The mega-gigantor things Mike Leach thread

[OKLA21FAN]

suspended for pulling a 'Mangino'? :gary:

(either that or a TTech buddy is playing a good practical joke on me)

[Phil]

Just saw it on ESPN bottom line.

[BoulderSooner79]

it said treatment of player injury -- must have poked the guy really hard.

[Phil]

http://www.redraiders.com/2009/12/28/leach-suspended/

[Phil]

Supposedly made a player with a concussion do some stuff he shouldn't have, according to the Tech Scout site message board.

[TMcGee86]

This is beyond weak. Yet another program unhappy with a guy they can't control and instead of just firing him they look for anything to blow up to force him out.

I hope he quits and moves on. Nothing would make my happier than seeing sand aggy suck again and seeing Leach move on to greener pastures.

[Viking Kitten]

From the AP wire:


LUBBOCK, Texas (AP) - Texas Tech coach Mike Leach has been
suspended while the school investigates complaints from a player
and his family about treatment after an injury.
The school said in a release Monday defensive coordinator Ruffin
McNeil will be the interim coach and lead the team in the Alamo
Bowl on Jan. 2 against Michigan State.
McNeil will remain in charge of the team until the investigation
is complete.
The Red Raiders went 8-4 this season.

[PLaw]

This is beyond weak. Yet another program unhappy with a guy they can't control and instead of just firing him they look for anything to blow up to force him out.

I hope he quits and moves on. Nothing would make my happier than seeing sand aggy suck again and seeing Leach move on to greener pastures.

You would need to understand Gerald Myers to understand the rest of the story. As a TTU alumni, I witnessed the Myers Mafia first hand living on the same dorm floor as the b-ball team in the early 80's. Myers played ball at TTU, then coached, and finally was elevated to AD when his mid-50's coaching style could not compete in the modern era of college hoops. While Myers is the "winningest" B-ball coach at TTU, he averaged only winning 16 games per year.

A native of Borger, he has been in Lubbock since the mid-50's except for a few years as an assistant coach at Houston Baptist in the 60's.

Leach has done more for TTU than any coach in history of the school and Myers knows it. Donations and revenue are way up. He is just not a "suck up" which obviously rubs Myers the wrong way. Myers and Leach are like the same poles of a magnet which will ultimately drive Leach out of Lubbock because Myers isn't going anywhere.

BOOMER

[soonerlaw]

Probably a rumor, but someone said the player was Craig James' son.

[TMcGee86]

Next year is shaping up to be a great year. With KU and TTU out of the way we should steam roll the Big12 and now we dont have to worry about facing FLA in the BCSCG.

No.8 is all but guaranteed. ;)

[spatton713]

wow leach really?

[Collier11]

Cant wait, cant wait, cant wait for Leach to publicly speak about this, its gonna be great

[Leroy Lizard]

This is beyond weak.

We won't know that until we find out what happened. It sounds like a player was injured and the coach forced him to perform certain duties that injured the player further. But even that is speculation.

[Collier11]

It sounds like another case of players being big babies so the player got a hold of his big name dad to take care of the issue

[Leroy Lizard]

Not to speculate, or anything.

[SoonerInLubbock]

Probably a rumor, but someone said the player was Craig James' son.


Thats the rumor here in Lubbock. Apparently Leach locked him in a shed for the duration of practice,lol. :pop:

[Rogue]

Yeah, ESPN just said something about an injured player being isolated for a few hours in a shed or closet or something.

[SouthFortySooner]

Stoops to Lubbock.

[Rogue]

Stoops to Lubbock: "No, thanks."
Fixed.

[ndpruitt03]

Sounds like Leach's days in Lubbock are done.

http://deadspin.com/5435755/mike-leach-walks-the-plank-update

[colleyvillesooner]

Player wouldn't practice after mild concussion. Spent 3 hours in the training room, then days later, time in an electrical closet.

Craig James son. Leach is ****ed if true.

[StoopTroup]

Leach has a Law Degree....I'm pretty sure he's got the upper hand on this one.

[Leroy Lizard]

Unless he's trying to be his own lawyer. What's the old saying?

[StoopTroup]

Sounds like Leach's days in Lubbock are done.

http://deadspin.com/5435755/mike-leach-walks-the-plank-update

Post from that link....lol


I've heard that the player in question had a broken hand and a scratched cornea.

Leach had a hook put in the cast and made the guy wear an eye patch with a skull and cross bones on it...then stand around practice going, "Arrrrghhh...harder ya scurvy dogs."

[StoopTroup]

Unless he's trying to be his own lawyer. What's the old saying?

Never put your lizard in a shark tank?

[Explodo]

Leach was just trying to make the guy comfortable while having him close to the practice field...Plus Craig JAmes was pissed his son was an aggie...This may not kill leach dead...but it'll definately be used to slime him.

Anyone know if the HOuston Chronicle is a TEch hater or lover? If the Chronicle is a consitant tech hater...I would view this as a minor event...Bevo Papers love to spin against their rivals.

[ouwasp]

well, I hope Mike quits on those sand aggies. Hope the James boy is okay too.

[Explodo]

SO the only thing being alleged is the james kid had to sit in a shed during practice?

Am I wrong on that?

[OKLA21FAN]

SO the only thing being alleged is the james kid had to sit in a shed during practice?

Am I wrong on that?


'time out' instead of hitting. Mike has been watching supernanny!

[SoonerBacker]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/ncaa/12/28/ttu-leach.ap/index.html?xid=si_ncaaf#

This confirms that it was Craig James' son.

[Leroy Lizard]

Maybe the issue was serious. Craig James was a great player himself, so he knows what football is all about. If Craig is upset, I would tend to think it isn't over some trivial matter. But we'll see.

[Explodo]

I'm Craig JAmes B*tch!

[King Barry's Back]

My God, no matter how serious the charge, if I went crying to my Mom and Dad and begged them to please get my coach fired because he had hurt my feelers, I wouldn't be able to show my face again.

And that this strategy has been successful in two cases in two months is actually sickening to me. And in both of these cases, the coaches involved are arguably the best that held a whistle at those two schools.

Is it too much for 20-yr olds to act like men, and either transfer, or get their own lawyer?

Maybe I'm looking at this wrong, as my folks are not big-time ESPN sports deities, but I swear I'd feel like the biggest jerk on earth.

[John Kochtoston]

ESPN is quoting Leach's lawyer, so Michael Leach, Esq. did not pull the cardinal sin of lawyering.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Craig James was one of the highest paid players on the SMU roster

[royalfan5]

My God, no matter how serious the charge, if I went crying to my Mom and Dad and begged them to please get my coach fired because he had hurt my feelers, I wouldn't be able to show my face again.

And that this strategy has been successful in two cases in two months is actually sickening to me. And in both of these cases, the coaches involved are arguably the best that held a whistle at those two schools.

Is it too much for 20-yr olds to act like men, and either transfer, or get their own lawyer?

Maybe I'm looking at this wrong, as my folks are not big-time ESPN sports deities, but I swear I'd feel like the biggest jerk on earth.

On the other hand is it too much to expect million dollar coaches to act like reasonable human beings?

[Explodo]

SO what was unreasonable about giving the kid a place to be in the dark and on the practice field?

[btk108]

Craig James was one of the highest paid players on the SMU roster

:D

[OUinFLA]

Leach to OU

I bet he would be a great OC

[Rogue]

If true, Leach is done for sure in Lubbock.

The issue is humiliating a hurt kid which has the, arguably intended, effect of discouraging other hurt kids from acting hurt, not practicing, and not playing.

It wouldn't be too much to ask these coaches to act like human beings if we paid them like human beings. But when their multi-million dollar gigs depend on the health of 19 year olds...we should expect them to jeopardize the kids' health from time to time in the interest of preserving the hugeass salary they're pulling down.

Edit: Yeah, I get the contradiction there, but I also get what Ithink I meant to mean I said. ;)

Why keep being surprised by rich athletes, coaches, golfers, etc who act like spoiled rich dudes?

[ashley]

:D

There is more truth to that than you would ever know. That is another can of worms. You think you know all about SMU but there is much more.

[Leroy Lizard]

My God, no matter how serious the charge, if I went crying to my Mom and Dad and begged them to please get my coach fired because he had hurt my feelers, I wouldn't be able to show my face again.

Do we know that is what happened? Or did the kid just mention it to his dad, who then took up the cause?


And that this strategy has been successful in two cases in two months is actually sickening to me. And in both of these cases, the coaches involved are arguably the best that held a whistle at those two schools.

Another way of looking at is to note that no coach can abuse players, no matter how successful. I mean, do we look the other way because of a coach's won/loss record?


Is it too much for 20-yr olds to act like men, and either transfer, or get their own lawyer?

Here, I agree. Once you walk on a campus, I don't want to hear from your parents. (For example, I have never talked to a parent about their son or daughter while teaching in college. Not once, nor will I.)

[Leroy Lizard]

SO what was unreasonable about giving the kid a place to be in the dark and on the practice field?

Depends on the motive. If it was to humiliate, then that smacks of 1960 or, even worse, SmellsOfBourbon.

However, if it was designed with the best interests of the athlete in mind, then that is entirely different.

We'll just have to wait and see.

[Explodo]

Also depends on the kid and if he was being a distraction on the practice field...True?

[Scott D]

I'm pretty sure that ESPN will get Mike fired, no matter what.

[BoulderSooner79]

The banner on ESPN says Leach is fighting this which Mangino never did.

EDIT: Mangino was never suspended, but he went quietly with the resignation/buyout/dismissal.

[Leroy Lizard]

If he was being a distraction (which I am not sure what that would even look like), why not just send him to the showers?

I can see using a brig on a convicted criminal, but a college student?


I'm pretty sure that ESPN will get Mike fired, no matter what.

I doubt ESPN can get Mike fired, and I doubt even more that they are going to take up Craig James' cause.

[AlbqSooner]

In the link Phil posted it says that Leach was given until Monday to apologize, which he did not do. It also says Leach said the kid (who he did not name) was something of a malinger and the kid's dad was like a little league dad.

Gotta love Mike on this one.

[Scott D]

tongue..in...cheek

[AlbqSooner]

If he was being a distraction (which I am not sure what that would even look like), why not just send him to the showers?

I can see using a brig on a convicted criminal, but a college student?



I doubt ESPN can get Mike fired, and I doubt even more that they are going to take up Craig James' cause.

Two more reasons you and I disagree.

[Leroy Lizard]

Okay, but could you elaborate?

[OUinFLA]

Edit: Yeah, I get the contradiction there, but I also get what Ithink I meant to mean I said. ;)



ok, you confused me with that one.

[olevetonahill]

Leach has always been pretty Blunt
I can see him doing this if he thinks the kids just goofin off.

I can see his Press conference now.

"If they want to Coddle these Kids and make pussies of em . then Im the wrong coach for this place "

[Oldnslo]

If Leach is axed, I'd expect him to be out of work for perhaps an attosecond.

[Dio]

"Happiness is Lubbock, texas in my rearview mirror..."

[delhalew]

What a freakin' weird football season.

[AlbqSooner]

Okay, but could you elaborate?

I disagree that Leach was using a brig.

I don't doubt that ESPN can get Leach Fired.

I don't doubt that ESPN will take up Craig James Banner in this.

While I recognize that constitutes three reasons where I said two, my reference was to the two sentences which contained those statements.

Elaborate enough for you?

[King Barry's Back]

On the other hand is it too much to expect million dollar coaches to act like reasonable human beings?

You exactly missed my point. I was speaking to grown men crying to their fathers. I found a nice article on redraiders.com. Key quote: "During the university’s initial investigation, Leach said the player was a slacker and his father was always calling and acting like a Little League dad."

UPDATE 4: LEACH SUSPENDED
By Don Williams on December 28th, 2009 181 Comments Printer-Friendly
Tech football coach Mike Leach was suspended for ordering a player to stand in shed at the Tech football practice facility for two hours, then repeating the punishment two days later because he felt the player was faking an injury that happened during practice on Dec. 16, the Avalanche-Journal has learned.

A source told the A-J Leach did not dispute the facts, brought to the university’s attention by the player and his parent.

Leach had until Monday to write an apology and when he did not, the university felt it had to take action.

“This was not taken lightly,” the source said, adding that Leach did not show any signs of remorse or did not say he wouldn’t do it again.
The player suffered a concussion at practice on Dec. 16 and Leach thought the player was faking.

The next day at practice, the player was ordered to stand in a shed. Leach had him watched and when he sat down, Leach had things removed from the shed so he could not sit down.

Two days later, Leach had the player stand in a dark room for three hours.

During the university’s initial investigation, Leach said the player was a slacker and his father was always calling and acting like a Little League dad.

This story will be updated as more information is available. We will also post updates at twitter.com/AJSports.

[King Barry's Back]

If true, Leach is done for sure in Lubbock.

The issue is humiliating a hurt kid which has the, arguably intended, effect of discouraging other hurt kids from acting hurt, not practicing, and not playing.

It wouldn't be too much to ask these coaches to act like human beings if we paid them like human beings. But when their multi-million dollar gigs depend on the health of 19 year olds...we should expect them to jeopardize the kids' health from time to time in the interest of preserving the hugeass salary they're pulling down.

Edit: Yeah, I get the contradiction there, but I also get what Ithink I meant to mean I said. ;)

Why keep being surprised by rich athletes, coaches, golfers, etc who act like spoiled rich dudes?

I understand you made the edit, but what's not clear to me here is, which is the spoiled rich dude? Leach or the James kid?

[Leroy Lizard]

I disagree that Leach was using a brig.

Well, neither one of us knows for sure.


I don't doubt that ESPN can get Leach Fired.

Exactly how would they go about doing that?


I don't doubt that ESPN will take up Craig James Banner in this.

To gain what?

ESPN is in the business to make money. I doubt they care about Craig James' problems with his kid. And even if they did, I am not sure what they could do to get Leach fired.

[Leroy Lizard]

The player suffered a concussion at practice on Dec. 16 and Leach thought the player was faking.

Leach should be old enough by now to know that whether a player has a concussion is up to the team's doctor to decide.

[olevetonahill]

LL has any one ever told you that you come across as ONE JUDGMENTAL PRICK ?

[Leroy Lizard]

Okay, okay... I'll change my argument:

"Leach should not be old enough by now to know that whether a player has a concussion is up to the team's doctor to decide."

Does that make you feel better?

[AlbqSooner]

When I was a medic in the Air Force I sometimes accompanied the Flight Surgeon as he made sick call at the brig. I know for sure what a brig is. I also know what a shed is. A shed does not resemble a brig. Two hours standing in a shed does not equate to brig time.

Hence, one of us knows for sure that Leach did not use a brig unless that Avalance-Journal inadvertently referred to a shed when it meant to say brig.

The power of ESPN is sufficient to get Leach or almost any other coach fired or retained. That is my opinion. You disagree. Hence you made my point that we disagree.

Oh, and you come across as ONE JUDGEMENTAL PRICK.

Now they have Vet.:D

[bstuff1979]

http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n172/wbennettberry/leachgonenuts.jpg

I'd hate to see Leach go, but I can tell you that it'll be the best press conf since Jim Mora's "PLAYOFFS?!?!?" rant. Given the accusations, and supposing that there's anything to them, I'd have to say that Tech would be well within reason to let him go.

[Sooner Eclipse]

We don't know the timeline on this stuff. How many days after the concussion was he still refusing to practice? Also, sound as if team docs may have OK'd the kid and he refused or personal docs disagreed with the team docs. But if team docs say good to go, then the kid should go, or not show up to practice. He shouldn't show up in sunglasses claiming that they are doctors orders. They clearly weren't team doctors orders.

[olevetonahill]

When I was a medic in the Air Force I sometimes accompanied the Flight Surgeon as he made sick call at the brig. I know for sure what a brig is. I also know what a shed is. A shed does not resemble a brig. Two hours standing in a shed does not equate to brig time.

Hence, one of us knows for sure that Leach did not use a brig unless that Avalance-Journal inadvertently referred to a shed when it meant to say brig.

The power of ESPN is sufficient to get Leach or almost any other coach fired or retained. That is my opinion. You disagree. Hence you made my point that we disagree.

Oh, and you come across as ONE JUDGEMENTAL PRICK.

Now they have Vet.:D

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

[Zbird]

Argghh. Maybe there's a pirate in Florida's future.

[King Barry's Back]

If he was being a distraction (which I am not sure what that would even look like), why not just send him to the showers?


Well, gosh, you know, I'm not Mike Leach, but I'll take a stab at it.

He told the kid to go stand in a dark quiet place because he thought the kid was gold bricking. He thought the kid was spoiled, and was an appendage of an over protective father (Bomar Sr on steroids), and he was trying to shame the kid into being tougher and trying harder to fight through his injuries.

He didn't "force" young Mr James to go in there, Leach lacks that power -- unless he is armed at practice. At worst, Leach could take away James's scholarship, but the James family doesn't seem to be hurtin', you know what I mean?

By sending James to "the showers," he'd basically be giving him a free day off.

Isn't it funny that one of the most outrageous coaches in the history of college sports, who was fired for his lack of anger management, was hired to cocah basketball in Lubbock, by the same AD?

[Leroy Lizard]

When I was a medic in the Air Force I sometimes accompanied the Flight Surgeon as he made sick call at the brig. I know for sure what a brig is. I also know what a shed is. A shed does not resemble a brig. Two hours standing in a shed does not equate to brig time.

You made a fool of yourself with "minor nit" and now you're going after "brig." What's with you?

I once said that a player was in the doghouse with a coach. But he wasn't really in a dog's house. There was no structure that usually housed a dog for which the player was confined.

Criminy!!! Do I have to place quotes around "brig" to clue you in on the fact that I wasn't using the term in its strictest use?


The power of ESPN is sufficient to get Leach or almost any other coach fired or retained.

And I asked you how they would even go about doing that. You are the head of ESPN and one of your anchormen has troubles with the way a coach treats his son. Why on earth would you even give a "****"? And even if you did, what would you really do about it?

Are you going to call the AD and demand the coach's firing? Exactly what do you propose doing?

Now, I am not saying an ESPN executive couldn't get a coach fired. It's POSSIBLE. I just don't see how.

By the way, the censored word is a synonym for feces. But I don't really mean "feces." It's slang. So I placed quotes around the asterisks to inform you that I am not really referring to feces.

[olevetonahill]

LL , Let me answer that fer Chrissy

If you dont think espn could get a coach fired you have no clue as to the Power of a Network to influence situations

They can throw enough negative press on this that the Only thing left to do would be to fire Mike .

[AlbqSooner]

Once again you make my original point. WE DISAGREE. Google disagree on that thar computer thing you made reference to. Let it go at that and quit being so unwilling to accept that not everyone will agree with you.

[Leroy Lizard]

Olevet called you Chrissy. Oh, man! And you thought *I* was insulting.


If you dont think espn could get a coach fired you have no clue as to the Power of a Network to influence situations

So you're not talking about a strategic decision to get someone fired, but rather just the typical negative press that a scandal can create. Okay, I can buy that.

You still haven't the question as to why they would even care, other than the usual desire to stir the pot for its entertainment value.

[Collier11]

Olevet called you Chrissy. Oh, man! And you thought *I* was insulting.



No, youre just annoying

[Leroy Lizard]

Can you spice it up a little next time? "No, youre just annoying." How dull.

[OUinFLA]

Is the off-season here already?

did I miss our bowl game?

[AlbqSooner]

You still haven't the question as to why they would even care, other than the usual desire to stir the pot for its entertainment value.

If you mean I haven't ANSWERED the question, try these. 1. Controversy sells. ESPN is in the business of selling its entertainment package. 2.Leach has insulted and offended an ESPN personality. People with power tend to react to insults and offense by wielding that power. It gets them their jollies to know that they can crush someone who refuses to write an apology. Come out of the ivory tower and experience the real world and you will realize this.

[AlbqSooner]

Is the off-season here already?

did I miss our bowl game?

LOL. Nahhh the bowl game is Friday. You just walked in on a guy who fancies himself an intellectual gaining experience according to your sig. :D

[Collier11]

Leroy used to just have different opinions and defend them strongly, now he has just become disagreeable for the sake of trying to get people riled up, I give him credit since he tries so hard...again, alot like LAS

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

I am sure Leach held him in there with a pirate sword

[Leroy Lizard]

1. Controversy sells. ESPN is in the business of selling its entertainment package. 2.Leach has insulted and offended an ESPN personality. People with power tend to react to insults and offense by wielding that power. It gets them their jollies to know that they can crush someone who refuses to write an apology. Come out of the ivory tower and experience the real world and you will realize this.

ESPN isn't in the business to get jollies. They want money.

The execs at ESPN have more important things to do than worry about what Craig James thinks. They didn't get in their position by fretting over such silly problems. They're businessmen.

Now, if ESPN thinks it can make some money going after Leach, that would be different. But I don't think it matters if it's Craig James' kid or not.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Guys hurry up and turn it to ABC...they are running a documentary on Mike Leach

[Collier11]

Then why doesnt ESPN cover the USC fiasco more, they have power over the stories they run and if they wanted to bring in more viewers they would cover it more but they dont. Yahoo is actually the one who is all over it

[SoonerLB]

I'm thinkin' that James kid must have a REALLY fat girlfriend ..... jus' sayin'. ;)

[Leroy Lizard]

Leroy used to just have different opinions and defend them strongly, how he has just become disagreeable for the sake of trying to get people riled up, I give him credit since he tries so hard

You weren't even involved in this thread until you posted:


No, youre just annoying

And you have the nerve to say that I only try to get people riled up? Good Lord!

[olevetonahill]

Guys hurry up and turn it to ABC...they are running a documentary on Mike Leach

I did Look :D :O

[Leroy Lizard]

Then why doesnt ESPN cover the USC fiasco more, they have power over the stories they run and if they wanted to bring in more viewers they would cover it more but they dont. Yahoo is actually the one who is all over it

You're mentioning of ESPN's lack of coverage doesn't help your argument because you never tell us why you think they're burying the story. Is the top brass at ESPN composed of USC grads? Are the anchormen's kids playing for USC? What is the conspiracy?

[OUinFLA]

Guys hurry up and turn it to ABC...they are running a documentary on Mike Leach


LOL, Im so gullible

[olevetonahill]

LL the LAS of the football forum:rolleyes:

[StoopTroup]

What's funny about all of this is that ESPN reported the incident....Leach doesn't deny it and was asked to apologize. He didn't apologize so I guess he deserves to be fired for not apologizing?

If they were going to fire him for the incident...they should have done it. They have suspended him at this point. The Team is without their Coach because there was no apology. If I was Leach....I would go on a vacation.

[olevetonahill]

LOL, Im so gullible

I looked at the guide :D

[StoopTroup]

Leroy....

You should probably post some more about this....lol

King Barry has a good point about Bobby Knight. Talk about hiring a lit fuse....lol

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

Leach doesn't deny it and was asked to apologize. He didn't apologize so I guess he deserves to be fired for not apologizing?




I noticed this too, very strange logic. He's not being fired for the so-called offense, but for not apologizing for it? WTF?

[btk108]

James was scheduled to do the Alamo Bowl....he no longer is.

[OUinFLA]

James was scheduled to do the Alamo Bowl....he no longer is.


either James, I would suspect.

[StoopTroup]

I think all three of them owe each other an apology.

[OUinFLA]

I think all three of them owe each other an apology.

then we'd have nothing to talk about here.

[olevetonahill]

They all 3 need a dose of OOprah .:rolleyes:

[JLEW1818]

so who came out of what closet?

[olevetonahill]

so who came out of what closet?

WE waitin fer the Dr. Phil show :D

[MamaMia]

Color me confused. What was a player with a concussion doing at practice anyway? :confused:

[SteelClip49]

could it be that 3 of the 4 1A coaches who never played football are basically fired in the same season?

Weis, Mangino and now possibly Leach.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Next year is shaping up to be a great year. With KU and TTU out of the way we should steam roll the Big12 and now we dont have to worry about facing FLA in the BCSCG.

No.8 is all but guaranteed. ;)Whatchu smokin', bubba?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Leach to OU

I bet he would be a great OCRIGHT ON!RIGHT ON!RIGHT ON!

RIGHT ON!RIGHT NOW!RIGHT NOW!RIGHT NOW!RIGHT NOW!

[olevetonahill]

Color me confused. What was a player with a concussion doing at practice anyway? :confused:

Ding , Ding, Ding, Winnah:D

[King Barry's Back]

could it be that 3 of the 4 1A coaches who never played football are basically fired in the same season?

Weis, Mangino and now possibly Leach.

Are you sure about Mangino not playing? I'd swear I remember him having been a college lineman -- but in a quick BING.COM search I couldn't find anything on his playing days. So you're probably right.

On Leach, one of the articles I saw was saying that the Craig James's Son incident is not serious for Leach to be fired, but that if more players come forward (ala Mark Mangino) that Leach is done for.

I don't agree. I do not think you can tell a football that he is not allowed to coach his team in a bowl game, and then welcome him back. Once you have yanked the rug that far from beneath coach's feet, he's gone.

So I think Leach out at Lubbock is a done deal.

Who posted a week ago that this year's coaching carousel was "anti-climactic"? But i guess Urban is not really out at Gainesville, so there's that.

[King Barry's Back]

ESPN isn't in the business to get jollies. They want money.

The execs at ESPN have more important things to do than worry about what Craig James thinks. They didn't get in their position by fretting over such silly problems. They're businessmen.

Now, if ESPN thinks it can make some money going after Leach, that would be different. But I don't think it matters if it's Craig James' kid or not.

How/Why ESPN might get a coach fired.

I think they could do it. How? Directly, and through their corporate marriage to ABC, they control major segments of the TV contracts regulating college football. They certainly don't formally have the power to call up, say the Chancellor of Texas Tech, and veto the coach. BUT, in business, a big emphasis IS on relationships -- and if ESPN suits communicated to Tech suits that a certain coach was complicating the relationship, that would be taken seriously.

Just like Tiger Woods has ALREADY been dropped by a couple of his biggest endorsers. Frankly, the fact that Woods pulls some doesn't have anything to do with selling a Cadillac -- or in fact is a positive. But companies like Cadillac don't like any hint of scandal or embarrassment, so Tiger gets dropped.

So, let's say, someone suitably senior at ESPN made a discreet phone call -- nothing written -- intimating that a coach's mistreatment of players made their college broadcasts a "problem," that call would be listened too. Would that be the only deciding factor? No, but it could be decisive if things were already dicey between a coach and an AD. (For example, Mike Leach and that idiot/blowhard at Tech.) Couple that with a major negative publicity campaign, and witch hunt for unproven accusations, and they could make it impossible for a coach to lead his team.

WHY? I agree, Leroy, that ESPN leaders are businessmen, and thus like to make money. But Leroy, surely you know that such uber-successful businessmen are also often megalo-ego maniacs. They realize that they weild influence, and can sometimes use this power to punish the slightest of personal transgressions. Craig James might or might not have this personality. And he might or might not have the pull with the corporate brass to move this up to sr managment.

But, in the end, I believe that ESPN COULD get a coach fired if they really wanted to, and that they might want to for reasons other than money.

Is ESPN working to get Leach fired? I have no way of knowing, but I suspect that they are not going to be on his side helping, either.

[King Barry's Back]

POINT FOR DISCUSSION:

Haven't seen this raised anywhere else.

The only coach to publicly step forward and defend Mark Mangino is now being fired three weeks later, for similar charges. Coincidence?

Discuss.

[Crucifax Autumn]

I'm sick of these college players being gigantic crybabies. If I wanted to watch crybabies play football I'd just watch the NFL.

As fo that "point of discussion" I don't think Leach's situation is even the least bit comparable to Mangino other than the fact that both involve players being wussies.

[Leroy Lizard]

I think they could do it. How? Directly, and through their corporate marriage to ABC, they control major segments of the TV contracts regulating college football. They certainly don't formally have the power to call up, say the Chancellor of Texas Tech, and veto the coach. BUT, in business, a big emphasis IS on relationships -- and if ESPN suits communicated to Tech suits that a certain coach was complicating the relationship, that would be taken seriously.

Sure, but if they mishandle it and the rest of the press corps gets wind of their actions, it could take down the entire network. And for what? Craig James' kid?


Just like Tiger Woods has ALREADY been dropped by a couple of his biggest endorsers. Frankly, the fact that Woods pulls some doesn't have anything to do with selling a Cadillac -- or in fact is a positive. But companies like Cadillac don't like any hint of scandal or embarrassment, so Tiger gets dropped.

The two situations are not alike at all. If CBS called the PGA and tried to pressure them into dropping Tiger off the tour, that would be more analogous.


So, let's say, someone suitably senior at ESPN made a discreet phone call -- nothing written -- intimating that a coach's mistreatment of players made their college broadcasts a "problem," that call would be listened too.

I think an ESPN exec would have to be psycho to make a call like that. I'm not in their business, so I don't have any firsthand knowledge of how things operate inside company headquarters, but I just cannot see a phone call like that being made by anyone with half a brain. You cannot keep things under wrap today. Word gets out. Hell, it could be digitally recorded. And now Texas Tech OWNS you.

Now, if there was something huge on the line, maybe they would have the guts to do it. But because Craig James doesn't think his kid is being well treated? I just don't see it happening.


But Leroy, surely you know that such uber-successful businessmen are also often megalo-ego maniacs. They realize that they weild influence, and can sometimes use this power to punish the slightest of personal transgressions. Craig James might or might not have this personality. And he might or might not have the pull with the corporate brass to move this up to sr managment.

I'm not sure the execs at ESPN view Craig James, but I would put money on "bit player." To the execs, the vice president of marketing is a big-time operator, as is the vice president of technology. Those are the guys who make the world spin around in their eyes. An announcer? Pffffft.

And Craig had better dare not try to influence those around him to take up his cause, or he could be looking for work in short order.

[King Barry's Back]

Sure, but if they mishandle it and the rest of the press corps gets wind of their actions, it could take down the entire network. And for what? Craig James' kid?



The two situations are not alike at all. If CBS called the PGA and tried to pressure them into dropping Tiger off the tour, that would be more analogous.



I think an ESPN exec would have to be psycho to make a call like that. I'm not in their business, so I don't have any firsthand knowledge of how things operate inside company headquarters, but I just cannot see a phone call like that being made by anyone with half a brain. You cannot keep things under wrap today. Word gets out. Hell, it could be digitally recorded. And now Texas Tech OWNS you.

Now, if there was something huge on the line, maybe they would have the guts to do it. But because Craig James doesn't think his kid is being well treated? I just don't see it happening.



I'm not sure the execs at ESPN view Craig James, but I would put money on "bit player." To the execs, the vice president of marketing is a big-time operator, as is the vice president of technology. Those are the guys who make the world spin around in their eyes. An announcer? Pffffft.

And Craig had better dare not try to influence those around him to take up his cause, or he could be looking for work in short order.

I don't think ESPN is trying to get Leach fired, I just think that they could do it. And just because you think that someone would be irrational to do something, does not mean that the person involved is not completely irrational.

Maybe you have not worked with the high-maintenance super-type-A personalities that I have crossed paths with, but believe me, there are people that would put a corporate empire before their own peevish self-centric concerns. I believe the ENRON guy (Ken Lay, I think?) is possibly an example. When they were taking down the Golden State of California through their electricity market manipulation schemes -- he went after people, publicly and with gusto, who had any questions for the emporer without clothes. One documented case occured, I believe, at an investors meeting, where a stock holder asked soemthing like "I don't see any profits in your financial data. Where is the money coming from?" And Lay called him, from the podium, an "*******."

You might argue that the Enron behavior is rational because Lay was worried sick about being pointed out being without clothes, but some corporate execs will simply not rest until vengence is meeted out on those who have crinkled their perceived reputations.

Leroy, I am surprised that you would even contest this. Yes, I agree, the world would be a better place if businessmen were somehow supermen that put corporate interests and making good business decisions above all other concerns. But sadly, businessmen are still men. And the same highly driven personality that has made them huge successes in business sometimes makes them obsessive-driven control freaks.

That's just the way it is. I can't really offer evidence, because I can't talk about the incidences that I am personally aware of and I can't really troll through business reporting and read between the lines to see what has taken place.

Again, you posited that ESPN had no power to get a coach fired, and that they had no interest under any scenario to so. I countered that I believed that ESPN does have significant influence (not that they "should", but that they do), and that they might choose to do so for personal or business reasons.

I think I have shown you to be wrong, but either way, we still disagree. Don't make me call you judgemental!:D

EDIT: Oh, I wanted to address one of the things that you raised. You suggested that an ESPN executive, who is doing tens of millions of dollars with a university, could "take down the entire network" for making a call suggesting that a certain university staff member didn't fit the company's interest.

I don't think that such a call, even if made public, would have more than minimal impact on ESPN. I can't see HOW such a call would impact ESPN, and I don't see WHY it would. It might anger fans at a specific school, but that would be local and would fade. Anything more I don't see.

So please, elaborate?

[Leroy Lizard]

If a real powerful man at ESPN had his kid hurt, maybe I could see it. Craig James? No way. Why would they even care at all?


EDIT: Oh, I wanted to address one of the things that you raised. You suggested that an ESPN executive, who is doing tens of millions of dollars with a university, could "take down the entire network" for making a call suggesting that a certain university staff member didn't fit the company's interest.

Well, maybe the role that ESPN plays has changed so much that such a call wouldn't be catastrophic. Maybe you're right. To me, it would be a PR disaster to try and influence the decision-making in an athletic department when you're the network that is supposed to be reporting the news. Who would be able to take their sports journalism seriously after such an incident? But then again, I am not sure many take them seriously anyway.

[sooner n houston]

Hows this for irony?


From a poster on Hornfans that clams to know someone on the team:
My friend at Tech said he hadn't heard anything about sunglasses, but that James was trying to practice too early and Leach told him to quit it, and when James wouldn't listen he said that locking him up was the only way...

If that's true, kind of funny that he's getting suspended because he DIDN'T want a player to dangerously play through an injury too soon? You'd expect the opposite to be the reason for a dispute over a coach's treatment of an injured player.

[adoniijahsooner]

In the link Phil posted it says that Leach was given until Monday to apologize, which he did not do. It also says Leach said the kid (who he did not name) was something of a malinger and the kid's dad was like a little league dad.

Gotta love Mike on this one.

Haha. Had to look that word up. "To feign illness or other incapacity in order to avoid duty or work."

[Jacie]

As fo that "point of discussion" I don't think Leach's situation is even the least bit comparable to Mangino other than the fact that both involve players being wussies.

I understand the "connection" to the case at Kansas but it seems to taint things against Leach for the network to state that.

[Crucifax Autumn]

I just think it's stupid to lump them into the same situation when they are obviously 2 different coaches, at 2 different schools, doing 2 extremely different things. If some coach somewhere had been fired for killing a kid with a gun at practice, these dooshes would be lumping that in too! lol

[Collier11]

You weren't even involved in this thread until you posted:



And you have the nerve to say that I only try to get people riled up? Good Lord!

Yours is people, plural, mine is you :D

[Collier11]

You're mentioning of ESPN's lack of coverage doesn't help your argument because you never tell us why you think they're burying the story. Is the top brass at ESPN composed of USC grads? Are the anchormen's kids playing for USC? What is the conspiracy?

USC is one of their cash cows and if they are involved in bringing them down, then what

[SoCal]

Sorry if this has already been posted...rumor has it, James was pissed at Leach because he wouldn't release his kid so he could transfer to SMU.

[SoonerLB]

Sorry if this has already been posted...rumor has it, James was pissed at Leach because he wouldn't release his kid so he could transfer to SMU.

Ooooooo..........., the plot thickens!

[TUSooner]

I never really liked Craig James as commentator. There.

[Jdog]

Are you sure about Mangino not playing? I'd swear I remember him having been a college lineman -- but in a quick BING.COM search I couldn't find anything on his playing days. So you're probably right.

On Leach, one of the articles I saw was saying that the Craig James's Son incident is not serious for Leach to be fired, but that if more players come forward (ala Mark Mangino) that Leach is done for.

I don't agree. I do not think you can tell a football that he is not allowed to coach his team in a bowl game, and then welcome him back. Once you have yanked the rug that far from beneath coach's feet, he's gone.

So I think Leach out at Lubbock is a done deal.

Who posted a week ago that this year's coaching carousel was "anti-climactic"? But i guess Urban is not really out at Gainesville, so there's that.

Thought he played at Youngstown state?

[Leroy Lizard]

USC is one of their cash cows and if they are involved in bringing them down, then what

Which tends to support my argument. Okay, I'll take it.

Now, I have a question: What exactly is this shed that everyone is talking about? Was the player locked inside?

[goingoneight]

This reminds me of a South Park episode where kids called the cops on their parents for "molestering" them when they just didn't like doing what their parents told them to do.

Hey, you know what? If all of Stoops's former big-time assistants keep getting fired for this stupid shat, maybe we'll rehire them all so we can never lose a game again... just like we never lost a game when they were all here.

[ouwasp]

I wish the ignore feature worked when other posters quote the person on the ignore list <sigh>

I'm looking fwd to Leach's comments in this issue... right now I don't see how he and TT can be reconciled, but I suppose stranger things have happened.

[CaliBornSoonerBred]

Just read this stating that Leach's lawyer has a letter from the team doctor stating he did no wrong and is backing Leach's decision. Link below

http://msn.foxsports.com/cfb/story/Texas-Texas-Leach-lawyer-no-wrong-122909

The lawyer for Mike Leach says the suspended Texas Tech coach did nothing wrong in how he treated a player with a "mild" concussion.

Ted Liggett says that keeping receiver Adam James inside during practice due to the injury was better for the player than letting him remain outside.

University officials suspended Leach on Monday while the school investigates complaints from James and his family about how the player was treated.

A person close to James with direct knowledge of the situation contends the player was twice forced to stand in a small, dark place for hours while the team practiced. The person spoke to The Associated Press on the condition on anonymity because of the ongoing investigation.

Liggett says he has a letter from the doctor who examined Adams that supports Leach's actions.

[olevetonahill]

I wish the ignore feature worked when other posters quote the person on the ignore list <sigh>

I'm looking fwd to Leach's comments in this issue... right now I don't see how he and TT can be reconciled, but I suppose stranger things have happened.

Ditto
I wan to hear that almost as much as I want see Deans response to my thread in the SO:D :pop:

[TMcGee86]

I can't see Liggett making that up, he has to know he will be forced to show his hand.

And this only further my initial reaction that this was a spoiled kid crying to daddy because he didn't get his way.

[Leroy Lizard]

Ted Liggett says that keeping receiver Adam James inside during practice due to the injury was better for the player than letting him remain outside.


They may be arguing two different things. The doctor may be talking about physical health, while the player may be talking about humiliation.

[olevetonahill]

They may be arguing two different things. The doctor may be talking about physical health, while the player may be talking about humiliation.

Which you Know the feeling of well , right ?:D

[Leroy Lizard]

If it makes you feel better.

[oupicasso]

SMU does not want or need AJ. His days are over in Lubbock. He needs to transfer to another school and make his own way.

[Collier11]

Which tends to support my argument. Okay, I'll take it.

Now, I have a question: What exactly is this shed that everyone is talking about? Was the player locked inside?

well I have heard a cpl of times that it was the training facility and some other room that was an actual room and nothing at all like a shed

[Soonerfan88]

More info from Adam Zuvanich of the Lubbock A-J:

Former players Graham Harrell and Eric Morris, who finished their Tech careers last season, said Leach handles injured players appropriately and equally. They said Leach and his coaching staff do not pressure players to return to the field before they’re healthy enough to do so, and Morris also said injured players are required to participate in practices just like every other Red Raider.

For example, a player with an injured leg would be required to do pushups during a workout so he could maintain his conditioning and continue to build strength. Former Tech offensive lineman Glenn January referred to the common practice as “Muscle Beach” and also said Leach “doesn’t deviate from the (NCAA) rule book at all and wouldn’t do anything to put a player in harm at all.”

“If you’re injured, you’re required to still participate in some form or fashion. You still have to be outside and doing something,” Morris said. “At times people have tried to get away with faking a little nag here and there, and to get away from people doing that, you always need to let everybody know they’re not going to stand around and do nothing. It’s a great thing to have in place. Some people want to get complacent and do different things because things aren’t going their way.”

Some former Tech players, who said they have been in contact with current Red Raiders and the coaching staff, questioned the validity of James’ complaint as well as his motives and intentions. They also said James has a reputation for being soft and somewhat of a prima donna.

“I think some people honestly are not tough enough to play college football, and (James) might be one of them, especially if he’s worried about being called out or humiliated,” Loper said. “… Sometimes that happens, especially at the collegiate level. It’s not like high school and Pop Warner, where everyone gets to play and gets a pat on the back. Sometimes coaches can be mean and yell.”

January said the shed in which James spent practice on Dec. 17 might have been the most appropriate place to deal with his concussion, because it kept him out of the sunlight. January said he and his teammates on the offensive line often retreated to the same shed during practices to rest and escape the heat. “It’s not like it’s some dungeon,” he said.
http://www.redraiders.com/2009/12/29/former-tech-players-support-suspended-leach/

James' story is getting pretty weak, IMO. Sounds like he was probably standing around doing nothing instead of participating in "Muscle Beach" (lots of things can be safely done with a mild concussion) so was sent to sit in the cooling off shed.

[rawlingsHOH]

Horrifically STUPID move by Leach.

Regardless of the specifics.

[Collier11]

If the above article is correct, you are way way wrong RHOH

[FaninAma]

Here, I agree. Once you walk on a campus, I don't want to hear from your parents. (For example, I have never talked to a parent about their son or daughter while teaching in college. Not once, nor will I.)

Probably what happened in Leach's case. He refused
to talk to the Craig so Craig escalated the situation
and went over Leach's head.

I wouldn't plant your "I'll never talk to a student's
parents" flag on a hill unless you're willing to die
on that hill......professionally speaking of course.

[Scott D]

Horrifically STUPID move by Leach.

Regardless of the specifics.

I bet the kid probably sat in the shed, and wasn't forced to stand. I also wouldn't be surprised if the kid concocted the story for his old man to try to impress him with toughness the kid doesn't possess.

also, I find it amusing that you people have taken my joke about ESPN and firing Leach and run with it.

[Leroy Lizard]

I wouldn't plant your "I'll never talk to a student's
parents" flag on a hill unless you're willing to die
on that hill......professionally speaking of course.

If you were a student at OU, would you want your professors talking to your parents about you? I wouldn't. It would be a serious breach of confidence.

[Collier11]

Ill actually agree with you on this one LL, if you are over 18 there is no reason for your professors to be talking to your parents and no reason for your parents to be talking to your professors unless there is something really crazy going on

[FaninAma]

If you were a student at OU, would you want your professors talking to your parents about you? I wouldn't. It would be a serious breach of confidence.

If I were a parent of a student at OU and I felt
a professor had dealt inappropriately with my son or
daughter and was acting unreasonably you better
believe I would get involved.

[olevetonahill]

Plus If i was PAYING my kids way . Id want to know the Lil Shat head was working .

[rawlingsHOH]

If the above article is correct, you are way way wrong RHOH
No, as of now Leach is suspended.

Why? Because it was a dumb move to put himself in that situation.

In the real world you have to C-Y-A. Because of snitches and sneeks.

[Collier11]

Leach is suspended for 2 reasons

1) The AD doesnt like him and hasnt liked him, in fact, last year the Prez went over the ADs head to give Leach his contract cus the AD was being an idiot
2) You have to be careful, when you are a major entity such as a university they arent going to take any chances

From what ive read (if true) it sounds like a bunch of sour grapes on the kids part and nothing more than an attention grab. We will see but I doubt anything comes from this

[Leroy Lizard]

If I were a parent of a student at OU and I felt a professor had dealt inappropriately with my son or daughter and was acting unreasonably you better believe I would get involved.

You may want to, but it would be inappropriate and the professor would likely refuse to speak to you.

[Leroy Lizard]

Plus If i was PAYING my kids way . Id want to know the Lil Shat head was working .

Then ask him.

Just don't bug me about it.

[beer4me]

Plus If i was PAYING my kids way . Id want to know the Lil Shat head was working .



This ^^^^

[Fraggle145]

If you were a student at OU, would you want your professors talking to your parents about you? I wouldn't. It would be a serious breach of confidence.

Students have had their parents call me in the office. I refuse to tell them anything, and tell them their kid is a big boy or girl and needs to take responsibility for themselves. This isnt high school. Pussies.

[beer4me]

Leach is suspended for 2 reasons

1) The AD doesnt like him and hasnt liked him, in fact, last year the Prez went over the ADs head to give Leach his contract cus the AD was being an idiot
2) You have to be careful, when you are a major entity such as a university they arent going to take any chances

From what ive read (if true) it sounds like a bunch of sour grapes on the kids part and nothing more than an attention grab. We will see but I doubt anything comes from this

Yep Leech had tried getting out of TT several times because of the friction between him and the management

[Fraggle145]

If I were a parent of a student at OU and I felt
a professor had dealt inappropriately with my son or
daughter and was acting unreasonably you better
believe I would get involved.

Unless you are a donor, what you say really in all likelihood doesnt mean squat. Taking your complaints to the TA or professor isnt going to get you anywhere so you will have to go to the Dept head or the Dean who is likely going to back the teacher if it has to do with grades.

Now if its something else, ;) ;) then you might have something.

[Fraggle145]

Plus If i was PAYING my kids way . Id want to know the Lil Shat head was working .

And I'd tell ya to ask your little Shat head :D

[TUSooner]

If I suspected that a prof was causing any harm to my child, even if that child were 21, I'd get interested pretty damn quick. I'd be especially wary if the prof was a mean-spirited, humorless, crab.

[beer4me]

And I'd tell ya to ask your little Shat head :D

But they don't ever tell you crap ;) :D :D :D

[Fraggle145]

If I suspected that a prof was causing any harm to my child, even if that child were 21, I'd get interested pretty damn quick. I'd be especially wary if the prof was a mean-spirited, humorless, crab.

No doubt. But lots of parents think that their child earning bad grades is somehow the prof doing harm... that's what I am talking about anyway.

EDIT: Sorta like this James situation seems to me, seems like Leach was trying to maintain standards of participation while doing what was best for the kids health.

[Leroy Lizard]

If I suspected that a prof was causing any harm to my child, even if that child were 21, I'd get interested pretty damn quick.

Call the authorities.

Now, if you want to take the law into your own hands, fine. But don't expect the university or the police to back you.

[FaninAma]

You may want to, but it would be inappropriate and the professor would likely refuse to speak to you.

Then I would go over his or her head and go to the dean of the specific college in question. If the dean of the college wouldn't talk to me I would go to Boren.

After that, depending on the seriousness of the matter it would be attorney to attorney. I doubt it would get that far.

It is just plain stupid to make yourself unavailable to a concerned parent. It only encourages mole hills being turned into mountains. Especially when I, as a concerned parent, am simply trying to find out both sides of the story.

[FaninAma]

Unless you are a donor, what you say really in all likelihood doesnt mean squat. Taking your complaints to the TA or professor isnt going to get you anywhere so you will have to go to the Dept head or the Dean who is likely going to back the teacher if it has to do with grades.

Now if its something else, ;) ;) then you might have something.

No, it wouldn't be about grades. It would have to be something a bit more serious.

[Leroy Lizard]

Then I would go over his or her head and go to the dean of the specific college in question. If the dean of the college wouldn't talk to me I would go to Boren.

If the issue is academic, you have no say at any level. The university cannot talk to you about the academic performance of your kid.

If the problem is discomfort, then your kid needs to drop the class.

If the issue is real harm, then that is a matter for the police.


It is just plain stupid to make yourself unavailable to a concerned parent. It only encourages mole hills being turned into mountains. Especially when I, as a concerned parent, am simply trying to find out both sides of the story.

This isn't high school. For all practical purposes, your kid is a mature adult responsible for taking care of his or her own problems.

Now, if you would like to offer an example of a situation where you think a parent should be able to intervene, that would probably clarify things greatly.

[FaninAma]

If the issue is academic, you have no say at any level. The university cannot talk to you about the academic performance of your kid.

If the problem is discomfort, then your kid needs to drop the class.

If the issue is real harm, then that is a matter for the police.



This isn't high school. For all practical purposes, your kid is a mature adult responsible for taking care of his or her own problems.

Now, if you would like to offer an example of a situation where you think a parent should be able to intervene, that would probably clarify things greatly.

I seriously doubt any university would be as cavalier about the matter as you
are suggesting. I would assume most of them would feel that I, as a parent, would be acting in good faith with the best interest of my son or daughter at heart.

And I would suggest that a University that felt all of it's students were capable of dealing with all issues they confront would have an ethical problem allowing a parent to pay their kids' tuition. That might adversely affect the schools bottom line but at least they would be intellectually consistent.

And I would also suggest the subject of this thread is a good example of where some honest communication on both sides, devoid of ego, could have defused the situation.

[Fraggle145]

I seriously doubt any university would be as cavalier about the matter as you
are suggesting. I would assume most of them would feel that I, as a parent, would be acting in good faith with the best interest of my son or daughter at heart.

And I would suggest that a University that felt all of it's students were capable of dealing with all issues they confront would have an ethical problem allowing a parent to pay their kids' tuition. That might adversely affect the schools bottom line but at least they would be intellectually consistent.

And I would also suggest the subject of this thread is a good example of where some honest communication on both sides, devoid of ego, could have defused the situation.

For the most part (obviously there are exceptions to everything) everything LL said is dead on. They may acknowledge you are acting in good faith, but liekly wont reveal anything to you if they can help it. It covers their asss and it's the only way to try to treat everyone equally. Everything that a parent pays for is in the students name. If the parent didnt pay it is still the student's responsibility to remit payment.

If the parents have a problem with the way things work, there are probably a couple of thousand students that applied and didnt get in that would be there to take that kids place. I mean students drop out every year, but enrollment stays about the same or slightly higher than last term. Just the nature of the beast.

[Leroy Lizard]

I seriously doubt any university would be as cavalier about the matter as you are suggesting. I would assume most of them would feel that I, as a parent, would be acting in good faith with the best interest of my son or daughter at heart.

We're not accusing the parents of being untoward. It concerns confidentiality and maturity.

Suppose your kid came home and said that I called her a "little slut." Okay, that's a serious matter. No prof should ever do such a thing. Now, you could act violently, but let's suppose you don't. Instead, you decide to confront me. Here is my response:

"If your daughter has an issue with the way I spoke to her, she is welcome to come and talk to me about it. If she doesn't want to do that, which is perfectly understandable, I would suggest she stop by the Dean's office and formally complain. He takes sexual harassment very seriously and I am sure he will handle the situation to your satisfaction."

If you call the Dean, here is what he is going to say:

"I have an open door policy. If your daughter thinks Prof. Lizard has acted inappropriately, then I welcome the opportunity to talk to her."

That's what's going to happen.

And there is a reason we handle it this way. Just because your daughter complained to you doesn't mean she wants someone to intervene. It isn't fair to her to have others deliberating over her situation without her involvement.
You wouldn't want that if you were a student.

Essentially, if your son or daughter is not ready to take on their own responsibilities, then maybe they're not ready for college.


And I would suggest that a University that felt all of it's students were capable of dealing with all issues they confront would have an ethical problem allowing a parent to pay their kids' tuition.

The university charges the student. It is up to the student to make arrangements for payment. If you decide to pay for her, that's between the two of you.

[TMcGee86]

well I have heard a cpl of times that it was the training facility and some other room that was an actual room and nothing at all like a shed

Ted Ligget was just on ESPN 103.3 in dallas and he said that the first facility was a garage next to the practice field and the second was the conference room at the south end of Jones Field where the visiting teams conduct their post game pressers.

Seems the James gang has played a little too loose with some of their language and it's going to come back and bite them in the ace.

He also said that Leach has a team wide mandate regarding injuries and practice and no one is allowed, if cleared to be out at practice, to simply sit down and enjoy the view. You are either on a bike, or standing on the sideline.

Since sweet baby james apparently had an aversion to sunlight, Leach did the next best thing to having him stand on the sideline and allowed him to stand in the darkest room nearest to the practice facility.

[Collier11]

and both buildings were air conditioned

[rawlingsHOH]

and Leach is suspended.

[Collier11]

point?

[rawlingsHOH]

Cover your ***

[Collier11]

weve already covered that havent we?

[beer4me]

Watch ESPNHD right now most likely he will be fired before Thursday before the school has to pay him 800K in bonus

[TMcGee86]

Man I freaking love it. This season has taken a definite upturn.

Enjoy retreating back to irrelevancy Texas Tech. Couldn't happen to a classier bunch of sand monkeys.

[Fraggle145]

If they do fire him, we gain a guaranteed W every other year...

[IronHorseSooner]

They get rid of the most productive coach in their history over an "I'm going to get my way" father and son act. I swear, football and politics in the State of Saxet are about as bat-carp crazy as it can get, and neither has any legitimacy.

[Leroy Lizard]

It looks like the school administration needs a workshop on handling student complaints.

[ndpruitt03]

The school is just making up an excuse to fire him. And they will end up paying for it in the w/l column and Mike Leach will get a job somewhere and have the same 7-9 wins type success he always has had.

[Leroy Lizard]

Adam James may have to transfer at this point. I just don't see how he would function on the team, whether his complaints were valid or not.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

The school is just making up an excuse to fire him. And they will end up paying for it in the w/l column and Mike Leach will get a job somewhere and have the same 7-9 wins type success he always has had.If he lands a football-prestigious HC gig, he might recruit well enough to field a defense, as well as an O.

[AlbqSooner]

It looks like the school administration needs a workshop on handling student complaints.

According to everything I read the student did not complain to the administration; he complained to daddy. Daddy complained to the administration.

According to your earlier statements, the school administration should have done nothing more than suggest entertaining a complaint from the student, and providing direction as to whom in the administration said complaint should be directed.

[Leroy Lizard]

According to your earlier statements, the school administration should have done nothing more that suggest entertaining a complaint from the student, and providing direction as to whom in the administration said complaint should be directed.

If the school fielded complaints from the father, then they made a huge mistake. Their student complaint handbook is either badly written or they didn't follow it. An administration may think that it is doing itself a favor by trying to work with the parents, but it's almost never a good idea.

Imagine this press release: "We have read some comments in the press that Mike Leach has mistreated a player on the team, but no player has come forward to complain. It is strict department policy not to act on second-hand accounts or innuendo."

Problem solved. No student complaint, no action.

Now, if Tech was using this as an excuse to get rid of Leach, then throw all this out the window -- their problems are much, much deeper.

[Jdog]

According to the Star-Telegram, the kid wasn't allowed to sit or lean on anything in a dark maintenance closet during practice. A guard was at the door to prevent him from leaving.

This is beyond nuts - especially if the kid recently suffered a concussion.

Jabba and the Pirate are both former OU OC - is there a hang over of this sort of bizarro behavior still left over at OU that chases away o-linemen?

Just a thought?

[recemp]

I'm probably from a different time and place but, I'd expect a football coach to kick my butt - at least the good ones.
Talked to a drill instructor at Fort Leonard Wood and he told me that they can't use profanity or touch a kid either. I couldn't imagine that.
Seems to me that TT has some buyer's regret and are trying to find cause to cut Leach before have to pay the 800k.
The good news is TT and KU won't be competitive for the near future

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Somebody said Craig James wouldnt use his ESPN influence?

You just missed him using it

[JLEW1818]

Craig James prlly thinks Jesse Palmer is a tool

[soonerbrat]

Students have had their parents call me in the office. I refuse to tell them anything, and tell them their kid is a big boy or girl and needs to take responsibility for themselves. This isnt high school. Pussies.


My son signed a form giving me permission to look at his grades and talk to the school about him....but, he is a straight A student and was student of the year in the college of arts and sciences this year :D:D:D

[Petro-Sooner]

My son signed a form giving me permission to look at his grades and talk to the school about him....but, he is a straight A student and was student of the year in the college of arts and sciences this year :D:D:D

So had he not signed it the parents would not be allowed to check his grades? :eek:

[Leroy Lizard]

I'm probably from a different time and place but, I'd expect a football coach to kick my butt - at least the good ones.

But what do you mean by "kick my butt."

Physical violence?


Talked to a drill instructor at Fort Leonard Wood and he told me that they can't use profanity or touch a kid either. I couldn't imagine that.

But that's a different matter entirely. These are STUDENTS, not professional soldiers. And they are not going to be placed in dangerous situations that require extreme survival techniques. Football is just a sport.


Somebody said Craig James wouldnt use his ESPN influence?

You just missed him using it

What exactly did he say?

[soonerbrat]

So had he not signed it the parents would not be allowed to check his grades? :eek:

that's right.

[Leroy Lizard]

So had he not signed it the parents would not be allowed to check his grades?

Again, this is college, not high school.

[olevetonahill]

And I'd tell ya to ask your little Shat head :D

Hell Id Just Bribe yer azz with some OVJ .:D

[olevetonahill]

Lets wrap this up ok ?
Its all about EGO . I dont think for a minute that the James kid was in any danger or Mistreated that badly .. Daddy James said You Mistreated MY son and raised a stink over it . Leach said Go **** yerself.

The Skool took daddies side cause maybe they aint got the money to pay Leach . But Now .
They Did say it would all go away if Mike just gave the James clan a written apology:eek:

Wait a Minute , Is that right ? No Harm No Foul . Just give the Prima donna Family a written apology :eek:

Wait a minute again , If this Kid was so Badly treated and his Health an Issue
what the **** good is an apology Gonna do ?

Smooth Daddy james EGO

[Petro-Sooner]

Again, this is college, not high school.

I understand that. I was commenting on Brat's post. Not Leach.

[Leroy Lizard]

To settle on the blame, we need to know the following:

1. What was the structure that James was placed in? I have heard everything from outhouse to Taj Mahal.

2. Why was James sent to the structure? Was it punishment, humiliation, or out of health concerns?

3. What was James' behavior prior to the "timeout"? Was he being a nuisance, not putting out any effort, or simply minding his own business?

Do we have any definitive answers to any of the above?

[Jdog]

Lets wrap this up ok ?
Its all about EGO . I dont think for a minute that the James kid was in any danger or Mistreated that badly .. Daddy James said You Mistreated MY son and raised a stink over it . Leach said Go **** yerself.

The Skool took daddies side cause maybe they aint got the money to pay Leach . But Now .
They Did say it would all go away if Mike just gave the James clan a written apology:eek:

Wait a Minute , Is that right ? No Harm No Foul . Just give the Prima donna Family a written apology :eek:

Wait a minute again , If this Kid was so Badly treated and his Health an Issue
what the **** good is an apology Gonna do ?

Smooth Daddy james EGO

We all know Leach is a little Different - not that there's anything wrong with it. I figure he got into the habit of doing these interesting sort of punishments back a few years ago to impress Bobby Knight. It would give him something to have in common with his role model. Now BK tells him to not apologize......

[BoulderSooner79]

To settle on the blame, we need to know the following:

1. What was the structure that James was placed in? I have heard everything from outhouse to Taj Mahal.

2. Why was James sent to the structure? Was it punishment, humiliation, or out of health concerns?

3. What was James' behavior prior to the "timeout"? Was he being a nuisance, not putting out any effort, or simply minding his own business?

Do we have any definitive answers to any of the above?

This is the internet - we don't need no stinkin' information. :P

Slobbering Lou Holtz nailed it when he said none of this makes any sense, so we must not have all the information.

And to those that think ESPN would take James side or somehow influence this - that assertion makes no sense either. I'm sure this is "uncomfortable" and not at all something they want any involvement. I wouldn't be surprised if Craig fades away from ESPN because of this. To their credit, ESPN states the connection with Craig James up front when I've watched - much the way a stock analyst must declare any ownership if they recommend a company.

[Collier11]

To settle on the blame, we need to know the following:

1. What was the structure that James was placed in? I have heard everything from outhouse to Taj Mahal.

2. Why was James sent to the structure? Was it punishment, humiliation, or out of health concerns?

3. What was James' behavior prior to the "timeout"? Was he being a nuisance, not putting out any effort, or simply minding his own business?

Do we have any definitive answers to any of the above?

2 things, first a doctor has stated in writing that the athlete was put in no harm at all, second, other players have said they go in there to get out of the heat many a time

[SicEmBaylor]

So had he not signed it the parents would not be allowed to check his grades? :eek:

Not in college. Even if the parents are paying. I signed the same sort of form.

Anyway, at the college level I pretty much agree with the policy. Regardless of who is paying, the student is an adult and has a right to the privacy of his or her grades.

[Leroy Lizard]

Just ask your kids for their grades if you really want to know. Don't bug the profs.


2 things, first a doctor has stated in writing that the athlete was put in no harm at all, second, other players have said they go in there to get out of the heat many a time

First, whether the player was put in harm's way doesn't really answer any of the questions. Second, what is "there" in "they go in there"?

I honestly don't know.

[Collier11]

True, parents choose to pay on behalf of students, they arent forced to. Regardless, they have no right to access their kids records

[Collier11]

Just ask your kids for their grades if you really want to know. Don't bug the profs.



First, whether the player was put in harm's way doesn't really answer any of the questions. Second, what is "there" in "they go in there"?

I honestly don't know.

There is a place by the practice field, I dont know what it is called or how big it is but it is air conditioned and has an exercise bike in it. Several players have said that is one of the places that James was sent, the other being a meeting room I believe. The players were quoted as saying that they go in to that "place"all the time to get out of the heat. It isnt a punishment room per say

[soonerhubs]

I am going to have to Bat for LL on this one. This is one of the major problems with the development of children today.

It's called Helicopter parenting (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicopter_parent), and it makes me sick. Part of the strengths people develop is in going out and taking risks in the real world.

Meddling parents need to learn when to let their kids fall on their spoiled asses every once in a while. Craig James is a helicopter parent and has lost all of my respect. I will make it a point to change the channel when this fool of a parent comes on because I think it's disgusting that he's spoiling his son so much.

It truly does ruin future generations, and if you truly think you need to "rescue" your child everytime a problem comes his or her way, you may want to think about how you deal with problems on your own.

Do you call your Mommy and ask her to yell at your boss when he chews you out? No... Didn't think so. Maybe, just maybe, college is a great opportunity for the kid to learn how to deal with these "real world" issues such as the "meanie" professor or the "hurtful" coach, because the real world has plenty of these people as supervisors, bosses, colleagues, etc., and I guarantee that they don't give a flying rat's *** what comes off as mean or rude.

[soonerbrat]

here's a good article from Texas Monthly

http://www.texasmonthly.com/2010-01-01/webextra.php

[Collier11]

I am going to have to Bat for LL on this one. This is one of the major problems with the development of children today.

It's called Helicopter parenting (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicopter_parent), and it makes me sick. Part of the strengths people develop is in going out and taking risks in the real world.

Meddling parents need to learn when to let their kids fall on their spoiled asses every once in a while. Craig James is a helicopter parent and has lost all of my respect. I will make it a point to change the channel when this fool of a parent comes on because I think it's disgusting that he's spoiling his son so much.

It truly does ruin future generations, and if you truly think you need to "rescue" your child everytime a problem comes his or her way, you may want to think about how you deal with problems on your own.

Do you call your Mommy and ask her to yell at your boss when he chews you out? No... Didn't think so. Maybe, just maybe, college is a great opportunity for the kid to learn how to deal with these "real world" issues such as the "meanie" professor or the "hurtful" coach, because the real world has plenty of these people as supervisors, bosses, colleagues, etc., and I guarantee that they don't give a flying rat's *** what comes off as mean or rude.

to piggyback onto this thought, I am pretty sure that our parents(im referencing if you were raised in the 80's) were the last generation of parents who actually disciplined their children correctly, now days it just doesnt happen as much. Party by choice of the parent and partly because anything and everything is abuse these days, discipline has become a no no and it is sad as we are seeing the effects of this in society today

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I spank my kids daily just because

[Leroy Lizard]

There is a place by the practice field, I dont know what it is called or how big it is but it is air conditioned and has an exercise bike in it. Several players have said that is one of the places that James was sent, the other being a meeting room I believe. The players were quoted as saying that they go in to that "place"all the time to get out of the heat. It isnt a punishment room per say

Next question: Do we know that these two structures are where James was sent that caused the uproar?

Have any players gone on record in identifying where James was sent? Or are these unnamed sources?

We're painting these rooms off like a luxury hotel. So what exactly was it that burned James? I would think it would have to be something that triggered the complaint.

It just doesn't add up.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Everybody knows me as a ESPN guy, but Im a dad...

I know you as a flying doosh rocket

[JLEW1818]

"we talking bout practice"

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Allen Iverson to the Rockets for McGrady

[soonerbrat]

Next question: Do we know that these two structures are where James was sent that caused the uproar?

Have any players gone on record in identifying where James was sent? Or are these unnamed sources?

We're painting these rooms off like a luxury hotel. So what exactly was it that burned James? I would think it would have to be something that triggered the complaint.

It just doesn't add up.


from Texas Monthly (http://www.texasmonthly.com/2010-01-01/webextra.php)



As far as anyone can tell, here is what happened. On December 16, Adam James suffered a mild concussion. Since he could therefore not participate in contact drills, the coaches had him walking the track. The next day he showed up wearing sunglasses, explaining that the doctor said this would help him recover. Leach, apparently thinking that James was exaggerating his injury—though this is not entirely clear—sent him to the team's equipment room to stand in the darkness. (In some accounts this has been described as a “shed” or a “closet.” I have been there and seen it, and it is a normal equipment room.) According to the James family’s allegations, Adam was forced to do this for the next two days.

[Collier11]

Next question: Do we know that these two structures are where James was sent that caused the uproar?

Have any players gone on record in identifying where James was sent? Or are these unnamed sources?

We're painting these rooms off like a luxury hotel. So what exactly was it that burned James? I would think it would have to be something that triggered the complaint.

It just doesn't add up.

From what ive read they are both near the practice field, also these players were not anonymous. There have also been past players come out in defense of Leach. If I find the link ill post it but im sure you could do a basic google search and find this info if you are so interested

[soonerhubs]

to piggyback onto this thought, I am pretty sure that our parents(im referencing if you were raised in the 80's) were the last generation of parents who actually disciplined their children correctly, now days it just doesnt happen as much. Party by choice of the parent and partly because anything and everything is abuse these days, discipline has become a no no and it is sad as we are seeing the effects of this in society today

You're right. I find it amusing that places outlaw corporal punishment citing studies that children who were spanked usually have higher levels of antisocial and aggressive behavior, but they never take into consideration the plausible alternative hypothesis that without the spankings these children's levels of aggression and antisocial behavior may actually be substantially higher.

In other words, these laws are perturbing a system at such a larger scale without knowing what the drastic consequences could be. (This is similar to the one rational argument I see regarding the global warming issue. CO2 levels have never been so high. So we really don't know what the consequences of these high levels, but do we really want to find out?)

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Mike Leach should put Malcolm Kelly in the dark room for mentioning his high school

[Collier11]

another downfall as much as I hate to admit it is the internet and video games, when I was a kid (im 28) I was forced to go out and play, no questions asked. Now days it is easier to just stick the kid in front of a video game or a computer, and less confrontational. I witness this all the time with my cousins and my GFs niece

[olevetonahill]

here's a good article from Texas Monthly

http://www.texasmonthly.com/2010-01-01/webextra.php

Thanks Brat.

[Leroy Lizard]

When I was in Lubbock in March, reporting on a TEXAS MONTHLY cover story (“Mike Leach Is Thinking...”, September 2009), he made receiver Ed Britton sit at a desk outdoors in a blizzard for two hours for missing study hall.

WTF????

If anything, that is worse than what they are describing he did to Adam James.


As far as anyone can tell [What is that supposed to mean], here is what happened. On December 16, Adam James suffered a mild concussion. Since he could therefore not participate in contact drills, the coaches had him walking the track. The next day he showed up wearing sunglasses, explaining that the doctor said this would help him recover. Leach, apparently thinking that James was exaggerating his injury—though this is not entirely clear—sent him to the team's equipment room to stand in the darkness.[For wearing sunglasses, or refusing to walk the track?] (In some accounts this has been described as a “shed” or a “closet.” I have been there and seen it, and it is a normal equipment room.) According to the James family’s allegations, Adam was forced to do this for the next two days.

I would tell Mike, "Mikey-baby, you just can't treat players like animals!"

Coaches should stay away from unusual punishments. Work with what is commonly acceptable and safe.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I was forced to listen to Kenny Loggins

[BoulderSooner79]

I was forced to listen to Kenny Loggins

Isn't that against the Geneva convention rules?

[btk108]

I was forced to listen to Kenny Loggins

Are you KIDDING me? Kenny Loggins "I'm Alright", Caddyshack, the gopher, the Baby Ruth turd....it was the beginning of an era :)

[Collier11]

I was forced to agree with LL on all matters concerning sports, worst day of my life

[soonerhubs]

So less sunlight is good for this spoiled little bitch, but he cries to daddy when Leach puts him in a darker room to protect him from light.

What a joke!

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Danger Zone ****er

[btk108]

Danger Zone ****er

ok...I'm sure you heard that one coming from behind a closed door....you should have covered your ears....that'll scar you for life...*LMAO*

[Leroy Lizard]

I was forced to agree with LL on all matters concerning sports, worst day of my life

Didn't do much for my self-esteem either.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I used to have nightmares of him singing footloose naked

[Collier11]

As an educator I cant imagine you took any joy in forcing someone to have the plainly incorrect view point for an entire day

[Leroy Lizard]

I think I see what happened.

Adam James shows up with sunglasses. Tells Leach that the sunglasses were advised by his doctor. Leach doesn't believe him and thinks James is just mocking his authority. He tells James, "If you think it's too bright, I'll put you in a place where sunlight won't be a problem." So he sticks James in the weight room with the light off.

If so, I would tend to side with James on this one if the sunglasses really were suggested by his doctor.

[Leroy Lizard]

As an educator I cant imagine you took any joy in forcing someone to have the plainly incorrect view point for an entire day

Just think of as the dark side. We can be patently evil.

[Collier11]

I used to have nightmares of him singing footloose naked

and then you asked me to act it out for you?

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I didn't have to ask....you said your hall and oates impression was next..jlew was oates and you both were gonna sing Maneater in the nude

[btk108]

and then you asked me to act it out for you?

He said FOOT, FOOT....put that thing away

[stoops the eternal pimp]

c11 likes to shake his willy at me and sing this little light of mine

[Jdog]

You're right. I find it amusing that places outlaw corporal punishment citing studies that children who were spanked usually have higher levels of antisocial and aggressive behavior, but they never take into consideration the plausible alternative hypothesis that without the spankings these children's levels of aggression and antisocial behavior may actually be substantially higher.

In other words, these laws are perturbing a system at such a larger scale without knowing what the drastic consequences could be. (This is similar to the one rational argument I see regarding the global warming issue. CO2 levels have never been so high. So we really don't know what the consequences of these high levels, but do we really want to find out?)

I grew up across from the prison and was beat by my mama everyday and I have no antisocial behavior. Just ask Vet.

PS: biggest cause of Global Warming is Bovine farts - emanating from central texas
How do you know that CO2 levels have never been Higher - do we have records that go back beyond 125 years. And how are your scientists measure CO2 levels?
I recently heard my scientist say that the increase of CO2 over the last 25 years was equaled to that of a fart in a hurricane. Mine is from MIT - where's yours from?
By the way - it just snowed for the first time in 85 years in DFW.
The Glaciers have been receding for more than 20K years..........

[Collier11]

and you like to call my willy a banana and ask if you can be the dirty little monkey who hides in my pants

[stoops the eternal pimp]

that is fun though

[soonerhubs]

I grew up across from the prison and was beat by my mama everyday and I have no antisocial behavior. Just ask Vet.

PS: biggest cause of Global Warming is Bovine farts.
How do you know that CO2 levels have never been Higher - do we have records that go back beyond 125 years. And how are your scientists measure CO2 levels?
I recently heard my scientist say that the increase of CO2 over the last 25 years was equaled to that of a fart in a hurricane. Mine is from MIT - where's yours from?

Oh hell, I'm not a believer in Anthropogenic Global Warming, I was just mentioning a slide show I recalled from a geography professor years ago. It looks like he was citing data from the Vostok ice core samples. Bovine Farts sounds like a plausible hypothesis as well.

[A Sooner in Texas]

that is fun though

Maybe Leach needs to put you and Collier in a dark room for a couple of hours. ;)

[btk108]

Maybe Leach needs to put you and Collier in a dark room for a couple of hours. ;)

Where have you been....they've pretty much asked for that situation since the time they jacked the thread :P

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Maybe Leach needs to put you and Collier in a dark room for a couple of hours. ;)

cause c11 likes the lights on ****er

[JLEW1818]

boner

[stoops the eternal pimp]

TIGER WOODS YA'll

[recemp]

[QUOTE=Leroy Lizard;2800769]But what do you mean by "kick my butt."

Physical violence?

But that's a different matter entirely. These are STUDENTS, not professional soldiers. And they are not going to be placed in dangerous situations that require extreme survival techniques. Football is just a sport

Pulled the helmet and jersey, spittle in the face, hurting my feelings - I guess (anything that Bobby Knight did) . It could be construed as physical assault - but it is a physical game. Running steps until you puked. Encouraged to play through injuries and pain. Worse than what the DI told me was going on with professional soldiers.
These are students in training to be professional athletes, it's not a club sport.


In 10 yrs we never heard a complaint about Leach. I don't know about Mangino.

If the kid's life or well being was threatened - I agree the punishment would be justified. I don't see anything like that

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I'll make love to you like you want me to

[boomerborn79]

I'll make love to you like you want me to

B-b-b-boys to men, abc dbd:D

[soonerstan56]

I can't wait to see Ruffin McNeil run Mike Leaches offense in the bowl game.
Their offense is all coach Leach and Texas Tech will not be themselves without him.

Stan

[Collier11]

boner

Fraggle?

[stoops the eternal pimp]

fraggle is sexy

[FaninAma]

LL, like I said, you or your dean can talk
to me or you can talk to my attorney.....
Your choice. Your refusal to sit down and have
a reasonable discussion about the issues would
lead me to believe that you cannot support or
defend your actions.

And it's silly to contend that an 18 or 19 year
old student should face a professor and school
administrators alone if it is the student's
word against the professor's in a serious matter.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

collier 11 wants to be locked up by Leach in a dark room with BTK108

[Collier11]

If it is grade related, I dont think an attorney would give a sh*t.

[btk108]

hey, hey, hey......don't be draggin me into your fantasies

[Collier11]

collier 11 wants to be locked up by Leach in a dark room with BTK108

Btk would just go to church with me then try and murder me

[Soonerfan88]

Ted Ligget was just on ESPN 103.3 in dallas and he said that the first facility was a garage next to the practice field and the second was the conference room at the south end of Jones Field where the visiting teams conduct their post game pressers.

Seems the James gang has played a little too loose with some of their language and it's going to come back and bite them in the ace.

He also said that Leach has a team wide mandate regarding injuries and practice and no one is allowed, if cleared to be out at practice, to simply sit down and enjoy the view. You are either on a bike, or standing on the sideline.

Since sweet baby james apparently had an aversion to sunlight, Leach did the next best thing to having him stand on the sideline and allowed him to stand in the darkest room nearest to the practice facility.

And the James' complaint becomes even weaker. If everyone is required to either stand or ride the bike, then James was not singled out or punished at all but simply being asked to follow the same rules as anyone else on the team.

[Blues1]

jmho ~ Watching Daddy James tonight on his espn interview I got a feeling of a Spoiled Dad and Son--- I could be wrong, but that was My Gut Feeling...His explaination of events and concerns just didn't seem to jive..We shall see, but something smells of BS somewhere.....