Today, I'm employing Mexicans...

[Okla-homey]

Doing landscaping and such around mi casa. They are doing a superb job. The jefe speaks English. The rest don't.

Is that so wrong?

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Make them call you El Guapo.

[Okla-homey]

Make them call you El Guapo.

I will! spek!

[Okla-homey]

I'm going to hire them to build me a flagstone area out back and a dry-stack stone fireplace. You couldn't hire 'Mericans to do that even if you wanted to do so.

[Leroy Lizard]

Doing landscaping and such around mi casa. They are doing a superb job. The jefe speaks English. The rest don't.

Is that so wrong?

If they are here illegally, yes. If they are here legally, no.

[Okla-homey]

If they are here illegally, yes. If they are here legally, no.

I doubt they are here legally. Think about it d00d. How TF does a Mexican get a work visa to do landscaping? Utterly impossible. And IDGAS because I'm getting my work done for a reasonable price, exactly as I specify, for cash and few cervezas.

If 'Mericans would present and not bid three-times as much for the same work, I'd hire 'em. But they haven't.

[KC//CRIMSON]

Who said Homey supported HB1804? Who dat?

[Tulsa_Fireman]

VIVA LA IMMIGRACION!

[Leroy Lizard]

I doubt they are here legally. Think about it d00d. How TF does a Mexican get a work visa to do landscaping? Utterly impossible. And IDGAS because I'm getting my work done for a reasonable price, exactly as I specify, for cash and few cervezas.

If 'Mericans would present and not bid three-times as much for the same work, I'd hire 'em. But they haven't.

They call this "r-a-t-i-o-n-a-l-i-z-a-t-i-o-n."

Aren't you a lawyer?


Who said Homey supported HB1804? Who dat?

Relevance?

[KC//CRIMSON]

Relevance?


My grandmother's holiday fruitcake isn't this dense, people.

[StoopTroup]

Your Grandmother wasn't a fruitcake either.

[KC//CRIMSON]

True.

[MR2-Sooner86]

Have them do all your work then call immigration services on them. You won't have to pay them then ;)

[JLEW1818]

tacos

[stoopified]

Another anonymous call goes out to INS. :)

[Crucifax Autumn]

Homey has no need to worry. They never do anything to the people EMPLOYING the illegals.

[Leroy Lizard]

My grandmother's holiday fruitcake isn't this dense, people.

Yeah, yeah, state the relevance.

[KC//CRIMSON]

Yeah, yeah, state the relevance.


He's educating the youth of America, people.

[Leroy Lizard]

Yeah, yeah, state the relevance.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Have them do all your work then call immigration services on them. You won't have to pay them then ;)This is the correct answer. Thread closed!

[StoopTroup]

There is a reason Homey isn't building a Winter Home in Arizona.

[SicEmBaylor]

Doing landscaping and such around mi casa. They are doing a superb job. The jefe speaks English. The rest don't.

Is that so wrong?

Yes, it is. I think at the very least you should be fined.

[StoopTroup]

Yes, it is. I think at the very least you should be fined.

10 Zimas?

[Leroy Lizard]

Yes, it is. I think at the very least you should be fined.

And caned, like in Singapore.

[SicEmBaylor]

And caned, like in Singapore.

Not caned...disbarred perhaps.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Gov't should not inhibit your ability to hire the most qualified.

[SicEmBaylor]

Gov't should not inhibit your ability to hire the most qualified.

When the most qualified is here illegally, they most certainly should. It's the only feasible way to go after illegals. Severely crack down on the employers who hire them.

Anyone who hires an illegal should be fined to such an extent that they're left penniless and destitute. They should even possibly face jail time.

Hell, if it were up to me then I might even make it a capital crime.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Not caned...disbarred perhaps.

Well what does the law say? Is a homeowner required to ask for proof of legal presence of all workers?

[Leroy Lizard]

When the most qualified is here illegally, they most certainly should. It's the only feasible way to go after illegals. Severely crack down on the employers who hire them.

Anyone who hires an illegal should be fined to such an extent that they're left penniless and destitute. They should even possibly face jail time.

Hell, if it were up to me then I might even make it a capital crime.

Then we can cane them.

[olevetonahill]

Gov't should not inhibit your ability to hire the most qualified.

jaun , Homey dint say he hired the MOST QUALIFIED he said he hired the cheapest :pop:

[Leroy Lizard]

Well what does the law say? Is a homeowner required to ask for proof of legal presence of all workers?

No, but if he doesn't want to break the law...

[SanJoaquinSooner]

No, but if he doesn't want to break the law...

If the answer is no, then he's not breaking the law.

[Leroy Lizard]

If the answer is no, then he's not breaking the law.

Actually, it looks like the answer is yes:


Anyone employing or contracting with an illegal alien without verifying his work authorization status is guilty of a misdemeanor.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersbcd d

Now I will be roundly criticized for pretending to be a lawyer. :D

[Okla-homey]

Why do you hate Mexicans?:(

[delhalew]

Yeah...it's wrong, but I'll bet you already knew that. People around here are hurting. I could easily find some qualified to do landscaping work for me at a very competitive price.
I used to pay $25 to have my lawn mowed by an American. Now I pay $10.

[1890MilesToNorman]

So if I go break any law I want but do a good job of it I shouldn't be prosecuted? I think I understand now.

Messicans and bankers live the good life. :D

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Actually, it looks like the answer is yes:



http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_immigrationissuecentersbcd d

Now I will be roundly criticized for pretending to be a lawyer. :D

Now Leroy, a higher ed dude should know better than to cite secondary sources. FAIR conveniently let out a bit of info

The actual regulations state:

(f) The term employee means an individual who provides services or labor for an employer for wages or other remuneration but does not mean independent contractors as defined in paragraph (j) of this section or those engaged in casual domestic employment as stated in paragraph (h) of this section;

274a.1(j)

(j) The term independent contractor includes individuals or entities who carry on independent business, contract to do a piece of work according to their own means and methods, and are subject to control only as to results.


Compare this to what FAIR states:

Employment includes any service or labor performed for any type of remuneration within the United States, with the exception of sporadic domestic service by an individual in a private home.5

[Harry Beanbag]

I think you're just a cheap bastard.

On a side note, the endless quest to make everything cheaper is what led to our manufacturing base going overseas and our country being invaded by uneducated leaches. By all means, let's continue to our own destruction.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Why do you hate Mexicans?:(A loyer, pulling the race card...say it ain't so!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

So if I go break any law I want but do a good job of it I shouldn't be prosecuted? I think I understand now.

Messicans and democrat politicians live the good life. :Dfixed

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I think you're just a cheap bastard.

On a side note, the endless demands of unions, making it impossible to compete, is what led to our manufacturing base going overseas. Also, our country being invaded by uneducated leaches and sponges. By all means, let's continue to our own destruction.fixed

[SicEmBaylor]

When I moved to Vicksburg, I had absolutely no trouble finding people people to help unload, move stuff, do lawn work, and minor handyman type repairs. They were willing, eager, and they did a great job. I paid about ten bucks an hour and they were thrilled to be working. The best part is they are actual Americans doing the jobs that folks like Homey claim Americans won't do. Bull****. If this were in Texas or even Oklahoma the illegals would saturate the market and make it harder for the kind of guys I hired to find work.

Homey's contribution to keeping jobs away from Americans disgusts me.

[yermom]

I think you're just a cheap bastard.

On a side note, the endless quest to make everything cheaper is what led to our manufacturing base going overseas and our country being invaded by uneducated leaches. By all means, let's continue to our own destruction.

next he's going to outsource his Good Morning posts to Mumbai :(

[Harry Beanbag]

next he's going to outsource his Good Morning posts to Mumbai :(


Maybe they would lose there white man, American military, government is awesome slant then. :)

[SanJoaquinSooner]

When I moved to Vicksburg, I had absolutely no trouble finding people people to help unload, move stuff, do lawn work, and minor handyman type repairs. They were willing, eager, and they did a great job. I paid about ten bucks an hour and they were thrilled to be working. The best part is they are actual Americans doing the jobs that folks like Homey claim Americans won't do. Bull****. If this were in Texas or even Oklahoma the illegals would saturate the market and make it harder for the kind of guys I hired to find work.

Homey's contribution to keeping jobs away from Americans disgusts me.

God Bless America. I support your right to choose who you hire.

Be honest, Sic em, did you verify legal presence for all those workers you hired?

[Leroy Lizard]

Now Leroy, a higher ed dude should know better than cite to any organization whose acronym spells something cute.

FIFY :D

[Leroy Lizard]

When I moved to Vicksburg, I had absolutely no trouble finding people people to help unload, move stuff, do lawn work, and minor handyman type repairs. They were willing, eager, and they did a great job. I paid about ten bucks an hour and they were thrilled to be working. The best part is they are actual Americans doing the jobs that folks like Homey claim Americans won't do. Bull****. If this were in Texas or even Oklahoma the illegals would saturate the market and make it harder for the kind of guys I hired to find work.

Homey's contribution to keeping jobs away from Americans disgusts me.

It's amazing that illegal aliens are filling the role of scabs, yet liberal big-time union supporters see no problem with their presence here.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

FIFY :D


yeah, calling it FAIR is like naming your country Greenland when 80% of it is covered with ice.

[Sooner Born Sooner Bred]

I'm going to hire them to build me a flagstone area out back and a dry-stack stone fireplace. You couldn't hire 'Mericans to do that even if you wanted to do so.
Exactly. Illegals do work that our lazy American asses refuse to do. There are quite a few roofing crews around here right now. I'm seeing lots of dark skinned peeps on rooftops and it isn't because the sun is shining so brightly. They are working their asses off doing a job some American only crew would want three or four times as much to do.

[Okla-homey]

The actual regulations state:

(f) The term employee means an individual who provides services or labor for an employer for wages or other remuneration but does not mean independent contractors as defined in paragraph (j) of this section or those engaged in casual domestic employment as stated in paragraph (h) of this section;

274a.1(j)

(j) The term independent contractor includes individuals or entities who carry on independent business, contract to do a piece of work according to their own means and methods, and are subject to control only as to results.




Eggszackry. And state legislation (are you listening Oklahoma HB1804-lovers?) cannot be more restrictive of my constitutional liberty to hire whomever I want to work in my yard, in accordance with the above-cited Federal regulation. Period.

The United States Constitution gives the Federal government exclusive authority and responsibility for immigration law and policy. States have no business meddling in it whatsoever. If the folks want change, they have precisely one route open to them; pack the Congress with enough anti-immigration politicians to change the current laws and elect a person POTUS who will same into law.

Unlikely, particularly given companies who employ illegals are not now being penalized for doing so and their directors and officers aren't being charged with such crimes that are already on the books. Heck, the poultry and beef packing industry would effectively cease to exist. Not to mention all the produce that would rot in the fields.

[soonerscuba]

I think you're just a cheap bastard.

On a side note, the endless quest to make everything cheaper is what led to our manufacturing base going overseas and our country being invaded by uneducated leaches. By all means, let's continue to our own destruction.My thoughts exactly, the demand side only finds fault with the supply side. That said the demand side is usually tied up with A) homeowners and B) the worshiped small business owner that is politically untouchable from an electoral standpoint. Being tough on immigration is going to extend beyond immigrants and few to none of our leaders have the guts to do it.

[Leroy Lizard]

Eggszackry. And state legislation (are you listening Oklahoma HB1804-lovers?) cannot be more restrictive of my constitutional liberty to hire whomever I want to work in my yard, in accordance with the above-cited Federal regulation. Period.


Is the hiring of anyone you wish a constitutional liberty? (I ask seriously.)

[Okla-homey]

I think you're just a cheap bastard.

On a side note, the endless quest to make everything cheaper is what led to our manufacturing base going overseas and our country being invaded by uneducated leaches. By all means, let's continue to our own destruction.

Honest question. Would you deliberately and willingly pay more for a given service or thing if the identical service or thing was conveniently offered by another for less money?

This country and its economy was built on the notion that competitive market forces insured the person or entity who offered the most for the least money would make money and the guy who couldn't compete would have to look for another line of work. In that way, consumers are generally assured of getting a good value. You start mucking with that model and the unintended consequences means we all lose.

[Okla-homey]

Is the hiring of anyone you wish a constitutional liberty? (I ask seriously.)

If I don't discriminate based on race, religion, country of origin and to a lesser extent, gender, yes.

I can also fire anyone I want, for any reason, except race, religion, country of origin and to a lesser extent, gender.

[Frozen Sooner]

If I don't discriminate based on race, religion, country of origin and to a lesser extent, gender, yes.

I can also fire anyone I want, for any reason, except race, religion, country of origin and to a lesser extent, gender.

Caveat:

Freedom to Contract is not a fundamental right, so the federal government only has to have a rational basis for interference in this right. It does not have to pass strict scrutiny.

[soonerboomer93]

I think you're just a cheap bastard.

On a side note, the endless quest to make everything cheaper is what led to our manufacturing base going overseas and our country being invaded by uneducated leaches. By all means, let's continue to our own destruction.

by all means lets not fail to mention that frankly, most 'Mericans would rather sit at a home on a couch then take many of the jobs the illegals are doing. It's not about the money they make, it's about the kind of work they'd be doing.

[Leroy Lizard]

yeah, calling it FAIR is like naming your country Greenland when 80% of it is covered with ice.


Perhaps they were clairvoyant.

[Okla-homey]

Caveat:

Freedom to Contract is not a fundamental right, so the federal government only has to have a rational basis for interference in this right. It does not have to pass strict scrutiny.

True. But I doubt Congress is going to pass a law limiting who I can hire to plant bushes in my Oklahoma yard. I could be wrong though. I blew the call on who would get elected president last time. Maybe Congress would. Yikes, I better tell them Mexican fellers to hurry-up and get all my bushes planted!11!1.:eek:

[Frozen Sooner]

Yeah, sorry-the board hung on my edit, which was to say:

I know Homey knows this, and his posts don't contradict it, I just wanted to make it clear that both the Federal and State governments can legislate in this area so long as they can come up with a reason in court how the restriction is limited to some legitimate purpose. Police power is usually good as a one-size-fits-all proposition, at least for the states.

[Harry Beanbag]

Honest question. Would you deliberately and willingly pay more for a given service or thing if the identical service or thing was conveniently offered by another for less money?

Depends on a lot of factors. True story: I needed some teflon pipe thread tape so I went to the hardware store. They had two basically identical choices. One was on a blue plastic reel made in China, the other was on a red reel made in Thailand. I bought the red one for a few pennies more.

There are plenty of reasons to buy or not to buy things and they are based on personal preferences, principles, and values. My principles mean more to me than my wallet. Maybe your's don't.



This country and its economy was built on the notion that competitive market forces insured the person or entity who offered the most for the least money would make money and the guy who couldn't compete would have to look for another line of work. In that way, consumers are generally assured of getting a good value. You start mucking with that model and the unintended consequences means we all lose.

This country was also built on the law. If the law was being enforced then the illegal black market labor wouldn't be here to corrupt the marketplace would it? The rest would take care of itself. Congrats on contributing to the downfall of the country you served and claim to love.

[Okla-homey]

Yeah, sorry-the board hung on my edit, which was to say:

I know Homey knows this, and his posts don't contradict it, I just wanted to make it clear that both the Federal and State governments can legislate in this area so long as they can come up with a reason in court how the restriction is limited to some legitimate purpose. Police power is usually good as a one-size-fits-all proposition, at least for the states.

But states cannot invade exclusive Federal perogatives, e.g. immigration law and policy, bankruptcy, trade and intercourse with Indian tribes, coining or minting of money, the post office, international treaties, war, etc.

[Frozen Sooner]

Also true. Field pre-emption and stuff. Goes back to Gibbons v. Ogden and stuff.

States may author laws that discriminate on the basis of national origin, though, so long as they pass strict scrutiny. I think a law (such as SB1070) that requires verification of immigration status before employment might full under that rubric. Can't remember the case name, and it's buried somewhere in my ridiculous Con Law outline. 140 pages. Gah.

[Frozen Sooner]

Also true. Field pre-emption and stuff. Goes back to Gibbons v. Ogden and stuff.

States may author laws that discriminate on the basis of national origin, though, so long as they pass strict scrutiny. I think a law (such as SB1070) that requires verification of immigration status before employment might full under that rubric. Can't remember the case name, and it's buried somewhere in my ridiculous Con Law outline. 140 pages. Gah.

[PDXsooner]

Does it bother anyone that the money you pay these workers goes completely untaxed? These workers are here driving on our roads, most likely dumping illegally, relying on our police and fire to protect/help them if they need it, and paying no money towards basic services.

That bothers me. Does anyone ever ask them their rate, and then reduce it by 25% to make up for the fact that it's tax-free?

[Harry Beanbag]

Does it bother anyone that the money you pay these workers goes completely untaxed? These workers are here driving on our roads, most likely dumping illegally, relying on our police and fire to protect/help them if they need it, and paying no money towards basic services.

That bothers me. Does anyone ever ask them their rate, and then reduce it by 25% to make up for the fact that it's tax-free?


People are too selfish to engage in any sort of critical thinking like that.

[yermom]

how is it any different that the kid down the street babysitting or mowing lawns for extra cash? how about their mom cleaning houses?

do you grill them on immigration status or if they are paying taxes?

[PDXsooner]

how is it any different that the kid down the street babysitting or mowing lawns for extra cash?

do you grill them on immigration status or if they are paying taxes?

No, maybe I rationalize it by knowing that these people are here legally, their parents pay taxes, and I know they will be paying taxes soon. I'm not saying it's right, that's probably how I explain it to myself. The being here legal thing is pretty big to me...

[olevetonahill]

how is it any different that the kid down the street babysitting or mowing lawns for extra cash? how about their mom cleaning houses?

do you grill them on immigration status or if they are paying taxes?

Come on Bro Ya know the answer to that.
The Kid down the street is gonna either use the Money to buy shat like a Play station thingy or save it and use it fer skool .
Juans cousins are gonna send the Money to Meheco :D

[yermom]

but you should pay more to a business so someone has a job, and taxes are paid...


i have a lot less problem with some guy doing construction in the US and spending money to live in his community and sending extra money home than big companies doing business here but exploiting cheap labor in some third world country while putting Americans out of work. especially when they put out inferior products as a result

[SicEmBaylor]

God Bless America. I support your right to choose who you hire.

Be honest, Sic em, did you verify legal presence for all those workers you hired?

Yeah, I think the chances of a bunch of black guys with thick southern accents being here illegally is pretty low compared to a bunch of Hispanics who speak little or no english. See, I use common sense.

[olevetonahill]

but you should pay more to a business so someone has a job, and taxes are paid...


i have a lot less problem with some guy doing construction in the US and spending money to live in his community and sending extra money home than big companies doing business here but exploiting cheap labor in some third world country while putting Americans out of work. especially when they put out inferior products as a result

I kinda agree to an extent Bro. Its not really the Honest hard working types I have a Prob with. I wish they could and Would get legal. My Prob is with all the ****ing lowlife scum that are here illegally, driving with no insurance, beating up their white gfs, creating a new generation of welfare bums,Etc.

When NAFTA Passed with in 1 year 2 major employers here in Leflore county up and moved their operations to Meheco.Puttin a bunch of decent wage earners out of work.

[olevetonahill]

Yeah, I think the chances of a bunch of black guys with thick southern accents being here illegally is pretty low compared to a bunch of Hispanics who speak little or no english. See, I use common sense.

Ya but how much of yer shat did those black guys STEAL.:D :P

[Harry Beanbag]

Yeah, I think the chances of a bunch of black guys with thick southern accents being here illegally is pretty low compared to a bunch of Hispanics who speak little or no english. See, I use common sense.


The pansy leftists call that racial profiling, not common sense.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Does it bother anyone that the money you pay these workers goes completely untaxed? These workers are here driving on our roads, most likely dumping illegally, relying on our police and fire to protect/help them if they need it, and paying no money towards basic services.

That bothers me. Does anyone ever ask them their rate, and then reduce it by 25% to make up for the fact that it's tax-free?

Please allow me to add that to my question to Sic em. Besides asking if Sic em checked for proof of legal presence, does he know if they are paying taxes on that $10/hour he paid them? How does he know they didn't illegally dump stuff?

[olevetonahill]

Please allow me to add that to my question to Sic em. Besides asking if Sic em checked for proof of legal presence, does he know if they are paying taxes on that $10/hour he paid them? How does he know they didn't illegally dump stuff?

What does he care? He dint have em hauling shat off he had em doing yard werk and Moving his stuff in the shack ;)

[Leroy Lizard]

Please allow me to add that to my question to Sic em. Besides asking if Sic em checked for proof of legal presence, does he know if they are paying taxes on that $10/hour he paid them? How does he know they didn't illegally dump stuff?


When is an employer required to fill out a 1099?

[olevetonahill]

When they pay some one more than 600$ i believe or if they wanta deduct the expense on taxes.
I aint sure about either tho

[Okla-homey]

Does it bother anyone that the money you pay these workers goes completely untaxed? These workers are here driving on our roads, most likely dumping illegally, relying on our police and fire to protect/help them if they need it, and paying no money towards basic services.




Only because we have our collective heads in the sand like some kind of frightened ostrich.

It's patently irrational and past the point of absurdity that we: 1) have millions of these people here (>15 million); 2) we lack the national will to make them go home and prevent their return, yet; 3) we will not abide measures to fully integrate them into the tax base.

Does it bother you that if we integrated them into our tax base, they wouldn't work so cheaply and the bug-a-boo asserted by the nativist crowd that THEY DON'T PAY TAXES AND THEY'RE MOOCHING ALL OUR JOBS AND GUBMINT SERVICES would melt like a Sno-Cone at the Alamo in August.

[Leroy Lizard]

Only because we have our collective heads in the sand like some kind of frightened ostrich.

It's patently irrational and past the point of absurdity that we: 1) have millions of these people here (>15 million); 2) we lack the national will to make them go home and prevent their return, yet; 3) we will not abide measures to fully integrate them into the tax base.

Does it bother you that if we integrated them into our tax base, they wouldn't work so cheaply and the bug-a-boo asserted by the nativist crowd that THEY DON'T PAY TAXES AND THEY'RE MOOCHING ALL OUR JOBS AND GUBMINT SERVICES would melt like a Sno-Cone at the Alamo in August.

Would they make enough money to pay taxes?

Sure, we can make them file a return. But if they send in 0$, then they are not taxPAYERS in my view.

[Okla-homey]

Would they make enough money to pay taxes?

Sure, we can make them file a return. But if they send in 0$, then they are not taxPAYERS in my view.

Even if they got all income tax withholding back, if they were here legally working and their employers issued W-2's, they would most definitely pay FICA, thus helping keep Social Security afloat.

And in a very real sense, they do pay some taxes already; sales tax, car tags and indirectly, the property taxes paid by their landlords.

Why no hue and cry to make renting a motel room, apartment or a house to an illegal alien a crime? Do landlords and motel desk clerks have to check citizenship status? The nativists are slipping! Think about it. If they had nowhere to lay their heads at night, they couldn't stay here.

[Harry Beanbag]

Only because we have our collective heads in the sand like some kind of frightened ostrich.

It's patently irrational and past the point of absurdity that we: 1) have millions of these people here (>15 million); 2) we lack the national will to make them go home and prevent their return, yet; 3) we will not abide measures to fully integrate them into the tax base.

Haven't seen the national polls regarding Arizona's law, huh? The people have the will, the ****tard politicians have ulterior motives.



Does it bother you that if we integrated them into our tax base, they wouldn't work so cheaply and the bug-a-boo asserted by the nativist crowd that THEY DON'T PAY TAXES AND THEY'RE MOOCHING ALL OUR JOBS AND GUBMINT SERVICES would melt like a Sno-Cone at the Alamo in August.

Then there's really no point in keeping them here, right?

[Okla-homey]

Haven't seen the national polls regarding Arizona's law, huh? The people have the will, the ****tard politicians have ulterior motives.

Harry, you're a smart guy. It's one thing for people to claim they're for sending them all home, and another thing entirely to have the national resolve to round-up 15 million people at the point of a gun, process them, put them in internment camps while they await eventual transport to wherever in Latin America they came from, then, use deadly force to keep them from returning.

Until we have the resolve to do those things, this "send them back" stuff is just p1ssin' in the wind.

Border fences, walls, etc. are ineffective. They slow folks down, but they don't stop them. The only thing that will stop folks from sneaking in is to litter the border areas with corpses of men, women and children observed trying to cross illegally. IOW, make it clear that if we get you in our sights as you attempt to sneak-in, you are dead. And we aren't about to do that. Thank God.

[yermom]

if people had the will, no one would hire them to do Homey-work

just like they don't have the will to not buy cheap plastic crap from Walmart

they might get stirred up when they listen to the radio, when when it comes to reality, it's a different story. they want someone else to fix the problem

[olevetonahill]

if people had the will, no one would hire them to do Homey-work

just like they don't have the will to not buy cheap plastic crap from Walmart

they might get stirred up when they listen to the radio, when when it comes to reality, it's a different story. they want someone else to fix the problem

Well Call me WILL.(but not SoonerWill):D
I refuse to set foot in a wallyworld.
I just hired a Local WHITE GUY who was born here to roof my shop:cool:

[SoonerInKCMO]

Well Call me WILL.(but not SoonerWill):D
I refuse to set foot in a wallyworld.
I just hired a Local WHITE GUY who was born here to roof my shop:cool:

Haven't been to one since 2001... place gives me the heebie-jeebies.

[Okla-homey]

I just hired a Local WHITE GUY who was born here to roof my shop:cool:

THAT'S RACIST! :D

Srsly, you paying cash or by check?

[olevetonahill]

THAT'S RACIST! :D

Srsly, you paying cash or by check?

Check
1/2 up front the other 1/2 when hes done
Ive known this kid since he was just a tad. His Dad and Uncle have done roofin here for years

[olevetonahill]

Haven't been to one since 2001... place gives me the heebie-jeebies.

Some where in the late 90s fer me, Hell i wont even go to that 'people of walmart' site:D
also aint been to a MacVomit since the early 90s
Most every thing wally has I can buy just as cheap at Atwoods or the Grocery store called 'price cutters' Plus get a better quality:cool:

[Harry Beanbag]

Harry, you're a smart guy. It's one thing for people to claim they're for sending them all home, and another thing entirely to have the national resolve to round-up 15 million people at the point of a gun, process them, put them in internment camps while they await eventual transport to wherever in Latin America they came from, then, use deadly force to keep them from returning.

Until we have the resolve to do those things, this "send them back" stuff is just p1ssin' in the wind.

Border fences, walls, etc. are ineffective. They slow folks down, but they don't stop them. The only thing that will stop folks from sneaking in is to litter the border areas with corpses of men, women and children observed trying to cross illegally. IOW, make it clear that if we get you in our sights as you attempt to sneak-in, you are dead. And we aren't about to do that. Thank God.


You're a smart guy too. Point of a gun talk is just hyperbolic nonsense. Enforce the laws the way they were written and most of them will end up leaving on their own BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE ANY MONEY. The criminal element could prove more difficult, especially the drug trafficking, but if Mexico wants a real border war, I say we give it to them.

[Okla-homey]

You're a smart guy too. Point of a gun talk is just hyperbolic nonsense. Enforce the laws the way they were written and most of them will end up leaving on their own BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE ANY MONEY. The criminal element could prove more difficult, especially the drug trafficking, but if Mexico wants a real border war, I say we give it to them.

Okay. Got it. Charge everyone with a crime who pays illegals to do anything. Can we at least start with Tyson Chicken over in Arkie?;)

[yermom]

i kinda like the lodging idea...

[Harry Beanbag]

Okay. Got it. Charge everyone with a crime who pays illegals to do anything. Can we at least start with Tyson Chicken over in Arkie?;)


I think we'll be starting in Arizona. ;)

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

You're a smart guy too. Point of a gun talk is just hyperbolic nonsense. Enforce the laws the way they were written and most of them will end up leaving on their own BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE ANY MONEY. The criminal element could prove more difficult, especially the drug trafficking, but if Mexico wants a real border war, I say we give it to them.Can a private sector, non-loyer make more sense than an esquire type? Why yes, he can. Duh, huh?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I think we'll be starting in Arizona. ;)I'm one Okie-Zonie who will be dam* glad when another state votes in an enforcement of illegal immigration laws law, and gets the dems and RINOS to STFU...and the enforcement of citizenship laws will begin in earnest.

[Okla-homey]

Can a private sector, non-loyer make more sense than an esquire type? Why yes, he can. Duh, huh?

Remember, it's esquire-types who preside over the courts in this country, and believe me, court is where that new Arizona law is going to die. Rather the way HB1804 was eviscerated here in Oklahoma.

Moreover, there is entirely too much money at stake in keeping these folks here working cheap leading to lax or non-existent enforcement of the plethora of Federal immigration laws already on the books. And I'm not talking the grand or two guys like me are paying.

Like I said, Tyson can't pluck chickens without illegal pluckers. And check out all those feedlots and beef packing houses in western Kansas. Just tiny examples mind you.

That's to say nothing of creating up to 15 million new Donk voters with a few strokes of a pen in Congress and the White House.

Finally, as to an illegal alien exodus arising from US employers getting in trouble for hiring illegals -- even if that ever happened, ask yourself this question. If you were a dirt poor father with no options, would you rather be unemployed and broke in the US, or Guatemala, Mexico, etc.

At least here, your kids have a school to go to where they get at least two meals a day. SCOTUS ruled long-ago you can't hose kids because they and/or their parents are illegal.

[GKeeper316]

I doubt they are here legally. Think about it d00d. How TF does a Mexican get a work visa to do landscaping? Utterly impossible. And IDGAS because I'm getting my work done for a reasonable price, exactly as I specify, for cash and few cervezas.

If 'Mericans would present and not bid three-times as much for the same work, I'd hire 'em. But they haven't.

whatever gets you through the night...

doesnt change the fact that you're helping to perpetuate the rush of illegals from mexico.

[Leroy Lizard]

Remember, it's esquire-types who preside over the courts in this country, and believe me, court is where that new Arizona law is going to die. Rather the way HB1804 was eviscerated here in Oklahoma.

Moreover, there is entirely too much money at stake in keeping these folks here working cheap leading to lax or non-existent enforcement of the plethora of Federal immigration laws already on the books. And I'm not talking the grand or two guys like me are paying.

Like I said, Tyson can't pluck chickens without illegal pluckers. And check out all those feedlots and beef packing houses in western Kansas. Just tiny examples mind you.

Serious question here: How do those businesses get away with it?

And why hasn't the government stepped in? If they haven't, doesn't that give credence to Arizona's complaint about federal non-action?

[tommieharris91]

You know, I would think a lawyer understands that every illegal getting paid under the table is committing tax evasion...

[Harry Beanbag]

You know, I would think a lawyer understands that every illegal getting paid under the table is committing tax evasion...


Yes, but that lawyer thinks it would be too much of a hassle to do anything silly like enforce federal law so let's just let the states go down the ****ter even more. Hey, at least he got his ornamental stone laid out around his flower beds for cheap without having to bother doing any manual labor himself.

[Okla-homey]

You know, I would think a lawyer understands that every illegal getting paid under the table is committing tax evasion...

Who said anything about "illegal under the table" payments. Wrote a check to the jefe. He's legal. Or maybe he ain't, but he didn't mind getting a check.

And like was established about thirty posts ago, PRIVATE CITIZENS ARE NOT REQUIRED TO VERIFY CITIZENSHIP STATUS BEFORE HIRING INDEPENDENT CONTRACTORS OR DOMESTICS.

And just how, pray tell, does the Average Joe hiring a guy to do work around his house go about confirming said contractor's citizenship status? Oh, I know, ask him for his national ID card! Duh! Arghhh! The Tinfoil Hat crowd is opposed to national ID cards because they have a chip that can allow the guys in the black helicopters to track them and control their minds. Dang-it!

[Okla-homey]

Serious question here: How do those businesses get away with it?

And why hasn't the government stepped in? If they haven't, doesn't that give credence to Arizona's complaint about federal non-action?

DamifIknow. But I know this, it ain't just Big Chicken, Big Beef and Big Ag doing it. Check out the kitchen of just about any restaurant in this town. And not just the Mexican restaurants. Check out who does the commercial janitorial and motel houskeeping. Ditto. Not to mention painters, dry-wallers, roofers, landscapers, frame carpenters, asphalt/paving outfits, lawn cutters, stone masons. I could go on, but why bother. You guys want all these people GONE! As in POOF!

[Leroy Lizard]

DamifIknow. But I know this, it ain't just Big Chicken, Big Beef and Big Ag doing it. Check out the kitchen of just about any restaurant in this town. And not just the Mexican restaurants. Check out who does the commercial janitorial and motel houskeeping. Ditto. Not to mention painters, dry-wallers, roofers, landscapers, frame carpenters, asphalt/paving outfits, lawn cutters, stone masons. I could go on, but why bother. You guys want all these people GONE! As in POOF!

How do people who live in northern states survive?

[Okla-homey]

How do people who live in northern states survive?

They aren't. They don't call it the Rust Belt for nuttin'

And who do you think has been rebuilding NOLA? FEMA actually stands for "Find Every Mexican Available." <props to George Lopez -- that FEMA line is his>

You can bet most of the heavy de-oiling down there will be performed by guys whose last names end in a vowel or a "z".

[Leroy Lizard]

They aren't. They don't call it the Rust Belt for nuttin'

Oh yeah, California is just swimmin' with money.

As is Nevada and Arizona.

[tommieharris91]

How do people who live in northern states survive?

They traffic in Mexicans by train.

[olevetonahill]

They traffic in Mexicans by train.

Would that be the Modern day 'Underground Rail Road'?:D

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

They aren't. They don't call it the Rust Belt for nuttin'

And who do you think has been rebuilding NOLA? FEMA actually stands for "Find Every Mexican Available." <props to George Lopez -- that FEMA line is his>

You can bet most of the heavy de-oiling down there will be performed by guys whose last names end in a vowel or a "z".WELL THEN, you've made enough of a persuasive argument for us citizens to just throw up our hands and say "YOU WIN, MEXICO/GUATEMALA/YEMEN/IRAN ETC.". We don't want to, and won't stop you from your goal of RECONQUISTA. Your cheap labor is simply too irresistable to us, and besides, who cares if democrats are forever elected, and we go totally socialist and totalitarian...NO IMPORTA, AMIGO! Laws are always subject to new interpretation. This isn't a country, anyway. It's just a region.

[Okla-homey]

WELL THEN, you've made enough of a persuasive argument for us citizens to just throw up our hands and say "YOU WIN, MEXICO/GUATEMALA/YEMEN/IRAN ETC.". We don't want to, and won't stop you from your goal of RECONQUISTA. Your cheap labor is simply too irresistable to us, and besides, who cares if democrats are forever elected, and we go totally socialist and totalitarian...NO IMPORTA, AMIGO! Laws are always subject to new interpretation. This isn't a country, anyway. It's just a region.

Now, now. Don't be going off the deep end. There is a middle way available to us. And that is the way I propose.

And there is some truth to the notion the Mexicans who are here illegally didn't cross the US border, the US border crossed them.

[olevetonahill]

Now, now. Don't be going off the deep end. There is a middle way available to us. And that is the way I propose.

And there is some truth to the notion the Mexicans who are here illegally didn't cross the US border, the US border crossed them.

HUH ?:confused:
Homester Ya know I got yer back but that is just nuts
:eek: :pop: :rolleyes: ;) :D

[Okla-homey]

HUH ?:confused:
Homester Ya know I got yer back but that is just nuts
:eek: :pop: :rolleyes: ;) :D

Google "Mexican War" bro.

[ndpruitt03]

You know what if we got rid of most of these entitlement programs most of the immigration issues wouldn't matter. I think we need to have some sort of protection against the Cartel and terrorists that come across the border though. But I think most of the issues I have with immigration end up being more about entitlement programs.

[olevetonahill]

Google "Mexican War" bro.

Dont need to Bro
That shat happened long time ago . The peeps that affected are all ded.
Now those on THIS side are Mericans, those on the South side are Beaners :D ;)

[Leroy Lizard]

And there is some truth to the notion the Mexicans who are here illegally didn't cross the US border, the US border crossed them.

There is no truth to that whatsoever. Your argument would only make sense if those wanting to get in were born north of the border and deported south after the border jumped. Rather, those born above the border after it jumped are entitled to full American citizenship and are here legally.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

And who do you think has been rebuilding NOLA? FEMA actually stands for "Find Every Mexican Available." <props to George Lopez -- that FEMA line is his>


I can vouch for this one. If you wanted your house rebuilt after the storm and asked for paperwork on all the folks working on it, you'd still be in a formaldehyde trailer.

Being an illegal isn't exactly an easy life. A lot of times they'll get hired by local contractors and get stiffed because the contractors know they won't go to the cops. Or they get robbed by the local thugs because everything they do is in cash. Most of these folks are hard working folks trying to make a better life for their family back home.

[Leroy Lizard]

I can vouch for this one. If you wanted your house rebuilt after the storm and asked for paperwork on all the folks working on it, you'd still be in a formaldehyde trailer.

Being an illegal isn't exactly an easy life. A lot of times they'll get hired by local contractors and get stiffed because the contractors know they won't go to the cops. Or they get robbed by the local thugs because everything they do is in cash. Most of these folks are hard working folks trying to make a better life for their family back home.


I have no hard feelings toward the people. The problem is the system and those that defend it.

[Okla-homey]

I have no hard feelings toward the people.

I'm happy to hear that Leroy. Because the vast majority of these folks are just trying to scrape out a better life for their families than is otherwise available in the craphole countries of their birth. As Americans who all generally descend from folks who bailed on the "Old Country" for precisely the same reasons as these Mexicans, Guatemalans, Hondurans, etc., we should "get" that.

And they are human beings, and at the risk of sounding sappy, it hurts my heart to see a man willing to work so hard for honest pay when so many of our fellow citizens are quite willing to stay on their couch and moan about their sorry plight.

[Jacie]

They traffic in Mexicans by train.

There might be some truth in this.

Couple of weeks ago whilst sitting in the local barber shop waiting my turn in the chair, the guy ahead of me posed a question about a construction project going on in town. Keep in mind I live a 40 minute drive from Canada so it isn't uncommon to see the Border Patrol in their spiffy SUV's. The barber said that some BP officers had stopped in to ask if he knew where the workers on the construction project were living. He didn't know but it sparked a comment about them being brought in from somewhere else.

[Okla-homey]

There might be some truth in this.

Couple of weeks ago whilst sitting in the local barber shop waiting my turn in the chair, the guy ahead of me posed a question about a construction project going on in town. Keep in mind I live a 40 minute drive from Canada so it isn't uncommon to see the Border Patrol in their spiffy SUV's. The barber said that some BP officers had stopped in to ask if he knew where the workers on the construction project were living. He didn't know but it sparked a comment about them being brought in from somewhere else.

IMHO, those alleged illegal constructors should prolly be more worried about what the union goons will do to 'em than the Border Patrol. I understand those building trade unions up in your neck of the woods do not play nice.

[Leroy Lizard]

I'm happy to hear that Leroy. Because the vast majority of these folks are just trying to scrape out a better life for their families than is otherwise available in the craphole countries of their birth. As Americans who all generally descend from folks who bailed on the "Old Country" for precisely the same reasons as these Mexicans, Guatemalans, Hondurans, etc., we should "get" that.

And they are human beings, and at the risk of sounding sappy, it hurts my heart to see a man willing to work so hard for honest pay when so many of our fellow citizens are quite willing to stay on their couch and moan about their sorry plight.

As I said in a post a while back, I'm not sure I wouldn't do the same if placed in the same position.

What gripes me is the protection of these people for political reasons. When a political party looks upon a huge reservoir of uneducated, unskilled, poverty-stricken foreigners as a future voting base, then I draw the line.

[Okla-homey]

As I said in a post a while back, I'm not sure I wouldn't do the same if placed in the same position.

What gripes me is the protection of these people for political reasons. When a political party looks upon a huge reservoir of uneducated, unskilled, poverty-stricken foreigners as a future voting base, then I draw the line.

Well it's a little late for line-drawing. The GOP, Libertarian, Tea Party and John Birch crowd have forced these folks into the Donk tent where they'll remain for at least a generation or two. If they do get the vote, its curtains for non-Donk candidates in states with large Hispanic populations.

And its nothing new. That's exactly what the Democrats did with the Irish in the NE as they disembarked from their ships c.1840-1870.

[MR2-Sooner86]

its curtains for non-Donk candidates in states with large Hispanic populations.

Not unless we deport them ;)

[Leroy Lizard]

Well it's a little late for line-drawing. The GOP, Libertarian, Tea Party and John Birch crowd have forced these folks into the Donk tent where they'll remain for at least a generation or two.

These people were always in the Donk tent. At some point, you have to right the wrong or simply allow the abuses to continue.

The problem was not going to go away on its own, especially since one of the parties was perpetuating the problem. If you don't draw the line now, it gets harder and harder each forthcoming year as the political party responsible for the abuses gains more and more power.

[Jacie]

IMHO, those alleged illegal constructors should prolly be more worried about what the union goons will do to 'em than the Border Patrol. I understand those building trade unions up in your neck of the woods do not play nice.

The last couple of decades, the unions have taken a few hits below the waterline. The power they once exerted ain't what it used it to be.

In this area alone, we've seen the closing of all the mines (zinc, limestone, marble), the GM plant in Massena (went belly up last year), while ALCOA workers nationwide (and locally) accepted a new contract rather than strike. The next group in line nationally and locally that is going to see a decline in membership will be unions for teachers and school support workers, with an estimated 300,000 to be laid off before the next school year begins.

[Leroy Lizard]

The last couple of decades, the unions have taken a few hits below the waterline. The power they once exerted ain't what it used it to be.

Have unions in the past expressed any outrage over the presence of illegal aliens in the job market?


The next group in line nationally and locally that is going to see a decline in membership will be unions for teachers and school support workers, with an estimated 300,000 to be laid off before the next school year begins.

Teacher and school support unions are doomed for two reasons: 1. Arne Duncan, the U.S. Secretary of Education, is a nasty union buster who has used $$$ to compel school districts to spurn union protections. 2. Arne Ducan has thrown his full weight in support of the charter school movement, and most charter schools are non-union.

If you are a union supporter, you can't be happy with Arne Duncan.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

You know what if we got rid of most of these entitlement programs most of the immigration issues wouldn't matter. I think we need to have some sort of protection against the Cartel and terrorists that come across the border though. But I think most of the issues I have with immigration end up being more about entitlement programs.HOW DARE YOU! Insulting one of our great political parties like that!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

These people were always in the Donk tent. At some point, you have to right the wrong or simply allow the abuses to continue.

The problem was not going to go away on its own, especially since one of the parties was perpetuating the problem. If you don't draw the line now, it gets harder and harder each forthcoming year as the political party responsible for the abuses gains more and more power.To deny or ignore this, or downplay its importance, is dishonest.

[Sooner in Tampa]

SOOOOOO...let me get this straight...IF you are here from Messico illegally...it's all good, you are just a hard working man trying to support your family in a dirt poor country? So, that's a good thing?

BUT (just from the tone of this discussion) if you are from somewhere else illegally...it's NOT a good thing?

So, that leads me to my question: IF the workers didn't speak English...instead they spoke...Pashtun, same low price labor...your good with them working on your land?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

SOOOOOO...let me get this straight...IF you are here from Messico illegally...it's all good, you are just a hard working man trying to support your family in a dirt poor country? So, that's a good thing?

BUT (just from the tone of this discussion) if you are from somewhere else illegally...it's NOT a good thing?

So, that leads me to my question: IF the workers didn't speak English...instead they spoke...Pashtun, same low price labor...your good with them working on your land?Or/in addition, maybe he doesn't mind that the status quo is allowing the Entitlement State to grow and become chronically entrenched?...

[ndpruitt03]

SOOOOOO...let me get this straight...IF you are here from Messico illegally...it's all good, you are just a hard working man trying to support your family in a dirt poor country? So, that's a good thing?

BUT (just from the tone of this discussion) if you are from somewhere else illegally...it's NOT a good thing?

So, that leads me to my question: IF the workers didn't speak English...instead they spoke...Pashtun, same low price labor...your good with them working on your land?


You can't both have a welfare state like we are developing and allow immigrants in. You just end up having to pay too much to too many people.

[Jacie]

You can't both have a welfare state like we are developing and allow immigrants in. You just end up having to pay too much to too many people.

Since they are coming here to work, the trick then is to get them to pay for us!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Since they are coming here to work, the trick then is to get them to pay for us!"haha, haha", he says, while watching the ship sink.