Should Marijuana be legal

[CowboyMRW]

I don't know if yall have had this debate and if you have you can let it die, but do you think that it should be legal.

I do, and I don't even smoke. But I think that we could put a big tax on it and that could be more funds for the US.

Also, people that get high just sit around and laugh and do nothing. It's not like they're just going out and driving. And if they do, they don't even drive 30.

[olevetonahill]

Yup
This subject has been " HASHED " over :D

[cccasooner2]

Yes, but only if I have sole distribution rights. (Well, I might share with one or two of you.)

.

[Penguin]

If you outlaw marijuana, only the crooks will have marijuana.

[C O R N * D O G]

nLsCC0LZxkY

[Sooner5030]

Legalization would not be in the form that would be consistent with personal freedom. To get through congress it'd be heavily regulated and only the connected folks (corp farms and unions) would be able to get through the barriers to entry in order to produce and distribute.

[SicEmBaylor]

Yes, absolutely.

[FirstandGoal]

In all honesty, IDGAS.

Never smoked it, never plan to.

If it gets legalized, meh.
If is stays illegal, meh.

I just don't get what the big deal is.

[Leroy Lizard]

People argue over this?

[olevetonahill]

In all honesty, IDGAS.

Never smoked it, never plan to.

If it gets legalized, meh.
If is stays illegal, meh.

I just don't get what the big deal is.

It must be a great seasoning, Cause it sure do make food taste better :D

[SicEmBaylor]

In all honesty, IDGAS.

Never smoked it, never plan to.

If it gets legalized, meh.
If is stays illegal, meh.

I just don't get what the big deal is.

I've never smoked it either. The big deal to me is that it's an issue of individual liberty. I absolutely hate hate hate government restricting what I consider to be a personal liberty. If you aren't hurting someone else then why the hell should it be illegal? If someone wants to smoke a naturally growing plant in the privacy of their own home then what f'n business is that of the government?

Seat belt laws are almost the same thing. How am I hurting someone else by making the personal choicenot to wear a seatbelt? Shouldn't I have the liberty to make that decision on my own since it doesn't impact anyone except for me?

It's asinine nanny-state big government bull**** that's the antithesis of everything I stand for and everything I think this nation was established to protect.

[THE-JROD]

I've never smoked it either. The big deal to me is that it's an issue of individual liberty. I absolutely hate hate hate government restricting what I consider to be a personal liberty. If you aren't hurting someone else then why the hell should it be illegal? If someone wants to smoke a naturally growing plant in the privacy of their own home then what f'n business is that of the government?

Seat belt laws are almost the same thing. How am I hurting someone else by making the personal choicenot to wear a seatbelt? Shouldn't I have the liberty to make that decision on my own since it doesn't impact anyone except for me?

It's asinine nanny-state big government bull**** that's the antithesis of everything I stand for and everything I think this nation was established to protect.

Tell us how you really feel :D:D

[Leroy Lizard]

Tell us how you really feel :D:D

I think Sic'Em doesn't like government control over one's individual liberties, or something like that.

[FirstandGoal]

Tell us how you really feel :D:D

:D

[FirstandGoal]

I've never smoked it either. The big deal to me is that it's an issue of individual liberty. I absolutely hate hate hate government restricting what I consider to be a personal liberty. If you aren't hurting someone else then why the hell should it be illegal? If someone wants to smoke a naturally growing plant in the privacy of their own home then what f'n business is that of the government?

Seat belt laws are almost the same thing. How am I hurting someone else by making the personal choicenot to wear a seatbelt? Shouldn't I have the liberty to make that decision on my own since it doesn't impact anyone except for me?

It's asinine nanny-state big government bull**** that's the antithesis of everything I stand for and everything I think this nation was established to protect.


Okay

(still don't GAS tho....:O )

[olevetonahill]

Okay

(still don't GAS tho....:O )

Well I just toked . So get me a Bowl of that stew ya made ;)

[FirstandGoal]

Well I just toked . So get me a Bowl of that stew ya made ;)

Kids already ate it all. Leftovers already frozen.
Be nice and I might let you have some beans and cornbread.

[olevetonahill]

Kids already ate it all. Leftovers already frozen.
Be nice and I might let you have some beans and cornbread.

See how you wimmens control us Mens ?:D

[bigfatjerk]

I think this should be up to the states. The federal government has no right to regulate substances and does a bad job of it. States would do a lot better job regulating this stuff at the local level than any federal law will do. I'm for legalizing of some of these drugs. But I don't do the drugs anyway so I really don't care that much. I can see why people would want some other drugs illegal.

[Leroy Lizard]

I don't do drugs. So I don't want others to be able to do them.

[THE-JROD]

See how you wimmens control us Mens ?:D

Heh, they do control whats fer dinner every night :D

[FirstandGoal]

See how you wimmens control us Mens ?:D

And I did it all without having my DDD's anymore. :hot:

[SicEmBaylor]

Tell us how you really feel :D:D

I like to keep my political views pretty close to the vest. ;)

[olevetonahill]

And I did it all without having my DDD's anymore. :hot:

Yea, You dayum wimmens control Most of the food and ALL the Punanny . There fore Ya control the Cojones also :D

[SicEmBaylor]

I think this should be up to the states. The federal government has no right to regulate substances and does a bad job of it. States would do a lot better job regulating this stuff at the local level than any federal law will do. I'm for legalizing of some of these drugs. But I don't do the drugs anyway so I really don't care that much. I can see why people would want some other drugs illegal.

100% right.

[SpankyNek]

All drugs should be legal.

[Midtowner]

Personal liberty has been covered.

But how much does it cost to keep drugs criminalized? As an attorney, I have to help clients deal with the ravages of drugs on themselves and their families.

Drugs shouldn't be a criminal issue, but they mean so much in terms of money for private prisons, public prisons, law enforcement cash seizures, etc. Billions and billions.

Really, in terms of the money we spend, what are we getting for it? What are we protecting people from? Themselves? Are we doing it in the best way? Addiction is a disease, but we treat the disease like a crime.

[sooner59]

Yes.

[Leroy Lizard]

Personal liberty has been covered.

But how much does it cost to keep drugs criminalized? As an attorney, I have to help clients deal with the ravages of drugs on themselves and their families.

Drugs shouldn't be a criminal issue, but they mean so much in terms of money for private prisons, public prisons, law enforcement cash seizures, etc. Billions and billions.

Really, in terms of the money we spend, what are we getting for it? What are we protecting people from? Themselves? Are we doing it in the best way? Addiction is a disease, but we treat the disease like a crime.

Because it is.

[Blue]

I'd much rather see a War on Pedos, War on Spending, War on Joy Behar, than I would a War on Drugs. Complete waste of money and resources.

[Soonerson1975]

I'd much rather see a War on Pedos, War on Spending, War on Joy Behar, than I would a War on Drugs. Complete waste of money and resources.

Is Joy Behar on drugs?

[Blue]

Is Joy Behar on drugs?

I have no idea.

[yankee]

No.

[SpankyNek]

Personal liberty has been covered.

But how much does it cost to keep drugs criminalized? As an attorney, I have to help clients deal with the ravages of drugs on themselves and their families.

Drugs shouldn't be a criminal issue, but they mean so much in terms of money for private prisons, public prisons, law enforcement cash seizures, etc. Billions and billions.

Really, in terms of the money we spend, what are we getting for it? What are we protecting people from? Themselves? Are we doing it in the best way? Addiction is a disease, but we treat the disease like a crime.

This is what really bothers me. We have the DSM IV proclaiming it as a disease, but states are not treating it properly if they are actually interested in reducing crime.

The disease is not, in of itself, a crime. Why do we treat these folks as criminals? Obviously, if they break some law due to the disease, they deserve punishment....

[SouthCarolinaSooner]

I think this should be up to the states. The federal government has no right to regulate substances and does a bad job of it. States would do a lot better job regulating this stuff at the local level than any federal law will do. I'm for legalizing of some of these drugs. But I don't do the drugs anyway so I really don't care that much. I can see why people would want some other drugs illegal.
Keep tyrants close by amirite

[47straight]

No.

[Leroy Lizard]

This is what really bothers me. We have the DSM IV proclaiming it as a disease, but states are not treating it properly if they are actually interested in reducing crime.

The disease is not, in of itself, a crime. Why do we treat these folks as criminals? Obviously, if they break some law due to the disease, they deserve punishment....

We don't jail them for being addicts. We jail them for possessing drugs, ingesting drugs, selling drugs, or buying drugs. None of those four are diseases.

[CowboyMRW]

We don't jail them for being addicts. We jail them for possessing drugs, ingesting drugs, selling drugs, or buying drugs. None of those four are diseases.

Well we could cut the jail housing in almost half if we made weed legal. That's a buttload of money we could save. Also we could tax it which is even more money. The stuff is no different then cigarettes or alcohol. People take it to have fun and it should be legal

[Leroy Lizard]

Well we could cut the jail housing in almost half if we made weed legal. That's a buttload of money we could save. Also we could tax it which is even more money. The stuff is no different then cigarettes or alcohol. People take it to have fun and it should be legal

Cowboy, we've hashed this out a thousand times here. No one is going to change their view.

[SpankyNek]

We don't jail them for being addicts. We jail them for possessing drugs, ingesting drugs, selling drugs, or buying drugs. None of those four are diseases.

I don't believe ingesting drugs is a crime in any part of our country.

Otherwise, a solid summary of what I stated in the last line of my post.

[Midtowner]

I don't believe ingesting drugs is a crime in any part of our country.

True to a point, but to be able to ingest drugs, one must possess them. The problem with making laws regarding the ingestion of drugs would seem to revolve around involuntary ingestion.

[Midtowner]

We don't jail them for being addicts. We jail them for possessing drugs, ingesting drugs, selling drugs, or buying drugs. None of those four are diseases.

Now you're just arguing semantics. Semantics are really the last refuge of someone who has seen his argument fail everywhere else.

The fact is that crimes are defined by the legislature, not by God, so it's probably okay to argue whether the policy is right or wrong from a public policy standpoint. Everyone gets that possession, distribution, etc., are criminal acts. The question being asked is whether our treatment of these acts is the ideal way of dealing with this problem? And no matter which side of this fence you sit on, drug use is a problem (in most cases).

Would it be a good use of the state's money to lock up some 20-something woman for a couple years who found that marijuana was the only thing which helped her with her menstrual cramps?

Is it a good use of state funds to hunt down and imprison cancer and glaucoma patients who find that marijuana is the only thing that helps them live a semi-normal life?

How about the 16 year old kid who uses it recreationally? Seize his car, charge him with a felony as an adult? Good use of state money?

Unlike some here, I do believe in free will. I do believe that an addict can simply make a decision not to be an addict anymore. I know lots of recovering alcoholics, I know lots of former smokers. And really, when we're talking about marijuana, we're talking about a substance which isn't chemically addictive in the same way which even alcohol or nicotine are, so we're talking more about a conduct crime than an addiction issue.

So throw out the disease argument entirely where marijuana is concerned. Keeping it illegal--good use of state money or waste of time?

[Veritas]

All drugs should be legal. Prohibition has done *nothing* positive. All it's done is create a powerful black market controlled by ruthless criminals, fill our prisons, and cost somewhere between $50-100 billion a year while the flow of drugs into this country has continued unabated.

[SunnySooner]

Weren't all drugs legal for like, ever, and everything seemed to progress along OK? Ya know, when you could buy laudanum (opiate) at the drugstore, drink a Coke with real coke, stop in an opium den on your way home, etc. etc.etc.

No cartels, no complete havoc and hell in Mexico, no prisons full of potheads.

Seems like it was working out OK back then, but legislating morality became popular and screwed it all up. Not sure if legalizing it now would help or not. California doesn't seem any better or worse off since it became so accessible there. Interesting.

[MR2-Sooner86]

Marijuana should be legal from a medical, moral, financial, and constitutional standpoint.

Isn't it weird when the government declares war on something suddenly what they declare war on pops up all over the place? I wish the government would declare war on skimpy dressed hot chicks.

[XingTheRubicon]

smoked 5 or 6 times in my 20's...never tried anything harder

One thing I experienced that may be exclusive to me, or not, I don't know...was I had little to no fear of anything around me. My girlfriend could have been sawing off her own leg off and I wouldn't have stopped watching X-Files. Another odd thing that actually happened was when I got absolutely torqued on a camping trip at Boiling Springs. We went to a cave, lit up...again and again and eventually someone noticed it was dark. Now, normally when I walk through a forest in the dark, I tread slowly and look for branches, rocks and holes. Long story short, I woke up with scratches all over my face, legs, neck and arms and a slightly hyper-extended knee. I remember LMAO as I walked back each time I hit something. I've never been that drunk.

Now, I know that everyone reacts differently, but that's my reason for not smoking on a regular basis (on top of the whole illegal part)


If people want to smoke weed, they should be able to. I still want it to be illegal, I just want the punishments to be more like a parking ticket...i.e. if you're caught with 5 lbs. of weed, you get a $30 fine. I have 3 kids and I don't want them to touch it. I'll do everything I can to accomplish that. However, it makes my job harder as a parent if weed is legalized. More underage kids will smoke if it's legal IMO.


I also find it kind of humorous/ironic that the ultra-liberal American Trial Lawyers Assoc. is largely responsible for US taxpayers spending billions of dollars incarcerating potheads.

[Midtowner]

I also find it kind of humorous/ironic that the ultra-liberal American Trial Lawyers Assoc. is largely responsible for US taxpayers spending billions of dollars incarcerating potheads.

(citation needed)

The ATLA is one of many Trial Lawyers groups, and from what I can tell from their website, they are just an honorary organization where you pay for your membership so you can be listed as being more competent than your peers.

They seem a lot more interested in the promotion of mass tort litigation than anything else if you look through their blog. And there's nothing "ultra liberal" about them really, unless you believe that holding corporate wrongdoers accountable to the people they injure is somehow liberal.

[bigfatjerk]

All drugs should be legal. Prohibition has done *nothing* positive. All it's done is create a powerful black market controlled by ruthless criminals, fill our prisons, and cost somewhere between $50-100 billion a year while the flow of drugs into this country has continued unabated.
While I agree I don't think this would ever happen if it came to the vote of the people. But I think a federal law against this stuff is a bad idea. Where states can do a better job of controlling things is saying you can't have drugs in a public area and restaurants and other private businesses would obviously have rules against drugs etc. Much of this would do more to control drugs than any federal law.

I personally think trying to control one's personal life with any law is wrong. But let's say the government decides not to fund the drug war anymore for whatever reasons. You think the state of Oklahoma isn't going to pass legislation to go after these drugs? And you really think businesses are really going to be popular if they start allowing drugs especially family friendly places? Smoking isn't illegal but you see a ton of restaurants around that have smoking/nonsmoking areas and some don't allow smoking at all. The same thing would happen if drugs were suddenly legalized federally. The states and private businesses do a better job of regulating this stuff than a federal government.

[XingTheRubicon]

(citation needed)

The ATLA is one of many Trial Lawyers groups, and from what I can tell from their website, they are just an honorary organization where you pay for your membership so you can be listed as being more competent than your peers.

They seem a lot more interested in the promotion of mass tort litigation than anything else if you look through their blog. And there's nothing "ultra liberal" about them really, unless you believe that holding corporate wrongdoers accountable to the people they injure is somehow liberal.


In 2009, there were about 800,000 marijuana arrests. If you total and multiply X800K per for legal/court costs/jails etc., that's a multi-billion dollar pie. If you think the ALTA, et al...are silent when it comes to lobbying/buying off D.C. to keep their share of hundreds of millions of dollars per month, every month, then you're probably so liberal, you probably have semen on your back hair and nothing I could say would ever change your mind anyway.

[Howzit]

yes.

[C&CDean]

"semen on your backhair" Heh. I chuckled.

[Midtowner]

In 2009, there were about 800,000 marijuana arrests. If you total and multiply X800K per for legal/court costs/jails etc., that's a multi-billion dollar pie. If you think the ALTA, et al...are silent when it comes to lobbying/buying off D.C. to keep their share of hundreds of millions of dollars per month, every month, then you're probably so liberal, you probably have semen on your back hair and nothing I could say would ever change your mind anyway.

I'm so liberal that when I tried to find evidence of the ATLA taking a position on the issue either way, I came up short.

The ATLA isn't a big organization. They more-less provide continuing education and the benefit of having a neato certificate on your ego wall. Other than that, they're not a big deal.

Criminal lawyers are not typically heavyweights when it comes to political influence. In fact, outside of a small minority, the majority of criminal lawyers are usually not very good lawyers who take on small cases, plead their clients out to whatever the D.A. offers, and fill in the blanks on the plea forms.

And the money they have available to contribute to lobbying efforts really pales in comparison to the private prison industry, the drug rehab industry, the drug and alcohol assessment companies, etc.

In 2010, the American Association for Justice, probably the largest trial lawyers lobbying group spent about 2.5MM on lobbying. What they lobbied for was mainly against caps on medical malpractice and tort litigation in federal courts--definitionally, conservative approaches because they require doctors, hospitals and wrongdoers to be held personally responsible for killing and maiming people through negligence.

And compared to what private prisons spend to secure federal and state dollars, really, what the AAJ spent on something completely different was a drop in the bucket.

Incarceration periods and numbers have been sharply rising. Lawyers aren't the ones benefiting from that fact. Prisons are. Try approaching the subject with a shred of intellectual honesty. What's going on is pretty obvious.

[2121Sooner]

Harry Anslinger was the initial director of the Federal Bureau of Narcotics. Here are some quotes from him in regards to marijuana ....

“There are 100,000 total marijuana smokers in the US, and most are Negroes, Hispanics, Filipinos, and entertainers. Their Satanic music, jazz, and swing, result from marijuana use. This marijuana causes white women to seek sexual relations with Negroes, entertainers, and any others.”

“…the primary reason to outlaw marijuana is its effect on the degenerate races.”

“Marijuana is an addictive drug which produces in its users insanity, criminality, and death.”

“Reefer makes darkies think they’re as good as white men.”

“Marihuana leads to pacifism and communist brainwashing”

“You smoke a joint and you’re likely to kill your brother.”

“Marijuana is the most violence-causing drug in the history of mankind.”

Pretty sure racism and fear mongering played a part in drug laws and still do to this day.

[C&CDean]

If you aren't hurting someone else then why the hell should it be illegal? If someone wants to smoke a naturally growing plant in the privacy of their own home then what f'n business is that of the government?

Seat belt laws are almost the same thing. How am I hurting someone else by making the personal choicenot to wear a seatbelt? Shouldn't I have the liberty to make that decision on my own since it doesn't impact anyone except for me?

It's asinine nanny-state big government bull**** that's the antithesis of everything I stand for and everything I think this nation was established to protect.

You know Sic, you usually make pretty decent analogies/comparisons. This one is way off kilter. When you smoke the dope you can injure someone else DIRECTLY because of your stupid decision to light up. Not wearing your seatbelt (or a helmet on a motorcycle) pretty much kills just you. I said "DIRECTLY" because some goon is gonna argue that if you die from not wearing your seatbelt you're hurting your family members.

As far as legalizing it? IDGAS anymore. It's been well chronicled on this board how deep I was into the weed in my day. Based on my personal experiences (and the experiences of many other ex-potheads I know) I think people who smoke it are ****ing idiots who are ruining their lives. Legal or not. I also think anyone who has never smoked it needs to STFU about it. You don't have a clue.

[XingTheRubicon]

So your position is...the ALTA et al (meaning the entire legal lobby) basically has no stance on something that brings in hundreds of millions of dollars/month to attorney's pockets. It's not their biggest concern, but it would be if the arrest number/$$$ didn't go up every year for a decade.

[Midtowner]

So your position is...the ALTA et al (meaning the entire legal lobby) basically has no stance on something that brings in hundreds of millions of dollars/month to attorney's pockets. It's not their biggest concern, but it would be if the arrest number/$$$ didn't go up every year for a decade.

I don't believe they lobby for stiffer criminal punishments for petty drug offenders. Go find some actual evidence that they do, and I might revise my belief. I have looked for that information and either my research skills aren't up to snuff or the information isn't out there because it doesn't exist.

[C&CDean]

I don't believe they lobby for stiffer criminal punishments for petty drug offenders. Go find some actual evidence that they do, and I might revise my belief. I have looked for that information and either my research skills aren't up to snuff or the information isn't out there because it doesn't exist.

Well if I ever need an attorney, I ain't hiring you. You spend way too much time on here researching stupid **** for an argument instead of taking care of my dang case.:P

[Midtowner]

Well if I ever need an attorney, I ain't hiring you. You spend way too much time on here researching stupid **** for an argument instead of taking care of my dang case.:P

Probably true!!!

[2121Sooner]

You know Sic, you usually make pretty decent analogies/comparisons. This one is way off kilter. When you drink the alcohol you can injure someone else DIRECTLY because of your stupid decision to get drunk. Not wearing your seatbelt (or a helmet on a motorcycle) pretty much kills just you. I said "DIRECTLY" because some goon is gonna argue that if you die from not wearing your seatbelt you're hurting your family members.

.


Weed, alcohol........drugs is drugs........and drugs is bad......M'Kay?

http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/jakewuz1/DRUGSAREBAD.png

But so delicious......

[C&CDean]

Your point would be better if I could see the pic.

[2121Sooner]

Your point would be better if I could see the pic.

I see it just fine. Not sure why it isnt showing up on yours. Maybe you are too high man!!!!

[olevetonahill]

Dean , The Peeps that smoke the weed aint all bad, I know just ax me ;)

Weed aint no better nor worse than the Hooch. If you let it control YOU , then its Bad , Be it Beer, Weed, Whiskey. Or any of that Go Fast ****.

[C&CDean]

Dean , The Peeps that smoke the weed aint all bad, I know just ax me ;)

Weed aint no better nor worse than the Hooch. If you let it control YOU , then its Bad , Be it Beer, Weed, Whiskey. Or any of that Go Fast ****.

I ain't saying any of them are bad Howie. I'm just saying y'all are stupid for doing it. Now in your case, you've pretty much made a choice to spend the rest of your life in simple exclusion on a hill. Smoke till you choke brother. It ain't like you're trying to go find a job or get ahead in life. You're happy with your simple existence and God bless you. Like the movie said "smoke up Johnnie!"

My point is for the younger folks - or for anyone who is still actively pursuing work/promotions/personal/career advancement/etc. The **** will drag you down. It's an anchor that will keep you from achieving half (or more) of what you could achieve. I know Homey (who ain't never even smelled the ****) will come on here and try to tell me he "knows a guy who gets high and is a successful .............." Right. I was what most folks would call "successful" when I gave up the weed. The difference between then and now is night and day. Yes, I had a job. Yes, I had benefits. Period. That was it. I was going nowhere fast and was tickled pink about it.

If you allow yourself to become a drunk then it will drag you down too. The major difference between the booze and the weed though is that the booze doesn't kill your motivation. Your drive. Your enthusiasm for something other than "where am I gonna cop my next bag of weed." Poll 1,000 successful CEOs of major companies out there and ask them "how many of y'all smoke the weed on a regular basis?" Then ask them "how many of y'all have a drink or two on a regular basis?" Your first answer will be 0. Your second answer will be about 975.

[olevetonahill]

Hell Bro, I bet I aint smoked moren 3 joints in the last 5 years.
Ill Take a hit every now and then. As for the Booze Ive pretty much quit that to cept fer Game days ;)
I agree that it can and will kill motivation, Im just sayin if ya do it in moderation it aint gonna hurt ya.
Smoke a little on the weekend / Drink on the week end . Whats the Dif.
I think we talkin 2 dif. ways of smokin the stuff Bro.

[2121Sooner]

I think your deer are smoking weed.


That is why they keep eating all your damn corn. It's likes Doritos to them.

[olevetonahill]

I think your deer are smoking weed.


That is why they keep eating all your damn corn. It's likes Doritos to them.

So thats whats been happenin to My lil patch.:mad:

[Aldebaran]

I ain't saying any of them are bad Howie. I'm just saying y'all are stupid for doing it. Now in your case, you've pretty much made a choice to spend the rest of your life in simple exclusion on a hill. Smoke till you choke brother. It ain't like you're trying to go find a job or get ahead in life. You're happy with your simple existence and God bless you. Like the movie said "smoke up Johnnie!"

My point is for the younger folks - or for anyone who is still actively pursuing work/promotions/personal/career advancement/etc. The **** will drag you down. It's an anchor that will keep you from achieving half (or more) of what you could achieve. I know Homey (who ain't never even smelled the ****) will come on here and try to tell me he "knows a guy who gets high and is a successful .............." Right. I was what most folks would call "successful" when I gave up the weed. The difference between then and now is night and day. Yes, I had a job. Yes, I had benefits. Period. That was it. I was going nowhere fast and was tickled pink about it.

If you allow yourself to become a drunk then it will drag you down too. The major difference between the booze and the weed though is that the booze doesn't kill your motivation. Your drive. Your enthusiasm for something other than "where am I gonna cop my next bag of weed." Poll 1,000 successful CEOs of major companies out there and ask them "how many of y'all smoke the weed on a regular basis?" Then ask them "how many of y'all have a drink or two on a regular basis?" Your first answer will be 0. Your second answer will be about 975.

Now.. Cocaine on the other hand... You can blow your mind on that **** and still be President. It's a hell of a drug.

[2121Sooner]

Our President is white...............on the inside

[C&CDean]

Now.. Cocaine on the other hand... You can blow your mind on that **** and still be President. It's a hell of a drug.

Heh.

Don't even get me started on this ****. Bad memories man, bad memories.

[Midtowner]

So what y'all are saying is that the worst part about weed is it kills your motivation to be successful?

Well then, that's a mighty good reason to be throwing people in the pokey, isn't it?

[2121Sooner]

So what y'all are saying is that the worst part about weed is it kills your motivation to be successful?

Well then, that's a mighty good reason to be throwing people in the pokey, isn't it?

And dont forget.......it's a gateway drug.

[Midtowner]

And dont forget.......it's a gateway drug.

I know your kidding, but for the benefit of others, that has, of course, been thoroughly debunked.

[2121Sooner]

I know your kidding, but for the benefit of others, that has, of course, been thoroughly debunked.


Nuh uh......The Queen Bee said so......

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2584/3774844897_41e70512f6.jpg

[C&CDean]

I know your kidding, but for the benefit of others, that has, of course, been thoroughly debunked.

Being an ex-druggy, and knowing a buttload of ex-druggies I call bull****. How many junkies do you know that went from Boonesfarm right to heroin? That's right, zero.

I am not saying weed leads directly to heroin, alls I'm saying is that a lot of folks start smoking weed, like it, and it doesn't kill them. Then they try a lude or some acid, like it, and it doesn't kill them. Eventually some of them try some smack, and anybody who has ever done dope will tell you there's nothing that can compare. Problem now is that you're doing something that is physically addicting and you can't just lay it down.

So by definition, it is a gateway drug. Then again, so is the Boonesfarm.

Your other statement in the other post was just dumb. There's very few (if any) folks sitting in the pokey for smoking a joint. There's very few (if any) sitting in the joint for having a little personal stash in their glovebox (I'm not talking about a traffic stop and spending a day or two, I'm talking about being convicted and sentenced to hard time). This is where all you people that don't know **** about it are all wrong.

Those folks in the joint for drug offenses are in almost all cases there for much larger amounts of the stuff, trafficking, cultivating, or it's their umpteenth time getting busted and the judge is tired of seeing their bloodshot eyes. There's also a very large percentage of them in there who were busted for other crimes, and just happened to have some weed on them.

One other thing I can say with true conviction. If there weren't any drugs, we'd have maybe 1 prison for the entire country. My mom has done her prison ministry for decades, and every single death row, lifer, 30-years in the hole loser committed their crimes while either a) under the influence, b) while attempting to purchase/sell drugs, c) trying to steal money to buy their drugs, or d) all of the above.

So the whole "billions of dollars being spent to incarcerate little potheads" crap is simply that. Crap.

[C&CDean]

And I forgot the wimmens. They all blame some woman in their life for their predicament. Mom, wife, girlfriend, ex-girlfriend. Some bitch put me in this place.

[Midtowner]

It has that characteristic because it is illegal, not because it is marijuana.

Make it legal and you won't be able to get crack and marijuana from the same sorts of folks.

It'd be as much a gateway drug as alcohol.

[Midtowner]

Your other statement in the other post was just dumb. There's very few (if any) folks sitting in the pokey for smoking a joint. There's very few (if any) sitting in the joint for having a little personal stash in their glovebox (I'm not talking about a traffic stop and spending a day or two, I'm talking about being convicted and sentenced to hard time). This is where all you people that don't know **** about it are all wrong.

Apparently, you don't know **** about Oklahoma criminal law. That's okay. Let me educate you. With marijuana, for simple possession charge, your first charge is just a misdemeanor, no big deal. We're one of the very few states which don't have a minimum possession amount, so you can actually be prosecuted for having seeds on your floor--and having bought a used car is not an excuse.

Your second offense is a felony. 2-10 years. Again, no minimum amount. There are lots of folks who do time for this, 'specially in county.

[Midtowner]

And I forgot the wimmens. They all blame some woman in their life for their predicament. Mom, wife, girlfriend, ex-girlfriend. Some bitch put me in this place.

This we can agree on.

I don't represent folks with drug problems. As a rule of thumb, if I catch a hint that my client's drug use is an issue, we go take a hair follicle to be certain. So far, I've only had one client come up 'dirty,' and that was for cocaine. That didn't go well for her.

As far as the men go, to a man, they blamed their ex for their drug problems. And typically, they come from households where their parents' little angel can do no wrong, and that stupid world view is being reinforced.

I blame hippies and Dr. Spock for a lot of this nonsense. No one wants to be responsible for the damage they do to themselves and others.

[C&CDean]

Apparently, you don't know **** about Oklahoma criminal law. That's okay. Let me educate you. With marijuana, for simple possession charge, your first charge is just a misdemeanor, no big deal. We're one of the very few states which don't have a minimum possession amount, so you can actually be prosecuted for having seeds on your floor--and having bought a used car is not an excuse.

Your second offense is a felony. 2-10 years. Again, no minimum amount. There are lots of folks who do time for this, 'specially in county.

I thought I mentioned that the judge was tired of seeing your bloodshot eyes.

How about while you're waisting your clients' time doing innerweb research for silly arguments you pull up all the numbers on the number of convicts doing 2-10 on their second offense? I'll bet you it ain't many. Can they get 2-10? Sure. Do they on a regular basis without some other extenuating circumstance? I'll bet not. Unless they've got a ****ty lawyer...

[olevetonahill]

This we can agree on.

I don't represent folks with drug problems. As a rule of thumb, if I catch a hint that my client's drug use is an issue, we go take a hair follicle to be certain. So far, I've only had one client come up 'dirty,' and that was for cocaine. That didn't go well for her.

As far as the men go, to a man, they blamed their ex for their drug problems. And typically, they come from households where their parents' little angel can do no wrong, and that stupid world view is being reinforced.

I blame hippies and Dr. Spock for a lot of this nonsense. No one wants to be responsible for the damage they do to themselves and others.

Then you aint much of a Criminal Defense lawyer are you?

A lawyers Job is to provide the vigorous defense . Not see if they are guilty or not before they decide to Defend em or not .

[olevetonahill]

I thought I mentioned that the judge was tired of seeing your bloodshot eyes.

How about while you're waisting your clients' time doing innerweb research for silly arguments you pull up all the numbers on the number of convicts doing 2-10 on their second offense? I'll bet you it ain't many. Can they get 2-10? Sure. Do they on a regular basis without some other extenuating circumstance? I'll bet not. Unless they've got a ****ty lawyer...

Dean , LeFlore county has one hell of a drug Prob and its Mainly the Meth shat.
There are folks that have been busted several times Manufacturing the carp . and they are In ReHab, and or Drug court

Ive never heard of any one here doing any time at all for Pot . Mostly those charges are dismissed when do a Plea deal

[C&CDean]

I know Howie. I've got a nephew from Arizona who got busted in OKC with a trunkload of weed (over 100 lbs) in 2000. I can find him on that OK Supreme Court website, and it shows his case as "pending." He spent 2-days in jail, and went back to Arizona and is married, has 3 kids, a good job, and when I told him I saw his deal on the website he said "they said they were gonna call me back and tell me when I had to go to court, but they never did."

The prisons are NOT full of simple potheads.

[XingTheRubicon]

I don't believe they lobby for stiffer criminal punishments for petty drug offenders. Go find some actual evidence that they do, and I might revise my belief. I have looked for that information and either my research skills aren't up to snuff or the information isn't out there because it doesn't exist.

never said they lobbied for stiffer penalties, almost the opposite...just that they would go scorched earth if legalization was anywhere close to possible right now.



If you're still confused, go find a 40 to 50 year old lawyer and ask them about MADD in the mid 80s. Back then, Mothers Against Drunk Driving was trying to get 30 day mandatory sentences for 1st time DUI offenders. It was estimated that DUI arrests would shrink by more than 75% if such a law was passed. It was also estimated that 8 to 9 thousand lives per year would be saved due to the reduced drinking and driving by US citizens.

Guess who was lobbying like hell against saving those lives. Take a wild ****ing guess.

[DIB]

never said they lobbied for stiffer penalties, almost the opposite...just that they would go scorched earth if legalization was anywhere close to possible right now.



If you're still confused, go find a 40 to 50 year old lawyer and ask them about MADD in the mid 80s. Back then, Mothers Against Drunk Driving was trying to get 30 day mandatory sentences for 1st time DUI offenders. It was estimated that DUI arrests would shrink by more than 75% if such a law was passed. It was also estimated that 8 to 9 thousand lives per year would be saved due to the reduced drinking and driving by US citizens.

Guess who was lobbying like hell against saving those lives. Take a wild ****ing guess.

The mothers?

[olevetonahill]

I know Howie. I've got a nephew from Arizona who got busted in OKC with a trunkload of weed (over 100 lbs) in 2000. I can find him on that OK Supreme Court website, and it shows his case as "pending." He spent 2-days in jail, and went back to Arizona and is married, has 3 kids, a good job, and when I told him I saw his deal on the website he said "they said they were gonna call me back and tell me when I had to go to court, but they never did."

The prisons are NOT full of simple potheads.

Meth and Major dealers? Yes.
Hell I know of one guy who Got out the joint on Parole for dealing the meth shat.This how ****ed up their brains get on that shat. He had a wife and 3 kids . He decided he wanted to get busted again and go back to the Pen . Said he made more money there.. I dont doubt it, But thats a hell of a way to do it . Oh and hes doing the Life with out now , Cause it was his 3rd Hard fall.

[C&CDean]

The mothers?

No, the potheads. Sheesh, try to keep up.

[DIB]

No, the potheads. Sheesh, try to keep up.

*cough* *cough* whut?

[C&CDean]

"no sticks or seeds that you don't need, acapulco gold is *hack*cough* bad-assed weed...."

[Jammin']

Marijuana is a gateway drug.

[DIB]

Marijuana is a gateway drug.

Your face is a gateway drug

[3rdgensooner]

Gateways are cool.

[Jammin']

the coolest, yo.

[sooner59]

It you smoke enough weed, you will think you actually went through a gateway...

http://www.psp-themes.net/data/media/4/Stargate.jpg

[Leroy Lizard]

Apparently, you don't know **** about Oklahoma criminal law. That's okay. Let me educate you. With marijuana, for simple possession charge, your first charge is just a misdemeanor, no big deal. We're one of the very few states which don't have a minimum possession amount, so you can actually be prosecuted for having seeds on your floor--and having bought a used car is not an excuse.

Your second offense is a felony. 2-10 years. Again, no minimum amount. There are lots of folks who do time for this, 'specially in county.

Anyone facing that kind of sanction for repeated use and still does it is either addicted or stupid.

Don't smoke pot, and you foil the state's plot to incarcerate you.

[MR2-Sooner86]

Anyone facing that kind of sanction for repeated use and still does it is either addicted or stupid.

Don't smoke pot, and you foil the state's plot to incarcerate you.

I guess white and black couples who married and violated the Racial Integrity Act of 1924 were stupid.

I guess John Scopes was stupid too for violating the Butler Act.

I guess people helping slaves were stupid for violating the Fugitive Slave Act of 1850.

So in Leroy's world, you even think about talking up evolution, marrying somebody outside of your race, or helping a slave, your butt should be in jail no matter what. It doesn't matter if it's right or wrong, it's on the books so obviously it's a good law and should be enforced and not even questioned.

[SpankyNek]

‎"If you're honest, you sooner or later have to confront your values. Then you're forced to separate what is right from what is merely legal. This puts you metaphysically on the run. America is full of metaphysical outlaws."

-Tom Robbins

I presume he has smoked pot.

[Midtowner]

never said they lobbied for stiffer penalties, almost the opposite...just that they would go scorched earth if legalization was anywhere close to possible right now.



If you're still confused, go find a 40 to 50 year old lawyer and ask them about MADD in the mid 80s. Back then, Mothers Against Drunk Driving was trying to get 30 day mandatory sentences for 1st time DUI offenders. It was estimated that DUI arrests would shrink by more than 75% if such a law was passed. It was also estimated that 8 to 9 thousand lives per year would be saved due to the reduced drinking and driving by US citizens.

Guess who was lobbying like hell against saving those lives. Take a wild ****ing guess.

Stiffer penalties have never been shown to reduce DUIs . Good thing that didn't happen.

[Leroy Lizard]

I guess white and black couples who married and violated the Racial Integrity Act of 1924 were stupid.

This isn't a matter of civil disobedience. Pot smokers willingly break the law and try their best to avoid getting caught. If they smoked it right in front of police officers and were willing to go to jail to demonstrate their opposition to the law, I wouldn't call them stupid. I would say they were wrong and they would still need to be punished (a component of civil disobedience that everyone conveniently forgets).

I think it is a complete insult to minorities to compare matters of civil rights and equal treatment with drug use. Unlike being born black or poor, people are not born potheads. They purposefully smoke the drug and are under no compelling interest to continue. (Note that a person born addicted to drugs falls outside of this argument. I have much more compassion for those caught in such a situation not of their own doing. Potheads have no such excuses.)

So, faced with two years in jail and a felony conviction, only an idiot would continue smoking pot. That seems pretty clear.

[Leroy Lizard]

Stiffer penalties have never been shown to reduce DUIs . Good thing that didn't happen.

The problem with such stats is that increased penalties are accompanied by a much more concerted effort to catch lawbreakers. I know fully well that DUI is taken far more seriously than it did in the 1960s. The incidences of drunk driving back then were low because the police often looked the other way.

So, just think about it for a minute. Do you not realize that the need to find a designated driver is much stronger now than in the 1960s? Are people much more wary of driving after a party than in the past? I certainly think so. And the stiffer penalties have a lot to do with it, I'm guessing.

[47straight]

Marijuana should be legal from a medical, moral, financial, and constitutional standpoint.



<snicker>

[2121Sooner]

<snicker>


when I smoke weed................I friggin LOVE snickers!!!!

[Midtowner]

Then you aint much of a Criminal Defense lawyer are you?

I really don't do criminal defense. Not much at least.


A lawyers Job is to provide the vigorous defense . Not see if they are guilty or not before they decide to Defend em or not .

Absolutely, but I mainly practice family law. And I don't get clients with drug problems because they typically can't afford me when they have to pay for drugs as well.

[MR2-Sooner86]

This isn't a matter of civil disobedience.

Yes it is.


Pot smokers willingly break the law and try their best to avoid getting caught.

So do high school kids with alcohol or cigarettes. It's against the law for them yet they still do it.

It was against the law to buy, sell, and consume alcohol and how did that work out for us? Exactly.


If they smoked it right in front of police officers and were willing to go to jail to demonstrate their opposition to the law, I wouldn't call them stupid. I would say they were wrong and they would still need to be punished (a component of civil disobedience that everyone conveniently forgets).

People do it already. I know on 4/20 at Colorado students pour into the center of campus and light it up. Do the police arrest anybody? Only if a fight or something breaks out but they let them do their thing. Why? They're not hurting anybody.


I think it is a complete insult to minorities to compare matters of civil rights and equal treatment with drug use.

Funny because our drug laws are based on racism.


Unlike being born black or poor, people are not born potheads.

They're not born alcoholics, smokers, gamblers or pornographers either.


So, faced with two years in jail and a felony conviction, only an idiot would continue smoking pot. That seems pretty clear.

Yet, pot use hasn't gone down and still continues. Why? People want to do it.

So, I must ask, you're completely for the government enforcing morality onto people whose only crime was sitting at their house eating pizza and listening to Grateful Dead albums? Do you really think it's the government's business to come in and say, "That's bad for you and I have to protect you from yourself" to it's citizens?


<snicker>

h0GZznxMC14

It's a classic 10th amendment case and the Federal Government is willingly violating it.

[47straight]

It's a classic 10th amendment case and the Federal Government is willingly violating it.

What about all those pesky state laws banning it?

[Leroy Lizard]

Yes it is.

No, it's not. Civil disobedience involves the purposeful breaking of a law in order to change the law. Those practicing civil disobedience are accepting of their punishment as a show of defiance. However, the vast majority of prisoners tried to get away with smoking pot and got caught.

Civil disobedience is not a substitute for "I don't think it should be the law, so I'll just go ahead and ignore it."

You're liberal, right? You should know that much.


So do high school kids with alcohol or cigarettes. It's against the law for them yet they still do it.

It was against the law to buy, sell, and consume alcohol and how did that work out for us?

High school kids doing drugs is not an act of civil disobedience, no more than a person raping his 13-year-old cousin is an act of civil disobedience. He may well think it is his right to have sex with his cousin. That does not excuse his behavior or mitigate its seriousness.


People do it already. I know on 4/20 at Colorado students pour into the center of campus and light it up. Do the police arrest anybody? Only if a fight or something breaks out but they let them do their thing. Why? They're not hurting anybody.

I think you need to read up on civil disobedience. You don't know what you're talking about. Attending a loser-fest on a certain night because you know the authorities will look the other way is not civil disobedience.


Funny because our drug laws are based on racism.

Drug laws were not put in place to deprive minorities of their rights, but to stop whites from adopting what many thought were the practices of minorities. While drug laws may have had racist overtones, they do not correlate to civil rights laws. So you cannot compare the two.

Now, if you are saying that blacks would truly benefit from being able to do drugs, then you could have a point. But I doubt many would agree with you.


They're not born alcoholics, smokers, gamblers or pornographers either.

Yeah, so what?


Yet, pot use hasn't gone down and still continues. Why? People want to do it.

People steal too. Just because a law is continually broken doesn't excuse those breaking the law.


So, I must ask, you're completely for the government enforcing morality onto people whose only crime was sitting at their house eating pizza and listening to Grateful Dead albums?

Wow. How you got that is pretty amazing. I didn't realize that either activity was illegal.


Do you really think it's the government's business to come in and say, "That's bad for you and I have to protect you from yourself" to it's citizens?

Which government are you referring? Federal or state?

[bigfatjerk]

What about all those pesky state laws banning it?
That's within their right and they are better at prosecuting these laws than any federal law.

[Leroy Lizard]

That's within their right and they are better at prosecuting these laws than any federal law.

Agreed, although I do think the feds should step in whenever the case of interstate commerce applies. (And I mean real interstate commerce, not that liberal crap that allows the feds to dominate our state's rights.)

[olevetonahill]

Pot should be legal, Should every one smoke it? Hell NO. some of em are already to stupid to come in out the rain

[MR2-Sooner86]

What about all those pesky state laws banning it?

That's fine. I mean Oklahoma just banned Four Loko but in other states it's legal. If Oklahoma and Texas don't want weed then they can pass those laws. If Colorado and Kansas want weed to be sold on every corner they can do that too. However, the feds have no say in the matter.


No, it's not. Civil disobedience involves the purposeful breaking of a law in order to change the law. Those practicing civil disobedience are accepting of their punishment as a show of defiance. However, the vast majority of prisoners tried to get away with smoking pot and got caught.

Yet when I mentioned people doing it in front of cops as a form of protest you said...


You don't know what you're talking about. Attending a loser-fest on a certain night because you know the authorities will look the other way is not civil disobedience.

So the authorities know a large member of people will be smoking marijuana and they can make a huge bust. If they look the other way it obviously isn't that bad now is it? I mean if a bunch of pedophiles were getting touchy with 10 year olds would the cops just "turn the other way" as you put it? If it's as bad as people say, why not arrest them? If they're turning the other way because people aren't harming anybody and are being peaceful then why is it against the law?

Of course I already know your line of thinking. You said "losers" and your argument is flawed now. Fallacy in your argument as you just jumped to a hasty generalization and obviously are looking down at people now and claiming statements that have no evidence to back it up.

You're true feelings are out now. You're done.

Oh yeah, as for civil disobedience...
Over 100,000,000 Americans have smoked marijuana. Why not arrest all of them? Why not arrest the 15,000,000 that are currently recreational smokers? Why not arrest all the medical patients in California, Colorado, and other states where they can smoke?
Why not arrest Obama, Clinton, Bush, and all the other elected officials that have publicly admitted to smoking marijuana? Say what you will about their politics but they don't seem like "losers" now do they?


You're liberal, right? You should know that much.

I'm actually more conservative than you. See, I like to uphold the constitution. You like to ignore it.



High school kids doing drugs is not an act of civil disobedience, no more than a person raping his 13-year-old cousin is an act of civil disobedience. He may well think it is his right to have sex with his cousin. That does not excuse his behavior or mitigate its seriousness.

So now marijuana smokers and kids who drank in high school are as bad as child rapist. Awesome.




Drug laws were not put in place to deprive minorities of their rights, but to stop whites from adopting what many thought were the practices of minorities. While drug laws may have had racist overtones, they do not correlate to civil rights laws. So you cannot compare the two.

You can make an argument that a person's "pursuit of happiness" is a civil right as long as it doesn't harm anybody else.



Yeah, so what?

You say people aren't born marijuana smokers and they're not born compulsive gamblers or alcoholics. People are free to make choices for themselves and NOT have the government make it for them.




People steal too. Just because a law is continually broken doesn't excuse those breaking the law.

So smoking marijuana is now like stealing? Even though stealing has been against the law for thousands of years and is even in the ten commandments. Marijuana? Exactly.


Wow. How you got that is pretty amazing. I didn't realize that either activity was illegal.

There you go right there. Most marijuana smokers sit at home and do just that. Harm anybody else? No. Causing a breakdown of society? No.


Which government are you referring? Federal or state?

Federal. As I've said, if a state wants to outlaw marijuana that's fine but it's NOT up to the federal government. If you really want to smoke marijuana, move to a state that allows it. Several states are starting to allow it.

[jkjsooner]

As far as legalizing it? IDGAS anymore. It's been well chronicled on this board how deep I was into the weed in my day. Based on my personal experiences (and the experiences of many other ex-potheads I know) I think people who smoke it are ****ing idiots who are ruining their lives.

I know people who do it once or twice a year. They never consider buying it themselves but will do it occasionally at a party when someone has it. Maybe you should consider the fact that some people have self control before using your experience to label them.

The fact that you were "deep into the weed" is a sure sign that you don't approach this topic from a normal perspective. It's like a recovered raging alcoholic questioning me for having an occasional glass of wine.


think anyone who has never smoked it needs to STFU about it. You don't have a clue.

Are you suggesting we all try it so that we can engage in the debate? Should our representatives try it before making up their mind on whether it should be legal or illegal?

[C&CDean]

mr2. Seriously. There's times when I go "you know, the boy is growing up." Then, you open your yapper and I go "you know, the boy is still dumber than a box of dicks."

Dude, potheads don't all sit at home, smoke their weed, and sing Peter, Paul, and Mary songs. There's a bunch of them hitting a liquor store right now as I type. There's a bunch of them car jacking some poor muh****ah this very second. There's a bunch of them ignoring the needs of their poor kids/family and sitting at home smoking their weed singing Peter, Paul and Mary tunes. Jeez.

[C&CDean]

I know people who do it once or twice a year. They never consider buying it themselves but will do it occasionally at a party when someone has it. Maybe you should consider the fact that some people have self control before using your experience to label them.

The fact that you were "deep into the weed" is a sure sign that you don't approach this topic from a normal perspective. It's like a recovered raging alcoholic questioning me for having an occasional glass of wine.



Are you suggesting we all try it so that we can engage in the debate? Should our representatives try it before making up their mind on whether it should be legal or illegal?

1. I bet you smoke Marlboro Lights when you drink too huh? Fag.

2. Yes, before you open your mouth spend a year or so smoking every day, or a couple times a week. Let me know how your life goes during that time.

[sooner59]

I know people who do it once or twice a year. They never consider buying it themselves but will do it occasionally at a party when someone has it. Maybe you should consider the fact that some people have self control before using your experience to label them.

The fact that you were "deep into the weed" is a sure sign that you don't approach this topic from a normal perspective. It's like a recovered raging alcoholic questioning me for having an occasional glass of wine.



Are you suggesting we all try it so that we can engage in the debate? Should our representatives try it before making up their mind on whether it should be legal or illegal?

Trick question. They already have. It just rarely becomes public until they run for POTUS.

[Leroy Lizard]

Yet when I mentioned people doing it in front of cops as a form of protest you said...

You said that they did it because they knew the cops wouldn't do anything.

I mean, c'mon.

Besides, we were talking about people in prison. These people are not in prison. So they're not relevant to the argument.


So the authorities know a large member of people will be smoking marijuana and they can make a huge bust. If they look the other way it obviously isn't that bad now is it?

You're confusing the issue. The issue here is whether their acts constitute civil disobedience, not whether you think their behavior is acceptable.

The women who lift their shirts up at Mardi Gras are not being civilly disobedient either.


I mean if a bunch of pedophiles were getting touchy with 10 year olds would the cops just "turn the other way" as you put it? If it's as bad as people say, why not arrest them? If they're turning the other way because people aren't harming anybody and are being peaceful then why is it against the law?

Of course I already know your line of thinking. You said "losers" and your argument is flawed now. Fallacy in your argument as you just jumped to a hasty generalization and obviously are looking down at people now and claiming statements that have no evidence to back it up.

You're true feelings are out now. You're done.

And you're rambling. Badly.


Oh yeah, as for civil disobedience...
Over 100,000,000 Americans have smoked marijuana. Why not arrest all of them? Why not arrest the 15,000,000 that are currently recreational smokers? Why not arrest all the medical patients in California, Colorado, and other states where they can smoke?
Why not arrest Obama, Clinton, Bush, and all the other elected officials that have publicly admitted to smoking marijuana? Say what you will about their politics but they don't seem like "losers" now do they?

Again, you can't seem to focus. If you want to call pot smoking an act of civil disobedience, go for it. You're wrong, but go for it.

If you want to say that there is nothing wrong with pot smoking, go for it. I won't agree, but go for it.

But don't confuse one issue with the other.


I'm actually more conservative than you. See, I like to uphold the constitution. You like to ignore it.

I see nothing unconstitutional about Oklahoma passing stiff drug laws.


So now marijuana smokers and kids who drank in high school are as bad as child rapist. Awesome.

Are you going to exhibit such childish reading comprehension throughout this thread?


You can make an argument that a person's "pursuit of happiness" is a civil right as long as it doesn't harm anybody else.

You can make an argument about a lot of things that are nonsensical. I can argue that Texas deserves to be ranked #1 this year in football.


You say people aren't born marijuana smokers and they're not born compulsive gamblers or alcoholics. People are free to make choices for themselves and NOT have the government make it for them.

Again, you can't seem to stay on track.

I stated that anyone who smoked pot knowing that a two-year prison term was the punishment was either addicted or stupid. That would true for gambling as well if it carried such a stiff penalty. But gambling does not carry such a penalty, so your comparison to gambling, smoking, alcohol, and pornography are absurd.



So smoking marijuana is now like stealing? Even though stealing has been against the law for thousands of years and is even in the ten commandments. Marijuana? Exactly.

Here is what I wrote:

"People steal too. Just because a law is continually broken doesn't excuse those breaking the law."

The issue is whether continual breaking of a law is tantamount to condoning the law. There are tons of laws on the books that are habitually broken, yet we all agree should remain on the books.

Ergo, your assertion is false. To argue that marijuana should be legalized requires more support than simply stating the number of times the law is broken.


There you go right there. Most marijuana smokers sit at home and do just that. Harm anybody else? No. Causing a breakdown of society? No.

False premise. Eating pizza doesn't hurt anyone. Smoking pot might not hurt anyone (depending on who you choose to believe). But even if it does, this does not indicate that, because eating pizza is legal, smoking pot should be legal.

Pizza is ingested. It is legal. Pot is ingested. That does not mean it should be legal. Just because two items share a characteristic does not mean they must share all characteristics. Basic logic.


Federal. As I've said, if a state wants to outlaw marijuana that's fine but it's NOT up to the federal government. If you really want to smoke marijuana, move to a state that allows it. Several states are starting to allow it.

I won't disagree in principle. It depends on the practice. For example, I don't want one state's legality to make it more difficult for another state to make it illegal. The feds control the borders, so they have an interest in regulating drugs to some extent.

[C&CDean]

I think mr2 AND leroy are higher than a dang kite right now.

[Leroy Lizard]

I think mr2 AND leroy are higher than a dang kite right now.

I'm high on life. :D

[C&CDean]

No, you're wasted on that skanky, ugly ho in your avatar.

[Leroy Lizard]

No, you're wasted on that skanky, ugly ho in your avatar.

That hurt, Dean.

[C&CDean]

The truth usually does.

[Leroy Lizard]

The truth usually does.

I can replace it with another one I had in mind.

But

you're

not

going

to

like

it.

[C&CDean]

Try me. She can't be worse than that pig.

[Leroy Lizard]

Try me. She can't be worse than that pig.

I used it in here about five years ago, and you threatened to ban me.

There is no "try you." If it goes up, it stays up.

[MR2-Sooner86]

mr2. Seriously. There's times when I go "you know, the boy is growing up." Then, you open your yapper and I go "you know, the boy is still dumber than a box of dicks."

Dude, potheads don't all sit at home, smoke their weed, and sing Peter, Paul, and Mary songs. There's a bunch of them hitting a liquor store right now as I type. There's a bunch of them car jacking some poor muh****ah this very second. There's a bunch of them ignoring the needs of their poor kids/family and sitting at home smoking their weed singing Peter, Paul and Mary tunes. Jeez.

Dean, even though I call you a c*ck gobbler or an douch* sprinkler at times, I still love ya. You're an ***hole, but you're a good man.

But really?

I'll admit, yes there are pot smokers who don't look after their kids. There are pot smokers who get behind the wheel and drive putting their's and other people's lives in danger.

I also know some losers, and I mean losers who smoke. They'll go nowhere in life. I know some losers who constantly are trying to keep from sobering up. I also know some losers down at the casino blowing each check thinking they'll become a millionaire. I also have friend who spend all their time playing video games and have no social life and can be considered loser. If you do too much of anything you can ruin your life.

I just find the whole thing stupid that for the past 70 years we've been telling people to stop it and they keep doing it and aren't stopping. I've had friends die from alcohol and prescription medication (lortabs) but I've never had a friend die from marijuana. Not one. Yet I hear people telling me how bad marijuana is even though I've never had a friend die from it. The whole thing comes across as upside down to me.

P.S. I still love you Dean ;)

[Leroy Lizard]

P.S. I still love you Dean ;)

That's another thing that should still be illegal.

[KC//CRIMSON]

That's another thing that should still be illegal.

You being allowed to have an internet connection should be illegal.

[SicEmBaylor]

A good friend of mine in my early days at Baylor had something of a drug problem. He liked the coke and adderall.

The guy was one of those people that has a horribly addictive personality. He finally quit both though and switched to pot as a "safer" substitute. I always found that odd since coke and adderall are "uppers" and pot is something of a downer.

I hated the fact that he did all of that, but at the end of the day he was only hurting himself not me so I never considered it my place to lecture him about it.

[SpankyNek]

A good friend of mine in my early days at Baylor had something of a drug problem. He liked the coke and adderall.

The guy was one of those people that has a horribly addictive personality. He finally quit both though and switched to pot as a "safer" substitute. I always found that odd since coke and adderall are "uppers" and pot is something of a downer.

I hated the fact that he did all of that, but at the end of the day he was only hurting himself not me so I never considered it my place to lecture him about it.

I was hooked on painkillers for almost 10 years.

I have been free since Nov 27, 2007.

I have a beer now and then, but haven't been drunk or done any drugs since that date (I also was a daily pot smoker from 89-2003).

Folks tried to get me to stop and no one succeeded until I ended up arrested and in jail...it broke the cycle, and I am a better man for it.

[Leroy Lizard]

A good friend of mine in my early days at Baylor had something of a drug problem. He liked the coke and adderall.


So do you. In fact, you bragged that you drink... oh.

[Leroy Lizard]

You being allowed to have an internet connection should be illegal.

Mr. Pissy Pants has arrived.

[XingTheRubicon]

Stiffer penalties have never been shown to reduce DUIs . Good thing that didn't happen.

Percentage of auto accident deaths that include alcohol.

Year Number Number Percent
1982 43,945 26,173 60
1983 42,589 24,635 58
1984 44,257 24,762 56
1985 43,825 23,167 53
1986 46,087 25,017 54
1987 46,390 24,094 52
1988 47,087 23,833 51
1989 45,582 22,424 49
1990 44,599 22,587 51
1991 41,508 20,159 49
1992 39,250 18,290 47
1993 40,150 17,908 45
1994 40,716 17,308 43
1995 41,817 17,732 42
1996 42,065 17,749 42
1997 42,013 16,711 40
1998 41,501 16,673 40
1999 41,717 16,572 40
2000 41,945 17,380 41
2001 42,196 17,400 41
2002 43,005 17,524 41
2003 42,643 17,013 40
2004 42,518 16,919 39
2005 43,443 16,885 39
2006 42,532 15,829 37
2007 41,059 15,387 37
2008 37,261 13,846 37


Perhaps making 60K/yr working at a family law office in a TJMaxx strip mall doesn't quite qualify you to know what the **** you're talking about.

[Midtowner]

You assume, of course, that things like seat belts and airbags have had zero impact there. Much more likely than a person thinking about the consequences of getting behind the wheel while drunk.

File under Correlation =/= Causation.

[47straight]

That's fine. I mean Oklahoma just banned Four Loko but in other states it's legal. If Oklahoma and Texas don't want weed then they can pass those laws. If Colorado and Kansas want weed to be sold on every corner they can do that too. However, the feds have no say in the matter.


Cool, but what you originally said looked pretty much like saying it was a constitutional right.

[olevetonahill]

Cool, but what you originally said looked pretty much like saying it was a constitutional right.

Hell it is a Constitutional Right
The right for the Pursuit of Happiness. Smokin the weed and Piggin out in front of the fridge makes me happy
So Yall leave me the hell alone .:P

[Leroy Lizard]

You assume, of course, that things like seat belts and airbags have had zero impact there. Much more likely than a person thinking about the consequences of getting behind the wheel while drunk.

File under Correlation =/= Causation.

Nope. Read again.

"Percentage of auto accident deaths that include alcohol."

That couldn't be explained away by seat belts or air bags. People are still getting killed. It's just that whenever a wreck causes a death, the chances of ti being caused by drunk driving is less.

And who can really doubt that stiffer penalties for DUI haven't caused changes in our behavior? People are much more fearful of getting a DUI than in the past.

[Midtowner]

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/04/22/20080422drunkendriving0422-ON.html

More DUIs are given out every year and it continues to trend up.

[2121Sooner]

mr2. Seriously. There's times when I go "you know, the boy is growing up." Then, you open your yapper and I go "you know, the boy is still dumber than a box of dicks."

Dude, potheads don't all sit at home, smoke their weed, and sing Peter, Paul, and Mary songs. There's a bunch of them hitting a liquor store right now as I type. There's a bunch of them car jacking some poor muh****ah this very second. There's a bunch of them ignoring the needs of their poor kids/family and sitting at home smoking their weed singing Peter, Paul and Mary tunes. Jeez.


For someone who smokes weed, you sure are angry.

Spicoli would not approve......

http://www.thearchnemesis.com/images/spicoli.jpg

[Leroy Lizard]

deleted

[Leroy Lizard]

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/04/22/20080422drunkendriving0422-ON.html

More DUIs are given out every year and it continues to trend up.


That article is a comparison among states, not a time study. Nice try. I guess you weren't expecting anyone to read it.

[XingTheRubicon]

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/04/22/20080422drunkendriving0422-ON.html

More DUIs are given out every year and it continues to trend up.

If more DUIs are given out each year because the the BAL limit has been lowered everywhere and enforcement is 10X of what it used to be 20 and 30 years ago.


One quick question, since you think seat belts and airbags only save your life if you're drunk...

if drivers are getting caught for DUI more, why are the percentage of auto accident deaths involving alcohol going down?

There's no way you could possibly be this simple, so it's curiosity I guess.

[bigfatjerk]

When you hand out more DUIs and watch those things more there will be less fatal accidents. But I think this is actually where having laws work. Those laws are what states should be doing and should be enforcing for all these substances. I'm not against DUI, DWI, etc laws. But I think trying to make a substance illegal isn't a way to make them less used or less dangerous. If someone is driving drunk or has complaints against them because of any activities they are doing and a neighbor calls them in I can see going after them.

[Veritas]

There's a lot of assumption in this thread that illegality acts as a deterrent against drug use. Which it doesn't.

[Leroy Lizard]

There's a lot of assumption in this thread that illegality acts as a deterrent against drug use. Which it doesn't.

And you're working under the assumption that refusal to obey a law makes the law bad.

[olevetonahill]

And you're working under the assumption that refusal to obey a law makes the law bad.

What arsehole did you drag that out of ?

[XingTheRubicon]

There's a lot of assumption in this thread that illegality acts as a deterrent against drug use. Which it doesn't.

are you serious?

if weed was sold at Wal Mart, there'd be the same amount of users?



I think illegality is a pretty good deterrent...I'm almost positive I would thoroughly hate jail.

[XingTheRubicon]

I know you don't go to the hole for just a joint

[Leroy Lizard]

I think illegality is a pretty good deterrent...I'm almost positive I would thoroughly hate jail.

Sounds like you're smarter than the average druggie.

[jkjsooner]

1. I bet you smoke Marlboro Lights when you drink too huh? Fag.

2. Yes, before you open your mouth spend a year or so smoking every day, or a couple times a week. Let me know how your life goes during that time.

(sarcasm)I don't think video games should be legal. Before you have an opinion on it spend 16 hours a day playing video games and see how your life goes. (/sarcasm)

Face it, your opinion on MJ is tainted by your experience. Of my friends who I've known who have smoked pot, all but one did so only occasionally and I don't know any of them who have done it in a very long time. One does so regularly and I'll agree it has affected both his personality and motivation. It's his lack of self control that is the problem.

As for your comment on who can open his mouth, would this apply to those who are in favor of keeping it illegal? Should we fill up our legislators with ex druggies since they're the only ones who are allowed to have an opinion? Or do you conveniently only want that to apply to those who want to legalize it?

[Blue]

Whats wrong with Marlboro Lights?! :D

[C&CDean]

(sarcasm)I don't think video games should be legal. Before you have an opinion on it spend 16 hours a day playing video games and see how your life goes. (/sarcasm)

Face it, your opinion on MJ is tainted by your experience. Of my friends who I've known who have smoked pot, all but one did so only occasionally and I don't know any of them who have done it in a very long time. One does so regularly and I'll agree it has affected both his personality and motivation. It's his lack of self control that is the problem.

As for your comment on who can open his mouth, would this apply to those who are in favor of keeping it illegal? Should we fill up our legislators with ex druggies since they're the only ones who are allowed to have an opinion? Or do you conveniently only want that to apply to those who want to legalize it?

We all know video games are the debbil. DOH.

Like I said, IDGAS anymore whether it's legal or illegal. Alls I'm saying is the people who have never smoked weed - yet use the argument that weed doesn't hurt people cause they know some groovy dude who does it and he's all wicked and bitchen and **** need to STFU about it cause they're clueless. They can still have their opinion, just keep it to themselves.

In all honesty, I think Sicem has to be a pothead though. Been at school for what, 28 years now and still doesn't even have an AA or BS? Eats nothing but candy and drinks a kegger of Coke every day? Has no clue what he wants to be when he grows up? Rides a scooter with stars and bars on the back? Has owned Beetles and Miatas? The boy is a poster child for potheads.

[Veritas]

are you serious?

if weed was sold at Wal Mart, there'd be the same amount of users?



I think illegality is a pretty good deterrent...I'm almost positive I would thoroughly hate jail.
Dude, weed *is* sold at Walmart. I've bought weed at Walmart before. Not from Walmart though. And FWIW I'm 10 years sober. Wait, no, nine years.

State of legality != distribution architecture. C'mon.

[XingTheRubicon]

We all know video games are the debbil. DOH.

Like I said, IDGAS anymore whether it's legal or illegal. Alls I'm saying is the people who have never smoked weed - yet use the argument that weed doesn't hurt people cause they know some groovy dude who does it and he's all wicked and bitchen and **** need to STFU about it cause they're clueless. They can still have their opinion, just keep it to themselves.

In all honesty, I think Sicem has to be a pothead though. Been at school for what, 28 years now and still doesn't even have an AA or BS? Eats nothing but candy and drinks a kegger of Coke every day? Has no clue what he wants to be when he grows up? Rides a scooter with stars and bars on the back? Has owned Beetles and Miatas? The boy is a poster child for potheads.

I don't think it's as much whether you've smoked or not, but your age. I find it interesting that 22 year old men and 45 year old men disagree on this issue so decisively.

One good rule of thumb is, when your parents still pay your car insurance... your opinion on any subject means absolutely nothing.

[Mississippi Sooner]

Dude, weed *is* sold at Walmart. I've bought weed at Walmart before. Not from Walmart though. And FWIW I'm 10 years sober. Wait, no, nine years.

State of legality != distribution architecture. C'mon.

One time about 15 years ago I found a bag of weed in the parking lot of the Walmart in Madill. I just opened the car door, looked down and there it was. Yes, I did pick it up, after looking around in a paranoid manner first, and then disposed of it properly. Like the American flag, marijuana should only disposed of by burning in a reverent manner. I did my part as a good American.

I did wonder, though, what the scene must have looked like when its previous owner found that he or she no longer had it. Were accusation made that someone else stole it, or was the poor soul just so burned out that he thought he must have smoked it all without realizing it? I wondered about this for perhaps thirty seconds.

[olevetonahill]

One time about 15 years ago I found a bag of weed in the parking lot of the Walmart in Madill. I just opened the car door, looked down and there it was. Yes, I did pick it up, after looking around in a paranoid manner first, and then disposed of it properly. Like the American flag, marijuana should only disposed of by burning in a reverent manner. I did my part as a good American.

I did wonder, though, what the scene must have looked like when its previous owner found that he or she no longer had it. Were accusation made that someone else stole it, or was the poor soul just so burned out that he thought he must have smoked it all without realizing it? I wondered about this for perhaps thirty seconds.

Yea , that confusion can drive ya nuts;)

[OULenexaman]

ah yes....the memories of having lost my $hit :mad:

[olevetonahill]

ah yes....the memories of having lost my $hit :mad:

Tru story
Back in 70 some friends and I were in Germany had 1/2 a Kilo of hash and was headed to Frankfort for an O/doors concert. We smokin out and drankin the wine, ( aw the good life) anyway this old car we were in broke down, we were close so we just got out and pushed it to the side of the rode and hoofed it on to the Concert.
You guessed it , We were so ****ed up we left the 1/2 Key in the junker . to ****ed up to try to find it again .

[Jammin']

Marijuana is a gateway drug.






And I hear it's not good for your memory either.

[DIB]

Marijuana is a gateway drug.






And I hear it's not good for your memory either.

Your mom is a gateway drug

[Jammin']

Your mom is a gateway drug

Exactly.

OR

Your reSponse is acTUally what I expected. Sooooo predictable.

[Jammin']

I'll play along for a minute, just for kicks:


Been a daily smoker for over 15 years, I'm gainfully employed, give back to the community on a weekly basis, have a wife and two beautiful kids, good health, good friends. Instead of having a drink at night, I have a smoke. Always after the kids are asleep and never in the house. How evil am I and is my life a wreck?

I'll take my answers without care.

[C&CDean]

I'll play along for a minute, just for kicks:


Been a daily smoker for over 15 years, I'm gainfully employed, give back to the community on a weekly basis, have a wife and two beautiful kids, good health, good friends. Instead of having a drink at night, I have a smoke. Always after the kids are asleep and never in the house. How evil am I and is my life a wreck?

I'll take my answers without care.

Evil? I don't know based on your brief description. Under-performing, not fulfilling your potential? I'd bet so.

Wait till your kids bust you (and they will). It sucks. In my case, my kid comes crying out of the bathroom in my bedroom carrying a bong with nasty bong water all down his front and in his mouth. I used to hide my bong under the bathroom sink. Cleaning all that **** out of his mouth and diaper was a real eye-opener for me. I'm just glad he was young enough to not be able to ask many questions.

My life was never really a "wreck" either. Had a good job, insurance, etc. Compared to where I am today? I'd have to call it extremely underwhelming. Financially, socially, professionally, hell in all most every way it's complete night and day. But when I was smoking daily, I felt just like you. I flip the switch the lights come on. I turn the key the car starts. I open the fridge and there's some groceries. My kids crawl into my lap and love me. Hey, this is as good as it could ever get...wrong.

[DIB]

Evil? I don't know based on your brief description. Under-performing, not fulfilling your potential? I'd bet so.

Wait till your kids bust you (and they will). It sucks. In my case, my kid comes crying out of the bathroom in my bedroom carrying a bong with nasty bong water all down his front and in his mouth. I used to hide my bong under the bathroom sink. Cleaning all that **** out of his mouth and diaper was a real eye-opener for me. I'm just glad he was young enough to not be able to ask many questions.

My life was never really a "wreck" either. Had a good job, insurance, etc. Compared to where I am today? I'd have to call it extremely underwhelming. Financially, socially, professionally, hell in all most every way it's complete night and day. But when I was smoking daily, I felt just like you. I flip the switch the lights come on. I turn the key the car starts. I open the fridge and there's some groceries. My kids crawl into my lap and love me. Hey, this is as good as it could ever get...wrong.

So, because you couldn't responsibly handle drugs, you assume that no one else can?

[Mississippi Sooner]

I'll only add that in the here and now, in my mid-40s with a loving wife and beautiful granddaughter, I still might take a puff on occasion if someone else has some and the setting is right. I can no longer remember the last time that I actually went out looking for it on my own. Real life is complicated enough.

I've found that as I've gotten older, the more I've found myself in agreement with the late, great Lewis Grizzard. If I want to catch a buzz, why bother with anything else if there's a good cold beer around?

[Jammin']

Evil? I don't know based on your brief description. Under-performing, not fulfilling your potential? I'd bet so.

Wait till your kids bust you (and they will). It sucks. In my case, my kid comes crying out of the bathroom in my bedroom carrying a bong with nasty bong water all down his front and in his mouth. I used to hide my bong under the bathroom sink. Cleaning all that **** out of his mouth and diaper was a real eye-opener for me. I'm just glad he was young enough to not be able to ask many questions.

My life was never really a "wreck" either. Had a good job, insurance, etc. Compared to where I am today? I'd have to call it extremely underwhelming. Financially, socially, professionally, hell in all most every way it's complete night and day. But when I was smoking daily, I felt just like you. I flip the switch the lights come on. I turn the key the car starts. I open the fridge and there's some groceries. My kids crawl into my lap and love me. Hey, this is as good as it could ever get...wrong.

I definitely worry about my kids busting me when I'm older. I'm not bold enough to use/own a bong anymore, nor do I keep anything in the house. and I guess I stretched it when I said "daily" as I dont' on evenings when we have plans, etc.. but with young kids we don't have plans much late night anymore. I don't know, I guess we are different people. I don't get stoned out of my mind at all. I go to the store, I take care of the house and cars, I cook dinner every night I'm home. Maybe I'm an exception and maybe I'll be you in a few more years. Time will tell. For now, i'm all for legalizing, which would eliminate my only real issue. (kids finding out)

[C&CDean]

So, because you couldn't responsibly handle drugs, you assume that no one else can?

WTF are you talking about? I was responsible as hell. I paid my bills, went to work, loved my family, etc. Hell, I even got some college credits during that time.

Maybe you should put down the bong for a while.

[C&CDean]

I definitely worry about my kids busting me when I'm older. I'm not bold enough to use/own a bong anymore, nor do I keep anything in the house. and I guess I stretched it when I said "daily" as I dont' on evenings when we have plans, etc.. but with young kids we don't have plans much late night anymore. I don't know, I guess we are different people. I don't get stoned out of my mind at all. I go to the store, I take care of the house and cars, I cook dinner every night I'm home. Maybe I'm an exception and maybe I'll be you in a few more years. Time will tell. For now, i'm all for legalizing, which would eliminate my only real issue. (kids finding out)

You'll probably either end up like me, or you'll do like a lot of long-term lifer potheads do. You'll just become complacent and OK with being half or less of what you could be. Good luck on your journey.

[DIB]

WTF are you talking about? I was responsible as hell. I paid my bills, went to work, loved my family, etc. Hell, I even got some college credits during that time.

Maybe you should put down the bong for a while.

I haven't smoked out a bong in a long time. I smoked a j a couple weeks ago, should I put that down?

The bottom line is that with the proper control and moderation, you can be very successful and occasionally partake in illicit drugs. I know many more people that have destroyed their lives by drinking too much.

PS. Maybe we have different definitions of responsible, but having a bong with bong water in a place that a small child can access is not responsible.

[C&CDean]

DIB,

Do you have small children? There ain't a place on the planet that's unaccessible.

If you hit a joint or a bong at a party or something once a month then no, it probably won't **** up your life. If you smoke it daily - or even a few times a week, you're hamstringing your life - not to mention that fact that depending on where you work - or want to work - you may find yourself unemployed if they decide to drug test. Is it worth it?

[Howzit]

You'll probably either end up like me, or you'll do like a lot of long-term lifer potheads do. You'll just become complacent and OK with being half or less of what you could be. Good luck on your journey.

Cause and effect. Chicken and the egg. Does pot cause people to become complacent and OK with being half or less of what they could be, or are they complacent and OK with being half or less of what they could be and so they smoke pot? Or are they complacent so they start smoking pot, and then are ok with being half or less of what they could be? Or do they smoke some pot, become somewhat ok with being half or less of what they could be, so they smoke some more pot and then become complacent, and finish up being ok with being half or less of what they could be the rest of the way?

Don't harsh my mellow.

[olevetonahill]

What a Half assed question ;)

[Aldebaran]

Not a day goes by that Michael Phelps doesn't wonder how many gold medals he would have won if he wasn't doing monster bong hits.

[thecynic]

I jsut don't think it's fair to lump people who casually smoke with stoners that have no ambition. I have 3 very good friends in different walks of life that smoke very regularly and have great jobs, are great parents and are productive members of society. So it's possible to smoke and be a good citizen.

[Howzit]

Well, that's just crazy talk.

[AlboSooner]

As a heads up, Nat Geo will show a series on drugs starting next Sunday. Marijuana is included in the show. Hopefully, when presented with scientific evidence, some of you will change your opinions on marijuana as a harmless weed.

[Howzit]

:les: NEVER!!!1

[DIB]

DIB,

Do you have small children? There ain't a place on the planet that's unaccessible.

If you hit a joint or a bong at a party or something once a month then no, it probably won't **** up your life. If you smoke it daily - or even a few times a week, you're hamstringing your life - not to mention that fact that depending on where you work - or want to work - you may find yourself unemployed if they decide to drug test. Is it worth it?

It appears we are arguing across each other. I would say that it would be very difficult, though not impossible, to smoke daily and be successful. I am an occasional smoker. I never smoke during the week. I do not have the experience to argue how daily smoking would affect my life.

[Howzit]

As a heads up, Nat Geo will show a series on drugs starting next Sunday. Marijuana is included in the show. Hopefully, when presented with scientific evidence, some of you will change your opinions on marijuana as a harmless weed.

Did they include alcohol and tobacco for comparisons? Honest question.

For the record I don't smoke teh marijoo. Anymore. Haven't for 30 years, but mainly because I feel better when I work out instead. However, I support legalization for a variety of the reasons that are probably listed in this thread but I'm not interested enough to read.

[AlboSooner]

Did they include alcohol and tobacco for comparisons? Honest question.



This assumes that I or somebody else, support the decision to keep those legal, or that those two are not dangerous.

Tobacco is synonymous with cancer now. Alcohol has caused and causes many problems, so why add one more headache to the list?

[C&CDean]

Did they include alcohol and tobacco for comparisons? Honest question.

For the record I don't smoke teh marijoo. Anymore. Haven't for 30 years, but mainly because I feel better when I work out instead. However, I support legalization for a variety of the reasons that are probably listed in this thread but I'm not interested enough to read.

Everybody always does the "alcohol vs. weed" comparison. I just wanna talk about the weed. We all know booze will kill you, hurt your family, and potentially ruin your health/life. It's well documented.

What ain't so well documented is the effects of marijooism. It's really hard to measure since it ain't legal, and there's no really thorough, long-termed CREDIBLE studies on it.

The only thing we know for sure is that it gives you cotton-mouth, the munchies, paranoia (in some folks anyhow) and ruins even the best parties. I can't tell you how many times I've been at a party and everyone is enjoying a few cocktails - chatting it up all happy and merry - then some goober fires up a joint. It goes around a couple times and BANG - everyone is looking at the wall, their shoes and it's quiet as a morgue. Some hot chick says something and you stammer all over yourself trying to get a response out.

There is some research out about lung/brain damage but I don't know how credible it is. What I do know for FACT is that within a year after quitting it I was promoted, had money in the bank, accrued sick leave, etc., and within 5 years had more than doubled my salary, got out of a crappy marriage, and was well on my way to being self-actualized like I am now.:P

[MR2-Sooner86]

Everybody always does the "alcohol vs. weed" comparison. I just wanna talWhat I do know for FACT is that within a year after quitting it I was promoted, had money in the bank, accrued sick leave, etc., and within 5 years had more than doubled my salary, got out of a crappy marriage, and was well on my way to being self-actualized like I am now.:P

Just admit it Dean, it was your ex-wife, not the pot that sucked the life and will to live out of you ;)

[Howzit]

This assumes that I or somebody else, support the decision to keep those legal, or that those two are not dangerous.

Tobacco is synonymous with cancer now. Alcohol has caused and causes many problems, so why add one more headache to the list?

Whether you support alcohol and tobacco being legal or not, they are. I just asked the question because I was truly interested in the comparison if the documentary's aim is to point out the dangers and retain the illegalization of marijuana.


Everybody always does the "alcohol vs. weed" comparison. I just wanna talk about the weed. We all know booze will kill you, hurt your family, and potentially ruin your health/life. It's well documented.

What ain't so well documented is the effects of marijooism. It's really hard to measure since it ain't legal, and there's no really thorough, long-termed CREDIBLE studies on it.

The only thing we know for sure is that it gives you cotton-mouth, the munchies, paranoia (in some folks anyhow) and ruins even the best parties. I can't tell you how many times I've been at a party and everyone is enjoying a few cocktails - chatting it up all happy and merry - then some goober fires up a joint. It goes around a couple times and BANG - everyone is looking at the wall, their shoes and it's quiet as a morgue. Some hot chick says something and you stammer all over yourself trying to get a response out.

There is some research out about lung/brain damage but I don't know how credible it is. What I do know for FACT is that within a year after quitting it I was promoted, had money in the bank, accrued sick leave, etc., and within 5 years had more than doubled my salary, got out of a crappy marriage, and was well on my way to being self-actualized like I am now.:P

Not arguing with any of that. And with all that said, I still support the legalization of teh marijoo.

I understand you don't want to compare alcohol and marijoo, but IMO that is a credible basis for making a decision on legalization. Balance the effects you listed with the costs associated with enforcement and incarceration of people convicted of marijoo-related "crimes," and I just come down on the other side of the fence.

Your argument is unpersuasive.

;)

[C&CDean]

Whether you support alcohol and tobacco being legal or not, they are. I just asked the question because I was truly interested in the comparison if the documentary's aim is to point out the dangers and retain the illegalization of marijuana.



Not arguing with any of that. And with all that said, I still support the legalization of teh marijoo.

I understand you don't want to compare alcohol and marijoo, but IMO that is a credible basis for making a decision on legalization. Balance the effects you listed with the costs associated with enforcement and incarceration of people convicted of marijoo-related "crimes," and I just come down on the other side of the fence.

Your argument is unpersuasive.

;)

Nuh uh.

Let me axe you dis. If they legalize it, will companies still be able to discipline you or not hire you for pissing dirty?

[Howzit]

Nuh uh.

Let me axe you dis. If they legalize it, will companies still be able to discipline you or not hire you for pissing dirty?

No idea. My guess is the original legislation would not address it, many companies (mine included) would continue their current policies, more people would get terminated, someone sues, and eventually the companies decide it's not worth the legal expense of enforcement.

So let's just concentrate on getting it legalized for right now, k?

This is really not a big sore spot for me, I just don't feel like it should be illegal.

[C&CDean]

Well yur rong.

[Howzit]

Well yur a big poopy head.

[thecynic]

Even if it is legal, couldn't companies still test for it and fire you if you were positive? I know of one okc company that has a morality clause that if you are seen drinking a glass of wine or beer in public they can fire you. Don't know how legal it is.

[Jammin']

What I do know for FACT is that within a year after quitting it I was promoted, had money in the bank, accrued sick leave, etc., and within 5 years had more than doubled my salary, got out of a crappy marriage, and was well on my way to being self-actualized like I am now.:P

Hmm, I changed jobs two years ago (my only job change since college and they called me, I wasn't looking, I'm 37) and am making well over double what I was before. The company is now training me for a position that would double what I'm making now and put me in a position I can't wait to take on. I certainly don't lack for money or benefits. My retirement is working well. Love my wife, kids, just booked flights for all of us to vacation in Vail in March. I'm thinking you's and me's are different types. Were you smoking ALL day? Were you smoking to get absolutely ****ed up every night? Sounds like you were an addict. (rimshot)

[C&CDean]

Hmm, I changed jobs two years ago (my only job change since college and they called me, I wasn't looking, I'm 37) and am making well over double what I was before. The company is now training me for a position that would double what I'm making now and put me in a position I can't wait to take on. I certainly don't lack for money or benefits. My retirement is working well. Love my wife, kids, just booked flights for all of us to vacation in Vail in March. I'm thinking you's and me's are different types. Were you smoking ALL day? Were you smoking to get absolutely ****ed up every night? Sounds like you were an addict. (rimshot)

My day started with a bong hit or two, and ended with the same. In between I might smoke a joint at lunch. Also, around the time I quit the weed started getting VERY potent. I'm sure the current crop is just as good or better. If you take a single hit, you're gonna get "absolutely ****ed up every night."

We're not so different you and me. You're just still smoking and think you've got it all going on. You've got plenty going on, but you're not all you could be. I ain't gonna argue with you about it because arguing with someone who is a stoner/drunk/druggie/sex addict/etc. is like talking to a wall. They're convinced it's all groovy and everything is perfect.

Someday maybe you'll cross to the other side of the fence. Let me know how it works out if you do. You'll be amazed.

[Jammin']

My day started with a bong hit or two, and ended with the same. In between I might smoke a joint at lunch. Also, around the time I quit the weed started getting VERY potent. I'm sure the current crop is just as good or better. If you take a single hit, you're gonna get "absolutely ****ed up every night."

We're not so different you and me. You're just still smoking and think you've got it all going on. You've got plenty going on, but you're not all you could be. I ain't gonna argue with you about it because arguing with someone who is a stoner/drunk/druggie/sex addict/etc. is like talking to a wall. They're convinced it's all groovy and everything is perfect.

Someday maybe you'll cross to the other side of the fence. Let me know how it works out if you do. You'll be amazed.

Damn, you were all in. I hope you don't think I'm arguing with you, cause I'm not. I do think you are broadbrushing everyone based upon your own past, which is pretty strange, but no biggie. I definitely have not been that free with my usage. I do not smoke in the AM or at lunch or before the kids go down. You are right, the potency you can find now is different than it was, even 5-7 year ago. I've got a small pipe that I take a couple of hits off in the evenings, grab a Fresca and I'm good. If I ever dry up I'll probably just add vodka to the Fresca and call it good. I'm glad you have found a balance in your life and wish you all the best.

[AlboSooner]

Whether you support alcohol and tobacco being legal or not, they are. I just asked the question because I was truly interested in the comparison if the documentary's aim is to point out the dangers and retain the illegalization of marijuana.

I don't know. We will have to tune in and find out.

[Midtowner]

Even if it is legal, couldn't companies still test for it and fire you if you were positive? I know of one okc company that has a morality clause that if you are seen drinking a glass of wine or beer in public they can fire you. Don't know how legal it is.

Companies are firing folks for being smokers, so yeah.

At will employment's a beeotch sometimes.

[sooner59]

Most people that I know that do it or ever have done it normally just blazed a little on a Friday or Saturday night and chilled instead of going out the the bars and drinking themselves into a stupor. My friends that did it would smoke maybe 2-3 times per month, and normally never left their apartment when they did. I don't even think any of them smoke anymore. This is what I was exposed to in college. Just like drinking...its perfectly fine if you don't abuse it and or act like a worthless retard. I guess that's why I never saw a problem with it. Alcohol was always much more dangerous to me. But then again, one of my best friends died because he was drinking and driving New Year's Eve my freshmen year.

And why is it every time I read the thread title, I read it with the first two words flipped....maybe I am dyslexic.

[thecynic]

there are no soccer riots in Amsterdam, just sayin

[Tiptonsooner]

Have any of you seen the movie Idiocracy??

[sooner59]

I have. I don't liken those who have a toke now and then as dumb, though. Most of the people I knew who smoked now and then were very intelligent. Most were near the top of their class and made staight A's at OU. They are in medical school, graduate school after triple majoring, and working as engineers. But they were smart enough to know their limits.

[Leroy Lizard]

Most people that I know that do it or ever have done it normally just blazed a little on a Friday or Saturday night and chilled instead of going out the the bars and drinking themselves into a stupor.

You know you're a total laggard when you can't even get the umph to go to a bar and drink.

"Hey man, what about... going to a... a... bar, man?"

"Dude, like... nawww, man. Let's just sit here and... what are we doing?"

"Smoking, man."

"Oh, yeah. Smoking. I forgot."

"Dude!"

[sooner59]

You know you're a total laggard when you can't even get the umph to go to a bar and drink.

"Hey man, what about... going to a... a... bar, man?"

"Dude, like... nawww, man. Let's just sit here and... what are we doing?"

"Smoking, man."

"Oh, yeah. Smoking. I forgot."

"Dude!"

When I say that, I mean it as.....Thursday was always the night when "everyone" on campus went out and partied. Friday, they would hit up a party or have one themselves, and maybe Saturday night they would smoke. It was cheaper than going to a bar, they had drank the two previous nights, and basically 100% of the people who went out to bars had a driver who had been drinking.

So yeah Leroy, instead of staying in for 1 out of 3 days, everyone should instead use their time for more purposeful things, like binge drinking, having drunk unprotected sex, and drinking and driving....you know, stuff that happens in college when people go out to bars. :rolleyes:

[Leroy Lizard]

When I say that, I mean it as.....Thursday was always the night when "everyone" on campus went out and partied. Friday, they would hit up a party or have one themselves, and maybe Saturday night they would smoke. It was cheaper than going to a bar, they had drank the two previous nights, and basically 100% of the people who went out to bars had a driver who had been drinking.

So yeah Leroy, instead of staying in for 1 out of 3 days, everyone should instead use their time for more purposeful things, like binge drinking, having drunk unprotected sex, and drinking and driving....you know, stuff that happens in college when people go out to bars. :rolleyes:

How about studying? Did they ever do any of that?

[sooner59]

How about studying? Did they ever do any of that?

Heh. Studying at college on a weekend? Only if there was a test on Monday or finals coming up. Besides that...you would have to be a laggard not to be able to drag yourself out to a bar, but rather just stay in. ;)

Sunday through Thursday night were strictly business. Once 9-10 pm came around on Thursday, everybody sort of just let their hair down....then went to class hung over on Friday. :D

I honestly never knew why Thursday was party night and not Friday. :confused:

And I knew a few people who never had fun, never partied, just always studied. And those people are in the same grad programs/medical school/jobs as the people who did have more fun. To each their own...

[Leroy Lizard]

Heh. Studying at college on a weekend? Only if there was a test on Monday or finals coming up. Besides that...you would have to be a laggard not to be able to drag yourself out to a bar, but rather just stay in. ;)

Question: Am I expected to feel sorry for students when they can't get a job once they graduate?

[sooner59]

You are not expected to feel anything for students. You are expected to provide them with the necessary tools/skills to get those jobs once they graduate for the given class you are teaching. It is up to them to attend class, do the work, meet the challenge, and develop and tune those skills that they learned in your class in order to get a job.

On the other hand....if you happen to be heavily partisan politically and your party is not in power at the time, then you have every right to feel sorry for them not being able to get a job because its not their fault...its the government's. :cool:

[Blue]

TOTP Maaaaaaan.

http://unrealitymag.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/snl_breuer.jpg

[sooner59]

Dammit Blue, did you get arrested for feeding a diabetic police horse? I'm not bailing you out again!

[booomer]

Yes, it should be legal, but only at work.

[texaspokieokie]

that's not fair, i'm retired.