley over Williams? Hybl over White? Etc. etc. etc.

Are you saying they did that or is there some sarcasm there. I never remember Hybl playing in front of a healthy White nor Peterson being second string beyond his first couple of games.

[Eielson]

I'm not really saying it his "fault". Football is a team sport. The loss is on the team. My point is, that team, that stadium, that offense, seemed uninspired. Blake seems to possess some natural leadership raw emotion that seems to be lacking. If he can really sling the ball like Herbie said, if he really has the ability to run this offense, why not give it a shot. Mix sh!t up a bit. Get the crowd on their feet. Put that defense on its hills. Pop the sh!t out of them on their lip. Landy is not capable of that. History doesn't lie

I've always found the fire people up argument pretty weak. First off, you really don't know how fired up guys are unless you're in the huddle. Secondly, it's not really the quarterback's job to do that anyway. Even if Landry did suck the motivation out of people, that shouldn't carry over to the running plays. If anything, they should be excited the ball isn't going to be in his hands. The passing plays were fine. Landry played almost mistake-free ball against one of the finest defenses in the country. If we run the ball consistently and our defense plays as well late in games as they do early, we're well on our way to getting whipped by Alabama in the national championship game.

[MyT Oklahoma]

Oh well. Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.

See 'ya next week.

[Eielson]

We lost to a great football team. The blame game doesn't need to be played. If it is, put it on Colvin or the running game, though. Not Landry.

[sooneredaco]

I'm not really saying it his "fault". Football is a team sport. The loss is on the team. My point is, that team, that stadium, that offense, seemed uninspired. Blake seems to possess some natural leadership raw emotion that seems to be lacking. If he can really sling the ball like Herbie said, if he really has the ability to run this offense, why not give it a shot. Mix sh!t up a bit. Get the crowd on their feet. Put that defense on its hills. Pop the sh!t out of them on their lip. Landy is not capable of that. History doesn't lie

I've always found the fire people up argument pretty weak. First off, you really don't know how fired up guys are unless you're in the huddle. Secondly, it's not really the quarterback's job to do that anyway. Even if Landry did suck the motivation out of people, that shouldn't carry over to the running plays. If anything, they should be excited the ball isn't going to be in his hands. The passing plays were fine. Landry played almost mistake-free ball against one of the finest defenses in the country. If we run the ball consistently and our defense plays as well late in games as they do early, we're well on our way to getting whipped by Alabama in the national championship game.

Are you saying that if Bell doesn't improve our ability to run the ball? I saw other wise. Perhaps the most emotional part of the game came when Bell came in for the 4 consecutive run plays that lead to our only touchdown. As far as I recall he wasn't mistake free. 0 TD's and 1 INT isn't mistake free football

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Are you saying they did that or is there some sarcasm there. I never remember Hybl playing in front of a healthy White nor Peterson being second string beyond his first couple of games.

Hybl was first string until the Texas game, White then started and was out 2 games later with a torn ACL.

[StoopTroup]

How many times over the last 4 years does this comment fit the bill?

Too many

When someone says it over and over every week and then a Team that lost to K-State nearly the same way plays an undefeated Team that's Ranked 5th in the Nation comes and you again are within a TD to tie up the game....

of course you get that feeling.

Against Texas I guess you get that feeling too....

What a croc of BS

We lost a big game against a good team...ND deserves to be told they are good and played well against one of the better Offenses in the Nation

We didn't play flawless Team Football

You want to hang in on LJ fine. It doesn't matter. Like some have said...Bob played the best QB we have and he'll play in the next game and probably every game till the last second ticks off the clock in whatever Bowl Game we play in.

[Curly Bill]

We lost to a great football team. The blame game doesn't need to be played. If it is, put it on Colvin or the running game, though. Not Landry.

STFU Whitney!

[soonercastor]

I remember one second and 10 where we killed the drive by attempting a run when it was apparent that it wasn't going to work.


I remember that drive, on first down we threw to Millard for no gain. Second down we run the ball, I was like WTF?

[sooneredaco]

STFU Whitney!
BAWHAHAHAHA!!!

[budbarrybob]

I distinctly remember a comment a former tOSU QB said, (Herbie, during the broadcast if you can't catch the hint) "I saw this guy in practice. He can really sling the ball. He can run this offense" or something to that extent. So are you saying have Bell in the game doesn't improve the run game? Because I saw otherwise tonight. Once again... Just sayin....

First off, I guess the TV didn't show the crowd accurately. It WAS fired up. Lots of noise and emotion for most of the game and especially when we needed to be loud. Landry is a decent system QB. Having Bell in at QB didn't change much in the run game. I think our average yards per carry was slightly over 2. Bell didn't fare any better. ND is a better team top to bottom. Save a couple of positions.

[Eielson]

As far as I recall he wasn't mistake free. 0 TD's and 1 INT isn't mistake free football

What mistakes did he make? That INT wasn't even legitimate, and ND's quarterback didn't throw for a touchdown, either.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Are you saying that if Bell doesn't improve our ability to run the ball? I saw other wise. Perhaps the most emotional part of the game came when Bell came in for the 4 consecutive run plays that lead to our only touchdown. As far as I recall he wasn't mistake free. 0 TD's and 1 INT isn't mistake free football

WTF, that INT was on the receiver, not Landry. He hit saunders right in the numbers (too bad the DB hit him before that).

[sooneredaco]

WTF, that INT was on the receiver, not Landry. He hit saunders right in the numbers (too bad the DB hit him before that).

He straight threw that ball into traffic with TO or whatever the Hale his name is right there to dive and pic it off, amazing play for sure.

I'm talking in circles here though... Main point I was trying to make in this thread is that the guy seems disconnected and emotionless and it seems to rub off on the team. It seems to especially be the case in biggest games. That rubs off on crowd, which that's a whole different topics for sure! No team in the country is intimidated to come play ball at our house. The Domers proved it by shoving it down our throat and adding insult to injury when the game was well in hand.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

He straight threw that ball into traffic with TO or whatever the Hale his name is right there to dive and pic it off, amazing play for sure.

I'm talking in circles here though... Main point I was trying to make in this thread is that the guy seems disconnected and emotionless and it seems to rub off on the team. It seems to especially be the case in biggest games. That rubs off on crowd, which that's a whole different topics for sure! No team in the country is intimidated to come play ball at our house. The Domers proved it by shoving it down our throat and adding insult to injury when the game was well in hand.

Wow, that is some logic chain off of weak unproveable premise.

[Breadburner]

WTF, that INT was on the receiver, not Landry. He hit saunders right in the numbers (too bad the DB hit him before that).


I thought that was P.I.....

[Eielson]

It seems to especially be the case in biggest games.

3-0 in bowl games. 3-0 vs Texas. 1-0 in Big XII championship games.


No team in the country is intimidated to come play ball at our house.

This is not true at all.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I thought that was P.I.....

Even though he hit the receiver before the ball came out of Landry's hand, there was no flag. Thus how could it be PI?

[Breadburner]

Even though he hit the receiver before the ball came out of Landry's hand, there was no flag. Thus how could it be PI?

I just thought he was draped over his back before the ball got there.....

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I just thought he was draped over his back before the ball got there.....

Sorry, forgot my sarcastic smiley.

[TitoMorelli]

When the biggest reason you can come up with to blame a player is that he doesn't act enough like Chase Daniel, that's some awfully weak sauce.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

When the biggest reason you can come up with to blame a player is that he doesn't act enough like Chase Daniel, that's some awfully weak sauce.

Maybe if Landry picked his nose more, we'd be undefeated

[SOONER44EVER]

Maybe if Landry picked his nose more, we'd be undefeated

Only if he ate it afterward. :)

[TitoMorelli]

Maybe if Landry picked his nose more, we'd be undefeated

:smug:

[Breadburner]

Sorry, forgot my sarcastic smiley.


Lol..I was wondering about that....hah...

[FaninAma]

Landry was fine....a lot better than the KSU game. I still think he has problems hitting receivers in stride and makes them reach back for too many passes which decreases their YAC.

And when is Josh going to learn to use some misdirection or counters when the power running game isn't working?

[soonertodd]

Anyone blaming Landry for this loss needs to STFU!

[Sooner70]

Yep. This one wasn't on Landry like KSU was. There was one play where he coulda run for a first down as he had a clear field and he tried a dunk pass that didn't work.

No, it appears this one is a case of a patchwork offensive line, although they tried very hard & played their hearts out, couldn't open the holes to result in a defined running game. I thought the OL did a good job the first part of the game giving Landry lots of throwing time. Then, ND forced OU into single dimension--no running-- & that' spelled the doom. ND's defensive front & LB corps is pretty darned physical & good. I was a bit surprised Landry didn't try the long ball more, as I thought their secondary was kinda questionable, but I'm sure there was a good reason.....

[Jason White's Third Knee]

How do people watch this and blame Landry? Oh yeah. The back up QB is always the most popular guy on the team.

My assessment. The D line applied no pressure. We dont have a Tommy Harris etc The O line got no push. Our running game stinks people. It has for years. Snap a few balls at the QBs feet or maybe when there is no QB there and we have a great way to stall promising drives and fail to get in the end zone. Feel free to erroneously blame it on one of the best players we have ... with a spotless off the field record no-less. Leading by example is no longer fashionable. We need a big fist pumping, camera mugging jackass like Tim tebow. Yep. We all loved Tebow's antics when we had a mild QB on our sidelines.

[olevetonahill]

This team was NOT fired up to play, Thats the fault of the Coaches from Bob Down. The Players dint want it bad enough. And why in hell was the Stadium so ****in quite?

Big East Officials? WTF.

[cleller]

Blake has the emotion, if he has skills to back it up then Im excited.

Wishing now we could go back and start the year with him. I think we'd likely be a better team. He's a winner. He has confidence and determination that we currently lack. Sorry Landry.

[FaninAma]

The crowd was fine. When ND had the ball the noise level was good. I really don't think the crowd should be loud when OU has the ball...but that is just me.

At some point the team has to do something positive to build on the crowd energy.

[FaninAma]

Wishing now we could go back and start the year with him. I think we'd likely be a better team. He's a winner. He has confidence and determination that we currently lack. Sorry Landry.

Every great OU QB has made critical plays in big games. The good QBs not so much.

[cleller]

After Landry got hit hard in the first quarter, there were several times in 3rd and long that Landry too quickly dumped off to a receiver for little or no gain. Very fast, very emotionless 3 and outs. In those situations Gholson would buy time and tear us up, or run for the first down.

My point is, we might fare better with a QB that can at least attempt to add that dimension to the team. I feel that Bell would.

[Sooner70]

Well folks, good (I'm on than end of it) bad or indifferent, at least OU knows who the starting QB is. It appears now our Longhorn friends are back in controversey about this as Mack hasn't said who will start next week. I'd sure rather be where OU is than have to continually put up with that kind of deal.

[OUNASH]

If Bell was as good of a thrower as Landry, he'd be in there.

I think Bell is probably a better overall athlete and passer if you well. The problem is Bell doesnt have the understanding yet of the whole offensive scheme and doesnt get the practice time with the first team as Landry. Landry will hold all of the recordsbut I beleieve Bell will be the better overall QB.

[cleller]

The crowd was fine. When ND had the ball the noise level was good. I really don't think the crowd should be loud when OU has the ball...but that is just me.

At some point the team has to do something positive to build on the crowd energy.

The crowd was good for the most part. The crowd sensational and pumped before the botched snap. Then, you could feel a chill already. Still, the crowd was great when ND took their first possession. After the 62 yard TD run it was never the same. It was still pretty good, especially on the east (student) side, but never again a super, emotional frenzy. People were pissed at the familiar way things seemed to be turning.
No confidence in the team.

[olevetonahill]

The crowd was good for the most part. The crowd sensational and pumped before the botched snap. Then, you could feel a chill already. Still, the crowd was great when ND took their first possession. After the 62 yard TD run it was never the same. It was still pretty good, especially on the east (student) side, but never again a super, emotional frenzy. People were pissed at the familiar way things seemed to be turning.
No confidence in the team.


I wernt there , Just dint seem very loud on TeeVee

[bluedogok]

First off, I guess the TV didn't show the crowd accurately. It WAS fired up. Lots of noise and emotion for most of the game and especially when we needed to be loud.
I guess some people prefer the sound mix of the Fox Network games where they over-mix the crowd audio to over power the announcers.

I don't like the Tebow-style RAH-RAH QB, it seems contrived and fake to me and something that could eventually wear on the team. It seems most of the successful QB's are more cerebral, quiet leader type of players. To me the RAH-RAH leaders tend to be more on the defensive side where the playing with reckless abandon attitude is better suited to that side of the ball.

[FaninAma]

Again, I only have 2 complaints against Landry. First, the receivers have to adjust their routes to catch too many of Landry's throws(even on short routes) which kills YAC. Secondly, when the team needs a big play in a big game Landry just doesn't get the job done. The one critical do or die play in the 4th quarter was made by Bell on the pass to Millard.

[okiewaker]

I don't know how good we will be next year but it will be nice to have a QB in there that is a threat to run the ball.

[sooneredaco]

After Landry got hit hard in the first quarter, there were several times in 3rd and long that Landry too quickly dumped off to a receiver for little or no gain. Very fast, very emotionless 3 and outs. In those situations Gholson would buy time and tear us up, or run for the first down.

My point is, we might fare better with a QB that can at least attempt to add that dimension to the team. I feel that Bell would.

I agree with ya

[sooneredaco]

Well folks, good (I'm on than end of it) bad or indifferent, at least OU knows who the starting QB is. It appears now our Longhorn friends are back in controversey about this as Mack hasn't said who will start next week. I'd sure rather be where OU is than have to continually put up with that kind of deal.

^^
No doubt

[FaninAma]

So, if Bell had been the starting QB from the start of the season what would our record be? It would have been at least 5-2. Personally I would be a lot more satisfied with a 5-2 record with Bell as the starter than I am now with a 4 year starter that just hadn't made plays in the big games over his career.

[sooneredaco]

So, if Bell had been the starting QB from the start of the season what would our record be? It would have been at least 5-2. Personally I would be a lot more satisfied with a 5-2 record with Bell as the starter than I am. Ow with a 4 year starter that just hadn't made plays in the big games over his career.

I agree. At least we'd be building for the future. At the same time, Landry has done a lot of good for this program so I guess it would be a di€k move to bench him at this point. So it's a really sh!ty position to be in as a team

[FaninAma]

I agree. At least we'd be building for the future. At the same time, Landry has done a lot of good for this program so I guess it would be a di€k move to bench him at this point. So it's a really sh!ty position to be in as a team

Not saying that. I think the coaches could have encouraged Landry to go pro in a more convincing way after his junior season.

[StoopTroup]

Again, I only have 2 complaints against Landry. First, the receivers have to adjust their routes to catch too many of Landry's throws(even on short routes) which kills YAC. Secondly, when the team needs a big play in a big game Landry just doesn't get the job done. The one critical do or die play in the 4th quarter was made by Bell on the pass to Millard.

Of course we wouldn't want to mention the 35 yard pass to Jalen Saunders to the ND 17 that set up Blake's Red Zone entry into the Game that happens nearly every game. It's why Blake gets his number called. He's been successful on short yardage. If Blake could make the 35 yarders....he'd start. If you don't give Landry the shot in the Red Zone...he's not going to make the big play.

[StoopTroup]

Not saying that. I think the coaches could have encouraged Landry to go pro in a more convincing way.

Maybe he'll come back for a 6th and 7th year....lol

[OUTrumpet]

I am not a Landry fan by any means, but this dumb *** offensive meerkat wait till the play clock is winding down strategy is what kills Jones as a QB; i would be willing to bet that if you look at most of his what the **** moments they probably occur when the play clock is about to go to 0; how the hell can you read a defense if you barely get the ball snapped in time?

I was saying this after the KSU game. We took a good offense and handed the keys to a rookie OC.

[FaninAma]

Maybe he'll come back for a 6th and 7th year....lol

Ala Jason White. LOL. I think Landry has accomplished all he is going to accomplish at OU which is a lot in terms of individual statistics.

It is just my opinion but this year I think we would have fared better with the athletic QB than the more experienced QB.

Does ND win last night's game if they play their experience senior over their RS freshman QB.

[sooneredaco]

I am not a Landry fan by any means, but this dumb *** offensive meerkat wait till the play clock is winding down strategy is what kills Jones as a QB; i would be willing to bet that if you look at most of his what the **** moments they probably occur when the play clock is about to go to 0; how the hell can you read a defense if you barely get the ball snapped in time?

I was saying this after the KSU game. We took a good offense and handed the keys to a rookie OC.

Yea Josh could have used a few more years on the sideline before being handed the keys to the O

[Texas Golfer]

Are you saying that if Bell doesn't improve our ability to run the ball? I saw other wise. Perhaps the most emotional part of the game came when Bell came in for the 4 consecutive run plays that lead to our only touchdown. As far as I recall he wasn't mistake free. 0 TD's and 1 INT isn't mistake free football

I believe he said almost mistake free. And I don't fault the QB for an interception that comes off the hands of the receiver.

[FaninAma]

Yea Josh could have used a few more years on the sideline before being handed the keys to the O

Earlier I tended to agree but now I think Josh's play calling is limited by Landry's pocket presence and less than stellar field vision. Let's wait and see what happens next year. We can't laud Josh for his handling of our QBs when he was QB coach and now not take into consideration that he knows the strenght and weaknesses of the QBs better than we do.

I do wish he would call more misdirection and counter plays. We never make defenses play our running game OR short passing gaame honestly. We always allow the defense to gamble and pursue agressively.

[Texas Golfer]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.

You're making it sound like Landry is the only change during that four year period. Josh was a change, too. Under Kevin Wilson, we ran over 100 plays a game and scored the most points in NCAA history. We now run about 65.

We came out last night with the hurry-up offense and moved the ball very well. Landry had about 110 yards passing and the game was only about 6 minutes old. We then slowed our game down and slowed our productivity.

In every game, our productivity was directly corrrelated to the pace of our offense. Even our running game is more productive.

The hurry-up confuses the defense and puts them into a quicker reaction scenario and tires them out. Our problem is not with the QB position. It's with the OC position.

[Breadburner]

Saunders never had a chance on that INT......

[SoonerorLater]

In aggregate I would say the "Hurry-Up" offense is a bad idea. For every plus there seems to be a corresponding minus. The main thing is, that I don't believe that running a greater amount of plays necessarily translates to a higher probability of winning a football game. More scoring yes. A higher likelihood of winning no.

[aero]

Notre Dame knew our weakness. Stop the run and make Landry win it. Kelly looked pretty confident from the get go. Dooesnt take a coaching genius to see the obvious.

[TitoMorelli]

We had an OC who imo would have loved to build his scheme around a multi-threat qb. Wilson devised a potent offense with few if any blue chip players at Northwestern. I wish he'd had the opportunity to implement the same overall scheme while at OU. Seems a little late to expect such changes now with an OC whose background is overwhelmingly pass-oriented. Still can't understand why we hire staffers with certain credentials if we have no intention of utilizing their coaching talents to their fullest.

And as to all the posters wishing Stoops would start Bell the rest of the season in order to prep for next year. You don't do that to seniors (not just LJ) who have given the time and effort to this club. You don't tell those players that they're now going to compromise their odds for winning the remaining games of their college career just so the underclassmen and a bunch of spoiled fans can get their hopes up for 2013.

[soonertodd]

Why didnt this thread show up after te Texas game,or the Tech game??

[Curly Bill]

Why didnt this thread show up after te Texas game,or the Tech game??

Because we blew out two inferior opponents???

[kevpks]

I'm not down on Landry for this game and I appreciate what he's accomplished here, but I am looking forward to Bell taking over the offense.

[soonertodd]

Because we blew out two inferior opponents???

no,seems the only times landry gets bashed is after a loss,the KSU gave he deserved the heat,this game no. this game was lost in the trenches,like most are. ND dictated what happened with their line play.was it Landrys fault the D gave up 2 big plays? was it his fault the refs are blind and missed a PI call on a huge drive,or throw a flag on a BS holding call that took 7 off the board?

[OU_Sooners75]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.

Coincidently, James Patton has been here for the same time frame.


Wonder if it has to do with the ****ty recruiting and coaching of the OL since 2008?

Our rushing game has slid every year since 2008. The QB doesn't make the run game successful. The OL does.

And when you don't have a reliable (doesn't have to be a top 10) rushing offense, you can't expect to be a great threat overall offensively.

And it all starts in the trenches. We pass block very good. But run block, no so.

And the OL is only as good as the coaching they get and the recruits that coach gets.


And judging by how pathetic our recruiting has been the last 3-4 years, we are now seeing the end result!


Want to be elite again? Win the battle in the trenches (both offense and defense lines), so you can win the war! OU has the skill players, now we need the big uglies!

[missann]

I'm a firm believer that a qb, and for that matter almost any player, can change how a team overall performs. You see it all the time. A running back can't get past the line after repeated attempts. Then a backup comes and makes good gains. The line is the same. The plays are the same. But that back sees the openings different. Or he makes just the right moves to elude tacklers. The qb is unquestionably the most important position and has the most effect on a team. Typically, a good or great team will have an outstanding qb. Not many great teams have mediocre qbs. The Ravens are one exception and Dilfer was a capable qb that didn't make mistakes and let the defense do the job. Yes, a different qb can make the same offense look different. And actually be better.

Yes! It's maddening to think how many QBs we lost via transfer or recruiting b/c of the decision to stick with LJ. Someone corrected another poster that Hybl indeed was starting ahead of Jason until he had to come out of the TX game. How in the world??

I don't understand. I look at non-powerhouse schools with multi-dimensional, fiery QBs. You mean to tell me OU can't attract one of those?? Or maybe we don't want to. Hmmm....

[SoonerorLater]

We had an OC who imo would have loved to build his scheme around a multi-threat qb. Wilson devised a potent offense with few if any blue chip players at Northwestern. I wish he'd had the opportunity to implement the same overall scheme while at OU. Seems a little late to expect such changes now with an OC whose background is overwhelmingly pass-oriented. Still can't understand why we hire staffers with certain credentials if we have no intention of utilizing their coaching talents to their fullest.

And as to all the posters wishing Stoops would start Bell the rest of the season in order to prep for next year. You don't do that to seniors (not just LJ) who have given the time and effort to this club. You don't tell those players that they're now going to compromise their odds for winning the remaining games of their college career just so the underclassmen and a bunch of spoiled fans can get their hopes up for 2013.

I think you start the players who give you the best chance to win the game you are playing without regard to their status. While I've not been a big Landry fan, at least given the offense we run, I couldn't say Blake Bell would give us a better chance to win more games. Would the experience help for next year? Maybe, maybe not. I would like to see Bell come in earlier then just mop up duty in 4th quarter when we are up big.

[Okie35]

I'm not down on Landry for this game and I appreciate what he's accomplished here, but I am looking forward to Bell taking over the offense.

I honestly want KW back.


Because we blew out two inferior opponents???

that's true but we used every play in the book and every weapon we had unlike against ND... Josh is really inconsistent

[FaninAma]

Notre Dame knew our weakness. Stop the run and make Landry win it. Kelly looked pretty confident from the get go. Dooesnt take a coaching genius to see the obvious.

Yep.

[8timechamps]

As Dean would say, "There's a lot lot of stupid in this thread!".

Landry played good last night. No boneheaded mistakes, and took what he was given by the ND defense. What a lot of you fail to realize, and I admittedly refused to believe until last night, Notre Dame's defense is very good (particularly their front 7). Better than any defense we've seen this year, and maybe better than any we've seen in the past couple of years.

How anyone could put this loss on Landry is mind-blowing. The bottom line is that we were beaten by A BETTER TEAM. For once, in the past few years, we didn't give this game away. Notre Dame took it.

[FaninAma]

Landry did not lose the game. Good on him. That was an improvement over the KSU game. He also didn't do anything special to win the game.

Nobody from OU really lost the game. I thought ND won a lot of the little battles. They converted on 3rd down in the 2nd half. They had the only 2 big plays of the game. They got the bounces and crucial officiating calls.

It looked sort of like the BCS championship game last year. Alabama made the plays when they had to.

[Sooner Schemer]

I honestly want KW back.



that's true but we used every play in the book and every weapon we had unlike against ND... Josh is really inconsistent

I'm not so sure it was Josh's idea to start running on first and second down.
And Notre Dame got better on pass defense once they realized they could get away with holding our receivers.

[TrophyCollector]

Time to BENCH LANDRY for the YEAR and let BELL finish the season... since he will be the QB next year

I'm not an LJ hater, but you have to ask yourself - if Stoops standard of excellence is winning championships, then why would any senior play a single snap the rest of this season? Obviously that won't happen which means the real goal is to attempt to win as many games as possible. 9-3, 10-2 and a good bowl is what we'll be shooting for but personally I'd take 7-5 this year to improve the odds of a Championship next year.

[sooneredaco]

Why didnt this thread show up after te Texas game,or the Tech game??

Because they both suck

[Jason White's Third Knee]

This thread started out dumb and is getting dumber. You don't **** over the seniors that have been here as many as five years and blow up their lives. That is completely selfish and idiotic. If they earn it they play.

Our line play on both sides was weak. We need to start recruiting there hard and possibly change offense line coaches. At least learn how to run block. It ain't the QBs fault when the run game sucks.

I am tired of OU being the team that validates other schools. KSU, ND, Boise, WV, and all that.

[SoonerorLater]

I'm not an LJ hater, but you have to ask yourself - if Stoops standard of excellence is winning championships, then why would any senior play a single snap the rest of this season? Obviously that won't happen which means the real goal is to attempt to win as many games as possible. 9-3, 10-2 and a good bowl is what we'll be shooting for but personally I'd take 7-5 this year to improve the odds of a Championship next year.

What you are suggesting is at best implausible in a world where you have to deal with real human beings. How could you recruit to a school if it got the reputation that upperclassmen would be pulled if the team was out of a National Championship hunt. Also no school is going to pile up losses in the hope of next year being better.

I would like to see the backups getting more PT when the game is under control.

[Texas Golfer]

I'm not an LJ hater, but you have to ask yourself - if Stoops standard of excellence is winning championships, then why would any senior play a single snap the rest of this season? Obviously that won't happen which means the real goal is to attempt to win as many games as possible. 9-3, 10-2 and a good bowl is what we'll be shooting for but personally I'd take 7-5 this year to improve the odds of a Championship next year.

The Big XII championship is not out of the question yet. You don't sacrifice a season.

[TitoMorelli]

I think you start the players who give you the best chance to win the game you are playing without regard to their status. While I've not been a big Landry fan, at least given the offense we run, I couldn't say Blake Bell would give us a better chance to win more games. Would the experience help for next year? Maybe, maybe not. I would like to see Bell come in earlier then just mop up duty in 4th quarter when we are up big.

Good idea.

[MichiganSooner]

How do people watch this and blame Landry? Oh yeah. The back up QB is always the most popular guy on the team.

My assessment. The D line applied no pressure. We dont have a Tommy Harris etc The O line got no push. Our running game stinks people. It has for years. Snap a few balls at the QBs feet or maybe when there is no QB there and we have a great way to stall promising drives and fail to get in the end zone. Feel free to erroneously blame it on one of the best players we have ... with a spotless off the field record no-less. Leading by example is no longer fashionable. We need a big fist pumping, camera mugging jackass like Tim tebow. Yep. We all loved Tebow's antics when we had a mild QB on our sidelines.

I agree with the above. Landry is an outstanding young man who played a heck of a game. Why not put the blame where it belongs? How about all those scholarship studs who were not on the field because they skipped classes, sluffed off in practice or during the off season, got in trouble with the law...got kicked off the team or suspended? They are the reason this team is not undefeated. They are the ones who let their teammates and fans down.

[aero]

I'm not trying to bash LJ and he certainly didn't cost us the game. He seems like a really good guy and he's a decent qb. I personally have never seen anything in his game that made me believe he was an outstanding qb that could win us a NC. That's just my opinion. I was hoping that he would go last year because I thought it was time for a change at that position. But he came back and deserved his chance and to be the starter. I agree that he earned it. He's had a lot of good games. But, for the most part, we seem to beat mediocre to bad teams and build up this belief that we are better than we are. Then we play a good team and it all gets exposed. We have good players, even some that may be really good. I agree with other posters that the LOS is where games are won or lost. We've had some good defensive linemen but seems we've been missing the Harris, Dvoracek, Cody types for a few years. I can't remember the last time we got game to game pressure on the opposing qb. I've seen 3 man fronts pressure qb's but we seldom do except occasionally against weaker teams.
The OL seems to pass block well but run blocking not so much. Again, against inferior teams it works and gets disguised. The hurry up offense almost seems gimmicky at this point. I'd rather be able to line up and run plays and make them stop us as opposed to trying to catch them out of personnel or position. It may work a few times or, again, against inferior teams but its not going to beat the better teams. I'd rather see us with the attitude that we are coming and try to stop us.
I think MS will get the defense back to nasty in a year or two. The offense.... I don't know. Maybe a player will come along that will help move things in a different direction. Didn't we switch from the bone to I with Billy? Anyway, no, its' not LJ's fault. Sometimes just a change is needed.

[TitoMorelli]

This thread started out dumb and is getting dumber. You don't **** over the seniors that have been here as many as five years and blow up their lives. That is completely selfish and idiotic. If they earn it they play.

You hit the nail on the head imo. It's incredibly immature for fans to want guys who have given 3+ years of devotion to this program to be shelved in favor of less talented or experienced undergrads.

[FaninAma]

You hit the nail on the head imo. It's incredibly immature for fans to want guys who have given 3+ years of devotion to this program to be shelved in favor of less talented or experienced undergrads.

So Landry is the most talented QB we have on campus? I give you the experience point and it is a given that it is an important factor but let me ask you a hypothetical question. If ND's top 2 QBs were at OU who would have started yesterday's game.....the senior of the RS freshman?

[dennis580]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.

When you have somebody as dominant in short yardage as Bell then you have to pull Landry. It has nothing to do with Landry, and everything to do with Bell. Bell is a absolute freak. Going to be a nightmare for defenses next year.

[MichiganSooner]

When you have somebody as dominant in short yardage as Bell then you have to pull Landry. It has nothing to do with Landry, and everything to do with Bell. Bell is a absolute freak. Going to be a nightmare for defenses next year.

What happens if he goes down with a knee injury in the first quarter of the first game next season?

[bluedogok]

What happens if he goes down with a knee injury in the first quarter of the first game next season?
The "what if" game can be played to infinity, you can't make solid plans on "what if" theories.

[zeke]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.

Are you F***ing kidding me.

Dumb A** comment

This may be the most stupid remark of the MOST stupid thread ever.

Got to blame it on LJ

Fact is that OU got beat by a better team. Period

Gawd

[FaninAma]

I'm not so sure it was Josh's idea to start running on first and second down.
And Notre Dame got better on pass defense once they realized they could get away with holding our receivers.

I am in agreement. I think there is some other input that is involved.

[tulsaoilerfan]

So Landry is the most talented QB we have on campus? I give you the experience point and it is a given that it is an important factor but let me ask you a hypothetical question. If ND's top 2 QBs were at OU who would have started yesterday's game.....the senior of the RS freshman?

I think we all know the answer there; NO WAY a freshman QB would start at OU over a senior even if the frosh was better

[soonertodd]

I'm not trying to bash LJ and he certainly didn't cost us the game. He seems like a really good guy and he's a decent qb. I personally have never seen anything in his game that made me believe he was an outstanding qb that could win us a NC. That's just my opinion. I was hoping that he would go last year because I thought it was time for a change at that position. But he came back and deserved his chance and to be the starter. I agree that he earned it. He's had a lot of good games. But, for the most part, we seem to beat mediocre to bad teams and build up this belief that we are better than we are. Then we play a good team and it all gets exposed. We have good players, even some that may be really good. I agree with other posters that the LOS is where games are won or lost. We've had some good defensive linemen but seems we've been missing the Harris, Dvoracek, Cody types for a few years. I can't remember the last time we got game to game pressure on the opposing qb. I've seen 3 man fronts pressure qb's but we seldom do except occasionally against weaker teams.
The OL seems to pass block well but run blocking not so much. Again, against inferior teams it works and gets disguised. The hurry up offense almost seems gimmicky at this point. I'd rather be able to line up and run plays and make them stop us as opposed to trying to catch them out of personnel or position. It may work a few times or, again, against inferior teams but its not going to beat the better teams. I'd rather see us with the attitude that we are coming and try to stop us.
I think MS will get the defense back to nasty in a year or two. The offense.... I don't know. Maybe a player will come along that will help move things in a different direction. Didn't we switch from the bone to I with Billy? Anyway, no, its' not LJ's fault. Sometimes just a change is needed.

we went to the i for dupree

[sooneron]

I think we all know the answer there; NO WAY a freshman QB would start at OU over a senior even if the frosh was better

Paul Thompson would beg to differ.

[OU_Sooners75]

Paul Thompson got beat out and wasn't the incumbent starter either.

He got his job back in 2006.

[aero]

we went to the i for dupree

Yes. Thanks. Old age is thing its toll. ;)

[TitoMorelli]

So Landry is the most talented QB we have on campus? I give you the experience point and it is a given that it is an important factor but let me ask you a hypothetical question. If ND's top 2 QBs were at OU who would have started yesterday's game.....the senior of the RS freshman?

My first impression is the same as yours, I imagine, that Bob would stick with the senior. Then again, the situations ND faced and we faced aren't necessarily the same. Others have addressed your post better than I can. I will say that I'd be concerned that the drop in passing efficiency would cancel whatever we gained in offensive balance, at least at this stage of the season.

Giving Bell and/or Allen more snaps in games seems to be a balanced alternative - assuming we get far enough ahead. I don't see any opponents remaining on the schedule that I'm confident we'll have disposed of by halftime.

[soonertodd]

Yes. Thanks. Old age is thing its toll. ;)

no prob buddy,i know what you mean haha

[sooneron]

Paul Thompson got beat out and wasn't the incumbent starter either.

He got his job back in 2006.
Incumbent wasn't mentioned in the original post. He said there is no way that a freshman would start over a senior, even if he was better.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Are you F***ing kidding me.

Dumb A** comment

This may be the most stupid remark of the MOST stupid thread ever.

Got to blame it on LJ

Fact is that OU got beat by a better team. Period

Gawd

Don't blame me for you not having a clue.

[sooneron]

Yeah, dude, you're like, a brilliant football mind...

[OkieThunderLion]

This and Tech were Landry's 2 best games of the season. I'd like so see more Bell. But Landry has done nothing to lose his job.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

This and Tech were Landry's 2 best games of the season. I'd like so see more Bell. But Landry has done nothing to lose his job.

Except he hasn't lead his offense to score points against the two best defenses the Sooners have faced this season. Is that all his fault, no, but he also hasn't helped in that depatment either. Just because a QB completes a pass, doesn't mean it was the right completion. He misses a lot of guys in better position to either get a first down or a score.

[Curly Bill]

LJ had decent stats Saturday, but he did not put the team in the endzone - that results in losing games. Is it all his fault, of course not, but the folks trying to absolve him of blame because he had good stats are also not correct.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

LJ's not Sam Bradford, but you should be able to win with him. We lost because of a misguided offensive philosphy of pass first, pass second and pass third. Alabama has mediocre qb's and finds ways to win games. lsu has horrible qb's and finds ways to win games. If we need Sam Bradford to win games then we're going to continue to get exactly what we're getting.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Paul Thompson got beat out and wasn't the incumbent starter either.

He got his job back in 2006.

He was for all intents and purposes. Otherwise they wouldn't have redshirted him in 2004 so he could be the QB for 2 years. The problem was that somewhere between 2003 and 2005 he lost his desire to run the ball (remember he almost had a 100 yards rushing in that 77-0 game in one quarter). I think that there is ample evidence for someone to argue that our coaches have no idea who the most talented QB on campus is.

[aero]

I think of this team much the same as the Dallas Cowboys. Seems like talented stable of receivers. Not an overpowering or reliable running game. Roster seems full of talent. Coaching seems to be questioned, maybe some deserved, some not. QB that seems to have talent and great stats but just doesn't seem to be able to lead the team to victory in the big games. I heard Tony Dungy on the radio talking about Dallas and he said something like "they don't seem like they can function properly when all the chips are on the line". That made me think of this group of Sooners. Oh well. They are what they are and I'll take them over any other team in the country, year in and year out. Hard to feel too bad being a Sooner fan.

[Kadosh]

We did not get beat by a better team. We lost the game.

Year by year, our recruiting class is always better than ND's recruiting class. It's comes down to how are those recruits being used. It comes down to the coaches.

Brian Kelly played a red-shirt freshman over the senior! The senior even got to play a few snaps, but that was it. Back to the freshman because that was working like clockwork.

I think it's absolute BS that pulling a senior for a junior is bad for the image of OUr program. You think a recruit would rather warm the bench for a couple years or be part of the game plan from the get go?!

Urban Meyer played a 2 QB system when Tebow was a freshman. Why wouldn't Stoops give that method a try? Adding Bell as a mobile QB would have probably opened up our running game. He would have added an element of surprise if he was going to take off or pass. If nothing else, the spy at defense would be occupied enough to have a WR open.

When we go to South Bend next year, Golsom will have more experience than Bell. You think they had confidence during Saturday's game? It's going to be at a whole other level next year. We better get our sh*t together by then.

One of the other big problems we have is that we play horrible against out of conference games (not counting the early game cupcakes). Is the issue that Stoops and staff have played enough conference games, and studied plenty of tape, to know opposing coaches actions? Do we get over confident going into those games thinking we will stomp all over the opponent? Maybe thinking the other team isn't going to bother preparing because the odds are against them? Whatever it is, the coaches have the responsibility to keep the team focused. If players are too busy getting haircuts for national TV, their spot should go to another player that is working much harder.

We were cooking on the first drive. Tempo was great. Brian Kelly was yelling at the refs to try to slow us down. Then that bad snap and Landry was rattled. Is there some juju in the locker room that if we don't score in the first drive, the game hangs by the balance?

I agree with Switzer. This philosophy of not letting underclassmen play is hampering OUr success.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Golson is a crappy QB that OU made look good by giving him all day to throw. Oklahoma needs to fix their front four. Do that and then front seven will be fixed.

[FaninAma]

LJ's not Sam Bradford, but you should be able to win with him. We lost because of a misguided offensive philosphy of pass first, pass second and pass third. Alabama has mediocre qb's and finds ways to win games. lsu has horrible qb's and finds ways to win games. If we need Sam Bradford to win games then we're going to continue to get exactly what we're getting.

Sounds like the 2000 offense. Actually we got beat Saturday because we tried to force the run out of a non-power running formation. The offensive coaching staff is going to have to commit to the power running game which mean we will have to do a better job of recruiting OL.

[FaninAma]

Golson is a crappy QB that OU made look good by giving him all day to throw. Oklahoma needs to fix their front four. Do that and then front seven will be fixed.

It was definitley his best game of the season. Defense played good enough to win. I guarantee you the coaching staff would have been thrilled to have just given up 13 points in the game with 6 minutes left in the 4th quarter. If you had told me that was going to be the case I would have thought OU would have been ahead by 10 or more.

The offense lost this game.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

It was definitley his best game of the season. Defense played good enough to win. I guarantee you the coaching staff would have been thrilled to have just given up 13 points in the game with 6 minutes left in the 4th quarter. If you had told me that was going to be the case I would have thought OU would have been ahead by 10 or more.

The offense lost this game.

Oh yeah, I definitely agree the defense did their job. They did in the KSU game as well given that KSU had well below half of their normal scoring output. My only disappointing thing was the inability to get some pressure on him sometimes to force some bad throws.

[OUTrumpet]

Except he hasn't lead his offense to score points against the two best defenses the Sooners have faced this season. Is that all his fault, no, but he also hasn't helped in that depatment either. Just because a QB completes a pass, doesn't mean it was the right completion. He misses a lot of guys in better position to either get a first down or a score.

Coming from someone that has coached qbs, I would be willing to be that it's the way that we are teaching him to read the coverage as it has been so consistent over the past few years on how he goes through the progression.

[social chairman]

Bob Stoops worst four year period was while Landry was the QB. I am thinking it's more than just coincidence. And if Landry was seriously a competent QB, he shouldn't have to be pulled in goal line situations. He was never pulled because of Oklahoma's lack of a running game. He was pulled because he always choked in goal line or red-zone areas. That's been a problem since 2009 and beyond. It will be a great day for the Sooner football program when he is gone. Oklahoma can get back to business again.This entire quote sickened me...

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Year by year, our recruiting class is always better than ND's recruiting class. It's comes down to how are those recruits being used. It comes down to the coaches.

Year after year we have some seriously overrated recruiting classes. Some examples:

http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2009/oklahoma-24

That was a great recruiting class?

And that isn't even as bad as the class before it (http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2008/oklahoma-24) where our best player on it was the punter.

So I then go look at the same 2 classes from Texas, the primary people we recruit against and wow their classes were horrid too

http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2008/texas-83
http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2009/texas-83

So my conclusion is that for whatever reason, the top talent in Texas is either peeking early or is being dramatically overestimated.

[FaninAma]

Landry is a good QB. OU would win the national championship with Landry as the QB if the Sooners had an offensive line like Bama's. But in the current offensive scheme the QB is required to make above average positive plays in order to beat a team with equal talent. Bradford could do it with his arm and field vision. I think Bell will be able to do it with his running and physical skills. Landry makes all of the routine plays when given time. He just doesn't make the exceptional plays.

[FaninAma]

So my conclusion is that for whatever reason, the top talent in Texas is either peeking early or is being dramatically overestimated.

Or not being developed appropriately or put in a scheme that allows us to compete against teams with similiar talent.

I tend to blame coaching more than I blame the talent.

[OU_Sooners75]

Incumbent wasn't mentioned in the original post. He said there is no way that a freshman would start over a senior, even if he was better.

There was no senior when Bomar got the nod. There was two redshirt freshmen (Bomar and Rawls, who transferred before summer) and a red shirt Junior, Paul Thompson.

Now, who is better than Jones?

I think Jones is the better of all our QBs right now.

If you think someone else is better, who? How do you know?

[TitoMorelli]

Can't remember for sure, but was Bomar made starter after the TCU loss? Or did the coaches wait a few more games?

[OU_Sooners75]

Except he hasn't lead his offense to score points against the two best defenses the Sooners have faced this season. Is that all his fault, no, but he also hasn't helped in that depatment either. Just because a QB completes a pass, doesn't mean it was the right completion. He misses a lot of guys in better position to either get a first down or a score.

I wonder what you were saying when Bradford struggled in 2007 in some games, where he failed to lead the team to score points?

What were you saying when Heupel was leading us and struggling to lead the offense to score points?

Maybe Clay should have caught that 3rd and goal pass late in the first half? Since he didn't we had to settle for 3. He catches it, there's a good chance he scores.

What about Stills not stepping out of bounds? What about his pass interference that negated a TD on the same drive?

What about our WRs running the right routes?

Any moron can say its all Landry's fault. But it wasn't. He completed over 68% of his passes vs. ND. He wasn't careless with the football. He led the offense to quite a few drives, in particular he created over 340 total yards of offense himself.

I'm not a Landry fan. Anyone that has been here long enough would know that. I was hoping he would go to the NFL after last season. I said since he was coming back OU was going to lose two or three games because of him. But this loss to ND was not because of him.

[OU_Sooners75]

Can't remember for sure, but was Bomar made starter after the TCU loss? Or did the coaches wait a few more games?

I think they had a two QB system going with bomar and thompson. But bomar got the nod. And he took over as the starter for good in the second game vs. Tulsa (or UCLA, can't remember who was second game off the top of my head). TCU was the first game.

[OU_Sooners75]

Was Ken Doresy (Miami) better than Jones?
Was Jefferson (LSU) a better QB?
Is McCarron (Alabama) a better QB?

Heck, someone find the list of all the QBs that have won a BCS title, and let's run down the list and see if they are better QBs than Landry Jones.

The QB doesn't win championships for you, well unless you're Young or Newton.

You need solid defense. You need to stay rather injury free. You need some luck. And you need a running game.

As far as the QBs go, they have got to be very good game managers. They don't need the talent to be a NFL pro-bowler.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Or not being developed appropriately or put in a scheme that allows us to compete against teams with similiar talent.

I tend to blame coaching more than I blmae the talent.

In the end, it is always the coaches fault since they control everything except academic eligibility. The problem is that our "talent" on the lines is very poor. Nothing the coaches can do can make these guys any better or bigger or stronger than what we are seeing. It was just mis-evaluation plain and simple. For the lines, we are looking at attributes of guys that just are not carrying over when they gain 50lbs (which is a problem that Texas tends to have in the secondary).

At other positions, we have guys who are athletic enough to play college football (thinking secondary/linebackers/WRs) but they are just not very good at the game of football. Getting them better at the game is something that coaches can help with, but due to mandatory restrictions on practice time, there is a limit to how much you can "coach a guy up".

[FaninAma]

In the end, it is always the coaches fault since they control everything except academic eligibility. The problem is that our "talent" on the lines is very poor. Nothing the coaches can do can make these guys any better or bigger or stronger than what we are seeing. It was just mis-evaluation plain and simple. For the lines, we are looking at attributes of guys that just are not carrying over when they gain 50lbs (which is a problem that Texas tends to have in the secondary).

At other positions, we have guys who are athletic enough to play college football (thinking secondary/linebackers/WRs) but they are just not very good at the game of football. Getting them better at the game is something that coaches can help with, but do to mandatory restrictions on practice time, there is a limit to how much you can "coach a guy up".

I think the fact that a converted TE is our best OL speaks volumes about our talent at that position. And I understand that converted TE's have been known to be very good OL on occassion but it seems like OU tries to make a living doing that.

How do you recruit for "football IQ"? if there is an objective way I think this coaching staff needs to improve in that area. I often wonder if Stoops would have recruited some of the players that played key roles on the 2000 team.

[OU_Sooners75]

You can't recruit for football IQ. Football IQ is learned, not a given.

When recruiting you look for players with the skillsets and their grades. Does the team they play on win games? Doesn't have to be championships, just more wins than losses.

Whe recruiting you look at their physical being for what you are wanting from them. Can they put on some weight and keep their agility, speed, and strength?

Then you look at their character. Are they always skipping classes? Do they volunteer time for their community? Do they go to church? Do they have a good role model? Is their home structure good enough they would succeed without football?

Justg a few things you look at when evaluating players. And no, church doesn't. Really mean much, but it does show you they have the mental capacity to buy into sommething. (If that makes any sense)

[sooner46]

Frist, our team was beaten by a better team as much as I hate to say that.

I am a Sooner fan Win, Lose or Draw, thru the down years and love the up years.

No one person is at fault for this lost, but no one stepped up to win as we should have. Both lines are weak and need improvement.
I will support coach Stoops as long as he wants to stay, I believe he stated one time he was going to retire at age 60.

We own Landry a lot and I wish him and Whitney well. I like being 11-2, 10-3, instead of 5-8, but as most Sooner fans I want 13-0 and the NC. I would like Coach Stoops to start building for next year that means on the second possession of the third quarter put Bell or Allen in get game experience. It took three games for our quarter back and the receivers to get on the same page.

My son played High School football and has said you can practice all you want, but nothing improves your abilities like game time. He when from not playing a down his 10 grade year to first team all-district his senior year. His coach said pretty good for someone who didn’t know how to get into a three point stand when started. It was because he played with heart.

My favorite all time quarter back is Steve Davis then Josh & Sam. Josh was the little engine that could. What can you say about Paul Thompson a team player, he played with heart, won a Big XII Championship. Josh won the Nation Championship with less talent than Landry and with less talent around him; the different is they played with what I call heart. We have some playing with Heart but not enough. You give me team with less talent but have heart (I know they need some talent - speed) over a talented team that believes they have arrived and are owed it, any time. Because the team with heart will find ways to win. Most talented teams today think they have arrived and that’s Texas problem and we are becoming like them.

In 1999 we had been down for ten years, we found a new coach and a bunch of kids with less talent but had heart and they won the Nation Championship in 2000.

Go Sooners I love you - Win or Lose and thanks for the win over Texas.

Sooner46 .

[sooneron]

LJ's not Sam Bradford, but you should be able to win with him. We lost because of a misguided offensive philosphy of pass first, pass second and pass third. Alabama has mediocre qb's and finds ways to win games. lsu has horrible qb's and finds ways to win games. If we need Sam Bradford to win games then we're going to continue to get exactly what we're getting.

You're right, he's not. Sam had some great pull out the win moments from behind like... 07 CU, 08 Fiesta Bowl, 08 UT, 08 Ufla...

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

You can't recruit for football IQ. Football IQ is learned, not a given.

This isn't true at all. Some people are just better at a game than other people and no amount of learning is going to close that gap.

The mix of athletic ability and football IQ are the true limiters as to how good a player can be as they go up levels (pop warner/high school/college/pro). The problem for our evaluators is that it is much easier to assume that a player's athletic ability will overcome his football IQ than it is to assume that a player will get better athletically to use that football IQ. What we saw in 1999 and 2000 was our coaches always went with football IQ and assumed athleticism except in a few cases. So we got guys like Dvoracek, Clayton, Strait, Q, etc because we were going after guys who could play the game. One notable case where we didn't do this is Ataleo Ford vs Wes Welker. Of course, we aren't the only ones guilty of this as Wes Welker is a guy who has been underestimated time and time again.

This all changed from 2002 on (which was the first full recruiting class year after the MNC). At that point, we stopped considering IQ over talent except in a few cases (Iglesias, Bradford, Gutierez, Runnels) with the exception of one position - Defensive End. At DE, we always have 2-3 "eval" picks that go with the 1 "superstar" pick that rarely pans out. If you think about the strongest and deepest position on the team for the last decade it is...Defensive End.

[8timechamps]

We did not get beat by a better team. We lost the game.

Wrong. Watch the game again, the ND line (both sides) controlled the game.




Year by year, our recruiting class is always better than ND's recruiting class. It's comes down to how are those recruits being used. It comes down to the coaches. Wrong again. Not only has ND had very good recruiting classes, they have kept more of their classes in the past 4 years than the Sooners have.



Brian Kelly played a red-shirt freshman over the senior! The senior even got to play a few snaps, but that was it. Back to the freshman because that was working like clockwork.

I think it's absolute BS that pulling a senior for a junior is bad for the image of OUr program. You think a recruit would rather warm the bench for a couple years or be part of the game plan from the get go?!

Urban Meyer played a 2 QB system when Tebow was a freshman. Why wouldn't Stoops give that method a try? Adding Bell as a mobile QB would have probably opened up our running game. He would have added an element of surprise if he was going to take off or pass. If nothing else, the spy at defense would be occupied enough to have a WR open.


Stoops knows what Bell is capable of, and what he can't do (or can't do as well as Landry). Do you really think you know more than Stoops? I don't.



When we go to South Bend next year, Golsom will have more experience than Bell. You think they had confidence during Saturday's game? It's going to be at a whole other level next year. We better get our sh*t together by then.

One of the other big problems we have is that we play horrible against out of conference games (not counting the early game cupcakes). Is the issue that Stoops and staff have played enough conference games, and studied plenty of tape, to know opposing coaches actions? Do we get over confident going into those games thinking we will stomp all over the opponent? Maybe thinking the other team isn't going to bother preparing because the odds are against them? Whatever it is, the coaches have the responsibility to keep the team focused. If players are too busy getting haircuts for national TV, their spot should go to another player that is working much harder.

Yeah, you're probably right. I'm sure Stoops just figured that ND wasn't wasting any time preparing for OU, because they knew they would lose. So, he probably let the kids have the week off to get haircuts. Are you ****ing kidding me?!



We were cooking on the first drive. Tempo was great. Brian Kelly was yelling at the refs to try to slow us down. Then that bad snap and Landry was rattled. Is there some juju in the locker room that if we don't score in the first drive, the game hangs by the balance?

I agree with Switzer. This philosophy of not letting underclassmen play is hampering OUr success.

When (if) you realize that we were beaten by a better team, all of these questions will go away for you. Like it, or not, Notre Dame is better than OU this year.

[OU_Sooners75]

This isn't true at all. Some people are just better at a game than other people and no amount of learning is going to close that gap.

The mix of athletic ability and football IQ are the true limiters as to how good a player can be as they go up levels (pop warner/high school/college/pro). The problem for our evaluators is that it is much easier to assume that a player's athletic ability will overcome his football IQ than it is to assume that a player will get better athletically to use that football IQ. What we saw in 1999 and 2000 was our coaches always went with football IQ and assumed athleticism except in a few cases. So we got guys like Dvoracek, Clayton, Strait, Q, etc because we were going after guys who could play the game. One notable case where we didn't do this is Ataleo Ford vs Wes Welker. Of course, we aren't the only ones guilty of this as Wes Welker is a guy who has been underestimated time and time again.

This all changed from 2002 on (which was the first full recruiting class year after the MNC). At that point, we stopped considering IQ over talent except in a few cases (Iglesias, Bradford, Gutierez, Runnels) with the exception of one position - Defensive End. At DE, we always have 2-3 "eval" picks that go with the 1 "superstar" pick that rarely pans out. If you think about the strongest and deepest position on the team for the last decade it is...Defensive End.

And you failed to even get the point that you quoted me of.

You can teach football IQ. You don't go out trying to recruit all players that have it. Hence I said, "You can't recruit for football IQ."

If that's what you are recruiting for, you'll never fill your scholarship limit, or have a very tough time doing so.

Every recruit you go after has a football IQ. But like a real mental IQ they vary.

Sure, if a kid is blowing smoke or grasping at straws when talking about football, as a recruiter you know their football IQ is low. So they likely won't succeed at the level you need them to.

That said, most recruits that have gone to camps, that have played for awhile, and that have the skill level to do well in D1 already have a manageable football IQ. Meaning they will only get smarter as a football player as they go, and as you teach them.

Any player can raise their football IQ by watching film. By being taught. Football IQ just doesn't happen without learning it.

[sooneron]

There was no senior when Bomar got the nod. There was two redshirt freshmen (Bomar and Rawls, who transferred before summer) and a red shirt Junior, Paul Thompson.

Now, who is better than Jones?

I think Jones is the better of all our QBs right now.

If you think someone else is better, who? How do you know?
Just to be clear, I'm not arguing your larger point to this thread. Thompson was a Sr, but by eligibility, he was a Jr. I agree that LJ is probably the best suited at the moment.

[sooneron]

Urban Meyer played a 2 QB system when Tebow was a freshman. Why wouldn't Stoops give that method a try? Adding Bell as a mobile QB would have probably opened up our running game. He would have added an element of surprise if he was going to take off or pass. If nothing else, the spy at defense would be occupied enough to have a WR open.

Good Lord! Did you actually watch UFla that year? Bell's usage is almost a mirror image of Tebow's first year, minus the ghey jump pass that Timmah would throw occasionally.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

And you failed to even get the point that you quoted me of.

You can teach football IQ. You don't go out trying to recruit all players that have it. Hence I said, "You can't recruit for football IQ."

If that's what you are recruiting for, you'll never fill your scholarship limit, or have a very tough time doing so.

Every recruit you go after has a football IQ. But like a real mental IQ they vary.

Sure, if a kid is blowing smoke or grasping at straws when talking about football, as a recruiter you know their football IQ is low. So they likely won't succeed at the level you need them to.

That said, most recruits that have gone to camps, that have played for awhile, and that have the skill level to do well in D1 already have a manageable football IQ. Meaning they will only get smarter as a football player as they go, and as you teach them.

Any player can raise their football IQ by watching film. By being taught. Football IQ just doesn't happen without learning it.

We are talking about 2 different things - you are talking about Xs and Os (football knowledge), I'm talking about how good they are playing the game. I personally don't think that knowledge is something that you should recruit for, but the subtle instincts that make some feel the game and know when to do what is what separates the wheat from the chaff. In basketball, we call it the "little things" - taking a charge, stopping a fast break, forcing a guy into the baseline and throwing it away. Those are things that you can't teach.

[Curly Bill]

Year after year we have some seriously overrated recruiting classes. Some examples:

http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2009/oklahoma-24

That was a great recruiting class?

And that isn't even as bad as the class before it (http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2008/oklahoma-24) where our best player on it was the punter.

So I then go look at the same 2 classes from Texas, the primary people we recruit against and wow their classes were horrid too

http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2008/texas-83
http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2009/texas-83

So my conclusion is that for whatever reason, the top talent in Texas is either peeking early or is being dramatically overestimated.

I know firsthand how much time, effort, and money is put into high school football in Texas. I think the kids are coached up to a very high level, in fact I'd argue higher than any other state, and so what you said there kinda hit me. I think it's very possible that because of the high level of coaching Texas kids get, the huge amounts of time that is spent on football, that Texas kids are in fact reaching, or at least very much nearing their ceilings while they are still in high school, thus when they get to college they don't continue to progress as much as kids from other parts of the country.

[sooneredaco]

Year after year we have some seriously overrated recruiting classes. Some examples:

http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2009/oklahoma-24

That was a great recruiting class?

And that isn't even as bad as the class before it (http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2008/oklahoma-24) where our best player on it was the punter.

So I then go look at the same 2 classes from Texas, the primary people we recruit against and wow their classes were horrid too

http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2008/texas-83
http://rivals.yahoo.com/oklahoma/football/recruiting/commitments/2009/texas-83

So my conclusion is that for whatever reason, the top talent in Texas is either peeking early or is being dramatically overestimated.

I know firsthand how much time, effort, and money is put into high school football in Texas. I think the kids are coached up to a very high level, in fact I'd argue higher than any other state, and so what you said there kinda hit me. I think it's very possible that because of the high level of coaching Texas kids get, the huge amounts of time that is spent on football, that Texas kids are in fact reaching, or at least very much nearing their ceilings while they are still in high school, thus when they get to college they don't continue to progress as much as kids from other parts of the country.

I've always been curious of this. So here is an off the wall question. How much is the high school football in Texas influenced by the next lest level of football in the state? In other words, does the style of football change from a physical one to more of a fitness spread type of football as the in state collegiate level changes? Is the Big 12 type football having any kind of an influence?

[Curly Bill]

I've always been curious of this. So here is an off the wall question. How much is the high school football in Texas influenced by the next lest level of football in the state? In other words, does the style of football change from a physical one to more of a fitness spread type of football as the in state collegiate level changes? Is the Big 12 type football having any kind of an influence?

Spread, throw it around type fotball is HUGE in Texas HS football right now. Even teams that have no business running the spread are running it because it's the "flavor of the month." There's not a group of people anywhere in the world that are more: monkey see, monkey do, than football coaches.,

[FaninAma]

You're right, he's not. Sam had some great pull out the win moments from behind like... 07 CU, 08 Fiesta Bowl, 08 UT, 08 Ufla...

Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like we played for a title in 08. The thing I remember about 08 is that in order to get to the title game we had to outscore a bunch of teams. Sam's performance in the 08 OSU game is legendary and clinched the Heisman for him. I haven't seen Landry come anywhere close to putting a string of games together like Sam did and Sam did it in only his 2nd year at starting QB.

Landry is a good QB. I am not suggesting he be benched. But in our offensive scheme we have to have a QB that makes the exceptional play....not the routine dump off short passes that the defense is expecting that essentially led to the interception and incomplete 4th down pass.

[SoonerorLater]

Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like we played for a title in 08. The thing I remember about 08 is that in order to get to the title game we had to outscore a bunch of teams. Sam's performance in the 08 OSU game is legendary and clinched the Heisman for him. I haven't seen Landry come anywhere close to putting a string of games together like Sam did and Sam did it in only his 2nd year at starting QB.

Landry is a good QB. I am not suggesting he be benched. But in our offensive scheme we have to have a QB that makes the exceptional play....not the routine dump off short passes that the defense is expecting that essentially led to the interception and incomplete 4th down pass.

Yep, agree. in 08 we had about as good of a QB as we are likely to ever have and we still couldn't reach the top of the mountain. Close but no cigar. As I have said on other threads it just doesn't seem feasible to be able to win it all with this type of offense in the present day. Your QB has to be exceptional. Even exceptional QBs aren't exceptional every game. Also for whatever reason teams that run spread offenses (I'll use that as a generic for multi formation / non-power running) usually have less than dominant defenses. I have theories why but empirical evidence says that's the case. If there is a spread team on the horizon that looks like they can win it all it's Oregon. Oregon is a lot different then most spread teams as they are primarily a running team that can use it to set up the pass. We will see. I would love an Alabama/Oregon championship game.

[One4OU]

If Bell is our short yardage guy why are there several times a game we are in 3rd and short and leave Landry in and wind up punting?

We did this on the second drive of the Texas game and at least twice against ND. Its not all Landrys fault the play calling, game strategy, and needed adjustments are terrible by the staff.

[sooneron]

Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like we played for a title in 08. The thing I remember about 08 is that in order to get to the title game we had to outscore a bunch of teams. Sam's performance in the 08 OSU game is legendary and clinched the Heisman for him. I haven't seen Landry come anywhere close to putting a string of games together like Sam did and Sam did it in only his 2nd year at starting QB.

Landry is a good QB. I am not suggesting he be benched. But in our offensive scheme we have to have a QB that makes the exceptional play....not the routine dump off short passes that the defense is expecting that essentially led to the interception and incomplete 4th down pass.



I don't totally disagree with you (second part), but Sam had more experienced receivers, a borderline all world line and probably, more stable RBs.
I'm not saying that Landry is as good as Sam, but there were a lot of people still wanting to see what Nichol could do after we lost to CU. All because he was more mobile than Sam.

[sooneron]

If Bell is our short yardage guy why are there several times a game we are in 3rd and short and leave Landry in and wind up punting?

We did this on the second drive of the Texas game and at least twice against ND. Its not all Landrys fault the play calling, game strategy, and needed adjustments are terrible by the staff.

^ This is a HUGE issue. I would like the people that called for Wilson's head while coronating Josh to step forward. Yeah, he wasn't ready for the job.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I know firsthand how much time, effort, and money is put into high school football in Texas. I think the kids are coached up to a very high level, in fact I'd argue higher than any other state, and so what you said there kinda hit me. I think it's very possible that because of the high level of coaching Texas kids get, the huge amounts of time that is spent on football, that Texas kids are in fact reaching, or at least very much nearing their ceilings while they are still in high school, thus when they get to college they don't continue to progress as much as kids from other parts of the country.

I just thinking about something. So a while back we did a look at the rivals top x for positions to see where they tended to be accurate. The 2 positions where they tended to constantly have issues were quarterback and DE. The 2 positions where they tended to be right most of the time were running back and WR. QB failures tended to be mental, DE tended to be physical (since it is the position where kids tend to have to gain the most weight). One interesting thing about the analysis was how many of those top Texas kids transferred out of D1. I'm just wondering if there isn't a 3rd thing I should have appended to the statement - that they aren't mentally tough.

[FaninAma]

I don't totally disagree with you (second part), but Sam had more experienced receivers, a borderline all world line and probably, more stable RBs.
I'm not saying that Landry is as good as Sam, but there were a lot of people still wanting to see what Nichol could do after we lost to CU. All because he was more mobile than Sam.

I was never a Nichol fan. Landry had a kid by the name of Broyles lining up at WR for the first 3 years of his QB tenure.

Landry's arm strength is comparabale to Sam's. Landry's ability to see the play unfolding before him and to read the defense isn't in the same ball park and that, more than any other reason, is why the offense struggles under Landry at times. It's the same reason why Tom Brady is considered a great QB while Jamarcus Russell was a bust.

[One4OU]

I know firsthand how much time, effort, and money is put into high school football in Texas. I think the kids are coached up to a very high level, in fact I'd argue higher than any other state, and so what you said there kinda hit me. I think it's very possible that because of the high level of coaching Texas kids get, the huge amounts of time that is spent on football, that Texas kids are in fact reaching, or at least very much nearing their ceilings while they are still in high school, thus when they get to college they don't continue to progress as much as kids from other parts of the country.

I just thinking about something. So a while back we did a look at the rivals top x for positions to see where they tended to be accurate. The 2 positions where they tended to constantly have issues were quarterback and DE. The 2 positions where they tended to be right most of the time were running back and WR. QB failures tended to be mental, DE tended to be physical (since it is the position where kids tend to have to gain the most weight). One interesting thing about the analysis was how many of those top Texas kids transferred out of D1. I'm just wondering if there isn't a 3rd thing I should have appended to the statement - that they aren't mentally tough.

I remember that analysis and from time to time still think about as texas struggles. At the time I dont think we were seeing as many people leave or have career ending injuries. It would sure be a great variable to throw in as well.

I would also add that if our staff is truly better at developing talent then that could be the reason we are having more success than texas, other than several of our players coming from other states.

[OU_Sooners75]

We are talking about 2 different things - you are talking about Xs and Os (football knowledge), I'm talking about how good they are playing the game. I personally don't think that knowledge is something that you should recruit for, but the subtle instincts that make some feel the game and know when to do what is what separates the wheat from the chaff. In basketball, we call it the "little things" - taking a charge, stopping a fast break, forcing a guy into the baseline and throwing it away. Those are things that you can't teach.

Yes you can teach a basketball player how to take a charge. How to stop a fast break. How to force a player baseline. Hell those are the fundamentals of basketball.

Hell, players just don't learn them on their own, without someone teachin (coaching) them.

Maybe some have a better knack at it. But they can be taught. Same in football.

All players learn it from someone. It just doesn't happen naturally.

I call them gifts. Some are more gifted at it than others. But you can still teach it.

[Breadburner]

Some are coachable some are not.....

[BetterSoonerThanLater]

I don't totally disagree with you (second part), but Sam had more experienced receivers, a borderline all world line and probably, more stable RBs.
I'm not saying that Landry is as good as Sam, but there were a lot of people still wanting to see what Nichol could do after we lost to CU. All because he was more mobile than Sam.

that being said, could you honeslty see LJ putting the team on his back and making a play the way Sam did vs. OSU? when he took off for the endzone and went all superman, he was telling the world, i'm not losing this game! LJ has never had that attitude...at least not outwardly. Sam and LJ's arms may be comparable, but Sam's attitude and football smarts, are head and shoulders above LJ's, and LJ has had this offense for 4 years. I rarely had apprehension when Sam stepped back to throw the ball, and i never worried about him making the same mistake over and over, or making the wrong decision consistanly. with LJ, regardles of the stats, he isn't even in the same ballpark as Sam. if Sam had been at OU for the same amount of time as LJ, i think the conversation about records would be completely different. All in all, i don't dislike LJ, i think he's a good kid and is a really good college football player. i just don't trust him, and the stats don't match the eye test.

look at what Sam has had to work with in STL. do you think LJ could be even remotely as successful as Sam in the same situation?

just my two cents.

BOOMER

[birddog]

It seems like a lot of "experts" think Landry will be drafted. I just don't see it. Maybe he doesn't have the players around him. I really don't think he can improve to the point of being successful in the nfl. Maybe a late round pick and clipboard holder. Hope I'm wrong because he's a good kid. Totally random thought...what the hell is Ryan tannehill doing in the nfl?

[OUmillenium]

probably running for his life

[OUmillenium]

LJ has beaten the whorns in his 3 games as a starter. That goes a long way in my book. Thanks for all your efforts LJ, you give us your best and the coaches try to put you in a position to be successful.

Having said that, bring on the BellDozer.

[Jason White's Third Knee]

Paul Thompson got beat out and wasn't the incumbent starter either.

He got his job back in 2006.

He was for all intents and purposes. Otherwise they wouldn't have redshirted him in 2004 so he could be the QB for 2 years. The problem was that somewhere between 2003 and 2005 he lost his desire to run the ball (remember he almost had a 100 yards rushing in that 77-0 game in one quarter). I think that there is ample evidence for someone to argue that our coaches have no idea who the most talented QB on campus is.


"Most talented" does not always mean "best choice".

[thecrimsoncrusader]

LJ has beaten the whorns in his 3 games as a starter.

While I am grateful that is the case, its helped immensely that Texas sucked in all 3 of those seasons.

[East Coast Bias]

What are we going to do next year? Have Bell run some form of a zone read? Can someone coach him up to the level we need, or are we going to be looking for someone else to fill the gap? I think at times we are much too hard on Landry. He is a solid quarterback a lot of teams would love to have. In my view his weakness is that he falls apart under pressure, but honestly most quarterbacks do. When you have the tools it comes down to execution. That is what Eli has on the other NFL quarterbacks right now. Its a tough gig, I remember Jason White throwing some boner pick sixes at times, as good as he was.....

[OU_Sooners75]

"Most talented" does not always mean "best choice".

Eggsactly!

[OU_Sooners75]

While I am grateful that is the case, its helped immensely that Texas sucked in all 3 of those seasons.

Please, by all means, tell me, and the rest of us, how you KNOW FOR SURE, Bell is the better choice?

Please, I really want to know how YOU know LJ is not the best choice this year!

[I Am Right]

Well not sure about the rest of you, but I'm ready for a change at the QB position. Yea I know the defense gave up big plays as well. Not saying have Blake Bell in there would have led to a W, but it sure as hale would have created a much needed momentum change. From the television side of things, that stadium was dead. I mean crickets dead. For one of the biggest OU games in recent memory. I guess there just wasn't anything to get to excited about? I guarantee you, Belldozer would have created a significant buzz. Just sayin....


You must not have been there. Loudest since Taco tech in 08. Great Crowd, lousy team!

[sooneredaco]

You must not have been there. Loudest since Taco tech in 08. Great Crowd, lousy team!

Yea like I mentioned from the TV side seemed super quite. The announcers even commented that this was the quietest they had ever seen this stadium. Could have very well been a the broadcast

[sooneredaco]

Thank you for a great night big guy! You came up huge...

Great to see the confidence in him in the clutch