PDA

View Full Version : Mark McGwire



Serge Ibaka
7/13/2010, 02:15 PM
All Star Weekend has me thinking about the steroid-era of baseball, and Mark McGwire absolutely occupies an interesting spot in the narrative of modern baseball. He captured our hearts during the homerun-race in 1998; I remember the Derby that season when he sent some crazy-blasts over the Green Monster.

And yet he's a liar and a cheater. And while other fan-bases have distanced themselves from cheating stars (Sosa and Bonds), Cardinals fans continue to embrace McGwire. He's been welcomed to their staff as a hitting-coach.

I like McGwire, and I don't think he was doing anything that was inconsistent with the current-culture of the game. But he's still an interesting phenomenon. And it's weird.

Collier11
7/13/2010, 02:43 PM
The reason Cardinal fans such as myself continue to embrace him is because he came out and apologized and was sincere in his apology. By all accounts, McGwire was always a good guy during his time in STL and he wanted to come clean way back when but got horrible advice by his attorney.

He was welcomed back as a hitting coach for two reasons, the guy knows hitting and because LaRussa defends his ex players to the death.

You really didnt ask a questions so ill assume I hit on what you were getting at?

Serge Ibaka
7/13/2010, 02:47 PM
I agree with everything you said, and it seems entirely practical/pragmatic to have a guy like McGwire in the clubhouse.

I just think it's interesting how McGwire escaped all of this by still being a nice-guy regardless of his transgressions.

stoops the eternal pimp
7/13/2010, 02:57 PM
I dont think it had really anything to do with his apology...I think its the fact that out of most or all of the roids guys, he was probably the most popular amongst media and fans...always seemed like a good guy...

Serge Ibaka
7/13/2010, 03:03 PM
...always seemed like a good guy...

*melt* http://media.cleveland.com/livingston_impact/photo/mcgwiresonerjpg-bccf1f9a894f1722_large.jpg

stoops the eternal pimp
7/13/2010, 03:08 PM
exactly...i remember SI had some kind of father/son type issue and he was on the cover...on the other hand, bonds has always appeared as a d-bag to the media, even pre- juice...clemens...d-bag.....

Collier11
7/13/2010, 03:36 PM
True STEP, it was because he was always a good guy but he didnt always get along with the media, remember during the HR chase, Sosa kind of brought him out of his shell.

stoops the eternal pimp
7/13/2010, 03:49 PM
well, it was a different "not get a long" than those other guys....the images of mcgwire with his son and with the maris family went a long way in establishing his popularity

Collier11
7/13/2010, 03:52 PM
true and I think everyone really believes that he was sincere

Scott D
7/13/2010, 03:56 PM
he's a d-bag :)

Collier11
7/13/2010, 03:58 PM
Your pitchers inability to field still haunting you? :eek: :D

Scott D
7/13/2010, 04:02 PM
I have no idea what you mean? Mark Buehrle is one of the finest fielding pitchers in all of baseball.

Collier11
7/13/2010, 04:05 PM
ah sh*t, I forgot you was a white sox fan...I was thinking Detroit, well its not as funny anymore ;)

Scott D
7/13/2010, 04:07 PM
and **** LaRussa :)

dogging the Tigers only gets under Paperclip's skin ;)

Collier11
7/13/2010, 04:10 PM
now I know :D

Serge Ibaka
7/13/2010, 04:27 PM
I'm a Royals fan.

sigh.

stoops the eternal pimp
7/13/2010, 04:31 PM
dear...gawd

have mercy on your soul

GottaHavePride
7/13/2010, 04:33 PM
hell, go back before his St. Louis days to the "Bash Brothers" - he and Jose Canseco out in Oakland. After the steroid thing everyone still (more or less) likes McGwire, and Canseco dropped off the face of the planet.

Collier11
7/13/2010, 04:37 PM
Isnt is funny that the sleaze ball Canseco has been proven pretty accurate with his claims yet everyone hates him, lol

Eielson
7/13/2010, 05:21 PM
Isnt is funny that the sleaze ball Canseco has been proven pretty accurate with his claims yet everyone hates him, lol

I don't hate him. I hate the system that makes them play 162 games in a season plus the playoffs as if that is humane. The body isn't made for that, and it pushes the players towards steroids. A lot of people who never played baseball at that level act as if they'd never use steroids if they were in that position. That's a load of crap. Steroids is part of baseball, and it's time to accept that.

Collier11
7/13/2010, 05:22 PM
No longer, it was a part of baseball for a long time and all the owners knew about it. IT is pretty much gone now, probably only cus they know they cant detect HGH yet :D

badger
7/13/2010, 05:36 PM
I think the difference - and everyone's already said it - was that Marky Mark was seen as a nice guy, whereas Bonds seemed arrogant and Sosa seemed defensive. Being a closet Brewer fan, I know a little more about the Sosa situation. One at-bat his supposed wooden bat falls apart to reveal cork inside. If steroids are well-hidden, corking bats is usually invisible... usually. Sosa got suspended for what he tried to explain as a practice bat getting mixed in with game bats. Even without 'roids in the discussion, Sosa was rightly labeled a cheater.

And then there was the boom box. Ah, the boom box. Sosa during his heyday as fan favorite and sausage king of Chicago (take that, Ferris Bueller) would notoriously blast salsa music from his boom box. Even when teammates had migranes. One time he left the locker room temporarily with the box blaring and an older player turned it down. Sosa returns, demanding to know who turned down his box. The vet said "it doesn't need to be on when you're not here." Situation settled.

Or... is it? Sosa is on his way out of Chicago and is no longer as beloved as he once was. He says he didn't leave during a game, but cameras catch him heading out in about the third. The boom box gets smashed to pieces. The entire team takes credit for destroying it. The Sosa era in Chicago is symbolically over.

Eielson
7/13/2010, 05:37 PM
No longer, it was a part of baseball for a long time and all the owners new about it. IT is pretty much gone now, probably only cus they know they cant detect HGH yet :D

It's not gone at all. People are still getting caught, and those are just the sloppy ones.

Collier11
7/13/2010, 05:39 PM
Im just saying that it isnt the problem it once was where all the stars are using it along with the no names

soonerinabilene
7/14/2010, 08:00 AM
i dont understand the hitting coach job. its not like he was great hitter. he could smash it over the fence, thats about it. he had a low batting average and struck out a lot. i just dont get it.

stoops the eternal pimp
7/14/2010, 08:10 AM
As far as my own opinions, I took a lot of the stuff McGwire had back then and don't see the big deal about it...

texaspokieokie
7/14/2010, 10:05 AM
notice they mostly only catch the minor leaguers,they don't want to hurt the big league stars.

of course, they got manny last year.

Collier11
7/14/2010, 11:27 AM
i dont understand the hitting coach job. its not like he was great hitter. he could smash it over the fence, thats about it. he had a low batting average and struck out a lot. i just dont get it.

Just cus he wasnt a great hitter for avg., he is still a really good teacher of hitting. There were many stories before he was hired of how current MLBers would go work out with him in the off-season and he would show them different thing.

Collier11
7/14/2010, 11:28 AM
notice they mostly only catch the minor leaguers,they don't want to hurt the big league stars.

of course, they got manny last year.

Thats cus the Major Leaguers are taking HGH, duh ;)

the_ouskull
7/14/2010, 11:53 AM
Isnt is funny that the sleaze ball Canseco has been proven pretty accurate with his claims yet everyone hates him, lol

I don't hate him, man. I think the guy's a freakin' genius. He's had a grand total of one marketable skill for his entire life, and has managed to flip it into a career. Great success!

yjrz=pidli;;

Collier11
7/14/2010, 12:00 PM
I dont either but many do

Scott D
7/14/2010, 02:23 PM
I respect that Canseco came out about that stuff....the other silly "stay on the fringe of celebrity" stuff, not so much. I mean dude, you lost a MMA fight to a 60 y/o man...wtf Jose?