Putting the BUDGET 'cuts' in perspective

[SoonerScribe]

Cutting $38 billion out of a $3.8 trillion dollar annual governmental budget is equivalent to cutting $380 dollars out of a $38 thousand dollar personal annual budget.

So, if you make 38k per year, you'd have to sacrifice a total of $31.06 per month.

Wow! How did our representatives ever make such deep and meaningful budget cuts?

What a ****ing joke!

[SoonerKnight]

Figured there would be more outrage! YOu seem only mildly outraged. :D

[Sooner5030]

it'd be more like spending $38k/year on a $25k/year salary and deciding to cut $380 to try and balance your checkbook. I guess you could "hope" for a $13k salary increase.

[soonercoop1]

Figured there would be more outrage! YOu seem only mildly outraged. :D

Plenty of outrage unfortunately we have been accustomed to incompetence...

[StoopTroup]

If they are cutting the budget.....won't I get a refund of $31.06? :D

[2121Sooner]

Only in America do people get to create a budget to spend money that isn't there, then come off the budget numbers they have created, still have an increase over the prior budget ......and call them budget "cuts"


Welcome to USA 2.0

[Soonerfan88]

I believe you will see fights for a much larger cut in the 2012 budget. This was just a small appetizer.

[bigfatjerk]

I believe you will see fights for a much larger cut in the 2012 budget. This was just a small appetizer.

I agree but I think the republicans will be demogogued out of bigger cuts. Just listen to democrats today and the last few days go on about rights of the elderly and "women".

BTW women's rights. It's basically talking about abortion. They are talking about giving women the right to kill. Only in America can you talk about a right to kill as good. And I'm talking about this as someone that is pro-choice.

[StoopTroup]

Only in America do people get to create a budget to spend money that isn't there, then come off the budget numbers they have created, still have an increase over the prior budget ......and call them budget "cuts"


Welcome to USA 2.0

The important thing is that every penny is accounted for.

Always know this....it will help you sleep better.

[1890MilesToNorman]

Theres only one option left for the citizens to reign in this gubment and it ain't gonna be pretty King George.

[StoopTroup]

Theres only one option left for the citizens to reign in this gubment and it ain't gonna be pretty King George.

?

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_9iw1SbELJnQ/TOK90FV61yI/AAAAAAAAASk/caLcV4iuis8/s1600/King+Ralph+-+better+than+a+Royal+Wedding.jpg

[SoCaliSooner]

I agree but I think the republicans will be demogogued out of bigger cuts. Just listen to democrats today and the last few days go on about rights of the elderly

Any time republicans want to cut anything out of the budget the deems classically say that "millions of starving seniors will have to choose between eating or medication", or that schools will lose funding. They have been trotting these lines out for at least 35 years.

[2121Sooner]

Problem is they are spending pennies that haven't been accounted for

[StoopTroup]

We could cut a ****load out of our Budget without cutting Education and any Senior Assistance. The thing I can't stand is it's difficult to draw the line on Senior care as so much of the services prices get jacked up and folks who aren't qualified for assistance due to doing a bit better in life and putting dough or having better retirement benefits start to throw a fit when they get cut out. Those that need can't get and those that get cut out and don't need whine and complain that they didn't receive anything for paying into it all these years even though they don't need it.

Greed and slackers who expect to be taken care of cause dissent.

Sad that in your later years....any of us would have to worry about our safety....our residence, our healthcare or our medicines.

You probably don't need assistance if you are traveling to Caribbean Islands to relax twice a year or still able to pay your Country Club dues and play golf 4-7 days a week.

[bigfatjerk]

We probably don't need a department of Education at the federal level. I bet if we handled it at the state levels more it would be a lot better off with most of them. I think we need a complete reform of social security so that people under 50 have a chance of getting these services. If we keep going like we are right now nobody is going to be able to pay it. The government will implode in 20 years anyway.

[StoopTroup]

We probably don't need a department of Education at the federal level. I bet if we handled it at the state levels more it would be a lot better off with most of them. I think we need a complete reform of social security so that people under 50 have a chance of getting these services. If we keep going like we are right now nobody is going to be able to pay it. The government will implode in 20 years anyway.


I might go half way with you....

It's probably not needed until College. I think since there are so damn many Private and State funded institutions....That the DOE could be streamlined and help maybe keep the Universities from posturing at the State levels for Government assistance and help smaller ones compete with Larger ones by making sure Student Loans were available equally. I'm sure there are other things that the DOE could do to make sure our Kids....no matter what State....have the opportunity to experience College after High School. We must keep Higher Education in our Great Country at the cutting edge if we are to allow folks to use their minds to achieve continued Greatness and help to solve the road blocks of the future IMO

[mgsooner]

Oh those poor Republicans. The dirty Dems just won't let them do anything they want to do. Let me pose this question: if the Republicans really wanted to slash the budget (as they say), why didn't they just put their foot down (a la the Wisconsin Gov) and say we don't care if the Government shuts down, we're cutting the budget? Things that make you go hmmmm

[StoopTroup]

The amount of Colleges on-line also serve to endanger the traditional 3-5 year institution. You work and go to school on-line and the College Experience suddenly become a Facebook Campus. Sure we can interact via technology but face to face classrooms can be an advantage over on-line classrooms IMO. On-line Classrooms provide easier access in a World where our time is so valuable too.

Things are changing and balance will need to be considered.

[StoopTroup]

Oh those poor Republicans. The dirty Dems just won't let them do anything they want to do. Let me pose this question: if the Republicans really wanted to slash the budget (as they say), why didn't they just put their foot down (a la the Wisconsin Gov) and say we don't care if the Government shuts down, we're cutting the budget? Things that make you go hmmmm

I'm against all this Dirty Lib and those Damn Greedy Conservatives rhetoric. It's creating a divide instead of bringing people together.

One thing I think we've seen happen outside of our Country is that Ideas can really turn into action via Technology. It's what we do with it once we are looking at each other face to face instead of Facebook to Facebook.

[olevetonahill]

I'm against all this Dirty Lib and those Damn Greedy Conservatives rhetoric. It's creating a divide instead of bringing people together.

One thing I think we've seen happen outside of our Country is that Ideas can really turn into action via Technology. It's what we do with it once we are looking at each other face to face instead of Facebook to Facebook.

THIS
In MHO all a person does By running off at the Mouth about How Terrible, "That Party " is
Are just showing their ignorance :rolleyes:

[mgsooner]

Off topic, but your avatar is hilarious. StoopTroup

[SoCaliSooner]

I also think that if you have a job that provides a guaranteed pension, then you should not be able to draw social security. I have a guaranteed pension as do most of my family members and there are people in worse need than I will
ever be. I wonder how much savings there would be if all municipal/county/ state and federal employees were exempted from drawing SS?

[2121Sooner]

You probably don't need assistance if you are traveling to Caribbean Islands to relax twice a year or still able to pay your Country Club dues and play golf 4-7 days a week.

Kind of a "for those based on need by those based on ability" theory?

That is an interesting political and economic concept

[mgsooner]

What if you just allowed people to "opt out" of Social Security? You don't pay in, you don't get anything at retirement. Hell I would opt out right now.

[SoCaliSooner]

What if you just allowed people to "opt out" of Social Security? You don't pay in, you don't get anything at retirement. Hell I would opt out right now.

That becomes a slippery slope. I pay property taxes for schools in three different counties and my kids are in private school. Can I opt out? What if people never have kids, could they opt out of paying for schools too ?

[mgsooner]

That becomes a slippery slope. I pay property taxes for schools in three different counties and my kids are in private school. Can I opt out? What if people never have kids, could they opt out of paying for schools too ?

Well is Social Security really supposed to be a "tax", like those are? Or something different...

[Sooner5030]

some of us believe that providing taxpayer/future citizen indebtedness funded services to women, the elderly and to the poor is not the purpose of our gubment. It was established to protect my freedoms and individual liberty from the therapeutic minded mob that want to trade my freedoms for their security.

[pphilfran]

What if you just allowed people to "opt out" of Social Security? You don't pay in, you don't get anything at retirement. Hell I would opt out right now.

If everyone elected to not participate the fund would be broke in short order...they need YOUR money TODAY to pay for current retirees...

The trust fund has about 2.6 trillion in it today...we pay out 700 billion a year...you do the math...

So for a few years we would be cashing out 700 billion in special issue bonds...and to get money out of those SI bonds the fed will have to issue new open market bonds to get the money....

To issue that large amount of bonds the fed would have to pay a high interest rate to move them...and that would be the beginning of the end...or the end of the beginning...or something like that...

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

I am just shocked how fast the Democrats destroyed this country. Remember back when Bush and the Republican controlled Congress and House had the deficit down to about like 15 dollars. The Republicans were so cost conscience when they were in charge!!

[StoopTroup]

Kind of a "for those based on need by those based on ability" theory?

That is an interesting political and economic concept

The last time you donated your time to help an elderly person you didn't know rake her yard or paint her house or fix a water leak was when?

I don't need an answer....

Just think we could all do a bit more and try to reduce the need.

Helping your 80 year old next door Neighbor load his golf clubs in his trunk.....not high on the list of Boy Scout achievements IMO.

Yeah we all have interesting ideas and concepts and some of us actually don't expect the Government to help...but we do like it when the help does go to the right people who need it. Where it goes wrong....I don't know but some folks do need help in this World.

[SoCaliSooner]

The last time you donated your time to help an elderly person you didn't know rake her yard or paint her house or fix a water leak was when?
....,,
Where it goes wrong....I don't know but some folks do need help in this World.

Apparently we can solve all problems by donating money to a paypal account, backslapping each other for our good deeds, and it absolves us from the *** holiness as well.

I think most people will help somebody out who is in need ...but young able bodied people getting tons of freebies in government subsidies make it a lifestyle and there is no incentive to work...

[2121Sooner]

The last time you donated your time to help an elderly person you didn't know rake her yard or paint her house or fix a water leak was when?

I don't need an answer....

Just think we could all do a bit more and try to reduce the need.

Helping your 80 year old next door Neighbor load his golf clubs in his trunk.....not high on the list of Boy Scout achievements IMO.

Yeah we all have interesting ideas and concepts and some of us actually don't expect the Government to help...but we do like it when the help does go to the right people who need it. Where it goes wrong....I don't know but some folks do need help in this World.

You won't get an answer either. When I do something to help my fellow man I don't come here to post about it looking for approval.

[StoopTroup]

You won't get an answer either. When I do something to help my fellow man I don't come here to post about it looking for approval.

We kind of noticed that about you.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

I also think that if you have a job that provides a guaranteed pension, then you should not be able to draw social security. I have a guaranteed pension as do most of my family members and there are people in worse need than I will
ever be. I wonder how much savings there would be if all municipal/county/ state and federal employees were exempted from drawing SS?

That already exists.

It's called a Government Pension Offset and while wages contributed prior to establishment of pensionable wages will count, if under a qualifying pension plan, your benefits will be reduced up to 2/3rds.

The way I understand it, the option rests entirely on whether or not the pension plan is a qualifying plan and its members contribute to Social Security through FICA withholdings. I do not contribute FICA because I have a qualifying pension plan. However, my contributions from before my current employment will qualify for social security payments but at that severely reduced level, thus making 2/3rds of my prior contributions simply contributions to the betterment of the system. Also to my understanding, this will also apply to spousal benefits on my death.

With all that considered, it's actually a benefit to Social Security. I'll be damned, a public service pension actually helping folks!

http://www.socialsecurity.gov/pubs/10007.html

[StoopTroup]

That already exists.

It's called a Government Pension Offset and while wages contributed prior to establishment of pensionable wages will count, if under a qualifying pension plan, your benefits will be reduced up to 2/3rds.

The way I understand it, the option rests entirely on whether or not the pension plan is a qualifying plan and its members contribute to Social Security through FICA withholdings. I do not contribute FICA because I have a qualifying pension plan. However, my contributions from before my current employment will qualify for social security payments but at that severely reduced level, thus making 2/3rds of my prior contributions simply contributions to the betterment of the system. Also to my understanding, this will also apply to spousal benefits on my death.

With all that considered, it's actually a benefit to Social Security. I'll be damned, a public service pension actually helping folks!

http://www.socialsecurity.gov/pubs/10007.html
****ing Unions are ruining this Country....lol

[SoonerKnight]

Well is Social Security really supposed to be a "tax", like those are? Or something different...

Is a law really a law? :rolleyes:

[87sooner]

(CNSNews.com) - The federal debt increased $54.1 billion in the eight days preceding the deal made by President Barack Obama, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D.-Nev.) and House Speaker John Boehner (R.-Ohio) to cut $38.5 billion in federal spending for the remainder of fiscal year 2011, which runs through September.

The debt was $14.2101 trillion on March 30, according to the Bureau of the Public Debt, and $14.2642 on April 7.

Since the beginning of the fiscal year on Oct. 1, 2010, the national debt has increase by $653.4 billion.

[StoopTroup]

At least the 38 billion we just cut is gonna save us all.....lol

[SoonerJack]

Any time republicans want to cut anything out of the budget the deems classically say that "millions of starving seniors will have to choose between eating or medication", or that schools will lose funding. They have been trotting these lines out for at least 35 years.

which is total BS because schools typically receive very little federal funding (and I'm perfectly fine with that).

[Leroy Lizard]

Schools receive a ton of money in the form of Title I, which is given to the states to dispense. The Dept of Ed largely serves to dole out money to states, which it now uses as a strong-arm tactic to carry out the social agendas of the governing party. (For example, "either adopt our national standards or lose your Title I money.") It could evaporate tomorrow and I wouldn't lose any sleep over it.

[2121Sooner]

We kind of noticed that about you.

Even though not intended, I will take that as a compliment

[StoopTroup]

Even though not intended, I will take that as a compliment

It was intended. I've realized you like being a dick to folks who give you a hard time and you never ever get over it. It's OK. I understand why some folks do it and have learned to not take it personally.

[Blue]

It was intended. I've realized you like being a dick to folks who give you a hard time and you never ever get over it. It's OK. I understand why some folks do it and have learned to not take it personally.

I know you like pics ST, so...

http://thepoliticalcarnival.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/irony.jpg

Ta da! :D

[2121Sooner]

I was about to "pot meet kettle" but yours is way better Blue

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Congress will never make the tough decisions until we are bankrupt and will no longer have a country. They will run every American into the ground and then run away to their tax havens...

[sappstuf]

After much fighting and gnashing of teeth, the Repubs were able to cut 38 billion from the annual spending.

In the eight days prior to the bill being signed, we ran a deficit of 54 billion...

The cuts mean nothing.. The fact the Dems fought against them so hard says we continue to be in serious trouble.

[texaspokieokie]

The important thing is that every penny is accounted for.

Always know this....it will help you sleep better.

your funniest post, ever !!!

[pphilfran]

After much fighting and gnashing of teeth, the Repubs were able to cut 38 billion from the annual spending.

In the eight days prior to the bill being signed, we ran a deficit of 54 billion...

The cuts mean nothing.. The fact the Dems fought against them so hard says we continue to be in serious trouble.

Sap...the most you can realistically cut is 2 or 3% a year...you cut more than that meager amount and you risk additional financial problems...3% would be about 90 billion...

Whatever we do must be put in place for a significant amount of time...slow, steady cuts...

[soonercruiser]

Oh those poor Republicans. The dirty Dems just won't let them do anything they want to do. Let me pose this question: if the Republicans really wanted to slash the budget (as they say), why didn't they just put their foot down (a la the Wisconsin Gov) and say we don't care if the Government shuts down, we're cutting the budget? Things that make you go hmmmm

Because we know, like Wisconsin, the Demoncrats would take their ball and go to Philly to play!
Whaaaaaaa!

[soonercruiser]

You won't get an answer either. When I do something to help my fellow man I don't come here to post about it looking for approval.

I really believe that some of the posters here expect you too.
Otherwise why post it????
:rolleyes:

[soonercruiser]

It was intended. I've realized you like being a dick to folks who give you a hard time and you never ever get over it. It's OK. I understand why some folks do it and have learned to not take it personally.

Kinda noticed that you are good at that game as well Stoop!

[diverdog]

Congress will never make the tough decisions until we are bankrupt and will no longer have a country. They will run every American into the ground and then run away to their tax havens...

How are they running every American into the ground? Hell most of what is in the budget is stuff people want. Ask your parents or grandparents if they want to give up SS or medicare. Ask the government employees like SoCali or Cruiser if they will give up their government pensions. Do you think Americans want to give up defense or environmental protection or our national parks? We got a government we have asked for by and large and the problem is we do not want to pay for it in terms of tax dollars. We are spoiled children who want our cake and eat it to. There is no such thing as collective sacrifice in this country.

Here are a couple of facts:

1. Half the people on this thread (statistically) probably pay no federal income tax. So they are not supporting anyone and probably barely paying for the benefits they receive.

2. Everyone is complaining about cutting pennies on the budget when all they want to do is cut pennies on the budget. The biggest gorillas in the room are Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, Defense and the service on the debt. You can cut all other government functions and not balance the budget. We either cut significantly from those functions or we have to raise taxes.

3. Oklahoma receives a ton of money in the form of federally subsidies and takes in more than it pays out in taxes. So a huge cut in benefits would hurt Oklahoma severally. Think what would happen if Tinker, Vance, Altus and Fort Sill were all shut down and the state did not get a dime in farm subsidies. All I am saying is people better be careful what they wish for in terms of budget cuts.

[Sooner5030]

Oklahoma receives a ton of money in the form of federally subsidies and takes in more than it pays out in taxes.

you mean some study from years ago proved that the total federal tax receipts (income tax, gas tax) was less than the benefits (SS, Welfare, Medicare/caid, highway and defense appropriations that were paid in OK?

OK itself does not pay income taxes....its citizens do.....and we are a net retirement state (more folks move here to retire than leave) so yeah.....a bunch of people paid income taxes living elsewhere (with higher incomes) and now live here and collect SS & medicare bennies.

Also, get rid of a progressive tax scheme and that'd end the debtor state debate.

besides......I seriously doubt most of us want to live or not live in OK based upon its GDP alone.

[GKeeper316]

some of us believe that providing taxpayer/future citizen indebtedness funded services to women, the elderly and to the poor is not the purpose of our gubment. It was established to protect my freedoms and individual liberty from the therapeutic minded mob that want to trade my freedoms for their security.

which is all well and good, ideologically, but lets take a trip in the way back machine.

millions of americans out of work due to a global economic depression (brought on by the same sort of **** banks are doing today) unable to find basic needs such as rooves over their heads, clothes to wear and food to eat. government had to do something and social security and the WPA largely is responsible for providing these thing during that particular crisis. this every man for himself bull**** was fine back in 1850, when we were still annexing land and expanding westward and they were giving away land to whoever agreed to live on it and work it.

thats no longer the case. land aint free no more, and a good idea will only get you so far without lots of investment capital.

[sappstuf]

Here are a couple of facts:

1. Half the people on this thread (statistically) probably pay no federal income tax. So they are not supporting anyone and probably barely paying for the benefits they receive.

That is true... So why do we only hear about "the rich" not paying their fair share?

I think the Ryan plan puts the lowest tax bracket at 8%..

Reasonable to you?

[sappstuf]

Sap...the most you can realistically cut is 2 or 3% a year...you cut more than that meager amount and you risk additional financial problems...3% would be about 90 billion...

Whatever we do must be put in place for a significant amount of time...slow, steady cuts...

Phil we added about 30% to spending in 3 years.. IMHO the world will not end if we cut back a little faster than that.

I don't expect much to change really.. Harry Reid a couple of months ago said the plan to cut 32 billion was "draconian" and "unworkable". All this mess and then he approves cuts of 6.5 billion above "draconian". Would those be tyrannical spending cuts??

I see tonight that Obama is going to set out a budget plan (http://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/world/9170714/obama-to-set-out-budget-plan-on-wednesday/) on Wednesday... Didn't he just do that a couple of months ago? It was his state of the union address and then his 2012 budget..

The Dems internal polls must show something they are really scared of.

But... The Party of Science has always had trouble with math. Just a couple of weeks ago, Dick Durban said:


Social Security is a little different. It does not add a penny to the deficit.

I'm honestly not sure if the Dems leadership can have an honest and frank conversation about our debt.

[hawaii 5-0]

I'm not hearing any complains about the up-front tax breaks for the wealthy and the corporations.

I guess that's OK with everyone?




5-0



Trump/Willy Wonka 2012

[olevetonahill]

which is all well and good, ideologically, but lets take a trip in the way back machine.

millions of americans out of work due to a global economic depression (brought on by the same sort of **** banks are doing today) unable to find basic needs such as rooves over their heads, clothes to wear and food to eat. government had to do something and social security and the WPA largely is responsible for providing these thing during that particular crisis. this every man for himself bull**** was fine back in 1850, when we were still annexing land and expanding westward and they were giving away land to whoever agreed to live on it and work it.

thats no longer the case. land aint free no more, and a good idea will only get you so far without lots of investment capital.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_QgcIP-pa2II/SUbQw9KAJcI/AAAAAAAAAX8/TygI4OQWl-E/s400/GomerPyle.jpg
Swings and Misses again

Gomer in the time frame YOU are describing SS was not introduced :rolleyes:

[StoopTroup]

Kinda noticed that you are good at that game as well Stoop!

I sometimes fight fire with fire Mr. Simmons.

[okie52]

I'm not hearing any complains about the up-front tax breaks for the wealthy and the corporations.

I guess that's OK with everyone?




5-0



Trump/Willy Wonka 2012

The rich got tax breaks?

[hawaii 5-0]

The rich got tax breaks?



Have a nice sleep Mr. Stilskin?




5-0






Trump/ Chuck Norris 2012

[diverdog]

you mean some study from years ago proved that the total federal tax receipts (income tax, gas tax) was less than the benefits (SS, Welfare, Medicare/caid, highway and defense appropriations that were paid in OK?

OK itself does not pay income taxes....its citizens do.....and we are a net retirement state (more folks move here to retire than leave) so yeah.....a bunch of people paid income taxes living elsewhere (with higher incomes) and now live here and collect SS & medicare bennies.

Also, get rid of a progressive tax scheme and that'd end the debtor state debate.

besides......I seriously doubt most of us want to live or not live in OK based upon its GDP alone.

I guess if you want to call 2005 "dated".

http://www.taxfoundation.org/press/show/22659.html

This is not a "dig" against Oklahoma but a fact of life. Folks in Oklahoma are screaming for big budget cuts and they may not be looking at the long term ramifications of how it will affect their state. For instance you pointed out that Oklahoma is a retirement state. That means that many folks are dependent on Medicare and SS. I suspect federal retirements play into the mix since Oklahoma has a lot of government employees. If these benefits get cut significantly how is are those benefits and income going to be replaced?

[okie52]

Have a nice sleep Mr. Stilskin?




5-0






Trump/ Chuck Norris 2012

Right through where the rich got tax breaks so please elaborate

[TheHumanAlphabet]

How are they running every American into the ground? Hell most of what is in the budget is stuff people want. Ask your parents or grandparents if they want to give up SS or medicare. Ask the government employees like SoCali or Cruiser if they will give up their government pensions. Do you think Americans want to give up defense or environmental protection or our national parks? We got a government we have asked for by and large and the problem is we do not want to pay for it in terms of tax dollars. We are spoiled children who want our cake and eat it to. There is no such thing as collective sacrifice in this country.

Here are a couple of facts:

1. Half the people on this thread (statistically) probably pay no federal income tax. So they are not supporting anyone and probably barely paying for the benefits they receive.

2. Everyone is complaining about cutting pennies on the budget when all they want to do is cut pennies on the budget. The biggest gorillas in the room are Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, Defense and the service on the debt. You can cut all other government functions and not balance the budget. We either cut significantly from those functions or we have to raise taxes.

3. Oklahoma receives a ton of money in the form of federally subsidies and takes in more than it pays out in taxes. So a huge cut in benefits would hurt Oklahoma severally. Think what would happen if Tinker, Vance, Altus and Fort Sill were all shut down and the state did not get a dime in farm subsidies. All I am saying is people better be careful what they wish for in terms of budget cuts.

Don't count me in on this. I happen to be more of a fiscal conservative than anything else. Talk about gov't. pensions. Hell my Dad has been sitting on his arse retired GS-12 for 30 years. He is making more today than he ever did working. Now that was the deal he had, it should be honored. But we don't need to honor all the so-called entitlements. They should be eliminated. 120+ weeks or whatever it is of unemployment - needs to be eliminated, welfare, make it workfare and but those puppies to work, CCC type of thing. Government should provide for defense and interstate commerce. Yeah some more. But, I for one would love to see a return to the weak Federal government.

[StoopTroup]

Don't count me in on this. I happen to be more of a fiscal conservative than anything else. Talk about gov't. pensions. Hell my Dad has been sitting on his arse retired GS-12 for 30 years. He is making more today than he ever did working. Now that was the deal he had, it should be honored. But we don't need to honor all the so-called entitlements. They should be eliminated. 120+ weeks or whatever it is of unemployment - needs to be eliminated, welfare, make it workfare and but those puppies to work, CCC type of thing. Government should provide for defense and interstate commerce. Yeah some more. But, I for one would love to see a return to the weak Federal government.

Nope. Get rid of it all. Your Dad should have put enough dough back in the last 30 years to be able to make it from here.

**** everyone! Nobody gets a free ride.

[hawaii 5-0]

Right through where the rich got tax breaks so please elaborate




Try a Google Search for 'tax breaks for the wealthy'

There's 1.3 million results.


Sheeesh.




5-0




Trump/Sasquatch 2012

[sappstuf]

Try a Google Search for 'tax breaks for the wealthy'

There's 1.3 million results.

Sheeesh.

5-0
Trump/Sasquatch 2012

What does the number of Google search results returned have to do with reality?

There are 5 million results on 'obama no birth certificate' and 3 million on '9/11 inside job'

You must be the rare birther/truther mix since Google search results are so relevant to you.... And it must sadden you that there isn't even a million results on 'koch brothers wisconsin'..

[okie52]

Try a Google Search for 'tax breaks for the wealthy'

There's 1.3 million results.


Sheeesh.







Trump/Sasquatch 2012

You mean the tax breaks everyone received? That's got you upset?

Brilliant!!

[hawaii 5-0]

You mean the tax breaks everyone received? That's got you upset?

Brilliant!!



OK, boys. Just try the highest 10 results and try to form an opinion.
Or try "Bush tax cuts for the wealthy". Obama continued them.


I can't even believe you two are going here.


Are you both so wealthy you pay someone to read to you? I'd sure like to be in that Camp.


5-0


Trump/Cowboy Bill Watts 2012

[SCOUT]

OK, boys. Just try the highest 10 results and try to form an opinion.
Or try "Bush tax cuts for the wealthy". Obama continued them.


I can't even believe you two are going here.


Are you both so wealthy you pay someone to read to you? I'd sure like to be in that Camp.


5-0


Trump/Cowboy Bill Watts 2012

It is difficult to reduce a rate of 0% any further.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Nope. Get rid of it all. Your Dad should have put enough dough back in the last 30 years to be able to make it from here.

**** everyone! Nobody gets a free ride.

Hey, I agree. I don't think the actuaries ever thought he would live this long... He is definitely an outlier on the longevity matrix...

[sappstuf]

It is difficult to reduce a rate of 0% any further.

That is not important, the rich must pay their "fair share"....

[hawaii 5-0]

I just read that 1 in 4 Baby Boomers has no retirement savings.

Sad.



5-0



Trump/Alfalfa 2012

[OutlandTrophy]

If they aren't worried about their retirement, why should I?

[okie52]

OK, boys. Just try the highest 10 results and try to form an opinion.
Or try "Bush tax cuts for the wealthy". Obama continued them.


I can't even believe you two are going here.


Are you both so wealthy you pay someone to read to you? I'd sure like to be in that Camp.


5-0


Trump/Cowboy Bill Watts 2012

Hmmm. The tax cuts for the rich got you bothered and this is pretty old news.

The Bush tax cuts were extended for everyone...much as it pains you to understand it. The deficit projected for the rich tax cuts was $700 Billion. The deficits caused by the tax cuts for everyone else was 3.2 Trillion. But it's the $700 billion that has you stirred up. Brilliant.

Take off the blinders, quit eating the Huffington pablum and try an independent thought which has obviously eluded you.

[texaspokieokie]

[QUOTE=hawaii 5-0;3195829]I just read that 1 in 4 Baby Boomers has no retirement savings.


1 in 4 baby boomers (the youngest) are nowhere near retirement.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

But the generational age range of the "baby boomers", while nowhere near retirement, puts them in a position where they won't be able to effect a long term enough plan to have a viable retirement option.

It's a legitimate point whether they're at retirement age or not.

[OutlandTrophy]

but what's the point to be made that 25% of the boomers have not saved for their retirement?

[Tulsa_Fireman]

To me, the point is that 25% of boomers haven't saved and retirement age or not, it's too late.

Therefore 25% of america's monstrous generation of doom will enjoy beans and hay and beef-in-a-can OR use the power of their vote to continue to buttdoggle you through FICA at increased, obscene levels.

To really JohnnyMack the thread, I will use the word "buttdoggle" again.

Buttdoggle.

[pphilfran]

At least 25% of Gen X will have no savings at age 50...

At least 25% of Gen Y will have no savings at age 50...

At least 25% of those not yet born will have no savings at age 50...

[okie52]

At least 25% of Gen X will have no savings at age 50...

At least 25% of Gen Y will have no savings at age 50...

At least 25% of those not yet born will have no savings at age 50...

You mean it's not just us. Whew...what a relief.

[pphilfran]

You mean it's not just us. Whew...what a relief.

I know...shocking, isn't it?

[OutlandTrophy]

To me, the point is that 25% of boomers haven't saved and retirement age or not, it's too late.

Therefore 25% of america's monstrous generation of doom will enjoy beans and hay and beef-in-a-can OR use the power of their vote to continue to buttdoggle you through FICA at increased, obscene levels.

To really JohnnyMack the thread, I will use the word "buttdoggle" again.

Buttdoggle.

mmm, now I'm horny and kinda hungry.

[Mongo]

mmm, now I'm horny and kinda hungry.

I have a can of potted meat and a throbbing erection. let's do this

[sappstuf]

At least 25% of Gen X will have no savings at age 50...

At least 25% of Gen Y will have no savings at age 50...

At least 25% of those not yet born will have no savings at age 50...

Greatest generation my butt..... ;)

[badger]

When I entered the workforce a long time ago... about 10 years ago on a summer job between college semesters, my parents told me about the facts of Social Security deductions on my minuscule paycheck:

Think of it as a gift to your grandparents, because you'll never get any of it back.

[OutlandTrophy]

I have a can of potted meat and a throbbing erection. let's do this

I have started without you but you're more than welcome to catch up. I can lend you a hand if it'll help.

[diverdog]

I just read that 1 in 4 Baby Boomers has no retirement savings.

Sad.



5-0



Trump/Alfalfa 2012

Retirement is the next big crisis. 401K's have been a miserable failure and have left Americans exposed to great risk of being poor in their old age.


Average 401(k) balance is $66,900

BY MARGARET COLLINS
Bloomberg News
Lawmakers concerned that Americans may outlive their savings are looking at ways to make the money last through retirement.

Workers who relied on traditional pensions are now trying to pay for retirement with their 401(k) savings, according to the Center for Retirement Research at Boston College. In 1983, 62 percent of workers had only company-funded pensions, while 12 percent had 401(k)s, the center said. In 2007, those numbers were 17 percent and 63 percent, respectively.

The average 401(k) account balance as of March 31 was $66,900, according to Boston-based Fidelity Investments, which has 11 million participants. The average monthly Social Security benefit as of April was $1,067.

Most American households at or near retirement ``are consumed by fear,'' said Anthony Webb, associate director of research at the research nonprofit. ``Instead of walking on the beach hand-in-hand in retirement, the reality is that they're sitting around the kitchen table cutting coupons.''

Legislators and regulators are focusing on income guarantees such as annuities to supplement traditional retirement plans. Annuities are insurance products that can provide monthly income for life in exchange for upfront payments.

Workers underestimate how much money they'll need in retirement and how long they'll live, said Roger Ferguson, chief executive officer and president of TIAA-CREF, whose New York-based firm manages $426 billion of retirement funds for 3.7 million teachers and academic researchers. The life expectancy of a 65-year-old U.S. male is 82, and 85 for a 65-year-old female, according to the Social Security Administration.

``Nearly half, or 47 percent, of those on the verge of retirement are predicted to run out of money,'' said Jack VanDerhei, research director for the Washington-based Employee Benefit Research Institute. ``They won't be able to cover their basic expenses and uninsured health care costs.'' EBRI has a database of 24 million 401(k) participants and 20 million IRA accounts.



Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/11/1675674/average-401k-balance-is-66900.html##ixzz1JF3nK19B

http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/11/1675674/average-401k-balance-is-66900.html#

[soonercoop1]

Sap...the most you can realistically cut is 2 or 3% a year...you cut more than that meager amount and you risk additional financial problems...3% would be about 90 billion...

Whatever we do must be put in place for a significant amount of time...slow, steady cuts...

While agree with you there is no way we will ever get this problem fixed at 2-3% a year in cuts...

[soonercoop1]

you mean some study from years ago proved that the total federal tax receipts (income tax, gas tax) was less than the benefits (SS, Welfare, Medicare/caid, highway and defense appropriations that were paid in OK?

OK itself does not pay income taxes....its citizens do.....and we are a net retirement state (more folks move here to retire than leave) so yeah.....a bunch of people paid income taxes living elsewhere (with higher incomes) and now live here and collect SS & medicare bennies.

Also, get rid of a progressive tax scheme and that'd end the debtor state debate.

besides......I seriously doubt most of us want to live or not live in OK based upon its GDP alone.

Agreed a flat tax is seriously needed so everyone pays including GE...

[pphilfran]

While agree with you there is no way we will ever get this problem fixed at 2-3% a year in cuts...

Yes you can...

We could resolve SS relatively easily...

Take 2% out of everything else each year and we are back in the race...

[soonercoop1]

Yes you can...

We could resolve SS relatively easily...

Take 2% out of everything else each year and we are back in the race...

Do you trust congress to hold to that without any increased spending and 2-3% per year in cuts? How long to pay off the debt at 2-3% per year?

[pphilfran]

Do you trust congress to hold to that without any increased spending and 2-3% per year in cuts? How long to pay off the debt at 2-3% per year?

Fat chance on trusting congress...

We don't have to pay off the debt...we need to keep it from getting higher...

The biggest key is GDP growth....we don't have that on a consistent basis and we will be screwed...we need 5% plus for a few years to suck up some of the unemployed...

We are going to eat some additional debt the next few years....put a long term plan into place and stick with it...consistent regs, consistent policy, consistent taxes...

[StoopTroup]

I think Companies all over America don't feel good about either Party's ideas about making things better.

[StoopTroup]

Do you trust congress to hold to that without any increased spending and 2-3% per year in cuts? How long to pay off the debt at 2-3% per year?

Trust Congress?

Hell...I don't trust any of you.....lol

[okie52]

I think Companies all over America don't feel good about either Party's ideas about making things better.

Obama is out to raise a billion dollar warchest. He may do it. If he does it will continue to show our poilitics is a lot less about ideology and more about greasing the powers that be.

[hawaii 5-0]

Obama is out to raise a billion dollar warchest. He may do it. If he does it will continue to show our poilitics is a lot less about ideology and more about greasing the powers that be.




He's just trying to keep up with the Koch Brothers.






5-0




Trump/Zippy 2012

[SoonerNate]

He's just trying to keep up with the Koch Brothers.






5-0




Trump/Zippy 2012

Or Soros... Your point?

[hawaii 5-0]

Or Soros... Your point?

My point is that the Koch Brothers have bought most of the Republican Governors and the Tea Baggers in Congress.

Now they want to buy the Presidency.



5-0





Trump/Newt 2012

[SoonerNate]

My point is that the Koch Brothers have bought most of the Republican Governors and the Tea Baggers in Congress.

Now they want to buy the Presidency.



5-0





Trump/Newt 2012

Link?

[StoopTroup]

Obama is out to raise a billion dollar warchest. He may do it. If he does it will continue to show our poilitics is a lot less about ideology and more about greasing the powers that be.

When did it stop being about that....lol

[bigfatjerk]

While agree with you there is no way we will ever get this problem fixed at 2-3% a year in cuts...

What if we privatize some things that would be cheaper and more efficient like how Indiana did with it's highway, or how about the incorporated cities are doing that are basically using corporations to help do municipal services in some cities. There's one in Georgia that's really been a success the last few years. Now they don't do it with police and other services. I think these would cut more than 2-3% over a year if they were done right. You can't just let these corporations have free reign and they have to do a list of things right to keep the deal going. But the government could really close the gap if they did these in a smart way. But then again I wouldn't accuse that many in our government of being smart.

[sappstuf]

Link?

Good luck with that!

[sappstuf]

Fat chance on trusting congress...

We don't have to pay off the debt...we need to keep it from getting higher...

And just think we were one senate vote from a balanced budget amendment back in the 90s...