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View Full Version : FSU's irreverent adoption of all things Native American has always been wrong...


Soonerus
9/16/2011, 10:07 PM
...especially to those of us in the land of the red man, Oklahoma...revenge will be sweet....again...
nighttrain12
9/16/2011, 10:23 PM
Little Red says hello.
Soonerus
9/16/2011, 10:32 PM
Exactly...
Okla-homey
9/17/2011, 07:10 AM
To be clear, they have the express permission of both the Seminole Nation of Florida and the Seminole Nation of Oklahoma. Which is also why they continue to be the Seminoles. The silly part however, is they put their Seminole warrior mascot on a horse. In truth, Seminoles where not a horse-based culture and fought on foot.
picasso
9/17/2011, 07:26 AM
To be clear, they have the express permission of both the Seminole Nation of Florida and the Seminole Nation of Oklahoma. Which is also why they continue to be the Seminoles. The silly part however, is they put their Seminole warrior mascot on a horse. In truth, Seminoles where not a horse-based culture and fought on foot.
And they didn't do a 1940's Hollywood Injun chant.
Soonerus
9/17/2011, 09:11 AM
Watching 80,000 Anglos doing the tomahawk chop has always tuned my stomach a little...
marfacowboy
9/17/2011, 09:14 AM
To be clear, they have the express permission of both the Seminole Nation of Florida and the Seminole Nation of Oklahoma. Which is also why they continue to be the Seminoles. The silly part however, is they put their Seminole warrior mascot on a horse. In truth, Seminoles where not a horse-based culture and fought on foot.

Precisely the point I made in the other thread, which is now locked. They dress the guy up like someone from a plains tribe. But that's what people want to see, the image fictionalized in 19th century dime novels.
47straight
9/17/2011, 02:15 PM
To be clear, they have the express permission of both the Seminole Nation of Florida and the Seminole Nation of Oklahoma. Which is also why they continue to be the Seminoles. The silly part however, is they put their Seminole warrior mascot on a horse. In truth, Seminoles where not a horse-based culture and fought on foot.

I had the understanding that the Fake Seminole Nation of Florida had approved but the Real Seminole Nation of Oklahoma had not.

Mostly because Free Shoes had paid the FSNF.
SicEmBaylor
9/17/2011, 02:21 PM
How did they get around the NCAA ban on injun-named mascots?
Soonerfan88
9/17/2011, 03:42 PM
See Homey's post above - they are officially sanctioned by the tribe. Don't mind the name but have never liked the tomahawk chop. If I were voting, that would be banned or all sanctions would be rescinded.

I think it is a crock that North Dakota can't keep the Fighting Sioux name simply because one of several bands didn't approve it when all others did.
SicEmBaylor
9/17/2011, 03:55 PM
See Homey's post above - they are officially sanctioned by the tribe. Don't mind the name but have never liked the tomahawk chop. If I were voting, that would be banned or all sanctions would be rescinded.

I think it is a crock that North Dakota can't keep the Fighting Sioux name simply because one of several bands didn't approve it when all others did.

I didn't think the NCAA cared if the name was sanctioned or not, but I guess since it references a specific tribe it's something of a different story. Still...I find it ridiculous that FSU (with probably very few indian students) keeps its mascot while NSU is, historically, an indian school full of indians and they had to change their mascot.
pphilfran
9/17/2011, 04:20 PM
North Dakota - Fighting Sioux...last I heard they couldn't get both Sioux tribes to agree and name will be changed..

Illinois - Fighting Illini....

Notre Dame - Fighting Irish...
OutlandTrophy
9/17/2011, 04:57 PM
North Dakots should change their nickname to the Sues and use a caricture of two little girls as their mascot

[/StuApproves]
GDC
9/17/2011, 05:01 PM
Redskins and Savages are the only mascots that are offensive, the rest are fine by me.
John Kochtoston
9/18/2011, 01:31 AM
Osceola is approved by the Seminole Tribe of Florida, which allows FSU to use the mascot within NCAA guidelines. The Seminole Tribe of Oklahoma has no official stance on the issue.
jumperstop
9/18/2011, 01:41 AM
I would think they would be offended by the 'scalp em' bs. They tribe might make sure that their mascot wears the correct outfit, but everything else including the fans dressed as indians is a mockery and I don't see how they can stand by that ****. I don't care, but I'm sure native americans are offended by a drunk *** frat wearing a headdress he bought at a costume store claiming to be an indian, yelling scalp em...
Tulsa_Fireman
9/18/2011, 01:39 PM
GO FIGHTING WAGONBURNERS
Lott's Bandana
9/18/2011, 01:45 PM
The worst, and one of the first, examples of changing names was Marquette.

They changed from Warriors to Golden Eagles.

Warriors? Who the hell was offended by that? If their mascot/logo was specific, change it, but Warrior applies throughout history and currently.




Marquette's intercollegiate athletic teams were the "Warriors" from May 1954 to July 1994 when the nickname was changed to the "Golden Eagles" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marquette_Golden_Eagles). Prior to 1962 Marquette football was known as "Golden Avalanche" and other teams were known as "Warriors," "Blue and Gold," and "Hilltoppers". The Marquette Warriors (the nickname that preceded Golden Eagles) won the NCAA basketball championship (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_Men%27s_Division_I_Basketball_Championship) in 1977. In 2004, Marquette began to consider changing the name back to Warriors, and conducted a poll (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_poll) that showed 92 percent of alumni and 62 percent of students "identified" with that nickname. However, the Board of Trustees (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Board_of_Trustees) ignored the results of the poll on the grounds that previous logos had been disrespectful (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_American_mascot_controversy) to Native Americans (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_Americans_in_the_United_States), and changed the nickname to simply "Gold". An intensely negative reaction by students, faculty, alumni, and fans led to yet another series of votes, which eventually pitted "Golden Eagles" against "Hilltoppers". Respondents were told in advance that write-in votes for "Warriors" would not be tabulated, although those results were later released, and "Golden Eagles" was restored in June 2006.
TUSooner
9/19/2011, 09:59 AM
What a stale old issue. Maybe the hypersensitive PC whiners will one day just get tired of being... well, hypersensitive PC whiners. Once all the Native American names are gone, some of the native people might get nostalgic for them, under the rubric, "any publicity is better than no publicity." But I don't even care any more. It's all so silly.
lexsooner
9/19/2011, 10:09 AM
And they didn't do a 1940's Hollywood Injun chant.

What about having a Jewish crooner play their mascot and then appear on the Tonight show and throw a tomahawk onto the crotch of a human figure?
AlbqSooner
9/19/2011, 10:30 AM
North Dakota - Fighting Sioux...last I heard they couldn't get both Sioux tribes to agree and name will be changed..

True. I suggested they change the name to the Fighting Indigenous North Dakotans.
Tulsa_Fireman
9/19/2011, 11:31 AM
The North Dakota Aboriginal Americans!
Lott's Bandana
9/19/2011, 01:45 PM
The North Dakota Lakota


fun to say
NormanPride
9/19/2011, 02:12 PM
The only thing that chaps me is their ridiculous mascot. The horse is nice but historically inaccurate, and the white dude with red paint on his face is about as bad as it gets.
OUDoc
9/19/2011, 02:50 PM
My whole take on mascots has been they are a source of pride to the organization. If they made fun of their own mascot, I could see the bitching. "Fighting Irish" borders on this. I'm 1/2 Irish and I couldn't give two shots of whiskey about ND's nickname.
TUSooner
9/19/2011, 03:15 PM
My whole take on mascots has been they are a source of pride to the organization. If they made fun of their own mascot, I could see the bitching. "Fighting Irish" borders on this. I'm 1/2 Irish and I couldn't give two shots of whiskey about ND's nickname.

One of ND's feel-good self-promotion adverts made me chuckle the other day during the game. It was a rather long ad about this dark-skinned (North African, I think) Muslim professor at ND who was working for religious peace, understanding, and tolerance, etc. in the world. He said that's what he was "fighting" for, and then he finished by saying something like "I'm the Fighting Irish." There an almost zen-like incongruity because the guy was so very not-Irish. I just thought it was kinda neat that this African-ish guy would proudly identify himself as "Irish" (even though ND really has very little to do with Ireland any more.) I generally hate ND, but this was such a funny-strange thing that I liked it for about 2 seconds.

I guess you had to be there. :redface:
C&CDean
9/19/2011, 03:23 PM
One of ND's feel-good self-promotion adverts made me chuckle the other day during the game. It was a rather long ad about this dark-skinned (North African, I think) Muslim professor at ND who was working for religious peace, understanding, and tolerance, etc. in the world. He said that's what he was "fighting" for, and then he finished by saying something like "I'm the Fighting Irish." There an almost zen-like incongruity because the guy was so very not-Irish. I just thought it was kinda neat that this African-ish guy would proudly identify himself as "Irish" (even though ND really has very little to do with Ireland any more.) I generally hate ND, but this was such a funny-strange thing that I liked it for about 2 seconds.

I guess you had to be there. :redface:

Well the Irish were the first ******s in this country. Just sayin'.
TUSooner
9/19/2011, 03:30 PM
Can you say ****** on here? Oh my!!


:biggrin:
SoonerBK
9/19/2011, 03:50 PM
It would have been kind of funny if Sammy could have been the quarterback that got to scalp FSU.
SicEmBaylor
9/19/2011, 04:11 PM
What are you injuns getting so bent out of shape about? I'm not offended by Col. Reb(RIP).
Tulsa_Fireman
9/19/2011, 04:21 PM
Are you offended by skinny white people?
Breadburner
9/19/2011, 04:58 PM
You know how to make 500 indians say oh $hit at the same time.....???.....Yell Bingo....!!!!!!
MR2-Sooner86
9/20/2011, 11:01 AM
What I find funny about the "Indian name ban" was the school with the most Indians enrolled in a NCAA college was NSU, the school located at the headquarters of the second largest Indian tribe in the world and founded by said tribe. What was the name of the school's mascot? The Red Men.

Not
one
****ing
peep
from
anybody.

The NCAA didn't even go after them. Their president decided "it was best to do it" and their alumni, the town, faculty, and students were in an uproar over it.
GDC
9/20/2011, 12:42 PM
They are still the Redmen as far as most of us are concerned.
SicEmBaylor
9/20/2011, 12:54 PM
They are still the Redmen as far as most of us are concerned.

All 5 of you?
GDC
9/20/2011, 02:24 PM
All 5 of you?

Meaning Cherokees who attended NSU at some point, not to mention other tribes.
okie52
9/21/2011, 09:51 AM
Never heard so much BS. Indians, or Native Americans for the PC, overwhelmingly support Indian mascots.


A March 2001 Sports Illustrated poll asked Native Americans whether high school or college teams should stop using native mascots, and 81 percent said no. That number rose to 83 percent when Native American respondents were asked the same question about professional teams.

Most Indians in this state supported lil Red (that are old enough to remember). Only PC activists at OU got it killed (along with our then weak OU prez).