Bama the beautiful

[okie52]

Alabama: An Important Lesson for Presidential Candidates


Grace Meng is a US researcher for Human Rights Watch.
Posted: 01/25/2012 7:15 pm

"If you've been here 25 years and you got three kids, two grandkids, you've been paying taxes, obeying the law, you belong to a local church. I don't think we're going to separate you from your family, uproot you forcefully and kick you out."

When Newt Gingrich spoke these words during a presidential debate, the other Republican candidates largely decried them as promoting "amnesty." They have instead promoted fences, employer sanctions, and other "enforcement-only" measures. Gingrich's recent win in South Carolina, however, should remind the remaining candidates -- as well as any politician who wants to address illegal immigration -- that according to a December Fox News poll, a supermajority of Americans, including Republicans, want a more practical and humane solution.

These Americans recognize that many unauthorized immigrants in this country have deep and extensive ties to the U.S., have U.S. citizen family, work for -- or even own -- American businesses, and are an integral part of their local communities. They recognize that it is impossible to deport 11 million people without hurting the entire country. And if any candidate continues to believe enforcement-only legislation is feasible or fair, he only has to look at Alabama, which essentially has put a plan of attrition into effect.

The sponsors of the Beason-Hammon Alabama Taxpayer and Citizen Protection Act, commonly known as HB 56, have not been shy about their intended goal. As Alabama State Representative Mickey Hammon stated, "[HB 56] attacks every aspect of an illegal alien's life... This bill is designed to make it difficult for them to live here so they will self-deport."

Other states like Arizona and Georgia passed similar laws, but Alabama is the only state in which most of the provisions of the law went into effect. And as Human Rights Watch found, as documented in our recent report "No Way to Live," the Beason-Hammon Act already has had a significant impact on unauthorized immigrants, the communities in which they live, and the state as a whole.

State government offices broadly interpreted a provision to require proof of legal status when signing up for utility service or licenses. So officials told a mother who has been living in the U.S. for 15 years that they wouldn't renew the registration tag for her family's mobile home.

The law denies unauthorized immigrants equal protection of the law. Two restaurant workers trying to sue for unpaid wages were told by a lawyer that they had no right to do that under the new law. A victim of assault and robbery didn't report the crime after the police told his friend they would inquire into his immigration status. Attorneys have even questioned whether the law imposes a duty on them to report unauthorized clients, while some judges have reportedly said they would report any unauthorized immigrant in their courtrooms.

In some ways, these are the bill's intended consequences. What the sponsors may not have intended is the impact on U.S. citizens and legal residents.

The impact has been especially severe on children of unauthorized immigrants, many of them U.S. citizens. A 27-year-old woman, in the U.S. for 20 years, did not take her 8-year-old daughter to the hospital when she had an asthma attack, fearing arrest. Although the provision requiring schools to check students' immigration status was temporarily blocked, many families withdrew their children and those who remain are fearful and anxious. A first-grade teacher struggled to fight back tears as she described how her students have asked her if she would adopt them if anything happened to their parents.

Residents of Latino descent, including citizens and permanent residents, have reported increased harassment and discrimination. A doctor, a permanent resident, said his car was stopped by a state trooper who gave no reason and was allowed to proceed only when he produced an Alabama driver's license. A pharmacy clerk at a discount store chain refused to fill a prescription for a permanent resident because she was not a citizen. Another mother, a U.S. citizen from a long-time Alabama family, was heartbroken when her U.S. citizen daughter, who is part Latino, came home from school crying because her classmate had told her she would have to "go back to Mexico."

Unauthorized immigrants in Alabama paid an estimated $130 million in state and local taxes in 2010. But local economies that grew with the immigrant community are rapidly shrinking. Farmers are facing a shortage of workers so severe that the state is considering using prison labor. Communities have been broken as families have left: one minister reported his congregation had decreased from 100 people to 25. Business leaders have called the law a mistake, fearing damage to the state's image and potential for investment.

Most Americans don't want their country to end up like Alabama. The Republican presidential candidates should heed them, and whoever wins the election this November should work with Congress to do what is in their power: pass smart, humane, and effective immigration reform.

hahahaha

Sounds like the law is working great.

Roll, Tide, Roll.

[Ton Loc]

Good to see you're back to being an a-hole about it.



Residents of Latino descent, including citizens and permanent residents, have reported increased harassment and discrimination. A doctor, a permanent resident, said his car was stopped by a state trooper who gave no reason and was allowed to proceed only when he produced an Alabama driver's license. A pharmacy clerk at a discount store chain refused to fill a prescription for a permanent resident because she was not a citizen. Another mother, a U.S. citizen from a long-time Alabama family, was heartbroken when her U.S. citizen daughter, who is part Latino, came home from school crying because her classmate had told her she would have to "go back to Mexico."

Unauthorized immigrants in Alabama paid an estimated $130 million in state and local taxes in 2010. But local economies that grew with the immigrant community are rapidly shrinking. Farmers are facing a shortage of workers so severe that the state is considering using prison labor. Communities have been broken as families have left: one minister reported his congregation had decreased from 100 people to 25. Business leaders have called the law a mistake, fearing damage to the state's image and potential for investment.

Nice work Alabama, now just get someone to try to pass a bill banning Sharia Law or fetus eating and your state can look as foolish as ours.

[okie52]

And you're still being a puzzy crying for the invaders. Thank God OK and Bama don't look as smart as those states that embrace illegals or communities that want to give them the right to vote.

[Ton Loc]

I'm not crying for them. I'm just not a Sadist about the situation.

Listen to This American Life episode #456 (http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/456/reap-what-you-sow). A large portion is about Alabama.

[okie52]

Sure you're crying for them and/or that a state that tries to curtail illegal immigration is the bad guy.

American Life episode #456? Is that supposed to be a link or a video?

[Turd_Ferguson]

American Life episode #456? Is that supposed to be a link or a video?I believe it's just a cool phrase to use when your a "wet behind the ears knowitall".

[okie52]

I believe it's just a cool phrase to use when your a "wet behind the ears knowitall".

Ahh...

[Ton Loc]

I believe it's just a cool phrase to use when your a "wet behind the ears knowitall".

It's a popular podcast that tells a few different stories on on similar topics.

btw - I added the link.

The show is all about unintended consequences. Alabama is not too fond of the law they passed. It is the first story.

[okie52]

Well the link won't play on my iPad so I'll have to wait til tomorrow. But I doubt BAMA is upset about the law...maybe some businesses that employed illegals....but we want them to be upset or in jail.

[pphilfran]

It's a popular podcast that tells a few different stories on on similar topics.

btw - I added the link.

The show is all about unintended consequences. Alabama is not too fond of the law they passed. It is the first story.

If there are so many illegals that it impacts the economy then there are too damn many illegals....

[SoonerPride]

Well the link won't play on my iPad so I'll have to wait til tomorrow. But I doubt BAMA is upset about the law...maybe some businesses that employed illegals....but we want them to be upset or in jail.

They are having a hard time harvesting their crops.

No one wants to do it.

The law will be repealed as too draconian and bad for the local economy.

[pphilfran]

They are having a hard time harvesting their crops.

No one wants to do it.

The law will be repealed as too draconian and bad for the local economy.

Then they will raise the pay rate and get the harvesters...the pay rate increase will then cause other local businesses to raise their minimum wage rate....the lower payed will see benefits...

There are also legal means to get immigrant harvesters into the fields...this is the first year to be in effect....the system will work better next year with one year under the growers belts...


Produce prices will increase by 5 to 10% on avg....

[okie52]

They are having a hard time harvesting their crops.

No one wants to do it.

The law will be repealed as too draconian and bad for the local economy.

I'd take that bet on repeal. Now it may face challenges in the courts but no way bamans will ever repeal it.

Explain the draconian part.

[pphilfran]

Or...

The cost to pick the produce increases to the point where development or use of automated machines becomes practical....then we can have stable costs, don't have to worry about illegals doing the work...and we won't have to beg the unemployed to actually do some physical labor...

[okie52]

God forbid the unemployed would stoop to work.

[Mississippi Sooner]

Could someone please explain to me just what types of crops Bama has that are in danger of rotting in the field? It just ain't that much of a farming state, other than timber.

[Ton Loc]

I'd take that bet on repeal. Now it may face challenges in the courts but no way bamans will ever repeal it.

Explain the draconian part.

The law won't be repealed, but they'll probably change some of it. I'm assuming they'll change the parts that seem to have the perceived effect of hurting business and the parts that deal with citizens holding police to the law. They might want to get on that because apparently some of it is going to be looked at by the surpreme court.

[dwarthog]

Could someone please explain to me just what types of crops Bama has that are in danger of rotting in the field? It just ain't that much of a farming state, other than timber.

Tomatoes, Cucumbers etc... probably not on a scale like out in California, but large enough to supply the local markets and large enough that a labor force is required.

[Mississippi Sooner]

Tomatoes, Cucumbers etc... probably not on a scale like out in California, but large enough to supply the local markets and large enough that a labor force is required.

Ok, I didn't think about tomatoes. There are a lot of pecans grown down in the coastal region, but I think they are mostly harvested mechanically. There are also a lot of turf farms down in that area that might require a lot of field labor.

[LiveLaughLove]

God forbid the unemployed would stoop to work.

Was listening to an audio book called "think and grow rich" by napoleon hill. It's an old book written post depression but pre-ww ii.

Roosevelt's government was bribing their electorate with "relief checks". The equivelant of today's welfare. The recipients in new York rioted and became violent.

Why? Not enough money? No. It seems back then the postman had to make you sign for the check. They would deliver them first so they could get rid of those liabilities. So most recipients got knocks on their doors around 7:30am.

They were rioting because they were tired of being awakened by the postman!

Ah how things never change.

Oh yeah, Roosevelt knew who buttered his bread. The postal service was ordered to quit delivering the checks befor 10am.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

If only the FEDGOV would enforce the immigration laws as Alabama is...

[SoonerPride]

If only the FEDGOV would enforce the immigration laws as Alabama is...

If only the GOP would endorse Reagan's position of amnesty.

I thought he was their saint?

[Midtowner]

If only the GOP would endorse Reagan's position of amnesty.

I thought he was their saint?

Maybe a middle-of-the road option would be best. A quick, safe way for those here illegally to have a path to citizenship, coupled with Alabama-like reforms for those who choose to not go the legal route? Both camps have great ideas. The status quo sure as hell isn't the best route, but it seems like the one we're destined to go down. Liberals, you shouldn't be against forcing people to follow our immigration laws. Conservatives, you shouldn't be so unrealistic and harsh, asking well-established families to simply uproot because we decided to change the rules on them.

Businesses need a cheap labor pool. So long as that labor pool consists of citizens or resident aliens, I really don't care where they came from or how they got here.

[Ton Loc]

Maybe a middle-of-the road option would be best. A quick, safe way for those here illegally to have a path to citizenship, coupled with Alabama-like reforms for those who choose to not go the legal route? Both camps have great ideas. The status quo sure as hell isn't the best route, but it seems like the one we're destined to go down. Liberals, you shouldn't be against forcing people to follow our immigration laws. Conservatives, you shouldn't be so unrealistic and harsh, asking well-established families to simply uproot because we decided to change the rules on them.

Businesses need a cheap labor pool. So long as that labor pool consists of citizens or resident aliens, I really don't care where they came from or how they got here.

Common sense does not compute.

Seriously though, what was the last big issue we ever reached a middle ground on? Even if there was a middle ground, you would never know because both neither party would be able to accept it. Neither side wants to be perceived as a "loser" on a deal.

[pphilfran]

Common sense does not compute.

Seriously though, what was the last big issue we ever reached a middle ground on? Even if there was a middle ground, you would never know because both neither party would be able to accept it. Neither side wants to be perceived as a "loser" on a deal.

Sad, but true...

[pphilfran]

I don't really care how we handle those that are already in the states...

All I know is that whichever path is chosen it will be expensive as hell and will further bloat the government...

Track down 10 million and send em home? Impossible and costly...

Track the path to citizenship for 8 million over several years....round up the 10% that don't sign up...round up the 10% that can't meet the standards...and then round up the % of the 8 million that don't make the grade in the specified time frame...Impossible and costly...

However we choose to lock down the border will be costly....
However we choose to audit millions of companies for hiring compliance will be costly...

We let this f'n mess go on for far too long and now it will be painful and expensive...but you can bet you azz they won't do chit and kick the can down to road so it can become even more costly and difficult to implement...

[Ton Loc]

I don't really care how we handle those that are already in the states...

All I know is that whichever path is chosen it will be expensive as hell and will further bloat the government...

Track down 10 million and send em home? Impossible and costly...

Track the path to citizenship for 8 million over several years....round up the 10% that don't sign up...round up the 10% that can't meet the standards...and then round up the % of the 8 million that don't make the grade in the specified time frame...Impossible and costly...

However we choose to lock down the border will be costly....
However we choose to audit millions of companies for hiring compliance will be costly...

We let this f'n mess go on for far too long and now it will be painful and expensive...but you can bet you azz they won't do chit and kick the can down to road so it can become even more costly and difficult to implement...

The 7 dangerous words:

It's the way we've always done things

[okie52]

If only the GOP would endorse Reagan's position of amnesty.

I thought he was their saint?

Reagan's amnesty did what? It gave 3,000,000 amnesty with the promise of border security. Well the 3,000,000 got their amnesty but as for the border security we now have 4 times the number of illegals.

Reagan's former cabinet members now say it was a mistake.

[okie52]

Bush, McCain and Kennedy tried to get the amnesty to pass congress in 2005. Obama has tried too.

Nothing will pass unless border security is guaranteed (unlike the Reagan amnesty). The problem is once the amnesty is given then following administrations can relax the border security and start the whole cycle again.

[SoonerPride]

Bush, McCain and Kennedy tried to get the amnesty to pass congress in 2005. Obama has tried too.

Nothing will pass unless border security is guaranteed (unlike the Reagan amnesty). The problem is once the amnesty is given then following administrations can relax the border security and start the whole cycle again.

You can erect a thousand foot wall along the entire border with Mexico and it won't solve illegal immigration. Why? Because nearly 1/2 of the illegal aliens came here legally and simply overstay their visas.

http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/36665

An electrified border fence with a moat filled with gators won't fix that bugaboo.

A fence or wall or whatever is a boondoggle and waste of time and money. In fact it would just shift the number of people who come legally then melt into the populace.

It's a tidy "solution" to an untidy problem.


We need to provide easier ways for skilled immigrants to come to the United States legally and become citizens. We also need to provide a sensible path to citizenship for immigrants long entrenched in this country, especially those who were brought here at a young age by their parents and who have been raised as Americans.

This, of course, must be balanced by enforcement of immigration laws and efforts to reduce illegal immigration. And illegal immigrants who commit crimes while here should be summarily deported.

All these are imperfect solutions to a complex problem. But they are better than relying on the false hope that a multi-billion-dollar border fence is the answer.

Read more here: http://www.heraldonline.com/2012/01/09/3646597/border-fence-wont-work.html#storylink=cpy

[okie52]

You can erect a thousand foot wall along the entire border with Mexico and it won't solve illegal immigration. Why? Because nearly 1/2 of the illegal aliens came here legally and simply overstay their visas.

http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/36665

An electrified border fence with a moat filled with gators won't fix that bugaboo.

A fence or wall or whatever is a boondoggle and waste of time and money. In fact it would just shift the number of peopel who come legally then melt into the populace.

It's a tidy "solution" to an untidy problem.

The fence isn't necessarily what I consider border security...although I do like landmines as a cheap, economical solution for our border.

Making sure illegals have no where to go is the approach I would much prefer. Everify as a start, severe punishment for sanctuary cities and employers that hire illegals, information exchange between municipal, state and federal agencies including schools and hospitals, not being able to rent a home or apartment, absolutely no benefits, etc... would get many to self deport.

[SoonerPride]

I would like to think you were kidding about landmines.

But sadly I think you are serious.

And that is the end of any rational discussion with you. Adios.

[okie52]

You are right, I am serious about landmines. Of course, as a humanitarian gesture I would give them warnings before the minefields. After that it would be proceed at your own risk. How could you be more fair than that?

[Ton Loc]

You are right, I am serious about landmines. Of course, as a humanitarian gesture I would give them warnings before the minefields. After that it would be proceed at your own risk. How could you be more fair than that?

If only you had been born South of the imaginary line drawn in the sand...

BTW - no disputes that immigration is a problem. We're just not all cold hearted bastards about it.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Common sense does not compute.

Seriously though, what was the last big issue we ever reached a middle ground on? Even if there was a middle ground, you would never know because both neither party would be able to accept it. Neither side wants to be perceived as a "loser" on a deal.

Current day politics isn't about solving problems. It's about creating wedge issues.

[okie52]

If only you had been born South of the imaginary line drawn in the sand...

BTW - no disputes that immigration is a problem. We're just not all cold hearted bastards about it.

Nope, just a bunch of puzzies about our sovereignty and right to protect our border. If I had been born south of the border, I might have tried to get into the US illegally. Wouldn't have made it right. It isn't that I don't understand people south of the border trying to get into the US, it's that I would make sure they don't. And, if they have been warned that our border is mined or protected in some other efficient manner, whose fault is it if they still kill themselves trying to get into the US?

Somehow you have embraced the "we can't do this or that" mentality to protect our border. Really a limiting process that has created much of the problem we face now with illegals.

[SoonerTerry]

This whole thing makes me ****ing sick!!!

What the **** is the matter with some people! All this beating of the drum "get the aliens out" is bull****. Are you afraid they are going to get some of your pie? I've know a hell of alot of immigrants and 99 % of them only want to work and feed their families, maybe give them a better life. If you have a problem with that, then you have a bigger problem than I know how to deal with. And don't give me this bull**** about "Doin it the legal way". The whole damn reason most of them come here is because they are broke, cant afford a lawyer, and have no prayer of working through the "legal" way to immigrate.

Personaly I think people willing to pack up all their belongings and strike out for greener pastures are the kind of people that build great nations, and our country could use an infusion of people willing to work their asses off to build a better life and build a better country.

Hey I've got an idea, lets work out a trade with mexico where we send them 2 lazy bastard americans and mexico sends us one willing to work their *** off for a good life. Hell, I bet that would help both countries in the long run.

There are not many things that **** me off more than smug ****ing people that are willing to treat a hard working honest "undocumented aliens" like dog ****.

And 52 that thing with land mines... the next time you have a thought like that, just let it go.

and one more thing. **** you Alabama.

[okie52]

Another open borders guy. How about rest stops for the illegals on their trek north?

More is not better. We don't need more uneducated, low income, unskilled, overpopulating groups coming to this country. Immigration that pursues skilled, educated, culturally diverse groups should be the only approach utilized.

Check with Europe and see how they are doing with illegal immigration.

Boomer Sooner and Roll, Tide, Roll.

[Ton Loc]

Another open borders guy. How about rest stops for the illegals on their trek north?

More is not better. We don't need more uneducated, low income, unskilled, overpopulating groups coming to this country. Immigration that pursues skilled, educated, culturally diverse groups should be the only approach utilized.

Check with Europe and see how they are doing with illegal immigration.

Boomer Sooner and Roll, Tide, Roll.

Actually, when/if they leave we might need hardworking, uneducated,low income, unskilled workers. Unfortunatly, we'll have to make do with what we have - Lazy, ignorant, americans looking for a hand out, but not hard work.

I know you support my idea of trading our worthless for their hardworking.

BTW- F Europe. We're better than them.

[okie52]

Actually, when/if they leave we might need hardworking, uneducated,low income, unskilled workers. Unfortunatly, we'll have to make do with what we have - Lazy, ignorant, americans looking for a hand out, but not hard work.

I know you support my idea of trading our worthless for their hardworking.

BTW- F Europe. We're better than them.

No doubt most illegals are hard working. He11, they're making about 10 times the bucks working here than south of the border. Now maybe if there weren't all of the illegals here to take the labor jobs some unemployed Amercans might actually do those jobs. Of course it would be for higher pay which really wouldn't be bad now, would it?

If you can figure a way to get our lazy bums to trade places with hard workers, sure, I'd be for it.

BTW-yep, we are better than europe so there is no need to follow in their footsteps and make their same mistakes.

[pphilfran]

I betcha that most people that want open borders also decry the wages given to the US working poor....

One flies in the face of the other....

[LiveLaughLove]

I betcha that most people that want open borders also decry the wages given to the US working poor....

One flies in the face of the other....

Not when you understand their motives. They could give one rip about illegals or the poor.

What they care about are the voting slaves it creates. Vote for us or you won't get your treat. Good slave, er, I mean poor downtrodden.

When the liberal rich actually give their money away to the poor, and live on an average median income, then I will consider them to actually believe in helping the poor and not just in gaining political power for themselves.

Until then, not so much.

[SoonerPride]

Not when you understand their motives. They could give one rip about illegals or the poor.

What they care about are the voting slaves it creates. Vote for us or you won't get your treat. Good slave, er, I mean poor downtrodden.

When the liberal rich actually give their money away to the poor, and live on an average median income, then I will consider them to actually believe in helping the poor and not just in gaining political power for themselves.

Until then, not so much.

Jealous much?

[okie52]

Not when you understand their motives. They could give one rip about illegals or the poor.

What they care about are the voting slaves it creates. Vote for us or you won't get your treat. Good slave, er, I mean poor downtrodden.

When the liberal rich actually give their money away to the poor, and live on an average median income, then I will consider them to actually believe in helping the poor and not just in gaining political power for themselves.

Until then, not so much.

There is a lot of truth to that. Also, note the not so subtle attempt to blackmail the repubs (and the dems to some degree, too) into caving in on illegals. The "hispanics will remember" when it comes election time.

Of course, the nonsense with that philosophy is that the more you make citizens the more the vicious cycle continues except with an even larger minority to contend with.

[LiveLaughLove]

Jealous much?

That's an odd response.

If illegals are granted citizenship or the right to vote legally (most dont mind voting illegally, since you know, they dont follow our laws anyway), it will tip the balance to the Dems.

I'm sure you have no problem with that, but to think that my vote is cancelled out by illegals upsets me just slightly.

Also pointing out the liberal riches hypocrisy is not being jealous. I'm the one that likes people being rich and getting to keep it from the government. All rich people. I'm just saying the liberal rich should put their money where their mouths are voluntarily. They won't and never do.

Romney gave 15% to charity. Obama 1%, Biden $360ish. Real compassion for the poor those guys have.

[diverdog]

Economic impact of Bama's law:

http://news.yahoo.com/alabama-immigration-crackdown-costs-state-11-bln-study-155547677.html




.The cost-benefit analysis by University of Alabama economist Samuel Addy estimated up to 80,000 jobs were vacated by illegal immigrants fleeing the crackdown, costing Alabama's economy up to $10.8 billion.


The lost jobs also cost Alabama up to $264.5 million in lost state sales and income taxes, and as much as $93.1 million in lost city and county sales taxes, it found.

[LiveLaughLove]

Economic impact of Bama's law:

http://news.yahoo.com/alabama-immigration-crackdown-costs-state-11-bln-study-155547677.html

It is costing them billions!

The author of this study:

"Dr. Sam Addy joined the Center for Business and Economic Research (CBER) in 1998 and assumed the position of Director in 2007. In this role, he regularly speaks to groups and organizations on topics including the Alabama economy, economic policy, economic development, and workforce development. Dr. Addy works with CBER’s economic research program and has directed and conducted economic impact studies for numerous public and private clients across the state. Other areas of emphasis include assessment and analysis of Alabama’s workforce; fiscal policy; socioeconomic analysis for transportation and other development projects; and environmental and climate change issues. Sam has published in academic journals and is often quoted in local, regional, national, and international media.

Sam is a native of the West African country of Ghana, where he obtained a B.Sc. in Metallurgical Engineering from the University of Science and Technology. He holds an M.S. in Mineral Engineering from the University of Minnesota, and a Ph.D. in Mineral Economics from The Pennsylvania State University. Dr. Addy worked briefly with the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign’s program in arms control, disarmament, and international security (ACDIS) before joining The University of Alabama. He obtained his U.S. citizenship in 2007 and is married with three children."

Not saying the study is inaccurate, but one thing I've learned is, everyone has a bias. Especially journalists and academia. For now, I'll take that study with a healthy grain of salt.

Might be true, might be complete hogwash.

[Midtowner]

Meh.. you can get an economist to say anything.

--like trickle down works.

[diverdog]

The author of this study:

"Dr. Sam Addy joined the Center for Business and Economic Research (CBER) in 1998 and assumed the position of Director in 2007. In this role, he regularly speaks to groups and organizations on topics including the Alabama economy, economic policy, economic development, and workforce development. Dr. Addy works with CBER’s economic research program and has directed and conducted economic impact studies for numerous public and private clients across the state. Other areas of emphasis include assessment and analysis of Alabama’s workforce; fiscal policy; socioeconomic analysis for transportation and other development projects; and environmental and climate change issues. Sam has published in academic journals and is often quoted in local, regional, national, and international media.

Sam is a native of the West African country of Ghana, where he obtained a B.Sc. in Metallurgical Engineering from the University of Science and Technology. He holds an M.S. in Mineral Engineering from the University of Minnesota, and a Ph.D. in Mineral Economics from The Pennsylvania State University. Dr. Addy worked briefly with the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign’s program in arms control, disarmament, and international security (ACDIS) before joining The University of Alabama. He obtained his U.S. citizenship in 2007 and is married with three children."

Not saying the study is inaccurate, but one thing I've learned is, everyone has a bias. Especially journalists and academia. For now, I'll take that study with a healthy grain of salt.

Might be true, might be complete hogwash.

Why do you have a problem with the bolded area? The Pentagon relies heavily on arms control analysis for regional conflicts? Most likely he was looking at the ME and Africa.

As far as the study it is a preliminary study and he is pointing out that all cost need to be looked at in the aggregate.

[diverdog]

Meh.. you can get an economist to say anything.

--like trickle down works.

My economics teacher said economist are like prostitutes. Once you pay them they will do anything.

[okie52]

Economic impact of Bama's law:

http://news.yahoo.com/alabama-immigration-crackdown-costs-state-11-bln-study-155547677.html







.The cost-benefit analysis by University of Alabama economist Samuel Addy estimated up to 80,000 jobs were vacated by illegal immigrants fleeing the crackdown, costing Alabama's economy up to $10.8 billion.


The lost jobs also cost Alabama up to $264.5 million in lost state sales and income taxes, and as much as $93.1 million in lost city and county sales taxes, it found.

Sounds like Bama has 80,000 new job openings.


Roll, Tide, Roll.

[diverdog]

Sounds like Bama has 80,000 new job openings.


Roll, Tide, Roll.

As Sarah Palin would say: "makin lemonade out of lemons" . You are funny.

[SoonerPride]

As Sarah Palin would say: "makin lemonade out of lemons" . You are funny.

Now if we could just find someone to pick those lemons for us.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

If only the GOP would endorse Reagan's position of amnesty.

I thought he was their saint?

I was against that then and still against it now.

Why do you want so many law breakers in our country? Why do you want for the U.S. to give up their soveriegn right to manage who enters the country?

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Maybe a middle-of-the road option would be best. A quick, safe way for those here illegally to have a path to citizenship, coupled with Alabama-like reforms for those who choose to not go the legal route? Businesses need a cheap labor pool. So long as that labor pool consists of citizens or resident aliens, I really don't care where they came from or how they got here.

Uproot their asses I say! Why cater to law breakers when we have many people in the pipeline doing it the legal way. We don't need their labor, we need to enforce our laws and close the borders.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

BTW- F Europe. We're better than them.

Not when it comes to policing borders and letting illegal aliens in... We are about the same. I think they are trying harder to stop it, they are finding the social cost to much for their bankrupt governments and excessive social spending...

[sappstuf]

Now if we could just find someone to pick those lemons for us.

Pay them enough and you will. I thought you wanted people to have a "living wage". As phil, said, the cost of fruits and veggies would go up about 10%.

I am willing to pay it to make sure Americans and people who are here legally get the jobs.

I guess you would prefer continuing to have a lower class quasi-citizen in our country so you can get your food cheaper...

That is very unliberal like. Or maybe it isn't....

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Uproot their asses I say! Why cater to law breakers when we have many people in the pipeline doing it the legal way. We don't need their labor, we need to enforce our laws and close the borders.


Unfortunately our bureaucrats aren't good at replacing obsolete pipelines.

http://www.peopledemocracy.com/images/politburo.jpg

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Unfortunately our bureaucrats aren't good at replacing obsolete pipelines.

http://www.peopledemocracy.com/images/politburo.jpg

Funny, you showed a pic of the politburo...I remember a story from a Russian project I was working on. The person I was talking to was relaying a story that in a meeting with the Russians, they were apparently (according to the story) pre-billing the project for all the oil we were going to leak onto the ground. The company challenged that and the reply was shock that someone could build a pipeline that didn't leak. Apparently, the Russians previously weren't too good at flanging up and working to tolerances that didn't cause contents to spill onto the ground...

Now that analogy is not far off the mark. They have the tools to flange up the immigration pipeline, they just can't enforce the rules they have to make it happen...

[Ton Loc]

Pay them enough and you will. I thought you wanted people to have a "living wage". As phil, said, the cost of fruits and veggies would go up about 10%.

I am willing to pay it to make sure Americans and people who are here legally get the jobs.

I guess you would prefer continuing to have a lower class quasi-citizen in our country so you can get your food cheaper...

That is very unliberal like. Or maybe it isn't....

How much are you planning on paying these people where the cost would only go up 10%? Something tells me not enough to get the poor people off their *** or an amount that would cause more than a 10% price increase.

Who eats fruits and veggies anyway? We're supposedly all a bunch of fat asses.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

The price of getting my lawn mowed in Louisiana has gone down. Thanks Alabama!

[diverdog]

Uproot their asses I say! Why cater to law breakers when we have many people in the pipeline doing it the legal way. We don't need their labor, we need to enforce our laws and close the borders.


We don't need their labor? Are you serious? What do you think would happen if every illegal walked off the job tomorrow?

[pphilfran]

We don't need their labor? Are you serious? What do you think would happen if every illegal walked off the job tomorrow?

I find it comforting that our economy is critically linked to illegal immigrants...

[okie52]

We don't need their labor? Are you serious? What do you think would happen if every illegal walked off the job tomorrow?

A drop in unemployment? A rise in the cost of produce? Guam would tip over?

[Mississippi Sooner]

A drop in unemployment? A rise in the cost of produce? Guam would tip over?

The rent is too damn high!

[TheHumanAlphabet]

We don't need their labor? Are you serious? What do you think would happen if every illegal walked off the job tomorrow?

Unemployment would go down and people would get back to working...

[Ton Loc]

Unemployment would go down and people would get back to working...

Finally - all those accountants, doctors, and engineers would be able to get their jobs back...

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Finally - all those accountants, doctors, and engineers would be able to get their jobs back...

Dont know any of those that are unemployed, however those people on the dole could take those illegals jobs and start being productive again...but thats not what the libs, dems or obammy wants...

[Ton Loc]

Dont know any of those that are unemployed, however those people on the dole could take those illegals jobs and start being productive again...but thats not what the libs, dems or obammy wants...

You're counting on the people on the government dole to take the crap jobs the illegals do?

Good plan.

[sappstuf]

A drop in unemployment? A rise in the cost of produce? Guam would tip over?

Dear god the horror. Just another reason we need to trim the military...

[diverdog]

Dont know any of those that are unemployed, however those people on the dole could take those illegals jobs and start being productive again...but thats not what the libs, dems or obammy wants...

Here is what would happen:

Most major hotels would shut down, most restaurants would shut down in the major cities, farm produce to market would shut down, construction and landscaping would take a huge hit, chicken production would shut down, slaughterhouses would shut down, most of your crap jobs in places like hospitals would go vacant and the list goes on. Our economy would grind to a stand still if all 11 million illegals suddenly headed home because no American is going to do the back breaking labor that is performed by illegal immigrants.

[okie52]

Here is what would happen:

Most major hotels would shut down, most restaurants would shut down in the major cities, farm produce to market would shut down, construction and landscaping would take a huge hit, chicken production would shut down, slaughterhouses would shut down, most of your crap jobs in places like hospitals would go vacant and the list goes on. Our economy would grind to a stand still if all 11 million illegals suddenly headed home because no American is going to do the back breaking labor that is performed by illegal immigrants.

Well lets reduce that number a little bit. Over half of those illegals will be children and are currently burdening our school and heathcare systems. In fact, the way the illegals reproduce it's probably more like 60%. So now we are down to 4.4 million if they are all employed. And we would have 4.4 million jobs open up in a nation that has high unemployment. Wages would rise dramatically in those industries to meet the shortfall. School systems and hospitals have an economic windfall from the withdrawal of millions of freeloaders.

I'm salivating at the prospect.