Some Of You Posters Need To Get A Life.

[hawaii 5-0]

Good Grief!!

Both sides are starting new threads about any little slur, misstep, or burp.

C'mon, gang. Is there really one poster out there that might be swayed by the dirt thrown around here? I think most people have made up their minds long ago.

Now it's not an Obamafest......it's a Big Baby Whinefest.

I don't read hardly any of these trashy threads. My time is better spent.

For those of you that feel the necessity to keep on needlessly ranting.......carry on.


5-0

[KABOOKIE]

So your dear leader comes under daily attack and now is the time to grow up? Boo ****ing hoo 5oh. Like you're one to talk. Just like the rest of them. Preaching peace and civility in politics and then turn around and sling nothing but mud.

[C&CDean]

Yeah, if I'm not mistaken, all those trashed up threads are full of 5-0 rantings. Three fingers pointing right back at you and all.

And for the record, anyone who can openly admit he is going to vote for Obama in 2012 is either very stupid, or very brave.

[olevetonahill]

Yea I dont know which is worse the Far right wingers who copy and paste every far out whacko deal they come across or the weirdo Lefties who post 15 paragraph post with charts and graphs and all kinds of studies to prove their point

5-0 did make a valid point tho
I doubt theres a person on this board that will change their voting stance between now and election time


We might have had a chance at converting icky to the conservative side but we will never know . :cocksure:

[Skysooner]

Yeah, if I'm not mistaken, all those trashed up threads are full of 5-0 rantings. Three fingers pointing right back at you and all.

And for the record, anyone who can openly admit he is going to vote for Obama in 2012 is either very stupid, or very brave.

Actually if it had been anybody but Romney, Gingrich or Paul, I would have gone back to Obama. I voted for him in 2008 as at the time he was saying the better things towards the energy business. McCain would have been a good choice however. I didn't feel like I could lose in that election. Now it is Romney and hoping he governs how he did in Massachusetts.

[pphilfran]

Is Icky gone for good? A truly sad day in the anals ( :) ) of SF...

[SouthCarolinaSooner]

Yeah, if I'm not mistaken, all those trashed up threads are full of 5-0 rantings. Three fingers pointing right back at you and all.

And for the record, anyone who can openly admit he is going to vote for Obama in 2012 is either very stupid, or very brave.
I think he's talking about mazeppa's 10 threads currently polluting the front page, half of which have no replies. Some of the right wingers here I strongly disagree with, L3, albosooner, okie52 etc at least can hold a good discussion. Mazeppa just copies and pastes random **** and leaves it

[olevetonahill]

I think he's talking about mazeppa's 10 threads currently polluting the front page, half of which have no replies. Some of the right wingers here I strongly disagree with, L3, albosooner, okie52 etc at least can hold a good discussion. Mazeppa just copies and pastes random **** and leaves it

As compared to YOU, Just pulling out yer azz :smug:

[marfacowboy]

And for the record, anyone who can openly admit he is going to vote for Obama in 2012 is either very stupid, or very brave.

Brave? Why's that?

[Skysooner]

Hardly brave when Obama is ahead right now. Putting an Obama sign in your yard though in Oklahoma is a whole other set of issues.

[okie52]

Icky's gone again? Well he had a good run this last time, much longer than I expected.

Is he gone for good? If so, he might have earned the perma banned hall of fame ( or is that shame?).

[okie52]

Hardly brave when Obama is ahead right now. Putting an Obama sign in your yard though in Oklahoma is a whole other set of issues.

If you work for an oil company in OK or TX and have an Obama sign in your yard better hope your boss doesn't see it.

[rock on sooner]

Hardly brave when Obama is ahead right now. Putting an Obama sign in your yard though in Oklahoma is a whole other set of issues.

Bet you don't see many yard signs, either! Shows ya how smart
the fews Dems in OK are:smile:

[olevetonahill]

Bet you don't see many yard signs, either! Shows ya how smart
the fews Dems in OK are:smile:

Dont think Ive seen a one this year nor any bumper stickers

[rock on sooner]

Dont think Ive seen a one this year nor any bumper stickers

See, I tolt ya theyz smart..:triumphant:

[okie52]

Dont think Ive seen a one this year nor any bumper stickers

Cash for clunkers removed all of obama's bumper stickers.

[diverdog]

I will admit that I will hold my nose and vote for Obama. The far right of the republican party scares the **** out of me. Romney is not a bad guy but he will be forced to vote for an extremist tea party agenda. We will also probably go to war with Iran. On the other hand if the Republicans gain control again and unleash their version of trickle down economics it might be the last time they see
a majority.

[rock on sooner]

Cash for clunkers removed all of obama's bumper stickers.

LOL...

[C&CDean]

Brave? Why's that?

Brave was a poor choice of words. Maybe I should have just said obscenely publically stupid?

Like yesterday at the walmarts. I think I posted about it somewhere. Anyhow, I'm waiting for momma to checkout and I'm watching a replay of the 2000 NC game against FSU. Black dude with a 2012 hat with the little obama thingie in it and an Obama t-shirt comes up and goes all dramatically "I thought football didn't start till next week!!" He was dead serious. I just said "typical Obamaite." He kinda slunk away.

The few people I've seen with the bumper stickers are so stereotypically white, pasty, scrawny, little faggoty car owning birkenstockers with thick woolen sweater types it's laughable. I was going through Austin a couple weeks back and saw at least 3 Nissan Versas with Obama stickers and all had people who were clones driving. It was laughable. And yes, I do look very closely at people with Obama stickers and crap. I can't really believe people wanna have "I'm a ****ing idiot" bumper stickers on their rides for all to see.

[Curly Bill]

I wear Birkenstocks - they're quality, comfortable footwear. But yeah, I still know what ya mean. ;)

[Curly Bill]

...and I sure as hell ain't no Obammy voter!

[okie52]

I will admit that I will hold my nose and vote for Obama. The far right of the republican party scares the **** out of me. Romney is not a bad guy but he will be forced to vote for an extremist tea party agenda. We will also probably go to war with Iran. On the other hand if the Republicans gain control again and unleash their version of trickle down economics it might be the last time they see
a majority.

Not a real shocker, there dd.

What version of economics have we been living with for the last 4 years?

You never were a big believer in the importance of energy.

[badger]

meh, some of the stuff is funny for the lulz. If you want serious political conversation a football message board is probably not the place for it.

[Breadburner]

One Big A$$ Mistake America....!!!

[marfacowboy]

Hardly brave when Obama is ahead right now. Putting an Obama sign in your yard though in Oklahoma is a whole other set of issues.

I reckon so.

[marfacowboy]

Brave was a poor choice of words. Maybe I should have just said obscenely publically stupid?

I think you mean "publicly." But why is that, since the Romney-Ryan plan increases the deficit? I thought that was the big issue. Guess not....
I figure it doesn't matter much in Oklahoma, though. It's going to the GOP.


Like yesterday at the walmarts. I think I posted about it somewhere. Anyhow, I'm waiting for momma to checkout and I'm watching a replay of the 2000 NC game against FSU. Black dude with a 2012 hat with the little obama thingie in it and an Obama t-shirt comes up and goes all dramatically "I thought football didn't start till next week!!" He was dead serious. I just said "typical Obamaite." He kinda slunk away.

Well, you were at Mal-Wart after all....it's well known for attracting folks that aren't exactly the sharpest tools in the toolbox.
But why does it always come to this? Both sides pointing their fingers and saying, "You're stupid...you're publicly stupid," etc.


The few people I've seen with the bumper stickers are so stereotypically white, pasty, scrawny, little faggoty car owning birkenstockers with thick woolen sweater types it's laughable. I was going through Austin a couple weeks back and saw at least 3 Nissan Versas with Obama stickers and all had people who were clones driving. It was laughable. And yes, I do look very closely at people with Obama stickers and crap. I can't really believe people wanna have "I'm a ****ing idiot" bumper stickers on their rides for all to see.

Sounds like a lot of stereotyping and irrational angst to me.

[Mazeppa]

I think he's talking about mazeppa's 10 threads currently polluting the front page, half of which have no replies. Some of the right wingers here I strongly disagree with, L3, albosooner, okie52 etc at least can hold a good discussion. Mazeppa just copies and pastes random **** and leaves it

I just post articles that I found interesting and thought someone else might find it interesting too. I don't do it for "replies".

[diverdog]

Not a real shocker, there dd.

What version of economics have we been living with for the last 4 years?

You never were a big believer in the importance of energy.


Okie:

And you are living in a pipe dream if you think drilling everywhere is going to fix this economy. If that were true then the economy would have been booming under Bush. What do you think will happen to our national treasury if we go to war with Iran? The Republicans do not have the answers and I am scared to death to give them complete control. The last time they had the Presidency we got into two major wars.

[rock on sooner]

Okie:

And you are living in a pipe dream if you think drilling everywhere is going to fix this economy. If that were true then the economy would have been booming under Bush. What do you think will happen to our national treasury if we go to war with Iran? The Republicans do not have the answers and I am scared to death to give them complete control. The last time they had the Presidency we got into two major wars.

Neither one of which was paid for, just like his tax cuts...

[cleller]

I was just thinking the other day that this place needs a poll put up on the election.

[okie52]

Okie:

And you are living in a pipe dream if you think drilling everywhere is going to fix this economy. If that were true then the economy would have been booming under Bush. What do you think will happen to our national treasury if we go to war with Iran? The Republicans do not have the answers and I am scared to death to give them complete control. The last time they had the Presidency we got into two major wars.

DD, I didn't say it would "fix" the economy but it is an awfully important part of the economy to be totally mishandled by the dems. If we were energy independent
that would eliminate about 70% of our trade deficit...think that might help our debt, unemployment and tax revenues?

Are we going to war with Iran because we sure went to war with Libya and we still don't know who we have helped there. Obama wouldn't have us in a war if we were attacked?
Well I'll damn sure don't want a CIC that would take that stance. Ill agree that in hindsight Iraq is not a war I would have supported but there were a lot of dems that supported that war.

And that is another reason energy independence is so important is that our foreign policy won't be handcuffed to protecting our oil suppliers in the ME. I am for non interventionist
Policies and I really don't see either candidate supporting those approaches but I do see Romney helping to remove the need for our presence in the ME, something that obama's
fantasy regarding energy will never do.

Obama's green energy and the millions of jobs it was going to create...Talk about pipe dreams.

[okie52]

Neither one of which was paid for, just like his tax cuts...

I haven't seen Obama let those tax cuts expire...have you?

[diverdog]

DD, I didn't say it would "fix" the economy but it is an awfully important part of the economy to be totally mishandled by the dems. If we were energy independent
that would eliminate about 70% of our trade deficit...think that might help our debt, unemployment and tax revenues?

Are we going to war with Iran because we sure went to war with Libya and we still don't know who we have helped there. Obama wouldn't have us in a war if we were attacked?
Well I'll damn sure don't want a CIC that would take that stance. Ill agree that in hindsight Iraq is not a war I would have supported but there were a lot of dems that supported that war.

And that is another reason energy independence is so important is that our foreign policy won't be handcuffed to protecting our oil suppliers in the ME. I am for non interventionist
Policies and I really don't see either candidate supporting those approaches but I do see Romney helping to remove the need for our presence in the ME, something that obama's
fantasy regarding energy will never do.

Obama's green energy and the millions of jobs it was going to create...Talk about pipe dreams.

Okie:

The war in Libya is a far far cry from a war with Iran. We supported one side in a popular uprising. A war with Iran is us against them.

We will never have energy independence with fossile fuel. OPEC doesn't want it and neither does our government. The best we can hope for is a lowering of our dependence.

[Skysooner]

Okie:

The war in Libya is a far far cry from a war with Iran. We supported one side in a popular uprising. A war with Iran is us against them.

We will never have energy independence with fossile fuel. OPEC doesn't want it and neither does our government. The best we can hope for is a lowering of our dependence.

Actually this is wrong. We aren't really dependent on OPEC for much longer. The group I direct does a statistical look at all old plays and new emerging plays. With $85/bbl oil we can achieve energy independence for the continent. It would help if Mexico would allow experts in as well, but we can go it alone. We are calling for 2018-2020 at this point. The stuff I work on is cutting edge and not being done anywhere else as far as we know unless it is XOM.

[MamaMia]

I think you mean "publicly." But why is that, since the Romney-Ryan plan increases the deficit? I thought that was the big issue. Guess not....
I figure it doesn't matter much in Oklahoma, though. It's going to the GOP. Publically/Publicly...what are you?...the spelling bee police? Until we know what cuts, if elected, Romney will see implemented, we cant say whether his plan will raise or lower the deficit but we know for a fact that Obamacare will cost a mint.



Well, you were at Mal-Wart after all....it's well known for attracting folks that aren't exactly the sharpest tools in the toolbox.
But why does it always come to this? Both sides pointing their fingers and saying, "You're stupid...you're publicly stupid," etc.
I have seen more Obama and oSu shirts in the Walmarts than I see Republican or OU shirts. These are old faded shirts from 4 years ago too. I do most of my shopping at Williams and Sonoma, Whole Foods, Sunshine Market and Akins in the city once a month. So, unfortunately, living in a small town, my only shopping choices for groceries here are two Uniteds and one Walmart, so I have to go there to get the things at both of those chains a couple times a week.


Sounds like a lot of stereotyping and irrational angst to me.I read nothing that sounded like "angst. Just his observation, and I would have to concur about the actual vehicles. The cars with Obama bumper stickers that I see are USUALLY stereotypically more run down, unkempt, older models, and not as clean. I do a lot of traveling and can honestly say that the vehicles I see with Republican bumper stickers are much fewer in number, however, they are usually nicer cars or trucks. I rarely see a really nice, clean vehicle with an Obama bumper sticker.

[edit] Back to Hawaii 5-0's reason for the thread in thinking we need a life for talking about politics because none of us will change the others minds. Thats not necessarily the objective. You cant argue that this forum does bring to light articles that we may have otherwise missed. So what if we discuss them? Some agree with each others views, some don't. I enjoy hearing both sides whether what they say changes my mind or not.

[diverdog]

Actually this is wrong. We aren't really dependent on OPEC for much longer. The group I direct does a statistical look at all old plays and new emerging plays. With $85/bbl oil we can achieve energy independence for the continent. It would help if Mexico would allow experts in as well, but we can go it alone. We are calling for 2018-2020 at this point. The stuff I work on is cutting edge and not being done anywhere else as far as we know unless it is XOM.

Are you saying by 2020 we will no longer import oil from OPEC? Man I will take that bet!

[rock on sooner]

Actually this is wrong. We aren't really dependent on OPEC for much longer. The group I direct does a statistical look at all old plays and new emerging plays. With $85/bbl oil we can achieve energy independence for the continent. It would help if Mexico would allow experts in as well, but we can go it alone. We are calling for 2018-2020 at this point. The stuff I work on is cutting edge and not being done anywhere else as far as we know unless it is XOM.

Are you advising Romney? He's calling for North American oil independence
by 2020.

[cleller]

Are you saying by 2020 we will no longer import oil from OPEC? Man I will take that bet!

It does sound far fetched, but I also think it is possible, IF we start converting to CNG at a logical rate, and continue the current trend of exploration in the US. If OPEC does not significantly drop their price, it gets even more likely.

If Obama or whoever is next would step up and work on a plan to utilize these gas reserves, oil consumption and greenhouse gases could be cut significantly. We would have to get serious about plans to convert long haul trucks to CNG and tell the coal lobbyists to get ready for a downturn, though. Lots of Dems in those coal states.

[marfacowboy]

Publically/Publicly...what are you?...the spelling bee police?

If you're going to accuse people of being "stupid," you shouldn't spell like a second grader.


Until we know what cuts, if elected, Romney will see implemented, we cant say whether his plan will raise or lower the deficit but we know for a fact that Obamacare will cost a mint.

Oh, so you're just willing to trust them and elect them on a program without specifics. As it stands now, and all we can do is make rational decisions about what we know, it increases the debt.



I have seen more Obama and oSu shirts in the Walmarts than I see Republican or OU shirts.

You probably did. The Obama supporters are probably poor and have little choice.


I read nothing that sounded like "angst. Just his observation, and I would have to concur about the actual vehicles. The cars with Obama bumper stickers that I see are USUALLY stereotypically more run down, unkempt, older models, and not as clean.

Oh, you think they're "faggoty," as well? How mean and ridiculously ignorant. They're probably poor. Students, unemployed people, etc.

[Skysooner]

Are you saying by 2020 we will no longer import oil from OPEC? Man I will take that bet!

Won't take the bet as there is so much out of our control. Given current costs, oil prices and a bit more robust NG price, it can happen yes. I see tons of things the public isn't privy too, but it is out there if you care to look for it. My big job year in and year out is quantifying reserves for North America and the cost of extraction.

[badger]

I just post articles that I found interesting and thought someone else might find it interesting too. I don't do it for "replies".

Then just create an "interesting articles related to politics" thread. No need to start a bajillion threads that nobody responds to. This is a message board after all. Posts and replies are kind of the purpose.

[rock on sooner]

I haven't seen Obama let those tax cuts expire...have you?

He wanted to, proposed it on those under $250K/yr..

[okie52]

Okie:

The war in Libya is a far far cry from a war with Iran. We supported one side in a popular uprising. A war with Iran is us against them.

We will never have energy independence with fossile fuel. OPEC doesn't want it and neither does our government. The best we can hope for is a lowering of our dependence.


Just shows you don't know **** about oil and gas. Our ng alone could make us energy independent and we are about to start exporting it....now here's the laugher dd...many dems are trying to block that because ng gives us an economic advantage over the rest of the world...the same morons that try to tax it 22% under cap and trade and that are trying to remove its tax deductions. Real rocket scientists. The party of science LOL.

The oil plays can also get us to energy independence but we can't have morons blocking access to a large part of the country's reserves. You really need to get a clue about energy rather than allowing your ideological slant to distort your perspective.

And we won't go to war with Iran under Romney any more than we will under Obama.

[okie52]

He wanted to, proposed it on those under $250K/yr..

He wanted to tax 250 and over...but those weren't the Clinton tax rates or the totality of the bush tax cuts now were they?

[rock on sooner]

He wanted to tax 250 and over...but those weren't the Clinton tax rates or the totality of the bush tax cuts now were they?

You are correct.

And your point about Romney not going to war with Iran, neither
will Obama, as you pointed out. HOWEVER, Israel may and probably
will force the U.S.'s hand and indications are that Netanyahu wants
to do it sooner rather than later...

[okie52]

You are correct.

And your point about Romney not going to war with Iran, neither
will Obama, as you pointed out. HOWEVER, Israel may and probably
will force the U.S.'s hand and indications are that Netanyahu wants
to do it sooner rather than later...

I'd be disappointed in Obama or Romney if they allowed Israel to dictate to us an involvement in a war with Iran. Now maybe we will let them be our "boots on the ground" with Iran although I think a war with Iran might save their regime for the time being rather than let it come tumbling down through sanctions.

[hawaii 5-0]

Then just create an "interesting articles related to politics" thread. No need to start a bajillion threads that nobody responds to. This is a message board after all. Posts and replies are kind of the purpose.


I'm glad someone 'got' the intent of my rant. I'm not calling any one person out. Those that flood the Bored with countless new threads know who they are.

5-0

[badger]

He wanted to tax 250 and over...but those weren't the Clinton tax rates or the totality of the bush tax cuts now were they?

What I think will happen, unless either side has a supermajority (GOOD LUCK WITH THAT DEMS, hahahahahahahahahahahahhaa) is that both sides will refuse to give a "win" to the other side and the tax cuts for everyone will just expire.

But, let's face it: This country needs more money to operate on lately and I think that is something both sides can have a stake in. Do you want more money to fund defense, Republicans? Do you want more money for health care, Democrats? Then we need tax increases. Trimming budgets is fine for awhile, but too many cuts as once sends governments scrambling.

If you are an independent, then there's soon going to be an area where we'll need more money for you as well: Disaster relief. Even if you're not impacted by the drought, you're about to be rocked by a hurricane. Sadly. I worry that Issac will be more than certain areas can handle (read Mississippi and Louisiana)

[C&CDean]

Something tells me marfaca dude is a Versa-owning panty waist.

[badger]

I'm glad someone 'got' the intent of my rant. I'm not calling any one person out. Those that flood the Bored with countless new threads know who they are.

5-0

Since we're in an election year, it's probably a good idea to take the football forum format:

1- Don't start new threads on topics that already exist. Use the search engine.

2- Don't start new threads with cute, non-specific titles. If it's about Obamacare, include that in the title. Don't entitle it "Dear Leader is Dear D00shebag" because that really isn't specific enough.

3- Just don't start new threads. Contribute to existing ones. Unless it's really something earth-shattering, there's plenty of threads that already exist.

Please just try.

[rock on sooner]

I'd be disappointed in Obama or Romney if they allowed Israel to dictate to us an involvement in a war with Iran. Now maybe we will let them be our "boots on the ground" with Iran although I think a war with Iran might save their regime for the time being rather than let it come tumbling down through sanctions.

Okie, I agree about the disappointment aspect, but the reality is that
Israel is a sovereign nation and Iran is a very real threat to them. I
think that Netanyahu will be preemptive out of concern for his own
country and, just by our association with Israel, be drawn into it.

FWIW, Israel will likely be quite thorough...

[okie52]

What I think will happen, unless either side has a supermajority (GOOD LUCK WITH THAT DEMS, hahahahahahahahahahahahhaa) is that both sides will refuse to give a "win" to the other side and the tax cuts for everyone will just expire.

But, let's face it: This country needs more money to operate on lately and I think that is something both sides can have a stake in. Do you want more money to fund defense, Republicans? Do you want more money for health care, Democrats? Then we need tax increases. Trimming budgets is fine for awhile, but too many cuts as once sends governments scrambling.

If you are an independent, then there's soon going to be an area where we'll need more money for you as well: Disaster relief. Even if you're not impacted by the drought, you're about to be rocked by a hurricane. Sadly. I worry that Issac will be more than certain areas can handle (read Mississippi and Louisiana)

I'm not against letting the tax cuts expire. We've heard for a long time about the Bush tax cuts coddling the rich but what seems to always be left out of the discussion is the tax cuts that were for everyone else. We can go back to the "glory days" of the Clinton tax rates and see how that works for the country. Obama has often preached "shared sacrifice" but I don't see the sharing when talks about taxes.

[okie52]

Okie, I agree about the disappointment aspect, but the reality is that
Israel is a sovereign nation and Iran is a very real threat to them. I
think that Netanyahu will be preemptive out of concern for his own
country and, just by our association with Israel, be drawn into it.

FWIW, Israel will likely be quite thorough...

I don't have a problem with Israel doing what it considers is in its best interests to protect its country and maybe survival. That doesn't mean its in the US's best interest though.

What I don't understand is one country telling another they can't have nukes. We have them, Russia, China, England, France, Pakistan, India, N Korea, all have them. I understand that Iran may be a signatory to a non proliferation agreement but I certainly don't know why that is such a binding document.

****, I consider N Korea more of a threat to fire a nuke than Iran and we aren't doing **** about them.

[marfacowboy]

Something tells me marfaca dude is a Versa-owning panty waist.

Actually, I have a Tacoma and my wife drives the Prius. Not that it's any of your business, but I thought I might as well clear it up for you. That 50 MPG sure is nice on long trips.
I can assure you, I'm anything but a "panty waist," but I often find that men that make those types of comments are usually the ones dealing with masculinity issues. Inside, you're questioning yourself, so on the outside you do all of these things (bullying, calling people "sissy" or things like "panty waist," wearing a lot of camouflage clothing, monster truck, etc.) to mask those inner demons.
Therapy can help, though. Don't give up.

[badger]

I'm not against letting the tax cuts expire. We've heard for a long time about the Bush tax cuts coddling the rich but what seems to always be left out of the discussion is the tax cuts that were for everyone else. We can go back to the "glory days" of the Clinton tax rates and see how that works for the country. Obama has often preached "shared sacrifice" but I don't see the sharing when talks about taxes.

It would be a huge sacrifice for many to give up that tax cut, but if they can promise that the money would be used to lower unemployment, improve infrastructure, increase energy independence and help education, it's time to give back to a country that has given all of us so much.

[C&CDean]

Actually, I have a Tacoma and my wife drives the Prius. Not that it's any of your business, but I thought I might as well clear it up for you. That 50 MPG sure is nice on long trips.
I can assure you, I'm anything but a "panty waist," but I often find that men that make those types of comments are usually the ones dealing with masculinity issues. Inside, you're questioning yourself, so on the outside you do all of these things (bullying, name calling, wearing a lot of camouflage clothing, monster truck, etc.) to mask those inner demons.
Therapy can help, though. Don't give up.

We need an emoticon for "yawn."

Since I don't know you, and you don't know me, we can both make assumptions about one another. My assumption is that you're a liberal pansy. Your assumption is that I'm a cammo-wearing redneck. You are partially correct, and I'm pretty much sure that I am as well.

I am also sure that there's a lot of liberal weirdos in Austin with Obama stickers on their Versas. It's not a "stereotype" it's just a fact based on personal observations.

My mother drives a Prius, and she loves her 50 mpg. I'm not sure what that whole "point" was about anyhow. Methinks you're just looking for an argument?

[marfacowboy]

We need an emoticon for "yawn."

Since I don't know you, and you don't know me, we can both make assumptions about one another. My assumption is that you're a liberal pansy. Your assumption is that I'm a cammo-wearing redneck. You are partially correct, and I'm pretty much sure that I am as well.

I am also sure that there's a lot of liberal weirdos in Austin with Obama stickers on their Versas. It's not a "stereotype" it's just a fact based on personal observations.

My mother drives a Prius, and she loves her 50 mpg. I'm not sure what that whole "point" was about anyhow. Methinks you're just looking for an argument?

I tell you what. I'll be at the Kansas St. game for sure. Maybe we'll get to meet and put all those stereotypes and assumptions to rest. We might even enjoy one another's company. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.
I grew up in what was essentially a North Memphis ghetto, Dean, on a street called N. Garland. I learned pretty quickly it was fight or get your *** beat. I'm no pansy. Being the only white kid on the block, I had to fight two, three, sometimes more kids (yes, usually black) with chains, bricks, knives, whatever, to literally survive. They'd try to steal my bike every time I got on it and road down the street.
But I also learned what those people go through. We got out. Most of them didn't. They had no reason to hate me, but I understood why they hated me. Memphis in the late 60's and early 70's was racially charged. Still is.
Those years are what shaped me and made me have some compassion for people that have little hope, bad schools and are surrounded by violence every ****ing day.

[okie52]

It would be a huge sacrifice for many to give up that tax cut, but if they can promise that the money would be used to lower unemployment, improve infrastructure, increase energy independence and help education, it's time to give back to a country that has given all of us so much.

It might be for the 50% that are actually paying income taxes. But I so often hear dems (including Obama) harken back to the days of Clinton that I thought embracing his total tax package would be the nirvana that so many people seem to miss.

[badger]

It might be for the 50% that are actually paying income taxes. But I so often hear dems (including Obama) harken back to the days of Clinton that I thought embracing his total tax package would be the nirvana that so many people seem to miss.

I know that half of us don't pay income taxes, but in states like Oklahoma, they pay their way very reliably in another tax: Sales tax. It's quite low in some states (my relatives in Delaware enjoy NO sales tax!) It's quite high here (about 8 percent).

People that are of such low income that they pay no income taxes probably give a majority of their incomes to that high sales tax here. Yes, I know that food stamped-purchases are tax-free. But, then there's gasoline purchases (heavily taxed). There's non-food stamp food purchases (anything pre-prepared), which is taxed. There's utility bills (which may be subsidized, but usually not 100 percent). And, if you're going for the stereotypes of the poors, there's iPhones, microwaves, cable and high speed Internet, etc. All taxed. A lot.

So, it is what it is as far as half of us not being on the income tax paying rolls. They're still getting hit hard by taxes, just in a different way.

[rock on sooner]

I know that half of us don't pay income taxes, but in states like Oklahoma, they pay their way very reliably in another tax: Sales tax. It's quite low in some states (my relatives in Delaware enjoy NO sales tax!) It's quite high here (about 8 percent).

People that are of such low income that they pay no income taxes probably give a majority of their incomes to that high sales tax here. Yes, I know that food stamped-purchases are tax-free. But, then there's gasoline purchases (heavily taxed). There's non-food stamp food purchases (anything pre-prepared), which is taxed. There's utility bills (which may be subsidized, but usually not 100 percent). And, if you're going for the stereotypes of the poors, there's iPhones, microwaves, cable and high speed Internet, etc. All taxed. A lot.

So, it is what it is as far as half of us not being on the income tax paying rolls. They're still getting hit hard by taxes, just in a different way.

Well said, Badger...:congratulatory:

[rock on sooner]

I don't have a problem with Israel doing what it considers is in its best interests to protect its country and maybe survival. That doesn't mean its in the US's best interest though.

What I don't understand is one country telling another they can't have nukes. We have them, Russia, China, England, France, Pakistan, India, N Korea, all have them. I understand that Iran may be a signatory to a non proliferation agreement but I certainly don't know why that is such a binding document.

****, I consider N Korea more of a threat to fire a nuke than Iran and we aren't doing **** about them.

Okie, N. Korea got theirs on the QT from Pakistan, almost before
anyone knew it...they're lousy at delivery systems and are pretty
well contained, with S. Korea and American carrier battlegroups.
As far as I can recall, N. Korea was bellicose to everyone.

Iran, on the other hand, is outright threatening Israel's very
existence and the guy running the show is every bit the loose
cannon that Kim Jong Il was, only on steroids. IMO, Iran is
far more dangerous than N. Korea.

[okie52]

I know that half of us don't pay income taxes, but in states like Oklahoma, they pay their way very reliably in another tax: Sales tax. It's quite low in some states (my relatives in Delaware enjoy NO sales tax!) It's quite high here (about 8 percent).

People that are of such low income that they pay no income taxes probably give a majority of their incomes to that high sales tax here. Yes, I know that food stamped-purchases are tax-free. But, then there's gasoline purchases (heavily taxed). There's non-food stamp food purchases (anything pre-prepared), which is taxed. There's utility bills (which may be subsidized, but usually not 100 percent). And, if you're going for the stereotypes of the poors, there's iPhones, microwaves, cable and high speed Internet, etc. All taxed. A lot.

So, it is what it is as far as half of us not being on the income tax paying rolls. They're still getting hit hard by taxes, just in a different way.

But those aren't income taxes, now are they, which can run up to 37%? And most of those are consumption taxes so there is some discretion as to how they spend their money. And most of their income doesn't go to pay sales taxes unless they search out and find some merchandise that is going for 50% or more in taxes. And you did mention their food stamp purchases being tax free. Gasoline taxes being heavily taxed? I think that runs about 45 cents a gallon so the other $3 is for the product. All of the items you mentioned like I phones, micro waves, etc... are going for 10% or less on sales taxes. So the worst you could say that after being excluded from paying income taxes and taxes on their food stamp products the worst the poor will be hit is with sales taxes at 10% or less. I don't really get the angst here.

I support a safety net and I don't think welfare is that big a deal to the country's financial well being but I do find it incredulous that people resort to using a 10% or less sales tax as being demonstrative of the poor doing "their fair share". They really aren't doing ****.

[okie52]

Okie, N. Korea got theirs on the QT from Pakistan, almost before
anyone knew it...they're lousy at delivery systems and are pretty
well contained, with S. Korea and American carrier battlegroups.
As far as I can recall, N. Korea was bellicose to everyone.

Iran, on the other hand, is outright threatening Israel's very
existence and the guy running the show is every bit the loose
cannon that Kim Jong Il was, only on steroids. IMO, Iran is
far more dangerous than N. Korea.

We've had 50,000 troops in S Korea for 60 years. They are still firing on S Korea, sinking ships and firing missiles over Japan with complete imbeciles running the country and a cult like following that defies description and logic...much worse than the ragheads in Iran as far as mindless followers.

Iran doesn't even have a bomb yet and we don't know for sure they will get one...N Korea, on the other hand has nukes for sure.

[badger]

I support a safety net and I don't think welfare is that big a deal to the country's financial well being but I do find it incredulous that people resort to using a 10% or less sales tax as being demonstrative of the poor doing "their fair share". They really aren't doing ****.

OK, let me say why I brought it up: When talking about tax cuts, there are usually two arguments - dollar-wise and percentage-wise. The rich pay more dollar-wise. The middle-class pay more percentage-wose. The poors pay nothing at all dollar-wise or percentage-wise.

I would argue that the poors (because I'm tired I'm not typing out "low income individuals and families" and because this is a message bored and all) pay more dollar-wise and percentage-wise as a group in sales tax than many others. They're 50 percent of the population (if you go by the dont-pay-income-tax thing), so half our people as a consumer base. That's a lot of stuff to sales tax. And since they don't make tons of money (or they'd be taxed on their income), they are paying a higher percentage of their income to sales tax compared to others.

And, since most (if not all) of their income goes to goods and services (as opposed to investments and paying off debt, unlike the middle and upper classes), they could very well be paying more dollar-wise on sales taxes as well. No, I don't have stats to back that up. I'm a zombie today, so don't make me.

So, take it for what it's worth. They're paying taxes, even if they're not paying income taxes.

[rock on sooner]

OK, let me say why I brought it up: When talking about tax cuts, there are usually two arguments - dollar-wise and percentage-wise. The rich pay more dollar-wise. The middle-class pay more percentage-wose. The poors pay nothing at all dollar-wise or percentage-wise.

I would argue that the poors (because I'm tired I'm not typing out "low income individuals and families" and because this is a message bored and all) pay more dollar-wise and percentage-wise as a group in sales tax than many others. They're 50 percent of the population (if you go by the dont-pay-income-tax thing), so half our people as a consumer base. That's a lot of stuff to sales tax. And since they don't make tons of money (or they'd be taxed on their income), they are paying a higher percentage of their income to sales tax compared to others.

And, since most (if not all) of their income goes to goods and services (as opposed to investments and paying off debt, unlike the middle and upper classes), they could very well be paying more dollar-wise on sales taxes as well. No, I don't have stats to back that up. I'm a zombie today, so don't make me.

So, take it for what it's worth. They're paying taxes, even if they're not paying income taxes.

Careful, Badger, yer startin ta sound like a Dem..:biggrin:

[rock on sooner]

We've had 50,000 troops in S Korea for 60 years. They are still firing on S Korea, sinking ships and firing missiles over Japan with complete imbeciles running the country and a cult like following that defies description and logic...much worse than the ragheads in Iran as far as mindless followers.

Iran doesn't even have a bomb yet and we don't know for sure they will get one...N Korea, on the other hand has nukes for sure.

Not to be picky but the troop level is roughly 30,000 and has been since
the 60's. I agree with your description, though, of the N. Korean leaders
and the mindless following. Here's my take why N. Korea does what it
does...they do just enough to get international attention, to keep getting
grain for stopping firing their guns, etc. Now, the real issue is that Kim
Jong Un is an unknown and thusly there will be more wait and see...

Iran is more of an open country, by that I mean more engaged with the
international community with their oil, support of Assad and the Hezbollah.
Ahmedenijad (sp?), I believe, is certifiable and would go off half cocked,
especially if/when he gets a nuke.

[badger]

Careful, Badger, yer startin ta sound like a Dem..:biggrin:

Maybe that's what people turn into when they're sleep-deprived: Democrats.

But it's not like Republicans support regressive taxes like sales taxes. I've never heard of Republicans out-and-out supporting lotteries or casinos. It's usually Democrats that are begging for sales tax initiatives, at least from what I've seen locally.

[C&CDean]

I tell you what. I'll be at the Kansas St. game for sure. Maybe we'll get to meet and put all those stereotypes and assumptions to rest. We might even enjoy one another's company. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.
I grew up in what was essentially a North Memphis ghetto, Dean, on a street called N. Garland. I learned pretty quickly it was fight or get your *** beat. I'm no pansy. Being the only white kid on the block, I had to fight two, three, sometimes more kids (yes, usually black) with chains, bricks, knives, whatever, to literally survive. They'd try to steal my bike every time I got on it and road down the street.
But I also learned what those people go through. We got out. Most of them didn't. They had no reason to hate me, but I understood why they hated me. Memphis in the late 60's and early 70's was racially charged. Still is.
Those years are what shaped me and made me have some compassion for people that have little hope, bad schools and are surrounded by violence every ****ing day.

Yeah, we could get together and have a good time. I seem to manage to do that with most posters I've met in real life.

Can't relate to your upbringing though. I was raised in Tucson, AZ. I hardly ever even saw a black kid until I was probably in Jr. High, and it was when we played a downtown school in sports. Mexicans, on the other hand, I was raised around/with. Hung out with them, dated the Mexican girls, spent the night at their houses, etc. Most were poor, but some families were middle class.

This probably brings us to our primary difference, politically speaking anyhow. The Mexicans I grew up with had parents who cared for their children. They went to church. They payed their bills. They worked their asses off to provide groceries for their families. Many didn't allow their kids to speak Spanish in the home so they would be better equipped to get a job in the American world.

My folks were fairly poor as well, but we never did without. Four kids in a 1,000 sf house with no AC, and we didn't know the difference.

So I guess I don't get the "I get their anger" deal. Why they mad at me? Or you? The Mexicans I was raised with were every bit as downtrodden/discriminated against than any black kid in Memphis. The difference is they give/gave a **** about themselves and their families and neighbors.

Anyhow, we all become somewhat conditioned by our upbringings. I don't have much (if any) tolerance for angry black people. **** em'. They don't like their situation? Fix it. Hell, they have more opportunities right now than my kids do.

[okie52]

OK, let me say why I brought it up: When talking about tax cuts, there are usually two arguments - dollar-wise and percentage-wise. The rich pay more dollar-wise. The middle-class pay more percentage-wose. The poors pay nothing at all dollar-wise or percentage-wise.

I would argue that the poors (because I'm tired I'm not typing out "low income individuals and families" and because this is a message bored and all) pay more dollar-wise and percentage-wise as a group in sales tax than many others. They're 50 percent of the population (if you go by the dont-pay-income-tax thing), so half our people as a consumer base. That's a lot of stuff to sales tax. And since they don't make tons of money (or they'd be taxed on their income), they are paying a higher percentage of their income to sales tax compared to others.

And, since most (if not all) of their income goes to goods and services (as opposed to investments and paying off debt, unlike the middle and upper classes), they could very well be paying more dollar-wise on sales taxes as well. No, I don't have stats to back that up. I'm a zombie today, so don't make me.

So, take it for what it's worth. They're paying taxes, even if they're not paying income taxes.

I get the "regressive" sales taxes idea, theory or whatever you want to call it. We left out the high sin taxes on cigs and alcohol, which the poor will pay for in disproportionate numbers but are we responsible for their bad choices? I'm sure they hit the lotteries in disproportionate numbers too. Everyone pays sales taxes...not just the poor. Want to just eliminate taxes on the poor altogether? Just how far do we have to go to provide enough comfort for low income families? They can qualify and receive welfare, WIC (foodstamps) and Soonercare, and they are exempt from income taxes.

I'm not seeing the shared sacrifice here.

[rock on sooner]

Maybe that's what people turn into when they're sleep-deprived: Democrats.

But it's not like Republicans support regressive taxes like sales taxes. I've never heard of Republicans out-and-out supporting lotteries or casinos. It's usually Democrats that are begging for sales tax initiatives, at least from what I've seen locally.

Badg, OK has over 70 casinos. How did a state as red as OK get
that many without a LOT of Republican support? Just askin'?

[badger]

I'm not seeing the shared sacrifice here.

True, but if you don't have any money to sacrifice, can you really be expected to share what you don't have?

Or, should we be expecting some other form of payment that isn't money? Hmmm there's a thought

[okie52]

Not to be picky but the troop level is roughly 30,000 and has been since
the 60's. I agree with your description, though, of the N. Korean leaders
and the mindless following. Here's my take why N. Korea does what it
does...they do just enough to get international attention, to keep getting
grain for stopping firing their guns, etc. Now, the real issue is that Kim
Jong Un is an unknown and thusly there will be more wait and see...

Iran is more of an open country, by that I mean more engaged with the
international community with their oil, support of Assad and the Hezbollah.
Ahmedenijad (sp?), I believe, is certifiable and would go off half cocked,
especially if/when he gets a nuke.

Yeah, I forgot it dropped some time ago. But 30,000 troops are still a lot of people we are paying to be there for 60 years. S Korea certainly has a much healthier economy than N Korea and can afford its own defense but we are still there.

Iran is definitely more engaged internationally than N Korea but that also causes them to use some caution in their behavior. Ahmadinejad may like to saber rattle but I don't think he really wants to go to war. He has to know that would be the end of Iran as we know it.

[okie52]

Badg, OK has over 70 casinos. How did a state as red as OK get
that many without a LOT of Republican support? Just askin'?

Indian lands...doesn't matter what anyone outside the tribes think. The lottery was a different issue, however. That did take some pub support for that but most pub leaders were against it.

[okie52]

True, but if you don't have any money to sacrifice, can you really be expected to share what you don't have?

Or, should we be expecting some other form of payment that isn't money? Hmmm there's a thought

I'm not saying they should pay more but they sure shouldn't be bitching about what they are paying or have people pandering to them as though they are being mistreated by the "system".

[C&CDean]

Indian lands...doesn't matter what anyone outside the tribes think. The lottery was a different issue, however. That did take some pub support for that but most pub leaders were against it.

Not true. Most of the Baptists were against it. There's plenty of those folks who are Democrats.

[rock on sooner]

Not true. Most of the Baptists were against it. There's plenty of those folks who are Democrats.

Well, Oklahoma IS the buckle on the bible belt! A Baptist was
the first person to fire me from a job:biggrin:

[XingTheRubicon]

I tell you what. I'll be at the Kansas St. game for sure. Maybe we'll get to meet and put all those stereotypes and assumptions to rest. We might even enjoy one another's company. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.
I grew up in what was essentially a North Memphis ghetto, Dean, on a street called N. Garland. I learned pretty quickly it was fight or get your *** beat. I'm no pansy. Being the only white kid on the block, I had to fight two, three, sometimes more kids (yes, usually black) with chains, bricks, knives, whatever, to literally survive. They'd try to steal my bike every time I got on it and road down the street.
But I also learned what those people go through. We got out. Most of them didn't. They had no reason to hate me, but I understood why they hated me. Memphis in the late 60's and early 70's was racially charged. Still is.
Those years are what shaped me and made me have some compassion for people that have little hope, bad schools and are surrounded by violence every ****ing day.

are you vanilla ice?

[okie52]

Not true. Most of the Baptists were against it. There's plenty of those folks who are Democrats.

Yeah, most baptists have always been against it. But I'm sure there were more dems for the lottery than the pubs and Henry was campaigning for it along with many dem leaders. Pub leaders, as I recall, were mostly against it.

[C&CDean]

Maybe. All a moot point now though.

[diverdog]

Not to be picky but the troop level is roughly 30,000 and has been since
the 60's. I agree with your description, though, of the N. Korean leaders
and the mindless following. Here's my take why N. Korea does what it
does...they do just enough to get international attention, to keep getting
grain for stopping firing their guns, etc. Now, the real issue is that Kim
Jong Un is an unknown and thusly there will be more wait and see...

Iran is more of an open country, by that I mean more engaged with the
international community with their oil, support of Assad and the Hezbollah.
Ahmedenijad (sp?), I believe, is certifiable and would go off half cocked,
especially if/when he gets a nuke.

The President of Iran does not have the authority to launch a nuke. That power lies with Ali Khamenei the
Supreme Leader. He controls the armed forces. At one time he supported Ahmadinejad but now they are on the outs.

What is also not widely known is that Israel has at least five or more dolphin class ballistic missile subs. This gives them a very robust first and second strike capability. Iran will not strike them and they are not the threat NK is to the rest of the world. Irans youth are also pro western. We have time.

[okie52]

Maybe. All a moot point now though.

Yep, as is the $300,000,000 a year our education system was going to get from the lottery.

[rock on sooner]

The President of Iran does not have the authority to launch a nuke. That power lies with Ali Khamenei the
Supreme Leader. He controls the armed forces. At one time he supported Ahmadinejad but now they are on the outs.

What is also not widely known is that Israel has at least five or more dolphin class ballistic missile subs. This gives them a very robust first and second strike capability. Iran will not strike them and they are not the threat NK is to the rest of the world. Irans youth are also pro western. We have time.

DD, He may not have the authority but that doesn't mean he wouldn't do
it. N. Korea is a threat, but "only" to S. Korea. I don't think NK has the
delivery system to do major damage...every test I've heard about has been
a failure. I could be wrong, if there have been successful tests not made
public...gotta believe if one was successful, they would've told the world.

[pphilfran]

DD, He may not have the authority but that doesn't mean he wouldn't do
it. N. Korea is a threat, but "only" to S. Korea. I don't think NK has the
delivery system to do major damage...every test I've heard about has been
a failure. I could be wrong, if there have been successful tests not made
public...gotta believe if one was successful, they would've told the world.

He is just a figurehead...when the Supreme Leader says jump...he asks how high...

[rock on sooner]

He is just a figurehead...when the Supreme Leader says jump...he asks how high...

Ya could be right, but I sure as hell don't trust him...

[East Coast Bias]

True, but if you don't have any money to sacrifice, can you really be expected to share what you don't have?

Or, should we be expecting some other form of payment that isn't money? Hmmm there's a thought
This is something I have struggled to understand as well, Badj? What kind of yearly income qualifies you to pay "zero" income tax?20K,25K? Who would want to sign up for taking welfare and 20K a year and try to make that work with a family? Maybe these folks don't want to get the education and put out the effort it takes to make 150K a year, that seems to be what we are saying here. Personally I don't expect a family with an annual income of 20K to pay income tax. I would like to see some controls on fraud.....

[cleller]

Yep, as is the $300,000,000 a year our education system was going to get from the lottery.

I thought all the lotteries and HB 1017 was supposed to stop the constant money woes for education. Not that money is the really the way to solve our educational troubles, anyway.

[marfacowboy]

So I guess I don't get the "I get their anger" deal. Why they mad at me? Or you? The Mexicans I was raised with were every bit as downtrodden/discriminated against than any black kid in Memphis. The difference is they give/gave a **** about themselves and their families and neighbors.

Anyhow, we all become somewhat conditioned by our upbringings. I don't have much (if any) tolerance for angry black people. **** em'. They don't like their situation? Fix it. Hell, they have more opportunities right now than my kids do.

It's just a cultural dynamic. I don't understand all the reasons, except of course blacks were slaves, imported against their will. Mexicans had a few more choices, historically at least.
In Memphis, Dr. King was killed, we had the sanitation strike and then the busing breakdown. All of it together was just too much, and blacks saw whites as the enemy. I suppose some of the adults spoke disparagingly about me, "that white boy," and the kids picked up on it. Kids can be pretty mean without a lot of adult encouragement, but it's still all basically learned behavior.
Anyway, I survived and learned a lot in the process.

[soonercruiser]

Yea I dont know which is worse the Far right wingers who copy and paste every far out whacko deal they come across or the weirdo Lefties who post 15 paragraph post with charts and graphs and all kinds of studies to prove their point 5-0 did make a valid point tho
I doubt theres a person on this board that will change their voting stance between now and election time
We might have had a chance at converting icky to the conservative side but we will never know . :cocksure:

Go easy on Phil vet.
I cut & paste all his charts for my night class.
Where's my eastern Indian accent....."and the colors are Grate"!

[hawaii 5-0]

Groan.

Here's another full page of crappy, useless threads.

5-0

[olevetonahill]

Groan.

Here's another full page of crappy, useless threads.

5-0

Why do you keep adding to em?

[okie52]

Why do you keep adding to em?

Heh, it wouldn't be complete without him.

[soonercruiser]

Why do you keep adding to em?

Because 5-O needs to "Get a Life"!
:uncomfortableness:

[KABOOKIE]

Groan.

Here's another full page of crappy, useless threads.

5-0




But, but you have a life and more important things to care about, right? :rolleyes:

[hawaii 5-0]

I'm not complaining about posts. I'm complaining about starting a new thread for every indescretion a politician makes.

The number of treads I've started are very small compared.......


Oh, I like my life quite nicely. It's another beautiful day here. My Sooners are on later. Boise lost. Life is good. What could be better except for a BJ and a steak?


5-0