A Terrible Divide - Bob Herbert NYT

[BoomerJack]

The Ronald Reagan crowd loved to talk about morning in America. For millions of individuals and families, perhaps the majority, it’s more like twilight — with nighttime coming on fast.
Look out the window. More and more Americans are being left behind in an economy that is being divided ever more starkly between the haves and the have-nots. Not only are millions of people jobless and millions more underemployed, but more and more of the so-called fringe benefits and public services that help make life livable, or even bearable, in a modern society are being put to the torch.
Employer-based pensions, paid vacations, health benefits and the like are going the way of phone booths and VCRs. As poverty increases and reliable employment becomes less and less the norm, the dwindling number of workers with any sort of job security or guaranteed pensions (think teachers and other modestly compensated public employees) are being viewed with increasing contempt. How dare they enjoy a modicum of economic comfort?
It turns out that a lot of those jobs were never so secure, after all. As the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities tells us:
“At least 44 states and the District of Columbia have reduced overall wages paid to state workers by laying off workers, requiring them to take unpaid leave (furloughs), freezing hew hires, or similar actions. State and local governments have eliminated 407,000 jobs since August 2008, federal data show.”
We have not faced up to the scale of the economic crisis that still confronts the United States.
Standards of living for the people on the wrong side of the economic divide are being ratcheted lower and will remain that way for many years to come. Forget the fairy tales being spun by politicians in both parties — that somehow they can impose service cuts that are drastic enough to bring federal and local budgets into balance while at the same time developing economic growth strong enough to support a robust middle class. It would take a Bernie Madoff to do that.
In the real world, schools and libraries are being closed and other educational services are being curtailed. Police officers are being fired. Access to health services for poor families is being restricted. “At least 29 states and the District of Columbia,” according to the budget center, “are cutting medical, rehabilitative, home care, or other services needed by low-income people who are elderly or have disabilities, or are significantly increasing the cost of these services.”
For a variety of reasons, there are not enough tax revenues being generated to pay for the basic public services that one would expect in an advanced country like the United States. The rich are not shouldering their fair share of the tax burden. The wars in Afghanistan and Iraq continue to consume an insane amount of revenue. And there are not enough jobs available at decent enough pay to ease some of the demand for public services while at the same time increasing the amount of taxes paid by ordinary workers.
The U.S. cannot cut its way out of this crisis. Instead of trying to figure out how to keep 4-year-olds out of pre-kindergarten classes, or how to withhold life-saving treatments from Medicaid recipients, or how to cheat the elderly out of their Social Security, the nation’s leaders should be trying seriously to figure out what to do about the future of the American work force.
Enormous numbers of workers are in grave danger of being left behind permanently. Businesses have figured out how to prosper without putting the unemployed back to work in jobs that pay well and offer decent benefits.
Corporate profits and the stock markets are way up. Businesses are sitting atop mountains of cash. Put people back to work? Forget about it. Has anyone bothered to notice that much of those profits are the result of aggressive payroll-cutting — companies making do with fewer, less well-paid and harder-working employees?
For American corporations, the action is increasingly elsewhere. Their interests are not the same as those of workers, or the country as a whole. As Harold Meyerson put it in The American Prospect: “Our corporations don’t need us anymore. Half their revenues come from abroad. Their products, increasingly, come from abroad as well.”
American workers are in a world of hurt. Anyone who thinks that politicians can improve this sorry state of affairs by hacking away at Social Security, Medicare and the public schools are great candidates for involuntary commitment.
New ideas on a grand scale are needed. The United States can’t thrive with so many of its citizens condemned to shrunken standards of living because they can’t find adequate employment. Long-term joblessness is a recipe for societal destabilization. It should not be tolerated in a country with as much wealth as the United States. It’s destructive, and it’s wrong.

[Veritas]

You can always count on objectivity from an article that starts with "the <insert soandso here> crowd." :rolleyes:


look out the window. More and more Americans are being left behind in an economy that is being divided ever more starkly between the haves and the have-nots.
Bull****. The country is divided between the responsible and the irresponsible, and unfortunately the latter greatly outnumber the former.

[47straight]

Pretty par for the course for the NYT. Lots of bitching and whining, no actual ideas, plans, or solutions.

[The Profit]

Pretty par for the course for the NYT. Lots of bitching and whining, no actual ideas, plans, or solutions.



You are correct. The op-ed piece doesn't describe any changes as much as it forecasts a revolution. You have to admit, real class warfare would be fun to watch.

[OklahomaTuba]

As poverty increases and reliable employment becomes less and less the norm, the dwindling number of workers with any sort of job security or guaranteed pensions (think teachers and other modestly compensated public employees) are being viewed with increasing contempt.Welcome to "Hope and Change".

[soonerscuba]

Bull****. The country is divided between the responsible and the irresponsible, and unfortunately the latter greatly outnumber the former.I wish I could agree with you but I simply cannot. Have you seen the qualified competition for open spots? I think we are far beyond bootstraps at this point.

I'm not so simple minded as to blame it on one president, party or policy, but history is an indicator of what happens when the population splits too widely, it's generally unfavorable, regardless of what the root cause was.

[OklahomaTuba]

Have you seen the qualified competition for open spots?Is it full of illegal aliens that shouldn't be here, foreign workers we don't need but keep letting in, or affirmative action cases?

Or maybe it's a trick question, cause there aren't any open spots (unless you work in Government anyhow).

[The Profit]

Is it full of illegal aliens that shouldn't be here, foreign workers we don't need but keep letting in, or affirmative action cases?

Or maybe it's a trick question, cause there aren't any open spots (unless you work in Government anyhow).



Tuba, do you remember who let the first 3 million illegals in the country, and why he did it? Yes, there are many open spots that would be available in roofing, landscaping, construction, etc. The pay is minimum wage. There are no benefits. There is no paid vacation, no sick leave, etc. But, it is work and there are openings.

Ending illegal employment is easy. When an owner of a company is caught with illegal workers, fine them $100K per illegal and give them 1 year in federal prison. I am not talking about a manager or assistant manager. I am talking about the CEO and/or President. Put the white collar fellows in the pen, and illegal employment will come to an end.

[oudanny]

The article only addresses one side of the equation. Just as you can't cut your way out of the economic mess we're in, you can't tax and spend your way out either. The government leaders need to step up and make some hard choices as do the American people. Self discipline and personal accountability need to move front and center.

[The Profit]

The article only addresses one side of the equation. Just as you can't cut your way out of the economic mess we're in, you can't tax and spend your way out either. The government leaders need to step up and make some hard choices as do the American people. Self discipline and personal accountability need to move front and center.



While president, Ronald Reagan proposed and signed into law a "Deficit Reduction Tax." Is this type of tax in order today?

[OklahomaTuba]

Yes, there are many open spots that would be available in roofing, landscaping, construction, etc. The pay is minimum wage. There are no benefits. There is no paid vacation, no sick leave, etc. But, it is work and there are openings.So this is Obama's "new normal".

Or, as the libz called it: Hope and Change?

[The Profit]

So this is Obama's "new normal".

Or, as the libz called it: Hope and Change?




Why do you try to make everything partisan or political? I just stated that there are jobs out there, and what kind of jobs there are.

[sperry]

This article is spot on. It is horrible out there right now. I attend one of the nations elite law schools and about 50% of my class has been unable to obtain employment. One of my friends in the law school runs a telecommunications business in New York City. He advertised a position for a secratary, and received 400 applications in the first day, many of whom from people with professional degrees. It's not about responsibility or irresponsibility.

[OklahomaTuba]

This is a terrible trend.


U.S. poverty rate jumps record amount

The U.S. poverty rate has skyrocketed by a record amount under the Obama administration, with one out of seven Americans considered poor last year, according to a report Saturday.

The disturbing trend is an estimate of 2009 census data set for release on Thursday, The Associated Press reported.

Underscoring the depth of the recession, a projected 45 million people - or about 15% of the population - were poor last year. In 2008, 13.2% of the country lived in poverty.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2010/09/12/2010-09-12_soaring_poverty_rate_hits_dismal_high__45_milli on.html#ixzz1DOA6IK00



Record Number of Americans Receiving Food Stamp Benefits
The number of Americans receiving federal aid through the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program, commonly known as food stamps, soared to a record 40.8 million in May, according to government data released shortly before the Senate voted to cut billions from the food stamps budget.
The Senate voted Thursday to cut $12 billion from the program in order to help fund a $26 billion package to help states avoid teacher layoffs.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/08/05/record-number-americans-receiving-food-stamp-benefits/#ixzz1DOB0MquS

[The Profit]

This article is spot on. It is horrible out there right now. I attend one of the nations elite law schools and about 50% of my class has been unable to obtain employment. One of my friends in the law school runs a telecommunications business in New York City. He advertised a position for a secratary, and received 400 applications in the first day, many of whom from people with professional degrees. It's not about responsibility or irresponsibility.



The bad news for you is that there are too damn many lawyers. Law schools are going to have to wise up and reduce the amount of students they have in each class.

[C&CDean]

This article is spot on. It is horrible out there right now. I attend one of the nations elite law schools and about 50% of my class has been unable to obtain employment. One of my friends in the law school runs a telecommunications business in New York City. He advertised a position for a secratary, and received 400 applications in the first day, many of whom from people with professional degrees. It's not about responsibility or irresponsibility.

This oughta tell you that there's WAY too many lawyers out there. There's no shortage of work for folks in the health care industry.

[Breadburner]

Hope in one hand Change in the other...See which one fills up first....

[OklahomaTuba]

Why do you try to make everything partisan or political?Well it is a political thread, in case you didn't notice the first thing mentioned was RR.

[The Profit]

Well it is a political thread, in case you didn't notice.




I thought it was an economic thread in which you inserted politics. My bad.

[soonerscuba]

Why do you try to make everything partisan or political? I just stated that there are jobs out there, and what kind of jobs there are.If you aren't familiar with his schtick, let me break it down for you. Republicans: good, Democrats: bad. The end.

[OklahomaTuba]

I thought it was an economic thread in which you inserted politics. My bad.You must have not read the article then.

[OklahomaTuba]

If you aren't familiar with his schtick, let me break it down for you. Republicans: good, Democrats: bad. The end.Which is basically your schtick, just in reverse.

[The Profit]

You must have not read the article then.




I read it. While it was obviously written by someone from the left, it was still an economic article. There will be class warfare (either theoretical or actual) in this country if the imbalance between haves and have nots continues to increase. I don't really see that as a dem vs. rep. thing, though.

[StoopTroup]

You can always count on objectivity from an article that starts with "the <insert soandso here> crowd." :rolleyes:


Bull****. The country is divided between the responsible and the irresponsible, and unfortunately the latter greatly outnumber the former.

Well V....I can agree with you and I can agree with a good portion of the article too.

I was watching a show on the History Channel "10 days that unexpectedly changed America" which was about the Homestead Strike which was a battle over harsh working conditions in Carnegie's Steel Mill. Workers at the Mill and Management were pitted against each other by Carnegie.

I am sure there will be those who disagree and those who might not but I do believe we have seen huge changes in the Middle Class in our Country over the last decade. Also the way we keep our military staffed during this administration and the last has become a political time bomb. Using our National Guard the way we did will have effects that I hope don't leave us unprepared on the Home Front. Losing our rights to own guns and using our NG abroad concern me as an American. It might not be an eminent concern but I believe that can only be measured should we need the NG to suddenly defend the Home Front. Something I hope we never have to do.

During Homestead the Unions lost their hold and things changed considerably.

Now Unions aren't so prevalent but many of the benefits workers in America have received over the years were as a result of Unions and Labor Forces negotiating them with Companies.

It's easy to dismiss however if you were educated to run a company as efficiently as possible, why would you offer your employees anything other than a job with a wage they would accept? The answer if course is benefits were used as a way to hire people cheaper at one point in our history. Now that many companies overhead are out if control they have fired portions of their workforce and rehired them with contract employees who are just looking for work. Union employees are basically contracted employees. My point is of course that these tactics will all result in changes in our economy. It has already.

The Bush Administration and the RNC were faced with what to do as the wealthy that lobbied for their own agendas cared not for their employees...they worried about the bottom-line. The current administration and the DNC aren't much different either.

The divide between rich and poor continues to widen. Attempts to quickly payoff debt that has taken decades to create will lead to disaster too. Longterm sacrifice on everyones part not just the poor and whats left of the middle class in America. We may need to change a bunch of laws and eliminate handouts and relief for all but the poor. At that point you can begin to find out who really wants to be apart of strengthening Americas role in keeping the World a peaceful place. We are still pouring billions of our taxes across our borders to help keep other Countries as our friends. You can't buy friends. You earn their respect. We've been buying off people for way to long IMO

[OklahomaTuba]

I read it. While it was obviously written by someone from the left, it was still an economic article.Sure, it's an economic article, for nitwits who can't read beyond a 4th grade level and have never read a real economic article in their life.

The fact you think this POS opinion piece from a political hack at the worst newspaper in the country is some sort of economic article is pretty damn funny.

[The Profit]

Sure, it's an economic article, for nitwits who can't read beyond a 4th grade level and have never read a real economic article in their life.

The fact you think this POS opinion piece from a political hack at the worst newspaper in the country is some sort of economic article is pretty damn funny.




Please don't allow facts to get in your way. Year in, and year out, the worst rated newspaper in the United States is our own Daily Oklahoman.

I stated that the article was obviously written by someone on the left (even a nit wit with a 4th grade level reading prowess would have noticed that), but there are certain points in the op-ed piece that are correct. We are headed for class warfare in this country, whether you choose to believe it or not.

[OklahomaTuba]

During Homestead the Unions lost their hold and things changed considerably.

Now Unions aren't so prevalent but many of the benefits workers in America have received over the years were as a result of Unions and Labor Forces negotiating them with Companies. No, unions lost "their hold" on things when they started worrying more about their political & economic self interests and less about what was best for their workers and the companies producing a quality globally competitive product.

But thankfully they now have "a hold" of our government, which they are quickly bankrupting as well.

Wash. Rinse. Repeat.

[Mississippi Sooner]

My class can beat up your class. Hell, my class can beat up the whole damn school.

[StoopTroup]

I read it. While it was obviously written by someone from the left, it was still an economic article. There will be class warfare (either theoretical or actual) in this country if the imbalance between haves and have nots continues to increase. I don't really see that as a dem vs. rep. thing, though.

They want you to believe that it is though. Right now the RNC is relieved that they were able to pull it off again. The DNC can't believe they pulled it off with Obama and is now trying to institute RNC ideas in an attempt to discredit them and regain their hold on the Senate and House and possibly pull off a re-election of Obama too. We as sheep continue to try and keep from vomiting. Hopefully a leader will emerge.

[OklahomaTuba]

We are headed for class warfare in this country, whether you choose to believe it or not.No, we're there already my friend. But its not the classes you want it to be. Its the private class vs the public class IMO.

[KantoSooner]

Some random thoughts:

1. You can't cut the federal budget without addressing the Military, Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security. Aside from those four, the rest of the budget is effectively meaningless. So, to live within our means, these four must be cut. There is undoubtedly waste and fraud and abuse in all four budgets. Enough to make the nut? Doubt it, but it should a bipartisan place to get started.

2. Are we short jobs? Or short jobs that people want? Probably both. But we could do a better 'job' at matching people up and providing relo expenses to those who'll move to where the work is.

3. foreign competition? live with it. I don't want to go back to $30 terry cloth bath towels and/or making a budget decision when buying sneakers. Life is competitive and that extends across borders. Do monkey see monkey do work: get paid bananas.

4. Pay for value. Is anyone really 'worth' what people on Wall Street are paid? Of course not. Is any CEO worth $100 mill a year? No. So, write to your retirement fund manager and tell him to vote against high compensation. Your letter will be meaningless. Yours plus 100,000 others will have his undivided attention.

5. Live within your means. 'Poor' Americans live lives that would beggar the imagination of many around the world. Color TVs, cars, cell phones, etc, etc. Every single one of us can get by on less. do so. Save your money to keep yourself safe. If you're so motivated, help out a family member or friend. Charity is impossible with a maxed out credit card.

[The Profit]

They want you to believe that it is though. Right now the RNC is relieved that they were able to pull it off again. The DNC can't believe they pulled it off with Obama and is now trying to institute RNC ideas in an attempt to discredit them and regain their hold on the Senate and House and possibly pull off a re-election of Obama too. We as sheep continue to try and keep from vomiting. Hopefully a leader will emerge.



Stoop, big banks and corporations control this country more than they ever have. How many wall street bankers have been indicted as a result of what happened during shrub's last year? What has happened to reign them in so that nothing like this will ever happen again. We worry about some poor illiterate punk, who robs a bank of $1,000.00, but we do nothing about bankers, who robbed the nation of billions, and sent millions of Americans to the unemployment lines.

[TUSooner]

Bull****. The country is divided between the responsible and the irresponsible, and unfortunately the latter greatly outnumber the former.


I wish I could agree with you but I simply cannot. Have you seen the qualified competition for open spots? I think we are far beyond bootstraps at this point.

I'm not so simple minded as to blame it on one president, party or policy, but history is an indicator of what happens when the population splits too widely, it's generally unfavorable, regardless of what the root cause was.

Veritas seems to have swallowed one of Tuba's facile bromides in this case. Sure, there's no substitute for responsibility and hard work, which are vital to any CHANCE at success. But that's no excuse for letting circumstances decay to where they crush the less fortunate, even the less able.

Besides, what do we think "irresponsible" people do when things get really tough and all the righteous and responsible folks tell them, "Tough sh!t! You shoulda been us." Historically, I don't think they have sat down and starved, saying, "Yeah, it's only what we deserve, after all."

Ideology is not the same as politics, and even good ideology is not the same as good politics.

PS- This is a general comment and not an endorsement of the NYT or Bob Herbert or the article in question.

[Chuck Bao]

I am an economist and I thought the article was spot on. Like it or not, Tuba, the US economy has changed and the workplace has changed, thanks to the change in technology. Lifetime employment and fringe benefits like healthcare insurance are out the window. Even state employees are going to have to lose their benefits. It sucks, I know.

[The Profit]

No, we're there already my friend. But its not the classes you want it to be. Its the private class vs the public class IMO.




Tuba, you make a valid point. The last president, who shrunk the size of government was Bill Clinton. I would like to see it shrink again. The military could be shrunk in half, and still be effective (after the wars are over, of course). The Dept. of Homeland Security should be eliminated. Do we really need an office of Veterans Affairs? Couldn't that be handled by another office. Just like consolidating schools, we should be able to consolidate government.

[OklahomaTuba]

Stoop, big banks and corporations control this country more than they ever have. How many wall street bankers have been indicted as a result of what happened during shrub's last year?It helps when nearly all the wall street bankers are democrats, and run the treasury dept, fed, etc (http://articles.cnn.com/2010-04-20/politics/obama.goldman.donations_1_obama-campaign-presidential-campaign-federal-election-commission-figures?_s=PM:POLITICS).

[The Profit]

It helps when nearly all the wall street bankers are democrats, and run the treasury dept, fed, etc (http://articles.cnn.com/2010-04-20/politics/obama.goldman.donations_1_obama-campaign-presidential-campaign-federal-election-commission-figures?_s=PM:POLITICS).



"You just make stuff up and tell it for the truth" was a line from the very funny book, "My Brother was an Only Child." This is what you have done with your assertion that most Wall Street Bankers are Democrats. It is simply not true. But, hey, you are consistent.

[OklahomaTuba]

Tuba, you make a valid point. The last president, who shrunk the size of government was Bill Clinton.
Thanks to the GOP's republican revolution on 1994, and the end of the cold war's "peace divided".

Unfortunately, he gutted the military and intelligence too much, and we're still paying for that in Afghanistan & in a big open hole in Manhattan.

[The Profit]

It helps when nearly all the wall street bankers are democrats, and run the treasury dept, fed, etc (http://articles.cnn.com/2010-04-20/politics/obama.goldman.donations_1_obama-campaign-presidential-campaign-federal-election-commission-figures?_s=PM:POLITICS).




That doesn't equate to them being Democrats. They were just smart enough not to vote for a melanoma besieged old man for president and an Alaskan baked-brain for Vice President.

[MR2-Sooner86]

Lets burn it down and start over then!

Anarchy FTW!

[The Profit]

Thanks to the GOP's republican revolution on 1994, and the end of the cold war's "peace divided".

Unfortunately, he gutted the military and intelligence too much, and we're still paying for that in Afghanistan & in a big open hole in Manhattan.





Oh damn, I forgot. It was Bill Clinton, who had been president for 8 months when the hole in NYC was created. It was that same Bill Clinton, who in August (one month before 9/11) was warned of the upcoming attack, and who ignored the warning, failed to warn the American public and instead chose to cut firewood in front of Fox TV cameras.

Bill Clinton increased military spending in 7 of the 8 years he was president, but please don't let facts get in the way.

[OklahomaTuba]

That doesn't equate to them being Democrats. No, they were looking out for themselves first. They knew Uncle Barry and Aunt Nancy would take care of them, keep them outta jail, etc. And boy did they!!!!!

[SoonerProphet]

Do we really need an office of Veterans Affairs? Couldn't that be handled by another office.

Ooooh, don't let these Reagan fanboys hear you talk like this. He was all about small government.:rolleyes:

[Bourbon St Sooner]

I am an economist and I thought the article was spot on. Like it or not, Tuba, the US economy has changed and the workplace has changed, thanks to the change in technology. Lifetime employment and fringe benefits like healthcare insurance are out the window. Even state employees are going to have to lose their benefits. It sucks, I know.

The article may be right about some things, but it's clearly calling for another spending orgy to create another temporary "fix". The problem is we've created an empire on debt. Our economy was propped up by spending money we don't have and the longer we continue this, the worse the crash is going to be.

As for the divide, we can thank the Fed and their bankster buddies for that. The Fed's loose monetary policy has just created asset bubble after asset bubble that has eventually burst. And of couse the banksters get bailed out by the taxpayers and the rest of us get left taking it in the shorts, including many public employee pension funds which are so woefully underfunded.

[sperry]

No, they were looking out for themselves first. They knew Uncle Barry and Aunt Nancy would take care of them, keep them outta jail, etc. And boy did they!!!!!



Looking out for their best interests? It is the Republiican party who has always been in favor of deregulating their industry, and in fact did, which gave free reign for the bankers to do essentially whatever they want.

[Veritas]

Veritas seems to have swallowed one of Tuba's facile bromides in this case.
+1 for the use of "facile bromides."

[OutlandTrophy]

If a person can figure out how to get to Williston, ND he/she can make a great amount of money right now.

If a person has a technical 4 year degree he/she can make a great living in Oklahoma right now.

If a person has a strong back and work ethic he/she can make a great living in Oklahoma right now.

You're going to have to work a little longer than 8-5 every day.

[BoomerJack]

Let me throw in the following comments from Greg Pallast from 2004:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

You're not going to like this. You shouldn't speak ill of the dead. But in this case, someone's got to.

On the 100th Anniversary of Ronald Reagan's birth, as we suffer a week of Reagan-kitcheria and pukey paeans, let us remember:
Reagan was a con-man. Reagan was a coward. Reagan was a killer.

In 1987, I found myself stuck in a crappy little town in Nicaragua named Chaguitillo. The people were kind enough, though hungry, except for one surly young man. His wife had just died of tuberculosis.

People don't die of TB if they get some antibiotics. But Ronald Reagan, big-hearted guy that he was, had put a lock-down embargo on medicine to Nicaragua because he didn't like the government that the people there had elected.

Ronnie grinned and cracked jokes while the young woman's lungs filled up and she stopped breathing. Reagan flashed that B-movie grin while they buried the mother of three.

And when Hezbollah terrorists struck and murdered hundreds of American marines in their sleep in Lebanon, the TV warrior ran away like a whipped dog — then turned around and invaded Grenada. That little Club Med war was a murderous PR stunt so Ronnie could hold parades for gunning down Cubans building an airport.

I remember Nancy, a skull and crossbones prancing around in designer dresses, some of the "gifts" that flowed to the Reagans — from hats to million-dollar homes — from cronies well compensated with government loot. It used to be called bribery.

And all the while, Grandpa grinned, the grandfather who bleated on about "family values" but didn't bother to see his own grandchildren.
The New York Times, in its canned obit, wrote that Reagan projected, "faith in small town America" and "old-time values."

"Values" my ***. It was union-busting and a declaration of war on the poor and anyone who couldn't buy designer dresses. It was the New Meanness, bringing starvation back to America so that every millionaire could get another million.

"Small town" values? From the movie star of the Pacific Palisades, the Malibu mogul? I want to throw up.

And all the while, in the White House basement, as his brain boiled away, Reagan's last conscious act was to condone a coup d'état against our elected Congress. Reagan's Defense Secretary Casper the Ghost Weinberger with the crazed Colonel, Ollie North, plotted to give guns to the Monster of the Mideast, Ayatolla Khomeini.

Reagan's boys called Jimmy Carter a weanie and a wuss although Carter wouldn't give an inch to the Ayatollah. Reagan, with that film-fantasy tough-guy con in front of cameras, went begging like a coward cockroach to Khomeini, pleading on bended knee for the release of our hostages.
Ollie North flew into Iran with a birthday cake for the maniac mullah — no kidding — in the shape of a key. The key to Ronnie's heart.
Then the Reagan roaches mixed their cowardice with crime: taking cash from the hostage-takers to buy guns for the "contras" — the drug-runners of Nicaragua posing as freedom fighters.

I remember as a student in Berkeley the words screeching out of the bullhorn, "The Governor of the State of California, Ronald Reagan, hereby orders this demonstration to disperse" — and then came the teargas and the truncheons. And all the while, that fang-hiding grin from the Gipper.

In Chaguitillo, all night long, the farmers stayed awake to guard their kids from attack from Reagan's Contra terrorists. The farmers weren't even Sandinistas, those 'Commies' that our cracked-brained President told us were 'only a 48-hour drive from Texas.' What the hell would they want with Texas, anyway?

Nevertheless, the farmers, and their families, were Ronnie's targets.

In the deserted darkness of Chaguitillo, a TV blared. Weirdly, it was that third-rate gangster movie, "Brother Rat." Starring Ronald Reagan.

Well, mis amigos, your kids can sleep easy tonight. The Rat is dead.

All week you're going to hear about how Reagan restored America's sense of patriotism - as if heartless slaughter, Club Med wars and making racism respectable are patriotic . (When they said "small town values" you know the color of the town, don't you?).

I wonder if the Reaganauts can recognize any of the weapons they sold the mullahs when they see students gunned down in Teheran.

I do plan a memorial, for the victims, not the victimizer.

Please join me in commemorating the ill star that brought us a celluloid cowboy on his movie-set horsey by lighting a candle for a mom from Chaguitillo.
******
This obituary was originally published in The London Observer on Reagan's death in 2004.

[47straight]

Wow, that was really even-balanced and carefully considered all the facts.

[pphilfran]

This article is spot on. It is horrible out there right now. I attend one of the nations elite law schools and about 50% of my class has been unable to obtain employment. One of my friends in the law school runs a telecommunications business in New York City. He advertised a position for a secratary, and received 400 applications in the first day, many of whom from people with professional degrees. It's not about responsibility or irresponsibility.

That entire line of work is non value added...the less we need/have the better...

What type of degrees did those applicants have? Could it be that we have too many degrees is some professions?

The fed says everyone needs to own a house...so they implement their plan... and they create a bubble...

The fed says everyone needs a degree...so they implement their plan... and they create a bubble...

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Let me throw in the following comments from Greg Pallast from 2004:


Are you the left wing RLIMC cut and paster? Do you have any original thoughts or do you just want to cut and paste other people's **** over here?

[Bourbon St Sooner]

This article is spot on. It is horrible out there right now. I attend one of the nations elite law schools and about 50% of my class has been unable to obtain employment. One of my friends in the law school runs a telecommunications business in New York City. He advertised a position for a secratary, and received 400 applications in the first day, many of whom from people with professional degrees. It's not about responsibility or irresponsibility.

Lawyers can't find a job? Maybe things are getting better in this country after all.

[Chuck Bao]

That entire line of work is non value added...the less we need/have the better...

What type of degrees did those applicants have? Could it be that we have too many degrees is some professions?

The fed says everyone needs to own a house...so they implement their plan... and they create a bubble...

The fed says everyone needs a degree...so they implement their plan... and they create a bubble...


I couldn't disagree more with that line of thinking. Of course, everyone should be given the opportunity to own their own home. That wasn't the problem since people have to live somewhere. The problem was in very shoddy and overly aggressive banking practices.

Likewise, people should be given the opportunity to further their education. I don't think that a bubble of over-educated people really is the key to our economic problem.

[TMcGee86]

Reagan's boys called Jimmy Carter a weanie and a wuss although Carter wouldn't give an inch to the Ayatollah.

This is laughable not only in it's falsehood but its stupidity.

[Leroy Lizard]

Are you the left wing RLIMC cut and paster? Do you have any original thoughts or do you just want to cut and paste some fruitcake's **** over here?

FIFY.

[Blue]

I wish I could agree with you but I simply cannot. Have you seen the qualified competition for open spots? I think we are far beyond bootstraps at this point.

I'm not so simple minded as to blame it on one president, party or policy, but history is an indicator of what happens when the population splits too widely, it's generally unfavorable, regardless of what the root cause was.

+1.

Imo, the riots in Egypt have little to do with democracy, freedom, religion, etc...It's just a crumbling economy and many youngsters with little or no hope for their future. As the global economy gets worse, we'll see it in many more countries.

We've already seen it in Greece, Ireland, Iceland, and many others.

[The Profit]

This is laughable not only in it's falsehood but its stupidity.




Not defending Carter, but why was that laughable. He, in fact, didn't give an inch to Khomeini. Although the rescue attempt sadly and unfortunately failed, Carter did not give an inch, did not try and trade weapons for the hostages, etc.

[Blue]

This oughta tell you that there's WAY too many lawyers out there. There's no shortage of work for folks in the health care industry.

Not necessarily true. I know quite a few folks in that industry that are newly graduated and having trouble finding work. They are being passed over for more experienced applicants. Hell even your line of work is slashing post offices and jobs all over.

It's ugly out there.

[pphilfran]

I couldn't disagree more with that line of thinking. Of course, everyone should be given the opportunity to own their own home. That wasn't the problem since people have to live somewhere. The problem was in very shoddy and overly aggressive banking practices.

Likewise, people should be given the opportunity to further their education. I don't think that a bubble of over-educated people really is the key to our economic problem.

Clinton started the easy money and wanted everyone to own a home...to build wealth...future administrations followed in his footsteps...to allow everyone to own a home exotic loans were allowed...the banks pushed those looser limits to the edge...it was a joint effort...

Not everyone needs to go to college...trade schools or Vo Techs make much more sense to a large part of our population...

I am not saying a degree is a bad thing...just saying easy fed money fuels the over expansion of housing and college prices...

[sperry]

That entire line of work is non value added...the less we need/have the better...

What type of degrees did those applicants have? Could it be that we have too many degrees is some professions?

The fed says everyone needs to own a house...so they implement their plan... and they create a bubble...

The fed says everyone needs a degree...so they implement their plan... and they create a bubble...



This is true in most industries, not just the law. Nurses and doctors and doctors are in high demand, and I would imagine engineers are as well. That being said, most people couldnt' hack it in those professions. I just commented on the legal industry because I have first hand experience (although I personally have employment lined up).


Also, I agree with you that there are too many lawyers, and that it's not really a value added position. But do you know why most people are in law school? It's because they applied and couldn't find work out of undergrad, or they were laid off from their current positions.

You say, "well we have too many degrees in some professions." That's probably true as well. Again, most people cannot excel in mathematics or the hard sciences. Should those people simply be unable to work, or if they can find work, be forced to accept abysmal salaries and low benefits?


If you're the same poster from the old board, I believe you're a PLM. I have many friends who are either currently in the energy management program, or recent graduates of the program, and they are having an incredibly hard time lining up work as well.

[Blue]

The article may be right about some things, but it's clearly calling for another spending orgy to create another temporary "fix". The problem is we've created an empire on debt. Our economy was propped up by spending money we don't have and the longer we continue this, the worse the crash is going to be.

As for the divide, we can thank the Fed and their bankster buddies for that. The Fed's loose monetary policy has just created asset bubble after asset bubble that has eventually burst. And of couse the banksters get bailed out by the taxpayers and the rest of us get left taking it in the shorts, including many public employee pension funds which are so woefully underfunded.

+1.

[sperry]

Clinton started the easy money and wanted everyone to own a home...to build wealth...future administrations followed in his footsteps...to allow everyone to own a home exotic loans were allowed...the banks pushed those looser limits to the edge...it was a joint effort...

Not everyone needs to go to college...trade schools or Vo Techs make much more sense to a large part of our population...

I am not saying a degree is a bad thing...just saying easy fed money fuels the over expansion of housing and college prices...


This country has rapidly lost it's decent paying blue collar jobs. More people go to college because it's the only way you even have a prayer of making a decent living.

[Leroy Lizard]

With his display of logic and writing skills, I find it hard to believe that Greg Palast graduated from a university.

EDIT: On second thought, I guess I can believe it. (shudder)

[StoopTroup]

Stoop, big banks and corporations control this country more than they ever have. How many wall street bankers have been indicted as a result of what happened during shrub's last year? What has happened to reign them in so that nothing like this will ever happen again. We worry about some poor illiterate punk, who robs a bank of $1,000.00, but we do nothing about bankers, who robbed the nation of billions, and sent millions of Americans to the unemployment lines.

Thanks....after 22 years of working for a huge Corporation...I finally understand who is in charge.

How many Folks at Enron went to jail?

Why is Bill Bartmann still allowed to do business in Tulsa like he's some sort of hero?

I'm sure we all wonder just how some of these folks get away with what they do. It's called Bankruptcy. It works well for some and others....it ruins their lives. Bankruptcy used to be a way to start over and to many folks misused it. Now the laws have changed and many what I believe are pure criminals have gone on to start other businesses. The Meek and the Folks with a Conscience aren't even given a second thought. Every chance I get to do business with a small business...I do it....even if they are a little more expensive than McDonalds, Walmart and Subway.

[picasso]

The rich gap grew wider in the 90's.

[soonercoop1]

While president, Ronald Reagan proposed and signed into law a "Deficit Reduction Tax." Is this type of tax in order today?

Not before the federal government is drastically reduced in size and scope then we can talk otherwise it is a nonstarter...

[soonerscuba]

The rich gap grew wider in the 90's.This is exactly why I don't think tax policy can realistically fix our income gap problem. The economy is focused on service-based, consultative positions that are a natural byproduct of an information based society, and no amount of taxation is going to fix that. I do believe that funding follows revenue and eventually the rich are going to take it in the shorts by sheer and overwhelming necessity. If that is a democratic process or not depends on a lot of factors to which no one really has any knowledge.

I actually agree that college is a complete and total farce for a solid percentage of undergrads if one isn't in for requisite training for a career, but that doesn't mean I would discourage it in that learning is a virtue unto itself. I read that plumbers could be looking at $150-200/hour in the next decade, that is better billable hour that some attorneys and consultants, and frankly better hours and less pressure why we aren't drilling this into high school students heads is beyond me.

[My Opinion Matters]

This oughta tell you that there's WAY too many lawyers out there. There's no shortage of work for folks in the health care industry.

Bull****. While this might be what people hear on Fox News, or read in Time Magazine, or hear from college and trade school recruiters this is no longer the case for many real-world healthcare job seekers that havegraduated from accredited programs and are professionally licensed. In many subsectors of healthcare the market is saturated to near epidemic levels, and thus far the response of every college, university, and trade school is denial; denial that is in the very least irresponsible and borderline unethical.

[sperry]

Bull****. While this might be what people hear on Fox News, or read in Time Magazine, or hear from college and trade school recruiters this is no longer the case for many real-world healthcare job seekers that havegraduated from accredited programs and are professionally licensed. In many subsectors of healthcare the market is saturated to near epidemic levels, and thus far the response of every college, university, and trade school is denial; denial that is in the very least irresponsible and borderline unethical.


Can't be anythign compared to the legal industry. I go to one of the premiere law schools in the country. Over 200 law firms came for our OCI, whereas a typical law school is going o have about 25-30 employers come, and STILL only about 50-60% of my class was able to obtain employment. I shudder to think what it's like for grads of a respectable school like OU or OCU.

[soonercruiser]

This oughta tell you that there's WAY too many lawyers out there. There's no shortage of work for folks in the health care industry.

Yes, but, Thank GOD not all lawyers want to chase ambulences for a living!
:D

[soonercruiser]

If you aren't familiar with his schtick, let me break it down for you. Republicans: good, Democrats: bad. The end.

The problems is....Demoncrats, liberals, and regressives are making a political careers out of creating dependency in the government.....rather than creating opportinities and independance for Americans.