Have the dims offered up any kind of a plan?

[achiro]

I'll admit to not having the patience to listen to all the back and forth crap lately but I've not heard any plans coming out of the dims side? I've heard of several from the Repub side that get poo poo'd by the dims but thats it. I've also heard the dims say to raise the debt ceiling and raise taxes but no specifics. So are there any? Has the prez offered up anything at all? Is there any dim leadership at all in this thing or is the plan just to bash everything the republicans come up with, wait until the last minute and raise the ceiling anway?

[XingTheRubicon]

harry reid, et al have one.

it cuts a trillion from Iraq and Af over the next 10 years and basically does nothing, just barely worse than boehners.

[Barry's_Scowl]

I'll admit to not having the patience to listen to all the back and forth crap lately but I've not heard any plans coming out of the dims side? I've heard of several from the Repub side that get poo poo'd by the dims but thats it. I've also heard the dims say to raise the dept ceiling and raise taxes but no specifics. So are there any? Has the prez offered up anything at all? Is there any dim leadership at all in this thing or is the plan just to bash everything the republicans come up with, wait until the last minute and raise the ceiling anway?

Yes, they have. http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/25/us-usa-debt-democrats-idUSTRE76O53120110725 And they've met with Republicans more than halfway again and again. The problem is, every time they've moved to meet the GOP, the Republicans have moved back again.

Just so you know, calling Democrats "dims" or "dumbocrats" or calling Republicans "retardicans" or "republicant's" does not help any of your arguments, no matter what side you're on. It makes you look brainwashed.

[achiro]

Yes, they have. http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/25/us-usa-debt-democrats-idUSTRE76O53120110725 And they've met with Republicans more than halfway again and again. The problem is, every time they've moved to meet the GOP, the Republicans have moved back again.

Just so you know, calling Democrats "dims" or "dumbocrats" or calling Republicans "retardicans" or "republicant's" does not help any of your arguments, no matter what side you're on. It makes you look brainwashed.

So yesterday was the first time the dims unveiled a plan and you're saying the Repubs are the problem? gotcha.;)

[soonerloyal]

I don't know anything about a "dim" plan. I did a quick search using your term and ignoring the "dim sum in plano texas" links, there seems to be only RW message board posts like yours. Regarding "dept" ceilings, lots of links for insulation, tile, etc. You might be able to save some money since there seems to be some good bargain outlets out there. :)

Regarding the latest Democratic-suggested plan, 100% of the suggested cuts have been backed or suggested by the GOP. Yet now the Republicans are refusing to entertain any of the suggestions.

Posted for your ease of digestion:

$1.2 Trillion in Discretionary Spending Cuts. The $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts include both defense and non-defense spending. (Before Speaker Boehner broke off talks with the White House on Friday, he had already agreed to $1.2 trillion in discretionary spending cuts.)

$70 Billion in Mandatory Savings. The proposal includes $70 billion in mandatory savings that were negotiated by Democrats and Republicans participating in the negotiations led by Vice President Biden. These savings will not impact Medicare, Medicaid, or Social Security benefits in any way. The mandatory savings will include:

$40 billion in Program Integrity Savings. The proposal saves $40 billion by reducing fraud and abuse in mandatory programs. This includes: Continuing Disability Reviews and SSI redeterminations, Internal Revenue Service tax enforcement, health care fraud and abuse control, and Unemployment Insurance improper payment reviews.

$15 Billion In Spectrum Sales

$10 -15 Billion In Agricultural Reforms

Higher Education Program Reforms Whose Savings Go To Sustain The Pell Grant Program

$1 Trillion in Savings From Winding Down the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan will save $1 trillion. (Paul Ryan’s budget also included this savings in its deficit reduction calculation, which was supported by 235 House Republicans and 40 Senate Republicans.)

$400 Billion in Interest Savings. The package includes $400 billion in interest savings, $220 billion from the discretionary spending cuts and $180 billion from winding down the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. (Both the Ryan budget and the House Cut, Cap and Balance plan similarly included interest savings in their total calculation.)

Establishes Joint Congressional Committee to Find Future Savings. In addition to $2.7 trillion in concrete savings, the Senate package will establish a joint, bipartisan committee, made up of 12 members, to present options for future deficit reduction. The committee’s recommendations will be guaranteed an up-or-down Senate vote, without amendments, by the end of 2011.

[NormanPride]

Anyone find it sad that it's that easy to find over two trillion dollars in savings?

[bigfatjerk]

Anyone find it sad that it's that easy to find over two trillion dollars in savings?

It's probably easier to replace those with 5 more trillion in spending. I thought the republicans were horrible in 2007 like most people. But think about this when the dems took over in 2007 the debt was at 7.5 trillion. It's now closing in on 15 trillion in only 4 years. That's why the democrats look so freakin unbelievable.

[achiro]

Anyone find it sad that it's that easy to find over two trillion dollars in savings?

Yep and I'm sure there is a whole lot more that could be cut without anyone even noticing.
I heard Coburn interviewed and he said many of his suggested cuts were multiple payments for the same thing.

[Ike]

Anyone find it sad that it's that easy to find over two trillion dollars in savings?

When the savings is spread out over an arbitrary number of years, it shouldn't be too hard.

[sappstuf]

harry reid, et al have one.

it cuts a trillion from Iraq and Af over the next 10 years and basically does nothing, just barely worse than boehners.

But that trillion is already going to happen.. It is taking savings that were already planned for and acting like it is new.. It is not.

[pphilfran]

But that trillion is already going to happen.. It is taking savings that were already planned for and acting like it is new.. It is not.

I agree with you...you can't count something that was already in progress...wouldn't be surprised if the repubs use similar savings practices...

[GKeeper316]

harry reid, et al have one.

it cuts a trillion from Iraq and Af over the next 10 years and basically does nothing, just barely worse than boehners.

harry reid's plan conceded every single point the pubs wanted, and they still voted it down.

[soonerloyal]

harry reid's plan conceded every single point the pubs wanted, and they still voted it down.

Obama gives in to Republican demands - Republicans walk out in protest

Floyd Harden
7/25/2011 9:20 AM

In the midst of debt ceiling negotiations with the Republican leadership, President Obama has done an abrupt about-face and made major concessions, forcing Republicans to walk out on the talks in protest.

Shortly after today’s meeting came to an abrupt end, Speaker of the House John Boehner expressed his frustration with the President. “Look, if he’s going to just agree to everything we ask for, we’re never going to be able to find common ground. The American people aren’t stupid, you know. They understand that if the President gives us everything we want, we must not want enough. So now we have to start over and come up with some even nuttier demands that even he can’t go along with. When President Obama is ready to take these negotiations seriously, we’ll be ready to go back to ignoring him. Until then, the ball is in his court, unless he agrees that the ball is in his court, in which case the Republican Party hereby demands that he change the ball to a hockey puck.”

Senior White House officials confirmed that the President upset Republicans by agreeing to their demands that he tackle the deficit by gutting Social Security and Medicare, dismantling "Obamacare," slashing Education spending, and forcing babies to change their own diapers. Negotiations broke down for good when Republicans balked at the President’s suggestion that billionaires should be required to chew their own food. Obama quickly apologized and withdrew the suggestion, a move widely seen as a slap in the face to Boehner.

Minutes after the meeting broke up, President Obama, speaking to reporters in the White House press room, expressed his frustration with the direction talks have taken. “I can’t figure out what these folks want. I caved on every issue. I agreed to all of their cuts and I promised not to seek higher taxes. I ordered pizza for everybody, picked off the bell peppers for Cantor, waxed Boehner’s limo, ironed all of McConnell’s dress shirts, and what do I get for my trouble? They treat me like I’m their Secretary of Transportation. That’s it, I’m drawing a line in the sand. As soon as I finish vacuuming Paul Ryan’s office, I’m done compromising.”

http://pardonthepundit.com/default.aspx?id=144

[Partial Qualifier]

harry reid's plan conceded every single point the pubs wanted, and they still voted it down.

Yeah... that ol' Harry Reid, he's well known for reaching across the aisle and bipartisan efforts when dealing with fiscal issues :confused:

[soonerloyal]

Nice sidestep of the point, Partial. Smooth. *thumbs up*

[Partial Qualifier]

If you can't see the obvious flaw and the not-so-obvious issues in a statement like "harry reid's plan conceded every single point the pubs wanted, and they still voted it down", then I'm guessing you couldn't handle much more than a flippant wisecrack anyway.

[bigfatjerk]

I've yet to see a plan out there that really wants to lower debt and deficit and you actually do that by cutting spending and cutting government programs and selling government owned properties. That's what one does when they can't pay off their debts they don't keep collecting debt hoping a miracle happens.

[bigfatjerk]

harry reid's plan conceded every single point the pubs wanted, and they still voted it down.

If you seriously believe a democrat(or republican for that matter outside of the libertarian wing) wants to cut spending and wants to concede anything as far as gvt spending then you are one naive individual. The deficit and debt we've accumulated the last 4 years since Dems took control of both houses is astonishing. I used to say the same about republicans 8 years before that but really it makes the republicans look like they were saving money in those 8 years.

[GKeeper316]

If you seriously believe a democrat(or republican for that matter outside of the libertarian wing) wants to cut spending and wants to concede anything as far as gvt spending then you are one naive individual. The deficit and debt we've accumulated the last 4 years since Dems took control of both houses is astonishing. I used to say the same about republicans 8 years before that but really it makes the republicans look like they were saving money in those 8 years.

and even more naive if you think we just magically accumulated this debt while obama's been in office.

[bigfatjerk]

About 5 trillion of it or so. And about 1.2 or 1.3 of the deficit too.

[GKeeper316]

naw **** it i give up...

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Larry Kudlow calls Reid's plan as Republican-lite, with no new taxes and is encouraging the pubs to accept it. His concern is not default, but downgrading the credit rating for U.S.