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Collier11
5/3/2010, 11:30 PM
Might just be a Paki...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_times_square_car_bomb

Collier11
5/3/2010, 11:33 PM
"One of the officials told The Associated Press that the potential suspect is a man of Pakistani descent who recently traveled to Pakistan."

Crucifax Autumn
5/3/2010, 11:40 PM
You'd think if that was the case the moron would have learned to build a bomb! lol

Collier11
5/3/2010, 11:43 PM
no ****e

yermom
5/3/2010, 11:48 PM
Might just be a Patsy...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_times_square_car_bomb

:eek:

i'm something of a cynic though

Crucifax Autumn
5/3/2010, 11:51 PM
Me too. They were denying ANY hint of Paki involvement 6 hours ago while they were still looking for a white dude.

Sooner98
5/3/2010, 11:58 PM
Just wondering, what's the over/under on number of posts before a someone predictably plays the "Christians are just as violent too, just look at the Crusades TEN CENTURIES AGO!!!!!11!!one1!!!1" card? :rolleyes:

I'll go ahead and set it at twelve, and take the under.

yermom
5/4/2010, 12:00 AM
how many cities have we bombed in the last few years?

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:07 AM
Do we really need to get into the diff between a terrorist and a military campaign?

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:08 AM
Just wondering, what's the over/under on number of posts before a someone predictably plays the "Christians are just as violent too, just look at the Crusades TEN CENTURIES AGO!!!!!11!!one1!!!1" card? :rolleyes:

I'll go ahead and set it at twelve, and take the under.

You won't hear that out of me and if you did it wouldn't be Crusades BS, it would be recent crap. That said, that's not the basis for my skepticism that the bomber is Paki. I just don't believe that every terror act is committed by a Muslim, despite their obvious love of such tactics. I think it's terrorism no matter what religion does it and it bothered me when Holder and the rest kept referring to "no connection to terrorism". That's just retarded when discussing a terrorist act.

When there is no "chatter", no signature, no photo evidence except for a white dude, no connection to the Pakis even after talking to the guy that sold the Nissan, and no witness saying they saw "abdul running away screaming alla akbar", etc. I don't believe sh*t until I actually have some real information. This board above most others knows damn well there is such a thing as "non-Islamic terrorism".

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:13 AM
Exactly, it would be nice to keep the lunacy from both sides out of it but we know that wont happen

yermom
5/4/2010, 12:17 AM
Do we really need to get into the diff between a terrorist and a military campaign?

is there a difference when they are bombing your people?

i'm not defending motives, but if the roles were reversed it would be called "guerilla tactics" and he'd be yelling "Wolverines" or something


i'm thinking our civilian body count and theirs isn't that dissimilar

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:18 AM
Of course not. I'll always consider every possibility though, no matter how this one turns out. Jumping to conclusions early will eventually lead to one of these weirdos getting away, regardless if it's domestic or foreign.

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:21 AM
Well, depends. Despite the fact that the country was so split on the Iraq war, most everyone could atleast acknowledge that we were getting rid of a horrible, murderous human being and many of those who helped him. In Afghanastan we were killing them because they attacked our country unprovoked...these type people like this guy in NYC are killing or trying to kill innocents simply because they hate us to put it generically

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:21 AM
is there a difference when they are bombing your people?

i'm not defending motives, but if the roles were reversed it would be called "guerilla tactics" and he'd be yelling "Wolverines" or something


i'm thinking our civilian body count and theirs isn't that dissimilar

I always get a kick out of Rambo III where he's helping the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan and teaching them to do the very sh*t that they do now as Al Quada. It wasn't Rambo, but there was some US training of those f*cksticks "for the greater good".

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:21 AM
Well, depends. Despite the fact that the country was so split on the Iraq war, most everyone could atleast acknowledge that we were getting rid of a horrible, murderous human being and many of those who helped him. In Afghanastan we were killing them because they attacked our country unprovoked...these type people like this guy in NYC are killing or trying to kill innocents simply because they hate us to put it generically

True enough, but so was McVeigh.

SicEmBaylor
5/4/2010, 12:22 AM
Bloomberg is a f'in idiot. Just hours after they found this bomb he got in front of the microphone saying there was no evidence to suggest the bomb was from an overseas/islamic terrorist.

Really? How the hell does he know that? Is the Mayor of NYC privy to our nation's intelligence services? Does the CIA give him a briefing every day? He doesn't know **** about what evidence may or may not have existed.

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:24 AM
True but I dont think McVeigh was doing it on behalf of Christianity and I also think it is completely fair to assume that if a Pakistani or Afghani or someone like that attempts a mass murder of this sort that it is due to terrorist ties while if a white person does it they are probably just some loon. Doesnt mean they couldnt possibly be a terrorist or have terrorist ties but you get the drift

yermom
5/4/2010, 12:25 AM
they hate us and they can't win a straight up fight, so this is the kind of thing they are left with. i don't think it has as much to do with religion as it does that.

i'm sure the Japanese would have done similar things if it was as easy to get half way across the world in the 40's

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:25 AM
Bloomberg is a f'in idiot. Just hours after they found this bomb he got in front of the microphone saying there was no evidence to suggest the bomb was from an overseas/islamic terrorist.

Really? How the hell does he know that? Is the Mayor of NYC privy to our nation's intelligence services? Does the CIA give him a briefing every day? He doesn't know **** about what evidence may or may not have existed.

Not exactly, but he does get more briefings than you or me! lol

In his defense, the people who ARE in a position to know were saying the same thing.

yermom
5/4/2010, 12:27 AM
i get the feeling they say that sometimes just so they terrorists don't get credit and to keep the fear level down

again though, i'm a cynic and don't trust the government much no matter who is in charge ;)

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:27 AM
True but I dont think McVeigh was a Christian and I also think it is completely fair to assume that if a Pakistani or Afghani or someone like that attempts a mass murder of this sort that it is due to terrorist ties while if a white person does it they are probably just some loon. Doesnt mean they couldnt possibly be a terrorist or have terrorist ties but you get the drift

WTF does Christian have to do with it? All I said is not all terrorism is Islamic and assuming so means that someone like McSh*thead could potentially get away if it's automatically assumed that only Muslims do crazy sh*t.

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:30 AM
It was brought up earlier in the thread about someone bringing up the Crusades, I was still tying into that statement somewhat as well as the fact that most homegrown terrorists dont seem to do it on behalf of relgion while many Muslims do

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:35 AM
Just because one guy assumed some far left lib was gonna start spouting BS about the crusades doesn't mean it was a substantial part of the actual conversation we were having. You and I and Yermom have been having a reasonable talk about how there are nuts of all flavors, the government is full of sh*t no matter who's in office, and how making assumptions or believeing every rash theory is dangerous. One smart*ss comment shouldn't distract from the grownups talking. lol

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:37 AM
I was just used to it so I guess I assumed it was already happening, lol

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:38 AM
LMAO

As long as we're gonna be silly now:

They musta thought Matt and Trey were catching a night out to see the Lion King!

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:42 AM
So when im in NY this Friday should I beat the **** out of every Paki or Afghani that I see? :D

Crucifax Autumn
5/4/2010, 12:51 AM
Yeah, but dress up in a bear suit and claim to be Muhamed first.

SanJoaquinSooner
5/4/2010, 07:58 AM
The vehicle identification number had been removed from the Pathfinder's dashboard, but it was stamped on the engine, and investigators used it to find the owner of record, who told them he had sold the vehicle to a stranger

I didn't know the engine had the ID number too, but that makes sense.

Hats off to investigators.

yermom
5/4/2010, 08:25 AM
apparently Achmed didn't know that either ;)

King Crimson
5/4/2010, 08:26 AM
WTF does Christian have to do with it? All I said is not all terrorism is Islamic and assuming so means that someone like McSh*thead could potentially get away if it's automatically assumed that only Muslims do crazy sh*t.

i totally agree.

when OKC happened it assumed it was islamic "terrorists". my dad worked in the building next to the Murrah building.....convenient scapegoat. the non-christians., turns out it was some guy who learned how to build a bomb in the US Military (when it happened, my dad US Army Ranger says i know how to build that bomb). christians have bombed abortion clinics.

TheHumanAlphabet
5/4/2010, 08:37 AM
how many cities have we bombed in the last few years?
Uh, zero?

King Barry's Back
5/4/2010, 08:43 AM
Just wondering, what's the over/under on number of posts before a someone predictably plays the "Christians are just as violent too, just look at the Crusades TEN CENTURIES AGO!!!!!11!!one1!!!1" card? :rolleyes:

I'll go ahead and set it at twelve, and take the under.

Don't forget: The only reason the Holy Land is Islamic is because the Muslims invaded and killed all the Christians.

Crusades = turnabout = fair play by most definitions.

King Barry's Back
5/4/2010, 08:48 AM
they hate us and they can't win a straight up fight, so this is the kind of thing they are left with. i don't think it has as much to do with religion as it does that.

i'm sure the Japanese would have done similar things if it was as easy to get half way across the world in the 40's

Fair enough, as far as your point goes.

But of course you realize that, as the big kid on the block, EVERYBODY more or less hates/ resents, and NONE of them can win in a straight up fight.

Yet almost only one religion every attacks us, and certainly only one CONSISTENTLY attacks us. And that happens to be a religion that orders its adherents to kill anybody that is not a fellow adherent.

Authorities are now saying that the bomber is not only a Paki, but is suspected of working with a group of international terrorists. Hopefully Bloomberg will shut-the-hell-up next time.

King Barry's Back
5/4/2010, 08:52 AM
LMAO

As long as we're gonna be silly now:

They musta thought Matt and Trey were catching a night out to see the Lion King!

Third consecutive post. Had to do it.

You make a joke, but one theory mentioned this morning in either the NY Times or the Washington Post is that the bomb was intended for the Times Square HQ of Comedy Central -- which apparently just ran the South Park episode making fun of the Islamic Prophet. (Sorry for no link.)

EDIT: Found the original article. From WPost, in a column called "Spy Talk," where the author discusses intel/security issues. Article slightly edited.

Bomb probe could renew focus on Pakistan group

The naming of an unidentified Pakistani American as a “person of interest” in the Times Square near-bombing could focus renewed attention on whether Lashkar-i-Taiba has turned its attention to cultural targets in the United States.

Another Pakistani American, David Headley, recently pled guilty to helping Lashkar-i-Taiba plan an attack on a Danish newspaper that had published a cartoon of the prophet Muhammad, as well as scouting Mumbai for its 2008 attacks there.

Some commentators have suggested that the Times Square offices of Comedy Central, which recently broadcast a South Park episode poking fun at the danger of portraying Muhammad in less than reverent light, was the real target on Saturday night.

A 20-year-old Virginia man who styles himself as an Islamic radical, Zachary Chesser, has engaged in an online campaign to whip up fury against the show.

According to the Anti Defamation League, which has been tracking his online posts, Chesser made his first comment about the South Park episode with an April 15 posting on Twitter.

"May Allah kill Matt Stone and Trey Parker and burn them in Hell for all eternity,” he said of the program’s creators, according to the ADL. “They insult our prophets Muhammad, Jesus, and Moses..."

Analysts remain uncertain, however, whether Lashkar-i-Taiba would pour resources into attacking cultural targets in the U.S., according to the London Telegraph.

"Evidence suggests the group is prepared to support attacks against the West, but not at the expense of its war against India,” analyst Stephen Tankel wrote late last year the West Point Combating Terrorism Center Sentinel.

“LeT willingly coordinated with [David] Headley on attacking Danish targets, but when the opportunity arose to use him to prepare new attacks in India, LeT suggested he shift focus to South Asia," Tankel wrote, using an acronym for Lashkar-i-Taiba.

Lashkar’s leaders called off Headley's plotting in Denmark, telling him he was needed more for the Mumbai operation, according to his statement of guilt.

As part of his guilty plea, Headley, who changed his name from Daood Gilani so he could travel more easily, is cooperating with investigators

SunnySooner
5/4/2010, 09:19 AM
So it was a Paki, a recent naturalized citizen. I saw where he was on the plane, and it had already left the jetway when they hauled him in. They took a couple others with him, but released them and they got back on the plane, which then took off for Dubai. Good thing, prolly would have been a lot harder to arrest him in Dubai. I just wonder what his real story is, right now he's saying he was a lone operator, but I doubt that. Hopefully they'll get him to cough up some useful info, and we can keep preventing these things.

I'm still amazed that we haven't had another serious attack since 9/11. This incident showed that cooperation between all the agencies has improved, the bomb was found Saturday, and now on Tuesday, we've got the dude in custody. Doubt it would have happened that fast in the old days. I wonder how many attacks have been prevented that haven't been reported like this one, plots we'll never know about. I bet it's a fair number. Makes me feel a little better about all the folks killed on 9/11, hopefully their deaths are not completely in vain if their murders forced the changes that have since saved many others from a similar fate.

JohnnyMack
5/4/2010, 10:17 AM
they hate us and they can't win a straight up fight, so this is the kind of thing they are left with. i don't think it has as much to do with religion as it does that.

i'm sure the Japanese would have done similar things if it was as easy to get half way across the world in the 40's

Hell George Washington ended up as POTUS by adopting this very strategy.

Jacie
5/4/2010, 10:38 AM
how many cities have we bombed in the last few years?

Not enough . . .

TheHumanAlphabet
5/4/2010, 12:17 PM
Well, it is the poor Paki's default on his home mortgage that drove him to it...:rolleyes:

He supposedly had a "wall Street" job, but nothing has been said. His wife has been in Paki for a significant time. I bet he was a "citizen" of convenience in order to do this dastardly deed. The default was prolly planned as he wasn't coming back to the U.S. Hope they find he lied on his citizenship app so we can revoke it.

TopDawg
5/4/2010, 12:46 PM
Yet almost only one religion every attacks us, and certainly only one CONSISTENTLY attacks us. And that happens to be a religion that orders its adherents to kill anybody that is not a fellow adherent.

There is no religion that is attacking us. There are people attacking us who either claim to be a member of a certain religion or are assumed to be a member of a certain religion because of their ethnicity. But Islam is no more attacking us than Christianity was attacking blacks when the KKK was carrying out its "ordained" racial cleansing.

Do you know any Muslims?

Collier11
5/4/2010, 12:53 PM
There is no religion that is attacking us. There are people attacking us who either claim to be a member of a certain religion or are assumed to be a member of a certain religion because of their ethnicity. But Islam is no more attacking us than Christianity was attacking blacks when the KKK was carrying out its "ordained" racial cleansing.

Do you know any Muslims?

True but they are still doing it on behalf of their religion, doesnt make the entire religion evil but it does make it seem as if they are teaching evil in some areas of the religion

TheHumanAlphabet
5/4/2010, 01:05 PM
True but they are still doing it on behalf of their religion, doesnt make the entire religion evil but it does make it seem as if they are teaching evil in some areas of the religion

This is the problem. Just as in Christianity, Judiasm and Islam, the faiths that do not have a hierarchical structure to ensure a common view or dispension of the doctrine, then it leaves interpretation to a single person. These can be considered part of the theology, but there is no check as to the appropriateness of the teaching. Non-denominational Christian churches are most susceptible and problematic here - i.e. the Westboro Baptist church. I guess there are individual synagogues that may fall into this, but I don't hear too much about radial Judiasm (at least here in the Midwest). We all know about radical Islam. Any ole Ahmed can have an insight, develop a mosque and then get whatever belief sanctioned with a fatwah and then go out and do violence.

JohnnyMack
5/4/2010, 01:06 PM
True but they are still doing it on behalf of their religion, doesnt make the entire religion evil but it does make it seem as if they are teaching evil in some areas of the religion

I would contend that all religions at some time or another have had members who used the text of their religion to promote their particular agenda. Sometimes it was for good, sometimes for evil. Islam is no more inherently evil than any other religion, including Christianity. What certain members of a religion choose to do with the text that drives their religion is up to them. It's one of the inherent flaws in choosing to follow something that has no basis in reason.

Collier11
5/4/2010, 01:09 PM
I would contend that all religions at some time or another have had members who used the text of their religion to promote their particular agenda. Sometimes it was for good, sometimes for evil. Islam is no more inherently evil than any other religion, including Christianity. What certain members of a religion choose to do with the text that drives their religion is up to them. It's one of the inherent flaws in choosing to follow something that has no basis in reason.

Absolutely, anyone with any knowledge at all of the Muslim religion or almost all religions for that matter will know that the teachings do not promote violence towards individuals or other belief systems

TMcGee86
5/4/2010, 02:26 PM
Hopefully they'll get him to cough up some useful info, and we can keep preventing these things.

I'm not sure I'd classify this one as something we "prevented."

From what I've read, we just got lucky it didn't go off. Much like we got lucky the airline bomb didn't go off.

Our luck is bound to run out.

OULenexaman
5/4/2010, 03:34 PM
I'm not sure I'd classify this one as something we "prevented."

From what I've read, we just got lucky it didn't go off. Much like we got lucky the airline bomb didn't go off.

Our luck is bound to run out.

I agree......we didn't prevent jack **** here.....pure luck......The dude put this whole thing together to perfection.....just didn't go bang.....all this done in a highly populated area right under the noses of Homeland Security....FBI...ATF....CIA....not good. :mad: :mad:

Collier11
5/4/2010, 03:38 PM
lets face it, if someone wants to cause mass destruction and they arent already on the terror watch list, it is gonna be hard to stop them

olevetonahill
5/4/2010, 04:05 PM
Can we just send this dude back to the Training camps ?
As a ****ing Instructor :D :D

badger
5/4/2010, 05:20 PM
I have been following this story all day.

To this would-be terrorist's credit, he admitted to everything and is working with authorities, so he might not end up in Guantanamo Bay's resort after all.

He is apparently the son of well-to-do parents and recently obtained U.S. citizenship and depending on who you listen to, either working Connecticut or Wall Street and appears to have lived in a nice home, where neighbors said he was really quiet and didn't really do much besides enter and leave the neighborhood.

I almost wonder if this guy isn't just a decoy for a better-planned attack... one that almost escaped, mind you.

There are rumors that the target was Viacom, aka South Park, aka teddy bear depiction of Mohammad. Don't think so, but interesting to note.

It was good that it was prevented, but I worry that now ain't the time to pat yourself on the back

Frozen Sooner
5/4/2010, 05:38 PM
[QUOTE=badger;2875651]
He is apparently the son of well-to-do parents and recently obtained U.S. citizenship and depending on who you listen to, either working Connecticut or Wall Street and appears to have lived in a nice home, /QUOTE]

I'm looking at the guy's pad on the television right now, and if you think that's a nice place, you need to move out of Tulsa. ;)

badger
5/4/2010, 05:46 PM
[QUOTE=badger;2875651]
He is apparently the son of well-to-do parents and recently obtained U.S. citizenship and depending on who you listen to, either working Connecticut or Wall Street and appears to have lived in a nice home, /QUOTE]

I'm looking at the guy's pad on the television right now, and if you think that's a nice place, you need to move out of Tulsa. ;)

For a dude living by himself that's nice... and it's Connecticut, not Oklahoma, so odds are that's not a cheap house. That looks like a default-on-your-mortgage house ;)

Frozen Sooner
5/4/2010, 06:03 PM
I was talking about the apartment they were saying was his. I thought the house was his parents' and got foreclosed on.

Boarder
5/4/2010, 07:55 PM
.The dude put this whole thing together to perfection.....just didn't go bang.....:

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/05/how-not-to-build-a-car-bomb-times-square-edition/

According to this article he was kind of an idiot who didn't know
what he was doing.

Collier11
5/4/2010, 08:07 PM
So...he was even on the no-fly list and still made it on an airplane, awesome

Leroy Lizard
5/4/2010, 08:40 PM
Absolutely, anyone with any knowledge at all of the Muslim religion or almost all religions for that matter will know that the teachings do not promote violence towards individuals or other belief systems

""But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practice regular charity, then open the way for them: for God is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful (9:5)."

-- Prophet Mohammed.

Leroy Lizard
5/4/2010, 08:44 PM
It was good that it was prevented, but I worry that now ain't the time to pat yourself on the back

The only thing that prevented a disaster was his own incompetence. If it had been McVeigh...

Leroy Lizard
5/4/2010, 08:46 PM
Well, he'll probably get a bunch of females sending in marriage proposals and maybe even a book deal. It may not have worked out so badly for him. :D

picasso
5/4/2010, 09:03 PM
they hate us and they can't win a straight up fight, so this is the kind of thing they are left with. i don't think it has as much to do with religion as it does that.

i

Yet they can come to our country and enjoy our freedoms. Go to school and openly worship their religion.

Boarder
5/4/2010, 09:12 PM
Yet they can come to our country and enjoy our freedoms. Go to school and openly worship their religion.
Nobody said they were rational.

tulsaoilerfan
5/4/2010, 09:36 PM
"One of the officials told The Associated Press that the potential suspect is a man of Pakistani descent who recently traveled to Pakistan."

Babu? :D

Sooner98
5/4/2010, 11:05 PM
"I blow you up, Jerry Seinfeld! You very, very bad man!"

http://content.ytmnd.com/content/a/6/0/a605cbb5329aa4f94c747a36e5b4377e.gif

TheHumanAlphabet
5/5/2010, 08:54 AM
So...he was even on the no-fly list and still made it on an airplane, awesome

Looks like it was updated every 24 hours and required review by airlines once every 24 hours. He slipped within that window by reserving his ticket on the way to the AP and paid cash. Looks like TSA is now requiring airline review within 2 hours after a special update announcement is made.

Harry Beanbag
5/5/2010, 12:30 PM
lets face it, if someone wants to cause mass destruction and they arent already on the terror watch list, it is gonna be hard to stop them


Apparently, we can't stop them even if they are. It is time for Janet "The System Worked Perfectly" Napolitano to have her *** fired.

And chalk one up to Sic'em for his anti all immigration stance.

Harry Beanbag
5/5/2010, 12:35 PM
According to this article he was kind of an idiot who didn't know
what he was doing.


Yet he was still able to:
1. Gain U.S. citizenship
2. Leave the country to visit Pakistan for terrorist training
3. Come back to the U.S., successfully be detained, questioned, and released upon his return
4. Build a bomb in an SUV and park in Times Square
5. Successfully make it to the airport and past security on his way out of the country.

Was he on the watch list this entire time? Just think what somebody who isn't an idiot could accomplish.

JohnnyMack
5/5/2010, 12:36 PM
Apparently, we can't stop them even if they are. It is time for Janet "The System Worked Perfectly" Napolitano to have her *** fired.

And chalk one up to Sic'em for his anti all immigration stance.

:rolleyes:

Like George Tenet and Bob Mueller and Condi Rice got fired after 09/11?

Harry Beanbag
5/5/2010, 12:45 PM
:rolleyes:

Like George Tenet and Bob Mueller and Condi Rice got fired after 09/11?


Maybe they should have been. I don't remember them acting like they did a good job though. Napolitano is a joke.

TMcGee86
5/5/2010, 01:27 PM
It was good that it was prevented, but I worry that now ain't the time to pat yourself on the back

Again, it wasn't "prevented". It just didn't work. We got lucky.

John Kochtoston
5/5/2010, 03:38 PM
If anyone is looking for recent examples of white-on-white, Christian-on-Christian terrorism, there's always Northern Ireland. The bomb is built on feelings, justified or not, of being repressed. Religion is just sometimes an easy way to light the fuse.

Flagstaffsooner
5/5/2010, 05:03 PM
It's only time before the messicans start doing this to us, strapping Bic lighters to their butts.