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View Full Version : For those that dont know the true story of the creation of the Big 12....



OU_Sooners75
9/21/2011, 10:16 PM
http://themercury.com/K-StateSports/article.aspx?articleId=3d2af06db8284de69292e4bd5d8 d69a2


Jon Wefald picks up the phone from his Minnesota home, and seconds later, the former Kansas State president poses a question.

"Now what on earth would you be calling me for?" Wefald asks laughing, knowing the reason for the call.

College athletics is potentially on the verge of monumental change. The Big 12 Conference, a league Wefald was instrumental in building, has been vulnerable to dissolution due to conference realignment over the past year.

So if there was ever a time to jump in the time machine and look back at how the Big Eight became the Big 12 (almost the Big 16, more on that later) nearly two decades ago, it's now.

Not many people know more details about that time than Wefald, who served two terms as the Chair of the Association of Big Eight universities from 1989-93.

He spares to tell the story of how the 12-team league was formed — a conference that seemed ideal, a grouping of schools Wefald thought would be together for a long time.

But before he begins to paint the picture of that time, there's one last thing.

"You know, this story has never been written before," he says.

Moments later, he begins to tell it.

It was 1990, and the landscape of college athletics would soon undergo a significant change.

Arkansas left the Southwest Conference for the Southeastern Conference that year, and Penn State left its independent status and joined the Big Ten.

"The dominoes are real shaky in 1990," Wefald said, reflecting back on that time period. "The dominoes were falling and I was concerned about the future of the Big Eight. It's very similar to July of 2010, and now late summer, early fall of 2011."

Wefald, along with Kansas chancellor Gene Budig and Iowa State president Martin Jischke, understood what was at risk if those dominoes continued to fall.

"That's when I started thinking to myself, 'OK, I'm the Chair here and I know there are two or three other Big Eight presidents that feel we have to get aggressive,'" Wefald said. "Otherwise what I was worried about was Texas would join the Pac-10 in 1990, kind of like the same thing we found last year and now. They'd be leaving the Southwest Conference and that would be a powerful force to maybe trigger Oklahoma into joining the Southeast Conference.

"And then Colorado, going all the way back to the late 80s and early 90s — there were people at the University of Colorado that wanted to join the Pac-10. They had that kind of vision for two decades."

So a group of Big Eight presidents, led by Wefald, became proactive.

"We felt we had to get aggressive because if we don't, there's a good chance the Big Eight takes a big hit. It would create a real disturbance."

Wefald, Budig and Jischke began to look at a partnership with the Southwest Conference, which consisted of eight schools after Arkansas' departure: Texas, Texas Tech, Texas A&M, Baylor, TCU, SMU, Rice and Houston.

"It was something we were willing to consider, and it was something we thought we could talk the other Big Eight presidents into," Wefald said.

Fast forward to 2011, a time when 16-team super conferences are talked about daily, and this is where the Big Eight actually appeared to be well ahead of the game approximately 20 years earlier.

The Big Eight's goal was to form a 16-team conference, with all eight of the remaining schools from the Southwest Conference merging with the original Big Eight of Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, K-State, KU, Missouri, Iowa State, Colorado and Nebraska.

"We actually were pushing that very hard," Wefald said.

The Southwest Conference presidents and Big Eight presidents happened to be together for a meeting of the national land grant and state universities in Kansas City in the summer of 1990.

Wefald would call a meeting for all the presidents from the two leagues to attend .Twelve to 13 of the 16 presidents showed up.

A partnership between the two leagues was discussed, but University of Texas president Bill Cunningham shut down the talks relatively quickly.

"We were talking about the merger," Wefald recalled. "After about a half-hour or 45 minutes, Bill Cunningham said 'we're not interested.' They were the only one to say that.

"It was kind of interesting even then, because without Texas, we thought, 'well we might as well conclude the meeting because Texas wasn't interesting. So the meeting ended."

Wefald, still the Chair of the Big Eight, thought the passing of time could perhaps change Texas' mind about a conference merger, so he let a couple of years go by.

Cunningham, the Texas president, was promoted to chancellor of the 15 educational institutions in Texas in 1992.

Bob Berdahl would take over as the university's president in 1993, and soon after, another meeting was called, this time in the hotel of the Dallas-Fort Worth Airport.

"We can't tell Texas they're coming up to Kansas City so we met at the Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport," Wefald said, half joking.

Fifteen schools were present at the meeting, with Rice being the lone exception.

Southwest Conference commissioner Steve Hatchell and Big Eight commissioner Carl James were at the hotel, but stayed out in the hall during the meeting.

"We met for I'd say two hours and just had a discussion, a complete discussion on a merger," Wefald said. "There's 15 schools there and we're kind of sitting on chairs, and after about a half-hour of conversation, I just said, 'well, let's just see who might be interested in mergering.'

"We're going around the room and it's one after the other 'I, I, I, I,' and ironically the last school was the University of Texas."

Fitting that it would once again come down to Texas. There sat new president Bob Berdahl, pondering the decision.

"The 14 schools said let's do it and we got to the University of Texas and Berdahl said 'I've got to think about this, I've gotta take it to our board of regents.' I just said to myself in my mind, 'oh darn-it, it's not going to happen.' That's just how influential the University of Texas is."

Berdahl, regarded as a low-key person by those who knew him, then caught everyone's attention.

"He just said 'if I had my way we'd join the Pac-10," Wefald recalled. "He just said 'look, we're not doing well in the Southwest Conference and we play all our games in Texas except for a few.'"

Unlike today, Texas was struggling in the early 90s. From 1991-93, the Longhorns posted a 16-16-1 record in football while failing to make a bowl game during that time. In addition, their basketball attendance was waning significantly. In its 1988 men's basketball season, Texas averaged just 4,028 fans per game in an arena that seated 16,231.

So Texas was seeking change.

"So we had 14 out of 15 that were saying 'I,'" Wefald said. "So the Big Eight presidents decided we shouldn't let this draw out and let's try and get a conference call within two weeks because you can't just let that sit there.

"We knew Texas had to meet with its board of regents and I assume that they did that within the week. So we had a conference call that was set up within ten days and all of the Big Eight presidents were on the conference call, and quite frankly, we did not know who was on for the Southwest Conference."

Fifteen minutes into that call, Wefald spoke up.

"I just said 'what do you guys in the Southwest Conference want to do?" he asked.

The first person to chime in: Bob Berdahl, the president of Texas.

"He said 'we've decided you should invite four schools: Texas, Texas A&M, Baylor and Texas Tech," Wefald recalled.

Texas and A&M were considered key components to the expansion, while Baylor and Texas Tech had some advantages on its side.

Ann Richards, the governor of Texas at the time, was a Baylor graduate. Therefore, the Bears' move to the Big 12 would be supported.

Texas Tech also had leverage, as key members in both the House and the Senate of the Texas legislature had a strong affiliation with the Red Raiders.

Meanwhile, TCU, SMU, Rice and Houston would be left out of the mix

"After the conference call I made sure we got telegrams with invitations to those four schools to join," Wefald said. "So like magic, we had a Big 12 and it was ready to go by 94."

On the outside looking in, everything seemed OK in the Big 12. But there were always points of contention in regards to the league perhaps catering to Texas. The Longhorns were a valued commodity to the league, and perhaps had some advantages others did not.

"The University of Texas, we met maybe a month later to come up with a mission statement and some ground rules," Wefald said. "Texas made it very clear all gate receipts would be kept by each school and we all supported that."

But Texas also took issue with Proposition 48s — which was a rule enacted in 1986 that requires incoming college athletes to have a 2.0 GPA in 11 core courses and score at least a 700 on the SAT or a 15 on the ACT. This was better known as partial qualifiers, and Texas wanted the number allowed in the old Big Eight to be decreased significantly in the Big 12, which left a sour taste in the mouth of Nebraska football coach Tom Osborne.

"At the time, Tom Osborne maybe had over 20 or 25 Prop 48s and they were all excellent players," Wefald said. "Texas said we're only going to permit one and if you don't go along with it we're not going to join — it was almost like that. And we supported that. It was so important to have Texas and Texas A&M as part of this new conference and Baylor and Texas Tech are both excellent — so we had this Big 12 and we pretty much agreed on the ground rules."

But there were other rules some schools were bitter over. Revenue would not be distributed evenly under the guidelines of the new Big 12, as only 50 percent was divided equally among the league's schools.

"It was always the debate on the other 50 percent of the television revenues," Wefald said. "In the Big Ten and the Southeastern Conference, they share 100 percent and that was always a point of contention. But Texas and Texas A&M, Oklahoma and probably Nebraska felt it was fine to have 50 percent based on appearances because they were going to be on just about every week and that's just the way it is."

So the Big 12 was built, and in 1996, K-State played Texas Tech in the inaugural Big 12 football game in Manhattan. It was an exciting time for nearly all involved.

Those happy times have now turned to doom and gloom for a league that just a few years ago, had its issues, but all the schools seemed content.

Now animosity appears to exist, and trustworthy relationships have seemingly turned into a game of everyone looking behind, hoping not to be stabbed in the back.

"I'm sitting here and I can't believe this is happening," Wefald said. "You're taking a conference that was just perfect. You could drive to anywhere — everything was drivable. We had great rivalries — historic rivalries. We all got along well."

The rapid speed of all the talk regarding conference realignment has shocked Wefald.

"I am stunned at how rapid and quick this whole development has taken place," he said. "I wish they would just think about it for a while.

"It's a great conference. I think people really love the Big 12. I just wish they would stop and think about all the advantages for the Big 12. There are so many."

Wefald admits he's just a fan now, but at the same time, it's difficult to watch something he helped build possibly crumble so quickly. And there's nothing he can do but hope that in the end, cooler heads prevail, and logic defies greed and jealousy. And with Tuesday's news, everything may turn out OK for the league.

"The whole thing — it's all most surrealistic," he said. "I shouldn't be getting a headache over this, but I do. It's just, 'why?' How is this helping the sports of all these Big 12 schools?

"It's very disappointing. It all kind of leaves you speechless. The fact that pride, irritation, anger over things you wouldn't say are that major would lead to the dissolution of the Big 12... I just wish everybody would sit back and think about it more.

"It would just be very heartbreaking to see the Big 12 break up."

MyT Oklahoma
9/21/2011, 10:23 PM
I was not aware of all of this. Thanks for sharing.

King Barry's Back
9/22/2011, 04:35 AM
Great read. Thanks for sharing it.

Really gives us some rich background for what is happening right now, and a good explanation for TX's behavior.

When 15 out of 16 college presidents are present, and 14 of 15 vote yes to the merger, and ONLY TEXAS votes no -- and they drop the whole proposal -- I think we can all understand why the 'horns treat the rest of the conference as their doormats.

It's because from the very beginning, we have been their doormats.

It's time this stopped.

King Barry's Back
9/22/2011, 04:37 AM
As a follow up to my own post - interesting to imagine what would have happened if the old SW Conference had moved north and joined the Big 12 w/o TX. TX could have gone west if they wanted, but those schools would have brought the state of Texas's entire TV market with them.

At worst, today, OU would be looking to join the PAC whatever.

Sooner1972
9/22/2011, 06:45 AM
Wow. Texass comes off even more arrogant, abrasive, and domineering back then than they are now (which is saying something). Also interesting to read why Baylor isn't in the C-USA as they should be, and why Texas Tech isn't in the MWC or something.

Sooner_Tuf
9/22/2011, 07:16 AM
I think that is interesting but I think the part about Ann Richards getting Baylor included has been proven false about a million times to date.

It's funny how Texas has always claimed they ruled the roost in the Big XII (they pretty much have) until lately when members are leaving because of them. Now Texas claims they only have one vote just like the rest of the schools.

Texas is driving off schools from the Big XII. I know they say they aren't but who are you going to believe, the schools that say they are leaving/left because of Texas or Texas themselves?

Arkansas left the SWC because of Texas and never looked back. Texas has done everything in it's power to make it's fellow members it's whipping posts. And it has worked pretty well except for OU. OU has benefited from Texas insisted upon insane policies just as Texas has. A&M did too to a lessor extent. As did Nebraska until the became almost irrelevant to CFB there for a few years. Until the LHN arrived. Texas found a way to gain advantage over absolutely everyone in the conference, OU included.

Enough really is enough. I don't care if we leave the Big XII or stay but Texas needs to be reigned in or forced out. No conference is going to take them with their prima donna attitude and policies. Let them be independent or go back to being Champion of an irrelevant conference like they were for so many years. They won't have enough money to pay enough teams to get a decent schedule.

Deloss Dodds has been a ruthless businessman for Texas but possibly gone too far. He came from KSU and it makes you wonder as bad as KSU has kicked Texas' butt on the field if they have a mole in Dodds destroying them from within ;)

All joke aside, Boren is a smart cookie. I think quite a bit smarter than Dodds. Boren will put us in the best place for us to be. I don't care what the Pac12 said if Boren wants to go they will listen. Just like the SEC said no to expansion and then worked a deal with A&M a few days later.

I'll miss the Texas game if it goes away just like I miss Thanksgiving with Nebraska but I'll live. So will everyone else.

soonerhubs
9/22/2011, 07:53 AM
I really struggle to trust sources who use words such as "mergering" and "I" (instead of aye). This article reeks of amateur writing, so I'm suspicious that the "facts" presented here are "vulnerable to dissolution."

Lawton4Life
9/22/2011, 08:45 AM
I really struggle to trust sources who use words such as "mergering" and "I" (instead of aye). This article reeks of amateur writing, so I'm suspicious that the "facts" presented here are "vulnerable to dissolution."

The source didnt write the story. A dude with a crappy copy editor wrote the story. Do you really think a former university president said Mergering?

I and AYE sound the same, so the guy probably wrote down I in the notebook and the cash strapped newspaper didnt have anyone smart enough to say hey, I think they mean AYE or maybe even YEA in this case.

Mac94
9/22/2011, 09:11 AM
Interesting read ... have always read things on the SWC side ... being an Aggie and a student up to 1994 we were hearing so much back then ... but never read much on the Big-8 side of things.


I think that is interesting but I think the part about Ann Richards getting Baylor included has been proven false about a million times to date.


Lt. Gov. Bob Bullock was the driver back then for keeping Texas, A&M, Baylor, and Tech together. At the time Texas was serious about the Pac-10 ... and A&M was all but headed to the SEC. In regards to A&M Bullock carried a big stick .. threatenign our funding if we bolted by promising help in funding what would become Reed Arena if we stuck witht he other Texas schools.

sooner518
9/22/2011, 09:18 AM
".....We had great rivalries — historic rivalries. We all got along well."

Sounds like, even then, no one got along with Texas.....

Here's my question: He mentions that they had a conference call with all the Big 8 members and some of the SWC members, but they didnt know which SWC members were on the call. It appears that only 4 SWC members were on that call. Did Texas just decide to include those 4 schools and exclude the other 4? Why werent they all on that call, and if they were, why didnt they (Rice, SMU, TCU, UH) voice any complaints over being left out of the new conference?

OklaPony
9/22/2011, 10:42 AM
Seems like this account of the situation explains why Nebraska, especially Tom Osborne, was eager to bail when the opportunity presented itself.

badger
9/22/2011, 10:49 AM
Tom Ozzy wasn't even a part of Nebbish football except in legend only during their dark ages of Cally and Solich. I remember seeing an interview where Callyburger finally invited him and the last title team back for the 10-year anniversary, only for the team to suck beyond suck (it was the game that the fans left before halftime, yes, even before the honoring ceremony). Ozzy joked afterward that he was worried Callahan wouldn't invite him back because of the bad luck he seemed to bring the team (I think that game they were so abysmal in was against KU, no joke).

The fact that he's back at NU now is only because the entire state didn't love him enough to elect him to office. I'm not sure that Nebraska itself, or even Ozzy, wanted out so badly, especially when they were finally starting to get competitive in football again.

EatLeadCommie
9/22/2011, 10:54 AM
TT and Baylor were added to the mix as afterthoughts and only because of political connections. It was originally supposed to be only UT and aTm to the Big 8.

jkjsooner
9/22/2011, 10:55 AM
Enough really is enough. I don't care if we leave the Big XII or stay but Texas needs to be reigned in or forced out. No conference is going to take them with their prima donna attitude and policies. Let them be independent or go back to being Champion of an irrelevant conference like they were for so many years. They won't have enough money to pay enough teams to get a decent schedule.

I still say we have power here. We can tell Texas to get in line or leave. If Texas leaves, that opens the floodgates and that will open up opportunities for us. If Texas goes to the PAC then we'll get an invite right after them. If Texas goes to the Big 10 or ACC (a horrible move) then other conferences will look at expanding.

Unfortunately, much of the rest of the conference may have no choice but to do whatever they can to keep Texas. That works against our hand but I still say that if Texas leaves the Big 12 we will find a good home outside of the Big 12.

Landthief 1972
9/22/2011, 11:00 AM
Interesting that Texas had that much leverage with the state their football and basketball team were in at the time (although never Boo Blake bad).

OULenexaman
9/22/2011, 11:14 AM
I had dinner once after a golf tourney with the old BB coach from Iowa State named Johnny Orr.....his version is a whole lot different.

Spritekid
9/22/2011, 11:16 AM
So here is my question... Why can't we add those teams now??

TMcGee86
9/22/2011, 11:30 AM
So here is my question... Why can't we add those teams now??

Because it makes no sense to add those teams now. You have to remember, football doesn't matter. Dollars matter. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. Everything else is a component of dollars.

So the first problem is if you add any teams, you have to split the pot again. This is why the Big12 will stay with 9/10 teams for the time being. And this is also why it is destined to be a failed conference.

Now that problem could be overcome if you can make the dollars add up to what they were pre-split. Unfortunately, those teams don't do that.

BYU might, and I stress, miiiiiight bring in enough to justify going to ten teams. But TCU/SMU/UH/RICE add nothing from a money stand point, and they infringe upon UT's (and OU's for that matter, they are not innocent in this) fertile recruiting grounds. The big 12 would add instant legitimacy to any team from an non BCS conference. So now all you've done is add a new threat, given them tons of new power, and it's in a market you already own. That's a no win situation from UT and OU's point of view. Why legitimize TCU? Or SMU? Or UH? You already have the Dallas and Houston markets on lockdown. Those schools barely have 100k fans total much less sell out their meager stadiums or bring in any money to the conference. So all you've done is make recruiting harder, going undefeated harder, and reduced the take you get from your TV deal. Why would UT or OU do that?

Same problem with someone like Boise. Sure it makes sense football-wise, but why add a legit contender when that contender wont pay for itself or open up a new recruiting base? All you would be doing is creating a new pipeline out of Texas for recruits to fill Boise's team. You make them a legitimate team now that they are in a real conference, and you make going undefeated even harder that it was before. And for your troubles you now have to split the pot 11 ways instead of 10.

That's why I think BYU is the only option. They have a somewhat national fan base, and bring in a new market. They aren't a legit threat in football, and because of the religious aspect of the school, they don't pose any real threat to recruiting. They may not bring in tons of dollars, but it adds a new TV market and keeps the conference looking legitimate and you aren't hurt too much in the process. A 9 team conference is a joke. A 10 team conference is at least respectable enough to not get nuked in the next year.

This whole thing is a cluster**** of greed, ambivalence, and arrogance. UT will not budge on the LHN. That is why there is not a Pac-16 today period. If UT had relented, even slightly, we would have superconferences right now. The Pac-12 would love to have OU, but the problem is, if they take OU and OSU, all of the sudden you have a 14 team league that you have to split into two 7-team divisions. Sounds simple enough until you look at the geography of it. OU/OSU would be paired with AU/ASU and Utah/Colorado. That's six teams. So they need one more. The problem is the remaining 8 teams are the original Pac-8. Good luck breaking that up. The way the Pac-8 was made was the perfect conference. Two southern CA teams (USC/UCLA), two north CA teams (Stanford/Cal), two Oregon teams (UO/OSU) and two Washington teams (UW/WSU). Who's going to volunteer to break up their long history with their neighbor? Certainly not USC or UCLA and those are the two teams that make the most geographic sense. Certainly not the two snob schools who already turn their nose up at the hicks from OK raiding their conference. And certainly not two northwest state schools which make no geographic sense anyway.

So OU got stuck on a called bluff and it bit them in the ***. I'm sure the Pac-12 would like OU and OSU. But when you try to make it work, it falls apart. Maybe you could live with a 8 team division and a 6 team division. But how is that fair to the 8 team division? Maybe you could rotate divisions but how do you structure that and ensure fairness? Maybe you could not have divisions and invent some round robin format. But how does that work with only ten games max to deal with. And at this point, you are talking about very radical changes and when put to the fire I think the Pac presidents said, ****, lets just hold off, why are we rushing into this anyway.

The problem is, it's not like there's any other option for the Pac 12, there are just no legit teams between CA and OK/TX that would be a better option. And it's not like there's any other option for OU. Make no mistake, OU wants no part of a conference that has no games played in the state of Texas. It's why they don't jump ship for the SEC or Big10 right now. Neither is a good option. The SEC does nothing for you except make your road to the MNC that much harder. You've just cut off your nose to spite your face. The Big10 doesn't pose the competition problem, but you still have to dump OSU and that's an issue, plus you've now got to sell your recruits on playing non-traditional rivals in cold remote locations. No kid from Texas wants to do that. It's why the Pac16 made sense, you open up a recruiting pipeline to CA, and the timing couldn't be any better considering we has three studs from CA right now, but you also keep your base in Texas and can still tell the boys' mommas that they will be able to see their boys play at least two games in state every other year. So I think the Pac just said, lets hold off, maybe the LHN folds, and if it doesn't OU is always going to be waiting there and we can take KU and Missou instead if conference Armageddon actually comes to fruition and UT wont budge.

OU_Sooners75
9/22/2011, 11:44 AM
Tom Ozzy wasn't even a part of Nebbish football except in legend only during their dark ages of Cally and Solich. I remember seeing an interview where Callyburger finally invited him and the last title team back for the 10-year anniversary, only for the team to suck beyond suck (it was the game that the fans left before halftime, yes, even before the honoring ceremony). Ozzy joked afterward that he was worried Callahan wouldn't invite him back because of the bad luck he seemed to bring the team (I think that game they were so abysmal in was against KU, no joke).

The fact that he's back at NU now is only because the entire state didn't love him enough to elect him to office. I'm not sure that Nebraska itself, or even Ozzy, wanted out so badly, especially when they were finally starting to get competitive in football again.

What the hell does this blabbering post have to do with the topic of the OP?

WOW!!!!!

OU_Sooners75
9/22/2011, 11:45 AM
TT and Baylor were added to the mix as afterthoughts and only because of political connections. It was originally supposed to be only UT and aTm to the Big 8.

Obviously you cant read real good.

The Big 8 was wanting all of the remaining SWC teams, Texas, Tech, A&M, Baylor, Rice, Houston, TCU, and SMU. They wanted to go to a 16 team conference, even over 20 years ago.

Try reading what the head of the Big 8 conference said!

OU_Sooners75
9/22/2011, 11:47 AM
I had dinner once after a golf tourney with the old BB coach from Iowa State named Johnny Orr.....his version is a whole lot different.

Yeah, because coaches were in the meeting rooms. :jaded:

I am not saying Orr's version isnt different, but I highly doubt he had the inside information like the ADs and Presidents did.

DCSooner
9/22/2011, 11:52 AM
75 is cranky today. =)

OULenexaman
9/22/2011, 01:15 PM
Yeah, because coaches were in the meeting rooms. :jaded:

I am not saying Orr's version isnt different, but I highly doubt he had the inside information like the ADs and Presidents did. Actually he was very involved in it and was the ring leader in trying to keep Texas out of the conference. He was very vocal about it. Quite colorful too.

badger
9/22/2011, 01:44 PM
What the hell does this blabbering post have to do with the topic of the OP?

WOW!!!!!

Um... check the post right above that one that mentions TOM OSBOURNE before you get out your neg spekker??????

Chill, man.

badger
9/22/2011, 01:49 PM
Because it makes no sense to add those teams now. You have to remember, football doesn't matter. Dollars matter. That's it. Nothing more, nothing less. Everything else is a component of dollars.

Yeah, I know man. As much as I'm sure another Texas school would love to get into the BCS mix via the Big 12, that ship's probably already sailed.

I lurked on texags back when this realignment thing was just exploding and their argument for letting A&M go right away to the SEC was that it would open up a BCS spot in the Big 12 for a current non-AQ team in Texas... like Houston, or SMU, etc. Perhaps that was what got the Texas legislature to not meet when the A&M-to-SEC rumors first surfaced?

TMcGee86
9/22/2011, 02:14 PM
Yeah, I know man. As much as I'm sure another Texas school would love to get into the BCS mix via the Big 12, that ship's probably already sailed.

I lurked on texags back when this realignment thing was just exploding and their argument for letting A&M go right away to the SEC was that it would open up a BCS spot in the Big 12 for a current non-AQ team in Texas... like Houston, or SMU, etc. Perhaps that was what got the Texas legislature to not meet when the A&M-to-SEC rumors first surfaced?

Yeah, it would be one thing if there was another legit team in Texas, but dollar-wise, there just isn't. No network is going to want to pay more because you got rid of A&M and added TCU.

Now if Baylor left, sure, it's a perfect transition to TCU or SMU or UH. Hell even if Tech left you could make the argument. But unfortunately A&M is just a hair above those in terms of importance, and the networks know it.

badger
9/22/2011, 02:27 PM
I still wonder if there is any chance in hell that A&M stays... and not the chance at the end of Dumb and Dumber, but a real chance :rcmad:

If not, it might be TCU that gets in. How do I know? Boone Pickens has a very, VERY big mouth lately and that's the team he can't shut his yapper about.

SicEmBaylor
9/22/2011, 02:58 PM
I'm opposed to adding another Texas team. The current Big XII members from Texas already saturate the Texas TV market. I also think there's a real danger in the conference becoming too Texas-centric.

Any additions should come from outside of Texas. Plus, an idea that had widespread appeal on BF's, move the Big XII offices to Tulsa.

Whet
9/22/2011, 03:01 PM
T. Boone Pickens is a geologist and donated money to build OSU's Geology building. He also donated more money to upgrade the athletic facilities, including the stadium. Pickens started at aTm, before transferring to OSU.

Although, aTm is located in texas, not all the people living there fans of aTM. In fact, aTm is not the most popular university in the state.

badger
9/22/2011, 03:03 PM
Any additions should come from outside of Texas. Plus, an idea that had widespread appeal on BF's, move the Big XII offices to Tulsa.

We are losing our Arena Football team to San Antonio, so we'll likely lose AFL league offices too. As such, I wouldn't mind seeing new athletic offices come in. Plus, that might actually give Tulsa a chance of hosting more sports events :D

As for adding more Texas teams, I think with everything that has happened up till now, anything can happen here on out... even if it's the worst, most inconceivable idea ever thought of :(

EatLeadCommie
9/22/2011, 03:08 PM
Obviously you cant read real good.

The Big 8 was wanting all of the remaining SWC teams, Texas, Tech, A&M, Baylor, Rice, Houston, TCU, and SMU. They wanted to go to a 16 team conference, even over 20 years ago.

Try reading what the head of the Big 8 conference said!
I can read fine. The original article didn't mention what I did, which is why I mentioned it. The article discussed the merging of the two conferences initially and then jumped ahead to UT and aTm offering only 4 teams. It skipped over the part where UT and aTm were the only ones set to go and political pressure was brought downward to add Baylor and TT. The SWC was so irrelevant by then that it made sense for UT and aTm only to go, leaving the rest of the Texas schools to whither on the vine. From a recruiting standpoint, that meant they wouldn't lose recruits to any of the other Texas schools anymore.

badger
9/22/2011, 03:24 PM
T. Boone Pickens is a geologist and donated money to build OSU's Geology building. He also donated more money to upgrade the athletic facilities, including the stadium. Pickens started at aTm, before transferring to OSU.

Although, aTm is located in texas, not all the people living there fans of aTM. In fact, aTm is not the most popular university in the state.

Proof what a stickler A&M is with its money: It cut T. Boone's $25 scholarship.

A&M's desperate need for more money will only lead to more stupid decisions, lol.

OU_Sooners75
9/23/2011, 01:41 AM
75 is cranky today. =)

I am always cranky!

Need to find me a good prostitute! you available? Im tired of STEP!

OU_Sooners75
9/23/2011, 01:43 AM
Um... check the post right above that one that mentions TOM OSBOURNE before you get out your neg spekker??????

Chill, man.

LOL...and your post still had NOTHING to do with the OP.

Good Jorb!

OU_Sooners75
9/23/2011, 01:44 AM
Actually he was very involved in it and was the ring leader in trying to keep Texas out of the conference. He was very vocal about it. Quite colorful too.

Yeah, I am pretty sure a little BBall coach was sitting among the decision makers. :jaded:

soonercoop1
9/23/2011, 07:40 AM
The Big8 saved the SW conference after Texass destroyed it....now Texass has destroyed the Big12...time to cut our ties with Texass and either kick them out or leave without them...

soonerhubs
9/23/2011, 07:49 AM
The source didnt write the story. A dude with a crappy copy editor wrote the story. Do you really think a former university president said Mergering?

I and AYE sound the same, so the guy probably wrote down I in the notebook and the cash strapped newspaper didnt have anyone smart enough to say hey, I think they mean AYE or maybe even YEA in this case.

Pardon me, but the source I was referring to WAS the dude with the crappy copy editor.

TheHumanAlphabet
9/23/2011, 04:57 PM
How many of you peeps know that the Martin Jischke spoken of in the story was a well respected and liked OU Engineering professor.

PLaw
9/23/2011, 10:56 PM
All I have to say is, "I sure miss the old Big 8". Great partners, great days.

I've always hated * and I hate the fact that we stood by and watched Nebbish leave without standing up with them against the vermin in Austin.

BOOMER

stoopified
9/24/2011, 11:36 AM
Typical UT bully boy Sh!T