Civil Rights Complaint for Woman Seeking "Christian Roommate"

[MR2-Sooner86]

Michigan Woman Faces Civil Rights Complaint for Seeking a Christian Roommate (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/10/22/civil-rights-complaint-filed-christian-roommate-advertisement/?test=latestnews)


A civil rights complaint has been filed against a woman in Grand Rapids, Mich., who posted an advertisement at her church last July seeking a Christian roommate.

The ad "expresses an illegal preference for a Christian roommate, thus excluding people of other faiths,” according to the complaint filed by the Fair Housing Center of West Michigan.

"It's a violation to make, print or publish a discriminatory statement," Executive Director Nancy Haynes told Fox News. "There are no exemptions to that."

Haynes said the unnamed 31-year-old woman’s case was turned over to the Michigan Department of Civil Rights. Depending on the outcome of the case, she said, the woman could face several hundreds of dollars in fines and “fair housing training so it doesn’t happen again.”

Harold Core, director of public affairs with the Michigan Department of Civil Rights, told the Grand Rapids Press that the Fair Housing Act prevents people from publishing an advertisement stating their preference of religion, race or handicap with respect to the sale or rental of a dwelling.

"It's really difficult to say at this point what could potentially happen," he told the newspaper, noting that there are exemptions in the law for gender when there is a shared living space.

But Joel Oster, an attorney with the Alliance Defense Fund, which is representing the woman free of charge, describes the case as "outrageous."

"Clearly this woman has a right to pick and choose who she wants to live with," he said.

"Christians shouldn't live in fear of being punished by the government for being Christians. It is completely absurd to try to penalize a single Christian woman for privately seeking a Christian roommate at church -- an obviously legal and constitutionally protected activity."

Haynes said the person who filed the initial complaint saw the ad on the church bulletin board and contacted the local fair housing organization.

The ad included the words, "Christian roommate wanted," along with the woman's contact information. Had the ad not included the word "Christian," Haynes said, it would not have been illegal.

"If you read it and you were not Christian, would you not feel welcome to rent there?" Haynes asked.

Oster said he hopes the case will eventually be dropped and that he's sent a letter to the state asking the authorities to dismiss the case as groundless.

"The First Amendment guarantees us Freedom of Religion," he said. "And we have the right to live with someone of the same faith. The Michigan Department of Civil Rights is denying her rights by pursuing this complaint."

But Haynes said officials plan on pursuing the matter.

"We want to make sure it doesn't happen again," she said.

:pop:

[yankee]

LMAO.

what a load of crock.

[kbsooner21]

Incredible.

[Leroy Lizard]

When I lived in California it was perfectly legal to seek roommates of certain religious beliefs as long as your renting practices didn't come across as a regular business. Not sure what it's like now.

[Frozen Sooner]

When I lived in California it was perfectly legal to seek roommates of certain religious beliefs as long as your renting practices didn't come across as a regular business. Not sure what it's like now.

That's still the federal Fair Housing Law. Called a Mrs. Murphy exception.

[Scott D]

personally, I wouldn't bother suing someone in Grand Rapids, it's not like they have money....or a full airport....or class....I could go on. :D

[Leroy Lizard]

That's still the federal Fair Housing Law. Called a Mrs. Murphy exception.

So what is your evaluation of the story?

[Condescending Sooner]

I wanna find the person who was obviously was in the church, and felt so violated that they took the time to call and complain.

And punch them in the teeth.

[Scott D]

I know..next we'll ban dating ads where people are looking for people with similar religious interests. :D

[Okla-homey]

I know..next we'll ban dating ads where people are looking for people with similar religious interests. :D

Not as long as we enjoy the freedom of association. I don't expect the gubmint would weigh in to regulate who you give it up to. Unless you're charging money for it. They have long taken a dim view of pay-to-play seckshual shenanigans.

[Frozen Sooner]

So what is your evaluation of the story?

Don't have enough facts, but I'd guess that either Michigan has tougher fair housing laws than the fair housing act or the Mrs. Murphy exception doesn't apply here for whatever reason.

Edit: Based solely on the statements by the people interviewed, that is. One would expect them to know Michigan housing laws.

[stoopified]

Some people will sue at the drop of a hat.Has the ACLU joined as a plaintiff yet?

[Veritas]

Some people will sue at the drop of a hat.Has the ACLU joined as a plaintiff yet?
This is the kind of deal where the ACLU would more likely side with the defendant.

[Okla-homey]

This is the kind of deal where the ACLU would more likely side with the defendant.

tru dat. the entity most likely to file an amicus brief is that "Freedom From Religion" pack of heathens:

http://www.ffrf.org/

[Leroy Lizard]

This is the kind of deal where the ACLU would more likely side with the defendant.

Yes, but I think for a different reason than most. It is unpopular to go after an individual and much more popular to be seen as the defender of the little guy (or little old lady).

[yermom]

I know..next we'll ban dating ads where people are looking for people with similar religious interests. :D

better not discriminate against same sex suitors either ;)

[royalfan5]

personally, I wouldn't bother suing someone in Grand Rapids, it's not like they have money....or a full airport....or class....I could go on. :D But the airport does have a nice statue of President Ford. Plus, they have a Steak and Shake which was a nice treat when I visited.

[Leroy Lizard]

So did you shake your steak?

[bluedogok]

My wife deals with Fair Housing issues all the time and based on the story the complaint seems groundless to her.

[GottaHavePride]

Yeah, I think this complaint will get laughed out of court.

[King Barry's Back]

The woman in question is exercising her Constitutional right to:

1. Freedom of speech

2. Freedom of association

3. Freedom of religion

4. Right to privacy (according to the US Supreme Court, not the document, but nevermind.)


The only law mentioned in the article was the Fair Housing Act. This will get laughed out of court.

And don't assume that the wise sages at the "Fair Housing Center of Western Michigan" know much of anything other than filing some documents here and there.

[Sooner5030]

Do the jurist prudent folks not practice materiality? Is this really worth crowding a f-ing docket?

1.5 trillion fed deficit, 13 trillion debt, states near BK, pensions about to take another hit from FASB, a mortgage mess that will stress our system, property rights and possibly call for TARP II, and we are soon to be known as the Banana Republic or Foodstampistan. All this and we are worried that one advert at a church denied someone their civil right to be a roommie? We deserve some type of reset.

[Frozen Sooner]

The woman in question is exercising her Constitutional right to:

1. Freedom of speech

Commercial speech is subject to greater regulation than political speech


2. Freedom of association

Probably


3. Freedom of religion

A neutral law of general applicability does not burden the free exercise of religion.


4. Right to privacy (according to the US Supreme Court, not the document, but nevermind.)

Possibly.



The only law mentioned in the article was the Fair Housing Act. This will get laughed out of court.

And don't assume that the wise sages at the "Fair Housing Center of Western Michigan" know much of anything other than filing some documents here and there.

Why would I assume you'd know any more than they would?

[TUSooner]

the person who filed the initial complaint saw the ad on the church bulletin board and contacted the local fair housing organization.

It makes me wonder who went to that church to spy out "unacceptable" bulletin board postings?

[landrun]

Commercial speech is subject to greater regulation than political speech
Probably
A neutral law of general applicability does not burden the free exercise of religion.
Possibly.
Why would I assume you'd know any more than they would?

So Froze, you think this will be considered a legit complaint??

If it is, we really are in trouble. :(

[Dio]

Yay, thought police!

[Frozen Sooner]

So Froze, you think this will be considered a legit complaint??

If it is, we really are in trouble. :(

Dunno. Under federal housing law, maybe not. I don't have enough facts about the case to determine whether the Mrs. Murphy exception applies. Plus, it might be something under Michigan law, and I don't know Michigan law at all. Just speaking to the federal constitutional claims, I don't think those are going to be super effective defenses.

[landrun]

Dunno. Under federal housing law, maybe not. I don't have enough facts about the case to determine whether the Mrs. Murphy exception applies. Plus, it might be something under Michigan law, and I don't know Michigan law at all. Just speaking to the federal constitutional claims, I don't think those are going to be super effective defenses.

So, if I understand what you're saying, you're saying that the constitution doesn't give this woman a right to say, "I'm looking for a room mate and I only want to live with a Christian." ???

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Unless, as mentioned, she is not exhibiting a standard business practice.

[yermom]

i could see where this might be an issue if she was running a boarding house or something, but a personal roommate?

of course, she's really just saving everyone some time. it's not like she is going to let Ms. Burqa move in after she sees her. and i'm not exactly going to even try calling someone with "Christian roommate wanted" so win-win

someone probably just doesn't like the yainch :D

[Frozen Sooner]

So, if I understand what you're saying, you're saying that the constitution doesn't give this woman a right to say, "I'm looking for a room mate and I only want to live with a Christian." ???

The First Amendment protections are very limited in the area of commercial speech. They exist, but if I recall correctly, the government only has to show rational basis and relation to burden commercial speech.

[Frozen Sooner]

i could see where this might be an issue if she was running a boarding house or something, but a personal roommate?

of course, she's really just saving everyone some time. it's not like she is going to let Ms. Burqa move in after she sees her. and i'm not exactly going to even try calling someone with "Christian roommate wanted" so win-win

someone probably just doesn't like the yainch :D

I could make a decent argument that making an exception for a lessor in this context would allow an easy end-run around the FHA. All you'd need to do is find a straw renter and have them advertise for a "roommate" that'd never see their "roomie."

[Leroy Lizard]

I could make a decent argument that making an exception for a lessor in this context would allow an easy end-run around the FHA. All you'd need to do is find a straw renter and have them advertise for a "roommate" that'd never see their "roomie."

I would think that non-Christians should support the lady's honesty in clarifying her desires for a roommate. Who wants to go through all the trouble to interview for a rental when they have no chance of success.

It's like the Kangaroo interviews that businesses hold. They advertise a position that they have already handed over to someone. So people spend a great deal of time and money interviewing for positions they have no chance of getting. I don't see how that benefits anyone.

[Frozen Sooner]

I would think that non-Christians should support the lady's honesty in clarifying her desires for a roommate. Who wants to go through all the trouble to interview for a rental when they have no chance of success.

It's like the Kangaroo interviews that businesses hold. They advertise a position that they have already handed over to someone. So people spend a great deal of time and money interviewing for positions they have no chance of getting. I don't see how that benefits anyone.

In this particular case, sure.

Bad facts make for bad law.

[MR2-Sooner86]

Lets turn this on it's head a little bit.

Suppose we take out "Christians only" it said "non-Jew" or "whites only" instead?

[47straight]

Lets turn this on it's head a little bit.

Suppose we take out "Christians only" it said "non-Jew" or "whites only" instead?

Suppose we take out "non-Jew" and replace it with "female" or "male"

[The]

Suppose we take out "non-Jew" and replace it with "female" or "male"

Suppose we take out "female" or "male" and replace it with "nullo"

[Leroy Lizard]

Lets turn this on it's head a little bit.

Suppose we take out "Christians only" it said "non-Jew" or "whites only" instead?

I have no problem with it. It's her home. If she wants to only live with white people, that's her choice.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Or take it out and put "kendolls".

Or even "mackbrown".

[Scott D]

But the airport does have a nice statue of President Ford. Plus, they have a Steak and Shake which was a nice treat when I visited.

Steak and Shake exploded up here before Sonic even broke ground up here.

[royalfan5]

Steak and Shake exploded up here before Sonic even broke ground up here.

I think Michigan got the better end of the deal on that one. I'd rough up a midget if it would help get a Steak and Shake here.

[bluedogok]

If it is a co-habitation situation in the same dwelling with a shared living space you have the right of association according to the federal Fair Housing Law according to my wife who is an advocate for people with disabilities and runs their housing programs. She deals with the fair housing laws all the time...she also has to attend and give seminars on the fair housing laws.

[TUSooner]

I have no problem with it. It's her home. If she wants to only live with white people, that's her choice.

I agree with Leroy.

Note to self: Make appointment with psychiatrist ASAP.

[olevetonahill]

It makes me wonder who went to that church to spy out "unacceptable" bulletin board postings?

Prolly THIS guy :eek:
http://users.tinyonline.co.uk/gswithenbank/devil.gif