30th anniversary of AIDS

[jkjsooner]

Since there's been so many gay threads around, I decided to add my own sorta gay thread...

A couple of weeks ago there was a lot of talk about the 30th anniversary of AIDS. I think this was dated back to the MMWR report from the CDC.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/june_5.htm

We're also coming up on the anniversary of the first report in the mainstream media - a NY Times article.

http://www.nytimes.com/1981/07/03/us/rare-cancer-seen-in-41-homosexuals.html

Anyway, for some reason I got fascinated on the subject - a subject I barely thought at the time other than being scared to use a public toilet. I don't think I even know of an outbreak of the mysterious disease until Rock Hudson got it.

There's a lot of interesting articles in the NY Times archives on it. From reading the articles, one thing was very clear. There was an assumption that if it was an infectious agent that a person would get sick very soon after being exposed to that agent. It was inconceivable that the period of dormancy could be approaching a decade. This lead many in the scientific community to believe it wasn't an infectious agent, if it was an infectious agent that it must be very difficult to transmit, that the infection rate was very low, etc. It's funny how so many researchers/doctors/scientists were led astray but this one simple assumption. They simply had no idea that when they first reported on the handful of cases that there were already tens of thousands infected.

There's also a very interesting Frontline documentary about the epidemic.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/aids/

The one thing I take away from all of this, and I'm sure this is going to be somewhat controversial, is that the minority of gays who were extremely sexually active in the '70s do deserve some blame. One negative to homosexuality is that there isn't the female controlling the rate of sexual promiscuity. If a gay person is so inclined, they can have sex with 15-20 guys a night and people were doing just that in the '70s. For 99.99% of straight men this simply is not an option.

I don't think this minority of gay men knew the risk they were putting society in and for that they deserve somewhat of a pass but let's face it, having sex with 15-20 random strangers a night (whether it be hetero or homo relations) is a recipe for an epidemiological disaster. Had it not been AIDS it would have probably been something else (and there was plenty of other diseases going around in this community as well). The same applies to IV drug users. Both are just a breeding ground for all sorts of nasty diseases.


Anyway, maybe someone will find these articles interesting. I love reading old articles with the benefit of hindsight.

[The]

http://s.myniceprofile.com/myspacepic/162/16299.gif

[StoopTroup]

Catchy thread title

[GKeeper316]

i remember when i first heard about aids... scary ****

its good to know that we've come so far in its treatment from the early days of the disease.

[Wishboned]

i remember when i first heard about aids... scary ****

its good to know that we've come so far in its treatment from the early days of the disease.

Even the possibility of a cure...

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2011/05/16/apparent-immunity-gene-cures-bay-area-man-of-aids/

[StoopTroup]

Just never have teh buttsecs when your man is on his period.

[jkjsooner]

Even the possibility of a cure...

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2011/05/16/apparent-immunity-gene-cures-bay-area-man-of-aids/

Yep, but there's a lot of work to do. They definitely can't give bone marrow transplants (event if they could find enough HIV immune donors) to all HIV positive people. It's too risky and way too costly.

But maybe the knowledge gained will lead to a realistic cure.

[jkjsooner]

Just one more thing from my post, I want to be clear that I am not blaming all gays nor do I think that anyone deserved to get AIDS.

One other point, the leaders of the blood industry and their accountants/attorneys deserve to be publicly executed.

This is why in some cases there needs to be no limit on legal liability. Some unethical companies will choose the bottom line over everything else and the only way to force them to think about their actions is the prospect that they might get sued to oblivion.

[Sooner_Tuf]

I have an idea. If the people that have it don't spread it around won't it die off with them?

[GKeeper316]

I have an idea. If the people that have it don't spread it around won't it die off with them?

unfortunately the majority of people in the world living with aids are in africa, and put more creedence to thier local tribal witch doctor instead of actual medical professionals and the witch doctors tell them stupid **** like having sex with a virgin will cure them.

[jkjsooner]

I have an idea. If the people that have it don't spread it around won't it die off with them?

What percent of HIV positive people know they are HIV positive?

There was actually a study led by a UNC team recently that showed that people on the antiretroviral cocktails are almost entirely noncontagious. The study was ended early because the results were so striking and statistically significant. The take-away from this is that people who are HIV positive should start taking their medications immediately instead of waiting for their t-cell count to go down to a certain level.

If you could identify those who have HIV and supply them the antiretroviral drugs you could start a decline in AIDS cases and start towards a path of ridding the world of HIV. The problem is that you will never be able to identify all of the HIV positive people.

[StoopTroup]

Isn't riding what spread the disease?

[jkjsooner]

Isn't riding what spread the disease?

:)

I thought I changed that before there were any responses.

[Turd_Ferguson]

I read that you can get aid's from a mosquito...I can't figure out how the hell somebody could **** a mosquito...

[soonercruiser]

i remember when i first heard about aids... scary ****

And it's still not scary???
No need to change behavior.....:rolleyes:

[StoopTroup]

I read that you can get aid's from a mosquito...I can't figure out how the hell somebody could **** a mosquito...

You have to get them really drunk

[yermom]

I read that you can get aid's from a mosquito...I can't figure out how the hell somebody could **** a mosquito...

you need a really small dick, and probably deserve to die anyway

[Blue]

tnGakbprjgE

[StoopTroup]

heh

[SunnySooner]

Wasn't there a Swiss flight attendant that was Patient Zero or something? Some guy that REALLY got around, and because of his occupation, he unknowingly spread the disease much faster than it would have spread if he had been, IDK, a farmer or whatever?

And nowadays, AIDS is kinda like just a chronic condition you have to take a bunch of meds for, like diabetes or rheumatoid arthritis. It seems like it's no longer a death sentence, it's completely treatable, just ask Magic.

[Mjcpr]

Happy Birthday you little bugger, you!

[Sooner_Tuf]

What percent of HIV positive people know they are HIV positive?

There was actually a study led by a UNC team recently that showed that people on the antiretroviral cocktails are almost entirely noncontagious. The study was ended early because the results were so striking and statistically significant. The take-away from this is that people who are HIV positive should start taking their medications immediately instead of waiting for their t-cell count to go down to a certain level.

If you could identify those who have HIV and supply them the antiretroviral drugs you could start a decline in AIDS cases and start towards a path of ridding the world of HIV. The problem is that you will never be able to identify all of the HIV positive people.

Maybe those people at risk could get tested and get their own drugs. Just like when I get sick.

The real American way would be to tax those people at risk to cover the cost.

[Chuck Bao]

Thanks for the articles, jkjsooner. I hadn't realized that it had been 30 years.

I lost so many friends and former lovers to this insidious disease. I can count at least 10 of them off the top of my head, probably more if I look back at some old pictures.

I do have survivor's guilt. It should have been me. When I came out and became sexually active, we knew to wear condoms. I suppose most of my friends didn't know that in time to save their lives.

At first, jkjsooner, I was going to criticize you seeming laying blame on the victims. You did explain it and I think it is right. A high degree of promiscuity comes with a high degree of health risks. That is a fact.

But, knowledge is a very important factor. I remember being out there on the street facing off against the Thai army in '92 as they had rigged the election after the '91 coup. In hindsight this saved millions of lives. The standoff between protesters and the army resulted in the palace interceding and my former boss, Anand Payarachon being appointed his first stint as compromise prime minister and he appointed his good friend Mechai Viravaidya as minister for tourism, information and AIDS. Yes, minister for tourism, information and AIDS.

Mechai immediately launched a huge AIDS awareness campaign. At that time, Thailand was predicted to be the next Africa in number of cases. It didn't happen thanks to Anand and Mechai and a timely coup. I have told both Anand and Mechai thank you because they really did save millions of lives.

Back then, getting tested for AIDS was a hard thing to do because it was basically a death sentence. I use to get regularly tested first in Hong Kong at an anonymous clinic and later at the Red Cross center in Bangkok.

Some of my friends lied to my face about positive tests even though it was pretty apparent that it wasn't just HIV+ but the HIV virus had already begun to wreck their immune system. Honestly, I don't blame them for that. I don't know what I would do.

One of the hardest things I had to deal with was my live-in boyfriend of two years tested positive. I tried to be supportive and I was rich back then and I took him to the finest hospitals in Thailand to immediately start any treatment to build his immunity system. The doctors did warn me that I was scaring the poor guy senseless and probably I did. To make a long story short, he was killed. I still don't think that AIDS was a factor in him getting murdered a year later.

That is all very ugly and unnecessary except getting a chance to vent and I am sorry for that.

In this 30 year anniversary thread, I just want to remember a few of my best friends who passed on.

Tom - PG painted his pic and I see that painting and remember him every day. I hate that Nope made me kick him out and he didn't have the courage to contact me again until he was dying.

Dr. Paisan - Brilliant man teaching at the leading medical school and a scientist. Fluent in English, German and his native language of Thai. Great wit and could pop off a few jokes while strapping on a harness and leave me as a deflated laughing fool.

Peter - Big accounting firm lawyer with a massive Hong Kong mid-levels apartment. He was my best friend and mentor when I came out. He actually could never admit to me what was happening to him. He claimed that he was just too ugly to be THAT promiscuous. I don't blame him. I am just sad that I wasn't there for him after I moved to Thailand.

[I Am Right]

Facts, just the Facts

[sappstuf]

I blame Reagan.....

[jkjsooner]

Chuck, thanks for your stories. I was insulated from the disease to a great extent but I know a lot of groups suffered tremendously. My wife used to work for a PR firm in DC and one day they had an AIDS rememberence and she came home talking about stories from some of the older employees who would literally go to a funeral every week. Until you hear stories like that it is really only numbers.

I came on a little strong in my first post. What I really wanted to say is that there are lessons to learn.


I blame Reagan.....

I don't know if you are serious or not but Reagan does deserve a lot of blame. I know that's almost like criticizing Jesus around here but Reagan made a huge mistake by ignoring AIDS.

By far, the biggest failure on the government's part was turning a blind eye to the growing crisis in the blood products. For three years they did nothing as 90% of hemophiliacs contracted AIDS.

While they did not know about the HIV virus, they had good statistical data on what groups are at most risk and also found a high correlation between people with AIDS and people with Hepatitis, which they could have screened for. It would have not bee perfect of course but would have severely reduced the probability of someone getting AIDS from blood products.

I can only imagine what would be said about Obama had he had such a devastating failure of leadership that lead to tens of thousands of deaths.

(sarcasm)Then again, I guess the blood banks are private industry and government has no businress in private industry. Afterall, wouldn't free markets favor those who do adequate testing?(/sarcasm) There might be some truth to that but obviously the free market failed miserably.

[Blue]

I can only imagine what would be said about Obama had he had such a devastating failure of leadership that lead to tens of thousands of deaths. Then again, I guess the blood banks are private industry and government has no businress in private industry...

OMG, STFU. It's called personal responsibility. Look into it.

[Mongo]

wrap it up. not that hard

[jkjsooner]

OMG, STFU. It's called personal responsibility. Look into it.

Holy crap! Are you saying hemophiliacs did not exercise a proper level of personal responsibility? Really?

I did say "tens of thousands" instead of hundreds of thousands because the statement you quoted was in reference to the failure to regulate the blood industry. Geez, that was even in the part you quoted.


wrap it up. not that hard

I don't think that stops the bleeding if your blood doesn't clot.

But, seriously, it took longer than it should have to determine that it was sexually transmissable because agencies like the CDC had had their funding so drastically cut. Might seem absurd now but originally many thought it was a response to some recreational drugs homosexuals were taking.

[Peach Fuzz]

War on drugs> war on AIDS :rolleyes:

[A Sooner in Texas]

Chuck, your remembrances of friends you've lost are heartbreaking. I haven't lost as many loved ones as you to AIDS but the ones I lost still leave an empty place in my heart. The one I think about most is Jim, an incredible artist and chef and one of the funniest persons I've known.

I saw the movie "Philadelphia" a week after I went to Jim's funeral in OKC. The scene when friends of Tom Hanks' character are singing "Mr. Sandman" started my crying, because Jim and I sang a lot together and that was our favorite.

Thank god for the advances that have been made against this cruel disease. It's pointless to cast blame; the best thing any of us can do is help educate other people - especially our children - how to protect themselves.

[olevetonahill]

wrap it up. not that hard

Dont **** Monkeys and it never would have got started.:rolleyes:

[yermom]

Dont **** Monkeys and it never would have got started.:rolleyes:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/lshawelu/THATSRACIST.gif

[olevetonahill]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v205/lshawelu/THATSRACIST.gif

Yea? so?:P :D

[SoCaliSooner]

I was happy when Pedro died. I'm more of a Puck fan.

[Blue]

I was happy when Pedro died. I'm more of a Puck fan.

It did give Judd a reason to live. That and that flat chested gook.

And I mean gook in the most non-racist way.

[yermom]

I was happy when Pedro died. I'm more of a Puck fan.

:O

[XingTheRubicon]

HBO's "and the Band Played On" was a 1993 documentary on the origin of AIDS. It was very, very interesting and frustrating as hell.

I still find it mesmerizing that Reagan didn't publicly even say the word AIDS until 1986. Didn't even say it. 12,000 US citizens had died, many of them from blood transfusions and he would not even say the word. Can you imagine, in this day and age, any president that could have 12,000 citizens die over a 5 year span and not even mention the disease? Not hating on Reagan, just really surprised by the anti-gay sentiment just 25 years ago.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0106273/

[SoCaliSooner]

I don't think it was just Reagan, it was most of America. Gays, bath houses, IV drug use, extreme promiscuity and gay pride parades featuring nudity and people having sex was what most people in America thought of....and rightfully so. It appeared that it was only affecting the population living the most recklessly. The dems and repubs in both houses weren't saying much either. The gay population wasn't quite a sympathetic bunch, and it wasn't until middle America was having kids with hemophilia and regular folks affected by blood transfusions, that it stopped being a "gay disease".

[pphilfran]

When I moved to Tyler in 1984 I lived in an apartment complex that had half the apartments rented to nurses...Tyler had two very large hospital complexes in town and a large cancer center north of the city...

The nurses were scared chitless of the virus...they wanted answers and they weren't getting many...

It opened my eyes...

[mgsooner]

I don't think it was just Reagan, it was most of America. Gays, bath houses, IV drug use, extreme promiscuity and gay pride parades featuring nudity and people having sex was what most people in America thought of....and rightfully so. It appeared that it was only affecting the population living the most recklessly. The dems and repubs in both houses weren't saying much either. The gay population wasn't quite a sympathetic bunch, and it wasn't until middle America was having kids with hemophilia and regular folks affected by blood transfusions, that it stopped being a "gay disease".

Ryan White changed everything.

[StoopTroup]

When I moved to Tyler in 1984 I lived in an apartment complex that had half the apartments rented to nurses...Tyler had two very large hospital complexes in town and a large cancer center north of the city...

The nurses were scared chitless of the virus...they wanted answers and they weren't getting many...

It opened my eyes...

My Father and I had lots of conversations about how Surgery and blood Transfusions and the effect of AIDS on just those two things had really piled on even more pressure/liability and overall panic right around 1982/1983. The moment a patient required a transfusion they had to get paperwork filled out so that the patient or Guardians understood the possibility of an infection. Then there was What the hell happens to your mind in the middle of a surgery if your gloves fail or you or someone in the unit got a squirt in the eye or you pricked your finger on an instrument? All of those "What ifs" really changed things. Then what if you had a patient that tested OK prior to surgery and later got AIDS?

The entire Medical Industry was changed in 2-3 years and the controversy in the News had Americans completely blaming the Gay Community.

If you were Gay...imagine if you were in a car wreck....would any Doctors help you? The answer of course was yes....but with all of the media attention...it probably wasn't to convincing to them.

[SoCaliSooner]

If you were Gay...imagine if you were in a car wreck....would any Doctors help you? The answer of course was yes....but with all of the media attention...it probably wasn't to convincing to them.

In all my years of working traffic collisions I've never really been able to guess sexual preference. It's not like two guys were unconscious but joined at the penis/anus.

"We have a 32 year old male in traumatic full arrest from a single occupant traffic collision with possible fractures to both legs, facial lacerations, abdominal swelling.....and he's homosexual based on our visual confirmation of patients spectacular dress shoes and sense of fashion"

[StoopTroup]

In all my years of working traffic collisions I've never really been able to guess sexual preference. It's not like two guys were unconscious but joined at the penis/anus.

"We have a 32 year old male in traumatic full arrest from a single occupant traffic collision with possible fractures to both legs, facial lacerations, abdominal swelling.....and he's homosexual based on our visual confirmation of patients spectacular dress shoes and sense of fashion"

Yeah....but I'm not talking about what was going on in your regimented head....

[SoCaliSooner]

Yeah....but I'm not talking about what was going on in your head....

I'll leave it to your Alice in Wonderland head to figure out how your perception of EMS differs from reality.

[StoopTroup]

I'll leave it to your Alice in Wonderland head to figure out how your perception of EMS differs from reality.

Your trained to protect yourself. It's pretty smart you follow the training you were given so you can transport people to the people trained to save lives. Good boy.

What were your MCAT Scores for your EMS application?

I always am amazed at how someone with $1500.00 worth of Emergency First Aid becomes a Brain Surgeon after 32 years.

[SoCaliSooner]

Your trained to protect yourself. It's pretty smart you follow the training you were given so you can transport people to the people trained to save lives. Good boy.

That's right, we push all kinds of meds intravenously, defib, start IV's and learn quite a bit about pharmacology and have to work in an ER doing rotations along side the docs. We practice "universal precautions" meaning we glove up and use the same precautions for every person as if they had the worst communicable diseases. That doesn't translate into diminished care. I transport HIV and AIDS patients all the time who are bleeding or who I have to start an IV on.

Take it from me G, drugs are bad...you can even check that out with your local life saver.

[StoopTroup]

That's right, we push all kinds of meds intravenously, defib, start IV's and learn quite a bit about pharmacology and have to work in an ER doing rotations along side the docs. We practice "universal precautions" meaning we glove up and use the same precautions for every person as if they had the worst communicable diseases. That doesn't translate into diminished care. I transport HIV and AIDS patients all the time who are bleeding or who I have to start an IV on.

Take it from me G, drugs are bad...you can even check that out with your local life saver.

You know....I bet most folks you're "Helping" are pretty relieved once they get to the Doctor.

BTW....My Statement about Gays and their thoughts were 1984-1985 thoughts. I really do understand how much the industry has changed as well as Gays have changed since they started letting you clean the toilets and work your way up to starting an IV.

Any idiot can run a Defib

[yermom]

what the hell are you talking about ST?

[StoopTroup]

Which Post?

[yermom]

yes.

[StoopTroup]

LMAO

Saving cats from trees.

7tzc-dB8Xuk

[StoopTroup]

6uS7zpzTx84

[Mongo]

hey Norm.... if you were a hot dog, would you eat yourself?


I would. I'd cover myself in mustard and relish. I'd be delicious

[StoopTroup]

A-8BYmkLXTY

[StoopTroup]

VklLG76_CCg

[SoonerofAlabama]

lOfZLb33uCg

[StoopTroup]

HOMVVuGvXBo

[Mjcpr]

Weird.

[StoopTroup]

Weird.

He must be drinking....

[SoonerofAlabama]

Which one was weird?

[SoCaliSooner]

I think I shall refer to ST as oxy moron.

[soonersponge]

Tom of Finland is excellent in his work. Just google him.

[SoCaliSooner]

Any idiot can run a Defib

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c285/fdmedictomc/firepics/5d911953.jpg
Sure....any AED is moron proof. It may or may not shock somebody in v-fib. It will go a maximum of 3 times and is meant to provide some assistance until trained ALS arrives. It runs about $1500





http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2009/03/090331-defrib-01.jpg

However we carry something with twelve leads and a monitor so we can read P, Q, R, S, and T waves so we can figure out 20-30 different things going on with your heart, transmit the data to the ER, and we have neat little paddles that we can adjust the juice on and shock a heart as many times as we want, I prefer extra crispy. It costs about $30,000.

[OutlandTrophy]

you might as well have posted a picture of a mid 90s Sony Walkman. He doesn't understand any of what you just posted.

http://images2.fanpop.com/images/photos/7900000/Walkman-the-90s-7963998-399-447.jpg

[StoopTroup]

Holy Smokes! 12 leads? Wow. That's a lot. I bet you wired your car stereo yourself too

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk136/nismoxero/nismo/PICT0023.jpg

[StoopTroup]

Outland and SoCali....

You guys win the SF 30 years of AIDS Award for 2011.

Congratulations!

http://bp2.blogger.com/_cXohXexKD4E/R8BGUOUsxzI/AAAAAAAAAhU/wQJG3XvfH9o/s400/bru-stev.jpg

[Thaumaturge]

It's too late for that, you'd know that much if you were saying what I think you saying. See for your self, check it later and you will.

NtSgWZbL_kE

20 years of republican rule can make a guy seem like its crazy, right, lol. But keep on stickin your finger in the air to try and figure which way the winds blowing. The rest of them might won't

[SicEmBaylor]

Magic Johnson is faking it.

[SoonerofAlabama]

I don't watch Family Guy, but I expected this thing to be on here:

TxamV-ii3yw&feature=related

[jkjsooner]

Magic Johnson is faking it.

Magic Johnson is one lucky guy. Had he caught it a few years earlier there's a good chance he's not alive today. It was still a death sentence when he first was diagnosed even if there were treatments to slow it down. As it was, plenty of people (event those with means like Arthur Ashe) died after Magic was diagnosed.

[stevo]

Weird.

major cpr is sooooooo judgmental

[Mongo]

major cpr is sooooooo judgmental

shut your AIDS face up. dont knock Pat

[stevo]

mongo is soooooooo mean

[Mongo]

its not my fault you have AIDS face

[stevo]

i've been called a lot worse

*cue the kids*

[SoonerofAlabama]

Is AIDS face anything like Herpes of the mouth?

[stevo]

eww. you people (and by "you people" I mean "you people") are worse than 2121. And that's bad.

[StoopTroup]

eww. you people (and by "you people" I mean "you people") are worse than 2121. And that's bad.

I guess you could go hang out at his message board then.

[Mongo]

eww. you people (and by "you people" I mean "you people") are worse than 2121. And that's bad.

AIDS face is joking, that 2121 reference was just flat out mean

[StoopTroup]

Very mean.

Ann Coulter>Stevo