The mega-gigantor things Mike Leach thread

[ouwasp]

If it is grade related, I dont think an attorney would give a sh*t.

c'mon now, if there's a buck to be made someone can hire a mercenary...

I wonder how this story would have evolved if Dad James had gone directly to Coach Leach w/ his concerns, rather than to the admin?

[Collier11]

it woulda been squashed by now most likely

[sooner59]

c'mon now, if there's a buck to be made someone can hire a mercenary...

I wonder how this story would have evolved if Dad James had gone directly to Coach Leach w/ his concerns, rather than to the admin?

He is a parent that thinks he is important. Obviously he would never do something like a normal person with common sense. ;)

[unbiasedtruth]

jmho ~ Watching Daddy James tonight on his espn interview I got a feeling of a Spoiled Dad and Son--- I could be wrong, but that was My Gut Feeling...His explaination of events and concerns just didn't seem to jive..We shall see, but something smells of BS somewhere.....


spot on.... here is an interesting story about the situation written by a non-sports publication and writer.... please pay particular attention to how Leach describes Craig "death Penalty" James....

personally I hope this comes back to bite CJ in the south end as he is walking north much like the baseball analyst for ESPN earlier this year....

http://www.texasmonthly.com/2010-01-01/webextra.php

[Salt City Sooner]

Here's a link (right side of the page) w/ a video tour of the 2 torture chambers:

http://www.kcbd.com/

[Collier11]

man, thats wretched. Poor guy, how could he survive

[Fraggle145]

fraggle is sexy

This.

[Fraggle145]

boner

And this.

[Leroy Lizard]

LL, like I said, you or your dean can talk to me or you can talk to my attorney.....Your choice.

Your attorney has even less authority in the matter than you do. I don't have to speak to him at all. Neither does the university.

In fact, your attorney will likely tell you that you have no beef in the argument. Now, if the attorney wants to represent your (hypothetical) daughter, fine. I will talk to him then. But at that point he is no longer acting as your attorney.


Your refusal to sit down and have a reasonable discussion about the issues would lead me to believe that you cannot support or defend your actions.

Let's make sure we understand that we are discussing a HYPOTHETICAL situation here. I haven't really hurt anyone.

Now, I have not refused to sit down and discuss the situation. Far from it. Your daughter can come and talk to me if she wishes. Most likely she will choose instead to talk to the Dean, which is fine.


And it's silly to contend that an 18 or 19 year old student should face a professor and school administrators alone if it is the student's word against the professor's in a serious matter.

If you want to accompany your daughter to the meeting, that would probably be acceptable. If you want your attorney to accompany the student, that's okay too. (Although I will likely seek to have the university's attorney sit in as well.)

This isn't about arrogance. It's about respect. The students in my class are adults and I give them the respect they deserve as adults. Talking to their parents is a breach of confidentiality and shows a lack of respect for their role as adults on a college campus.

Again, this is not high school. If your daughter is not ready for college, then I would suggest waiting a few more years.

[Leroy Lizard]

I wonder how this story would have evolved if Dad James had gone directly to Coach Leach w/ his concerns, rather than to the admin?

He shouldn't have got involved at all. And the administration should not have talked to him about the situation.

But once he decided to get involved, it was his choice whether to talk to the coach or administration.

[sozo]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/12720824/emails-dispute-james-claims-of-mistreatment

[sozo]

I can't wait to see Ruffin McNeil run Mike Leaches offense in the bowl game.
Their offense is all coach Leach and Texas Tech will not be themselves without him.

Stan
LOL Yeah I am looking forward to see him looking at that 3x4 piece of paper and make sense of it.

[TexasLidig8r]

So, the hearing has just begun (in chambers) in Lubbock.

Leach has to prove that there is a likelihood of success on the merits of the case and there will be irreparable harm if the TRO is not issued.

The irreparable harm is a no brainer.

The likelihood of success is more problematic. He will have to make a prima facie case that sand aggy breached his contract by unilaterally suspending him and did not afford him any due process rights.

Coin flip as to whether the judge will grant the TRO.

Regardless, I'm sure the negotiations on the buy out are underway between Pirate Mike's mouthpiece and the university's attorneys.

Look for something in the $7 - $8 million range, with non-disparagement clauses and perhaps a clause that Leach can't coach for any Big XII school for at least 5 years.

Then.. Sumlin to Tech.

Leach does the ESPN analyst thing for a year and then lands with someone like Arizona State.

[beer4me]

jmho ~ Watching Daddy James tonight on his espn interview I got a feeling of a Spoiled Dad and Son--- I could be wrong, but that was My Gut Feeling...His explaination of events and concerns just didn't seem to jive..We shall see, but something smells of BS somewhere.....

With you Blues I got the same impression. It appeared to me ESPN may have forced him to make a statement because he certainly did not look comfy standing there speaking.

I have no idea how or why this thread went every direction except the actual event, I mean good grief this was not a grade issue and until Leech filed the RO against the school, I never heard anything about lawyers getting in the middle of this event.

[Collier11]

So, the hearing has just begun (in chambers) in Lubbock.

Leach has to prove that there is a likelihood of success on the merits of the case and there will be irreparable harm if the TRO is not issued.

The irreparable harm is a no brainer.

The likelihood of success is more problematic. He will have to make a prima facie case that sand aggy breached his contract by unilaterally suspending him and did not afford him any due process rights.

Coin flip as to whether the judge will grant the TRO.

Regardless, I'm sure the negotiations on the buy out are underway between Pirate Mike's mouthpiece and the university's attorneys.

Look for something in the $7 - $8 million range, with non-disparagement clauses and perhaps a clause that Leach can't coach for any Big XII school for at least 5 years.

Then.. Sumlin to Tech.

Leach does the ESPN analyst thing for a year and then lands with someone like Arizona State.

So if the RO is granted and eventually it is found that Leach did no wrong, considering his stellar discipline and academic standing in the past, can he hammer TT pretty bigtime? Would there be a chance in this scenario where the AD gets the ax and Leach is kept on?

[TUSooner]

Liz-
I'd never bother any prof about grades. I repeat that I would be very active and interested if we were talking about a threat of harm. I'd probably start with attemtpting to address the prof directly, like honorable people used to do. But if he "went bunker" like you indicate you would do, I'd go ahead and take whatever legal (as opposed to illegal) action the situation warranted. But my daughters are pretty smart. They'd figure out pretty quick if a prof was a humorless, obnoxious, unfair pedant, and they would either learn to deal with the jerk or drop the class.

[PLaw]

jmho ~ Watching Daddy James tonight on his espn interview I got a feeling of a Spoiled Dad and Son--- I could be wrong, but that was My Gut Feeling...His explaination of events and concerns just didn't seem to jive..We shall see, but something smells of BS somewhere.....

Had to turn it off - it started making me nauseated listening to Craig "Mustain" James.

I've always been a CJ fan from his days at Memorial HS to the Pony Express to the NE Pats - and as a college football commentator. That said, this issue with Coach Leach really shows that he is the spoiled, pampered athlete that we would expect from Memorial HS and SMU.

If he has been giving Coach Leach advice, then I hate to think about the earful that he gave the Celina HC when his son played there. He has taken Mitch Mustain's dad's antics to a whole new level by playing into Myers scheme to run Coach Leach out of Lubbock.

It's clear, Myers is not able or capable of guiding a major college sports program. Gerald's recognition as a top AD's is solely due to the results Coach Leach delivers on the gridiron. These continued charades in Lubbock clearly demonstrate Gerald's defficiencies.

BOOMER

[FaninAma]

LL, this is my last word on the subject. Just
suffice it to say that if you are going to draw
silly little lines in the sand like never talking to
a student's parents then get ready to have that
line crossed and be ready to defend the reasoning
that went into that decision.

Personally, I try to head off potential problems
and if allowing a concerned parent the chance to
voice a concern to me in a face to face conversation
even if I don't agree with their concern then so
be it.

If Leach was arrogant enough to refuse to talk
to Craig James then he deserves every bit of the
fallout headed his way.

[olevetonahill]

So if the RO is granted and eventually it is found that Leach did no wrong, considering his stellar discipline and academic standing in the past, can he hammer TT pretty bigtime? Would there be a chance in this scenario where the AD gets the ax and Leach is kept on?

THIS

I think you hit right there My friend

Heres another Link to Opinions about this

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=188&f=1650&t=5362438

[MeMyself&Me]

If Leach was arrogant enough to refuse to talk
to Craig James then he deserves every bit of the
fallout headed his way.

I couldn't disagree more. This is college, not high school and these are not minors.

He only deserves the fallout if he actually did something wrong.

[Collier11]

LL, this is my last word on the subject. Just
suffice it to say that if you are going to draw
silly little lines in the sand like never talking to
a student's parents then get ready to have that
line crossed and be ready to defend the reasoning
that went into that decision.

Sorry but you are wrong on this one, UNLESS the issue at hand involves some kind of abuse, the professor has no reason to talk to a parent. Even in that case im sure the university would direct the parents to their attorney.

Personally, I try to head off potential problems
and if allowing a concerned parent the chance to
voice a concern to me in a face to face conversation
even if I don't agree with their concern then so
be it.

It is none of the parents concern, that is the issue. These are adults, sometimes kids need to take care of their own issues, unless like I said above it is something serious.

If Leach was arrogant enough to refuse to talk
to Craig James then he deserves every bit of the
fallout headed his way.

In this issue it appears that the only thing Leach was arrogant enough to do is to NOT apologize to the James family, Leach is a smart guy though and if he felt he did nothing wrong then why admit guilt?

[TexasLidig8r]

So if the RO is granted and eventually it is found that Leach did no wrong, considering his stellar discipline and academic standing in the past, can he hammer TT pretty bigtime? Would there be a chance in this scenario where the AD gets the ax and Leach is kept on?

Tech has more of a chance to get hammered if the Restraining Order is not granted and the suspension stands... especially if Tech uses that as the excuse not to pay him his contractual bonus of $800K if he is the coach of Tech on Dec. 31.

The more information that comes out on this, the more it seems like the James' kid is a punk and may have engaged in a bit of a "flight of fantasy."

[olevetonahill]

The more information that comes out on this, the more it seems like the James' kid is a punk and may have engaged in a bit of a "flight of fantasy."

Like the sign says "It Finally Happened"

http://rlv.zcache.com/funny_graduation_card_hell_freezes_over-p137834164602600933q53o_400.jpg

Lid and I agree on something :eek: :D

[Blues1]

More about this ....
LINK
http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/12720824/emails-dispute-james-claims-of-mistreatment

[olevetonahill]

Liz-
I'd never bother any prof about grades. I repeat that I would be very active and interested if we were talking about a threat of harm. I'd probably start with attemtpting to address the prof directly, like honorable people used to do. But if he "went bunker" like you indicate you would do, I'd go ahead and take whatever legal (as opposed to illegal) action the situation warranted. But my daughters are pretty smart. They'd figure out pretty quick if a prof was a humorless, obnoxious, unfair pedant, and they would either learn to deal with the jerk or drop the class.

Id just Kick his asz and be done with it .:cool:

[Crimsontothecore]

I truly believe Leach is being railroaded and the Jame
s kid is an arrogant punk who can't handle the fact that Leach didn't coddle him and anoint him the starter because of who his daddy is.
Having said all that, I hope Leach gets fired.......for my own selfish reasons;)

[Bourbon St Sooner]

At this point, I'm taking this as a spoiled kid and his self-important father trying to tarnish the image of a coach they obviously don't like for whatever reason.

And now ESPN, after years of extolling the virtues of Bobby Knight despite his known verbal and physical abuse of players throughout the years, trying to tar and feather a guy that's never been accused of anything.

[BoulderSooner79]

I truly believe Leach wants to get fired and TT wants to fire him. The James kid was just a convenient pawn for both parties. The contract extension signed earlier this year was only done after very adversarial dealings - both parities may have buyers' remorse. The only remaining thing to do is to settle on the exit price and conditions.

[TUSooner]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/12720824/emails-dispute-james-claims-of-mistreatment

Read the emails you find in there.
Yes, they're only one side of the story, and they do not speak to the particular complaint of Adam James. But they are plausible and persuasive when you consider their overall tone and the unselfish motives of the writers. They paint a very unattractive picture of Adam James and his daddy. (And we're not talking a court of law right here, so reign in your lawyerly officiousness and indignation.)
Even if the allegtions are viewed in the light least favorable to Leach, they show that he punished a player in a way that was not physically threatening or otherwise hurtful of anything but the player's feelings, which is rather the point of punishment, isn't it?
Did the Jameses think only one side of the story would come out? I sense a backfire. If I were a coach, I'd never consider letting a rotten apple like Adam James on any team of mine. And Craig James's harmless dorkiness as a commentator is now overshadow by a lack of credibility.

That's my humble opinion.

[TooSoon]

I am going to have to Bat for LL on this one. This is one of the major problems with the development of children today.

It's called Helicopter parenting (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helicopter_parent), and it makes me sick. Part of the strengths people develop is in going out and taking risks in the real world.

Meddling parents need to learn when to let their kids fall on their spoiled asses every once in a while. Craig James is a helicopter parent and has lost all of my respect. I will make it a point to change the channel when this fool of a parent comes on because I think it's disgusting that he's spoiling his son so much.

It truly does ruin future generations, and if you truly think you need to "rescue" your child everytime a problem comes his or her way, you may want to think about how you deal with problems on your own.

Do you call your Mommy and ask her to yell at your boss when he chews you out? No... Didn't think so. Maybe, just maybe, college is a great opportunity for the kid to learn how to deal with these "real world" issues such as the "meanie" professor or the "hurtful" coach, because the real world has plenty of these people as supervisors, bosses, colleagues, etc., and I guarantee that they don't give a flying rat's *** what comes off as mean or rude.


It has nothing to do with football, but this is the best post of the thread, imo.

I am the parent of a sophomore in college. If she has a problem with a prof., she handles it herself. I, as the parent of a legal adult, stand by to offer support and advice IF ASKED. I give said advice on how my adult child can proceed to handle her issue. Any direct involvement on part comes only after every possible avenue has been explored by my daughter herself and ONLY if it is of a very very very serious nature which has unfairly threatened her ability to graduate or is a threat to her physical (or in the case of sexual harrassment) or emotional safety.

In a few years, these "kids" really will be completely full fledged adults. How are they going to be able to handle the real world if they have not gotten plenty of practice at handling their problems? They are not going to magically become independent, capable adults overnight simply because they have a degree. They certainly won't if every time they have run into a road block, their loving parents have swooped in to make it all better. Our job as parents is to produce independent, productive human beings. It is our instinct to protect, but we do our kids a huge disservice if we always act on that instinct. They MUST experience the feeling of discomfort, negative consequences, and failure, even if those situations aren't always "fair." They need to also experience fighting a battle and winning it - WITHOUT our help- as it gives them a very important feeling of confidence, competence, and arms them for the next battle.

[olevetonahill]

So how long does this hearing take ?

When do we hear the results ?

[Collier11]

dont you have cable, turn it to ESPN and pay tention

[olevetonahill]

dont you have cable, turn it to ESPN and pay tention

Hell I never think to turn that TeeVee on . Cept fer Football.
So what happened ?

[Collier11]

nothing yet

[Collier11]

Hell I never think to turn that TeeVee on . Cept fer Football and pron.


Fixed for full disclosure

[TooSoon]

Does anyone have a link to a Texas Tech message board like this one? The ones that pop up on google aren't free. I want to know where the TT community stands on this, but I don't want to have to pay for it.

[Collier11]

The TT community stands firmly behind Leach, just to save you the time

[olevetonahill]

Fixed for full disclosure

Naw I watch the Pron on dis here puter :hot: :D

[OUMallen]

I can't wait to find out the outcome. So I'll post. Here. Now. Interested.

[spatton713]

Craig James was one of the highest paid players on the SMU roster

f**kin awesome....excellent reminder

[TUSooner]

Has ESPN become the PC & niceness police of college football? They seem to act like every complaint about "mean coaches" is a terrible affront to sports. Some of those ESPN guys had to have played sports. Since when to they expect coaches never to discipline players or do slightly unpleasant things to get their attention? It's a good thing Bear Bryant retired and died before ESPN turned all warm and runny.

[Blues1]

Has ESPN become the PC & niceness police of college football? They seem to act like every complaint about "mean coaches" is a terrible affront to sports. Some of those ESPN guys had to have played sports. Since when to they expect coaches never to discipline players or do slightly unpleasant things to get their attention? It's a good thing Bear Bryant retired and died before ESPN turned all warm and runny.

Just thinking about Jimmy Harris our QB back in the 50's getting his two front teeth knocked out by one of our own Sooner players ~ Maybe we should let some of these modern day players play without face masks ~~ :)

[ouflak]

Mike Leach fired??? Per the judge???? That sounds... odd... if you'll forgive the pun.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=188&f=1650&t=5368713

[OUMallen]

They opened the hearing to the public. Twitter feed from reporter in the courtroom.

http://twitter.com/Chrislevel

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

i see this as a shrewd calculation by craig james. he was trying to use a lot of in the news levers to put a little pressure on leach to bend to his thinking and play his son. the problem was that because leach is who he is, it escalated out of control faster than you can say "Arrr".

look at it from james's point of view...

1. every college coach has skeletons in his closet. heck, he is a skeleton himself from his days at SMU
2. a coach just got fired for player abuse
3. my kid has a concussion and its the "injury du jour"
4. the AD doesn't like leach
5. he probably believed his son's entire story which painted a much bleaker picture than reality
6. he has the power of the media behind him
7. when teams are struggling, players say things they shouldn't (ala kansas)

he probably felt if he twisted the thumbscrews he could get leach to see his way of thinking. as an outside observer, you look at his reasoning and go "hmm, that might work, if it weren't for this being mike leach".

the problem is that when leach escalated, 1 and 6 and 7, which were the lynchpins in the argument are falling apart.

[olevetonahill]

WOW
eSpin just saod Tdech Fired Him .
Wonder hot that Injunction thing wiil work now ?

[beer4me]

Mike Leach fired??? Per the judge???? That sounds... odd... if you'll forgive the pun.

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=188&f=1650&t=5368713

Yep being reported FIRED:mad:

[delhalew]

Tech fans should be furious.
Mark another point down for the pussification of America.

[Crucifax Autumn]

This **** is ridiculous.

[TUSooner]

Leach deserves better than Ttech and Lubbock anyway. Now that little place can settle back under the dust where it belongs. Mike Leach will rise again; Ttech... not so much

[OUMallen]

This is unreal. All this stemmed from his refusal to apologize?

[TUSooner]

Maybe ESPN will fire Craig James? (One can hope. :D )

[ouduckhunter]

ESpin had no credibility with me before, but this is just a travesty!! Their concerned interviews with self righteous Craig James, etc. has sunk them to new depths of stupidity!! Horrible reporting and journalism!!!

I hope that if and when they get to the bottom of this, that ESpin, Craig James, and TT rue the day they messed with Leach!

Aarrggghhhhhh!

[rawlingsHOH]

Dumb move, Leach.

[sooner59]

How many death threats do you think the James family will receive by Tech fans?

I hope Leach gets a nice job somewhere and Tech returns to the college football dungeon, where they can stay in the dark while everyone else plays football.

[olevetonahill]

Im wondering How the players are gonna respond .

[OKLA21FAN]

Stoops to Tech!!!!!! :pop:

[rawlingsHOH]

How many death threats do you think the James family will receive by Tech fans?


Wow, that would be even dumber than what Leach did!

[TUSooner]

Dumb move, Leach.

Wrong. Dumb move Tt. Why should Leach apologize for being a coach and disciplining a player?! Face it, that's ALL this is about even if you take the Jameses' whining at face value.

Here's hoping Tt wallows in the gutter with KU for many seasons to come!

[beer4me]

Man this is just bewildering to me. Now I admit I was raised in a different era but geeze my coaches when I played and wrestled could all but kill me and no one batted a eye.

And not just me but everyone we might not have liked it but you sucked it up and went on and hopefully learned from whatever we did wrong.

pussification of America is right on IMO. :mad:

[Frozen Sooner]

This whole thing is just bizarre beyond belief. The one thing that makes me wonder about this is why does Leach never seem to get serious interest from other schools? I've been curious if something gets around in the interview process, because it seems like some big-time schools would come sniffing around and abruptly switch course. Then again, I always thought it was simply because he's such an odd duck that he doesn't interview well.

If the Leach side of this story is correct, then this is a travishamockery. I'd be happy to have the guy back on our sideline until he can find another head coaching gig. Shoot, this probably means Seth Littrell is going to be looking for a job.

[ouduckhunter]

The only winner in this sordid, infantile, ridiculous mess is the Alamo Bowl!

They just got a whole lot of press! :pop:

[olevetonahill]

Wrong. Dumb move Tt. Why should Leach apologize for being a coach and disciplining a player?! Face it, that's ALL this is about even if you take the Jameses' whining at face value.

Here's hoping Tt wallows in the gutter with KU for many seasons to come!

Kev. Mallen
does Mike have any Legal moves left ?

[Blues1]

This is unreal. All this stemmed from his refusal to apologize?

If I'm a Football Coach at a Major College and I treat all players the same and don't do actual harm to a player - Then I wouldn't apologize either.....Jmho.....

[bonkuba]

Wow, that would be even dumber than what Leach did!

Still don't believe Leach did anything wrong.......other than not apologize (I just gained more respect for him....never be pushed into apologizing.....especially when you did nothing wrong).

I, along with most everyone, hopes that Leach is hired by tomorrow and kicks Tech in the *** in a game soon to come. TT will be NOTHING without Leach.

[TMcGee86]

Wow, that would be even dumber than what Leach did!

Yeah disciplining a malcontent is a horrible decision for a coach to make. He should have rewarded the little guy with some ice cream and a cookie. The team would respond wonderfully to that. :rolleyes:

[TUSooner]

Im wondering How the players are gonna respond .

EXACTLY. I'll bet you they are talking about not playing the game (just talking). I expect they'll play and lose in a desultory fashion.

[ndpruitt03]

If I'm a Football Coach at a Major College and I treat all players the same and don't do actual harm to a player - Then I wouldn't apologize either.....Jmho.....

What did Leach really do wrong? Not treat him like he had a dad that's on TV?

[Crucifax Autumn]

And espn just said that 96% of Tech fans and alumni are on Leach's side on this. Should be bad news for the university and team.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

i see this as a shrewd calculation by craig james. he was trying to use a lot of in the news levers to put a little pressure on leach to bend to his thinking and play his son. the problem was that because leach is who he is, it escalated out of control faster than you can say "Arrr".

look at it from james's point of view...

1. every college coach has skeletons in his closet. heck, he is a skeleton himself from his days at SMU
2. a coach just got fired for player abuse
3. my kid has a concussion and its the "injury du jour"
4. the AD doesn't like leach
5. he probably believed his son's entire story which painted a much bleaker picture than reality
6. he has the power of the media behind him
7. when teams are struggling, players say things they shouldn't (ala kansas)

he probably felt if he twisted the thumbscrews he could get leach to see his way of thinking. as an outside observer, you look at his reasoning and go "hmm, that might work, if it weren't for this being mike leach".

the problem is that when leach escalated, 1 and 6 and 7, which were the lynchpins in the argument are falling apart.


8. His over-inflated ego told him that everybody will believe what he says and only what he says.

[boomersooner28]

Gonna be a whole lot of pissed off Red Raider fans over this. The James kid better get the hell outta Lubbock.

They are done.

[bonkuba]

Kev. Mallen
does Mike have any Legal moves left ?


We'll see....he'll get paid either way (I hope he tries to break 'em).

Any D1 school that needs a coach would be crazy to pass on this guy. Just have to make sure the kids aren't whiners :D

[Frozen Sooner]

Kev. Mallen
does Mike have any Legal moves left ?

Several. He can litigate the meaning of "for cause" in his contract, for one.

[TMcGee86]

It would be the most money thing to evar happen if they just walked out there and literally laid down.

Granted, no chance that happens, but it would be money.

[bonkuba]

Gonna be a whole lot of pissed off Red Raider fans over this. The James kid better get the hell outta Lubbock.

They are done.


^^ This ^^

[OKLA21FAN]

When the heck did David Swank get on the TTech payroll????? :gary:

[Crucifax Autumn]

I hope they get beat 120-0 in the bowl game now.

[Frozen Sooner]

We'll see....he'll get paid either way (I hope he tries to break 'em).

Any D1 school that needs a coach would be crazy to pass on this guy. Just have to make sure the kids aren't whiners :D

He doesn't. Since he was fired "for cause" then (at least as I am given to understand) they get out of paying a big chunk of his contract.

He gets $1.6mm for the remaining four years on his contract. He may not be allowed to coach elsewhere in those four years if he wants the money though.

[olevetonahill]

EXACTLY. I'll bet you they are talking about not playing the game (just talking). I expect they'll play and lose in a desultory fashion.

Im bettin the Shack on Mich. St. now

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Oh, and I look forward to Leach abusing poor youngsters as OC at OU next year.

(I know it's not going to happen, but let me dream)

[bonkuba]

He doesn't. Since he was fired "for cause" then (at least as I am given to understand) they get out of paying a big chunk of his contract.


Well, here's for hoping :D :D

[ndpruitt03]

Oh, and I look forward to Leach abusing poor youngsters as OC at OU next year.

(I know it's not going to happen, but let me dream)

If he came to OU he would not even be allowed to call his own plays. Same thing happened in 99.

[sooner n houston]

Its all over the web!

[boomersooner28]

I wonder if Stoops has already made the call.....to Leach.

[sooner n houston]

http://www.myfoxlubbock.com/content/news/special/story/leach-fired/c6RRhrS4rEKFUoBcE8UM6A.cspx

[Frozen Sooner]

Including a thread right on the first page entitled "Leach"!

[bonkuba]

I wonder if he starts a bonfire in front of the ADs house with all the pirate shat? :D

[ouduckhunter]

I wonder if Stoops has already made the call.....to Leach.

You gotta wonder, don't ya??

[Bourbon St Sooner]

If he came to OU he would not even be allowed to call his own plays. Same thing happened in 99.

Go away NickZepp. I don't go around ****ting on your dreams you little pissant.

[bonkuba]

I wonder if Stoops has already made the call.....to Leach.

Maybe to tell him that the ordeal was f'd up. As much as I would like to have him back....I can't see it happening.......I know I crushed my own dream there.

[TMcGee86]

You think we have time to get the ninja offense installed before tomorrow?

[olevetonahill]

He doesn't. Since he was fired "for cause" then (at least as I am given to understand) they get out of paying a big chunk of his contract.

He gets $1.6mm for the remaining four years on his contract. He may not be allowed to coach elsewhere in those four years if he wants the money though.

What the Heads are sayin is Hes gonna get the 400k a year for the rest of his Contract

Im just wondering as Crazy as Mike is. If He dont sue they arse and try to get the Job back just to **** with them :cool:

[sooner59]

If you want to see exactly where this kid had to spend a couple of hours. I nothing wrong with it. I have stayed in hotels that weren't as nice as the "electrical closet". Its a damn media room.

http://ncaafootball.fanhouse.com/2009/12/30/leachs-lawyer-takes-camera-inside-the-shed-and-closet

[bonkuba]

What the Heads are sayin is Hes gonna get the 400k a year for the rest of his Contract

Im just wondering as Crazy as Mike is. If He dont sue they arse and try to get the Job back just to **** with them :cool:

That would be....just.....priceless!!!:D

[OKLA21FAN]

TTech to hire this guy.............

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_dnwb_hyOhyc/SwwDWizR3ZI/AAAAAAAABEg/Ea_I9-4f2UU/s200/edgenarro.JPG

[Frozen Sooner]

What the Heads are sayin is Hes gonna get the 400k a year for the rest of his Contract


Yeah, that's what I said. $1.6mm for four years is $400k for the four years remaining on his contract. A lot of contracts that have liquidated damages have a provision that if the damages are mitigated (in this case by finding alternate employment) then all that is due is the mitigated amount. If he lands another head coaching gig, then he'd probably get paid more than $400k per year and the school owes nothing.

[ouleaf]

Way to go Tech! You just set your program back at least 10+ years. Leach was the only thing going for that program. I'm willing to bet you just pissed off most of your fans and probably a fair amount of donors too. There is no way you will get a coach of equal or better quality to replace Leach.

[TUSooner]

Kev. Mallen
does Mike have any Legal moves left ?

Of course I don't know, but I'll offer something anyway! :D

As Homey has so accurately pointed out a number of times, absent specific contractual rights or rights against unconstitutional discrimination based on race, sex, religion, etc., an employee has no action for "wrongful termination." Whether state law gives Leach other rights, or whether he has certain rights as an employee of the State of +exas, I don't know.

An article says Leach was fired "for cause." Not sure exactly what "cause" that is, but he ought to be able to challenge that reason to obtain what he thinks he is entitled to under his contract. That will likely lead to a settlement, so Ttech will supposedly save some money by being lying c*nts. I would like to see Leach drag it out to a verdict and win, thereby rubbing Ttech's nose in the poopoo.

I suppose there might be a "stretch" possibility of a defamation type action against the James, but I'm really just guessing. I have forgotten what I ever knew about defamation, and I never knew anything about that action in +exas anyway. :)



My Hall of Shame now includes Jim Caldwell, the Ttech AD (whatever his name is) and Adam and Craig James. :mad:

[bent rider]

I wonder if Stoops has already made the call.....to Leach.

I would love it! 'Cept he's a better fit for the East Carolina Pirates! Or Tampa Bay Bucs?

[CaliBornSoonerBred]

There goes Tech's booster and donor money out the window for quite some time. I know a few Tech alums and 2 of them donate a good amount of money. They've both stated they won't be writing that check this year.

But serioulsy, are there ANY decent head coaching spots out there available to him? I would have said Cincy if it was still open but I think all open spots are def a step down for him.

Will Tech do the same and pluck KW from OU??

[Blues1]

BREAKING: Texas Tech Fires Mike Leach

Last Update: 12:17 pm

Print Story | ShareThis
BREAKING NEWS: 11:55a.m. - Sources tell FOX 34 Texas Tech has fired Mike Leach as head football coach.

Before the hearing this morning, Mike Leach's personal attorney, Ted Liggett, received a letter from Texas Tech signed by President Guy Bailey terminating Leach's employment effective immediately.

According to the letter, Leach is in violation of Article Four of his contract. That's the performance clause, which deals with the health and welfare of players.

Liggett tells FOX 34 Leach will be filing a lawsuit against the University "soon."

[Frozen Sooner]

I suppose there might be a "stretch" possibility of a defamation type action against the James, but I'm really just guessing. I have forgotten what I ever knew about defamation, and I never knew anything about that action in +exas anyway. :) d:

He probably has a better cause of action against the James family for tortious interference with a contractual relationship.

[Crucifax Autumn]

I think everyone should complain to espin every single time Craig James says anything about anything until they fire his ***.

[CaliBornSoonerBred]

BREAKING: Texas Tech Fires Mike Leach

Last Update: 12:17 pm

Print Story | ShareThis
BREAKING NEWS: 11:55a.m. - Sources tell FOX 34 Texas Tech has fired Mike Leach as head football coach.

Before the hearing this morning, Mike Leach's personal attorney, Ted Liggett, received a letter from Texas Tech signed by President Guy Bailey terminating Leach's employment effective immediately.

According to the letter, Leach is in violation of Article Four of his contract. That's the performance clause, which deals with the health and welfare of players.

Liggett tells FOX 34 Leach will be filing a lawsuit against the University "soon."


Was this the a**hat who he was at such odds with over the contract last year?

[beer4me]

Of course I don't know, but I'll offer something anyway! :D

As Homey has so accurately pointed out a number of times, absent specific contractual rights or rights against unconstitutional discrimination based on race, sex, religion, etc., an employee has no action for "wrongful termination." Whether state law gives Leach other rights, or whether he has certain rights as an employee of the State of +exas, I don't know.

An article says Leach was fired "for cause." Not sure exactly what "cause" that is, but he ought to be able to challenge that reason to obtain what he thinks he is entitled to under his contract. That will likely lead to a settlement, so Ttech will supposedly save some money by being lying c*nts. I would like to see Leach drag it out to a verdict and win, thereby rubbing Ttech's nose in the poopoo.

I suppose there might be a "stretch" possibility of a defamation type action against the James, but I'm really just guessing. I have forgotten what I ever knew about defamation, and I never knew anything about that action in +exas anyway. :)



My Hall of Shame now includes Jim Caldwell, the Ttech AD (whatever his name is) and Adam and Craig James. :mad:


From what the radio is saying just cause was for Insubordination for refusing to apologize.

[TUSooner]

He probably has a better cause of action against the James family for tortious interference with a contractual relationship.

There was a debate as to what extent such an action even exited in Louisiana back in my law school days, so it never corssed my mind. :D

[Blues1]

What are Texas tech players going to do...??

Maybe just stand around the field and let Mich State score at Will..... :)

jmho ~~~ But I gotta believe something stange is gonna Happen....

[SoonerLB]

I think ESPN should fire Craig James for being a meddler in a college football program. Just sayin' .......... ;)

[TUSooner]

Bottom line: "for cause" will be the big issue. I don't know what the contract says about being fired for cause, that is, whether Leach is entitled to anything or nothing if the "for cause" stands up.

[ndpruitt03]

The great thing about this for the rest of the South, Tech just got a LOT easier.

[Frozen Sooner]

There was a debate as to what extent such an action even exited in Louisiana back in my law school days, so it never corssed my mind. :D

You people with your weird insistence on civil law... ;)

Only reason I even thought of it is it turned up on the civ pro final.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

What are Texas tech players going to do...??

Maybe just stand around the field and let Mich State score at Will..... :)

jmho ~~~ But I gotta believe something stange is gonna Happen....

I definitely gotta watch this game now. Maybe the whole team will come out and moon the school president's box.

[Frozen Sooner]

Bottom line: "for cause" will be the big issue. I don't know what the contract says about being fired for cause, that is, whether Leach is entitled to anything or nothing if the "for cause" stands up.

That's my thought as well. He can litigate "for cause" for a while-apparently the contract had some progressive discipline steps that should be met on a "for cause" firing, and it doesn't seem they were met. That being the case, he's got case law on his side out the wazzoo. The contract appears to provide for $400k per year for the duration of the contract on a "for cause" firing. Another big point of litigation is the timing: had he been fired tomorrow, Tech would owe him an additional $800k. He's got a strong bad faith argument, methinks.

[soonervegas]

I kind of agree. I don't see how they can put him back on the air....

[beer4me]

I am not a lawyer but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express one time :D

But isn't "for cause" a catch all that can be used for anything not specifically written in a contract?

I know I have contract with the gubermint I signed when hired in and it has a "for cause" clause which I always took to mean for anything not listed but should be :D

[TUSooner]

Perhaps the headlines should say "ESPN Fires Leach." I never saw anything on ESPN like I did elsewhere (CBS) about how bogus the allegations were (or might be). Not saying the coverage wasn't there, but ESPN's coverage sure seemed to focus only on the allegations....

[Hot Rod]

Well, I don't see this helping his son's football career either.

[beer4me]

IMO Nothing that happens can be fair to Leech at this point.

Unless he can sue them and cause them to go bankrupt :D

[Hot Rod]

I definitely gotta watch this game now. Maybe the whole team will come out and moon the school president's box.

And wasn't Leach the offensive play caller? Who gets the new responsibility days before the bowl game? I thought Leach did a good job.

[Soonerhaze]

Figured I'd be the first to start this thread. Bring Leach back, win a NC, heat blows over, he gets another job and we get numero ocho!

[FaninAma]

If the school fielded complaints from the father, then they made a huge mistake. Their student complaint handbook is either badly written or they didn't follow it. An administration may think that it is doing itself a favor by trying to work with the parents, but it's almost never a good idea.

Imagine this press release: "We have read some comments in the press that Mike Leach has mistreated a player on the team, but no player has come forward to complain. It is strict department policy not to act on second-hand accounts or innuendo."

Problem solved. No student complaint, no action.

Now, if Tech was using this as an excuse to get rid of Leach, then throw all this out the window -- their problems are much, much deeper.

LOL. Hiding behind beaurocratic policies and procedures may work with subordinates and employees but it fails miserably when dealing with those outside of the workplace....ie your clients and customers.

I'm sure TT has policy and procedure manuals out he wazoo.....lot of good they did in this situation.

[IronHorseSooner]

ESPN= no transparency. If ESPN were truly professional, and not the money harlots that they are (especially since the merger with Mickey Mouse), they would recuse themselves from this entire thing due to a conflict of interest.

[okiedokie]

If he is proven innocent then I would not mind him back in Norman? :)

[Sooner-N-KS]

I hope Leach has grounds to sue Craig James as well as Tech.

[Blues1]

ESPN= no transparency. If ESPN were truly professional, and not the money harlots that they are (especially since the merger with Mickey Mouse), they would recuse themselves from this entire thing due to a conflict of interest.

Amen & Amen...!!!

[FaninAma]

Not in college. Even if the parents are paying. I signed the same sort of form.

Anyway, at the college level I pretty much agree with the policy. Regardless of who is paying, the student is an adult and has a right to the privacy of his or her grades.

Disagree strongly. Adults pay their own way. They do not ask Mom and Dad to pay and then tell them it's none of their business regarding grades. That would last about 1 semester in my family.

[soonerhubs]

Anyone think this group's membership will increase drastically over this next week? http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2217018103

Or this one:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=395936730467&ref=search&sid=203101022.2245123276..1

Or this one:
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=223161129078&ref=search&sid=203101022.2245123276..1

[FaninAma]

In this issue it appears that the only thing Leach was arrogant enough to do is to NOT apologize to the James family, Leach is a smart guy though and if he felt he did nothing wrong then why admit guilt?

No, Leach acted on a maturity level eaqual to that of his player. Leach didn't need to prove a point. Sitting the kid on the bench and ignoring him was the best course of action. If the possibility of losing his scholaship wasn't a big enough motivator then I doubt Leach's little antics of humiliation, however mild and harmless you may think they were, wouldn't be effective, either.

Just a stupid decision by Leach and I guarantee you he has made plenty of other stupid decisions that the TT administration is aware of that you are not.

[Frozen Sooner]

No, Leach acted on a maturity level eaqual to that of his player. Leach didn't need to prove a point. Sitting the kid on the bench and ignoring him was the best course of action. If the possibility of losing his scholaship wasn't a big enough motivator then I doubt Leach's little antics of humiliation, however mild and harmless you may think they were, wouldn't be effective, either.

Just a stupid decision by Leach and I guarantee you he has made plenty of other stupid decisions that the TT administration is aware of that you are not.

Interesting. Like I said above, every time someone seemed interested in hiring Leach away they'd abruptly switch their focus. I really wonder if there's some big skeletons in his closet.

[Blues1]

What Graham Harrell had to say....(THE EMAIL)


To Whom It May Concern:

Texas Tech University and the athletic department is filled with great people from the top down, starting with the chancellor all the way down to the student athletes involved in the programs. In the football program, Gerald Myers and the rest of the administration have put together an unbelievable staff that believe success only comes from hard work and doing things right. The staff expects the players and everyone involved to buy into their beliefs, but like anywhere not every player agrees with or buys into what the coaches and program stand for. At Texas Tech the majority of the players do everything the coaches ask of them and anything possible to improve the team. Adam James is one of the few players who has never bought into what Texas Tech football was built on and in my years there with him had a negative impact on the team because of his attitude and work ethic on and off the field. Coach Leach demands a lot out of every player in the program and pushed his players and coaches as hard as any coach I have ever been around, but he is fair to every player and would never make and decision or action that is not best for the Texas Tech football program.

Before Adam James ever entered the football locker room at Texas Tech I heard how spoiled and selfish he acted in a team atmosphere from many of my baseball friends. Adam was on the baseball team his true freshman year at Tech, before he ever joined the football team, and did not make it through the baseball season because of his selfish attitude. After a baseball game in which he felt like he did not get enough playing time, but the team still won twenty to one, he came into the locker room after the game and “pouted and threw a big fit” according another player on the baseball team. A few weeks later in the middle of the season, he just stopped showing up to practices or game and quit because he was not happy about how he was being treated. One of my roommates was a baseball player on the team and many of my friends were a part of the team that witnessed all of this. These baseball players told me he was “spoiled and selfish” before he ever came to the football team. After quitting baseball he came out for football and his selfish attitude was very evident, as was his laziness. During off-season workouts he often would be caught skipping lifts in the weight room or finding ways to cut corners/get out of conditioning exercises. When we had player organized seven on seven throwing in the summer, when he would show up he was much more interested in playing his own games on the side of the field or telling people that he wasn’t going to run any routes because the coaches do not get him a “fair opportunity” anyway. During the season he was often “injured” (it usually seemed like a very minor injury that could keep him out of practice but never out of any other activity, including games) so he would not participate in some drills in practice. None of these acts were productive for our team, but the most detrimental part of Adam was his off field attitude and actions. In the locker room and away from the facility, Adam used any opportunity he had to tell other players how he was being treated unfairly, how the coaches did not give him a fair chance and how we did not have to do everything the coaches told us because they had no option but to play some of us. When I heard these kinds of things I usually tried to put an end to them but Adam pretty consistently talked bad about the coaches or down played the importance of working hard, when he was off the field. When he talked to young players or players that were usually on the scout he would explain how the coaches were not fair to certain players and only played favorites. When he talked to players that did get some playing time he would talk about how we didn’t really have to do what the coaches asked of us because the coaches had to play us anyway. And it almost always tied back to how he was not getting a fair chance to play just because the coaches were unfair. The coaches were always more than fair to Adam I felt, because he came in the game during certain formations and situations last football season, but because of his work ethic and attitude, many of the players on last years team had a hard time trusting him or relying on him because he was not always practicing and we had seen his laziness during the off-season. Adam was a kid that seemed like he had been given everything he wanted his whole life and acted like if things did not go exactly how he wanted someone was treating him unfairly or someone needed to be blamed for his failures. He was a selfish player on and off the field that was counter-productive for our team and would be for any other team.

Mike Leach was not only my head coach, but he was my position coach all five of my years at Texas Tech. I spent more time with him than any other player during my five years and had meetings with him every day. He was very hard on me and every other player in program and he held very high expectations for every player. He would push us all every day during the season and during the off-season. He felt that hard work, dedication and doing things right was the only way we could be successful and compete in the Big XII conference. He worked harder and longer than anyone else in program and was committed to winning at all cost. He would never have been unfair to a player or not played the best players he had because he wanted to win more than anything else. Coach Leach also expected us to be tough but smart at the same time. He would not pressure a kid to play with a serious injury or play when he did not feel ready to play. Coach Leach is a man that cares about his player and puts his players, coaches and the well being of the Texas Tech football program above all else.

Coach Leach is a great coach at Texas Tech that emphasizes the importance of hard work and doing things the right way so that the football program has the best opportunity possible to be successful. He, along with the administration and the rest of his staff, have built a great football program at Texas Tech that is built on the virtues and principles that give any program an opportunity to be successful. Every single player may not buy into the program’s beliefs, but Mike Leach has almost everyone on board with him and the Texas Tech football program on a successful track.

Graham Harrell

[KantoSooner]

ooooooookay; so where do we stand in the B12 South?

Texas: No Colt, no Shipley, lots o' seniors going/gone.
Tech: Just went back into the 'irrelevant' category
A&M: Remains irrelevant to everyone except UT who they somehow manage to beat every so once in a while
Baylor: Unless their QB comes back strong, they're toast for a while
OSU: Graduating what? 19 of 22 starters....who we beat anyway.

Next year is looking okay to me.

[Collier11]

A&M will have their best shot to be good next yr, texas will be good cus they are texas, if we get our Oline in order we should be able to win conf title #7 next yr, God forbid another injury plagued season like this

[FaninAma]

Note to Graham:

Then why was Leach even keeping him on the fottball team? If the James had requested a release as has been reported I would think that Leach would be jumping with joy and would expediting that request as a top priority. Instead it looks like he got into a pissing contest with the James family and ended up being the one who got wet.

I like Stoops' policy of facilitating any unhappy player's transfer request. It has served him well.

[TUSooner]

No, Leach acted on a maturity level eaqual to that of his player. Leach didn't need to prove a point. Sitting the kid on the bench and ignoring him was the best course of action. If the possibility of losing his scholaship wasn't a big enough motivator then I doubt Leach's little antics of humiliation, however mild and harmless you may think they were, wouldn't be effective, either.

Next up: Federal Football Coaching Standards! Because individual coaches are not entitled to any discretion on how they discipline players or run their programs.


Just a stupid decision by Leach and I guarantee you he has made plenty of other stupid decisions that the TT administration is aware of that you are not.

"Where there's no smoke, there still might be fire anyway!"

I just haven't seen anything that makes me think Leach was worthy of firing, unless eccentricity is now a crime.

[FaninAma]

Next up: Federal Football Coaching Standards! Because individual coaches are not entitled to any discretion on how they discipline players or run their programs.



"Where there's no smoke, there still might be fire anyway!"

I just haven't seen anything that makes me think Leach was worthy of firing, unless eccentricity is now a crime.

Patience, Grasshopper, patience. all will be revealed in time.

[delhalew]

Things like this sure do make me appreciate Castiglione.

[Blues1]

Note to Graham:

Then why was Leach even keeping him on the fottball team? If the James had requested a release as has been reported I would think that Leach would be jumping with joy and would expediting that request as a top priority. Instead it looks like he got into a pissing contest with the James family and ended up being the one who got wet.

I like Stoops' policy of facilitating any unhappy player's transfer request. It has served him well.

Who Knows...? ` Maybe after The Bowl Game Adam James would have gotten his Release....

Next Question ~ What Coach is Going to want The Head Football Coach Job at TT after this..??

jmho ~ This whole thing is just F^&%ed Up For TT and College Football

[TUSooner]

Patience, Grasshopper, patience. all will be revealed in time.

Pardon me if I don't take your word for it just yet. Somebdy will have to show me. ;)

Currently, the evidence indicates that the Jameses are spoiled whiny brats who got their way because it coincided with the desires of the Tt AD.

I believe Adam James would have been allowed to go anywhere except to another +exas FBS school, according to Leach's reported policy.

I hope Adam goes to SMU and June Jones really locks him in a shed.

[boomersooner28]

This should end OUr losing streak at Tech.


And yes, about OUr administration...we have the best. And Stoops knows it. Thats one of the main reasons Bob has stuck around and will continue to stick around. If we lose Boren and or Castiglione things get a lil sticky around Norman.

[sooner94]

Things like this sure do make me appreciate Castiglione.

Amen, brother. I never thought about that before, but Cast sure does make things hospitable for our good coaches. And that is what a good AD should do.

[C&CDean]

Personally, I like Leach. He's an interesting and colorful coach. We'll see if more crapola comes out, but I'm really thinking his bad relationship with the AD is at the root of this, and that Leach will be exonerated and that the little faggoty James boy will be run outta town on a rail. At least that's what I'm hoping.

[MeMyself&Me]

Note to Graham:

Then why was Leach even keeping him on the fottball team? If the James had requested a release as has been reported I would think that Leach would be jumping with joy and would expediting that request as a top priority. Instead it looks like he got into a pissing contest with the James family and ended up being the one who got wet.

I like Stoops' policy of facilitating any unhappy player's transfer request. It has served him well.

Because he wanted to transfer to SMU which is on Tech's schedule. I think you'll find most coaches have limitations for where you can transfer that would eliminate teams you're scheduled to play. I've also heard he's not wanted anywhere anyway, including SMU but I don't know if that's right.

I do agree with your prior point that there may be something here we don't know about... but if so, we will know eventually.

As far as parents having a right to know their kids grades if they're paying for college, well that's between the kids and the parents, not the school and the parents.

[Soonerus]

All I am saying is: Poorly played Texas Tech...very poor...

[sooner59]

I can't wait for Leach to throw in his two cents (after the legal stuff is done). He will probably have to keep his mouth shut until after his case is settled in court. But maybe not......knowing his Leachisms. Should be a lot of nuggets to quote him on.

[ouwasp]

oddball thought: how do you think Leach would do as a color commentator for the OU broadcast booth?

The whole TT thing is bizarre. It would be hard to make up stuf like this. Why didn't they fire Leach last week? What if he had submitted a written apology? Funny: if he had submitted an apology, then used his postgame presser to disavow the letter :D

[TUSooner]

Here's the new ESPN College Gameday line up:
Rece Davis, Mike Leach, Craig James

[beer4me]

I can't wait for Leach to throw in his two cents (after the legal stuff is done). He will probably have to keep his mouth shut until after his case is settled in court. But maybe not......knowing his Leachisms. Should be a lot of nuggets to quote him on.

It should be greatness of the highest order :D

[ouduckhunter]

ESPN= no transparency. If ESPN were truly professional, and not the money harlots that they are (especially since the merger with Mickey Mouse), they would recuse themselves from this entire thing due to a conflict of interest.

ITA, ESpin is so full of sanctimonious idiots that my head is spinning!! This just makes me so furious!!

I hope that all Leach fans bombard ESpin with complaint calls everytime Craig James is on air!

[beer4me]

ITA, ESpin is so full of sanctimonious idiots that my head is spinning!! This just makes me so furious!!

I hope that all Leach fans bombard ESpin with complaint calls everytime Craig James is on air!


Yep on that they should lock up their switchboard !!

[TUSooner]

ESPiN full of "sanctimonious idiots"? Yes! Just the right phrase.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Personally, I like Leach. He's an interesting and colorful coach. We'll see if more crapola comes out, but I'm really thinking his bad relationship with the AD is at the root of this, and that Leach will be exonerated and that the little faggoty James boy will be run outta town on a rail. At least that's what I'm hoping.

i hear he is applying at the post office.

[Blues1]

There's Only ONE Coach I can think of that Could take this PILE of Shiiitt at Texas Tech and make it Look Like A PONY.....

And I never really like him that much - But I do think he could do ONE HELLVA of a Job Under these conditions....I'm Serious....

LOU HOLTZ ---- Get Ready Lou and get Rockin' ~~~ :)

[beer4me]

There's Only ONE Coach I can think of that Could take this PILE of Shiiitt at Texas Tech and make it Look Like A PONY.....

And I never really like him that much - But I do think he could do ONE HELLVA of a Job Under these conditions....I'm Serious....

LOU HOLTZ ---- Get Ready Lou and get Rockin' ~~~ :)


I kinda like Lou he is pretty funny sometimes but I don't think at his age now he could do it.

[budbarrybob]

oddball thought: how do you think Leach would do as a color commentator for the OU broadcast booth?

The whole TT thing is bizarre. It would be hard to make up stuf like this. Why didn't they fire Leach last week? What if he had submitted a written apology? Funny: if he had submitted an apology, then used his postgame presser to disavow the letter :D

Or pull a Franchoine and quit after the bowl game AND disavow the letter stating he did it to play in the bowl game :D

[ouduckhunter]

I wonder when Donald Trump is holding his press conference to show support for Leach!! And, will ESpin cover it???

[Salt City Sooner]

Here's the new ESPN College Gameday line up:
Rece Davis, Mike Leach, Mills Lane, Craig James
Patched that up for ya. ;)

[NOVSooner]

so where's leach end up? Cincy?

[Scott D]

Cincy hired Butch Jones from Central Michigan.

[Scott D]

Oh and Craig James probably doesn't need the ESPN job, I'm sure his pension from SMU has kicked in by now ;)

[TUSooner]

Here's the new ESPN College Gameday line up:
Rece Davis, Mike Leach, Mills Lane, Craig James
Patched that up for ya. ;)
Heh, funny. But I had to Google boxing ref Mils Lane :O

[Collier11]

and Judge Mills Lane

[TUSooner]

and Judge Mills Lane

I know the face, but...... :(

[Scott D]

I know the face, but...... :(

Come out clean....LETS GET IT AWHN!

[Collier11]

He was Judge Judy before Judge Judy was popular, if I remember correctly

[Collier11]

I know the face, but...... :(

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2006/0816/box_a_lane_275.jpg[

[Scott D]

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2006/0816/box_a_lane_275.jpg[

DID TYSON ASK FOR A CHIANTI AND SOME FAVA BEANS!!! LETS GET IT AWHN!

[TXBOOMER]

The James boy should not step foot back in Lubbock. RIP Texas Tech Football. If they have any committs we want we need to get in there now. I hope all of their players start putting in their transfer request. Craig James was partially responsible for destroying SMU now Tech.

[Scott D]

If only Eric Dickerson had a son at Tech, it'd be classic right now.

[Collier11]

Itd be funny if James got his nose broke, not that I condone violence

[TXBOOMER]

I wonder if James will play in the Bowl game. If he does, TT fans will BOO his arse off. I have work with a couple of Tech grads that freaking out.

[TMcGee86]

I srsly can't imagine him being on the team. I would want to kill him. He just destroyed an entire program.

I don't know who should be more pissed, the seniors who now have to face a bowl game without leach, or the underclassmen who just had their program ripped out from under them.

All for a guy that everyone obviously hated prior to this anyway and is a bench warmer.

They should lock him in his hotel closet.

[CaliBornSoonerBred]

no need for a new thread but....

Kevin Wilson to Tech? Just throwing that out there.........

[TJKDone]

Leach is one dumb smart guy. It says somewhere that pride goes before the fall...

Hook'em

[Collier11]

Actually I have heard that he quietly wanted to get fired because he knew they had no cause, would get a big payday, and he has the community, players, and boosters behind him

[The Ghost of Mex]

I hate it when college football players are called “kids” and treated like kids. If you can go to war for your country…you are no longer a kid. All be it in Adam James’ case, an over privileged, the-world-owes-me-respect young adult. This is further evidence of the woosification of America. Grow a pair and shut up.

Daddy didn’t do him any favors last night…later on last night…later later on last night, in the middle of the night several times…and various times this morning…during the replays.

I hope Leach wins B2B National Titles at his next job. Dudes a stud. I would stand in a dark closet for the man any time.

[Collier11]

I would stand in a dark closet for the man any time.

Kinky!

[The Ghost of Mex]

Kinky!

Maybe...

[TUSooner]

Hey Vet! Don't bet the house against Tt just yet!
From ESPN.com:

Some Texas Tech players believed the university's decision to dismiss Leach was appropriate.

"I have no complaints about this decision. [Leach] put Adam [James] in a shed like an animal. Like an animal in a cage. That was bull," defensive lineman Chris Perry. "You call other players. I think it was a good decision. We have our pep back now. We practice hard this week. We had less stress this week. You know why? Because he's gone."

Said cornerback Taylor Charbonnet: The players make this team, not one coach. As Adam's friend, I didn't like it at all what [Leach] did. He was my brother and I didn't agree with it. I don't know why [Leach] did that. But I know we our fully behind [interim] coach Ruffin [McNeil]. We love him and support him."

[MeMyself&Me]

Hey Vet! Don't bet the house against Tt just yet!
From ESPN.com:

Man! That's a stark contrast to what has been reported to be said by other players...

[BoulderSooner79]

Actually I have heard that he quietly wanted to get fired because he knew they had no cause, would get a big payday, and he has the community, players, and boosters behind him

I don't know about the reason, but I do think people are overlooking the possibility that Leach *wanted* this. Not to get fired with cause (he'll fight that), but to part ways with TT. And the feeling from the Tech AD is mutual. The James kid may be a whiney *****, but that seems like a detail compared to the stance both Leach and TT have taken. There was acrimony when his contract was signed and it never went away. CFB is a sport and now you get a bonus soap opera at no extra charge!

[TMcGee86]

But I know we our fully behind [interim] coach Ruffin [McNeil]. We love him and support him."

Good luck with that.

[TUSooner]

Man! That's a stark contrast to what has been reported to be said by other players...

There definitley have been many pro-Leach anti-James opinions. Those were a suprising contrast.

Whatever, Tt without Leach is not bad for OU.

[Collier11]

Leach will land on his feet and James will still be a crybaby scrub

[Frozen Sooner]

no need for a new thread but....

Kevin Wilson to Tech? Just throwing that out there.........

Thank you. For a while I thought the "Reply to Thread" feature was broken. ;)

[TUSooner]

Leach will land on his feet and James will still be a crybaby scrub

Until he (James) has to get a real job, anyway. Maybe Daddy will help him get on at the World Wide Leader.

[Widescreen]

Not sure what to make of comments from a backup DT and another guy who isn't even listed in the 2-deep.

[cburgsooner]

I had a son who played against Adam "the spoiled brat" James, he had NO D1 sholly offers coming out of school, Daddy Craig talked Leach into giving him a Gray shirt . Ive been around Daddy Bomar and ill tell you that Craig James is a hell of alot worse,

[NOVSooner]

Cincy hired Butch Jones from Central Michigan.

slipped my mind, thanks man

[TUSooner]

Not sure what to make of comments from a backup DT and another guy who isn't even listed in the 2-deep.

Well, everybody has at least a few friends, it seems. Maybe they were bench buddies with nothing better to do than gripe.

[prrriiide]

This whole thing is playing out in the media. Every up-and-coming assistant and tier-2 HC in the country is seeing how Tech treats the winningest coach they've ever had. The only way I see Tech getting a "proven" HC is if it's an out-of-work coach a la Fulmer or Long, accompanied by a contract that reads like War and Peace. Who wants to go to work at a place where you are thanked for your efforts by your boss taking the side of a documented liar and cheat?

Tech has schidt in their mess kit on this one.

That's bad for OU and for the BigXII. We need Tech to be good.

[ouwasp]

friendly reminder... go to fark central and see some of the great items brainstormed regarding Leachgate...

[BoulderSooner79]

This is the best and most thoughtful verbiage on the subject I've seen so far. Mandel talks about there being no winners here and how it might impact TT, Leach and the father/son James combo.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/stewart_mandel/12/30/leach-fired/index.html

[TheHumanAlphabet]

In my opinion, James was a goldbricker, Leach called him on it. Tech AD hated Leach and wanted him gone. I'm wondering if the AD put James up to it to build a case against Leach. It would be great if all the Tech coaches "quit" right before kickoff and left the field. Tech is done as far as football goes. We are now the Big 12-2. I bet there will be a huge settlement prior to the lawsuit going to trial. Leach takes time off and then he stings the press with an anti-Tech/AD presser that will blow the doors off of Tech football.

[soonerboomer93]

Obscurity is welcoming sand aggie back with open arms

[Scott D]

Not sure what to make of comments from a backup DT and another guy who isn't even listed in the 2-deep.

Ironically, the same type of players that Graham Harrell said in his letter that James was spreading his 'message' to since he joined the football program.

[Leroy Lizard]

LOL. Hiding behind beaurocratic policies and procedures may work with subordinates and employees but it fails miserably when dealing with those outside of the workplace....ie your clients and customers.

This WAS an internal affair involving a student and a coach. It should have been handled as such.

[Leroy Lizard]

Not sure what to make of comments from a backup DT and another guy who isn't even listed in the 2-deep.

Actually, those players often have a better perspective on things. Too often we ask the star players how they were treated. "Very well." Of course, you were the star player.

[Leroy Lizard]

In my opinion, James was a goldbricker, Leach called him on it. Tech AD hated Leach and wanted him gone. I'm wondering if the AD put James up to it to build a case against Leach.

If I want to pull off an underhanded, illegal move, the last person I'm going to approach is the son of a network announcer.

[Leroy Lizard]

In my opinion, James was a goldbricker, Leach called him on it. Tech AD hated Leach and wanted him gone. I'm wondering if the AD put James up to it to build a case against Leach. It would be great if all the Tech coaches "quit" right before kickoff and left the field. Tech is done as far as football goes. We are now the Big 12-2. I bet there will be a huge settlement prior to the lawsuit going to trial. Leach takes time off and then he stings the press with an anti-Tech/AD presser that will blow the doors off of Tech football.

I have a different view of what happened:

Leach didn't like James (maybe even for good reason). James shows up with sunglasses, which pisses of Leach. To punish him, he has James stand in the weight room with the lights off for two hours, making sure that James cannot sit down.

Daddy James calls the AD to complain (which he shouldn't have done). The AD tells Leach that such punishment is unacceptable, but an apology will make the situation go away. Leach digs in his heels and refuses.

If this is what happened, a firing is appropriate.

[TXBOOMER]

I have a different view of what happened:

Leach didn't like James (maybe even for good reason). James shows up with sunglasses, which pisses of Leach. To punish him, he has James stand in the weight room with the lights off for two hours, making sure that James cannot sit down.

Daddy James calls the AD to complain (which he shouldn't have done). The AD tells Leach that such punishment is unacceptable, but an apology will make the situation go away. Leach digs in his heels and refuses.

If this is what happened, a firing is appropriate.

From what I've heard that is pretty much what happened. A lot of their fans don't dfeel a firing was appropriate. Their program will go into the gutter. Just watch.

[Leroy Lizard]

What do you do when your coach refuses to write an apology that you think will avert potential lawsuits?

To me, with $800,000 on the line, Leach made this an easy decision for Tech.

[TUSooner]

Actually, those players often have a better perspective on things. Too often we ask the star players how they were treated. "Very well." Of course, you were the star player.

"Those" players? Which ones? Bad ones? Slackers? They probably have a "different" perspective but I doubt a better one.

The flip side:
There's a reason why slackers are not stars, and why they wind up in the doghouse (or the shed): They're ****ing SLACKERS !
If the coaches treated the stars badly would that even even things out?

Alienating (or neglecting) good workers is bad in any sort of enterprise. So is tolerating slackers and bad-mouthers.

Nonetheless, I agree that Adam James and his whiny daddy were primarily a great convenience for the Tt administrators who wanted Leach out anyway.

[SoonerStormchaser]

i'll just stop by and post this, cause I am furious at Tech for this:

I hope the entire Texas Tech sports program goes to hell in a handbasket for the next century...and that James kid ends up replacing his phone number a dozen times due to all the calls he's about to get.

Leach got royally ****ed today.

[Leroy Lizard]

"Those" players? Which ones? Bad ones? Slackers? They probably have a "different" perspective but I doubt a better one.

The flip side:
There's a reason why slackers are not stars, and why they wind up in the doghouse (or the shed): They're ****ing SLACKERS !
If the coaches treated the stars badly would that even even things out?

The question here is, "Did Leach administer punishment that the community would consider unusually severe?"

Now, you can ask the star players, but I'm not sure they are the best source. You should ask the benchwarmers and the slackers. They are the ones, if any, that would have faced such forms of punishment.

So the fact that two benchwarmers were interviewed is probably a good thing. They would know more than others about the type of punishment metered out for poor performance.


Alienating (or neglecting) good workers is bad in any sort of enterprise. So is tolerating slackers and bad-mouthers.

I'm not going to have a worker stand in a darkened room, no matter how badly they slack. There are just some things you shouldn't do to others. And it could very well be that Leach went over the line.

Throw him off the team if you really don't want him. But if you are going to keep him on the team, then treat him like a human being.

Given that, I'm not saying Leach mistreated Adam. I really don't know what happened.

[Leroy Lizard]

We don't even know if Adam James initiated any of this. For all we know, he mentioned the incident to his dad and it got taken out of his hands. So I'm not sure that Adam deserves all the hate we are dishing his way.

Sometimes it's hard to see the other person's view.

[Veritas]

Boo ****ing hoo, you had to stand in a shed. ****, what a whiny candy-***. If I'd have been given a choice between standing in a darkened shed and running bleachers until I puked whenever I pissed off the coaches, I know which one I've have taken.

[Widescreen]

So the fact that two benchwarmers were interviewed is probably a good thing. They would know more than others about the type of punishment metered out for poor performance.

That's laughable. People generally don't like being punished and don't typically have a favorable view of the person responsible for their punishment.

Mr. Criminal, tell us your opinion of the judge who put you in the pokey for 3 years.

[Petro-Sooner]

Boo ****ing hoo, you had to stand in a shed. ****, what a whiny candy-***. If I'd have been given a choice between standing in a darkened shed and running bleachers until I puked whenever I pissed off the coaches, I know which one I've have taken.

Agreed!

[Leroy Lizard]

Boo ****ing hoo, you had to stand in a shed. ****, what a whiny candy-***. If I'd have been given a choice between standing in a darkened shed and running bleachers until I puked whenever I pissed off the coaches, I know which one I've have taken.

Go in a darkened room and stand for over two hours. Time drags. It looks like he was forced to do this two days in a row.

It's needless humiliation. (Now, I'm not sure this really happened.)


That's laughable. People generally don't like being punished and don't typically have a favorable view of the person responsible for their punishment.

Mr. Criminal, tell us your opinion of the judge who put you in the pokey for 3 years.

The question was, "What happened to you when you faced punishment?" Asking someone who never faced any punishment is worthless. You have to ask those that endured it.

[guzziguy]

Go in a darkened room and stand for over two hours. Time drags. It looks like he was forced to do this two days in a row.

It's needless humiliation. (Now, I'm not sure this really happened.)



The question was, "What happened to you when you faced punishment?" Asking someone who never faced any punishment is worthless. You have to ask those that endured it.

Did AJ show up two days in a row with a pissy attitude and shades? You would have thought once would have been enough to strongly suggest a change in the student athlete's behavior was in order. I'm with the lead pirate here.

[Leroy Lizard]

Did AJ show up two days in a row with a pissy attitude and shades?

I don't know. I am not sure anyone here does.

But forcing a player to stand in a darkened room is an unusual punishment. I don't think I have ever heard of such a thing. Unusual punishments are not a good idea, because you don't know the real effect on the player's psyche.

Coaches should rely on commonly accepted techniques for handling this type of problem. And most importantly, they need to be man enough to apologize when the higher-ups point out the problems with their methods.

This is a situation that was handled badly by everyone involved.

[ashley]

If his punishment was truly demeaning and something no other players were ever subjected to then you have a real problem on your hands.

[MeMyself&Me]

Go in a darkened room and stand for over two hours. Time drags. It looks like he was forced to do this two days in a row.

It's needless humiliation. (Now, I'm not sure this really happened.)



The question was, "What happened to you when you faced punishment?" Asking someone who never faced any punishment is worthless. You have to ask those that endured it.

I'm guessing you never ran bleachers or 'lines' as we used to do. I'd take the dark shed any day... and it ain't even close. Yeah, boredom sucks, but it don't hurt. Humiliating? I don't see how this is more humiliating than being singled out to do bleachers which has been a part of football for as long as football has been around.

[SoonerBacker]

From KCBD in Lubbock:
http://www.kcbd.com/global/video/flash/popupplayer.asp?ClipID1=4421239&h1=EXCLUSIVE%20look%20at%20the%20rooms%20in%20ques tion&vt1=v&at1=News&d1=333700&LaunchPageAdTag=Sport&activePane=info&rnd=8696014


Check it out if you want to see the rooms in question. While I realize that this is an interview with Leach's lawyer, I will say that if this is the truth, TT F'd up BIG TIME!

[MeMyself&Me]

Also, this 'punishment' complied with what Adams told Leach regarding doctors orders.

[Leroy Lizard]

I'm guessing you never ran bleachers or 'lines' as we used to do. I'd take the dark shed any day... and it ain't even close. Yeah, boredom sucks, but it don't hurt. Humiliating? I don't see how this is more humiliating than being singled out to do bleachers which has been a part of football for as long as football has been around.

This isn't just boredom we are talking about.

Also, placing someone in a dark room and forcing him to stand is pretty juvenile.

We are also assuming that Adam James did something worth punishment, but that hasn't been established either. Leach may have just been pissed that James showed up with sunglasses and went off on him.


Also, this 'punishment' complied with what Adams told Leach regarding doctors orders.

That is very misleading. All the doctor said was that the punishment didn't have any harmful effects on the player's concussion. That does not excuse the punishment.

Forcing him to walk naked in the mall wouldn't have harmed his concussion any either, but so what?

[olevetonahill]

Guys arguing with ll is Futile .
No matter what stance you take He will take the opposite:rolleyes:

[Leroy Lizard]

I just tend to oppose mob mentality. And that is exactly what this is: mob mentality.

[Piware]

Texas Tech has pooped in their chili on this one and it's not looking so hot for Craig James and his spoiled little kid either. There must be something genetic about a compulsion to destroy one CFB program after another.

If ESPN had a hand in this, they should be barred from every campus in the country.

I like Leach and, after watching the interview with his attoryney, I don't blame him for not apologizing when he did nothing wrong. Unorthodox - perhaps, wrong - don't think so.

[Leroy Lizard]

It's interesting that you say you like Leach. I think that is coloring a lot of this. Also, a lot of people don't like Craig James, which is part of the problem.

[ouwasp]

fellow posters: I have learned the ignore button is your friend. I have used it once, just the other day. :)

Now if you would just quit quoting the fellow I am ignoring please. :)

[SicEmBaylor]

It's interesting that you say you like Leach. I think that is coloring a lot of this. Also, a lot of people don't like Craig James, which is part of the problem.

I've always liked Craig James and Mike Leach. I especially like Craig James.

In this incident though, CJ has shown himself to be a major league *******.

[BIGC]

Not like Leach sent the kid to Gitmo and had him waterboarded. Personally I see nothing wrong with Leach's actions based on what I have seen published. Heck Bear Bryant subjected his entire teams to far worse than what this kid went through, back then it was character building, today we call it abuse. Guess when I put my daughter in timeout and make her stand in the corner I better check on who is watching since this practice is now a mortal sin at even the college level. Would hate to be fired from my own house;)

[Kimberlyz4OU]

yep.........Craig James = PRICK - he was just talking about how hard this has been on his family

Gah, grow the H up - BOTH of you! I honestly cannot wait to hear Leach talk about this, love him!!

[Leroy Lizard]

I certainly think he made a mistake in raising the issue to Tech. But at that point this may have had less to do with him than the relationship between the coach and AD.

[prrriiide]

What do you do when your coach refuses to write an apology that you think will avert potential lawsuits?

To me, with $800,000 on the line, Leach made this an easy decision for Tech.

According to Leach"s mouthpiece, he was, in fact, never afforded the choice of apologizing or not. Reports to the contrary notwithstanding.

[Leroy Lizard]

Not like Leach sent the kid to Gitmo and had him waterboarded. Personally I see nothing wrong with Leach's actions based on what I have seen published. Heck Bear Bryant subjected his entire teams to far worse than what this kid went through, back then it was character building, today we call it abuse. Guess when I put my daughter in timeout and make her stand in the corner I better check on who is watching since this practice is now a mortal sin at even the college level.

We can always dredge up more severe punishments, especially if we go back to the days when you could practically kill a player and get away with it (a la Darrell Royal).

Let's not use Gitmo and waterboarding as our standard for what constitutes a harsh penalty.

[Leroy Lizard]

According to Leach"s mouthpiece, he was, in fact, never afforded the choice of apologizing or not. Reports to the contrary notwithstanding.

I think whether he was asked to apologize is a crucial bit of information here.

[Explodo]

not really...there was nothing to apologize for.

[OU Adonis]

Check this out.

On the dallas morning news

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/12-09/1231newleach.pdf

[Explodo]

Oh BTW...I'm Sorry. I'm sorry for global warming, Bigfoot, the Loch Ness Monster and The great Farrah Fawcett Poster staining incident of 1979.

[BoulderSooner79]

It's interesting that you say you like Leach. I think that is coloring a lot of this. Also, a lot of people don't like Craig James, which is part of the problem.

I have to agree and this is what TT wants. They want everyone to focus on James when the incident was just an excuse. Myers wanted to get rid of Leach and he was going to find a way to do it. Now if we wind the time machine ahead several years, how do you think all the actors in this play end up? This will not end well for James father/son pair. I suspect Craig will not be with ESPN. TT will have to get real lucky with the next coach to post a similar winning percentage as they had with Leach. And I'll bet their football revenue takes an immediate hit - could cost the AD his job. Leach will probably come out okay. He may have to sit out a year on TT's dime, but he probably ends up a HC at a place he would rather be than Lubbock (with higher pay). The one caveat is that he may have to tone it down a bit in order to convince the next AD he won't be a problem. It won't hurt my feelings if TT is an easier 'W' for us in the future - the big12 south doesn't need more competition. ;)

[Leroy Lizard]

not really...there was nothing to apologize for.

First of all, we really don't know that. Second, sometimes you have to apologize in instances where you think you did nothing wrong. Leach is a lawyer. He knows that.

[BIGC]

We can always dredge up more severe punishments, especially if we go back to the days when you could practically kill a player and get away with it (a la Darrell Royal).

Let's not use Gitmo and waterboarding as our standard for what constitutes a harsh penalty.

Wasn't the point at all, apparently you missed the point! I can tell you and I would never see eye to eye... end of discussion.... Gitmo, was a point of sarcaism not a true point of the discussion.

[olevetonahill]

Arguing with the Leapin Lizard
Is like arguing with http://www.downbeast.com/FencePost.jpg

[OU Adonis]

"Good, ignore aything the do between now and tuesday except acknowledging receipt of his fully executed contract as presented. I hope he doesn't sign, that gives us a full year to find another coach after we fire him after next season and pay off the remaining year on his contract...."

That was in an email last year. Thats gotta be damning to TT no?

[MeMyself&Me]

fellow posters: I have learned the ignore button is your friend. I have used it once, just the other day. :)

Now if you would just quit quoting the fellow I am ignoring please. :)

Where is this 'ignore' button you speak of? I'm not seeing it. I didn't even notice it was LL I was replying to or I wouldn't have bothered.

[Leroy Lizard]

olevet, you have only stated this about thirty times by now.

[TMcGee86]

Also, placing someone in a dark room and forcing him to stand is pretty juvenile.

you keep saying "forcing him to stand" like it's some kind of punishment. Even at my high school we were not allowed to sit or kneel during practice. You stood on the sidelines.

So why should it be any different for James? He told the coach the doc said no sunlight, and Leach gave him no sunlight.

I guaranfreakingtee you that everyone else stood for those two hours. There is nothing cruel or unusual about requiring college athletes to stand for two hours.

[Leroy Lizard]

That was in an email last year. Thats gotta be damning to TT no?

Who wrote it, and to whom? Is it authentic?

[Explodo]

First of all, we really don't know that. Second, sometimes you have to apologize in instances where you think you did nothing wrong. Leach is a lawyer. He knows that.

See post 481...

[OU Adonis]

Who wrote it, and to whom? Is it authentic?

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/img/12-09/1231newleach.pdf

Its on the Dallas Morning news... read the document. Its on page 4 of the PDF.

[guzziguy]

fellow posters: I have learned the ignore button is your friend. I have used it once, just the other day. :)

Now if you would just quit quoting the fellow I am ignoring please. :)

Thank you so much for reminding me of the ignore setting. The board appears to be tilting toward sanity already.

[prrriiide]

I think whether he was asked to apologize is a crucial bit of information here.

Click the link in post #464 and watch at 2:20. He categorically states that the apology offer was never made. "Never happened."

Leach has been thrown under the bus at the behest of a proven liar and cheat, mainly because there isn't enough room in Lubbock for the egos of both Leach and the AD. TTU is going to get what it deserves. I feel sorry for the players and fans that are standing downwind now that the schidt has hit the fan. There are already rumors coming out of Lubbock that one of the multi-million dollar donors to their stadium expansion has withdrawn his support. TTU's admin hasn't just stepped in it...they're wallerin around in it like pigs in a sty.

[Leroy Lizard]

you keep saying "forcing him to stand" like it's some kind of punishment. Even at my high school we were not allowed to sit or kneel during practice. You stood on the sidelines.

So why should it be any different for James? He told the coach the doc said no sunlight, and Leach gave him no sunlight.

I guaranfreakingtee you that everyone else stood for those two hours. There is nothing cruel or unusual about requiring college athletes to stand for two hours.

Craig James played college and pro football and felt that the punishment was beyond called for, to the point where he called the AD on it.

So, who really knows?

[Leroy Lizard]

Click the link in post #464 and watch at 2:20. He categorically states that the apology offer was never made. "Never happened."

What is the university saying?

If they never offered the option to apologize, that makes a difference in my eyes.

[TMcGee86]

Click the link in post #464 and watch at 2:20. He categorically states that the apology offer was never made. "Never happened."

Leach has been thrown under the bus at the behest of a proven liar and cheat, mainly because there isn't enough room in Lubbock for the egos of both Leach and the AD. TTU is going to get what it deserves. I feel sorry for the players and fans that are standing downwind now that the schidt has hit the fan. There are already rumors coming out of Lubbock that one of the multi-million dollar donors to their stadium expansion has withdrawn his support. TTU's admin hasn't just stepped in it...they're wallerin around in it like pigs in a sty.

Well, he dealt a little in fancy lawyer talk there.

He never said they didn't request an apology. What he said was that there was never an agreement that if he apologized that he would get his job back, or something to that effect.

[Leroy Lizard]

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...31newleach.pdf

Its on the Dallas Morning news... read the document. Its on page 4 of the PDF.

It's not loading.

[OU Adonis]

Keep trying, I am sure its getting hit a lot

[TMcGee86]

Craig James played college and pro football and felt that the punishment was beyond called for, to the point where he called the AD on it.

So, who really knows?

Well that's hardly an unbiased source, but was this even "punishment"? I think leach just check-raised him. The kid tried to be a punk (imho) and Leach said okay if sunlight bugs, I am going to be doubly careful.

Son got butthurt about it and daddy called down the thunder.