Who's our best LB?

[NormanPride]

In our D, LB play is about as key as it gets. Over the years we have gotten consistent play out of every other position, but LB is very hot and cold. So here's the question: Who is our best LB right now? I'm not talking about for next year or whatever. Right now, who do you put on the field first?

I say Bird.

[OUNASH]

Corey Nelson hands down.

[NormanPride]

I haven't watched him as much as I should, but he's looked good as well. Needs to work on consistency when tackling, but he's a positive.

[primetime43]

I know this...it aint Travis Lewis. I get annoyed with all the trash talking he does. There was a reason he came back for his senior year.

[delhalew]

Travis single handedly gave up a TD against ATM.

[cleller]

Couldn't pick. Not a Torrance Marshall, etc in the bunch. Bird sure looks the part, but hasn't had enough time on the field to prove anything. Hopefully, he'll be one of those backups that surprises when he gets his turn.

[Pricetag]

I know this...it aint Travis Lewis. I get annoyed with all the trash talking he does. There was a reason he came back for his senior year.

I loved it when he was up yapping at the A&M guy yesterday after he had just been juked out of his shorts and had given up the first down.

[SoonerinKC]

I don't know who the best one is, but I have been pleasantly surprised with Bird. Travis has issues with coverage across the middle.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Probably Tony Jefferson

[lasooner123]

tony jefferson?

[landrun]

Travis single handedly gave up a TD against ATM.

Yep! Not too long after he gave us one of those shark signals on top of his helmet too.

I couldn't believe it. ... not that he gave up the TD... but that he did the shark thing.

I was wondering the other day, I think the reason he leads us in tackling each year (and broke Boz's record) is because he is tackling all those backs and tight ends who are catching all those passes in his zone each game. :nightmare:

[NormanPride]

Travis single handedly gave up a TD against ATM.

Two, actually. They had a TD run late in the game where their RB ran at Travis' lane, and he was too busy letting the pulling guard come five yards out of the hole to chickenfight with him to actually make any kind of move at the ball carrier. If he had attacked the lane like I'm assuming was his responsibility, the runner would have been forced to go outside, where we had unblocked defenders.

When jkm talks about the "little things" that Lewis doesn't do, this is a perfect example of one. Instead of hitting the lane and not making a tackle, he dogs the play and leaves a wide open lane for a TD.

I'm not saying he's always bad. He wouldn't be starting if he was. He's just so dang inconsistent and he's got so much potential that I get frustrated that he's not going 100% on every play.

Also, I don't consider Jefferson as a LB, but if I did he would be the best.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Brent Venables does so suck it!

[meoveryouxinfinity]

Travis cannot tackle a guy one on one. Go count how many times he's whiffed on a tackle or been dragged by a ball-carrier. It's embarrassing.

[kbsooner21]

Tom Wort

[Landthief 1972]

Lewis is a leader on the field, and reads the field before the snap really well, but Wort plays smarter after the snap, and tackles better. From watching Bird for a few games, you can tell that kid just plays with complete, unbridled enthusiasm for the game. He looks like he's completely psyched to be playing for OU, and he plays pretty smart for a young kid learning the system.

[Neath a Western Sky]

Lewis is a leader on the field, and reads the field before the snap really well, but Wort plays smarter after the snap, and tackles better. From watching Bird for a few games, you can tell that kid just plays with complete, unbridled enthusiasm for the game. He looks like he's completely psyched to be playing for OU, and he plays pretty smart for a young kid learning the system.

This poster's words echo my thoughts. Byrd has made a pile of tackles each time he's had significant PT, including Texas, Kansas, and A & M, and when he gets hold of a runner, he doesn't get shucked. Against A & M, he reminded me of Box, only stronger. He has that knack of finding the seam to the ball carrier. We were concerned a few weeks ago about his wheels, and some of us suggested his "half-step slows" would evaporate with some experience. His performance against the Aggies evidenced that to me. He stayed with a receiver on a crossing route and broke up the pass. Later, he spotted a receiver out in the flat that Tannehill hit on a crucial 3rd and 2 in the 4th quarter and nailed him for no gain. I'd like to see Byrd at MLB, Wort at WLB, and Nelson in there too in various capacities as they have done in some games. That's the future--and the present--in my opinion.

[delhalew]

Travis cannot tackle a guy one on one. Go count how many times he's whiffed on a tackle or been dragged by a ball-carrier. It's embarrassing.

That's bad, but not as embarrassing as leaving receivers completely unattended. Shark my ***.

[CBUS_SOONER]

tough one. I think they are very average

[cccasooner2]

I think Stoops threw Javon under the bus on the play you guys are talking about. Yeah, but what the hell does that guy know?

[VA Sooner]

Lewis is a leader on the field, and reads the field before the snap really well, but Wort plays smarter after the snap, and tackles better. From watching Bird for a few games, you can tell that kid just plays with complete, unbridled enthusiasm for the game. He looks like he's completely psyched to be playing for OU, and he plays pretty smart for a young kid learning the system.


This ^ 100%.

Travis is the vocal leader of the LBs and can get guys in to position. But to me, Wort is the silent leader who is making the plays and plugging up the middle and now getting the confidence to attack the middle for the sack/TFL. He's maturing this year very quickly into the LB that Austin Box became by the end of last year once he was starting to recuperate from his back surgery (or thought he was).

Bird plays with heart... he looks to Lewis and Wort for direction pre-snap but he seems to play with a passion that Reynolds and Calmus did in previous years. I think we'll be OK with the LBs once we figure out the DT situation... one veteran and some young ones up front. Solidify that and the LBs will be more consistent with their gap integrity.

[VA Sooner]

By the way... Travis is a very good linebacker but he's obviously playing hurt... he couldn't cover the Aggie wide receiver after biting down on the run... when he figured out where the ball was really going, he was already beat by a few steps and you could tell his foot was killing him the way he was limping/running down the field to catch up. If anything, he blocked Javon from making the play, albeit deep in Sooner territory.

Lewis is fast from sideline to sideline... but the broke foot is catching up to him. I think that's why both linebackers were on the bench in the fourth quarter... something I hate to see in any game... unless it's a blowout.

[OUmillenium]

I know this...it aint Travis Lewis. I get annoyed with all the trash talking he does. There was a reason he came back for his senior year.

I have to agree. He rarely gets a hit or tipped pass. Gets tangled up in the line too often without plugging a hole. Just doesn't seem to be a big timer in my opinion. Likes to dance and hoop it up a lot but Wort is the guy who gets things done in the middle of the field. They should just blitz Lewis from various positions and not rely on him stopping the run or having to cover anybody. Hope he tears it up and goes to the NFL but right now its just hope.

[cyclonesooner]

Probably Wort. Travis Lewis is a disappointment, but he does play the best Matador LBer technique in the nation the way he ole's around the blocker, consistently opening the gate for huge running lanes. Pretty technique poor.

[d.stOUgh]

I don't know who the best one is, but I have been pleasantly surprised with Bird. Travis has issues with coverage across the middle.

seeing as how travis lewis has played with a broken toe this year and still leads the lb's in tackles...i'd say a healthy #28 would be far & away our best this year...imo.

that being said, tom wort, bird, nelson & jefferson (not all true lb's) are doing a hell of a job.

BOOMER SOONER!!!

[NormanPride]

The Will LB always leads the team in tackles in a Stoops defense.

[delhalew]

Lewis shows the same tendencies he did last year with a healthy foot. Tons of talent, mixed results.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I think Stoops threw Javon under the bus on the play you guys are talking about. Yeah, but what the hell does that guy know?

Our staff tends to grade guys on assignments, which yes Javon missed a key (again). When Reynolds scored a 100 against Warshington, it was mentioned that Calmus never scored above an 80%. My comment at the time was "Your grading system is borked".

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Just to point out something here. Travis Lewis is an excellent linebacker when he isn't blocked. This was also true of Reynolds before his last year. If you don't block them they will make the play 95%+ of the time. the problem with both of those guys was when you sent a blocker in their general direction, at that point they were both neutralized 90%+ of the time.

This is why these guys are so hot and cold on their stats (its also a good way to tell the good offensive coordinators vs the bad). Think about how easy it has been for our opponents to use formations to guarantee our linebackers either block themselves (wort) or get a player on a linebacker (lewis/wort).

What I'm looking for in an OU linebacker is someone who makes the play unblocked 85% of the time and makes the play blocked 50% of the time. That is a decent OU linebacker, a dominant one would be 90% on both. At this point, Bird comes the closest to that decent number. Nelson is the best linebacker on the team at getting past blocks, he's just not very good unblocked because he tends to get himself out of position.

[yankee]

Apparently our linebackers suck, based on the nit-picking and negativity of some of the posters. I'd say we're DOOMED.

[NormanPride]

I hate to break it to you, yankee, but based on their PERFORMANCE they are not very good. It is a glaring weak point in our D.

[rock on sooner]

Hard to understand, being 8-1, 6th in the BCS, an outside shot at playing for the national title, certainly a great shot at winning the conference and still
reading about our "glaring weakness". There shouldn't be bye weeks...entirely too much time to think!:D

[NormanPride]

Championship level teams should have championship level performers. They are not performing at a championship level, and are thus a glaring weakness. Other weaknesses are our DTs and our OL in run assignments. This team can have weaknesses... how else would we have lost to Tech?

[rock on sooner]

:D, NormanPride,:D!

[StoopTroup]

LBs are why we lost a game.

[8timechamps]

By the way... Travis is a very good linebacker but he's obviously playing hurt... he couldn't cover the Aggie wide receiver after biting down on the run... when he figured out where the ball was really going, he was already beat by a few steps and you could tell his foot was killing him the way he was limping/running down the field to catch up. If anything, he blocked Javon from making the play, albeit deep in Sooner territory.

Lewis is fast from sideline to sideline... but the broke foot is catching up to him. I think that's why both linebackers were on the bench in the fourth quarter... something I hate to see in any game... unless it's a blowout.

Yep. I think people forget that Lewis has not been at 100% since injuring his toe. As for the trash talk, that doesn't bother me one but. In fact, I like it, especially from a linebacker. That's how he plays the game, and he certainly doesn't do it for our benefit.

As for the TD he "gave up" against A&M last week, two things: First, that's what happens on a safety blitz sometimes. There isn't a linebacker in the country that can line up as a linebacker and cover like a safety. He had run responsibility, and got a little out of position. Two, that wasn't a designed play by A&M. The play broke down, and Swopes ad libbed. He was able to find space after he realized there was no safety. That's just a very good play made by a good receiver.

As for who is our best linebacker, I'd say Wort. He doesn't seem to get out of position as much this year, yet he still plays like his hair is on fire and brings his feet on every hit. I think Wort has a chance to be the next great LB out of OU.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Hard to understand, being 8-1, 6th in the BCS, an outside shot at playing for the national title, certainly a great shot at winning the conference and still
reading about our "glaring weakness". There shouldn't be bye weeks...entirely too much time to think!:D

osu is undefeated, 2nd in the BCS, and has a better than outside shot at playing for the NC, a great shot at winning the conference....I would say most think they have glaring weaknesses
lsu is undefeated, 1st in the BCS, most likely will play for the NC, most likely win their conference..About everyone here says they have glaring weaknesses...

Not really hard to understand IMO.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

osu is undefeated, 2nd in the BCS, and has a better than outside shot at playing for the NC, a great shot at winning the conference....I would say most think they have glaring weaknesses
lsu is undefeated, 1st in the BCS, most likely will play for the NC, most likely win their conference..About everyone here says they have glaring weaknesses...

Not really hard to understand IMO.

I'm not sure some people understand what you do on a message board. They also don't understand the difference between a constructive "this is what we are" thread and a "OMG FIRE CHUCK LONG I CAL PLAIS UN MI XOBOX BETR THEN HEM!!!1!!!" thread.

[8timechamps]

I'm not sure some people understand what you do on a message board. They also don't understand the difference between a constructive "this is what we are" thread and a "OMG FIRE CHUCK LONG I CAL PLAIS UN MI XOBOX BETR THEN HEM!!!1!!!" thread.

That's it.

[Chiliman]

LBs are why we lost a game.
Without question. All underneath, screens and crossing routes 5-10 yards past the LOS.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

That's why a lot of times, I don't discuss a lot of what I think here..Because it always goes a direction I don't want it to..I was crucified on here in the early stages in discussing the NFL draft stuff, because I didn't think every "great" player OU had was NFL worthy...

[StoopTroup]

Landry Jones = Draft Worthy


And I'm sorry. :D

[Eielson]

Did you guys want to debate who our best linebacker is, or did you guys just want a chance to bash Travis Lewis?

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Did you guys want to debate who our best linebacker is, or did you guys just want a chance to bash Travis Lewis?

I think I illustrated fairly well in what my criteria were for the position. For others, its just our culture. If you think this is bad, NEVER go to a pro board. Holy crap. On one of the Vikings boards Remi Ayodele was just crucified.

[Eielson]

I think I illustrated fairly well in what my criteria were for the position. For others, its just our culture. If you think this is bad, NEVER go to a pro board. Holy crap. On one of the Vikings boards Remi Ayodele was just crucified.

I'm not personally calling you out. I just find it odd that people throughout the thread are randomly calling out Lewis. They're not even refuting somebody who called him the best that I can see. I guess I just don't like the idea of piling on the insults to a player who has done a lot for us, hasn't caused much trouble, and is playing hurt.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I'm not personally calling you out. I just find it odd that people throughout the thread are randomly calling out Lewis. They're not even refuting somebody who called him the best that I can see. I guess I just don't like the idea of piling on the insults to a player who has done a lot for us, hasn't caused much trouble, and is playing hurt.

The worst insult I see in this thread is the word "disappointing". People are pointing out flaws in the guys game, not insulting him personally. And since this is a football message board, I do believe that is allowed. The point I'm not going to address is the woofing because that is a personal preference thing.

To his credit, the following points have been raised:

1) He's a leader -> I'm not sure how you measure this/refute it. So it just boils down to whether you feel personally he elevates the players around him.
2) He's playing hurt -> Yep, all the kudos in the world. Its also why I don't hold things like lack of sideline speed against him this year.
3) He reads the snap very well and gets people in position -> So now we are getting into measureable stuff. Basically this is # of correct reads/Defensive plays. Personally, I find this a misnomer because Lewis gets the call from the sideline and puts them in to the position called. The initial Pro is that he does this himself (which linebackers in the past have done btw), however he doesn't and we've developed a little bit of the meerkat on the defensive side of the ball this year. I do give him credit for keeping our DTs in the right gaps because they are wrong 75% of the time.
4) from me -> He is very very good when he isn't blocked.
5) He is one lucky son of a gun (thinking of berkhead's fumble last year in the big 12 championship game).

Cons

1) He Ole's blockers -> I've shown this in screenshot form numerous times. As good as Lewis is when he's unblocked, he's equally bad when a blocker gets within 4 yards of him.
2) He can't tackle someone one one one -> I don't necessarily agree with this. He's a pretty good tackler when he thinks he can make the tackle.
3) not said -> He takes plays off -> If he can't make the tackle, he gives pop warner effort. This is honestly my #1 argument about him being a leader because everyone on the team does this. There was a time several years ago where you would get multiple plays a game with 1 opposing ball carrier on the sidelines getting swarmed by 7 Sooners. When was the last time you saw that? Against aTm I saw our first 3 man swarm of the season.

[rock on sooner]

Step, NormanPride...listen,guys, the last sentence of my post "entirely too much time to think.:D was obviously a weak attempt at
humor and you both took it seriously. Sorry, having said that..we lost to Tech because every aspect of our team did not play to its
best, not just the backers, or the O-line, or the D-line, or the QB, or the WRs or ST or the secondary or the RBs or the coaches!

[yankee]

I hate to break it to you, yankee, but based on their PERFORMANCE they are not very good. It is a glaring weak point in our D.

Oh...OK NormanPride. Thanks for clearing that up!!!1one

[Eielson]

I know this...it aint Travis Lewis. I get annoyed with all the trash talking he does. There was a reason he came back for his senior year.


Travis single handedly gave up a TD against ATM.


I loved it when he was up yapping at the A&M guy yesterday after he had just been juked out of his shorts and had given up the first down.


Yep! Not too long after he gave us one of those shark signals on top of his helmet too.

I couldn't believe it. ... not that he gave up the TD... but that he did the shark thing.

I was wondering the other day, I think the reason he leads us in tackling each year (and broke Boz's record) is because he is tackling all those backs and tight ends who are catching all those passes in his zone each game. :nightmare:


Two, actually. They had a TD run late in the game where their RB ran at Travis' lane, and he was too busy letting the pulling guard come five yards out of the hole to chickenfight with him to actually make any kind of move at the ball carrier. If he had attacked the lane like I'm assuming was his responsibility, the runner would have been forced to go outside, where we had unblocked defenders.

When jkm talks about the "little things" that Lewis doesn't do, this is a perfect example of one. Instead of hitting the lane and not making a tackle, he dogs the play and leaves a wide open lane for a TD.

I'm not saying he's always bad. He wouldn't be starting if he was. He's just so dang inconsistent and he's got so much potential that I get frustrated that he's not going 100% on every play.


That's bad, but not as embarrassing as leaving receivers completely unattended. Shark my ***.


Travis cannot tackle a guy one on one. Go count how many times he's whiffed on a tackle or been dragged by a ball-carrier. It's embarrassing.


I have to agree. He rarely gets a hit or tipped pass. Gets tangled up in the line too often without plugging a hole. Just doesn't seem to be a big timer in my opinion. Likes to dance and hoop it up a lot but Wort is the guy who gets things done in the middle of the field. They should just blitz Lewis from various positions and not rely on him stopping the run or having to cover anybody. Hope he tears it up and goes to the NFL but right now its just hope.


Probably Wort. Travis Lewis is a disappointment, but he does play the best Matador LBer technique in the nation the way he ole's around the blocker, consistently opening the gate for huge running lanes. Pretty technique poor.

This is the first page and a half of the discussion, and I even left off about 5-6 posts about Lewis, so I feel justified in asking, "Did you guys want to debate who our best linebacker is, or did you guys just want a chance to bash Travis Lewis?"

[8timechamps]

This is the first page and a half of the discussion, and I even left off about 5-6 posts about Lewis, so I feel justified in asking, "Did you guys want to debate who our best linebacker is, or did you guys just want a chance to bash Travis Lewis?"

You've been here long enough to know real debates here are few and far between.

[Mazeppa]

#55

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

This is the first page and a half of the discussion, and I even left off about 5-6 posts about Lewis, so I feel justified in asking, "Did you guys want to debate who our best linebacker is, or did you guys just want a chance to bash Travis Lewis?"

Once again, outside of the trash talking they aren't bashing the guy, they are bashing his play. There is a distinct difference between the two. I guarantee you if you would have done this thread at the beginning of the season anyone who would have said anything contrary to him being the best would have been hauled out back and shot.

[NormanPride]

Yeah, the moment jkm pointed him out last year his play has really stuck out to me. I've been watching individual players a lot more this year, and he's the one that is most hot/cold.

I ragged on Fleming a bit early in the season for his poor angles in run support, but I think that was rust because he looks a TON better now. Hurst, however, has had a number of brain farts on technique and lapses in concentration. Still the minority for him, though.

The point of this thread was to reevaluate the LB position because it's our biggest weakness on D. With Bird getting more and more playing time because Wort is injury prone, I felt it was time to get people to look at who our best players at that position really are. It was more to talk about Bird and Nelson being bright spots than Lewis being a dark one.