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Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 05:04 PM
I am going to try to enlist your support for a transsexual professor at Southeastern Oklahoma State University in Durant. If you don't like that first sentence, then please quickly click on another thread.

Dr. Rachel Tudor is an assistant professor of English, Humanities and Literature at Southeastern for the past seven years and is an accomplished scholar. She has been denied tenure twice despite overwhelming support from the tenure recommendation committee.

If you an have time, please read the following link or just follow the link at the bottom of the page to go to the online petition. I thank all of you in advance.

http://www.bilerico.com/2011/04/oklahoma_english_prof_denied_tenure_at_public_coll .php?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=facebook&utm_campaign=F

Okay, the link to the online petition is the following.

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/help-rachel-tudor/

I just called my friend who teaches in the very same English, Humanities and Literature department at SOSU and she confirmed that the article is correct. She did confirm that Dr. Tudor has 100% support from the faculty and is popular with the students and she is prolific in writing for academic journals. You'd think that SOSU should want to keep her.

The problem is with the administration and they, themselves, cite religious problems with granting Dr. Tudor tenure.

Maybe if we reach the 1,000 petition goal and with the threat of a pending lawsuit will make them get over their religion.

Thanks again for your help.

yermom
4/26/2011, 05:09 PM
what does their religion have to do with hir tenure?

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 05:15 PM
what does their religion have to do with hir tenure?

Well, ya know Baptists. The thing is that SOSU is not like Baylor and certainly can't afford to pretend that it is, so yeah exactly.

Besides that, SOSU does get a lot of support from Oklahoma taxpayers.

The Maestro
4/26/2011, 05:19 PM
Okay, I am happy to support, but is it wrong if I am curious for before and after pics?

sooner59
4/26/2011, 05:27 PM
Okay, I am happy to support, but is it wrong if I am curious for before and after pics?

If you are curious for two different pics, doesn't that make you bi-curious?

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 05:27 PM
Thank you The Maestro and spek.

Exactly what before and after pics do you want to look at? I guess some people, maybe the more enlightened people, like to look at both. For me, not so much. I fall definitely on one side.

sooner59
4/26/2011, 05:28 PM
Oh, and Chuck, I signed it. Done and done.

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 05:41 PM
Oh, and Chuck, I signed it. Done and done.

You a good man and spek.

usmc-sooner
4/26/2011, 05:44 PM
I'd have religious problems too.

MsProudSooner2
4/26/2011, 05:53 PM
Good luck! I signed the petition.

OutlandTrophy
4/26/2011, 05:54 PM
who do we email to voice our support of ontinuing to deny the tenure?

TIA

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 05:55 PM
I'd have religious problems too.

Well, I am not going to discount your religious beliefs in any way, usmc-sooner, even though I do disagree with them. But for the admin of a state-owned and run university to state it like that is probably not a university proud, brightest of the bright moment for Southeastern, especially given the pending lawsuit.

Sooner5030
4/26/2011, 06:00 PM
I can support:

transexual professor

I cannot support:

-professor of English, Humanities and Literature
-tenure

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 06:00 PM
Good luck! I signed the petition.

Very much appreciate it, MsProudSooner2, and spek.

StoopTroup
4/26/2011, 06:05 PM
I can support:

transexual professor

I cannot support:

-professor of English, Humanities and Literature
-tenure

Why not? If it's because you don't support tenure at all....then I'd say just sign it and go fight that fight as a politician.

usmc-sooner
4/26/2011, 06:05 PM
I can understand gay but what the heck is transsexual. And if you think people in Durant are embarrassed by this, then you've probably never been to Durant.

Chuck I disagree with you on a lot of things but you never go crazy over it and I appreciate it. We can agree to disagree.

Mongo
4/26/2011, 06:08 PM
I can understand gay but what the heck is transsexual. And if you think people in Durant are embarrassed by this, then you've probably never been to Durant.

Chuck I disagree with you on a lot of things but you never go crazy over it and I appreciate it. We can agree to disagree.

you know how you tuck your dick when dudes nail you? it's alot like that

:D

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 06:10 PM
who do we email to voice our support of ontinuing to deny the tenure?

TIA

Alright to be fair, I have to tell you where to send an email not supporting tenure for Dr. Rachel Tudor at SOSU.

You have to send the email to:

http://bealonghorn.utexas.edu/

They may laughs, but just ignore it and feel good that you did your part.

usmc-sooner
4/26/2011, 06:10 PM
you know how you tuck your dick when dudes nail you? it's alot like that

:D

in and signed

oumartin
4/26/2011, 06:14 PM
Typically I would not support this but anything to stick to the baptists!

StoopTroup
4/26/2011, 06:17 PM
Alright to be fair, I have to tell you where to send an email not supporting tenure for Dr. Rachel Tudor at SOSU.

You have to send the email to:

http://bealonghorn.utexas.edu/

They may laughs, but just ignore it and feel good that you did your part.

He fits better there....lol:texan:

AlboSooner
4/26/2011, 06:19 PM
To me this is about her ability as a professor, and it appears there are no problems there. I don't agree with her changing genders, but I think it's wrong to hold that against her academic ability.

Signed. Will it do any good?

StoopTroup
4/26/2011, 06:20 PM
To me this is about her ability as a professor, and it appears there are no problems there. I don't agree with her changing genders, but I think it's wrong to hold that against her academic ability.

Signed. Will it do any good?

Can't hurt

usmc-sooner
4/26/2011, 06:23 PM
I thought these profs all taught at the University of North Texas.

StoopTroup
4/26/2011, 06:25 PM
I thought these profs all taught at the University of North Texas.

Nope....Dennis Rodman University

http://torontosportsnut.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/dennis_rodman.jpg

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 06:25 PM
I can support:

transexual professor

I cannot support:

-professor of English, Humanities and Literature
-tenure

That is pretty funny. When I studied at Southeastern, the English, Humanities and Literature department was widely known as the most liberal in the whole university. It is pretty amazing for Durant Oklahoma. Don't get me wrong. That department also had the very best professors in the university, in my opinion. I particularly appreciated Dr. Littlejohn and Dr. Sparks. Inexplicably, I wound up taking Dr. Littlejohn's graduate level class of advanced English grammar. Yeah, who knew?

Inexplicably, my college sweetheart and ex-girlfriend wound up teaching in that department for 20+ years. Yeah, who knew?

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 06:36 PM
I can understand gay but what the heck is transsexual. And if you think people in Durant are embarrassed by this, then you've probably never been to Durant.

Chuck I disagree with you on a lot of things but you never go crazy over it and I appreciate it. We can agree to disagree.

I have definitely been to Durant and they tell me I was born there. If you think they are embarrassed by this, well I am pretty sure more than a few of them have been around the block a time or two or maybe those were just my frat brothers.

And, I am not touching "what the heck is transsexual?" with a 10-foot pole unless I want to get baned here. Mongo's description confused me, but I am not going there either.

I very much do like the fact that we can agree to disagree. You da man! And, spek.

Midtowner
4/26/2011, 06:38 PM
It's shocking that the administration would be ruining this woman's career over antiquated religious hangups which have zero to do with her job performance. Maybe soon, there'll come a day when hillbillies stop being appointed to positions of power.

Mongo
4/26/2011, 06:38 PM
I thought these profs all taught at the University of North Texas.

they do!!!

Mongo
4/26/2011, 06:39 PM
I have definitely been to Durant and they tell me I was born there. If you think they are embarrassed by this, well I am pretty sure more than a few of them have been around the block a time or two or maybe those were just my frat brothers.

And, I am not touching "what the heck is transsexual?" with a 10-foot pole unless I want to get baned here. Mongo's description confused me, but I am not going there either.

I very much do like the fact that we can agree to disagree. You da man! And, spek.

my post confused me too, but it is just a dig at usmc

stoops the eternal pimp
4/26/2011, 06:41 PM
Im a current student at SOSU but have never seen this person...

Will report from on site tomorrow

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 06:41 PM
Typically I would not support this but anything to stick to the baptists!

Snicker. I know what you mean. And, I am Baptist, Buddhist Baptist but still Baptist. And, spek.

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 06:47 PM
To me this is about her ability as a professor, and it appears there are no problems there. I don't agree with her changing genders, but I think it's wrong to hold that against her academic ability.

Signed. Will it do any good?

My friend (read ex-girlie friend) said that it would. According to her, the university admin is really starting to feel the heat from the negative publicity. The additional pressure of the petition and, of course, the pending lawsuit may play a role too. I really don't know the chance of success of the lawsuit, but honestly I would never want to see my old school sued and money taken away from an already underfunded university.

You got my spek for signing the petition.

AlbqSooner
4/26/2011, 07:53 PM
I signed with the following comment:

"Heterosexual male who values excellence in education."

olevetonahill
4/26/2011, 08:06 PM
I signed it, just told em to quit being dooshes :D

Blue
4/26/2011, 08:11 PM
I suppose she'll want her/his own bathroom? Pfft.

AlbqSooner
4/26/2011, 08:18 PM
I am pretty sure she won't go to a certain McDonalds to use the bathroom.

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 08:18 PM
I thought these profs all taught at the University of North Texas.

I suppose so. They are supposed to have a very good music department. Maybe someone can coax GHP out to give his opinion.

I think UNT is the 3rd largest university in Texas with enrollment of something like 36,000 students.

Mongo
4/26/2011, 08:19 PM
I suppose so. They are supposed to have a very good music department. Maybe someone can coax GHP out to give his opinion.

I think UNT is the 3rd largest university in Texas with enrollment of something like 36,000 students.

yeah, and it sucks

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 08:23 PM
Nope....Dennis Rodman University

http://torontosportsnut.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/dennis_rodman.jpg

Heh! I guess I will have to change my resume now.

We were there at the same time. You could always tell Dennis from a mile off because he was so tall and his pants were too short. Now, he can afford pants that fit, while I can't.

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 08:28 PM
It's shocking that the administration would be ruining this woman's career over antiquated religious hangups which have zero to do with her job performance. Maybe soon, there'll come a day when hillbillies stop being appointed to positions of power.

Hillbillies, at least those from southeastern Oklahoma, ain't dumb. If there is a lawsuit, they'll get it. Otherwise, I'll just pretend to have skipped from high school to grad school.

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 08:35 PM
Im a current student at SOSU but have never seen this person...

Will report from on site tomorrow

Very interested in your report, STEP. I had no idea that you were studying there.

Are you taking any classes in the English, Humanities and Literature Department? My friend teaches composition.

DIB
4/26/2011, 08:40 PM
#514

proud gonzo
4/26/2011, 09:09 PM
I signed the petition.

My parents went to Southeastern.

Midtowner
4/26/2011, 09:26 PM
Hillbillies, at least those from southeastern Oklahoma, ain't dumb. If there is a lawsuit, they'll get it. Otherwise, I'll just pretend to have skipped from high school to grad school.

I wasn't commenting on the folks at your fine university. I was commenting on your administration. Our regional college administrative jobs, particularly top jobs go to some of the most undeserving people.

StoopTroup
4/26/2011, 09:41 PM
The Alums there are a very fun bunch of folks....

http://blog.piercingdot.com/celpics/dennis-rodman-and-his-facial-piercing_49.jpg

Chuck Bao
4/26/2011, 10:04 PM
The Alums there are a very fun bunch of folks....

http://blog.piercingdot.com/celpics/dennis-rodman-and-his-facial-piercing_49.jpg

Hey, we definitely are that and a bit more.

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 08:44 AM
Talked to a few of the English majors last night..Kind of the general consensus is that even though a lot of people are not fans of the transsexual side of it, they feel like she deserves equal treatment...The whole changing the rules in the middle of the situation makes the university look really bad.

As far as her teaching skills, nobody had anything bad to say...About all of the feedback was between "OK" to "really good"..Only spoke to 8 of them, but thats the general feeling I got.

Aldebaran
4/27/2011, 08:48 AM
In Dewrant, Oklahoma.

These are heady times, I tell ya. Things just haven't been the same since Naifehs burned down.

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 08:50 AM
Roma's is still standing though...mmmmm

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 08:50 AM
And Taco Casa

Aldebaran
4/27/2011, 08:51 AM
And Taco Casa

Then at least there is still a reason to live. And hope for the future.

I'm hungry for burritos now.

SoCaliSooner
4/27/2011, 09:05 AM
Then at least there is still a reason to live. And hope for the future.

I'm hungry for burritos now.

You mean man tacos?

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 09:06 AM
Then at least there is still a reason to live. And hope for the future.

I'm hungry for burritos now.

and 46 cent sweet tea

texaspokieokie
4/27/2011, 09:07 AM
and Salito's

Aldebaran
4/27/2011, 09:08 AM
You mean man tacos? :pop:

rekamrettuB
4/27/2011, 09:20 AM
In Dewrant, Oklahoma.

These are heady times, I tell ya. Things just haven't been the same since Naifehs burned down.

Naifeh's is back...and has been for quite sometime. It relocated to Cartwright after his place burned down towards the lake. Recently the Choctaws lured him to a building across from their casino/resort thing. Really nice place and same great food.

Taco Casa super sweet tea is currently 92 cent. Times are tough.

homerSimpsonsBrain
4/27/2011, 10:35 AM
...
Inexplicably, my college sweetheart and ex-girlfriend wound up teaching in that department for 20+ years. Yeah, who knew?

Normally this would not be confusing but I thought you were gay? Or maybe you mean 2 different people?


My friend (read ex-girlie friend) said that it would. According to her, ...

Now you're just ****ing with me. When you say "ex-girlie" do you mean she's now a he, or is this another former girlfriend?

The Buddhist-Baptists need to write a manual so the rest of us can keep up.





Just messin with ya chuck :)

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 10:38 AM
Taco Casa super sweet tea is currently 92 cent. Times are tough.

daggum boy...thats hiwayyy robbery..

C&CDean
4/27/2011, 10:39 AM
I don't GAS about this professor, but I will say that only fags drink the sweet tea.

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 10:40 AM
that makes me a little angry

http://www.thewheelfx.com/lane/GIFS/ALittleAngry.gif

olevetonahill
4/27/2011, 10:45 AM
I don't GAS about this professor, but I will say that only fags drink the sweet tea.

Once again, I agree with Dean

TheHumanAlphabet
4/27/2011, 10:45 AM
Chuck,

Outside of loss of job, would denial of tenure at SOSU be such a bad thing? Not sure if a person such as Dr. Tudor would want to be in Duuurant in the first place.

Best thing to happen to me was that Universities found me the #2 person and the #1/2 (depending on when you look) Forbes company in the world hired me. I am in a much more ideological location.

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 10:49 AM
Once again, I agree with Dean

http://www.thewheelfx.com/lane/GIFS/AngrySheep.jpg

olevetonahill
4/27/2011, 10:57 AM
http://www.thewheelfx.com/lane/GIFS/AngrySheep.jpg

That pic was taken in Stoolwater wernt it?

stoops the eternal pimp
4/27/2011, 11:01 AM
actually that picture was taken at lexington...some retiring postal worker was cut out of the back side of the pic due to this being a family board

Okla-homey
4/27/2011, 11:06 AM
Petition, schmetition. If this guy were smart, and also not interested in becoming a cause celebre in the cross-dressing community, he would resume wearing mens clothes, get his precious tenure, then go back to drag. After he gets tenure, he's bulletproof.

C&CDean
4/27/2011, 11:06 AM
See. Pics of my wife all over this board...

The Profit
4/27/2011, 11:32 AM
Petition signed with the comment, "our state has a sorry history of discrimination. It needs to end now!!!"

Chuck Bao
4/27/2011, 12:43 PM
Chuck,

Outside of loss of job, would denial of tenure at SOSU be such a bad thing? Not sure if a person such as Dr. Tudor would want to be in Duuurant in the first place.

Best thing to happen to me was that Universities found me the #2 person and the #1/2 (depending on when you look) Forbes company in the world hired me. I am in a much more ideological location.

Agree. I am surprised that Southeastern attracts and keeps some of the better quality professors. In my opinion, the English, Humanities and Literature department has the best professors in the university and they are widely known to be the most liberal and certainly not what you would expect in Duuurant Oklahoma.

I hope that Southeastern is able to convince her to stay after all of this.

proud gonzo
4/27/2011, 12:48 PM
My mom worked in the theater department at Southeastern--she was their costumer--and they won some national competitions.

My dad went there for the aviation school. At the time, it was one of the very few aviation programs in the country.

Chuck Bao
4/27/2011, 12:51 PM
Petition, schmetition. If this guy were smart, and also not interested in becoming a cause celebre in the cross-dressing community, he would resume wearing mens clothes, get his precious tenure, then go back to drag. After he gets tenure, he's bulletproof.

Well, I guess so, except for the fact that she had sex reassignment surgery something like four years ago.

I highly doubt that she wants to be a cause celebre and would rather quietly move on to a better university that pays better. It really hadn't caught the media's attention yet and I seriously hope that it doesn't for the negative press for Oklahoma and my alma mater.

Bourbon St Sooner
4/27/2011, 12:58 PM
I'd sign the petition but I'm not an OK resident anymore and not an alum of SOSU so I don't feel like I have a dog in that fight.

Hopefully the good folks there will judge her for her ability to do her job and not whether she used to have a dick or not.

Chuck Bao
4/27/2011, 01:01 PM
My mom worked in the theater department at Southeastern--she was their costumer--and they won some national competitions.

My dad went there for the aviation school. At the time, it was one of the very few aviation programs in the country.

When I went to school there, those were the two best programs. My dorm roommate came from Arizona for the aviation degree. Southeastern hosted the Summer Shakespeare Festival, which was really quite good. Also, the Southeastern debate team (largely English majors in sort of a pre-law plan) was ranked nationally.

sooner59
4/27/2011, 01:28 PM
Sweet tea is for closers.

okie52
4/27/2011, 02:40 PM
Petition signed with the comment, "our state has a sorry history of discrimination. It needs to end now!!!"

Hallelujah!!!

BOOMERBRADLEY
4/27/2011, 02:55 PM
SOSU Alum here.

Best thing I ever did was move the day after I graduated.


PS. Salitas sucks but we definitely hit up some Taco Casa back in the day. Also the Donut shop on main street around midnight is the place to be

Okla-homey
4/27/2011, 05:39 PM
Well, I guess so, except for the fact that she had sex reassignment surgery something like four years ago.

I highly doubt that she wants to be a cause celebre and would rather quietly move on to a better university that pays better. It really hadn't caught the media's attention yet and I seriously hope that it doesn't for the negative press for Oklahoma and my alma mater.

This particular human being has a "y" chromosome. Therefore, he is now, and will always be male, as a matter of genetic fact. If he commits a crime in Oklahoma and is sentenced to prison, he will be incarcerated in a mens prison. I checked out your link, and he looked like a man with a female haircut to me. If he had boobs installed, no problem. All he has to do is wear a loose shirt.

Therefore, all he has to do is put on mens clothes and get on with it. After he gets his tenure, he can put on a tinkerbell costume if he wants and no one can fire him.

We call that achieving your goal "the easy way." As in, utilizing the path of least resistance.

texaspokieokie
4/27/2011, 08:28 PM
ain't it too late for that now ??

proud gonzo
4/27/2011, 10:27 PM
When I went to school there, those were the two best programs. My dorm roommate came from Arizona for the aviation degree. Southeastern hosted the Summer Shakespeare Festival, which was really quite good. Also, the Southeastern debate team (largely English majors in sort of a pre-law plan) was ranked nationally.

what years were you there? I think they graduated around '74 maybe...

Chuck Bao
4/27/2011, 10:48 PM
what years were you there? I think they graduated around '74 maybe...

80-84

Midtowner
4/28/2011, 07:00 AM
We call that achieving your goal "the easy way." As in, utilizing the path of least resistance.

Sometimes the path of least resistance, while easier is not the moral thing to do. Sometimes, folks will tend to take a stand on principal.

It would have been easier for black students in the 1950s to simply not apply to the University of Alabama, but they did it because that was the right thing to do.

I'm sure there'll be some disagreement as to whether discrimination against transexuals is a civil rights issue, but from the transexual's point of view, I don't think it's a close question.

Okla-homey
4/28/2011, 08:36 AM
Sometimes the path of least resistance, while easier is not the moral thing to do. Sometimes, folks will tend to take a stand on principal.

It would have been easier for black students in the 1950s to simply not apply to the University of Alabama, but they did it because that was the right thing to do.

I'm sure there'll be some disagreement as to whether discrimination against transexuals is a civil rights issue, but from the transexual's point of view, I don't think it's a close question.

Apples and oranges. Blacks could not change their ethnicity in the 1950's when they sought admission to the Univerisity of Alabama.

OTOH, this man can wipe off the make-up and put on a damn pair of pants. If he wants to be a girl when he's not on the clock, that's fine.

yermom
4/28/2011, 01:39 PM
you know the difference between gender and sex, right?

i'm fairly sure this person is post-op from above posts, but i'm not going back to see where

i have no idea how such a person is treated in prison.

OutlandTrophy
4/28/2011, 02:11 PM
I don't know the difference in gender and sex other than I've never had gender with my wife.

Aldebaran
4/28/2011, 02:14 PM
OTOH, this man can wipe off the make-up and put on a damn pair of pants. If he wants to be a girl when he's not on the clock, that's fine.

Or, she can have the courage to be who she is IRregardless of someone's narrow view of gender identity and try for a little freedom.

Midtowner
4/28/2011, 02:35 PM
Apples and oranges. Blacks could not change their ethnicity in the 1950's when they sought admission to the Univerisity of Alabama.

OTOH, this man can wipe off the make-up and put on a damn pair of pants. If he wants to be a girl when he's not on the clock, that's fine.

1) She's post-op, so no, she can't change that. She has female parts. You can't fix that by putting on pants.

2) Your narrow view of gender identity is not shared by the vast majority of the psychological community. Gender identity disorder is real and gender reassignment surgery happens.

You are just wrong. She cannot change her gender. She's a woman. The comparison is valid.

TheHumanAlphabet
4/28/2011, 02:44 PM
1) She's post-op, so no, she can't change that. She has female parts. You can't fix that by putting on pants.
You are just wrong. She cannot change her gender. She's a woman. The comparison is valid.

Hope she doesn't try to go to the bathroom at McDonald's in Baltimore...

Okla-homey
4/28/2011, 06:02 PM
1) She's post-op, so no, she can't change that. She has female parts. You can't fix that by putting on pants.

What female parts couldn't be covered by mens clothes? Do his girl bolt-ons light-up or emit sounds or something?

2) Your narrow view of gender identity is not shared by the vast majority of the psychological community. Gender identity disorder is real and gender reassignment surgery happens.

Don't get me started. According to the DSM-IV(4th) "gender identity disorder" is a mental disorder. And it only became vogue to cut-up sufferers since the early 1980's. Before that, therapists used to help people get better without going under the knife to be converted into sideshow freaks.

You are just wrong. She cannot change her gender. She's a woman. The comparison is valid.

Sorry. He cannot change his gender. He was born male. After all, isn't that the common argument the LGB community uses when people assert they could be "healed" of homosexuality? "Born that way," etc. You can't have it both ways.

usmc-sooner
4/28/2011, 06:12 PM
I think when you start having surgery to lop off body parts or add body parts, then you have a mental disorder. If I cut my legs off to make me short and died my skin black because I felt like I was Gary Coleman trapped in my body, then you'd say I was crazy. But no if I say whack of my pecker and they drilled a ***** into me cause I say I'm a woman trapped in a man's body. I think that's crazier.

yermom
4/28/2011, 06:16 PM
Sorry. He cannot change his gender. He was born male. After all, isn't that the common argument the LGB community uses when people assert they could be "healed" of homosexuality? "Born that way," etc. You can't have it both ways.

so the DSM was a valid publication before the 1980s but magically is not now?

Midtowner
4/28/2011, 06:26 PM
Don't get me started. According to the DSM-IV(4th) "gender identity disorder" is a mental disorder. And it only became vogue to cut-up sufferers since the early 1980's. Before that, therapists used to help people get better without going under the knife to be converted into sideshow freaks.

So only treatments prior to the 1980s are acceptable in your book?

soonercruiser
4/28/2011, 07:38 PM
1) She's post-op, so no, she can't change that. She has female parts. You can't fix that by putting on pants.

2) Your narrow view of gender identity is not shared by the vast majority of the psychological community. Gender identity disorder is real and gender reassignment surgery happens.

You are just wrong. She cannot change her gender. She's a woman. The comparison is valid.

AH!
Professional proof that our society IS SICK!

soonercruiser
4/28/2011, 07:40 PM
So only treatments prior to the 1980s are acceptable in your book?

I'm sure the sex change surgery is covered by Obamacare.
After all - we are in the era of "Change".

yermom
4/28/2011, 08:03 PM
does Obamacare even pay for anything yet?

and our society is pretty far behind in dealing with such matters compared to other parts of the world, and even historically

Midtowner
4/28/2011, 10:42 PM
does Obamacare even pay for anything yet?

and our society is pretty far behind in dealing with such matters compared to other parts of the world, and even historically

Well, in Iran, they'd just kill her.

Some of the folks here wish we were more like Iran, apparently.

Gandalf_The_Grey
4/29/2011, 01:57 AM
Iran does a magnificent job keeping their left wing "dead" silent!

sooner59
4/29/2011, 02:13 AM
:thumbs down:

:embarassed:

:sad face:

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

**** everything that isn't republican!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-soonercruiser

PS: PT Cruisers are for closers...

Ctina
4/29/2011, 06:58 AM
Sorry. He cannot change his gender. He was born male. After all, isn't that the common argument the LGB community uses when people assert they could be "healed" of homosexuality? "Born that way," etc. You can't have it both ways.


DSM V is on it's way. It will probably update Gender Identity Disorder.

Sex is what you are born as genetically/parts wise. She was born male and has transitioned to female. Genetically yes, she is male.

Gender is what you identify as. She has probably felt she was female since she was a child.

Neither has any bearing on who you want touching your happy bits so your "Born that way" point is irrelevant.

It's 2011, catch up.

olevetonahill
4/29/2011, 08:00 AM
DSM V is on it's way. It will probably update Gender Identity Disorder.

Sex is what you are born as genetically/parts wise. She was born male and has transitioned to female. Genetically yes, she is male.

Gender is what you identify as. She has probably felt she was female since she was a child.

Neither has any bearing on who you want touching your happy bits so your "Born that way" point is irrelevant.

It's 2011, catch up.


I firmly believe that people who say this kinda crap are prolly under 30 and left leaning.

Those of us that are older really do have a hard time with change. Fer instance did you know that up until 1973 Homosexuality was commonly considered to be a Mental Illness?

Until the 80s EVERY home had ash trays for those who smoked whether or not those that lived there smoked or not?

The world is constantly changing, These things take time .

Ike
4/29/2011, 08:23 AM
Whether it is or is not a mental disorder really should have no bearing. There are lots of people with mental disorders who are still good at whatever it is that they do.

OCD is a mental disorder. I've known at least one high quality physicist that had OCD. Possibly more. Anorexia and Bulimia are mental disorders too. I think you'd be hard pressed to call those grounds for firing. Not all mental disorders are equal, nor do all of them cause one to cease being a functional, productive member of society.

OutlandTrophy
4/29/2011, 08:40 AM
I think the main question is: Should anyone receive tenure?

BOOMERBRADLEY
4/29/2011, 08:43 AM
I think the main question is: Should anyone receive tenure?

That's hardly the main question, but I think if the proper boards of trustees are on board with it I don't see why not

BOOMERBRADLEY
4/29/2011, 08:45 AM
The world is constantly changing, These things take time .

I can agree with this.

The creators of Southpark changed the meaning of the word "Fag" to those that ride Harley's or are just inconsiderate in general.

These things take time

olevetonahill
4/29/2011, 09:07 AM
Whether it is or is not a mental disorder really should have no bearing. There are lots of people with mental disorders who are still good at whatever it is that they do.

OCD is a mental disorder. I've known at least one high quality physicist that had OCD. Possibly more. Anorexia and Bulimia are mental disorders too. I think you'd be hard pressed to call those grounds for firing. Not all mental disorders are equal, nor do all of them cause one to cease being a functional, productive member of society.

Ike, Im not arguing one way or the other. Just saying that how we view things takes time to change. Some of us Older peeps seem to take a little longer on some things than others.

Personally i dont GAS if some one wants to walk around with bananas covering their body, It theirs they can do what they want. ;)

Midtowner
4/29/2011, 09:15 AM
AH!
Professional proof that our society IS SICK!

Give it about 20 years. Folks who believe as you do will be about as numerous and accepted as the KKK types are today. Of course, the thing about progress is that it tends to leave some folks behind.

Chuck Bao
4/29/2011, 01:05 PM
The petition is now up to 773 from all over the US and a few from overseas. The goal was 1,000 so we are getting there. Dr. Tudor's firing was finally picked up by the Advocate so I am hoping that we can reach the goal.

http://www.advocate.com/News/Daily_News/2011/04/28/Professor_Terminated_for_Being_Transgender/

Thank you to all of the posters here who signed the petition.

Ctina
4/29/2011, 04:17 PM
I firmly believe that people who say this kinda crap are prolly under 30 and left leaning.

Those of us that are older really do have a hard time with change. Fer instance did you know that up until 1973 Homosexuality was commonly considered to be a Mental Illness?

Until the 80s EVERY home had ash trays for those who smoked whether or not those that lived there smoked or not?

The world is constantly changing, These things take time .

I am left leaning although I don't really like either political party. Both are too busy trying to look good and blame the other side to actually try to accomplish anything. I am 37 so I'm neither a spring chicken or an old goat. ;)

As multiple attempts to teach my mother how to use her VCR and then DVR have shown me, yes it does take older folks a while to grasp new fangled ideas. Hence the education of the differences between sex, gender, and sexual orientation. Just doing my part for humanity.

OutlandTrophy
4/29/2011, 05:23 PM
has it been fired yet?

Okla-homey
4/29/2011, 05:47 PM
DSM V is on it's way. It will probably update Gender Identity Disorder.

Sex is what you are born as genetically/parts wise. She was born male and has transitioned to female. Genetically yes, she is male.

Gender is what you identify as. She has probably felt she was female since she was a child.

Neither has any bearing on who you want touching your happy bits so your "Born that way" point is irrelevant.

It's 2011, catch up.

I disagree. The fact is, when the DSM V comes out, it will probably be influenced by the LGBT lobby that worked hard to have homosexuality declared a healthy disposition and not a mental disorder in the 1970's.

You're confusing political correctness with science.

If people who get turned on by little kids, or poodles, or cadavers had a lobby, you might see those things taken off the mental disorder list too.

Look, I have no problem with people who choose and/or are born homosexual. I think they should be allowed to do whatever they want in the privacy of their homes and should be allowed to marry. But please, cut-it with the "gender is defined by the bearer" crap. It insults my intelligence.

And comparing this man's fight to those of blacks who strove to achieve equal rights in the 1950's and 1960's insults that struggle and those who died to achieve it.

StoopTroup
4/29/2011, 05:51 PM
DSM V is on it's way. It will probably update Gender Identity Disorder.

Sex is what you are born as genetically/parts wise. She was born male and has transitioned to female. Genetically yes, she is male.

Gender is what you identify as. She has probably felt she was female since she was a child.

Neither has any bearing on who you want touching your happy bits so your "Born that way" point is irrelevant.

It's 2011, and I'm working on growing up so I can reach Old Goat Status.

FIFY

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/29/2011, 05:56 PM
Look, I have no problem with people who choose and/or are born homosexual. I think they should be allowed to do whatever they want in the privacy of their homes and should be allowed to marry. But please, cut-it with the "gender is defined by the bearer" crap. It insults my intelligence.

And comparing this man's fight to those of blacks who strove to achieve equal rights in the 1950's and 1960's insults that struggle and those who died to achieve it.
Gender is defined by the bearer, gender has nothing to do with physical or biological characteristics. Sex is the biological and physical differences. But I strongly agree with your second statement.

Okla-homey
4/29/2011, 06:00 PM
Gender is defined by the bearer, gender has nothing to do with physical or biological characteristics. Sex is the biological and physical differences.

So, if that's true, does that mean I can check "female" on any government form because I feel like it that day? Or do I have to get bolt-ons first? A note from my shrink? Wear pantyhose? What exactly are the rules?

StoopTroup
4/29/2011, 06:13 PM
So, if that's true, does that mean I can check "female" on any government form because I feel like it that day? Or do I have to get bolt-ons first? A note from my shrink? Wear pantyhose? What exactly are the rules?

You need bolt-ons?

I'm really confused now. :D :pop:

yermom
4/29/2011, 06:37 PM
So, if that's true, does that mean I can check "female" on any government form because I feel like it that day? Or do I have to get bolt-ons first? A note from my shrink? Wear pantyhose? What exactly are the rules?

i think that's probably a valid question.

i mean, Quagmire in drag just to hang out in the women's bathroom doesn't sound that unlikely.

but the person in question isn't trying to run track as a woman, just teach English or whatever.

it's not like s/he is being let go for other reasons and pulling out some discrimination card, they are admitting that this is why they are denying tenure

StoopTroup
4/29/2011, 07:28 PM
Should McDonald put a Breakfast Burrito on the "I'm a Man Today" door and a Egg McMuffin on the "Hey I'm a lady today" door?

Ctina
4/29/2011, 07:45 PM
I disagree. The fact is, when the DSM V comes out, it will probably be influenced by the LGBT lobby that worked hard to have homosexuality declared a healthy disposition and not a mental disorder in the 1970's.

You're confusing political correctness with science.

If people who get turned on by little kids, or poodles, or cadavers had a lobby, you might see those things taken off the mental disorder list too.

Look, I have no problem with people who choose and/or are born homosexual. I think they should be allowed to do whatever they want in the privacy of their homes and should be allowed to marry. But please, cut-it with the "gender is defined by the bearer" crap. It insults my intelligence.

And comparing this man's fight to those of blacks who strove to achieve equal rights in the 1950's and 1960's insults that struggle and those who died to achieve it.

I wasn't the one to compare with the Civil Right's movement, but it does have shades of it. I'm sure there are plenty of gay and transgendered people who have been killed while just trying to live their lives and be treated equal. Or committed suicide because of abuse and people calling them "it" as has been done in this thread.

The Mental Health sciences are not a cut and dried thing. It isn't peer pressure or political correctness that made homosexuality change from a mental disorder so much as understanding what it is. Mental Health standards reflect what society accepts as normal. In some countries, homosexuality is still considered a sickness while in others, transgendered folks are legally protected and can legally change their gender. As long as no one else is being hurt by what someone likes to do in the bedroom or how they live their lives, I could not give less of a crap what they do. As long as they are good at their job, it should have no relevance.


FIFY

I'm a grown up as I plan to be. I'll leave the old goat status to you and Vet since you both wear it so well. :D




i mean, Quagmire in drag just to hang out in the women's bathroom doesn't sound that unlikely.



That's the problem with most things, some schmuck abuses the rights and privileges of others for their own selfish ends, fubar-ing it for the people who need it.

StoopTroup
4/29/2011, 07:50 PM
You better face it.....your destined to be an Old Goat unless you are gonna do a gender change or Congress passes a law that keeps you from having to join AARP.

The day I got my first letter from AARP for insurance....it kind of hit me....

Chuck Bao
4/29/2011, 09:56 PM
I disagree. The fact is, when the DSM V comes out, it will probably be influenced by the LGBT lobby that worked hard to have homosexuality declared a healthy disposition and not a mental disorder in the 1970's.

You're confusing political correctness with science.

If people who get turned on by little kids, or poodles, or cadavers had a lobby, you might see those things taken off the mental disorder list too.

Look, I have no problem with people who choose and/or are born homosexual. I think they should be allowed to do whatever they want in the privacy of their homes and should be allowed to marry. But please, cut-it with the "gender is defined by the bearer" crap. It insults my intelligence.

And comparing this man's fight to those of blacks who strove to achieve equal rights in the 1950's and 1960's insults that struggle and those who died to achieve it.

I am going to insult your intelligence, Homey. As they say in the intelligence community, bad intelligence is worse than no intelligence.

It is extremely offensive to continue to insist that homosexuality is a mental disorder, going against what experts in the mental health industry have been saying for the last 40-50 years. Gays can function well within our modern society and actually tend to be more educated and achieve a higher income than average. Is that due to a mental disorder?

I am no expert on mental disorders. Based on my very limited knowledge, a mental disorder connotes a mental illness that manifests in undesirable, self-destructive behavior in some form. I, for one, appreciate very much the recent advances in medical science and that many mental disorders can be overcome with new pharmaceutical products making sufferers functioning members of society again. However, there is not a straight pill and I highly doubt there will ever be one.

Speaking of self-destructive behavior, which do you think is least destructive: 1) conforming to society norms by marrying and raising a family even though it means living a lie, possible infidelity and being very unhappy and making everyone else in the family equally unhappy, or 2) being able to live a fulfilling life with your partner of choice? Truthfully, I have had several affairs with married men with children and I am ashamed. They were ashamed. Cheating is exactly the right word for it because everyone involved was cheated. I learned my lesson and that is the major reason why I decided that I didn’t have to conform to society pressure.

Why am I not surprised that you bring up child sexual abuse and bestiality in a thread about gays? That is just the normal talking point of people against gay rights, along with the standard “oh, I have gay friends”. It is disingenuous and stupid. It is akin to arguing that a straight man cannot gain custody of his daughter after divorce from his wife because he could rape the daughter. I am not even going to touch the idea that some guy could marry his pet iguana. What part of two consenting human adults happily living together is difficult to understand?

Have you ever considered the fact that the gay lobby is there because the need is there?

It is even dumber to not recognize the gay rights movement and it is indeed analogous to the suffrage movement and civil rights movement. For our resident historian, let me educate you. Gays have been persecuted throughout history and it continues today. Police entrapment is still common place. I have no words to describe how incredibly sad that is for everyone involved. If gays could just live openly, it wouldn’t be an issue.

Trying to define the importance of a rights movement in terms of bloodshed is probably not the right approach. I am not sure how many lives were lost in the women’s suffrage movement.

The Stonewall riots were a watershed point for gay rights in that the gays finally begun to fight back. The Stonewall riots were a series of spontaneous, violent demonstrations against a police raid that took place in the early morning hours of June 28, 1969 at the Stonewall Inn in Greenwich Village, New York City. The fight for equal rights for gays started from that police raid and it continues today.

StoopTroup
4/29/2011, 10:54 PM
I think Homey is right on some of this Chuck and not because of intelligence....it's because a good number of folks find our lives have become very difficult because of all of these societal changes we've had to endure in the last 30 years.

The political correctness, the hurt feelings, the idea that because we may not like certain things we are racist or a bigot or hateful. Many of us have sat here watching court case after court case try to straighten out every person's particular situation and since much of it hasn't gotten the attention that maybe the Gay, Lesbian, Bi and Transwhatever groups give it....we are crapping on their rights.

The Blacks and every minority in America have some sort of beef with our Country and the majority that live in it and we are all just trying to raise families. If we don't get it...how are we supposed to teach our kids what's right?

I remember getting a speeding ticket and arguing with the officer and being told "Ignorance of the law is no excuse son". These days....unless you watch Court TV or go get a law degree, there isn't anyway for most of us to quickly sort though it all. We must scan the room quickly and decide whether or not it's wise to speak. If someone we don't wish to hear from speaks and gets loud....we have security ask them to calm down and if they don't...they get tasered and then a law suit begins.

I swear.....it all has to get easier if we are going to make it in America.

Changing the law every five minutes because someone decides to make up a new fad is killing our Country.

We are either a Man or a Woman.

This BS about rights for people who mate with inanimate objects or alter themselves is ridiculous.

People can live openly.

Gays who thinks their rights are violated because they can't do something in a parade that is in bad taste are disruptors. The Gays and others like them do a lot to hurt their cause IMO.

Sometimes....I do not think many of them really know what the hell they really want...they just leave Home that day looking for someone to make them feel bad so they can blow it up into something and have another rule added to the rule book of things that no one knows or cares about.

America was created because of stupid rules. Now we sit around fighting for more and more stupid rules when all that really needs to take place is for people to get along. If they can't get along.....they should maybe find another Country that has Laws that are more to their liking.

So much of what we are supposed to be ashamed of is stuff that folks should be ashamed of. Keep your lifestyle in your bedroom. People used to be less vocal or opinionated about many of these things. IMO....if you do something that makes you feel shameful....it's not because I'm violating your rights....it's because I'm uncomfortable being around a bunch of folks who are different than me.

I was up on the Elk River taking our kids on a canoe trip and these folks blocked the river with their canoes and the rest of us couldn't get through or by them. Some of them started getting naked in front of our kids. We told them to cover up and get their **** together. They argued that we didn't have the right to mess up their good time. If we didn't want to see this stuff....we should have chose another river.

People are majorly ****ed up these days and they want rights for stuff they shouldn't have.

Everyone has enough rights.

This lady....if she's a good teacher and she's got the same qualifications and work record that everyone else has...she should get tenure. If we as a society aren't able to do it.....we should maybe make all of this even more simple. Get rid of tenure just like some folks want to get rid of Unions. I don't think it's the answer....but these lobbyists and specialty groups are out of control too.

This has all gotten out of hand IMO and the Gay Movement in America has become very militant.

yermom
4/29/2011, 11:01 PM
We are either a Man or a Woman.


all other values judgments aside, this is simply not true.

AlboSooner
4/29/2011, 11:04 PM
all other values judgments aside, this is simply not true.

In the western culture you can only be a man or a woman, but like you hinted, worldwide there have been third genders longer than the US has been a country.

yermom
4/29/2011, 11:05 PM
even in this country before the Puritans got a hold of it...

AlboSooner
4/29/2011, 11:08 PM
even in this country before the Puritans got a hold of it...

Great point. Forgot about that.

yermom
4/29/2011, 11:24 PM
this is what i'm referring to:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-Spirit

Chuck Bao
4/29/2011, 11:48 PM
I think Homey is right on some of this Chuck and not because of intelligence....it's because a good number of folks find our lives have become very difficult because of all of these societal changes we've had to endure in the last 30 years.

The political correctness, the hurt feelings, the idea that because we may not like certain things we are racist or a bigot or hateful. Many of us have sat here watching court case after court case try to straighten out every person's particular situation and since much of it hasn't gotten the attention that maybe the Gay, Lesbian, Bi and Transwhatever groups give it....we are crapping on their rights.

The Blacks and every minority in America have some sort of beef with our Country and the majority that live in it and we are all just trying to raise families. If we don't get it...how are we supposed to teach our kids what's right?

I remember getting a speeding ticket and arguing with the officer and being told "Ignorance of the law is no excuse son". These days....unless you watch Court TV or go get a law degree, there isn't anyway for most of us to quickly sort though it all. We must scan the room quickly and decide whether or not it's wise to speak. If someone we don't wish to hear from speaks and gets loud....we have security ask them to calm down and if they don't...they get tasered and then a law suit begins.

I swear.....it all has to get easier if we are going to make it in America.

Changing the law every five minutes because someone decides to make up a new fad is killing our Country.

We are either a Man or a Woman.

This BS about rights for people who mate with inanimate objects or alter themselves is ridiculous.

People can live openly.

Gays who thinks their rights are violated because they can't do something in a parade that is in bad taste are disruptors. The Gays and others like them do a lot to hurt their cause IMO.

Sometimes....I do not think many of them really know what the hell they really want...they just leave Home that day looking for someone to make them feel bad so they can blow it up into something and have another rule added to the rule book of things that no one knows or cares about.

America was created because of stupid rules. Now we sit around fighting for more and more stupid rules when all that really needs to take place is for people to get along. If they can't get along.....they should maybe find another Country that has Laws that are more to their liking.

So much of what we are supposed to be ashamed of is stuff that folks should be ashamed of. Keep your lifestyle in your bedroom. People used to be less vocal or opinionated about many of these things. IMO....if you do something that makes you feel shameful....it's not because I'm violating your rights....it's because I'm uncomfortable being around a bunch of folks who are different than me.

I was up on the Elk River taking our kids on a canoe trip and these folks blocked the river with their canoes and the rest of us couldn't get through or by them. Some of them started getting naked in front of our kids. We told them to cover up and get their **** together. They argued that we didn't have the right to mess up their good time. If we didn't want to see this stuff....we should have chose another river.

People are majorly ****ed up these days and they want rights for stuff they shouldn't have.

Everyone has enough rights.

This lady....if she's a good teacher and she's got the same qualifications and work record that everyone else has...she should get tenure. If we as a society aren't able to do it.....we should maybe make all of this even more simple. Get rid of tenure just like some folks want to get rid of Unions. I don't think it's the answer....but these lobbyists and specialty groups are out of control too.

This has all gotten out of hand IMO and the Gay Movement in America has become very militant.


I vote this as your worst post ever, StoopTroup. You really disappoint me because I do take it personal. How can I not take it personal when I can’t live in my country of birth with my life partner? Are you telling me that I am demanding rights that I shouldn’t have?

I mean…seriously? I suppose that there were many “good people” who felt bitter and shock about societal changes during the women’s suffrage movement cumulating in the 19th amendment to the Constitution in the 1910s and the civil rights movement in the 1950s. I am so sorry that you feel that your life has become very difficult because of societal changes over the last 30 years.

Why do you think people are more opinionated these days and willing to speak out? That’s called freedom. And, I assume that that is what we still stand for regardless of societal mores.

Exactly why do you think this has gotten out of hand and the queers in American have become “very militant”? Militant? What? If being militant is all about wearing a G-string in public and dancing around, I would have to disagree. I am very sorry to hear about your experience with nudity on a canoe trip, but I assume that those were straights, not queers.

Yeah, I get it. Shut the **** up, stay in the closet, keep it in the bedroom and we will get along just fine. Meanwhile, I am effectively exiled from my own country, so pardon me if I can’t agree and get all militant.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 01:48 AM
No...I don't think you do.

I'm saying it's creating a backlash.

I've got 2 kids. I'm confused by all of this ****. If I've confused and you and you are confused about how I feel.....how the hell are we supposed to teach these kids not to hate?

You aren't exiled. You could move here if you want. You fell in Love with someone who can't move here. It's not the first time in the History of the World. It might seem that way....but it's not.

I just think that what you may want isn't the same thing as some of these folks who are trying to marry their spouse they have lived with in this Country and they might not give a **** about your situation yet you may think they do.

Everybody has their own agenda and creating laws to meet everyone isn't helping us teach these kids. Kids are blunt as hell. They'd probably ask you some questions you'd be very uncomfortable to answer or address if you were to stand before them in an assembly for instance.

Hell.....we can't even get idiots like Fred Phelps to care about the feelings of the Parents and friends of fallen soldiers.

I really do feel for you as I know some things are difficult in your life. The one things I know is this....

None of them are my fault and I'll be damned if I am going to lay my head down at night feeling like I've said or done something wrong.

I've supported the Teachers fight to get tenure. I hope it works out as it would seem she is due Tenure.

The rest of this BS about gender is over-complicating the fight IMO.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 02:06 AM
Like some folks have said....things like this don't change quickly. You may want them to....but it just doesn't happen that way. It might take generations. Given that scenario....you don't like that. Then folks who will lose that fight in this generation become militant. The folks who don't care whether you get what you want make it tougher on you because of it and wall-laah.....you have a huge mess. Laws that don't make sense. hate groups on both sides of the issue and then people who could drink a few beers and enjoy life together are suddenly at odds.

Again....I hope the Teacher gets her Tenure.

CORNholio
4/30/2011, 04:05 AM
Of course, the thing about progress is that it tends to leave some folks behind.

You call it progress. I call it social decay.

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 05:11 AM
No...I don't think you do.

I'm saying it's creating a backlash.

I've got 2 kids. I'm confused by all of this ****. If I've confused and you and you are confused about how I feel.....how the hell are we supposed to teach these kids not to hate?

You aren't exiled. You could move here if you want. You fell in Love with someone who can't move here. It's not the first time in the History of the World. It might seem that way....but it's not.

I just think that what you may want isn't the same thing as some of these folks who are trying to marry their spouse they have lived with in this Country and they might not give a **** about your situation yet you may think they do.

Everybody has their own agenda and creating laws to meet everyone isn't helping us teach these kids. Kids are blunt as hell. They'd probably ask you some questions you'd be very uncomfortable to answer or address if you were to stand before them in an assembly for instance.

Hell.....we can't even get idiots like Fred Phelps to care about the feelings of the Parents and friends of fallen soldiers.

I really do feel for you as I know some things are difficult in your life. The one things I know is this....

None of them are my fault and I'll be damned if I am going to lay my head down at night feeling like I've said or done something wrong.

I've supported the Teachers fight to get tenure. I hope it works out as it would seem she is due Tenure.

The rest of this BS about gender is over-complicating the fight IMO.

Maybe it is creating a backlash. Maybe some people are confused and don’t know how to explain it to their kids. Well, that’s too bad. I am certain that some people said the very same thing after women’s suffrage and the civil rights movements.

My mom’s dad and mom were racists. That is a fact. My mom and dad definitely were not. That is a pretty quick change from one generation to the next.

I highly doubt that any amount of publicity or advertising will change anyone’s opinion. But if we can achieve acceptance in the next generation or the one following it, then it is worth every effort to take one small step at a time.

And I do realize, StoopTroup, that people don’t always get what they want and there is plenty of heartache and suffering in this world. But, I am stubborn enough to just keep fighting for what I think is fair. You can fault me on that, if you want.

Midtowner
4/30/2011, 08:36 AM
You call it progress. I call it social decay.

Okay, so what is the societal harm in treating transexuals, homosexuals, etc. the same as everyone else?

None that I can see. If you want to call it social decay, you need to illustrate the sort of social harm being caused.

OutlandTrophy
4/30/2011, 09:27 AM
I vote this as your worst post ever, StoopTroup. You really disappoint me because I do take it personal. How can I not take it personal when I can’t live in my country of birth with my life partner? Are you telling me that I am demanding rights that I shouldn’t have?


this makes no sense whatsoever. Exactly why can't you and Nope live together in the US of A?

SanJoaquinSooner
4/30/2011, 09:42 AM
this makes no sense whatsoever. Exactly why can't you and Nope live together in the US of A?



Nope doesn't qualify for a spousal visa because he is not a she.

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 10:11 AM
this makes no sense whatsoever. Exactly why can't you and Nope live together in the US of A?

Juan already answered for me.

I have to add that I was traumatized by rejection of a travel visa by the US embassy in Bangkok in a previous attempt. I just wanted a meet-the-family and do-you-think-you-can-live-here sort of thing.

Instead, the trip to the US embassy provided the only souvenir of what I thought would be a life-changing trip - a permanent stamp in my friend's passport of "VISA DENIED". I was treated like a leach on Thai society and one so worthless that I was incapable of finding another American to love me. My friend was automatically assumed to be a prostitute, who would ditch me the moment he arrived in either LA or SF.

Talk about feeling degraded.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 10:17 AM
I think Homey is right on some of this Chuck and not because of intelligence....it's because a good number of folks find our lives have become very difficult because of all of these societal changes we've had to endure in the last 30 years.
Your life has been made difficult because gays want equal rights?



The political correctness, the hurt feelings, the idea that because we may not like certain things we are racist or a bigot or hateful. Many of us have sat here watching court case after court case try to straighten out every person's particular situation and since much of it hasn't gotten the attention that maybe the Gay, Lesbian, Bi and Transwhatever groups give it....we are crapping on their rights.

What?



The Blacks and every minority in America have some sort of beef with our Country and the majority that live in it and we are all just trying to raise families. If we don't get it...how are we supposed to teach our kids what's right?
What?



I remember getting a speeding ticket and arguing with the officer and being told "Ignorance of the law is no excuse son". These days....unless you watch Court TV or go get a law degree, there isn't anyway for most of us to quickly sort though it all. We must scan the room quickly and decide whether or not it's wise to speak. If someone we don't wish to hear from speaks and gets loud....we have security ask them to calm down and if they don't...they get tasered and then a law suit begins.

What?



I swear.....it all has to get easier if we are going to make it in America.

Changing the law every five minutes because someone decides to make up a new fad is killing our Country.

We are either a Man or a Woman.

This BS about rights for people who mate with inanimate objects or alter themselves is ridiculous.

What? And no, you aren't either man or woman. Gender roles go further than just black or white.



People can live openly.

Gays who thinks their rights are violated because they can't do something in a parade that is in bad taste are disruptors. The Gays and others like them do a lot to hurt their cause IMO.

Sometimes....I do not think many of them really know what the hell they really want...they just leave Home that day looking for someone to make them feel bad so they can blow it up into something and have another rule added to the rule book of things that no one knows or cares about.

America was created because of stupid rules. Now we sit around fighting for more and more stupid rules when all that really needs to take place is for people to get along. If they can't get along.....they should maybe find another Country that has Laws that are more to their liking.

So much of what we are supposed to be ashamed of is stuff that folks should be ashamed of. Keep your lifestyle in your bedroom. People used to be less vocal or opinionated about many of these things. IMO....if you do something that makes you feel shameful....it's not because I'm violating your rights....it's because I'm uncomfortable being around a bunch of folks who are different than me.

I was up on the Elk River taking our kids on a canoe trip and these folks blocked the river with their canoes and the rest of us couldn't get through or by them. Some of them started getting naked in front of our kids. We told them to cover up and get their **** together. They argued that we didn't have the right to mess up their good time. If we didn't want to see this stuff....we should have chose another river.

What a sobstory, your kids saw someone naked! :eek: You think that anything that is different from what you think is normal should stay out of your sight? Everyone should just shut up and sit down, because you don't have any civil rights problems, they shouldn't either?





This has all gotten out of hand IMO and the Gay Movement in America has become very militant.
Yeah support our military amirite

Okla-homey
4/30/2011, 10:31 AM
IMHO, the bottom line on all this is as follows.

There are basically three kinds of American opinion/attitude on LGBT stuff : 1) people who refuse to tolerate it for various reasons that may include, but are not limited to, religious reasons, unreasonable fears, or personal prejudices of unknown or private origin; 2) people who are willing to tolerate it, and; 3) people who accept it as a healthy alternative lifestyle or acknowledged genetic predisposition.

I'm pretty much in the second group above. I also happen to believe that the younger you are, the more likely you are in the third group. The older or more ignorant you are, the more likely you're in the first group.

No doubt some might consider all this a gross oversimplification, but there it is.

Turd_Ferguson
4/30/2011, 11:15 AM
Your life has been made difficult because gays want equal rights?


What?


What?


What?


What? And no, you aren't either man or woman. Gender roles go further than just black or white.


What a sobstory, your kids saw someone naked! :eek: You think that anything that is different from what you think is normal should stay out of your sight? Everyone should just shut up and sit down, because you don't have any civil rights problems, they shouldn't either?


Yeah support our military amiriteWhat?

olevetonahill
4/30/2011, 11:21 AM
What?

HE SAID HES A DUMAS
Pay Tention

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 11:28 AM
Your life has been made difficult because gays want equal rights?


What?


What?


What?


What? And no, you aren't either man or woman. Gender roles go further than just black or white.


What a sobstory, your kids saw someone naked! :eek: You think that anything that is different from what you think is normal should stay out of your sight? Everyone should just shut up and sit down, because you don't have any civil rights problems, they shouldn't either?


Yeah support our military amirite

None of this was directed at you.....so STFU

Turd_Ferguson
4/30/2011, 11:33 AM
HE SAID HES A DUMAS
Pay TentionO.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 11:39 AM
None of this was directed at you.....so STFU
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_43FdVZkYqAU/TUyzSvIOyVI/AAAAAAAADPc/g2a0KzA60AI/s1600/obamam-lol-y-u-mad-tho.jpg

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 12:10 PM
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_43FdVZkYqAU/TUyzSvIOyVI/AAAAAAAADPc/g2a0KzA60AI/s1600/obamam-lol-y-u-mad-tho.jpg

I'm not mad.

Just think you shouldn't jump in on something Chuck and I are talking about.

He and I have met a few times and he knows exactly what I'm talking about and why.

You decided to jump into the conversation. I asked you to butt out.

If you can't do that....then I think you are a problem on this board.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 12:23 PM
I'm not mad.

Just think you shouldn't jump in on something Chuck and I are talking about.

He and I have met a few times and he knows exactly what I'm talking about and why.

You decided to jump into the conversation. I asked you to butt out.

If you can't do that....then I think you are a problem on this board.
Its called a message board bro, people might jump into your conversation. Thats kind of the idea

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 12:27 PM
Its called a message board bro, people might jump into your conversation. Thats kind of the idea

Yep. Chuck and I were messaging each other. You butted in with a bunch of nonsense that appears to be more of an attack of my post than a message.

I asked you to STFU and you think you have the right to continue to harass me about it.

You don't.

I asked you to quit and you continue to do it.

olevetonahill
4/30/2011, 12:27 PM
I was raised that if a Kid jumped into an adult conversation said Kid got the **** slapped out of em.;)

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 12:29 PM
I was raised that if a Kid jumped into an adult conversation said Kid got the **** slapped out of em.;)

Well....we all know we can't do that anymore.....we have to be nice and ask them to quit until their mommy or daddy puts them in time out.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 12:33 PM
Yep. Chuck and I were messaging each other. You butted in with a bunch of nonsense that appears to be more of an attack of my post than a message.

I asked you to STFU and you think you have the right to continue to harass me about it.

You don't.

I asked you to quit and you continue to do it.
Actually I did quit any posting about the discussion you and chuck were having. I'm sorry for butting into your conversation, carry on with your nonsensical close minded rants.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 12:33 PM
I was raised that if a Kid jumped into an adult conversation said Kid got the **** slapped out of em.;)
Me and Stooptroup are having a conversation please leave

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 12:37 PM
Actually I did quit any posting about the discussion you and chuck were having. I'm sorry for butting into your conversation, carry on with your nonsensical close minded rants.

We did.....it just wasn't here.

Which again proves that your description of nonsensical close minded rants only can be validated if you were able to have a conversation with people. You can't so we took the discussion elsewhere.

He and I have been talking about this **** for a long time.

You've been involved about 2 seconds and have made a conclusion that only an uneducated twit would make but that's OK....it's just a message board.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 12:40 PM
We did.....it just wasn't here.

Which again proves that your description of nonsensical close minded rants only can be validated if you were able to have a conversation with people. You can't so we took the discussion elsewhere.

He and I have been talking about this **** for a long time.

You've been involved about 2 seconds and have made a conclusion that only an uneducated twit would make but that's OK....it's just a message board.
I could hardly be expected to know you and him have had this discussion for a long time before, and for butting in I do apologize. But if you don't want people to respond, send it to him in a PM, don't put it in the thread :rolleyes:

olevetonahill
4/30/2011, 12:40 PM
Me and Stooptroup are having a conversation please leave

Ya best be keerful
http://leonardmanion.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Google-bitch-slap-300x226.jpg

olevetonahill
4/30/2011, 12:41 PM
Well....we all know we can't do that anymore.....we have to be nice and ask them to quit until their mommy or daddy puts them in time out.

Kids got the **** slapped outa em fer sassin their elders to.;)

AlboSooner
4/30/2011, 12:42 PM
http://cdn2.knowyourmeme.com/i/000/097/086/original/Vvvyx.jpg

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 12:43 PM
I could hardly be expected to know you and him have had this discussion for a long time before, and for butting in I do apologize. But if you don't want people to respond, send it to him in a PM, don't put it in the thread :rolleyes:

I'm not sure those are board rules but if you want them to be....I suggest you contact management about getting it changed.

I don't think it's to much to ask you to respect our conversation on the board about this.

AlboSooner
4/30/2011, 12:47 PM
haters gonna hate.

Thaumaturge
4/30/2011, 12:47 PM
I'm not sure those are board rules but if you want them to be....I suggest you contact management about getting it changed.

I don't think it's to much to ask you to respect our conversation on the board about this.

I must spread some Reputation around before giving it to StoopTroup again.

Approved!

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 12:54 PM
I'm not sure those are board rules but if you want them to be....I suggest you contact management about getting it changed.

I don't think it's to much to ask you to respect our conversation on the board about this.
Again, I didn't realize you were having a private conversation with Chuck. Make it more obvious next time

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 01:07 PM
Again, I didn't realize you were having a private conversation with Chuck. My bad.

If it was private....it would have been in a PM.

If you have a point here, make it......otherwise.....quit harassing me about it.

Chuck and I are fine about all of this and we've worked it out. You don't understand where we were coming from because you weren't a part of it.

Chuck can fight his own battles and he didn't ask you to analyze my post to him.

You should quit baiting me as that is harassment and is against board rules. I've asked you more than once now to let it go. If you need further explanation on this...I suggest you contact Board Management.

SanJoaquinSooner
4/30/2011, 01:12 PM
I always say "attack the argument, not the arguer."

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 01:17 PM
I always say "attack the argument, not the arguer."

He could have done that....instead he chose to take all that stuff I wrote and tear it down.

If he's got a viewpoint he should post about it like Homey did. This crap about not respecting each other's opinions and acting like it was a personal affront to you the reader when you weren't even involved in the conversation has made this board a real POS the last few weeks.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 01:29 PM
He could have done that....instead he chose to take all that stuff I wrote and tear it down.

If he's got a viewpoint he should post about it like Homey did. This crap about not respecting each other's opinions and acting like it was a personal affront to you the reader when you weren't even involved in the conversation has made this board a real POS the last few weeks.
The "what" was a point of confusion because some of the things you were saying genuinely didn't make sense.



The Blacks and every minority in America have some sort of beef with our Country and the majority that live in it and we are all just trying to raise families. If we don't get it...how are we supposed to teach our kids what's right?

The hell is that supposed to mean?

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 02:18 PM
The "what" was a point of confusion because some of the things you were saying genuinely didn't make sense.


More than once....I have explained to you that I have a conversation going with Chuck going on this somewhere else. We are friends and are working this out.

I don't owe you any explanations about my posts. I've told you as such.

I'll ask you again....to leave it alone.

TIA

ST

Gandalf_The_Grey
4/30/2011, 02:37 PM
That is horrible board etiquette, everyone knows if you want someone to leave it alone you say "I am going to have to ask you to stop posting in this thread."

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 02:40 PM
That is horrible board etiquette, everyone knows if you want someone to leave it alone you say "I am going to have to ask you to stop posting in this thread."

Thanks bubbles....:D

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 02:41 PM
The "what" was a point of confusion because some of the things you were saying genuinely didn't make sense.


I am going to have to ask you to stop posting in this thread.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 02:42 PM
That is horrible board etiquette, everyone knows if you want someone to leave it alone you say "I am going to have to ask you to stop posting in this thread."

Of course this isn't my thread....:D

Collier11
4/30/2011, 04:08 PM
People being held back for being different is no different than those who are different and beg for undeserved attention, I dont see the fairness in this

Ctina
4/30/2011, 04:24 PM
I didn't understand half those posts either. If you having a conversation on a public message board, why would you be annoyed when people jump in?


Anyway, about what to teach your children: That there are many people in the world who are different from your family. If they are not hurting other people (as in physically or by taking things that belong to others, injuring someone's "sensibilities" doesn't count) and as long as their love lives involve consenting adults, it's no one's business how they live their lives. They should not be treated as second class citizens.

I don't know why that's so difficult to grasp. If you don't like the way other people conduct their lives, move on with your own life since it doesn't involve you, but they have every right to live as they see fit.

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 04:46 PM
Thanks guys for lightening the mood of the thread and continually bumping it. Yeah, ya'll have added a couple of pages since I posted some pretty stupid personal stuff and nobody is going to go back and read that stuff now. Thanks. I do appreciate it.

Particularly, I want to thank SouthCarolinaSooner and StoopTroup for working together to create posts that seem antagonistic but really aren't. Alright, I let the cat out of the bag. Anyway, most excellent job, fellas.

Oh and SouthCarolinaSooner, don't you dare think that you have an in on StoopTroup. Hands off, he's mine. I called dibs first. You may not know that we are close. Well, maybe not close enough in terms of body parts geographically, but hell I am still trying.

If anyone thinks that I am just being sarcastic, you'd be wrong. StoopTroup will confirm that. He knows that I love him.

By the way, the petition is now up to #972 and still climbing. For all of you that signed the petition, thanks. For those of you who haven't yet, click on the first post of this thread and click on the second link.

OutlandTrophy
4/30/2011, 04:49 PM
just think, there are 4 million people in Oklahoma and less than 1,000 people have signed this petition.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 04:51 PM
I love you too Honey Bunny. :D


Thanks guys for lightening the mood of the thread and continually bumping it. Yeah, ya'll have added a couple of pages since I posted some pretty stupid personal stuff and nobody is going to go back and read that stuff now. Thanks. I do appreciate it.

Particularly, I want to thank SouthCarolinaSooner and StoopTroup for working together to create posts that seem antagonistic but really aren't. Alright, I let the cat out of the bag. Anyway, most excellent job, fellas.

Oh and SouthCarolinaSooner, don't you dare think that you have an in on StoopTroup. Hands off, he's mine. I called dibs first. You may not know that we are close. Well, maybe not close enough in terms of body parts geographically, but hell I am still trying.

If anyone thinks that I am just being sarcastic, you'd be wrong. StoopTroup will confirm that. He knows that I love him.

By the way, the petition is now up to #972 and still climbing. For all of you that signed the petition, thanks. For those of you who haven't yet, click on the first post of this thread and click on the second link.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 04:58 PM
just think, there are 4 million people in Oklahoma and less than 1,000 people have signed this petition.

I think the thing that is most important is how many does she need and how many of them are registered voters.

I'm pretty sure there are way less than 4 million registered voters.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 05:11 PM
Oh and SouthCarolinaSooner, don't you dare think that you have an in on StoopTroup. Hands off, he's mine. I called dibs first.

StoopTroup He knows that I love him.



I'm eating hotlinks in ur honor tonight. :pop:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_ouIk9GkMis8/SO--WWBlmUI/AAAAAAAABLM/BuM5kkPBoJg/s400/Hot_Link_Dog.gif

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 05:13 PM
just think, there are 4 million people in Oklahoma and less than 1,000 people have signed this petition.

Good point. The initial goal of the online petition drive was 1,000, but that does seem less than ambitious. Most of those signing the petition live outside Oklahoma.

My influential friends haven't signed it but I made sure that they do know about it. I guess influential people don't sign their names to online petitions. I assume that they want to keep this as quiet as possible to keep it from turning into such negative press for SOSU and they will work behind the scene to fix it. So yeah, I may have done a very bad thing in bringing up the issue here.

I do have faith. I will still keep you updated on whether Dr. Tudor is fired in May or not.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 05:38 PM
I'd also like to mention this....

The way my words came out last night is certainly not my true spirit.

http://www.thelostogle.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/sally-kern.jpg

DIB
4/30/2011, 06:31 PM
I'd also like to mention this....

The way my words came out last night is certainly not my true spirit.

http://www.thelostogle.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/sally-kern.jpg

I know what you were trying to say, but you came across as a little crazy, last night. There are definitely those in the gay and lesbian community that could be considered "militant" or "in your face", but I would argue that they are a vocal minority. The vast majority would just like to have the rights of straight couples and live a normal life. I just don't see how what gays and lesbians do has any affect on me. Expanding rights doesn't hurt this country, only restricting them does. In a situation where the rights of an individual does not infringe on the rights of others, the government should always err on the side of individual rights.

SouthCarolinaSooner
4/30/2011, 06:39 PM
Doesn't supporting our military include supporting our gay militants as well?

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_vJJWmzKz0Gw/SnkWjya4K5I/AAAAAAAACW8/-rDxrs7-ZDk/s400/Gay+Flag+Planting.jpg

But DIB you're wrong. We (by we i mean they) have too many rights. Just the other day i was with my children saw two gay moslems making out in public!!! Chest hair, beards and turbans were all touching! That stuff needs to stay in the bedroom and deep in the closet, they dont need to push their views on me Gays (and others like them) don't have the same preferences as me, so they should be legally restricted so they don't influence my children and also give them the gay disease.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 06:47 PM
I know what you were trying to say, but you came across as a little crazy, last night. There are definitely those in the gay and lesbian community that could be considered "militant" or "in your face", but I would argue that they are a vocal minority. The vast majority would just like to have the rights of straight couples and live a normal life. I just don't see how what gays and lesbians do has any affect on me. Expanding rights doesn't hurt this country, only restricting them does. In a situation where the rights of an individual does not infringe on the rights of others, the government should always err on the side of individual rights.

You realize it was Friday night right?

You realize we are all crazy right?

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 06:48 PM
DIB.....

BTW....I'd like to remind you....

It's Saturday Night.

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 07:34 PM
DIB.....

BTW....I'd like to remind you....

It's Saturday Night.


You are not even going to say "brace yourself", StoopTroup?

I did talk to a faculty member in the department a second ago and she said that no announcement has been made yet. Dr. Tudor's contract expires at the end of May, so if there is a reversal in the tenure decision that it will have to come before then.

She said that Dr. Tudor seems to be handling it very well and probably will stay if tenure is offered. That is very good news. She also believes, like I do, that the university has clamped down on the news for now because it does not want the negative publicity.

If Dr. Tudor is not granted tenure, I swear right here and now that I will rain down fire and brimstone on those Baptists there. I swear to bring as much negative publicity to it as I can. I know that other alumni have promised to boycott the university.

In other news from Southeastern, my favorite economics professor is retiring and his retirement party is on Monday. I will have to email him and tell him how much he meant to me and that I actually became an economist. Southeastern does have some great teachers and does offer very good value for the money.

StoopTroup
4/30/2011, 09:41 PM
Holy Smokes.....

They better give her tenure.

It will be a lot less painful than the anal penetration thing. I swear that is extremely uncomfortable if your lover is angry....

Right DIB?

Sooner_Tuf
4/30/2011, 09:57 PM
I feel like I have just read the cliff notes for Brokeback Mountain.


Oh Good Luck to the Doctor and the Thai Boy in their respective fights. I hope it all ends well for all involved.

DIB
4/30/2011, 10:02 PM
Holy Smokes.....

They better give her tenure.

It will be a lot less painful than the anal penetration thing. I swear that is extremely uncomfortable if your lover is angry....

Right DIB?

It might be painful, but your mom likes the strap-on, so I let her do it on her birthday.

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 10:19 PM
I feel like I have just read the cliff notes for Brokeback Mountain.


Oh Good Luck to the Doctor and the Thai Boy in their respective fights. I hope it all ends well for all involved.

Thanks Sooner_Tuf, I hope so too and spek.

Nope is NOT a Thai boy. I need to clarify that before someone gets the wrong impression. He is almost 40. He reminded me this morning that we have been together for 9 years. I hadn't realized that it had been that long.

Anyway, it is not in your best interest to EVER call him "boy". Trust me on that. He is pretty mean and has a chip on his shoulder and he will fight. He was competing in body building contests when I first met him and he still works out for 2 hours every morning (without that chemical mess that he was into). I can fight back, but he probably (okay certainly) just lets me win.

Chuck Bao
4/30/2011, 10:24 PM
It might be painful, but your mom likes the strap-on, so I let her do it on her birthday.

Oh come on DIB, don't gay up this perfectly good thread. I ain't giving you any pos spek.

sanantoniosooner
4/30/2011, 10:24 PM
You aren't a man until you hit 40.

SoonerBread
4/30/2011, 11:11 PM
Typically I would not support this but anything to stick to the baptists!

Oh, those evil Baptists.

This Baptist cares none about her individual sexual orientation/perception. If the professor is on point, and the university backs him/er up, good enough for me.

Signed...

Chuck Bao
5/1/2011, 12:05 AM
Oh, those evil Baptists.

This Baptist cares none about her individual sexual orientation/perception. If the professor is on point, and the university backs him/er up, good enough for me.

Signed...

I'm Baptist too - with a Buddhist flair. I wasn't just picking on the Baptists, but that very stupid admin guy said that his Baptist beliefs didn't allow him to grant tenure. I would love to see the two of them get into a debate. He probably couldn't find the jawbone of his *** until he got to the Samson and Philistines story.

Sooner_Tuf
5/1/2011, 03:36 PM
Thanks Sooner_Tuf, I hope so too and spek.

Nope is NOT a Thai boy. I need to clarify that before someone gets the wrong impression. He is almost 40. He reminded me this morning that we have been together for 9 years. I hadn't realized that it had been that long.

No disrespect meant.


Anyway, it is not in your best interest to EVER call him "boy". Trust me on that. He is pretty mean and has a chip on his shoulder and he will fight. He was competing in body building contests when I first met him and he still works out for 2 hours every morning (without that chemical mess that he was into). I can fight back, but he probably (okay certainly) just lets me win.

Yeah, yeah, yeah I saw "The Hangover" :D For more than thirty five years I have trained using John Browning's P35 program. While not as physically demanding as P90x, after a long military career and working on five continents I'm still here. I think I will be OK. But thanks for the advice on my personal safety.

stoopified
5/1/2011, 04:39 PM
Inexplicably, my college sweetheart and ex-girlfriend wound up teaching in that department for 20+ years. Yeah, who knew?Well on the bright side they apparently got along well,working together for 20+ years. :D

Chuck Bao
5/3/2011, 01:30 PM
This issue seems to have completely dropped off the radar with all of the important news coming out recently. But, I was very happy to see that the number of people signing the online petition is now up to 1,268, exceeding the initial 1,000 goal.

I'm told that she was very impressed about the man in Thailand who has taken up her cause. I want to take her out for a beer or a glass of wine and a meal the next time I am home.

Anyway, it isn't just her cause but academic freedom, the reputation of my alma mater, the impact on previous graduates and current students, as well as the principle that a university, even a teaching college like SOSU, should be about higher learning, not a trade school.

Thanks again to everyone signing the petition (first post - second link).

Mongo
5/3/2011, 01:43 PM
I dont know if anyone has asked, but, is she hawt?

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 09:49 AM
The latest word that I heard is that there will NOT be any negotiations of either extending her contract or offering tenure.

I am now looking for options on raining down fire on the admin of my old university.

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 09:53 AM
Good Luck Chuck.

sanantoniosooner
5/7/2011, 09:58 AM
Maybe AAMCO will sponsor a campaign.

Okla-homey
5/7/2011, 03:06 PM
Happy to hear at least one public institution of higher learning has the cajones to stick to its guns. My understanding of the law is that decisions to grant tenure or extend contracts are totally at the discretion of the college - as long as the applicant's race, national origin or religion aren't imputed.

Perhaps this professor should just move on. It's pretty clear he's not welcome. If he's the shizz folks here say he is*, surely he can get a sweet gig at some more "enlightened" college or university.

And another thing. Any attempt to "rain fire down" on SOSU will very likely have the opposite effect. There are a lot more folks who will be happy about what the administration did, then those who are disappointed. And if this became a national story, I'm pretty sure $$$ would roll in from all over in support of good ol' SOSU.

* apparently, some of this aggrieved professor's former students have weighed-in on the link Chuck posted and have opined the guy is a crappy teacher.


I personally agree. Being in her class she has shown that she isn't capable of handling the teaching of English. She went as far as to let a student write an essay like a Freshman in high school. You ignore the facts that you're going on Dr. Tudor's bias alone. You are going on what she has assumed to be the reason for her dismissal. In 2007 when the change of gender was announced to the school the University would have dismissed her within a year if this had anything to do with her trans-gender choice. HOWEVER we are now in the year 2011, 4 years of her working at the school since that decision. She may have all the "paper" qualifications, and may look good on paper. However, in a real life experience she is not capable of being a efficient teacher. Allowing students to slide with inferior writing styles and techniques and setting them up for failure as they are too ignorant of English themselves.

Midtowner
5/7/2011, 03:11 PM
Happy to hear at least one public institution of higher learning has the cajones to stick to its guns. My understanding of the law is that decisions to grant tenure or extend contracts are totally at the discretion of the college - as long as the applicant's race, national origin or religion aren't imputed.

Perhaps this professor should just move on. It's pretty clear he's not welcome. If he's the shizz folks here say he is, surely he can get a sweet gig at some more "enlightened" college or university.

And another thing. Any attempt to "rain fire down" on SOSU will very likely have the opposite effect. There are a lot more folks who will be happy about what the administration did, then those who are disappointed. And if this became a national story, I'm pretty sure $$$ would roll in from all over in support of good ol' SOSU.

Forty years ago, you'd be able to say the same about a black prof who was let go. Because something is popular doesn't make it right.

Okla-homey
5/7/2011, 03:20 PM
Forty years ago, you'd be able to say the same about a black prof who was let go. Because something is popular doesn't make it right.

It seems there's much more to the story. It would seem that also at issue is the fact the guy is a crappy teacher. Read some of the posts on Chuck's link by his former students. I pasted in one above. The kids make sense. If it was about his suffering from "gender identity disorder," they would have fired him when he came out in 2007.

If one would presume to become a cause-celebre, one must first make sure one's house is in order.

sanantoniosooner
5/7/2011, 03:55 PM
This dude/chick may or may not be a good or crappy teacher.

Trusting student reviews of teachers is about as stupid as it gets though. I've personally had many teachers that were negatively rated but were awesome teachers and then had some go the other way too.

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 04:53 PM
Happy to hear at least one public institution of higher learning has the cajones to stick to its guns. My understanding of the law is that decisions to grant tenure or extend contracts are totally at the discretion of the college - as long as the applicant's race, national origin or religion aren't imputed.

Perhaps this professor should just move on. It's pretty clear he's not welcome. If he's the shizz folks here say he is, surely he can get a sweet gig at some more "enlightened" college or university.

And another thing. Any attempt to "rain fire down" on SOSU will very likely have the opposite effect. There are a lot more folks who will be happy about what the administration did, then those who are disappointed. And if this became a national story, I'm pretty sure $$$ would roll in from all over in support of good ol' SOSU.

Are you kidding or just crazy? I am pretty sure $$$ will not roll in from all over in support of ol’ SOSU. How much are you willing to donate? Scratch that. Nothing good will come from this, trust me on that.

My alumni friends are pissed off enough to start a boycott of the university.

I am still trying to figure out how much of the university is funded by our tax dollars. I guess a clue is the fact that the average tuition cost for a state resident at one of our regional universities is $3,313/semester and for a non-resident it is $9,452.

SOSU has an enrollment of 4,854, but I have no breakdown of state residents and non-residents. I assume that the vast majority would be residents besides a very small number who commute from the Denison/Sherman area. Assuming that 90% are state residents, the number works out to $27 million per semester or probably more than $60 million per year.

Okay, those numbers ARE wonky because they could be just jacking up the tuition of non-residents and that has nothing to do with actual costs. Yeah, **** those people from North Texas who spend money in Oklahoma. On the other hand, the state board of regents for higher education claims to oversee an annual budget in excess of $1 billion. If SOSU gets $60 million, or about 6%, of that, I guess that it would seem about right.

It doesn’t matter if it is $60 million or $1 million. The point is that our tax dollars are being spent on a university that has publicly admitted that bigotry is the policy in the guise of “Baptist beliefs”.

I am taking all of my numbers from this large pdf 2010 annual report produced by the Oklahoma Regents of Higher Education. It is a bit embarrassing, I know. They are in serious need of a quality editor.

http://www.okhighered.org/studies-reports/annual-report2010.pdf

I did find it encouraging if we do rank 9th nationally in terms of enrollment in public higher education.


Looking at the Numbers
For the last three semesters, Oklahoma’s higher education institutions have logged record enrollments on our state campuses. Based on the latest data available, Oklahoma is ranked ninth in the nation in the percentage of the state’s population enrolled in public higher education. In 2001, Oklahoma was ranked 14th.

Who Is Enrolled?
During 2008-09 at Oklahoma’s public institutions, females outnumbered males by 57 percent to 43 percent. The white population comprised 69.9 percent of higher education enrollment, while minority enrollments made up 30.1 percent. The American Indian population had the highest minority enrollment with 11.0 percent, followed by 9.0 percent black enrollment, 2.5 percent Asian-American enrollment and 3.9 percent Hispanic enrollment.

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 05:09 PM
* apparently, some of this aggrieved professor's former students have weighed-in on the link Chuck posted and have opined the guy is a crappy teacher.


I personally agree. Being in her class she has shown that she isn't capable of handling the teaching of English. She went as far as to let a student write an essay like a Freshman in high school. You ignore the facts that you're going on Dr. Tudor's bias alone. You are going on what she has assumed to be the reason for her dismissal. In 2007 when the change of gender was announced to the school the University would have dismissed her within a year if this had anything to do with her trans-gender choice. HOWEVER we are now in the year 2011, 4 years of her working at the school since that decision. She may have all the "paper" qualifications, and may look good on paper. However, in a real life experience she is not capable of being a efficient teacher. Allowing students to slide with inferior writing styles and techniques and setting them up for failure as they are too ignorant of English themselves.

Where in the hell did that quote come from? I didn't see it in the links I provided.

Listen up, you poopy head bad guy. All I have seen is glowing praise and support for Dr Tudor from current and former students. My friend who is her colleague said that she is very well liked and appreciated by both faculty and students. And, I do trust her and her judgment over anyone else. She is very religious and yes Baptist. The tenure board recommended her unanimously. And, the admin made it clear that she wasn't getting tenure because of their "Baptist beliefs".

If you dare to try to twist this around and try to make it seem that Dr Tudor is a crappy professor you are going to find crap flung right back atcha.

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 05:19 PM
Where in the hell did that quote come from? I didn't see it in the links I provided.

Listen up, you poopy head bad guy. All I have seen is glowing praise and support for Dr Tudor from current and former students. My friend who is her colleague said that she is very well liked and appreciated by both faculty and students. And, I do trust her and her judgment over anyone else. She is very religious and yes Baptist. The tenure board recommended her unanimously. And, the admin made it clear that she wasn't getting tenure because of their "Baptist beliefs".

If you dare to try to twist this around and try to make it seem that Dr Tudor is a crappy professor you are going to find crap flung right back atcha.

Now Chuck, I think ya went to far with that statement. How can you trust the judgement of anyone who wants/Has their weenus whacked off?:D

Collier11
5/7/2011, 05:27 PM
Chuck, of course you are going to believe your friend, doesnt mean that is the consensus of the student and faculty as a whole...I dont know, im just saying that you might be looking thru a biased pair of shades

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 05:30 PM
Now Chuck, I think ya went to far with that statement. How can you trust the judgement of anyone who wants/Has their weenus whacked off?:D

You better take that back and quick or I am going to call you a few names that you've never heard of and I will regret later. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

I'm being serious here. Hell, I dated that colleague of Dr Tudor for several years and I didn't even get beyond first base because of her Baptist beliefs. Trust me, she is a good source.

Collier11
5/7/2011, 05:33 PM
so she didnt put out to a gay guy and that makes her a good source? :D

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 05:38 PM
You better take that back and quick or I am going to call you a few names that you've never heard of and I will regret later. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

I'm being serious here. Hell, I dated that colleague of Dr Tudor for several years and I didn't even get beyond first base because of her Baptist beliefs. Trust me, she is a good source.

I Love you like a Brother and I been on yer side. Did ya not see the smilie face?

Joke bro. Trying to lighten the moment .:cool:

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 05:39 PM
so she didnt put out to a gay guy and that makes her a good source? :D

The Prof. Aint Ghey just confused :eek: :D

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 05:40 PM
Chuck, of course you are going to believe your friend, doesnt mean that is the consensus of the student and faculty as a whole...I dont know, im just saying that you might be looking thru a biased pair of shades

I am not wet behind the ears on this. I did teach one year at the university level. Faculty do tend to pull together and avoid criticizing each other. But, if it were a 50/50 thing, my friend would have told me. The fact is that the tenure committee unanimously recommended approval. Dr Tudor is an excellent professor and by dismissing her, the admin of the university is depriving the students of SOSU of a quality education because of their Baptist beliefs.

Collier11
5/7/2011, 05:42 PM
well you know more about it than I do

OutlandTrophy
5/7/2011, 05:43 PM
that's fine and dandy that the faculty and students like him.

It appears that the people that sign his check do not. It sucks but I'm sure he will find a job somewhere else.

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 05:54 PM
so she didnt put out to a gay guy and that makes her a good source? :D

I am officially putting you on my **** list.

For the record, everything was working and I was a trying and doing a bit of experimenting during my college days. I guess I wasn't experimenting with the right people. Yeah, I was stupid college student, but that is what it is supposed to be about, right? Not Baptist beliefs, right? The irony is that I left her to get my graduate degree at Baylor, of all places.

I can't believe that I am admitting to being that stupid.

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 06:06 PM
that's fine and dandy that the faculty and students like him.

It appears that the people that sign his check do not. It sucks but I'm sure he will find a job somewhere else.

Yeah, but they can't sign those checks without money from the state and state taxpayers.

I intend to be all up in face of people and maybe I have waiting for this moment when I finally get the courage to come out of the closet and fight for what I think is right. There be fire and brimstone coming with me.

OutlandTrophy
5/7/2011, 06:09 PM
are you a state taxpayer?

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 06:12 PM
are you a state taxpayer?

As a very Large Property owner in Okla. I bet he do Pay a **** load in Taxes
Plus his foreign Income Is taxed By the feds and The State.

OutlandTrophy
5/7/2011, 06:14 PM
As a very Large Property owner in Okla. I bet he do Pay a **** load in Taxes
Plus his foreign Income Is taxed By the feds and The State.

I just know he has parents in OK and he lives in Tailand.

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 06:18 PM
I just know he has parents in OK and he lives in Tailand.

Just his Mom, I do know he owns a lot of Income producing Property and Like I said. His Foriegn income Is taxed here also.

He aint a dead beat.
A really nice guy if you know him.

Okla-homey
5/7/2011, 06:30 PM
I am not wet behind the ears on this. I did teach one year at the university level. Faculty do tend to pull together and avoid criticizing each other. But, if it were a 50/50 thing, my friend would have told me. The fact is that the tenure committee unanimously recommended approval. Dr Tudor is an excellent professor and by dismissing her, the admin of the university is depriving the students of SOSU of a quality education because of their Baptist beliefs.

Dear Chuck. I'm going to try to break this down. SOSU is a regional campus of the state university system. It reflects the mores and attitudes of the region in which it is located. Now, that said, the thing that gets me sideways on this issue is the fact this man is pouting because the powers that be at SOSU decided he won't get tenure or have his contract extended. And clearly, he's blaming the fact he thinks he's a girl for the decision. Like any dispute, there are at least two sides to the story. I cruised that link you posted and his former students said Tudor sux as a teacher.

Listen. please. These tenure decisions are completely within the discretion of the administration. Until SCOTUS rules that people with "gender Identity disorder" are a protected class, he's hosed. (no pun intended). And even if SCOTUS issued such an opinion tomorrow, there's still the matter of whether Tudor is a good enough teacher to rate the tenure he craves. And it appears to me that is an open question.

And for the record, as a Baptist, I don't appreciate you belittling what we beleive. But I also recognize you have a right to your opinion. Just as I do.

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 06:35 PM
Well put Homey
I like it when 2 sides of an issue can disagree with out being disagreeable

You are one Very intelligent person who I respect a lot. Chuck is also.
You two are on totally different sides of this issue. With Chuck being from the area, and an Aluminum of the School I tend to side with him, Cause hes closer to the issues.
JMHO.

Okla-homey
5/7/2011, 06:41 PM
Yeah, but they can't sign those checks without money from the state and state taxpayers.

I intend to be all up in face of people and maybe I have waiting for this moment when I finally get the courage to come out of the closet and fight for what I think is right. There be fire and brimstone coming with me.

Chuck. With all due respect. You are an SOSU alum who also happens to be an ex-pat American living in Thailand. It's a fact that Americans who emigrate to Thailand often so so for sordid reasons. Now, I know and respect you, and I know you didn't emigrate to Thailand for freaky reasons, but they don't know that. Moreover, you don't pay taxes in Oklahoma. For all those reasons, I doubt SOSU gives two shiites what you think.

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 06:57 PM
Well put Homey
I like it when 2 sides of an issue can disagree with out being disagreeable

You are one Very intelligent person who I respect a lot. Chuck is also.
You two are on totally different sides of this issue. With Chuck being from the area, and an Aluminum of the School I tend to side with him, Cause hes closer to the issues.
JMHO.

Thank you Ole Vet. I am much closer to this situation, although Homey is originally from Ardmore.

He is way off base in claiming that Dr Tudor is anything but an excellent teacher. The evidence that I am seeing is far, far, far weighted in support.

The only evidence that Homey provided was a quote, not a link to the quote mind you, to some anonymous person who says that someone else got an undeserved positive grade for a freshman paper. Huh?

Lawyer it up with the predicable smear all ya want, Homey. It still doesn't change the facts. By the way, you would suck in closing arguments in a jury case.

StoopTroup
5/7/2011, 06:57 PM
He's hosed.....LMAO

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 06:59 PM
Thank you Ole Vet. I am much closer to this situation, although Homey is originally from Ardmore.

He is way off base in claiming that Dr Tudor is anything but an excellent teacher. The evidence that I am seeing is far, far, far weighted in support.

The only evidence that Homey provided was a quote, not a link to the quote mind you, to some anonymous person who says that someone else got an undeserved positive grade for a freshman paper. Huh?

Lawyer it up with the predicable smear all ya want, Homey. It still doesn't change the facts. By the way, you would suck in closing arguments in a jury case.

Bro, Come on, Dont throw Darts and none will be thrown .
Win yer argument with Facts. ;)

StoopTroup
5/7/2011, 07:00 PM
Man....give people around here a little personal info and they start shoving things up your ***.....lol

I didn't kill that hamster. I swear by it.

StoopTroup
5/7/2011, 07:02 PM
so she didnt put out to a gay guy and that makes her a good source? :D

Did you hear about the gay Indian?






He was a brave sucker.

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 07:24 PM
Chuck. With all due respect. You are an SOSU alum who also happens to be an ex-pat American living in Thailand. It's a fact that Americans who emigrate to Thailand often so so for sordid reasons. Now, I know and respect you, and I know you didn't emigrate to Thailand for freaky reasons, but they don't know that. Moreover, you don't pay taxes in Oklahoma. For all those reasons, I doubt SOSU gives two shiites what you think.

Excuse me, but I do pay taxes in Oklahoma. I certainly pay ad valorem taxes each year and I will have to pay more than a few pennies on the lease of my mineral rights this year.

I take great offense, and I mean this very seriously, with any implication that you have mentioned about the reason why I live in Thailand.

You are one tricky SOB. It is still inexcusable to say: Americans who live in Thailand are there for sorted reasons, but I don't think you are there for that. Your intention is to link me with those low lifes and nothing can be further from the truth. That is totally unacceptable and deceptive. Why would you even bother to do that? I do not understand it except that it is a personal attack.

For the record, I am in Thailand because my company sent me here and I decided to stay. I have a good record and stock market recognized awards for best research team in Thailand. I have contributed to Thai society and helped in the development of the country. For that, I can be proud.

My grandmother once told me that she was concerned about my soul because someone in her Baptist church, the one that I was baptized in, said that I am promoting gambling since the stock market is just a legal den of gambling.

I told her that Thailand is a very poor country and that private companies list on the stock market, not to promote gambling, but to raise money so they could invest in new manufacturing equipment and hire more people. The money that I am helping to raise by providing research reports on these companies is actually good in helping to develop the country.

I am still very satisfied that my response to my grandma is still correct.

StoopTroup
5/7/2011, 07:26 PM
Are their any Baptist Stock Brokers?

olevetonahill
5/7/2011, 07:38 PM
Just his Mom, I do know he owns a lot of Income producing Property and Like I said. His Foriegn income Is taxed here also.

He aint a dead beat.
A really nice guy if you know him.


Chuck. With all due respect. You are an SOSU alum who also happens to be an ex-pat American living in Thailand. It's a fact that Americans who emigrate to Thailand often so so for sordid reasons. Now, I know and respect you, and I know you didn't emigrate to Thailand for freaky reasons, but they don't know that. Moreover, you don't pay taxes in Oklahoma. For all those reasons, I doubt SOSU gives two shiites what you think.


dayum Homey did ya Totally miss my Post?:eek:

Chuck Bao
5/7/2011, 07:40 PM
Are their any Baptist Stock Brokers?

Sure there are. There are even some Baptist missionaries in Thailand (my cousins for example) who have independent means and invest their money in the Thai stock market. I hope Homey will not try to interrupt that thought by saying that there are pedophiles in Thailand and he doesn't think that Baptist missionary cousins are involved.

Gandalf_The_Grey
5/8/2011, 03:42 AM
It is a very slippery slope for a state funded University to do something like this. What if they denied tenure because as a baptist, they frown on Jews, Muslims, or any other religion? Then you take the next step, if they deny tenure because someone smokes, is fat, or is divorced because those are also issues they could do on moral grounds. I don't agree with tenure but if you ARE going to offer it, the only way I see a denial as acceptable is if you have proven on a large scale that you are incompetent or a danger to your students further education.

OutlandTrophy
5/8/2011, 07:43 AM
The Admin doesn't think this guy deserves tenure.

It's pretty simple.

Chuck Bao
5/8/2011, 08:26 AM
The Admin doesn't think this guy deserves tenure.

It's pretty simple.

Damn straight! The admin of a university are pretty simple folk. The faculty can run circles around them, intellectually, and the bean counters still can't find their own *** even though there has been a circle drawn around it, intellectually of course.

Methinks "something is rotten in the state of Denmark".

OutlandTrophy
5/8/2011, 09:10 AM
Methinks "something is rotten in the state of Denmark".

This professor's teaching ability, perhaps?

Chuck Bao
5/8/2011, 12:59 PM
This professor's teaching ability, perhaps?

Perhaps not given the fact that tenure committee gave her their unanimous support.

Gandalf_The_Grey
5/8/2011, 01:11 PM
Yeah but tenure committees are known communist and Muslim Extremist...

Midtowner
5/8/2011, 01:11 PM
It is a very slippery slope for a state funded University to do something like this. What if they denied tenure because as a baptist, they frown on Jews, Muslims, or any other religion?

Then there'd be a legal cause of action. In Oklahoma, discrimination against homosexuals (or heterosexuals, for that matter) is not actionable.


Then you take the next step, if they deny tenure because someone smokes, is fat, or is divorced because those are also issues they could do on moral grounds.

They could actually deny tenure on those grounds


I don't agree with tenure but if you ARE going to offer it, the only way I see a denial as acceptable is if you have proven on a large scale that you are incompetent or a danger to your students further education.

That's not how it works. It's of course whether you are competent, but can also depend on lots of other factors, e.g., how many grants have you landed for research, the quality of your research, how well you get along with the faculty, whether the faculty thinks your beliefs or methods are orthodox or unorthodox, etc.

Now, do you have the right to be angry? To sign online petitions? To buy a billboard close to campus condemning the school's actions? To take out ads in the local paper? To write letters? To protest? To gritch on the internet? Absolutely. But the school has the power to deny this lady her tenure because she's gay. It absolutely does. If you don't like it, gritch louder.

Gandalf_The_Grey
5/8/2011, 01:18 PM
They have every right to do it...that isn't the argument. I just don't like an institution of higher learning that uses my tax dollars denying a qualified teacher that met every requirement asked of her tenure because of what he/she wants to do with their genitalia. If this was a private school, go ahead and knock yourself out, but if you are going to use our money, you better get on board with hiring and keeping the best people.

Midtowner
5/8/2011, 01:30 PM
They have every right to do it...that isn't the argument. I just don't like an institution of higher learning that uses my tax dollars denying a qualified teacher that met every requirement asked of her tenure because of what he/she wants to do with their genitalia. If this was a private school, go ahead and knock yourself out, but if you are going to use our money, you better get on board with hiring and keeping the best people.

If you want to make that taxpayer money argument, take a look at what state you're in. I assure you, right or wrong, taxpayer sentiment supports the school's decision. It ain't right or moral, but it just is. And no online petition is going to fix that.

2121Sooner
5/8/2011, 01:46 PM
I think if she/he were teaching gym class she/he would be fine.


Too bad though, cause even if this were the best teacher in the world, they would be on their way out if Oklahoma. ........or most states for that matter.

Chuck Bao
5/8/2011, 01:56 PM
If you want to make that taxpayer money argument, take a look at what state you're in. I assure you, right or wrong, taxpayer sentiment supports the school's decision. It ain't right or moral, but it just is. And no online petition is going to fix that.

I disagree. "It just is" is no excuse to do nothing. I have no illusion that the general public's mindset will change overnight. But gradually, I think that people are starting to understand it a little bit more.

Gandalf_The_Grey
5/8/2011, 02:07 PM
If the best teacher is an albino, 3 foot tall midget, transsexual, blue skinned, I would prefer them to teach me kids than a 6'3" blonde hair, blue eyed moron.

Sooner_Tuf
5/8/2011, 03:33 PM
If the best teacher is an albino, 3 foot tall midget, transsexual, blue skinned, I would prefer them to teach me kids than a 6'3" blonde hair, blue eyed moron.

Why is that?

OutlandTrophy
5/8/2011, 08:05 PM
Perhaps not given the fact that tenure committee gave her their unanimous support.

How many people does the tenure committe decline tenure for each year?

jk the sooner fan
5/8/2011, 08:08 PM
How many people does the tenure committe decline tenure for each year?

how many times have they ever???

bonkuba
5/8/2011, 08:19 PM
Tenure to me is an excuse to not do your job....due to it almost being impossible to fire the idiots once they have tenure. There are exceptions obviously.....but I dont see the point in it.....even with some fool that cant figure out if he wants a wee wee or not.....can't help it.....hahahahahaha!!!!!:D:D :D

Midtowner
5/8/2011, 08:41 PM
I disagree. "It just is" is no excuse to do nothing. I have no illusion that the general public's mindset will change overnight. But gradually, I think that people are starting to understand it a little bit more.

I never advocated doing nothing, but an online petition? How lame.

You're not going to change anyone's mind with lame topics like that. Why not just publish a rant on your Facebook wall or something equally worthless?

Want to make the administration hear you? The only thing they'll listen to is money. If you can contact some big money donors to your school and get them to vote with their pocket books, you may make some headway.

As far as this prof goes, she might actually be quite happy to be getting the heck out of Doo-rant.

StoopTroup
5/8/2011, 09:09 PM
There sure are a huge amount of latent homosexuals really concerned about all of this.

I think all of you are FABULOUS ! ! !

StoopTroup
5/8/2011, 09:17 PM
Tenure to me is an excuse to not do your job....due to it almost being impossible to fire the idiots once they have tenure. There are exceptions obviously.....but I dont see the point in it.....even with some fool that cant figure out if he wants a wee wee or not.....can't help it.....hahahahahaha!!!!!:D:D :D

What's funny to me is I have it and I didn't need anyone's input as to why I should receive it....

I just got it for still being employed and doing a good job.

This person is clearly not going to get it based on the fact that the guy running things knows that this Teachers contract will run out and once that passes...it's all over.

If there wasn't tenure.....he probably wouldn't be there either. Why not just give the tenure. Sounds like the place is majorly screwed up anyways. If the two of them can't get along after that....get rid of them both.

Chuck Bao
5/8/2011, 10:37 PM
Tenure to me is an excuse to not do your job....due to it almost being impossible to fire the idiots once they have tenure. There are exceptions obviously.....but I dont see the point in it.....even with some fool that cant figure out if he wants a wee wee or not.....can't help it.....hahahahahaha!!!!!:D:D :D

Now, this is something I may actually know a little something about.

In the brokerage industry, there is something called the "integrity of research". It simply means that nobody - including senior management, the investment banking department, the head of sales - could interfere with our stock recommendations. As research head, I answered only to the chairman of the board of directors.

I imagine that academia is the very same. Tenure is needed to protect the integrity of the research work. No chance for interference from job security. Our universities are not corporations. Instead, they are supposed to be respected teaching and research institutions.

Gandalf_The_Grey
5/9/2011, 02:16 AM
Why is that?


Because I would want my kids to get a good education.... Let's see, in my scenario that weirdo gets my kids good grade and high test scores and into a good university. Idiot guy gets my kids good grades and low test scores and they end up at SOSU on academic probation ;)