PDA

View Full Version : How about better parents?



diverdog
11/20/2011, 09:52 AM
Good article:


How About Better Parents?By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN (http://topics.nytimes.com/top/opinion/editorialsandoped/oped/columnists/thomaslfriedman/index.html?inline=nyt-per)IN recent years, we’ve been treated to reams of op-ed articles about how we need better teachers in our public schools and, if only the teachers’ unions would go away, our kids would score like Singapore’s on the big international tests. There’s no question that a great teacher can make a huge difference in a student’s achievement, and we need to recruit, train and reward more such teachers. But here’s what some new studies are also showing: We need better parents. Parents more focused on their children’s education can also make a huge difference in a student’s achievement.
How do we know? Every three years, the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, or O.E.C.D., conducts exams as part of the Program for International Student Assessment, or PISA, which tests 15-year-olds in the world’s leading industrialized nations on their reading comprehension and ability to use what they’ve learned in math and science to solve real problems — the most important skills for succeeding in college and life. America’s 15-year-olds have not been distinguishing themselves in the PISA exams compared with students in Singapore, Finland and Shanghai.
To better understand why some students thrive taking the PISA tests and others do not, Andreas Schleicher, who oversees the exams for the O.E.C.D., was encouraged by the O.E.C.D. countries to look beyond the classrooms. So starting with four countries in 2006, and then adding 14 more in 2009, the PISA team went to the parents of 5,000 students and interviewed them “about how they raised their kids and then compared that with the test results” for each of those years, Schleicher explained to me. Two weeks ago, the PISA teampublished the three main findings (http://www.pisa.oecd.org/dataoecd/4/1/49012097.pdf) of its study:
“Fifteen-year-old students whose parents often read books with them during their first year of primary school show markedly higher scores in PISA 2009 than students whose parents read with them infrequently or not at all. The performance advantage among students whose parents read to them in their early school years is evident regardless of the family’s socioeconomic background. Parents’ engagement with their 15-year-olds is strongly associated with better performance in PISA.”
Schleicher explained to me that “just asking your child how was their school day and showing genuine interest in the learning that they are doing can have the same impact as hours of private tutoring. It is something every parent can do, no matter what their education level or social background.”
For instance, the PISA study revealed that “students whose parents reported that they had read a book with their child ‘every day or almost every day’ or ‘once or twice a week’ during the first year of primary school have markedly higher scores in PISA 2009 than students whose parents reported that they had read a book with their child ‘never or almost never’ or only ‘once or twice a month.’ On average, the score difference is 25 points, the equivalent of well over half a school year.”
Yes, students from more well-to-do households are more likely to have more involved parents. “However,” the PISA team found, “even when comparing students of similar socioeconomic backgrounds, those students whose parents regularly read books to them when they were in the first year of primary school score 14 points higher, on average, than students whose parents did not.”
The kind of parental involvement matters, as well. “For example,” the PISA study noted, “on average, the score point difference in reading that is associated with parental involvement is largest when parents read a book with their child, when they talk about things they have done during the day, and when they tell stories to their children.” The score point difference is smallest when parental involvement takes the form of simply playing with their children.
These PISA findings were echoed in a recent study by the National School Boards Association’s Center for Public Education, and written up by the center’s director, Patte Barth, in the latest issue (http://www.asbj.com/MainMenuCategory/Archive/2011/November/Most-Effective-Parental-Involvement.html) of The American School Board Journal.
The study (http://www.centerforpubliceducation.org/Main-Menu/Public-education/Parent-Involvement), called “Back to School: How parent involvement affects student achievement,” found something “somewhat surprising,” wrote Barth: “Parent involvement can take many forms, but only a few of them relate to higher student performance. Of those that work, parental actions that support children’s learning at home are most likely to have an impact on academic achievement at school.
“Monitoring homework; making sure children get to school; rewarding their efforts and talking up the idea of going to college. These parent actions are linked to better attendance, grades, test scores, and preparation for college,” Barth wrote. “The study found that getting parents involved with their children’s learning at home is a more powerful driver of achievement than parents attending P.T.A. and school board meetings, volunteering in classrooms, participating in fund-raising, and showing up at back-to-school nights.”
To be sure, there is no substitute for a good teacher. There is nothing more valuable than great classroom instruction. But let’s stop putting the whole burden on teachers. We also need better parents. Better parents can make every teacher more effective.

Caboose
11/20/2011, 01:07 PM
Good article:

Whether or not parents need to do better does not somehow change the fact that public worker unions are the scourge of society.

REDREX
11/20/2011, 01:48 PM
Maybe we need a Parents Union ?----No that would make things worse

Midtowner
11/20/2011, 04:06 PM
It only makes sense to focus policy on the aspects of education we have control over. Unless we're going to start revoking parental rights over poor grades, we can't fix the parents, but we can have an effect on teacher and administrator quality.

REDREX
11/20/2011, 04:12 PM
It only makes sense to focus policy on the aspects of education we have control over. Unless we're going to start revoking parental rights over poor grades, we can't fix the parents, but we can have an effect on teacher and administrator quality.---And that should be a local not a Federal issue

cleller
11/20/2011, 05:03 PM
It only makes sense to focus policy on the aspects of education we have control over. Unless we're going to start revoking parental rights over poor grades, we can't fix the parents, but we can have an effect on teacher and administrator quality.

It the government did not throw out such a wide and deep safety net, some of the "parents" might rethink their rates of reproduction.
That is, if they actually had to feed, clothe, and house their children they might choose to raise fewer, under more responsible circumstances.

diverdog
11/20/2011, 05:17 PM
It only makes sense to focus policy on the aspects of education we have control over. Unless we're going to start revoking parental rights over poor grades, we can't fix the parents, but we can have an effect on teacher and administrator quality.

What really needs to happen is to get administrators who have enough balls to stand up to bad parents and their brats.

My wife failed a kid one time and she got called on the mat by the principal. She called the kids parents, talked to them at least 3 times, warned them that the kid was failing every test, sleeping in class, not handing in work and what did the spineless weasel of a principal do.....yep caved to the parents and forced her to give the kid a c-.

Public schools need to have all the tools that are available to private schools including chunking out kids who are not doing work.

C&CDean
11/20/2011, 05:27 PM
What really needs to happen is to get administrators who have enough balls to stand up to bad parents and their brats.

My wife failed a kid one time and she got called on the mat by the principal. She called the kids parents, talked to them at least 3 times, warned them that the kid was failing every test, sleeping in class, not handing in work and what did the spineless weasel of a principal do.....yep caved to the parents and forced her to give the kid a c-.

Public schools need to have all the tools that are available to private schools including chunking out kids who are not doing work.

+1

soonercoop1
11/20/2011, 06:48 PM
What really needs to happen is to get administrators who have enough balls to stand up to bad parents and their brats.

My wife failed a kid one time and she got called on the mat by the principal. She called the kids parents, talked to them at least 3 times, warned them that the kid was failing every test, sleeping in class, not handing in work and what did the spineless weasel of a principal do.....yep caved to the parents and forced her to give the kid a c-.

Public schools need to have all the tools that are available to private schools including chunking out kids who are not doing work.


and maybe less administrators, a benign union, and a program to reward good teachers and the ability to fire bad ones...parental "responsibility" is key...

C&CDean
11/20/2011, 06:49 PM
and maybe less administrators, a benign union, and a program to reward good teachers and the ability to fire bad ones...parental "responsibility" is key...

+1

NormanPride
11/20/2011, 08:33 PM
+1

+1

SCOUT
11/20/2011, 10:03 PM
I was told that there would be no math...

diverdog
11/20/2011, 11:55 PM
and maybe less administrators, a benign union, and a program to reward good teachers and the ability to fire bad ones...parental "responsibility" is key...

coop it is way more than just unions. We expect our public schools to be all things to all people. There is mom down the street who is constantly in the faces of the administrators because her kid "can't cope" and has "issues" and she is demanding free special tudors, a teacher that caters specifically to her son in a classroom of 25 kids. If she does not get her way then she sues. Something is very wrong in an environment like that where schools live in constant fear of being sued.

SCOUT
11/21/2011, 12:05 AM
Society has decided to accommodate the lowest common denominator. This is true for the school system, the tax system and the entertainment industry. There is nothing more destructive than this trend, IMO.

cleller
11/21/2011, 07:41 AM
Society has decided to accommodate the lowest common denominator. This is true for the school system, the tax system and the entertainment industry. There is nothing more destructive than this trend, IMO.

Boy, isn't that evident? Its the Idiocracy Effect.

Mississippi Sooner
11/21/2011, 08:43 AM
Boy, isn't that evident? Its the Idiocracy Effect.

You like money? I like money, too! We should hang out.

C&CDean
11/21/2011, 09:11 AM
Boy, isn't that evident? Its the Idiocracy Effect.

One needs to look no further than the football board for living proof.

kbsooner21
11/21/2011, 10:02 AM
One needs to look no further than the football board for living proof.

+1

pphilfran
11/21/2011, 12:39 PM
One needs to look no further than the football board for living proof.:biggrin:

yermom
11/21/2011, 12:46 PM
when was it decided that kids can't fail anymore?

Ton Loc
11/21/2011, 02:17 PM
when was it decided that kids can't fail anymore?

If it makes you feel better, there are 5 kids that are in my daughters 1st Grade class that were held back. Awesome!

Better Parents +1 - Fine them, take away their "benefits", make the parents come to school with the kid for a week, or whatever creative thing you want to do. I know it is extreme, but I'm to the point where I would support a test that you have to pass before you're allowed to have a kid. There's nothing more dangerous than a kid with crappy parents.

pphilfran
11/21/2011, 02:20 PM
If it makes you feel better, there are 5 kids that are in my daughters 1st Grade class that were held back. Awesome!

Better Parents +1 - Fine them, take away their "benefits", make the parents come to school with the kid for a week, or whatever creative thing you want to do. I know it is extreme, but I'm to the point where I would support a test that you have to pass before you're allowed to have a kid. There's nothing more dangerous than a kid with crappy parents.

You can't require a test...but I would go for making it painful on the parents by using some of your suggestions....

soonerbrat
11/21/2011, 02:22 PM
can i have the readers' digest version?

Ton Loc
11/21/2011, 02:31 PM
You can't require a test...but I would go for making it painful on the parents by using some of your suggestions....

I know I can't have tests. At least, not until the minority report future.

oudavid1
11/22/2011, 12:17 PM
What really needs to happen is to get administrators who have enough balls to stand up to bad parents and their brats.

My wife failed a kid one time and she got called on the mat by the principal. She called the kids parents, talked to them at least 3 times, warned them that the kid was failing every test, sleeping in class, not handing in work and what did the spineless weasel of a principal do.....yep caved to the parents and forced her to give the kid a c-.

Public schools need to have all the tools that are available to private schools including chunking out kids who are not doing work.

Give up because the student gives up?

Maybe education isnt for you.

C&CDean
11/22/2011, 05:41 PM
Give up because the student gives up?

Maybe education isnt for you.

No david. Chunk them right back to their POS parents and let them educate them. It's not the school's or teacher's responsibility to prepare a child to come to school. It's not their responsibility to insure their homework is done and assignments are turned in. If the kids lays down, and the parents don't care? **** em'. In the A.

pphilfran
11/22/2011, 05:46 PM
No david. Chunk them right back to their POS parents and let them educate them. It's not the school's or teacher's responsibility to prepare a child to come to school. It's not their responsibility to insure their homework is done and assignments are turned in. If the kids lays down, and the parents don't care? **** em'. In the A.

This is where we need a stronger Vo Tech system...I know it won't help every kid but I am sure there are many that have no desire to be in a classroom setting and would rather be getting a hands on skill...

Tulsa_Fireman
11/22/2011, 06:14 PM
This is where we need a stronger Vo Tech system...I know it won't help every kid but I am sure there are many that have no desire to be in a classroom setting and would rather be getting a hands on skill...

There used to be a time where these kids would end up as brick laborers, framers hands, roofers, and landscapers.

C&CDean
11/22/2011, 06:15 PM
This is where we need a stronger Vo Tech system...I know it won't help every kid but I am sure there are many that have no desire to be in a classroom setting and would rather be getting a hands on skill...

Votech is big down here, but if the kids are still just hanging out smoking dope outside the welding class what good does it do?

pphilfran
11/22/2011, 06:17 PM
Votech is big down here, but if the kids are still just hanging out smoking dope outside the welding class what good does it do?

It won't help every kid...but there are some that would take to skill training much more easily than the 3 R's....a lot of countries have successful programs...

Ton Loc
11/22/2011, 06:30 PM
New York had kids coming straight out of High School getting jobs for boeing back in the 80's. The Vo-Tech is full in my district, but there is still a negative stigma attached to it.

diverdog
11/22/2011, 06:51 PM
It won't help every kid...but there are some that would take to skill training much more easily than the 3 R's....a lot of countries have successful programs...

We should model after Germany where they have a great apprentice program. At the end they have highly skilled workers. You can demand high wages when you can drill a hole through a Swiss watch spring and it is still in one piece. Just saying.

soonercruiser
11/22/2011, 09:24 PM
There used to be a time where these kids would end up as brick laborers, framers hands, roofers, and landscapers.

This is what we need to go back to.
More lower performing students need to find a trade the can do and make a living at.
(Not just dreaming about the NBA or NFL either!) :fatigue:

The value of a college education is highly overrated!

cleller
11/23/2011, 09:00 AM
Hunger and cold used to be motivators to get people to work, until the government started regulating hunger and cold for everyone.

oudavid1
11/24/2011, 01:32 AM
No david. Chunk them right back to their POS parents and let them educate them. It's not the school's or teacher's responsibility to prepare a child to come to school. It's not their responsibility to insure their homework is done and assignments are turned in. If the kids lays down, and the parents don't care? **** em'. In the A.

I feel like this issue is impossible to solve. Why I felt at the age of 19 I could do it.....good question.

bigfatjerk
11/24/2011, 07:58 AM
Why can't people screw up and learn from these screw ups? I don't get this view that the individual is too stupid to fix their own problems. There's a lot of things we do that screw over our youth. But I actually don't think parenting is that big a problem. Our education system is a complete joke, and ends up promoting the bad things it should be against.