Census waste...

[Okla-homey]

I've been reading about how the bunch running the Federal executive branch have been blowing unprecedented amounts of money on this year's Census.

Today, I received a letter from the Director of the Census Bureau, some guy named Robert M. Grove, sent first-class, printed in English, Spanish, Korean, Chinese (not sure if Mandarin or Cantonese), Vietnamese, and Russian, advising me I'd get my Census form next week, and that I should dutifully fill it out, and return same when it arrives.

WTF?

I also understand if a household does not return said form, a human being Census worker, must make up to four (4) trips to that address in attempts to get the information.

Now, I ask you, does that seem like bending over backwards to count and derive demographic data on people who are too stupid, high or afraid to be found to fill out a stinking form, stick it in the addressed, postage-paid envelope provided and put it in a mailbox? In other words, potential democrat voters? ;)

[Scott D]

why do you hate lazy people?

[LosAngelesSooner]

You'd know more about this than I, but isn't conducting a census a requirement in the Constitution?

[AlbqSooner]

You'd know more about this than I, but isn't conducting a census a requirement in the Constitution?

The short answer is yes. The Constitution does NOT require all the crap they want to know about you though.

[LosAngelesSooner]

Does the crap help government run more efficiently in the long run?

[Scott D]

What is "No" Alex. The Government couldn't run efficiently if you spotted it the first 10 letters.

[LosAngelesSooner]

Give me a real answer, Scott. Come on...

[SbOrOiNaEnR]

Today, I received a letter from the Director of the Census Bureau, some guy named Robert M. Grove, sent first-class, printed in English, Spanish, Korean, Chinese (not sure if Mandarin or Cantonese), Vietnamese, and Russian, advising me I'd get my Census form next week, and that I should dutifully fill it out, and return same when it arrives.

Got the same form in the mail today, and it REALLY pissed me off, for most of the reasons you already laid out.

[My Opinion Matters]

Is there anything you ****'s don't complain about?

[LosAngelesSooner]

Yes.

Everything that Saint Dubya ever did. 'Cause he was teh awesome.

[Scott D]

Give me a real answer, Scott. Come on...

My answer is still no. I have no faith that it positively influences the distribution of government funds, I question whether or not it accurately redistricts congressional ranges. I highly doubt it accurately represents the numbers it will claim to represent. And finally, I fail to see how it would reduce any of the governmental red tape that they love in DC more than anything, because it justifies not only their existence, but the reason they continue to need to add to their payrolls at the expense of the American taxpayer.

[LosAngelesSooner]

Ah. Cool. Thanks. That's all I was asking for. :)

[Scott D]

My first answer was far better.

[LosAngelesSooner]

From a **** talking perspective, yes. From an "actually answering my question" perspective, no. ;)

[fadada1]

we got it too. save the postage and just send the damn thing... in ENGLISH.

[yermom]

can they not just put that letter with the census form?

anyone know what the 10 questions are?

[fadada1]

1. are you currently alive?
2. counting yourself, how many people are you?
3. do you know where i can get a sooner ringtone?
4. if you were to own a scooter, would you tell anyone?
5. bitches man, bitches.
6. sorry, #5 wasn't actually a question.
7. do you thing sherman was a prick?
8. WAYLT?
9. does the invisible thread still exist?
10. can you take it to the football board?

[Zbird]

What really Pissed me off was that they mailed it out to tell you the census is coming. Duuuuh! When it gets here we'll all know that without the Billions being spent on an unnecessary notice when we're drowning in red ink.

DON'T EFFING GET ME STARTED!

[SicEmBaylor]

The only thing the f'ing government needs to know are how many people are in my household. That's it. As for the rest of it, they can go screw themselves.

[swardboy]

^ This.

[Crucifax Autumn]

One of the questions should be "Are you currently running a meth lab or cooking crack?" just to see how many easy busts they can get thanks to morons.

[JohnnyMack]

I can't wait to receive the census so I can fill out "Jedi" in the religion column.

[Okla-homey]

If they send the letter informing us of the census through the mail and the census is coming through the mail, isn't there the same chance of people opening either letter? I mean, if you're going to throw out the census without opening it, you're probably going to throw out the other letter too. Wasted paper, wasted postage, wasted effort.

zackly.

[Crucifax Autumn]

As a Repub and a person who voted for W twice, this is completely dishonest and inaccurate on your part. I have never met a single repub who wasnt a far right looney who said W didnt make mistakes. I know he made some mistakes, some were out of bullheadedness, some was trusting people around him that he shouldnt have trusted, some for other reasons...I do think he did some good that many dems would never give him credit for because they hate him so much but I understand that he was far from perfect.

The far right loonies might actually be MORE critical of Bush actually, particularly if they are honest about it.

[Collier11]

Yes.

Everything that Saint Dubya ever did. 'Cause he was teh awesome.

As a Repub and a person who voted for W twice, this is completely dishonest and inaccurate on your part. I have never met a single repub who wasnt a far right looney who said W didnt make mistakes. I know he made some mistakes, some were out of bullheadedness, some was trusting people around him that he shouldnt have trusted, some for other reasons...I do think he did some good that many dems would never give him credit for because they hate him so much but I understand that he was far from perfect.

[Okla-homey]

From the letter:
"Your response is important. Results from the 2010 Census will be used to help each community get its fair share of government funds for highways, schools, health care facilities, and many other programs you and your neighbors need. Without a complete, accurate census, your community may not receive its fair share."

From the Constitution:
"The actual Enumeration shall be made within three Years after the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States, and within every subsequent Term of ten Years, in such Manner as they shall by Law direct."

One is in the Constitution the other isn't. One promises you goodies, the other doesn't. One is correct, the other is propaganda to sell you the lie that government solves all ills.

Sorry, I know I'm up on the soap box. But I don't want the government to give me things. I want it to take less in taxes and only do what is needed and what my neighbors and I can't do, like build interstate highways, aircraft carriers and intercontinental ballistic missiles.

[proud gonzo]

If they send the letter informing us of the census through the mail and the census is coming through the mail, isn't there the same chance of people opening either letter? I mean, if you're going to throw out the census without opening it, you're probably going to throw out the other letter too. Wasted paper, wasted postage, wasted effort.

[Chuck Bao]

Today, I received a letter from the Director of the Census Bureau, some guy named Robert M. Grove, sent first-class, printed in English, Spanish, Korean, Chinese (not sure if Mandarin or Cantonese), Vietnamese, and Russian, advising me I'd get my Census form next week, and that I should dutifully fill it out, and return same when it arrives.

WTF?

Why? No love for the Thai/Lao population? No Arabic? No Hindi? No Urdu? No Farsi? No Tagalog? I suppose all of the Japanese and German-Americans can read English, probably with better comprehension skills than the other hyphened Americans, including Redneck and Hillbilly-Americans. :O

And, Homey, I think if it is printed, then it is just Chinese. Mandarin and Cantonese are dialects and only pronounce the simplified Chinese characters adopted by the PRC differently. ;)

I'm just jealous because I am not getting one. The County Election Board has my address and automatically mails me all ballots, so I can vote absentee. So, how do they count the US military serving overseas?

[Okla-homey]

So, how do they count the US military serving overseas?

I imagine the DoD will figure out something. Perhaps just provide the info to the Census since the DoD well knows who is assigned overseas, as well as all requested demographic data as to members and their dependents accompanying them.

[NormanPride]

1. How was your day?
2. What's that thing over there?
3. Who is your daddy?
4. What does he do?
5. Where are you going?
6. Are you coming back?
7. If you die, can I have your stereo?
8. What's a dikfer?
9. What did you eat that for?
10. Do you smell fresh bread?

[sooner n houston]

I think I will add about ten people to my count. Maybe we all should, get more money back into the hillbilly state! :D

[badger]

An example of Census waste arrived in the mail yesterday - we had two envelopes addressed to us labeled "current resident."

I mean, TWO! What is it, one for each of us, or something? Our joint tax returns not enough of a clue that you just have to send one, or is one a pet census?

:D

[NormanPride]

Actually, the other was addressed to John and Lou, I believe. So that was a screwup by the mail carrier. :D Our mail carriers are pretty crap...

[badger]

Actually, the other was addressed to John and Lou, I believe. So that was a screwup by the mail carrier. :D Our mail carriers are pretty crap...

Mkay... sorry Census. You don't suck after all. Just your ads do. Gawd, your ads suck.

[NormanPride]

Indeed. They are terribad.

[Scott D]

even Ed Begley Jr. deserves some work.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Why are y'all dissing on the government's new jobs plan? More overpaid envelope stuffers is just what we need to get this country back on its feet.

[LosAngelesSooner]

As a Repub and a person who voted for W twice, this is completely dishonest and inaccurate on your part. I have never met a single repub who wasnt a far right looney who said W didnt make mistakes. I know he made some mistakes, some were out of bullheadedness, some was trusting people around him that he shouldnt have trusted, some for other reasons...I do think he did some good that many dems would never give him credit for because they hate him so much but I understand that he was far from perfect.Do you feel that I would put you in the same category as RLiMC and Tuba?

Trust me...it wasn't inaccurate in the way I intended it. And I certainly wasn't putting you into that category any more than I would put myself in that category.

[Collier11]

well you made a blanket statement, or atleast thats the way I took it

[SanJoaquinSooner]

The only thing the f'ing government needs to know are how many people are in my household. That's it. As for the rest of it, they can go screw themselves.

How many people are in your household?

[yermom]

.5

[C&CDean]

Well I'm glad to see the USPS is delivering as usual and everyone is getting their forms on time. Be sure to mail them all back, and if you really want to make a difference, buy a stamp and put it over the "no postage necessary" printing in the upper right corner. Thanks in advance.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

One of the questions should be "Are you currently running a meth lab or cooking crack?" just to see how many easy busts they can get thanks to morons.You've reason to believe their supply is running low?

[TopDawg]

Well I'm glad to see the USPS is delivering as usual and everyone is getting their forms on time. Be sure to mail them all back, and if you really want to make a difference, buy a stamp and put it over the "no postage necessary" printing in the upper right corner. Thanks in advance.

Another government official trying to get more money out of us.

[C&CDean]

Wrong again TD. While your taxdollars are paying for the Census, they don't pay a ****ing dime to the USPS. Mail early, mail often...

[SicEmBaylor]

How many people are in your household?

Who the hell revolted and made you the government?

None of your damned business.

[Collier11]

the real interesting question would be how many people are in SJSs household, lol

[LosAngelesSooner]

well you made a blanket statement, or atleast thats the way I took itI made a snarky comment.

And don't take my blanket.

[Collier11]

im sure you are more of a snuggy type of fella

[SunnySooner]

At this point, why couldn't this whole mess be handled online? If I can do all my banking there, why can't I tell Uncle Sam how many peeps are sucking air in my house? What is this, 1990? Send the counters out after those few thousand left that don't have regular innerwebz access, and get the thing over with quickly and efficiently.

[Collier11]

how are they gonna track every persons email though?

[Okla-homey]

At this point, why couldn't this whole mess be handled online? If I can do all my banking there, why can't I tell Uncle Sam how many peeps are sucking air in my house? What is this, 1990? Send the counters out after those few thousand left that don't have regular innerwebz access, and get the thing over with quickly and efficiently.

Puh-leeze. An on-line Census would disadvantage the poor, illiterate and the non-computer savvy. Which would mean they wouldn't get counted, and democrat-heavy Congressional districts would shrink or be cut-out in the ensuing re-apportionment.

Remember, the Census, per our Constitution, exists for one reason and one reason only; to derive how many representatives a state gets, and the boundaries of those congressional districts.

And while we're at it, we can't vote on-line for precisely the same reason. Notwithstanding it could be done more securely than the wink-and-nod way poll workers handle in-person voting in far too many places nowadays. Simply put, likely democrat, indigent voters would be disadvantaged in that they would be the ones who would have to get to a polling place, while folks with the money, and who actually pay taxes, would be disproportionately represented because they have computer skillz.

[colleyvillesooner]

1. How was your day?
2. What's that thing over there?
3. Who is your daddy?
4. What does he do?
5. Where are you going?
6. Are you coming back?
7. If you die, can I have your stereo?
8. What's a dikfer?
9. What did you eat that for?
10. Do you smell fresh bread?


Kindergarten cop spek.

[Okla-homey]

A census taker once tried to test me. I ate his liver with some fava beans and a nice chianti.

http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/9547/thesilenceofthelambsant.jpg

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Who the hell revolted and made you the government?


We the people.
;)

[OULenexaman]

That was funny Homey....just wait till you see all the TV ads coming on all the networks...they spent milllions more to come....

[SanJoaquinSooner]

the real interesting question would be how many people are in SJSs household, lol

We have a four bedroom house, so I believe we're legally allowed 8 people. Yes, that's the number.

[OULenexaman]

Oh....I forgot to mention....did you know that an advertising firm based in Chicago did the work you will see shortly on TV??? True story...

[Collier11]

We have a four bedroom house, so I believe we're legally allowed 8 people. Yes, that's the number.

heh

[TopDawg]

Wrong again TD. While your taxdollars are paying for the Census, they don't pay a ****ing dime to the USPS. Mail early, mail often...

Wrong again, Dean. I'm talking about the money from the unnecessary stamp.

[C&CDean]

Stamps are necessary. How the hell do you think your Auntie Gertrude sends out birthday cards?

Now go buy a couple rolls or sheets. It works even better if you just collect them and don't stick them on anything.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

The far right loonies might actually be MORE critical of Bush actually, particularly if they are honest about it.What constitutes Far Right Looniness, IYHO?

[yermom]

What constitutes Far Right Looniness, IYHO?

http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/member.php?u=39714

[NormanPride]

Oh....I forgot to mention....did you know that an advertising firm based in Chicago did the work you will see shortly on TV??? True story...

That's not too strange. Many of the best firms able to handle this kind of thing are in Chicago.

[TopDawg]

Stamps are necessary. How the hell do you think your Auntie Gertrude sends out birthday cards?

Now go buy a couple rolls or sheets. It works even better if you just collect them and don't stick them on anything.

Just for your stubborness, I'm going to save the census return envelope until it's time to send Auntie Gertrude her birthday card. Then I'll stealthily replace the Census Bureau address with her address.

[OklahomaTuba]

Does anyone else count their pets & fav bottles of scotch as part of the household?? Or is it just me???

[C&CDean]

Just for your stubborness, I'm going to save the census return envelope until it's time to send Auntie Gertrude her birthday card. Then I'll stealthily replace the Census Bureau address with her address.

Works for me. Hell, you already paid for postage on that envelope with your tax $$ whether you use it or not.

[Crucifax Autumn]

What constitutes Far Right Looniness, IYHO?

People who make Hitler look like Jerry Brown.

[SicEmBaylor]

I have a question for Dean.

Is it true that if you reverse the addresses on an envelope and mail it without a stamp that it'll be "returned" to the person you're intending to sending it to thus successfully cheating the system?

[Crucifax Autumn]

I like when I get lucky and the postmark doesn't actually mark the stamp.

[C&CDean]

I have a question for Dean.

Is it true that if you reverse the addresses on an envelope and mail it without a stamp that it'll be "returned" to the person you're intending to sending it to thus successfully cheating the system?

Try it, and the Inspection Service will hunt you down like a dog and cut your throat while you sleep.

[Crucifax Autumn]

That's cool as long as they take video footage so we can all munch popcorn and enjoy the show.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

People who make Hitler look like Jerry Brown.Pol Pot, Stalin, Idi Amin? Your criteria for right-wing loony?

[ELP Sooner]

How many people were living in your residence on April 1, 2010?

Were there any additional people living at your residence on April 1, 2010 that you did not include in Question 1?

Do you live in a house, apartment, or mobile home?

What is your phone number?

What is your name (last, first, middle initial)?

What is your gender?

What is your age on April 1, 2010 and what is your birthday?

Are you Latino, Hispanic, or Spanish origin?

What is your race?

Do you sometimes stay at or live at another residence (for example: military base, college dorm, jail)?

If you live alone, you are finished with the 2010 Census. If there are others living in the household with you, you will need to provide the following information on them: name, age, race, gender, date of birth, relation to you, living tenure.

[Collier11]

answer the 1st question then put it in the mail

[TopDawg]

Works for me. Hell, you already paid for postage on that envelope with your tax $$ whether you use it or not.

But it'll be nice to have the extra 44 cents I would've spent on Gertrude's card. If I pull off that trick again in 2020 and 2030, I will have saved enough for a lotto ticket. I'm gonna get rich off the USPS!

[Crucifax Autumn]

Pol Pot, Stalin, Idi Amin? Your criteria for right-wing loony?

It's not that complicated, and neither is the concept of an extreme left wing loony. There's the standard range of Americans that can run the full gamut from Hitleresque to Staliesque. People that don't fall into that VERY wide spectrum I feel pretty safe calling "loony".

If Beck and Limgaugh say "Holy sh*t, that guy's way out there!" about someone so far to their right that they are actually frightened by them, that is a Loony.

If Olberman and Franken say "Holy sh*t, that guy's way out there!" about someone so far to their left that they are actually frightened by them, that is a Loony.

A healthy conservative or healthy liberal drifts a bit to center or leans heavily to their side, I understand it. Leaning so far they fall out of the deep end and into the bottomless sea of crazy and conspiracy is totally ununderstandable.

[Crucifax Autumn]

How many people were living in your residence on April 1, 2010?


Do I have to include the dead hookers in the basement?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

It's not that complicated, and neither is the concept of an extreme left wing loony. There's the standard range of Americans that can run the full gamut from Hitleresque to Staliesque. People that don't fall into that VERY wide spectrum I feel pretty safe calling "loony".

If Beck and Limgaugh say "Holy sh*t, that guy's way out there!" about someone so far to their right that they are actually frightened by them, that is a Loony.

If Olberman and Franken say "Holy sh*t, that guy's way out there!" about someone so far to their left that they are actually frightened by them, that is a Loony.

A healthy conservative or healthy liberal drifts a bit to center or leans heavily to their side, I understand it. Leaning so far they fall out of the deep end and into the bottomless sea of crazy and conspiracy is totally ununderstandable.All the despots are/were guys who wanted/had total control over their populace, without checks and balances. They are all leftists. We've had exhaustive threads on this, with some saying that if the govt. doesn't actually own the economic entity, but only totally controls it, that is extreme right.

Limbaugh agrees with my definition, that he is right wing. Right wing in America is a Constructionist, the opposite of authoritarian,-not a despot like Hitler. Left wing is govt. control, whether by actual ownership or simple authoritarian control.

I think some on this board believe that an America that would have a State Religion, would be run by Right Wing Extremists. Maybe that definition works. It's prohibited by the First amendment, and I believe it's ludicrous to think that to be likely. Is this what you mean by "too far to the right"?

[TopDawg]

Do I have to include the dead hookers in the basement?

If they're dead, they're not living.

[Okla-homey]

Consider again the languages, in addition to English, chosen for said letter that inspired this thread.

Cuban, Red Chinese, North Korean, Vietnamese, and former Soviet Union.

You can't make this stuff up folks. Maybe the loonies are right about this guy.;)

[SCOUT]

Stamps are necessary. How the hell do you think your Auntie Gertrude sends out birthday cards?

Now go buy a couple rolls or sheets. It works even better if you just collect them and don't stick them on anything.

How about just sending back an envelope full of rocks to all of those prepaid postage bulk mail items?

[soonerloyal]

Let's see, not a bit bothered by the census in any year Obama wasn't President...check. Not bothered by waste of paper under any previous Administrations...check. No feathers ruffled when census asked the same damn questions in W's 2000..check. Didn't bat an eyelash when freedoms were really threatened, before BHO again, of course...check.

Yep. Reactionary Right, Pavloving again like clockwork. :rolleyes:

[SoonerInKCMO]

Clinton was president in 2000.

[SCOUT]

Clinton was president in 2000.

Heh

[soonerloyal]

Yep. effed up that'un.

Still, didja whine like stuck pigs under any GOPs when they was a-countin'?

Reactionary drooling. Every time the Fox buzzer sounds...

[SCOUT]

Yep. effed up that'un.

Still, didja whine like stuck pigs under any GOPs when they was a-countin'?

Reactionary drooling. Every time the Fox buzzer sounds...

I bet many on this board were indeed drooling, but not for the reasons you are putting forth. Just admit that you tried to make a political attack and it backfired. It is ok.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

http://2010.census.gov/2010census/how/interactive-form.php


They've tweeked the ethnicity and race questions (8 and 9) but they're still a work in "progress."

consider if your heritage is an indigenous tribe of Mexico. You may think, "well I'm not "Hispanic/latino/Spanish" but I am of Mexican heritage."

And then on question 9 what race would you check? California defines American Indian as heritage of an indigenous tribe in North, Central, or South America. I'm not sure what the U.S. is expecting.

Honestly, in California, half the people appear to be multiracial. And now question 9 says check one or more boxes. I guess that accommodates those who might be half indonesian and half jamaican.... well maybe the census needs two or more "others"

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I bet many on this board were indeed drooling, but not for the reasons you are putting forth. Just admit that you tried to make a political attack and it backfired. It is ok.She prolly meant the Census of 2005.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Has anyone reading this sent in the Census form with only the first question answered? Any reaction from the govt?

[Okla-homey]

Let's see, not a bit bothered by the census in any year Obama wasn't President...check. Not bothered by waste of paper under any previous Administrations...check. No feathers ruffled when census asked the same damn questions in W's 2000..check. Didn't bat an eyelash when freedoms were really threatened, before BHO again, of course...check.

Yep. Reactionary Right, Pavloving again like clockwork. :rolleyes:

As I recall, there were no wasteful, advance, "we're going to send you a census form" mailings like the one I lamented in 2000 or 1990.

And I don't recall any specific instances of attempted "freedom-threatening" before the current occupant of the White House took up residence. Except for Clinton's abortive attempt to "reform" health care which set-up the GOP takeover of Congress during WJC's first-term.

You can snipe at those who haven't drunk the BHO Kool-aid, but the fact is, the guy is fiddling while the unemployment rate is burning down this country.

[Crucifax Autumn]

This whole census thing could be more complicated than it seems at first glance. Earlier today my wife couldn't remember for sure how old she is and had to add our daughter's age to 21 to get it straight.

[TopDawg]

And I don't recall any specific instances of attempted "freedom-threatening" before the current occupant of the White House took up residence.

"Attempted freedom threatening." Now there's a great term. Could be the next WMD. "These people are guilty of multiple counts of AFT!!! BURN THEM!!!"

What specific instances of AFT have you seen under the current occupant of the White House and can you explain to someone who wasn't into politics when Clinton was in office how his acts were examples of AFT?

[Crucifax Autumn]

Arrogant Fart Tamer?

I'm 'fused!

[yermom]

Consider again the languages, in addition to English, chosen for said letter that inspired this thread.

Cuban, Red Chinese, North Korean, Vietnamese, and former Soviet Union.

You can't make this stuff up folks. Maybe the loonies are right about this guy.;)

would you rather not count the people in the US that don't read English, or read it well?

is the letter kinda retarded? yes

i still don't get all of the outrage

isn't this form way more streamlined than the previous one?

[My Opinion Matters]

Puh-leeze. An on-line Census would disadvantage the poor, illiterate and the non-computer savvy. Which would mean they wouldn't get counted, and democrat-heavy Congressional districts would shrink or be cut-out in the ensuing re-apportionment.

Remember, the Census, per our Constitution, exists for one reason and one reason only; to derive how many representatives a state gets, and the boundaries of those congressional districts.

And while we're at it, we can't vote on-line for precisely the same reason. Notwithstanding it could be done more securely than the wink-and-nod way poll workers handle in-person voting in far too many places nowadays. Simply put, likely democrat, indigent voters would be disadvantaged in that they would be the ones who would have to get to a polling place, while folks with the money, and who actually pay taxes, would be disproportionately represented because they have computer skillz.

Indigents don't count as real people. Got it.

[tommieharris91]

Indigents don't count as real people. Got it.

They're only 60% of a person.

[Okla-homey]

Indigents don't count as real people. Got it.

They're people indeed, but too often people who made lots of bad life choices, and thus their judgment is questionable. Not exactly my definition of your ideal electorate.;)

[Okla-homey]

"Attempted freedom threatening." Now there's a great term. Could be the next WMD. "These people are guilty of multiple counts of AFT!!! BURN THEM!!!"

What specific instances of AFT have you seen under the current occupant of the White House and can you explain to someone who wasn't into politics when Clinton was in office how his acts were examples of AFT?

This whole obsessive-compulsive attempt to nationalize health care and get between you, your doctor and the insurance company with which you have a contractual relationship comes to mind.

How about the notion contained within the bill requiring people, under penalty, who are breathing, and who can afford it, to buy health insurance.

How about giving the Supreme Court hell on national TV for holding that Americans who choose to form a group to pursue a particular goal (a/k/a "corporation) should not be constrained in the amount of money they can spend exercising their First Amendment rights to support or criticize a candidate for public office?

More generally, his firmly held view, as published in his books, that folks with bucks must subsidize those with less bucks?

The notion that government is the answer to social ills.

[TopDawg]

This whole obsessive-compulsive attempt to nationalize health care and get between you, your doctor and the insurance company with which you have a contractual relationship comes to mind.

How about the notion contained within the bill requiring people, under penalty, who are breathing, and who can afford it, to buy health insurance.

How about giving the Supreme Court hell on national TV for holding that Americans who choose to form a group to pursue a particular goal (a/k/a "corporation) should not be constrained in the amount of money they can spend exercising their First Amendment rights to support or criticize a candidate for public office?

More generally, his firmly held view, as published in his books, that folks with bucks must subsidize those with less bucks?

The notion that government is the answer to social ills.

So these are attempts at freedom threatening, but you can't think of any previous attempts other than Clinton's?

Perhaps in a few months, when May 21 comes around, your "Good Morning" thread can be a reflection on Bush's "[t]here ought to be limits to freedom" quote in response to his attempts to shut down a satirical website poking fun at him. Looks like Obama is just agreeing with Bush.

[tommieharris91]

The only thing the f'ing government needs to know are how many people are in my household. That's it. As for the rest of it, they can go screw themselves.

That's funny. Every Congress since 1790 apparently didn't see it this way.