Anyone know why we struggle on short yardage and red zone scoring?

[OU_Sooners75]

This is not a thread to bitch about coaches or players. Nor is it a thread to be a downer. But just a thread trying to debate what has happened to our offense in short yardage and goal line.

That said, 6 of the last 7 TDs have gone to Blake Bell. The other to Millard.

Now, I like seeing Bell out there punishing people. But when we have to bring out a different QB and personnel, that shows something is wrong with our offense.


Anyone know what it is when we have a short field? Do we not have the pass plays to get the ball to the TEs? Do we not have the push with 7-8 guys as opposed to 9 guys blocking?

It is just frustrating to witness.

Glad we won and glad the defense played great! The offense today did what was needed.

Here's hoping for #8 (Big 12 championship)!

[picasso]

I'm gonna guess the other team is tackling us.

[OU_Sooners75]

I'm gonna guess the other team is tackling us.

Good guess, but incorrect.

I guess if I were to reword my question....

Why can't we get a push by our OL? If every DL just so much better than our blockers and OL?

[oumartin]

line only knows how to pass block. Aren't physical enough to run block.

[Sooner70]

I'm not a FB technician, but when the field gets shortened like that, seems like the offensive team loses some of it's advantage. Recivers have no room to work. With OU's Whaley & Broyles out, OU gets further disadvantaged down there. In comes an innovative approach with Bell. Seems like our OL +additional backs can just give him a bit of daylight, he makes the best of it. Also, no exchanges & less chance for turnover.

[OU_Sooners75]

line only knows how to pass block. Aren't physical enough to run block.

We ran for over 260 yards today. You can't say they are not physical enough.

[OU_Sooners75]

I'm not a FB technician, but when the field gets shortened like that, seems like the offensive team loses some of it's advantage. Recivers have no room to work. With OU's Whaley & Broyles out, OU gets further disadvantaged down there. In comes an innovative approach with Bell. Seems like our OL +additional backs can just give him a bit of daylight, he makes the best of it. Also, no exchanges & less chance for turnover.

Even with Broyles and Whaley healthy we struggled in short yardage and red zone.

Why don't we utilize our TEs and FBs more?

[picasso]

I'm a naked bootleg kinda guy in the red zone myself. I'd sincerely like to see Millard get more carries. Anywhere.

[rock on sooner]

Agree about Millard. Belldozer is becoming predictable...hard to stop but predictable. Today the announcer made a good
point when we misfired on one by Bell cutting back away from the blocking...needs to be lots more successful wrinkles or
better execution with the base plays.......

[Soonerus]

I am bored with Belldozer...

[OU_Sooners75]

I am bored with Belldozer...

Me too.

It isn't bad...but when that is all you do when you get down there...then it tells the regular offense you suck!

[Soonerus]

This team suffers in multiple areas...

[oumartin]

We ran for over 260 yards today. You can't say they are not physical enough.

did you watch the game? 100 yards game on reverses on two carries by Franks.

We averaged 4 yards per rush other than that.


OU ran the ball 45 times. when was the last time that happened?


When you get inside the red zone and you can't push people off the LOS that means you aren't physical enough.

Also, running the ball outta the shotgun=fail

[Soonerus]

This team is desperate to go to the Belldozer so often...

[Sooner5030]

our O philosophy is about creating space and taking advantage of that space.

The opposing D is trying to take away space.

The end zone (just like our conservative calls at times) reduces the space available to work with.

pretty simple really

[oumartin]

our O philosophy is about creating space and taking advantage of that space.

The opposing D is trying to take away space.

The end zone (just like our conservative calls at times) reduces the space available to work with.

pretty simple really


If it's that simple then it seems pretty stupid to go with a philosophy that becomes non advantageous for 40 yards of the field.

[rekamrettuB]

Me too.

It isn't bad...but when that is all you do when you get down there...then it tells the regular offense you suck!

And if the redzone statistics didn't hammer this point home, then putting in the Bell did.

And for those of you getting bored with it...I don't get bored of moving the chains and scoring. I got bored with telling players to fall down at the 21 so we had a decent chance of seeing a TD.

[OU_Sooners75]

did you watch the game? 100 yards game on reverses on two carries by Franks.

We averaged 4 yards per rush other than that.


OU ran the ball 45 times. when was the last time that happened?


When you get inside the red zone and you can't push people off the LOS that means you aren't physical enough.

Also, running the ball outta the shotgun=fail

Ill take a 4 yard average any day! 4+4+4=12

I guess you discredit AD's 249 yards against OSU back in 2004 when he had 2 rushes for 136 yards?

[OU_Sooners75]

And if the redzone statistics didn't hammer this point home, then putting in the Bell did.

And for those of you getting bored with it...I don't get bored of moving the chains and scoring. I got bored with telling players to fall down at the 21 so we had a decent chance of seeing a TD.

Im talking about short yardage too.

[PLaw]

No data to support, but I believe teams that go with the QB under center and not in the gun may tend to be a little more successful inside the 10 yard line.

I absolutely hate trying to run the rock out of the gun inside the red zone. I would much more prefer the "I-formation". I think it affords the offense the most options. You can go power with two or three TE's, you can run option, play action, mis-direction or just plain old fashioned power "I" dive.

Spread O's get more limited as the field gets shortened.

BOOMER

[oumartin]

NO, I am not discrediting the runs. I was pointing out a 4 yard average besides those two runs.

there is nothing wrong with a 4 yard average.

but imagine that average if we had guys moving people off the LOS inside the red zone which we dont.!

You asked about the struggles and now you wanna argue.

Kinda stupid isn't it

[OU_Sooners75]

NO, I am not discrediting the runs. I was pointing out a 4 yard average besides those two runs.

there is nothing wrong with a 4 yard average.

but imagine that average if we had guys moving people off the LOS inside the red zone which we dont.!

You asked about the struggles and now you wanna argue.

Kinda stupid isn't it

Exactly....I asked about the red zone and short yardage and you go on some stupid spill about 2 reverses that went for 80 yards....and about how the rest of our rushing averaged 4 yards a carry.

I know things are difficult Martin...but don't go full retard.

[Soonerus]

If you repeatedly cannot score in short yardage situations, you have a line problem...

[oumartin]

If you repeatedly cannot score in short yardage situations, you have a line problem...

the supermarket deli cutter is having trouble grasping that.

[8timechamps]

Exactly....I asked about the red zone and short yardage and you go on some stupid spill about 2 reverses that went for 80 yards....and about how the rest of our rushing averaged 4 yards a carry.

I know things are difficult Martin...but don't go full retard.

http://1.static.buzzine.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/780x441/RobertDowneyJr_081708_784.jpg

[OU_Sooners75]

the supermarket deli cutter is having trouble grasping that.

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2011/10/full_retard.jpg

[BoulderSooner79]

I agree it seems odd we don't use the TE more in the redzone considering how deadly that was with Gresham. The other play we don't seem to have that other teams do is the fade pass. OSU lives on that one to Blackmon. I feel if we were better at those 2 things, the threat would help us run better in close too. When we bring in Bell, it shows we sure can be physical, albeit with an extra blocker.

[OU_Sooners75]

I agree it seems odd we don't use the TE more in the redzone considering how deadly that was with Gresham. The other play we don't seem to have that other teams do is the fade pass. OSU lives on that one to Blackmon. I feel if we were better at those 2 things, the threat would help us run better in close too. When we bring in Bell, it shows we sure can be physical, albeit with an extra blocker.

For the last 3 or 4 years our offense was to run run run inside the 10...why? our coaches seem to have no trust in our passing game inside the 10.

[jkjsooner]

This team is desperate to go to the Belldozer so often...

Was Florida desperate to go with Tebow so much in the redzone in 2006? If so then desperation breeds national titles and I want more of it...

[Soonerus]

Was Florida desperate to go with Tebow so much in the redzone in 2006? If so then desperation breeds national titles and I want more of it...

I don't think Florida used the formation so often..but I am ok with more MNC's...

[oumartin]

.but I am ok with more MNC's...


LSU says HI!

[tulsaoilerfan]

I don't understand why we don't keep the field spread out instead of bunching everyone in tight; i also hate running out of the shotgun but we seem to do that all the time inside the 10 also; it seems to me that bunching everyone in tight like that would make it harder to block everyone but then again what do i know.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I think it all just boils down to execution..Just today there was bad passes, drops, INT, craptastic blocking, all on different short yardage/red zone plays....Between the 20s, a play can be successfully executed with 8/11 guys handling their jobs, but not in redzone and short yardage when the defense knows you are just trying to get a 1st down...

[Tulsa_Fireman]

I think it all just boils down to execution..Just today there was bad passes, drops, INT, craptastic blocking, all on different short yardage/red zone plays....Between the 20s, a play can be successfully executed with 8/11 guys handling their jobs, but not in redzone and short yardage when the defense knows you are just trying to get a 1st down...

This, this, this.

Those boys couldn't catch the clap in a vietcong whorehouse today.

[Salt City Sooner]

Our BACKS averaged right at 6 yards a pop (31 for 184). It was pretty consistent production too, as, unless I mis-counted, OU only had 6 runs of 10+ yards, with the longest being Finch's 20 yarder. Tell me that we get that kind of production the rest of the year & I'll take my chances. I also would remind some here that that muffed punt came off our rushing total to the tune of 35 yards so, when we actually ran the ball on offense, the guys had almost 3 bills on the ground.

[hawaii 5-0]

I have no problem with Blake Bell coming in on short yardage plays as long as he's effective. That Interception stunk.

I don't want to see Landry get hurt on some QB sneak.

Usually on those Belldozer plays Bell takes the snap and waits for the blocking to develop. That gives the Defense time to adjust. I'd like to see him take the snap and plow right ahead over our best linemen or the most opportune hole in the line. I've yet to see this.


In the jumbo package are there any WRs still in the game or do they get pulled? I'd like to see an option where Reynolds or Stills is out wide with single coverage. Bell can fake a handoff, or roll out and either keep it or throw a jump ball to the one-on-one WR.

5-0

[EatLeadCommie]

the simple answer is Coach Patton

[cleller]

When you've got first and goal on the 1 against Iowa State at home, and kick a field goal, it should be obvious that there is a problem.

We got a problem and the answer is Ripkowski. We need more Ripkowski.

[soonercoop1]

Patton and the O-line....

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I find the best way to explain this is with pictures. These are from FSU, I'm pulling over the ISU game, so I can illustrate it later. The key thing is that ISU had a really really good linebacker (the best on the field by a large margin). You had to use his lack of footspeed against him (which was why we were gashing them outside).

Okay, Play 1 Redzone...

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay1-1.png

Slot Near Side, we outnumbered 9-7 in the box (Landry and Running Back removed). We try to even this up by leaving one lineman unblocked for Whaley as well as the deep safety.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay1-2.png

Play begins, their nose tackle is "pancaked" but clogs up the middle. Its one of the things our DTs struggle with, if you are getting beat, make a pile.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay1-3.png

Millard misses his block forcing Whaley to make 2 DL miss before he gets to the LOS. Things look bleak at this point.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay1-4.png

Whaley manages somehow to maneuver to a spot that gives him enough space to split the 2 defenders. If we'd managed to get some space on the DT, he probably would have managed to make this work. However, special note to the arrows denoting our receivers. They are just jogging and basically taking the play off. If Whaley somehow would have been able to split he would have been tackled by these guys because of the poor effort out there. It will come back to bite us next play and in about 50 more plays that I've rewound this season. The effort put forth blocking by our wideouts not named Jaz Reynolds has been pretty mediocre.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay1-5.png

Whaley cuts again going for the home run ball. Its a pretty good decision as that DT is starting to recover and there isn't much there. Unfortunately that FSU DE is pretty agile and manages to correct his angle and get a good hit on him.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay1-6.png

He falls through the crease for a 1 yard gain. Had he just tried to split he probably would have gotten 2-3 on this carry but not much more, by doing that extra cut he was trying to get the TD. The FSU DE was just too good this time. However, as you'll see this was just a setup play for play 2.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-1.png

Next play, FSU is in the same D, because we look like we are in the same set. We aren't however, as we have an overload to the wide side of the field (only 2 blockers to the right of the center with one of them an eligible receiver. FSU has aligned themselves so that we are actually 1 on 1 with blockers at the point of attack.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-2.png

The extra blockers are telling as we get a nice bowl. Please note that this play is coming at the WRs but they are loafing again.
http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-3.png

Great lane if Broyles occuplies that guy this is an easy TD with someone as talented as Whaley.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-4.png

So we saw this type of cut a lot last year with Demarco. Finch would just bolt towards the hole and try to use his speed to bust it (which with this hole might have worked). Whaley uses his pathing to make people block themselves. He goes towards the LOS forcing the linebackers to sit still and allow his blockers extra seconds to establish themselves so that he can then make a bolt towards the hole.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-5.png

So if Broyles actually tried to stand up block, this is an easy TD. Whaley would dive inside to occupy the safety and then dart over Broyles block for the angle at the end zone. Something we saw in screenshots from Demarco last year. Unfortunately Broyles just goes for the cut block. Pretty much every time you see an OU blocker go for the cut block, he's being lazy. A running back can't read a cut block nor can they use their blocker to position the defender into taking an unfavorable tackling angle. They just have to hope and pray you take the guy to the ground out of reach.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-6.png

And Broyles whiffs giving Whaley no choice but to try to power the ball in against 3 guys.

http://pics.ouportal.com/FSURedZoneOffensePlay2-7.png

And an easy TD is stopped at the 2.

3rd down (not shown) FSU overloads us and gets us in the backfield (2 missed blocks). As you can see, this is effort and execution, not talent. Goal Line is about getting it right every single time. What the bell formation does is it gives us one more blocker and less chance of a man free.

[PLaw]

I find the best way to explain this is with pictures. These are from FSU, I'm pulling over the ISU game, so I can illustrate it later. The key thing is that ISU had a really really good linebacker (the best on the field by a large margin). You had to use his lack of footspeed against him (which was why we were gashing them outside).

Great post, need more of this ^^^

BOOMER