PDA

View Full Version : Jake-Brakes?



ouwasp
3/15/2012, 11:38 PM
So the other day my daughter and I are driving into another town and spots the sign that says "No Jake Brakes". She asks what that means. I tell her all of my limited knowledge; that Jake-braking is when the semi-trucks downshift to slow down instead of using the standard braking system. This produces a loud engine noise that is not pleasing to hear, thus the ban.

So was I correct? Why would truckers rather jake-brake?

Thanks in advance you South Oval geniuses... ;)

Turd_Ferguson
3/16/2012, 12:01 AM
Jake brake is a system designed to slow the truck down through engine compression rather than using the wheel brakes. Google will give you a pretty good description of how it works. A bull hauler running 8" open exhaust and turning on the jake brake as he comes into town can be pretty obnoxious sounding...

pphilfran
3/16/2012, 04:45 AM
During the compression stroke It opens the exhaust valve at TDC....I am sure you have heard one used...a loud roar as they decelerate....

StoopTroup
3/16/2012, 06:07 AM
My understanding is that Jake Brakes are derived from Jacob Brakes but that Jake has become the industry name for what Turd describes. Yeah they are loud but provide a great mid range assist in braking performance and save on the wear and tear of the vehicles primary friction braking systems.

Lots of places do not like them used near high population of humans.

I think it's a great innovation. Gas vehicles use throttles and when you back off the throttle on your car, your car slows down. Diesel Trucks...not so much. It's good that these many heavy haulers are equipped with such systems as there would be a bunch more dead folks out there on our Nations Highways more than likely.

Turd_Ferguson
3/16/2012, 06:12 AM
I-80 West bound from Park City down into Salt Lake...Do that with a load behind ya, I garauntee ya you'll wish you had either a jake or exhaust brake...:D

soonerhubs
3/16/2012, 06:27 AM
I-80 West bound from Park City down into Salt Lake...Do that with a load behind ya, I garauntee ya you'll wish you had either a jake or exhaust brake...:D That's some steep declines there! :)

Lott's Bandana
3/16/2012, 08:23 AM
That's some steep declines there! :)


One of my favorite stretches of highway...especially if I'm traveling UP to get to PC!

cleller
3/16/2012, 08:39 AM
I once had a dirt bike with a "jake brake" system, too. There were two spark plug ports on the cylinder head. One for the plug, the other held the decompression valve. Had a small lever near the clutch you could pull, releasing the compression from the engine. Practical in limited applications.

Its a little like taking a lid off a boiling pot, rather than just turning the fire down.

tator
3/16/2012, 10:32 AM
It's good that these many heavy haulers are equipped with such systems as there would be a bunch more dead folks out there on our Nations Highways more than likely. How do ya figure that?

Mississippi Sooner
3/16/2012, 12:29 PM
How do ya figure that?

Unlike traditional brakes, Jake brakes don't overheat. I can testify to what a life saver they can be. They've made a lot of advances with them, too, in the last twenty years. Heck, I've seen demonstrations where, with the new ones, you can go down an incline like the Grapevine with a 43,000 pound load and hardly touch your brakes. Makes those runaway truck ramps a lot less necessary.

Mississippi Sooner
3/16/2012, 12:31 PM
But with all that said, those guys who use them in populated areas or just keep them on even when they are on fairly flat ground are being jackasses. There is no reason for it other than to make a loud noise.

tator
3/16/2012, 02:50 PM
Unlike traditional brakes, Jake brakes don't overheat. I can testify to what a life saver they can be. They've made a lot of advances with them, too, in the last twenty years. Heck, I've seen demonstrations where, with the new ones, you can go down an incline like the Grapevine with a 43,000 pound load and hardly touch your brakes. Makes those runaway truck ramps a lot less necessary.I get that, now how would there be a "bunch more dead folks out there" without jake brakes? I just don't see the logic in no jake brakes = dead humans. It's a bit of a stretch.

texaspokieokie
3/16/2012, 03:01 PM
I once had a dirt bike with a "jake brake" system, too. There were two spark plug ports on the cylinder head. One for the plug, the other held the decompression valve. Had a small lever near the clutch you could pull, releasing the compression from the engine. Practical in limited applications.

Its a little like taking a lid off a boiling pot, rather than just turning the fire down.was to be used to kill the engine.

Turd_Ferguson
3/16/2012, 03:05 PM
I get that, now how would there be a "bunch more dead folks out there" without jake brakes? I just don't see the logic in no jake brakes = dead humans. It's a bit of a stretch.So, you don't think there was a drop in fatality accidents with the advent of Truck Escape Ramps?

tator
3/16/2012, 03:07 PM
So, you don't think there was a drop in fatality accidents with the advent of Truck Escape Ramps?Definitely. Stay on topic.

Turd_Ferguson
3/16/2012, 03:11 PM
Definitely. Stay on topic.Well then...I think you may be discombobulated...

tator
3/16/2012, 03:16 PM
Listen, can't a guy troll ST in peace? Sheesh...

Turd_Ferguson
3/16/2012, 03:23 PM
Listen, can't a guy troll ST in peace? Sheesh...DAMMIT!!! Just when I thought I was about to win an innerweb argument!!

StoopTroup
3/16/2012, 03:24 PM
So, you don't think there was a drop in fatality accidents with the advent of Truck Escape Ramps?

He's not gonna understand Turd. He's more than likely one of the statistics I was talking about.

People don't understand that they need to respect those rigs they are pulling in front of. I tell you. I don't give a damn what Tator thinks....I have friends that have driven the Rockies and Pacific Coast Highways and even the Appalachian Mountains and everyone of them have stories that IMO should be told in Driver's Ed Classes.

I'm glad the long haulers have Jakes on them so that when they get into populated areas they haven't run down their primaries or have a problem they didn't know about with their brakes. The number of folks I've seen drive in front of Rigs and expect them to be able to stop....well...every time I see it I just accelerate around it all as fast as I can and say a little prayer for the driver that he doesn't end up squashing them like a bug.

The highways are dangerous Tator. Be careful out there.

Tator....ask yourself this. If a Rig's Brakes went out and he didn't have a Jake Brake....and you were sitting at some intersection listening to gospel Music on your Bose Stereo in your car and using your IPhone to post something on SoonerFans while he was headed your direction with a full load.....would you be happier if he say hit you doing 5-15 MPH with his rig or 70 MPH?

tator
3/16/2012, 03:30 PM
DAMMIT!!! Just when I thought I was about to win an innerweb argument!!You can have the assist on my victory :)

tator
3/16/2012, 03:33 PM
Tator....ask yourself this. If a Rig's Brakes went out and he didn't have a Jake Brake....and you were sitting at some intersection listening to gospel Music on your Bose Stereo in your car and using your IPhone to post something on SoonerFans while he was headed your direction with a full load.....would you be happier if he say hit you doing 5 MPH with his rig or 70 MPH?This whole scenario is a farce, I don't listen to gospel OR have an iPhone. I can't put myself in this situation and give you a realistic response, sorry.

StoopTroup
3/16/2012, 03:38 PM
sorry.

I accept your apology.

tator
3/16/2012, 03:41 PM
You're a gentleman, sir.

StoopTroup
3/16/2012, 03:54 PM
Turd....You win. I didn't get into this for another one. :D

stoopified
3/17/2012, 10:40 AM
Well then...I think you may be discombobulated...No need to use profanity :)

pphilfran
3/17/2012, 11:02 AM
was to be used to kill the engine.

They use them now to bleed off some compression from big bore, high compression engines to help the electric starter or manual kick start...

Two strokes (mostly flattrackers) used them for brakes...

StoopTroup
3/17/2012, 11:04 AM
BTW....I'm talking to a friend about this who had just as many truck drivers as friends as I do and he got all confused to as the term Jake Brake has been misused over the years. Jacob Brake Systems is where the term came from but just like those signs that say "No Jake Brake" if a Truck Driver got stopped and ticketed for using one, I'm not sure that an attorney couldn't tear the ordinance to shreds depending on how the truck had been equipped. Technology and automatic gearboxes and other things all are very different than the original Jacob Brakes. So in the end, unless we are talking about a specific truck and type of terrain ect. I think we can argue about all of this for days. Where is Jerk when we need him?

texaspokieokie
3/17/2012, 11:05 AM
signs i've seen say "no engine braking".

texaspokieokie
3/17/2012, 11:06 AM
They use them now to bleed off some compression from big bore, high compression engines to help the electric starter or manual kick start...

Two strokes (mostly flattrackers) used them for brakes...small bikes used them as a kill switch.

pphilfran
3/17/2012, 11:08 AM
small bikes used them as a kill switch.

They can be used for that....

StoopTroup
3/17/2012, 11:13 AM
signs i've seen say "no engine braking".

See right there is probably proof that jake brake signs had been challenged. Engine compression braking is different than Jacob Braking and exhaust braking. There are all types of systems so it would seem they are getting down to just outlawing loud exhaust or equipment but I'm no expert on that stuff.

I did weld an old steel beer can onto the exhaust pipe of this old car once so it wouldn't be so loud. When you started it it sounded like you opened up a 6 pack all at once. :D

StoopTroup
3/17/2012, 11:18 AM
Thread jack!

Anyone remember the old pull tab cans that they outlawed because fish would swallow them?

http://s.ecrater.com/stores/10124/48c1cdb6731f4_10124n.jpg

http://www.rustycans.com/Graphics/7ziptops.jpg

pphilfran
3/17/2012, 11:19 AM
Thread jack!

Anyone remember the old pull tab cans that they outlawed because fish would swallow them?

http://s.ecrater.com/stores/10124/48c1cdb6731f4_10124n.jpg

I just dropped them down into the can...

Turd_Ferguson
3/17/2012, 11:35 AM
How do you figure Jake Brake is different than engine compression braking?

And why would he get cornfused over the term Jake Brake?

Turd_Ferguson
3/17/2012, 11:43 AM
signs i've seen say "no engine braking".From Wikipedia:


Jacobs claims that the use of Jake Brakes on signs prohibiting engine retarding brakes violates their trademark and discriminates against Jacobs brand products.

pphilfran
3/17/2012, 11:57 AM
Most of the time you want your product name to be used as the generic..."Give me a kleenex"...

Not so in this case...

3rdgensooner
3/17/2012, 12:09 PM
I've learned stuff today.

pphilfran
3/17/2012, 12:38 PM
Basically useless stuff...but it is still learned stuff...

cleller
3/17/2012, 12:55 PM
Simplify it to say jake brake + brake pedal = stop faster.

On the two stroke bike the compression release was good when going down a big hill to bleed off a little compression so you weren't overrevving at at the bottom. You could pick up in the same gear you started down the hill in, rather than have to jockey up and down. Can't remember if I used it as a kill switch.

ouwasp
3/17/2012, 01:22 PM
heh... I've learned a lot as well. Thanks to all. Interesting. It's good to learn new things...

My bro used to live on the side of a highway on a hillside. It was fun to hear him complain about the loud blatting noise he had to endure late at night. I gonna see him toniight. Think I'll get him going.... ;)

StoopTroup
3/18/2012, 01:56 AM
How do you figure Jake Brake is different than engine compression braking?

And why would he get cornfused over the term Jake Brake?

It wasn't me. It was my buddy that got it all confused. He kept rattling on about it until I was ready to talk about beer. :D

delhalew
3/18/2012, 09:36 AM
The engine brakes aren't nearly as loud on newer trucks. Unless you are fully loaded on a steep grade with high rpms, it's pretty tolerable.

Turd_Ferguson
3/18/2012, 11:13 AM
The engine brakes aren't nearly as loud on newer trucks. Unless you are fully loaded on a steep grade with high rpms, it's pretty tolerable.Yup, but most all company owned trucks still have muffler/converter. The O/O's running with open exhaust are the ones that will rattle the windows.

It always seems to be bull haulers and rock haulers that make the most racket...

Tulsa_Fireman
3/18/2012, 06:16 PM
Not to mention a large number of newer big machines are transitioning to actual driveline retarders.

Silent and amazing.

pphilfran
3/18/2012, 06:27 PM
Not to mention a large number of newer big machines are transitioning to actual driveline retarders.

Silent and amazing.A similar system has been used in industry for some time...mostly used as a brake to apply tension in low tolerance/auto adjust systems...

C&CDean
3/18/2012, 06:28 PM
I once had a dirt bike with a "jake brake" system, too. There were two spark plug ports on the cylinder head. One for the plug, the other held the decompression valve. Had a small lever near the clutch you could pull, releasing the compression from the engine. Practical in limited applications.

Its a little like taking a lid off a boiling pot, rather than just turning the fire down.

That would be a "compression release". Had it on my Bultaco, my Husky, and the Ossa. Sorta handy...sorta. Man, that was back in the day.

pphilfran
3/18/2012, 08:09 PM
That would be a "compression release". Had it on my Bultaco, my Husky, and the Ossa. Sorta handy...sorta. Man, that was back in the day.

Nice rides...I had an original Elsinore....

Turd_Ferguson
3/18/2012, 08:58 PM
Nice rides...I had an original Elsinore....I did to, but mine wasn't big enough for a compression dump :D

http://craigmac215.tripod.com/bikes/74mr50.jpg