The Nightmare Conference Realignment Senario?

[Mac94]

What happens in these senarios from an OU perspective?

The Big-10 does expand ... by three ... Nebraska, Missouri, and Rutgers jump ship but Note Dame says thanks but no thanks ... now at 14 the Big-10 decides thats enough for now.

The SEC, seeing the Big-10 expand to only 14 instead of the "super conference" 16 teams decides why rock the boat, things are good for them and they decide not to expand at this time.

The Pac-10 decides to add two but leave it at that.

their options there might be: Utah/Colorado, Texas/Colorado, or Texas/Texas A&M

The leftovers end up as a conference with maybe Texas or A&M or Colorado, Tech, Baylor, OU, oSu, KU, KSU, and ISU with no place to go and 3 or 4 teams short of the needed 12 for a conference title game. Plus, the weakened state of the league drives down the value of the leagues TV contract come renual time in 2012 and the leftovers loose poistion and money to the block of 3 semi super conferences.

[NormanPride]

Somebody will want A&M and OU.

[IronHorseSooner]

In that case, the SEC would probably make a move anyway, and look to get OU & A&M.

[goingoneight]

We're in no danger whatsoever. We're Oklahoma... contrary to the haters' beliefs, we have one of the top athletic programs in the country. When OU is on, people sit up and listen. We're not going to end up WAC'd or leftover BIG 12'd.

[soonerfan28]

If Missouri goes to the Big 10 minus Nebraska and Colorado heads to the Pac-10 then I would like to see TCU and BYU added w/OU moving to the north and TCU taking its spot in the south. That would give everybody OU vs Nebraska every year and a chance to see the actual best 2 teams in the conference play for the Big XII championship in OU & Tex.

Not likely to happen that way but would love to see that

[KantoSooner]

Beg pardon, but precisely what do TCU and BYU bring to a B12 other than being kind of well known and kind of available?
The critical Salt Lake City media market?
I simply don't see teams that could be added, in the event of losing Nebs, Colorado or Missouri that would be anything other than a 'push' in terms of media draw.
We've had the discussion for months and frankly our media contract is not that far out of whack considering the number of teevees the B12 brings to the party vs. the B10 and SEC. We can bump our numbers up a bit through renegotiation, but we're not going to justify doubling our take.
Thus I am drawn to the conclusion that B10 expansion may be lucky for us. We need realignment or be resigned to forever running 3rd or 4th in the money department. And, over time, that will have an effect.

[virginiasooner]

Rutgers in the Big 10? How moronic. Pitt makes more sense (mainly because of Penn State). But of course, the Domeheads make the most sense, but since they have their own teevee deal, they're "special" and don't want to share the revenue -- which they don't get from going to a first tier bowl game because they haven't been to a first tier bowl game in about 15 years. Of course, Iowa State could jump ship and join the Hawkeyes in the Big 10, but who could we pick up to replace them? Colorado State? Wyoming?

[TexasLidig8r]

Rutgers in the Big 10? How moronic. Pitt makes more sense (mainly because of Penn State).

Why?

It's about the number of new television sets that could be delivered to the Big 10/11.

Penn State is well situated in Pitt and the addition of Pitt would not bring new markets.

Although college football does not enjoy the fanaticism in the greater NYC area, at least Rutgers is relatively close and would stir up some interest in East Coast markets.

It's not about competitive balance.. it's about the dollars and cents.

[Flagstaffsooner]

Why?

It's about the number of new television sets that could be delivered to the Big 10/11.

Penn State is well situated in Pitt and the addition of Pitt would not bring new markets.

Although college football does not enjoy the fanaticism in the greater NYC area, at least Rutgers is relatively close and would stir up some interest in East Coast markets.

It's not about competitive balance.. it's about the dollars and cents.

For once you make sense.:eek:

[Taxman71]

The Big 12 doesn't need any more private schools (BYU and TCU) and definitely no more texas schools. Sounds like the Big 12 better broker a better TV deal or teams are going to jump for more money.

[yankee]

Beg pardon, but precisely what do TCU and BYU bring to a B12 other than being kind of well known and kind of available?


i think TCU would be exciting from a football standpoint, but they bring nothing in terms of $$$. UT, OU, Texas Tech, A&M and Baylor already have the DF/W market locked up, so from a financial standpoint it's not feasible at all. BYU would be a wiser choice money-wise.

[Flagstaffsooner]

BYU would be a wiser choice money-wise.

Kinda far for them to travel.
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4021/4209874943_432bfa35f9.jpg
My apologies to my Freind Hubler.;)

[yermom]

it doesn't seem like anyone gets Texas without aTm or OU without OSU

and the Big 12 would have C-USA, WAC or MWC teams lining up to get to 12 teams

[soonerfan28]

TCU and BYU bring nothing to the table but good football and that doesn't pay the bills. Still it's something I wouldn't mind seeing.

[TexasLidig8r]

Sounds like the Big 12 better broker a better TV deal or teams are going to jump for more money.

Watch for the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance to start to gain steam.

The Pac 10 just hired CAA as a consultant on expansion and a possible alliance (?).

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2010-05-11/sbj-pac-10-hires-hollywood-agency-caa-star-power-mind

With CAA's pull on West Coast media outlets, if the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance can be formalized, that would be very compelling for networks and corporations to know they have the Los Angeles, San Francisco, Dallas-FW, Houston, Phoenix, Seattle markets locked up.

[Mjcpr]

Watch for the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance to start to gain steam.

The Pac 10 just hired CAA as a consultant on expansion and a possible alliance (?).

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2010-05-11/sbj-pac-10-hires-hollywood-agency-caa-star-power-mind

With CAA's pull on West Coast media outlets, if the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance can be formalized, that would be very compelling for networks and corporations to know they have the Los Angeles, San Francisco, Dallas-FW, Houston, Phoenix, Seattle markets locked up.

Plus Seminole, Enid and Kingfisher.

[soonersam]

It would be sad if Nebraska turns it back on tradition and leaves the conference they helped build to a power!!

[swardboy]

Plus Seminole, Enid and Kingfisher.

Dam rite!!!!

[soonervegas]

Watch for the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance to start to gain steam.

The Pac 10 just hired CAA as a consultant on expansion and a possible alliance (?).

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2010-05-11/sbj-pac-10-hires-hollywood-agency-caa-star-power-mind

With CAA's pull on West Coast media outlets, if the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance can be formalized, that would be very compelling for networks and corporations to know they have the Los Angeles, San Francisco, Dallas-FW, Houston, Phoenix, Seattle markets locked up.

I wonder what the definition of an alliance is in the Presidents minds? Is it let's broker a TV deal together or is it AU and ASU in the PAC 10 East with 6 current Big 12 schools?

If the Big 12's hand is forced by Mizz and NU exodus....I really like option 2.

[Mr. Nuke]

Why?

It's about the number of new television sets that could be delivered to the Big 10/11.

Penn State is well situated in Pitt and the addition of Pitt would not bring new markets.

Although college football does not enjoy the fanaticism in the greater NYC area, at least Rutgers is relatively close and would stir up some interest in East Coast markets.

It's not about competitive balance.. it's about the dollars and cents.
To put it into perspective the average in market basic cable carry fee for the BTN is being reported as $0.70 per month per subscriber. There are about 5 million cable subscribers in the 5 boroughs. IF Rutgers could deliver NYC, that alone is worth approximately $42 million a year.

Watch for the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance to start to gain steam.

The Pac 10 just hired CAA as a consultant on expansion and a possible alliance (?).

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2010-05-11/sbj-pac-10-hires-hollywood-agency-caa-star-power-mind

With CAA's pull on West Coast media outlets, if the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance can be formalized, that would be very compelling for networks and corporations to know they have the Los Angeles, San Francisco, Dallas-FW, Houston, Phoenix, Seattle markets locked up.
The problem is (assuming everyone stays for a moment) that you are then splitting revenue 22 ways. Yeah it would be a good thing for the conference, but does it eliminate the gap between the Big 10 and the SEC compared to the Big 12? Probably not.

[JLEW1818]

Lid likes pee

[Mr. Nuke]

It would be sad if Nebraska turns it back on tradition and leaves the conference they helped build to a power!!
It would be sad to go, but quite frankly the Big XII failed to some extent. We merged with the SWC hoping the Texas schools would get us a better television package. Almost 15 years later, here we are. The Big 10 and SEC have mega deals. There is really nothing the Big 12 can do to rectify the situation.

[soonervegas]

So does Texas' ego end up getting credit for ruining two conferences?

[prrriiide]

So does Texas' ego end up getting credit for ruining two conferences?

Yes. Along with a lot of formerly-awesome little mountain towns in Colorado and New Mexico.

[sooner94]

We're in no danger whatsoever. We're Oklahoma... contrary to the haters' beliefs, we have one of the top athletic programs in the country. When OU is on, people sit up and listen. We're not going to end up WAC'd or leftover BIG 12'd.

Exactly. We will be fine. Oklahoma is a good TV draw nationally, as are most of the top programs. Ever notice how non-OU fans love to see us lose? That means those people watch our games.

Let's sit back and until the dust settles and then figure out what we want to do.

I feel bad for the lesser football powers in the Big 12. They stand to lose some $$ with the reorg.

[ashley]

Rutgers in the Big 10? How moronic. Pitt makes more sense (mainly because of Penn State). But of course, the Domeheads make the most sense, but since they have their own teevee deal, they're "special" and don't want to share the revenue -- which they don't get from going to a first tier bowl game because they haven't been to a first tier bowl game in about 15 years. Of course, Iowa State could jump ship and join the Hawkeyes in the Big 10, but who could we pick up to replace them? Colorado State? Wyoming?

The big 10 wants Rutgers for the New Youk TV market. This is no secret.
Something is going to happen and OU, tu and the Aggies will not be left out.

[MeMyself&Me]

To put it into perspective the average in market basic cable carry fee for the BTN is being reported as $0.70 per month per subscriber. There are about 5 million cable subscribers in the 5 boroughs. IF Rutgers could deliver NYC, that alone is worth approximately $42 million a year.

The problem is (assuming everyone stays for a moment) that you are then splitting revenue 22 ways. Yeah it would be a good thing for the conference, but does it eliminate the gap between the Big 10 and the SEC compared to the Big 12? Probably not.

Yeah, I don't think the Western Alliance works unless you can eliminate some of the 'dead weight' teams. I think the only way that's possible is if both the Pac-10 and the Big 12 dissolve their current conferences to form a new one. However, I don't think 'dead weight' schools would be left behind because of the political pressure that would result.


So does Texas' ego end up getting credit for ruining two conferences?

That's how I see it.

[rawlingsHOH]

i think TCU would be exciting from a football standpoint, but they bring nothing in terms of $$$. UT, OU, Texas Tech, A&M and Baylor already have the DF/W market locked up, so from a financial standpoint it's not feasible at all. BYU would be a wiser choice money-wise.

correct, they add nothing. they'd be a good football team (for a couple years, before the conference swallows them, and turns them into Baylor North) and create some exciting games, but that's it.

[rawlingsHOH]

Watch for the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance to start to gain steam.

The Pac 10 just hired CAA as a consultant on expansion and a possible alliance (?).

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-football/article/2010-05-11/sbj-pac-10-hires-hollywood-agency-caa-star-power-mind

With CAA's pull on West Coast media outlets, if the Big 12 - Pac 10 alliance can be formalized, that would be very compelling for networks and corporations to know they have the Los Angeles, San Francisco, Dallas-FW, Houston, Phoenix, Seattle markets locked up.

that would be an alliance of craptastic officiating. that much i know.

[S008NER]

it doesn't seem like anyone gets Texas without aTm or OU without OSU

and the Big 12 would have C-USA, WAC or MWC teams lining up to get to 12 teams

We are not joined at the hip with state and I believe that a&m may feel that they are a better fit with SEC teams, unlike the academic types in austin.

[KantoSooner]

academic

types

in Austin

I know, I know, but as I read those words I am forced to physically restrain the urge to laugh out loud. I know not what yardstick those so inclined choose to measure such things but I've had lots of contact with undergrads from Austin as well as other B12 schools and there is no difference. None. Let's cease buying into UT's unwarranted academic arrogance.

[delhalew]

Texas definately gets some blame. I know Nebraska fans blame them for eliminating partial qualifiers and the unique money structure of the big 12. As long as we win, the structure benifits us. Nebraska having been down, has taken a big hit at the hands of cocky whorns. Face it, as long as the Red River game continues, most of us would be happy to get away from Texas.

[delhalew]

academic

types

in Austin

I know, I know, but as I read those words I am forced to physically restrain the urge to laugh out loud. I know not what yardstick those so inclined choose to measure such things but I've had lots of contact with undergrads from Austin as well as other B12 schools and there is no difference. None. Let's cease buying into UT's unwarranted academic arrogance.

They feel superior to the SEC. If you look up the stats, however, they are no better.

[OK2U]

Stoops talks conference realignment (video):
http://www.okblitz.com/Article.aspx?id=21051

[MichiganSooner]

TCU and BYU bring nothing to the table but good football and that doesn't pay the bills. Still it's something I wouldn't mind seeing.

Do you realize the Cougars sell out their 24,000 seat basketball arena for all games?

Have you ever heard of Salt Lake City?

[jumperstop]

I agree with most of you guys, OU will be fine and will not be left out to dry in this whole mess. As for teams to replace Nebbish and Mizzou, I don't see why a lot of people think TCU would be good from any stand point. They may have some good media now, but their fan base isn't great. Also many of you think that their football team is on par with Big 12 teams. Didn't last time we met we beat their stellar year team where they were in the top 10 by like 30 points? I don't need any reminding of what happened in 05 or whatever year that was, but that was a down year. On a consistent basis I see them being no better than Baylor, ok maybe better than Baylor, more like a Colorado or ISU where they can compete to win the North but will never be able to compete with the better schools in the south.

[TMcGee86]

The only way UT and A&M would get split up would be if A&M had a standing offer from someone like the SEC and UT bolted for the Pac10.

Considering the fact that the legislature has to approve the move, and the Governor is basically the de facto President of A&M right now, there is no way he would allow UT to bolt without A&M in tow.

[GottaHavePride]

academic

types

in Austin

I know, I know, but as I read those words I am forced to physically restrain the urge to laugh out loud. I know not what yardstick those so inclined choose to measure such things but I've had lots of contact with undergrads from Austin as well as other B12 schools and there is no difference. None. Let's cease buying into UT's unwarranted academic arrogance.

Undergrads EVERYWHERE are pretty equal. However, UT has a ton of money, a lot of academic resources, and very good graduate programs.

[rawlingsHOH]

On a consistent basis I see them being no better than Baylor, ok maybe better than Baylor, more like a Colorado or ISU where they can compete to win the North but will never be able to compete with the better schools in the south.
Right with your first thought. Another Baylor. Of course Baylor was better than TCU in the last years of the SWC. TCU hadn't finished higher than Baylor since 1984.

[goingoneight]

I would say that even with respect to TCU's solid coaching staff, they'd struggle if they had to play in a division with Mack Brown's Texas teams, Bob Stoops' OU teams, Mike Leach's Texas Tech teams, Les Miles and Gundy at OSU... well... let's just say they've been better than usual since the forming of the B12. A&M... meh... sometimes decent, most of the time just aggy is as aggy does. Two of TCU's best teams... one barely squeaked by the worst OU team of the Stoops era, at the worst point of the season for said bad OU team, and got destroyed a few years later by them. The've been pwn3d by Tejas, too in recent years.

[goingoneight]

Besides, the idea of conference realignment isn't bringing in something you already have (another Texas team on an already B12-pwned TV market). The idea is expansion an improvement money-wise.

[KantoSooner]

Undergrads EVERYWHERE are pretty equal. However, UT has a ton of money, a lot of academic resources, and very good graduate programs.

I can grant you all these points and still not feel obligated to tug at my intellectual forelock before the Great UT. They are simply not superior, academically, to the degree they claim. And yet most people around these parts seem to give them that without question.

sorry to beat the dead pony so mercilessly.

[bluedogok]

The only way UT and A&M would get split up would be if A&M had a standing offer from someone like the SEC and UT bolted for the Pac10.

Considering the fact that the legislature has to approve the move, and the Governor is basically the de facto President of A&M right now, there is no way he would allow UT to bolt without A&M in tow.
I don't know, I think the landscape is different now than at the end of the SWC, I don't think the aTm people would require themselves to go along with wherever UT went, in fact I think some might prefer it if UT went their own way as long as they had their still annual game. They don't feel like they have been forgotten like the SWC had been on the national scene. I do agree that much of it depends on what the options are behind the scenes.

I know quite a few UT and aTm alumni who wouldn't mind not being in the same conference, they would prefer something like what OU-Texas had before the Big 12 happened. Still have a "big game" but not a conference championship ender.