Talk of "Big 10" to go to 12 Teams...?

[Blues1]

Mizzou to THE BIG Ten....?

Link

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/report-big-ten-to-make-expansion-statement-today/....

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Mizzou isn't going anywhere

[Sasakwa]

They need to go to 12 and have a conference championship game. If they did, and the Pac-10 did the same, we'd be closer to a playoff.

Mizzou brings alot of TVs to that conference, but I'm sure they'd rather have ND.

[TopDawg]

If any Big XII team should go over there, it should be Iowa State. I know it's less appealing, but it makes more geographical sense.

[BoulderSooner79]

I'll be sooo confused if we end up with 2 big12s. Maybe the big10/11 should just be called the "conference formally known as the big10". Or just go the Prince route and invent a nameless symbol.

[illinisooner]

As a Big 10 guy, I'd prefer Notre Dame or Pitt over Mizzou. And the talk of adding Rutgers or Syracuse is ridiculous. Maybe we could add Iowa St!? Kidding. I think within a few years, all the BCS conferences will have 12 teams and a conference title game. Maybe the Pac 10 could get Utah and someone else like New Mexico? No idea about the Big East, although they do have 16 teams in basketball lol.

[TopDawg]

I think within a few years, all the BCS conferences will have 12 teams and a conference title game. Maybe the Pac 10 could get Utah and someone else like New Mexico? No idea about the Big East, although they do have 16 teams in basketball lol.

I've already got it worked out. Don't worry.

[badger]

The old guy who has pushed it for years (Joe Pa) would rather they expand out east than head south or west... or southwest, heh.

I could see them going after Rutgers or Syracuse or a fertile recruiting ground out there to raid the Big Least.

The former Wisconsin coach coming out for Big 10 expansion doesn't surprise me. Wisconsin won two Rose Bowls with Heisman Trophy winner Ron Dayne, but they never were in the discussion for a national championship.

[MI Sooner]

Why wouldn't Missouri want to leave? Traditional Rivalry w/ Kansas? Minor sports? Academics? Geography?

As of the most recent data I found, which appears to be a couple years old, the Big 10 football revenue/team is 15% higher than the Big 12 ($76 million vs. $66 million). Also, T-Boone U's numbers seem to be inflated since they got $10 million more than Oklahoma, which I'm guessing isn't an annual occurance.

[ndpruitt03]

Give them ISU and Mizzou, put TCU and Tulsa in the Big 12 and change the divisions to east west instead of north south.

[rawlingsHOH]

As a Big 10 guy, I'd prefer Notre Dame or Pitt over Mizzou. And the talk of adding Rutgers or Syracuse is ridiculous. Maybe we could add Iowa St!? Kidding. I think within a few years, all the BCS conferences will have 12 teams and a conference title game. Maybe the Pac 10 could get Utah and someone else like New Mexico? No idea about the Big East, although they do have 16 teams in basketball lol.

Never thought of Pitt before. Makes sense geographically. Are they up to the standards academically?

[John Kochtoston]

ND won't join the Big 10, since the Big 10 will require ND to join as an equal partner. If ND does ever decide to join a conference (more likely than one might think, since Comcast won't put up with paying big bucks for crappy numbers on NBC), the Irish will go to the Big East, since the BE is desperate and will let ND dictate terms of joining (uneven revenue splits and TV money). Plus, ND is already in the Big East for everything but football, so they wouldn't need to uproot an entire athletic department.

As to the Big 10, I think both Nebraska and Mizzou are both likely candidates. Nebraska has always (somewhat justifiably) felt shafted by the Big 12 and wouldn't mind the extra cheese the Big 10 would bring in. Mizzou would bring the KC and St. Louis markets with them, which would be desirable from a Big 10 perspective. They can always play Kansas as an OOC game.

However, at the end of the day, I think the Big 10 goes East, either to Pitt, Rutgers or Syracuse. Big TV markets, and a school would be more willing to move from the Big East instead of the Big 12, IMHO.

[KC//CRIMSON]

http://cdn.wl.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/vandy2.jpg

The Big Ten Conference is talking about expansion again. Wisconsin AD and former football coach Barry Alvarez is planning to amp up the 11-team conference’s charge to find a 12th member, which would allow the league to split into two divisions and host a championship game.

“We’re irrelevant for the last three weeks of the football season because we’re not playing,” Alvarez said Friday. –ESPN.

Alavarez and proponents of expansion face an uphill battle in bringing another mouth to feed. Notre Dame, with their lucrative football TV deal running through 2015, seems to be out. I’ve heard arguments for Missouri and Pittsburgh being natural fits, but only in a football context. That’s great, but the faculties of the conference’s current member schools won’t care. Fortunately, there’s a better, more mind-blowing option for a 12th school that has a much better chance of making everyone happy.

Vanderbilt.

Is it an ideal fit? Maybe not, but the possibility of Vanderbilt defecting to the north is a conversation that needs to be had. The school has ties to the Big Ten (Ohio State president Gordon Gee most recently held that same post at the Nashville institution), plus a burgeoning academic reputation among the best schools in the nation. Its recent disbanding of its athletic department could indicate that Vandy wants to get away from the hyper-competitiveness of the SEC, and joining a new conference for a change of scenery might be of some appeal.

http://cdn.wl.uproxx.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/big_ten_map.jpg

Geographically, Vanderbilt is not ideal for the Big Ten, nor vice versa. Even as the SEC’s second-northernmost school, the longest Big Ten road trip by bus (Minnesota) would be 13 hours. Which is longer than the 9-1/2 hour bus trip that the women’s basketball team would face heading to Gainesville each season, but still a far cry from the 23-hour road trip that the ACC’s Boston College would take if it drove down to fellow conference member Miami.

Vanderbilt joining the Big Ten is more than simple food for thought. It might be the only school that has a chance of being ratified by the Big Ten’s faculty. And their Nashville TV market wouldn’t upset the Big Ten Network, either. Besides, the football people just need a warm body to beat on for three months. Vandy fits the bill for everyone.-WL

[John Kochtoston]

Give them ISU and Mizzou, put TCU and Tulsa in the Big 12 and change the divisions to east west instead of north south.

Right, because it's a good idea to replace big state schools, with their large alumni bases and ability to raise revenue, with small, private schools that have little chance to keep up in facilities and revenue races. :rolleyes:

[badger]

I would endorse the Vandy move - the SEC probably hides a lot of its dirty football secrets in its only private school.

Also, as for the complaints about travel time... durrr... NASHVILLE!!!! Wisconsin goes to Hawaii once every four years and you don't hear THEM complaining how long it takes to get on Honolulu!

[ndpruitt03]

Right, because it's a good idea to replace big state schools, with their large alumni bases and ability to raise revenue, with small, private schools that have little chance to keep up in facilities and revenue races. :rolleyes:

It would make the conference easier to win.

[rawlingsHOH]

Right, because it's a good idea to replace big state schools, with their large alumni bases and ability to raise revenue, with small, private schools that have little chance to keep up in facilities and revenue races. :rolleyes:
Agree.

TCU has simply been a hot football program the last few years, with a real good coach.

But they'd just end up another Baylor (Vandy, Northwestern, etc) if thrown into the Big 12, eventually.

It's about $.

[John Kochtoston]

It would make the conference easier to win.

It's not about easy to win. It's about MONEY.

[Jello Biafra]

“We’re irrelevant for the last three weeks of the football season because we’re not playing,” Alvarez said Friday. –ESPN.



yeh, THAT'S why their irrelevant.

[StoopTroup]

Give em ISU and put ND in the Big XII

Trade TCU for Baylor too.

[Sasakwa]

Nebraska would never get the invite based on academics. I could see Mizzou going if they could still play KU every year or almost every year in most sports. If they kept that matchup thats just gravy for the Big 10 who gets the benefit of all those extra viewers. I think they make more sense than Pitt and no way they go after Syracuse or Rutgers.

The Big 10 has a MUCH better TV deal than the Big XII. Why does our deal suck so bad? Look at the TV markets we reach. Its embarrassing. If Mizzou bolts and the North continues to suck and our TV deal continues to suck, we could see the conference take a big step back.

[SoonerPr8r]

Give them Mizzou, Take Tulsa (or Arkie) and Change their name to the Big North

[Jello Biafra]

Nebraska would never get the invite based on academics. I could see Mizzou going if they could still play KU every year or almost every year in most sports. If they kept that matchup thats just gravy for the Big 10 who gets the benefit of all those extra viewers. I think they make more sense than Pitt and no way they go after Syracuse or Rutgers.

The Big 10 has a MUCH better TV deal than the Big XII. Why does our deal suck so bad? Look at the TV markets we reach. Its embarrassing. If Mizzou bolts and the North continues to suck and our TV deal continues to suck, we could see the conference take a big step back.

no^^^ if the big XII continues to play in the NC title game, we won't take a step back. hell, until we dropped out of the top 25 recently, at least for the last 3 years, we were damn near a lock for a must see game every week.

keep at least 3 porgams in the top 10 every year, we
(BIG XII) will have nation wide television locked on us.

[badger]

If we go for just TV-wise, there are a few programs we HAVE to keep.

Texas, Mizzou and Colorado.

Denver market's huge, St. Louis/Kansas City is a huge market, and Austin/Houston/Dallas/rest of Texas is huge.

We can't lose those three, without trying to get another big market. If we do lose one of those guys, we might try going after Memphis. They have to feel a little bit rejected by not getting a Big East invite, no?

[John Kochtoston]

Nebraska would never get the invite based on academics. I could see Mizzou going if they could still play KU every year or almost every year in most sports. If they kept that matchup thats just gravy for the Big 10 who gets the benefit of all those extra viewers. I think they make more sense than Pitt and no way they go after Syracuse or Rutgers.

The Big 10 has a MUCH better TV deal than the Big XII. Why does our deal suck so bad? Look at the TV markets we reach. Its embarrassing. If Mizzou bolts and the North continues to suck and our TV deal continues to suck, we could see the conference take a big step back.

Nebraska is an AAU school, which is what the Big 10 cares about.
http://www.aau.edu/about/article.aspx?id=5476

The Big 12 TV deal does suck, but the Big 10 does have the Nos. 3, 11, 15, 18 and 23 markets. That's a bigger draw than 5, 10, 16 and 21 for the Big 12, and that's why they get the better deal.

http://www.tvjobs.com/cgi-bin/markets/market2.cgi

[Scott D]

1. Any 12th team will not be Missouri.

2. Notre Dame is first on their list, followed by 3 Big East schools...Pitt, Syracuse, and Cincy (the least likely candidate) which is about even with UConn on the wish list.

3. Iowa State will not be given consideration.

4. The Big-10 would likely change it's name to reflect regionality (ala the SEC/Pac-10).

To recap...quit thinking they're going to raid the Big-12 for Missouri, it is absolutely not going to happen, and that has come from people within the Conference multiple times.

[John Kochtoston]

1. Any 12th team will not be Missouri.

2. Notre Dame is first on their list, followed by 3 Big East schools...Pitt, Syracuse, and Cincy (the least likely candidate) which is about even with UConn on the wish list.

3. Iowa State will not be given consideration.

4. The Big-10 would likely change it's name to reflect regionality (ala the SEC/Pac-10).

To recap...quit thinking they're going to raid the Big-12 for Missouri, it is absolutely not going to happen, and that has come from people within the Conference multiple times.

I won't argue about Missouri, since you seem to know more about that situation. However, ND won't be the pick either, since ND won't join on equal footing, and the other schools in the Big 10 won't let the Irish in any other way. I think Rutgers will be looked at, as well.

Agreed on the Iowa State comment. They'll probably go back to the term "Western Conference" which was the official name up until the 50s or 60s.

[TopDawg]

4. The Big-10 would likely change it's name to reflect regionality (ala the SEC/Pac-10).

Great Lakes Conference.

[rawlingsHOH]

4. The Big-10 would likely change it's name to reflect regionality (ala the SEC/Pac-10).
I'll take that bet!

[BoulderSooner79]

Could go to Big10ish

[BillyBall]

4. The Big-10 would likely change it's name to reflect regionality (ala the SEC/Pac-10).


The Norris Division

[TopDawg]

Could go to Big10ish

Big 10 Or So
Big 10 Give-Or-Take

[badger]

Old name: Big Televen
New name: Big T-t-twelve

[sooneredaco]

To quote Alverez I think a good name for them would be The Big "Irrelevent"... Has a ring to it IMO

[Scott D]

I won't argue about Missouri, since you seem to know more about that situation. However, ND won't be the pick either, since ND won't join on equal footing, and the other schools in the Big 10 won't let the Irish in any other way. I think Rutgers will be looked at, as well.

Agreed on the Iowa State comment. They'll probably go back to the term "Western Conference" which was the official name up until the 50s or 60s.

The Notre Dame angle is pretty interesting as a whole. ND wants to pretty much be on a par with Texas in terms of dictating to the conference. The wildcard in the matter goes back to the the stronghold of alumni in Chicago.

What makes the situation even more confusing, and honestly might make Notre Dame more amenable to considering joining the Big-10 is the fact that it's still very very possible that the domers lose their tv deal, so they'll need to replace that revenue stream in some manner.

Personally I think the likely candidate will be from the pool of Big East teams that fit in more than just Football and can be considered more of a natural rivalry.

[Harris County Sooner]

The radio sports dorks here in Houston were talking up UH as a Big 10 expansion. Makes absolutely no sense no matter how you analyze it. I wish they would share what they are smoking.

[Harris County Sooner]

The Big 10 could pick up 3 more teams and be the Big 10-4, good buddy.

[King Barry's Back]

As a Big 10 guy, I'd prefer Notre Dame or Pitt over Mizzou. And the talk of adding Rutgers or Syracuse is ridiculous. Maybe we could add Iowa St!? Kidding. I think within a few years, all the BCS conferences will have 12 teams and a conference title game. Maybe the Pac 10 could get Utah and someone else like New Mexico? No idea about the Big East, although they do have 16 teams in basketball lol.

Rutgers/Syracuse is NOT ridiculous, in fact, other ND's national draw, bringing in NY/NJ TV screens is pretty much the only expansion objective that makes sense.

Somebody mentioned that Big 10's football revenues were already ahead of the Big XIIs -- geez, imagine where they'll be with a CCF? And imagine where they will be with a buttload of NY/NJ-ites tuned in to their TV package? Or ND fans nationwide?

Missouri would be very good for them, but not as good as NY. Pleeze. Plus, luring them away from the Big XII is problematic. Not that it couldn't be done, but the Big XII is a pretty good conference.

Iowa State? Now that's a ridiculous idea. State fans are wonderful people and probably my favorite in the Big XII, but they'd bring about 10 TV sets with them. And no recruiting grounds. Iowa is already a big 10 state, period.

Pitt doesn't look so attractive to me as the conference already has the PA TV market with PSU. Maybe wrapping up western PA looks good for them?

My guess is that it will be Syracuse or Rutgers. They are already in crappy conferences, and a pitch from the Big 10 doesn't seem like a tough sell. A shot at the Rose Bowl? Sounds good to northeasterners, I'd guess.

And I'd guess that informal feelers have already gone out, and been positively received, by at least one leading contender-- and that school's new status of Big 10 member will soon be announced.

Otherwise, I think the conference wouldn't be going public with it.

[mightysooner]

Trade TCU for Baylor too.

Oh hell no. I've heard people say this over and over. Does the Big XII south need to be any tougher as a division? Put TCU in the North and kick ISU out. They'd bring some star power to the Big XII for sure and....add to the competitiveness of the conference as compared to the SEC.

[King Barry's Back]

Big 10 Or So
Big 10 Give-Or-Take

Big 10, plus or minus

Circa Big 10

Somebody said "Western Conference"? For a conference with teams in MI, IA, IL, OH, PA? Western? Are you kidding me?

[ndpruitt03]

Oh hell no. I've heard people say this over and over. Does the Big XII south need to be any tougher as a division? Put TCU in the North and kick ISU out. They'd bring some star power to the Big XII for sure and....add to the competitiveness of the conference as compared to the SEC.

If TCU and Baylor traded places then they would be about the same type programs now as the other one is. TCU would be last in the south, Baylor would be dominating a smaller conference. Baylor was holding their own in the SWC every year. No one would have thought they would have been as bad as they are when this conference formed.

[mightysooner]

If TCU and Baylor traded places then they would be about the same type programs now as the other one is. TCU would be last in the south, Baylor would be dominating a smaller conference. Baylor was holding their own in the SWC every year. No one would have thought they would have been as bad as they are when this conference formed.


No way TCU would be last in the south. Third maybe....but last? No way man.

[John Kochtoston]

Big 10, plus or minus

Circa Big 10

Somebody said "Western Conference"? For a conference with teams in MI, IA, IL, OH, PA? Western? Are you kidding me?

That was the conference's name for a while ... admittedly the name was created when those states were "The West." Just saying.

[cdlbdd]

If TCU and Baylor traded places then they would be about the same type programs now as the other one is. TCU would be last in the south, Baylor would be dominating a smaller conference. Baylor was holding their own in the SWC every year. No one would have thought they would have been as bad as they are when this conference formed.

Agree.

[ndpruitt03]

No way TCU would be last in the south. Third maybe....but last? No way man.

In 1995 Baylor had been to 16 bowl games all time, 3 of those in the 90s
TCU had been to 15 all time and 1 in the decade of the 90s

There's a good chance TCU would have ended up even worse than Baylor.

[rawlingsHOH]

No way TCU would be last in the south. Third maybe....but last? No way man.

The point is, if you put TCU in the Big 12, eventually their lack of resources would get the better of them, and they'd be swallowed up too.

And yes, Baylor was a better football program than TCU at the inception of the Big 12. Not to mention, 10x the better overall athletic dept.

[badger]

From recent articles, it sounds like the Big 10 is serious about this now.

Circle the wagons, Big 12. We don't want them stealing any of our big TV markets (however, you are quite welcome to take Iowa State... it's a long drive up there anyways)

[49r]

Wikipedia has a pretty detailed article on the Big 10 conference, I found the history section (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Ten_Conference#History) quite informative:


On January 11, 1895, the presidents of the Universities of Chicago, Illinois, Minnesota, and Wisconsin; Northwestern and Purdue Universities, and Lake Forest College met in Chicago to discuss the regulation and control of intercollegiate athletics. The eligibility of student-athletes was one of the main topics of discussion. The Intercollegiate Conference of Faculty Representatives was founded at a second meeting on February 8, 1896. Lake Forest was not at the 1896 meeting that established the conference and was replaced by the University of Michigan. At the time, the organization was more commonly known as the Western Conference, consisting of Purdue, Michigan, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Illinois, Chicago, and Northwestern.


The conference was again known as the Big Nine after the University of Chicago decided to de-emphasize varsity athletics just after World War II. Chicago discontinued its football program in 1939 and withdrew from the conference in 1946 after struggling to gain victories in many conference matchups. It was believed that one of several schools, notably Pittsburgh, Nebraska, Michigan State, Marquette, Notre Dame, and Iowa State would replace Chicago at the time. On May 20, 1949, Michigan State ended the speculation by joining and the conference was again known as the Big Ten. The Big Ten's membership would remain unchanged for the next 40 years.

The conference’s official name throughout this period remained the Intercollegiate Conference of Faculty Representatives. It did not formally adopt the name Big Ten until 1987, when it was incorporated as a not-for-profit corporation. In 1990, the Big Ten universities voted to expand the conference to 11 teams, and extended an invitation to Penn State, which it accepted. When Penn State joined in 1990, it was decided that the conference would continue to be called the Big Ten, but its logo was modified to reflect the change; the number 11 is disguised in the white areas of the traditionally blue "Big Ten" lettering.


The University of Texas also approached and entered into discussions with the Big Ten in the 1990s. UT was keen to upgrade it's academic profile and depart the SWC and desperate to seek affiliation with the Pac 10.

"Texas wanted desperately the academic patina that the Pac 10 yielded," recalls UT President Robert Berdahl, who went on to serve as chancellor at Pac-10 member California-Berkeley. "To be associated with UCLA, Stanford and Cal in academics was very desirable."

Still, expansion in the Pac-10 depended on unanimous approval of the member schools. And Stanford, which had long battled UT in athletics as well as academics, objected. For UT, the way west never materialized.

UT next approached the Big Ten. Having added Penn State in 1990, the Big Ten was now made of universities that, in the view of UT officials, matched UT's profile — large state schools with strong academic reputations. Berdahl liked the fact that 10 conference members belonged to the American Association of Universities.

Yet, distance remained a disadvantage. Iowa, the closest Big Ten school to Austin, was 856 miles away — but the appeal of having 10 of 12 schools in the same time zone was seen as a plus.

But after adding Penn State in 1990, Big Ten officials had put a four-year moratorium on expansion. Although admitting interest, Big Ten bosses ultimately rejected UT's overtures.

[49r]

...although the part about time zones is inaccurate. The article implies that only two conference members are not in the Central Time Zone. It's actually six in Eastern Time Zone - Penn State, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Indiana and Purdue. The other five are in the Central Time Zone.

[humblesooner]

...although the part about time zones is inaccurate. The article implies that only two conference members are not in the Central Time Zone. It's actually six in Eastern Time Zone - Penn State, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Indiana and Purdue. The other five are in the Central Time Zone.

Before checking, I would have bet you were wrong.
Unfortunately, I would have lost the bet.
Good catch.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Mizzou has a better chance at winning the Big 12 than they would the Big 10/11/12 (they'd have to change their name)... Mizzou ain't going anywhere, unless they want to never win a conference championship.

[Jello Biafra]

Before checking, I would have bet you were wrong.
Unfortunately, I would have lost the bet.
Good catch.

yup me too...i knew that ND was in the central so i guess i just assumed purdue and indiana was as well.

[soonerborn30]

Even if one of the Eastern-ish teams would bring more TV's, that doesn't necessarily mean anyone will be watching said TV's. People in NY/NJ couldn't care less about college football. It's all about the Giants/Jets for them. In my experience (which, I will admit, is limited) with people from that area, not a one has cared about Rutgers or could even name the coach.

[fadada1]

notre dame is about as sharp as a sack of wet mice. #1 - nice way to treat your players by not accepting a bowl invite; #2 - while you may not NEED the money, you still need it; #3 - if you were in the big10, your travel schedule would be cake; #4 - no, you won't be able to keep all the bowl money for your greedy selves, but when you fail to make/choose not to accept a bowl, you get to get some of the money from everyone else.

DUMBASSES.

[Blues1]

2 more Links about the Big 10 going to 12

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/12665737/big-ten-expansion-to-large-dozen-makes-perfect-sense

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/15/mizzou-would-listen-to-big-ten-on-expansion/

[badger]

Mizzou has a better chance at winning the Big 12 than they would the Big 10/11/12 (they'd have to change their name)... Mizzou ain't going anywhere, unless they want to never win a conference championship.

Mizzou has been awesome lately in the Big 12 - they just won the Big 12 conference tourney and went to the Elite Eight in basketball.

They also declared two-straight Big 12 North titles before Nebraska took over again this season... tee hee, emphasis on NORTH title. They can thank us for that emphasis.

However, they remain our biggest threat of defection, so we better do our best to keep them.

[BillyBall]

Mizzou has been awesome lately in the Big 12 - they just won the Big 12 conference tourney and went to the Elite Eight in basketball.

They also declared two-straight Big 12 North titles before Nebraska took over again this season... tee hee, emphasis on NORTH title. They can thank us for that emphasis.

However, they remain our biggest threat of defection, so we better do our best to keep them.

If Mizzou does leave I would imagine that Arkansas would be the first school to be approached about joining the Big 12. What that would mean to a potential realignment of the divisions, I have no idea.

I have to believe the thinking would be to reunite old SWC rivals, so I don't know who from the South would get booted to the North to replace Mizzou.

[badger]

I am not sure whether Arkie would leave the SEC or not - it is the S-E-C! S-E-C! after all :rolleyes:

If we are indeed seeking another school, I want ALL talk on adding another Texas or Oklahoma team to STOP. We are NOT adding Tulsa, we are NOT adding SMU, Rice, Houston, North Texas, TCU, UTEP, or any of those MINOR schools. We need a NEW market to reach, and those teams don't reach new markets.

[jaux]

Rutgers will be invited and accept. It's a huge state school which is what they want and I believe it's worth the risk for more tv revenue and fan interest which would be huge if they can tap it.
Domers will join the big east. Big fish in little pond suits them now.
All this happens NLT 2012.
Just in time for us to kick the domers *** in 2013.

[badger]

Rutgers will be invited and accept. It's a huge state school which is what they want and I believe it's worth the risk for more tv revenue and fan interest which would be huge if they can tap it.
Domers will join the big east. Big fish in little pond suits them now.
All this happens NLT 2012.
Just in time for us to kick the domers *** in 2013.

Notre Dame to the Big Least makes sense - they already play basketball in that conference.

Rutgers is a perfect fit for the Big 10, as it allows them to have another far east team with a big New Jersey fanbase. Joe Pa will be pleased.

[rawlingsHOH]

I am not sure whether Arkie would leave the SEC or not - it is the S-E-C! S-E-C! after all :rolleyes:

If we are indeed seeking another school, I want ALL talk on adding another Texas or Oklahoma team to STOP. We are NOT adding Tulsa, we are NOT adding SMU, Rice, Houston, North Texas, TCU, UTEP, or any of those MINOR schools. We need a NEW market to reach, and those teams don't reach new markets.

Colorado State would be fine with me.

[delhalew]

Colorado State would be fine with me.
Does Colorado st help the our conference?
We have a colorado team who's fans can't be bothered to support their team.

[delhalew]

Rutgers will be invited and accept. It's a huge state school which is what they want and I believe it's worth the risk for more tv revenue and fan interest which would be huge if they can tap it.
Domers will join the big east. Big fish in little pond suits them now.
All this happens NLT 2012.
Just in time for us to kick the domers *** in 2013.
^this. Rutgers is the best fit and would have the smallest domino effect and have the least affect on big rivalries.

[Blues1]

If someone leaves the Big 12 ~~What about Arizona in The Big 12 --- ?
BYU or Houston ...?

[49r]

yup me too...i knew that ND was in the central so i guess i just assumed purdue and indiana was as well.

Au contraire! South Bend, IN (Notre Dame) is also in the eastern time zone! Has been since 1967.

http://www.worldtimezone.com/time-indiana12.php

:D

[badger]

If someone leaves the Big 12 ~~What about Arizona in The Big 12 --- ?
BYU or Houston ...?

The only way that I'd want another Texas school is if we were to drop one that we already have... and we really can't right now, because we need at least one private school (for hiding info purposes, heh) and the other three are big draws in their own rights.

If we were to drop Baylor and pick up both BYU and Houston, though, that would be intriguing.

[rawlingsHOH]

Does Colorado st help the our conference?
We have a colorado team who's fans can't be bothered to support their team.
Not sure. I just know it is a large, public, state university, that isn't too far of a stretch geographically, and most importantly... is not located in Texas!

[delhalew]

Rutgers/Syracuse is NOT ridiculous, in fact, other ND's national draw, bringing in NY/NJ TV screens is pretty much the only expansion objective that makes sense.

Somebody mentioned that Big 10's football revenues were already ahead of the Big XIIs -- geez, imagine where they'll be with a CCF? And imagine where they will be with a buttload of NY/NJ-ites tuned in to their TV package? Or ND fans nationwide?

Missouri would be very good for them, but not as good as NY. Pleeze. Plus, luring them away from the Big XII is problematic. Not that it couldn't be done, but the Big XII is a pretty good conference.

Iowa State? Now that's a ridiculous idea. State fans are wonderful people and probably my favorite in the Big XII, but they'd bring about 10 TV sets with them. And no recruiting grounds. Iowa is already a big 10 state, period.

Pitt doesn't look so attractive to me as the conference already has the PA TV market with PSU. Maybe wrapping up western PA looks good for them?

My guess is that it will be Syracuse or Rutgers. They are already in crappy conferences, and a pitch from the Big 10 doesn't seem like a tough sell. A shot at the Rose Bowl? Sounds good to northeasterners, I'd guess.

And I'd guess that informal feelers have already gone out, and been positively received, by at least one leading contender-- and that school's new status of Big 10 member will soon be announced.

Otherwise, I think the conference wouldn't be going public with it.

KBB gets it.

[MiccoMacey]

When looking for a suitable replacement for a team, you can't just look at how good their football team is.

While Baylor sucks in football, they have a decent men's basketball team and really good women's team, and nationally respected baseball team. I know they are in a small market in Waco, but they have respectable sports programs outside of football (and that may be on the rise a little).

I know it's all about the money...but sometimes you want your conference to be competitive nationally as well. Adding a great football school who has no other redeeming sports programs, even if it makes you a little more money, isn't always the best thing to do.

[badger]

KBB gets it.

King Barry's Back has got my back ;)

[Jello Biafra]

Au contraire! South Bend, IN (Notre Dame) is also in the eastern time zone! Has been since 1967.

http://www.worldtimezone.com/time-indiana12.php

:D

meh...i know its on a website and all but im not buying it. i drove from the north side fo chicago to southbend for our game in 99 and i distinctly remember talking to some ND peeps at a tailgate abotu this very subject. something about the norwest corner of indiana is in the central??

[49r]

meh...i know its on a website and all but im not buying it. i drove from the north side fo chicago to southbend for our game in 99 and i distinctly remember talking to some ND peeps at a tailgate abotu this very subject. something about the norwest corner of indiana is in the central??


In 1999, Indiana had some whacky time laws - all but a few counties were on Eastern Standard Time all year long - so that meant that when the rest of the country would "Spring Ahead" to observe Daylight Saving Time in the summer Indiana stayed the same which would mean they would effectively be observing the same time as Chicago...but still technically not in the Central Time Zone.

Apparently in 2006 or 2007 though, Indiana began observing Daylight Saving Time to, so with the exception of the counties immediately east of Chicago and a few counties in SW Indiana they are fully an hour ahead of us here in the Central Time Zone. Yes, even in South Bend.

Not that this really amounts to anything, but I can go on and on about really stupid trivial stuff that nobody cares about...

[royalfan5]

If Mizzou leaves, and Arkansas Says no to the Big XII, why not take a run at Memphis? Upgrade the league in Basketball, and get a foot in the door in the south. Plus, it would probably encourage Fred Smith to put some serious coin into the program, which could benefit the league. If not Baylor would have someone to kick around.

[John Kochtoston]

The only way that I'd want another Texas school is if we were to drop one that we already have... and we really can't right now, because we need at least one private school (for hiding info purposes, heh) and the other three are big draws in their own rights.



You can't hide info in a private school. Any document that comes into the possession of a gov't employee while he's doing his job is presumed open to a FOIA request, then it's up to that gov't entity to show a judge it falls under one of the exceptions to FOIA if they don't want it out. So, unless Baylor gets a ton of documents that none of the other schools get to see, anything that Boren, Castiglione, Nafieh etc. come into possession of are subject to a request.

[John Kochtoston]

If Mizzou does leave I would imagine that Arkansas would be the first school to be approached about joining the Big 12. What that would mean to a potential realignment of the divisions, I have no idea.

I have to believe the thinking would be to reunite old SWC rivals, so I don't know who from the South would get booted to the North to replace Mizzou.

Arkansas isn't leaving the SEC. They make way too much money there.

Personally, I'd love to see the Big 12 make a run at BYU and Utah, to shore up the Salt Lake City markets (plus, those are two schools that give a rat's *** about football). It would be nice to get New Mexico and UNLV to give a **** about football and upgrade their facilities to Big 12 standards, so the Big 12 could also be in the Albuquerque and Las Vegas TV markets, but I don't think that would happen.

[soonerbrat]

Au contraire! South Bend, IN (Notre Dame) is also in the eastern time zone! Has been since 1967.

http://www.worldtimezone.com/time-indiana12.php

:D

doesn't indiana just keep the same time and not change? so part of the year they are central, and part of the year they are eastern time?

[Poli Sci]

Just a thought. Would a Nebraska move to the Big 10 free up the possibility of having OU v. Nebraksa every year at Thanksgiving?

[King Barry's Back]

If Mizzou does leave I would imagine that Arkansas would be the first school to be approached about joining the Big 12. What that would mean to a potential realignment of the divisions, I have no idea.

I have to believe the thinking would be to reunite old SWC rivals, so I don't know who from the South would get booted to the North to replace Mizzou.

Who would go north? Oklahoma or Ok St.

We would control our own fate. If we wanted to stay in the South, we would do so. If we wanted to go north and resurrect our rivalries from the Big 8 days, we would do that.

OSU wouldn't control their own fate.

[sooner n houston]

Okie state would love the chance to go to the North. They thinkl they would win the North once in a while! :D

[Scott D]

From recent articles, it sounds like the Big 10 is serious about this now.

Circle the wagons, Big 12. We don't want them stealing any of our big TV markets (however, you are quite welcome to take Iowa State... it's a long drive up there anyways)

*sigh*

Scuttlebutt up in this area..you know..dead center of Big-10 country is that the push is going to be toward heavily convincing Rutgers to leave the Big East for the Big 10.

[Scott D]

If someone leaves the Big 12 ~~What about Arizona in The Big 12 --- ?
BYU or Houston ...?

nobody's leaving the Big 12

[badger]

*sigh*

Scuttlebutt up in this area..you know..dead center of Big-10 country is that the push is going to be toward heavily convincing Rutgers to leave the Big East for the Big 10.

No, I agree. I've already said that I expected them to take either Syracuse or Rutgers... but if they'd rather have Iowa State, I won't lose any sleep over it :D

[Scott D]

Nobody wants Iowa State, even everyone in Ames knows that.

[tfoolry]

Iowa State would be a good addition to Missouri Valley.

[Blues1]

Anyone remember ~ Iowa State Beat Nebraska --- And we ~~~ :(

[IronHorseSooner]

As an SU grad, I doubt that they would go to the Big 10/11. Their rivalries are in bball with G-Town, UCONN, 'Nova, and Pitt. Rutgers has no natural rivalries in either football or bball that I know. They would make sense to go to the Big 10/11. The Big East would then go after ND or a team like UCF to get another FLA market.

[Scott D]

Anyone remember ~ Iowa State Beat Nebraska --- And we ~~~ :(

with 8 turnovers even east popcorn state could have had a chance to win that abortion of a football game.

[Muahahaha]

Missouri should and hopefully will be the 12th team. Big 12 gets Arkansas and SEC gets Georgia Tech back.

[bcgvh]

Give them ISU and Mizzou, put TCU and Tulsa in the Big 12 and change the divisions to east west instead of north south.

This is a good plan.

[delhalew]

nobody's leaving the Big 12
You never know about these things. Surely you remember the clusterf*ck resulting from the SEC expansion that caused a complete rearrangement of college football, including the creation of the Big 12.

Also important to remember these things take years, especially when you're talking about the Big Slow.

[rawlingsHOH]

You never know about these things. Surely you remember the clusterf*ck resulting from the SECOND expansion that caused a complete rearrangement of college football, including the creation of the Big 12.
Also important to remember these things take years, especially when you're talking about the Big Slow.

I remember when everyone was certain the new Big 12 was going to be more like a Big 20, with BYU out of the WAC, and some SWC schools included. That never panned out.

[delhalew]

I remember when everyone was certain the new Big 12 was going to be more like a Big 20, with BYU out of the WAC, and some SWC schools included. That never panned out.
The difference is the Big televen's expansion is long overdue and vital to their relevence.
The suits in charge are finally acknowleging this. They will get somebody and there will be ripples.

[Scott D]

You never know about these things. Surely you remember the clusterf*ck resulting from the SECOND expansion that caused a complete rearrangement of college football, including the creation of the Big 12.

Also important to remember these things take years, especially when you're talking about the Big Slow.

None of the Big 12 schools are Candidates for the conference up here. They don't need the St. Louis market, they already have Chicago, if anything they'll expand eastward for a piece of the New York market. As has been said in many posts prior to this one, Rutgers is probably the leading candidate to woo, UConn would be second.

[SicEmBaylor]

When looking for a suitable replacement for a team, you can't just look at how good their football team is.

While Baylor sucks in football, they have a decent men's basketball team and really good women's team, and nationally respected baseball team. I know they are in a small market in Waco, but they have respectable sports programs outside of football (and that may be on the rise a little).

I know it's all about the money...but sometimes you want your conference to be competitive nationally as well. Adding a great football school who has no other redeeming sports programs, even if it makes you a little more money, isn't always the best thing to do.

This.
There's nothing I hate more than this bull**** about TCU replacing us. Arkansas would be a legitimate replacement, but not TCU.

First of all, when the conference was formed we were a much better football program than TCU and TCU lacked the statewide political support.

I guarantee you if TCU and Baylor's positions had been reversed they wouldn't have been much better off in the Big XII then we have been and they don't have nearly the national success in other sports that we do.

Yes, our football team sucks but you have to realize we're the smallest school in the Big XII and competing in one of the toughest (if not the toughest) conference in the nation. Having said all that, our other athletic programs hold their own.

If the Big XII broke up, I have no idea where we'd go. I kind of like the idea of throwing some of the more nationally successful programs in non-BCS conferences into a new BCS conference and joining that.

[Blues1]

This.
There's nothing I hate more than this bull**** about TCU replacing us. Arkansas would be a legitimate replacement, but not TCU.

First of all, when the conference was formed we were a much better football program than TCU and TCU lacked the statewide political support.

I guarantee you if TCU and Baylor's positions had been reversed they wouldn't have been much better off in the Big XII then we have been and they don't have nearly the national success in other sports that we do.

Yes, our football team sucks but you have to realize we're the smallest school in the Big XII and competing in one of the toughest (if not the toughest) conference in the nation. Having said all that, our other athletic programs hold their own.

If the Big XII broke up, I have no idea where we'd go. I kind of like the idea of throwing some of the more nationally successful programs in non-BCS conferences into a new BCS conference and joining that.

Amen Brother...
Just think you post here more often than all the Stanford Fans on
the West Coast -- :) - IF your QB had stayed healthy you might be in San Fran playing usc suck..Hang in there your Football Coach is on to something,even Sooner Fans can see that....!!!
Keep Rockin'

[John Kochtoston]

One thing I always hear when conference realignment is discussed is the Big 12 should get Arkansas. As if all that needs to be done is pick up the phone. Arkansas is not leaving the SEC. They make way too much money there.

[Soonerfan88]

First, everything I've heard about Mizzou leaving for the Big 10 has been MU begging to be asked, not an actual invitation to join. Missouri has not been a part of any discussion coming from Big 10 territory, only from Columbia. Rutgers makes much more sense.

Second, if there was reason to add another team to the Big 12 I think BYU would be a great choice. Yes, the travel may be a little farther but not something too far. They have a decent athletic department that matches well with the sports already offered throughout the Big 12. From a TV perspective, we add not only the state of Utah but somewhat of a national draw from the Mormon contingent.

[delhalew]

None of the Big 12 schools are Candidates for the conference up here. They don't need the St. Louis market, they already have Chicago, if anything they'll expand eastward for a piece of the New York market. As has been said in many posts prior to this one, Rutgers is probably the leading candidate to woo, UConn would be second.

I know...I said it. My point is never say never. My previous post was obviously supposed to read..."SEC expansion" not SECOND(damn blackberry).

Once one shoe drops the ripples can go anywhere.

[Scott D]

Well I can tell you this now...unofficially Rutgers is being wooed, and unofficially they are listening.

[delhalew]

Well I can tell you this now...unofficially Rutgers is being wooed, and unofficially they are listening.

Good. As I said somewhere in this thread, I think Rutgers causes the least amount of domino effect.

[Scott D]

anyone from the Big East causes little to no domino effect to be honest.

[delhalew]

Well, I'm going to concern myself with football since that is the moneymaker and for me to pretend I know basketball would do us both a disservice.

From a football standpoint, I couldn't agree more.

I say Rutgers specifically because they seem to be the strongest contender, though I have also heard UCONN, Pitt, Syracuse, and...I forgot the other one that seemed feasible from the East.

[Scott D]

That's why surprisingly Rutgers makes sense, granted their men's hoops isn't as advanced as their women's hoops, but they're a serviceable program. The fact that Rutgers has spent a lot of money upgrading their athletic facilities doesn't hurt the argument at all. The knock against the other Big East schools that would reasonably make sense is that none of them bring as much of a guarantee of the coveted "Tri-state" market the way that Rutgers does.

[delhalew]

Its a shame college sports aren't bigger up there. They're too concerned with their Yankees and Knicks and Giants, bla bla bla.

[Scott D]

Well college basketball is still king in the Big East....in regards to football, there just aren't enough schools in the vicinity with major programs (college). Rutgers was bad for a very very long time before Schiano got there.

[delhalew]

Well college basketball is still king in the Big East....in regards to football, there just aren't enough schools in the vicinity with major programs (college). Rutgers was bad for a very very long time before Schiano got there.

I just have a hard time getting this. Do the Alum support Bball, but not fooseball? Or is mostly a local media problem?

[Scott D]

I just have a hard time getting this. Do the Alum support Bball, but not fooseball? Or is mostly a local media problem?

Well in the 16 (total) schools in the Big East, there are a chunk that either don't have a football program (Seton Hall, St. John's, Depaul, Marquette & Providence) or have a lower tier football program (Georgetown, Villanova) + the one school that remains 'independent' for football (Notre Dame). So only half the conference plays Division 1-A (FBS) football. All of the member schools have basketball and I believe baseball programs.

A lot of it has to do with the fact that half the conference has an enrollment of less than 20k students, and 6 of those 8 have less than 15k enrollment. In the case of Rutgers in football, they were losing recruits left and right to Penn State, Pitt, Syracuse, and for awhile even Temple.

Hell, even in the late 60s my dad was recruited by Rutgers and Temple and wanted to go to Temple, but my grandfather made him go to Rutgers because my aunt wanted to go to Rutgers.

[delhalew]

That's a pretty good breakdown. I prolly would have gotten that before if I followed Bball more closely.

Still, I always thought schools like Rutgers or Boston College could be more successful if they had more community support.

[Mr. Nuke]

nobody's leaving the Big 12
If anyone gets asked, they will be gone.

[Scott D]

That's a pretty good breakdown. I prolly would have gotten that before if I followed Bball more closely.

Still, I always thought schools like Rutgers or Boston College could be more successful if they had more community support.

Well I know in New Jersey that high school football is pretty popular. But, yeah in that region basketball is just a lot more popular, probably because it's a year round sport up there much like how football is pretty year round in Florida and Texas.