Tell Me Why I'm Wrong: V

[Sooner04]

When watching the NFL these days, it's impossible to ignore how vital good quarterback play is to a successful Sunday/Monday. Time and time again I've watched teams lose games they had no business losing because of ineptness behind center (that's your cue, Mr. Sanchez).

I've said it before, and I've said it again, but I don't believe you can win in the NFL if your QB isn't any good. Average QB play can get you so far, and good QB play can take you a LONG way, but sorry QB play is a one-way ticket to cleaning out your head coach's office.

And that's why I'm here to talk about Adrian Peterson. For all the ribbing I give some fans on here about Peterson's fumbles, you must know this: I love the guy. He's a monster. He's one of the very few "hold your breath" players left in the game. He has been a tremendous ambassador for the University of Oklahoma (my alma mater, my team!) and the Minnesota Vikings (my pro team for life!). He does not get in trouble, he does not slap women around in the bathroom, he's not on the substance abuse policy watch list......he's just wonderful......even if he does fumble too much. ;) Kidding!

But Adrian Peterson is not the prototype. He's the old type. His day has come and gone. In today's NFL, it is ALL about the quarterback. You may be loaded like the Jets, but that's no good if one of the two guys who touches the ball on every play is a scum-sucking dog on the gridiron (and I'm not talking about Nick Mangold). For those who watch the pro game, surely you realize that the lion's share of the rules are slanted to help the offense., and those slanted rules GREATLY assist the PASSING game.

1. No blows to the QB's head (there's got to be a better way to word that).
2. No contact beyond five-yards.
3. No blows to a defenseless receiver.
4. No defender can leave his feet to launch himself into a receiver.

And on and on and on! You know who these rules do not help or affect? That's right, Adrian Peterson. He's still going to get beaten up and stripped and mauled every time he touches the ball while other players are protected and pampered. Rubbish! But it's the NFL in 2010.

One needs look no farther than the 2009 Minnesota Vikings offense compared to their predecessors from 2008:

They scored 91 more points.
They averaged 49 more yards per game.
They won two more games and clinched a bye.

But they did those things in 2009 with Peterson rushing for nearly 400 yards LESS than he did in 2008. The O-line wasn't any good, but they added Favre and the offense turns into a juggernaut.

It has been my contention for some time that stellar RB play is a luxury, but good QB play is MANDATORY to succeed in today's NFL. Don't believe me? Take a gander at Chris Johnson of the Tennessee Titans. His 2009 was an all-time season for somebody goofing around on a video game, but it was real. It actually happened.

Rushing Yards - 2006
Receiving Yards - 503
Yards from Scrimmage - 2509 <----NFL Record
Fumbles - 3

That's absurd. It gets no better than that. It's simply as good as a running back can play. Know what his team's record was? 8-8, and they missed the playoffs.

Poor QB play is why Barry Sanders went an entire career and only won ONE playoff game.

Poor QB play is why Eric Dickerson rushed for 2105 yards in '84 and didn't even win his division.

The last two guys to lead the NFL in rushing AND win the Super Bowl in the same season are Terrell Davis in 1998 and Emmitt Smith in 1995. Know what they had in common? Both had HOF quarterbacks handing the ball off to them.

To me, it's inescapable. Solid QB play has to be part of the equation. Anything less is certain death! And that's why I'm here to talk about Adrian Peterson. With Chester Taylor rushing for over 1200 yards in 2006, I'm here to say the Vikings needed to look elsewhere with their first-round pick in 2007. They needed a quarterback or, at the very least, they needed to ship off that pick to TRADE for a quarterback. Look at where they are now: they're racking up boatloads of frequent flier miles in and out of Hattiesburg International Airport wooing Brett Favre back from the brink every off-season.

And do you know why? Because they have to! Because they have nothing behind him. They have Tarvaris Jackson, a man who'd check down out of a Hail Mary, and they know full well that they could line up the '76 Steelers "D" alongside the '09 Saints "O" and still be ****ed because they've got Tarvaris Jackson taking the snaps if Favre gets knocked into next week.

And they are screwed because they drafted Adrian Peterson in the first round in 2007. Peterson is so good that he made them just good enough to never be high enough in the draft to get the QB they so desperately need. It's like they are forever chained to the clutches of mediocrity, and it's as much BECAUSE of Adrian Peterson as anybody.

I'll leave you with this little statistical nugget:

The four leading rushers in the NFL in 2009 were as Chris Johnson, Steven Jackson, Thomas Jones and Maurice Jones-Drew. Their teams went a combined 25-39.

The four highest rated passers in the NFL in 2009 were Drew Brees, Brett Favre, Philip Rivers and Aaron Rodgers. Their teams went a combined 49-15.

In terms of putting together a team to win a Super Bowl, I think it was a bad pick. I think Adrian Peterson, by the Minnesota Vikings, was a BAD pick.

So, tell me why I'm wrong.

[KantoSooner]

So, don't hold back now. Speak your mind, man: HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT MARK SANCHEZ?

[KBoomer11]

You're wrong because the most proven quarterback out of that draft is Trent Edwards. Tell me who else would they have picked? It was a great pick, a pick that helped turn that franchise around.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Im going to let a few more chime in before I respond with my answer..can't wait to read some of the responses

[yankee]

whoever thought jackson would be a good QB in the NFL is a dumb arse. :D ;)

[stoops the eternal pimp]

whoever thought jackson would be a good QB in the NFL is a dumb arse. :D ;)

I got paid for it though! :D :P

[Sooner04]

You're wrong because the most proven quarterback out of that draft is Trent Edwards. Tell me who else would they have picked? It was a great pick, a pick that helped turn that franchise around.
Look at what the Texans did with Matt Schaub. Got him out of a trade. That's why I suggested packaging the Peterson pick to get a solid, NFL-ready quarterback.

Peterson's 2008 was absolutely stellar. But once Frerotte got hurt they had to go back to Tarvaris and he checked them down right out of the playoffs with a limp-wristed performance against the Philadelphia Eagles.

If the NFL were slanted more toward the running back then Peterson's 2008 should've brought about more success than a Wild Card loss at home to Donovan McNabb.

TopDawg texted me right after they drafted Peterson. I was in the airport in San Diego, California, and I sent him back a one-word reply: TRADE!

[Jacie]

If there is an exception to this then I was watching it last night. A team can win with average or subpar quarterback play if it fields a strong defense.

I bring up last night's MNF season-opening double header, the first game being the Ravens vs. Jets, playing in front of the crowd at the Meadowlands. I know he must have completed a pass but it seemed everytime I was watching, Flacco, the Ravens QB, was overthrowing his receivers. I know I saw 6, 7, or 8 incompletions in a row and somehow they still won. I guess he did complete a 39-yarder on one of their possessions that started inside their own 10-yard line and it seemed that was where they were for the entire second half. The only difference in the two offenses were the Ravens managed to move the ball on the ground enough to buy them some field position, while Jets were completely inept.

The drive for the only touchdown in the game was aided by penalties.

[Harry Beanbag]

I've had the same thoughts for a couple of years now. The one team that Peterson was available to that made a huge mistake by passing on him was the Arizona Cardinals. Add Peterson to Kurt Warner, Larry Fitzgerald, and Anquan Boldin and that's the greatest offense of all time. Levi Brown didn't make them a better team.

Peterson did help sustain the life of the Brett Favre circus though. Teams still play 8 in the box against the Vikings.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Not really an exception because the Ravens were playing a team with a worse quarterback

[NOVSooner]

i say the Vikings picking Peterson was not bad at all on their part. it has turned the organization around, albeit they haven't turned the corner to the super bowl. I think i will focus on the part about "he's made them too good to where they can't get the qb they desperately need." to draft a qb and expect him to be absolutely great in his 1st season is a stretch. aaron rodgers was a late 1st round pick i believe. brady, we all know his story. yes, some of the absolute best to play and currently play were high 1st round picks but that's selling short the possibility of finding a gem late 1st round or later to COMPLIMENT the RB they already have. i agree with much of what you suggest, that's why i focused on the whole can't get a qb they need part. i think they can get a qb they can groom over time that will give them a great qb-rb tandem that the league will be talking about. they can build around Adrian. much like the Rams have Steven Jackson so all the pressure isn't on Sam. (yes i know he was 1st pick and the vikings won't be 1-16 anytime soon)

[rawlingsHOH]

Poor QB play is why Barry Sanders went an entire career and only won ONE playoff game.

Poor QB play is why Eric Dickerson rushed for 2105 yards in '84 and didn't even win his division.

The last two guys to lead the NFL in rushing AND win the Super Bowl in the same season are Terrell Davis in 1998 and Emmitt Smith in 1995. Know what they had in common? Both had HOF quarterbacks handing the ball off to them.
It's been a QB driven league since the 80s, and even more so since the cutdown in DB contact.



In terms of putting together a team to win a Super Bowl, I think it was a bad pick. I think Adrian Peterson, by the Minnesota Vikings, was a BAD pick.

So, tell me why I'm wrong.
Who were the QBs that went after him?

The reason Favre was miraculously good last year, was soley due to Peterson. And you know I am the biggest Favre-lovin' apologist this board will ever see. I watched the fronts he was getting. Never saw anything like that in his 16 years in Green and Gold. Sold out to stop AD.

[My Opinion Matters]

Guys named Brad Johnson, Eli Manning, and Trent Dilfer have won Super Bowls this decade. During Pittsburgh's first Super bowl season this decade Ben Roethlisberger threw for 2,300 yards for the entire season. That's...uhh.....143 yards per game.

I think what you mean to say is you need a Peyton, a Tom, or a Drew to win a Super Bowl...but of course there's a reason there's only 3 of those guys.

[rawlingsHOH]

whoever thought jackson would be a good QB in the NFL is a dumb arse. :D ;)

His book has yet to be written.

[Frozen Sooner]

When watching the NFL these days, it's impossible to ignore how vital good quarterback play is to a successful Sunday/Monday. Time and time again I've watched teams lose games they had no business losing because of ineptness behind center (that's your cue, Mr. Sanchez).

I've said it before, and I've said it again, but I don't believe you can win in the NFL if your QB isn't any good. Average QB play can get you so far, and good QB play can take you a LONG way, but sorry QB play is a one-way ticket to cleaning out your head coach's office.

And that's why I'm here to talk about Adrian Peterson. For all the ribbing I give some fans on here about Peterson's fumbles, you must know this: I love the guy. He's a monster. He's one of the very few "hold your breath" players left in the game. He has been a tremendous ambassador for the University of Oklahoma (my alma mater, my team!) and the Minnesota Vikings (my pro team for life!). He does not get in trouble, he does not slap women around in the bathroom, he's not on the substance abuse policy watch list......he's just wonderful......even if he does fumble too much. ;) Kidding!

But Adrian Peterson is not the prototype. He's the old type. His day has come and gone. In today's NFL, it is ALL about the quarterback. You may be loaded like the Jets, but that's no good if one of the two guys who touches the ball on every play is a scum-sucking dog on the gridiron (and I'm not talking about Nick Mangold). For those who watch the pro game, surely you realize that the lion's share of the rules are slanted to help the offense., and those slanted rules GREATLY assist the PASSING game.

1. No blows to the QB's head (there's got to be a better way to word that).
2. No contact beyond five-yards.
3. No blows to a defenseless receiver.
4. No defender can leave his feet to launch himself into a receiver.

And on and on and on! You know who these rules do not help or affect? That's right, Adrian Peterson. He's still going to get beaten up and stripped and mauled every time he touches the ball while other players are protected and pampered. Rubbish! But it's the NFL in 2010.

One needs look no farther than the 2009 Minnesota Vikings offense compared to their predecessors from 2008:

They scored 91 more points.
They averaged 49 more yards per game.
They won two more games and clinched a bye.

But they did those things in 2009 with Peterson rushing for nearly 400 yards LESS than he did in 2008. The O-line wasn't any good, but they added Favre and the offense turns into a juggernaut.

It has been my contention for some time that stellar RB play is a luxury, but good QB play is MANDATORY to succeed in today's NFL. Don't believe me? Take a gander at Chris Johnson of the Tennessee Titans. His 2009 was an all-time season for somebody goofing around on a video game, but it was real. It actually happened.

Rushing Yards - 2006
Receiving Yards - 503
Yards from Scrimmage - 2509 <----NFL Record
Fumbles - 3

That's absurd. It gets no better than that. It's simply as good as a running back can play. Know what his team's record was? 8-8, and they missed the playoffs.

Poor QB play is why Barry Sanders went an entire career and only won ONE playoff game.

Poor QB play is why Eric Dickerson rushed for 2105 yards in '84 and didn't even win his division.

The last two guys to lead the NFL in rushing AND win the Super Bowl in the same season are Terrell Davis in 1998 and Emmitt Smith in 1995. Know what they had in common? Both had HOF quarterbacks handing the ball off to them.

To me, it's inescapable. Solid QB play has to be part of the equation. Anything less is certain death! And that's why I'm here to talk about Adrian Peterson. With Chester Taylor rushing for over 1200 yards in 2006, I'm here to say the Vikings needed to look elsewhere with their first-round pick in 2007. They needed a quarterback or, at the very least, they needed to ship off that pick to TRADE for a quarterback. Look at where they are now: they're racking up boatloads of frequent flier miles in and out of Hattiesburg International Airport wooing Brett Favre back from the brink every off-season.

And do you know why? Because they have to! Because they have nothing behind him. They have Tarvaris Jackson, a man who'd check down out of a Hail Mary, and they know full well that they could line up the '76 Steelers "D" alongside the '09 Saints "O" and still be ****ed because they've got Tarvaris Jackson taking the snaps if Favre gets knocked into next week.

And they are screwed because they drafted Adrian Peterson in the first round in 2007. Peterson is so good that he made them just good enough to never be high enough in the draft to get the QB they so desperately need. It's like they are forever chained to the clutches of mediocrity, and it's as much BECAUSE of Adrian Peterson as anybody.

I'll leave you with this little statistical nugget:

The four leading rushers in the NFL in 2009 were as Chris Johnson, Steven Jackson, Thomas Jones and Maurice Jones-Drew. Their teams went a combined 25-39.

The four highest rated passers in the NFL in 2009 were Drew Brees, Brett Favre, Philip Rivers and Aaron Rodgers. Their teams went a combined 49-15.

In terms of putting together a team to win a Super Bowl, I think it was a bad pick. I think Adrian Peterson, by the Minnesota Vikings, was a BAD pick.

So, tell me why I'm wrong.

Five Words:

Trent Dilfer: Super Bowl Champion.

[C&CDean]

I don't really give a **** about anything Minnesota.

Of course if Peterson could end up in Green Bay along with AR & Co. that'd be the bombaliciousdiggitydildo.

[Sooner04]

Five Words:

Trent Dilfer: Super Bowl Champion.
You do realize there was a stretch from 1999 through 2001 where Trent Dilfer's record as a starter was 18-4, correct?

I didn't say you needed super-duper QB play. You just need solid QB play. When you've got cogs everywhere else you just need a QB who isn't going to lose the game for you. Tarvaris will throw that cripping Pick-6. I've seen it with my own two eyes. Sanchez will throw that 8-yard out on 3rd and 9.

It doesn't have to be Manning, Montana or Fouts back there. But it can be Brad Johnson or Gus Frerotte if they won't lose the game for you.

[Harry Beanbag]

Five Words:

Trent Dilfer: Super Bowl Champion.

Five more words:

Greatest Defense of All Time

[rawlingsHOH]

aaron rodgers was a late 1st round pick i believe.

Was damn near the #1 pick, but the 49ers completely lost their minds.

[Collier11]

Guys named Brad Johnson, Eli Manning, and Trent Dilfer have won Super Bowls this decade. During Pittsburgh's first Super bowl season this decade Ben Roethlisberger threw for 2,300 yards for the entire season. That's...uhh.....143 yards per game.

I think what you mean to say is you need a Peyton, a Tom, or a Drew to win a Super Bowl...but of course there's a reason there's only 3 of those guys.

While I dont think Eli or Ben are top tier QBs compared to Tom, Drew, and Peyton, they are far above Brad or Trent

[BoulderSooner79]

I was a big Bronco fan back in the Elway/Davis days. Davis does not get enough credit for what he did for that team. Okay, he was SB MVP and league MVP, so yeah he got credit. But history attributes it to being a "system" back and most credit goes to Elway. But Davis put 8 and even 9 guys in the box and then Elway torched them with single coverage on Rod Smith, Ed McCaffrey and Shannon Sharpe. No other time in his career did Elway have those kind of numbers. But you're right, Elway was a legit HOF QB and it is a QB league and nothing is going to change that. Also, T. Davis was a smart pick in the 6th round :)

[Collier11]

Look at what the Texans did with Matt Schaub. Got him out of a trade. That's why I suggested packaging the Peterson pick to get a solid, NFL-ready quarterback.



And until last year it wasnt certain that Schuab would pan out

[saucysoonergal]

You are wrong because you are a ginger. Everyone knows that gingers don't know squat!









;)

[My Opinion Matters]

And until last year it wasnt certain that Schuab would pan out

Matt Schaub's career playoff record as a starter: 0-0

[Frozen Sooner]

You do realize there was a stretch from 1999 through 2001 where Trent Dilfer's record as a starter was 18-4, correct?

I didn't say you needed super-duper QB play. You just need solid QB play. When you've got cogs everywhere else you just need a QB who isn't going to lose the game for you. Tarvaris will throw that cripping Pick-6. I've seen it with my own two eyes. Sanchez will throw that 8-yard out on 3rd and 9.

It doesn't have to be Manning, Montana or Fouts back there. But it can be Brad Johnson or Gus Frerotte if they won't lose the game for you.


Five more words:

Greatest Defense of All Time

Both of which tend to disprove you need even "solid" QB play to win in the NFL.

[Frozen Sooner]

It seems your point is that in order to win games in the NFL, you need a QB that won't lose games.

Hardly an earth-shattering revelation there. It's also a good idea to have a defense that won't lose games, and a punter who won't lose games, a coach who won't lose games...etc...

[TahoeSOONER]

I'd say you're wrong based on allot of team are going to have trouble with the Ravens defense. Just that Dline alone could do damage but then you throw in some of the best linebackers in the league and dominance is what you're going to get.

Sanchez is an average QB that ran into a great defensive game plan and his WR couldn't make plays when they needed to. I love defense so I was entertained.

In order to have a great offense you need to have the biggins up front to protect. Ask P. Manning about that this weekend.

It's all a balance, it's still a team game. To say Sanchez was terrible when they couldn't keep that Ngata (spelling?) or half the Ravens team putting pressure on the backfield is putting it all on one player.

[Breadburner]

There's is more than one way to make it to the big show and win....And they all don't include a super-star tossing the pig-skin.....

[proudsoonergal]

Both of which tend to disprove you need even "solid" QB play to win in the NFL.

Lawyered.

[Sooner04]

It seems your point is that in order to win games in the NFL, you need a QB that won't lose games.
That isn't my point at all. I covered a new way to build a successful franchise HERE (http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134745). My point is the Vikings are well equipped to win a Super Bowl, with or without Peterson, as long as they find a serviceable quarterback.

They've had a solid defense and solid offensive tools since 2008. A solid, serviceable QB would have them built to last.

My point was that he was a bad draft pick because they are, in my opinion, no closer to winning a Super Bowl now with him than they would be without him.

[TahoeSOONER]

That isn't my point at all. I covered a new way to build a successful franchise HERE (http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134745). My point is the Vikings are well equipped to win a Super Bowl, with or without Peterson, as long as they find a serviceable quarterback.

They've had a solid defense and solid offensive tools since 2008. A solid, serviceable QB would have them built to last.

My point was that he was a bad draft pick because they are, in my opinion, no closer to winning a Super Bowl now with him than they would be without him.

Peterson makes all the difference.

The defense that was built to stop the run got used in the second half and their sack master Allen got goose egged.

They already have a hall of fame QB that had his best year ever last year.

[C&CDean]

When Favre leaves the queens will go right back to where they belong. Somewhere between Chicago and Detroit.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I've discussed this in other threads but the pendulum has swung the way of the offense and big time quarterback play is necessary in the league to win the Super Bowl.

How long was Dilfer in Baltimore? and How many SB's have they played for since then? That was 10 years ago! There was a time in the league that "ok" quarterback play was enough...just-dont lose-the-game quarterbacking isn't enough anymore..Heck even brad johnson threw 22 TD's and only a handful ot picks their superbowl year.. How many more have they competed for since then?

The old run the ball and pass when you have to offense isn't working now..probably will again in a couple of years, but not now...Even the Ravens have figured that out.

2009 AFC playoff teams.

1. Indianapolis-
2. San Diego-
3.NE-
4. Cincy-
5. NYJ-
6. Bal-

Every AFC team that was in the playoffs last year drafted their quarterback and the only ****ty quarterback in the bunch was Mark Sanchez...Did they almost get there? Yup, and if he doesn't suck as bad as he did, they probably make it...AFC quarterbacks were darn good for the most part.

2009 NFC quarterbacks

1. Saints
2. Vikings
3. Cowboys
4. Arizona
5. Green Bay
6. Philly

Brees, Favre, Romo, Warner, Rodgers, McNabb..Not a ball control, play not to lose quarterback in the bunch..

I'll tell you where Minnesota drafted wrong B...It was not in 2007 or 2006 but 2005 when they took Troy Williamson with the 7th pick and let a very sound, strong armed, quick release owning quarterback slide past them twice named Aaron Rodgers.

[Sooner04]

They already have a hall of fame QB that had his best year ever last year.
That's precisely my point. Peterson rushed for 400 LESS yards, but the stellar QB play took them from being gone in the Wild Card round to the brink of the Super Bowl.

Peterson's 2009 was only 10 more rushing yards per game than Chester Taylor's 2006. Now, some will think that Favre was as good as he was because of Peterson. That may be true, but I don't subscribe to that theory as much. I think RB production can be replaced.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

That's precisely my point. Peterson rushed for 400 LESS yards, but the stellar QB play took them from being gone in the Wild Card round to the brink of the Super Bowl.

Peterson's 2009 was only 10 more rushing yards per game than Chester Taylor's 2006. Now, some will think that Favre was as good as he was because of Peterson. That may be true, but I don't subscribe to that theory as much. I think RB production can be replaced.

I have to agree with this..

[Sooner04]

I'll tell you where Minnesota drafted wrong B...It was not in 2007 or 2006 but 2005 when they took Troy Williamson with the 7th pick and let a very sound, strong armed, quick release owning quarterback slide past them twice named Aaron Rodgers.
Man, you ain't kidding. But I don't think this topic gets much play if I go the Troy Williamson route instead of Peterson. :)

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Man, you ain't kidding. But I don't think this topic gets much play if I go the Troy Williamson route instead of Peterson. :)

Well I guess the moral of the story is I agree with you....while Peterson is a superstar, big time runningbacks aren't the key to the SB right now

[TahoeSOONER]

That's precisely my point. Peterson rushed for 400 LESS yards, but the stellar QB play took them from being gone in the Wild Card round to the brink of the Super Bowl.

Peterson's 2009 was only 10 more rushing yards per game than Chester Taylor's 2006. Now, some will think that Favre was as good as he was because of Peterson. That may be true, but I don't subscribe to that theory as much. I think RB production can be replaced.

They had the Saints by the juggular and couldn't choke them out. Tip your cap to the Saints! To say Peterson could be replaced by Chester Taylor is laughable. Taylor is a fine back that can block and catch the ball out of the backfield but he's no AD.

I see your point, that's why most teams have a two back system.

[rawlingsHOH]

That's precisely my point. Peterson rushed for 400 LESS yards, but the stellar QB play took them from being gone in the Wild Card round to the brink of the Super Bowl.


He had 300 more yards receiving and scored 8 mores TDs, than the previous year. Yards from scrimmage near the same. Still got his yards, but do to Favre, got them differently.

If the question is.... Is a franchise QB more valuable than a franchise RB? That answer is easy, of course.

But I thought the question was.... Should Minnesota have drafted somebody else with the #7 pick? Who?




Peterson's 2009 was only 10 more rushing yards per game than Chester Taylor's 2006. Now, some will think that Favre was as good as he was because of Peterson. That may be true, but I don't subscribe to that theory as much. I think RB production can be replaced
But in 2006, with Chester playing, the QB stats were abysmal. The defense allowed Chester his yards (a modest 4.0/carry and only 6 TDs) and totally stopped the passing game with no game breaking threat in the backfield. The Vikings QB ratings improved every year once Peterson arrived.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

And they are screwed because they drafted Adrian Peterson in the first round in 2007. Peterson is so good that he made them just good enough to never be high enough in the draft to get the QB they so desperately need. It's like they are forever chained to the clutches of mediocrity, and it's as much BECAUSE of Adrian Peterson as anybody.


here is where you are wrong, because you are thinking about it like its the NBA. in the NBA, rarely does a hall of famer escape the top 5 picks. in the NFL, its fairly common for a team that picks 23rd or later to pick up superstars. new england has been pretty good to downright dominating for a decade doing it.

[Spritekid]

So what defines a good QB would be my question.... because you can have receivers that can make you look like the best QB in the country and receivers that can make you look like crap!

[proudsoonergal]

I've discussed this in other threads but the pendulum has swung the way of the offense and big time quarterback play is necessary in the league to win the Super Bowl.

How long was Dilfer in Baltimore? and How many SB's have they played for since then? That was 10 years ago! There was a time in the league that "ok" quarterback play was enough...just-dont lose-the-game quarterbacking isn't enough anymore..Heck even brad johnson threw 22 TD's and only a handful ot picks their superbowl year.. How many more have they competed for since then?

The old run the ball and pass when you have to offense isn't working now..probably will again in a couple of years, but not now...Even the Ravens have figured that out.

2009 AFC playoff teams.

1. Indianapolis-
2. San Diego-
3.NE-
4. Cincy-
5. NYJ-
6. Bal-

Every AFC team that was in the playoffs last year drafted their quarterback and the only ****ty quarterback in the bunch was Mark Sanchez...Did they almost get there? Yup, and if he doesn't suck as bad as he did, they probably make it...AFC quarterbacks were darn good for the most part.

2009 NFC quarterbacks

1. Saints
2. Vikings
3. Cowboys
4. Arizona
5. Green Bay
6. Philly

Brees, Favre, Romo, Warner, Rodgers, McNabb..Not a ball control, play not to lose quarterback in the bunch..

I'll tell you where Minnesota drafted wrong B...It was not in 2007 or 2006 but 2005 when they took Troy Williamson with the 7th pick and let a very sound, strong armed, quick release owning quarterback slide past them twice named Aaron Rodgers.

Well, not to be difficult, but technically SD didn't draft Rivers. I don't think that takes anything away from your point.

[agoo758]

Don't forget that in 2008, Drew Brees almost broke the single season passing yard record, and his team didn't even make the playoffs. Of course the QB is important, but so is the rest of your offense, and your defense.

[soonerbub]

Call me crazy but I can see T Jackson holding a Lombardi in the next 5 years. It's gonna take a 7-9 yr to get Brett to hang it up (this yr sorry). I think TJ couldve played as good as #4 did in the superdome

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Well, not to be difficult, but technically SD didn't draft Rivers. I don't think that takes anything away from your point.

no, because that was worked out ahead of time

[Sooner04]

Call me crazy but I can see T Jackson holding a Lombardi in the next 5 years.
You, sir, are crazy.

Unless T Jackson gets to hold it after another starting QB has won the game for us.

[turner78]

I think I have to agree with the OP

[Sooner04]

Peterson was a monster today. 28 carries for 145 yards and a touchdown. Even caught five passes out of the backfield for 41 yards. An all-around outstanding day.

But his QB played like garbage and the Vikings lost.

I simply do not believe you can win in the NFL without good quarterback play. If your QB plays well while your RB gets stuffed you can still win. But if your QB is a dog, I don't think victory can be attained.

Look how well EVERYBODY else played for Minnesota today. It was a fantastic peformance. It's all about the QB, and Favre sucked.....surprise surprise, his team lost.

:(

[rawlingsHOH]

Peterson was a monster today. 28 carries for 145 yards and a touchdown. Even caught five passes out of the backfield for 41 yards. An all-around outstanding day.

But his QB played like garbage and the Vikings lost.

I simply do not believe you can win in the NFL without good quarterback play. If your QB plays well while your RB gets stuffed you can still win. But if your QB is a dog, I don't think victory can be attained.

Look how well EVERYBODY else played for Minnesota today. It was a fantastic peformance. It's all about the QB, and Favre sucked.....surprise surprise, his team lost.

:(

They had about 5 drops, the receivers were bad.

[bluedogok]

I simply do not believe you can win in the NFL without good quarterback play. If your QB plays well while your RB gets stuffed you can still win. But if your QB is a dog, I don't think victory can be attained.
The way the game is constructed now you really can't. You have to have a "good" QB and have an incredible defense and special teams and some luck to contend without an exceptional QB. When the Ravens won and when Tampa Bay won they had those components...but that the exception to the rule.

[texaspokieokie]

QB has to have good players to win.

it's a TEAM game.

QB has always been the most important on any team.

[rawlingsHOH]

Well, the Vikings could have traded up to select Jamarcus Russell, or they could have stayed at #7 and selected Brady Quinn.

Then they would have been set at QB, for sure!

[tommieharris91]

Wanna know who would a perfect QB for Sooner04?














Kyle Orton.

[soonerbub]

04 you don't think TJ couldve done better today? (yeah the SB thing was a pipe dream)

[BoulderSooner79]

Favre used up all remaining magic last year. He is another surgery and another season older and he doesn't have his #1 passing target, Sydney Rice. The Vikes will be extremely lucky to get a wildcard spot and if they do, I'm guessing TJ will be the QB. Bummer, because I really want to see AD in more playoff games.