On the bright side of things

[Since71ASooner4Life]

Even though we have a terrible coach (only 4 NC games in nine years, with two 1-point losses to quality opponents while the best QB & TE in the country are out with injury), the Big-12 Championship and a BCS game are up for grabs. Maybe if we can find a decent coach somewhere (and get back our best wide receiver from injury) we can start to compete here!

[Sooner70]

Since 71: I get you. It ain't coaching that cost this game. It was Franks/Clayton blowing their assignments midway in 3Q allowing easy TD. Coaches are supposed to coach, and players are supposed to execute. Coaches can't be on the field to execute. Players have to do that.

There's still the Big 12. Let's learn from this and get on it. A good thing...Tennell caught a pass.

[sendbaht]

Since71ASooner4Life I like your style!!! Keep it up son...

[jduggle]

Since 71: I get you. It ain't coaching that cost this game. It was Franks/Clayton blowing their assignments midway in 3Q allowing easy TD. Coaches are supposed to coach, and players are supposed to execute. Coaches can't be on the field to execute. Players have to do that.

There's still the Big 12. Let's learn from this and get on it. A good thing...Tennell caught a pass.

I couldn't disagree more. How many times have we used the excuse of "blowing their assignments" with respect to a BV defense? At some point the coach has to take a hit. Look, if you don't get pressure on a QB quickly and cause him to make a mistake, you better have an all world safety to bail you out because BV's zone is very porous. At least if BV played man coverage you could say the better team won because they just beat the coverage.

[wishbonesooner]

If winning a Big 12 championship is our real goal, the I'm good, let's have a beer. Bob told us he wanted us to expect more way back when, but I'm good if all the rest of you are. Even though you only have to beat 2 and some years 3 decent teams to win the Big 12.

[SoonerTroll]

the reall bright side of things is that basketball is not too far away :) Lindys has us 14 preseason, 3rd in the big 12 and we have the number one shooting guard, Go Capel!!!

[StoopTroup]

I couldn't disagree more. How many times have we used the excuse of "blowing their assignments" with respect to a BV defense? At some point the coach has to take a hit. Look, if you don't get pressure on a QB quickly and cause him to make a mistake, you better have an all world safety to bail you out because BV's zone is very porous. At least if BV played man coverage you could say the better team won because they just beat the coverage.

At some point?

Hell...folks on here have been calling for his head since he became DC....lol

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

And they were calling for Mike Stoop's head before his. I can still remember everyone being furious that Mike Stoops couldn't stop OsU from lobbing balls over the top to that little Rashaun Woods guy.

[cheezyq]

Since 71: I get you. It ain't coaching that cost this game. It was Franks/Clayton blowing their assignments midway in 3Q allowing easy TD. Coaches are supposed to coach, and players are supposed to execute. Coaches can't be on the field to execute. Players have to do that.

There's still the Big 12. Let's learn from this and get on it. A good thing...Tennell caught a pass.

"It was a game where the coaching staff let everyone down by asking its team to execute a rubbish gameplan -- The mistakes were subtle and maybe not evident to most fans -- One of the problems with a plan that relies on fitting square pegs into round holes is that it makes the players look really bad -- the line doesn't look like it can block, the QB is always running for his life, and the RBs never have a hole." - Chris Brown on tOSU/USC, Rivals.com

[cheezyq]

At some point?

Hell...folks on here have been calling for his head since he became DC....lol

That's what happens when your first game as a DC is a 35-7 blowout loss to a K-State team that had ONE weapon. If anyone knew how to exploit BV, it was Snyder. Can you say, "blueprint"?

Jes' sayin'

:D

[okienator]

How many top 20 teams run man coverage. Just wondering.

[Soonerman08]

Since 71: I get you. It ain't coaching that cost this game. It was Franks/Clayton blowing their assignments midway in 3Q allowing easy TD. Coaches are supposed to coach, and players are supposed to execute. Coaches can't be on the field to execute. Players have to do that.

There's still the Big 12. Let's learn from this and get on it. A good thing...Tennell caught a pass.

Oh really???? Doesn't Franks/Clayton blowing their assignments count as bad coaching? How about the O-Line issues still to date? How about **** poor playcalling? Thinking the whole coaching thing is the issue.

[cvsooner]

I couldn't disagree more. How many times have we used the excuse of "blowing their assignments" with respect to a BV defense? At some point the coach has to take a hit. Look, if you don't get pressure on a QB quickly and cause him to make a mistake, you better have an all world safety to bail you out because BV's zone is very porous. At least if BV played man coverage you could say the better team won because they just beat the coverage.

The last TD Stoops said WAS man coverage, and Franks didn't get it done. Bad coaching? Or a player not being coached? Or a player not capable of doing what you're asking him to do?

[pappy]

How many top 20 teams run man coverage. Just wondering.

pretty much the entire sec

[pappy]

The last TD Stoops said WAS man coverage, and Franks didn't get it done. Bad coaching? Or a player not being coached? Or a player not capable of doing what you're asking him to do?

it looked to me that it was miscommunication and franks thought they were in zone

[Sooner70]

Soonerman08: Really. If we've got such lousy coaching, then how did this same bunch of coaches get us to the NC game last year?

If you send your kid to Defensive Driving School & the kid gets a speeding ticket for zipping thru a School Zone, is that the fault of the Instructor?

[Soonerman08]

Soonerman08: Really. If we've got such lousy coaching, then how did this same bunch of coaches get us to the NC game last year?

If you send your kid to Defensive Driving School & the kid gets a speeding ticket for zipping thru a School Zone, is that the fault of the Instructor?

Here is the deal. People criticize others for blasting our schemes with this comment "you want to criticize our schemes for getting us rated as a record setting offense?"

Well good coaching goes like this. 1. Recognizing strengths and weaknesses of the team 2. Coaching to those strengths and weaknesses 3. Not foolishly thinking that since something worked last year that it will work this year.

To comment on #3. Sure it is nice to give it a try, but if it doesn't work then don't do it. The "it" I am referring to is the no-huddle. It should have been scrapped at the beginning of the season or after the BYU game. It is pretty obvious that we have a lot of offensive issues, and this is adding to it.

The key here...A good coach would recognize this as one of our problems and fix it.

We ran it very well last year because we had a darn good O-Line and experience.

[TXBOOMER]

How many top 20 teams run man coverage. Just wondering.

Gators are in man about 80% of the time.

[setem]

the reall bright side of things is that basketball is not too far away :) Lindys has us 14 preseason, 3rd in the big 12 and we have the number one shooting guard, Go Capel!!!

Look here! It is football season! I know they have started playing basketball but we are not Kansas or Oklahoma State fans! True Sooners fans will never say "wait for basketball season"

[oksoonerdave]

We have 3 Big XII games remaining. Just maybe and I mean maybe if we can keep the same O-line as we had against KU and KSU, we can win the remaining games, 2 at home and 1 away. Injuries have been just plain devastating to our schemes. These injuries brings in less qualified players who will make mistakes and cause penalties. Usually at the most inappropriate time.

Does anyone know if and when we had this many injuries during the season? I don't.

[westbrooke]

Here is the deal. People criticize others for blasting our schemes with this comment "you want to criticize our schemes for getting us rated as a record setting offense?"

Well good coaching goes like this. 1. Recognizing strengths and weaknesses of the team 2. Coaching to those strengths and weaknesses 3. Not foolishly thinking that since something worked last year that it will work this year.

To comment on #3. Sure it is nice to give it a try, but if it doesn't work then don't do it. The "it" I am referring to is the no-huddle. It should have been scrapped at the beginning of the season or after the BYU game. It is pretty obvious that we have a lot of offensive issues, and this is adding to it.

The key here...A good coach would recognize this as one of our problems and fix it.

We ran it very well last year because we had a darn good O-Line and experience.

I thought this after the first game, too, but I no longer do. And I keep seeing this argument cropping up again this week. I'm curious as to why. What happened in this last game that makes people think that a huddle is a panacea? Our most experienced lineman, Trent, was the one making the worst mistakes, so there's, at best, an inverse correlation between familiarity with no-huddle play calling and poor play. Landry was shaky, but he's been practicing in the no-huddle since he got to campus, so how would changing up his routine help?

If we think that huddling will help, and I'm not sure that it would, it's only a bandaid on a bullet hole. As you say, our issues run much deeper than this. Tulsa_Fireman had a good post (http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2761989&postcount=4) on the value of the no-huddle in another thread.

[Leroy Lizard]

I just wish people would make up their mind. Is KW a good OC or not? Is BV a good DC or not?

But instead, we get crap like, "Well, the defense has played great this year... I'll give him that, but Nebraska did score on that pass play" and "Well, he did set an NCAA record last year, but this year..." So we sort of give them their due, but in reality all we are doing is waiting for a bad game to jump on the "He's an idiot" bandwagon. Who can possibly live up to such expectations?

The know-it-alls that think KW and BV don't know what they're doing are the same people that would have called for the end of the wishbone in 1982. It was so obvious back then to the average boneheaded fan that the wishbone was dead. Why couldn't that idiot Switzer understand that?

If I'm a head coach, I'm telling my assistant coaches "above all, never listen to the fans. They think they know everything, but they wouldn't know their *** from a hole in the ground." And that is the plain truth.

[Soonerman08]

I thought this after the first game, too, but I no longer do. And I keep seeing this argument cropping up again this week. I'm curious as to why. What happened in this last game that makes people think that a huddle is a panacea? Our most experienced lineman, Trent, was the one making the worst mistakes, so there's, at best, an inverse correlation between familiarity with no-huddle play calling and poor play. Landry was shaky, but he's been practicing in the no-huddle since he got to campus, so how would changing up his routine help?

If we think that huddling will help, and I'm not sure that it would, it's only a bandaid on a bullet hole. As you say, our issues run much deeper than this. Tulsa_Fireman had a good post (http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2761989&postcount=4) on the value of the no-huddle in another thread.

The no-huddle (meerkat) has caused numerous delay of games and false starts. That is the biggest problem with it.

[cvsooner]

I might grant you the no-huddle has led to some delay of game penalties, but false starts...uh, no. That's on the players.

[westbrooke]

Not to keep beating a dead horse, but what exactly is the evidence that the meerkat is the cause of these penalities? The fact that we run the meerkat and get called for penalties? That's correlation but not necessarily causation. Having players on the field with red uniforms and double-digit numbers starting with 7 is also correlated with these penalties. But no one, rightly so, is arguing that the color red or the number 7 is causing our penalties.

I'm still trying to reconcile the arguments I've heard. Some people are saying we need to huddle to slow down our offense because the pace is confusing our players and not giving the D enough rest. Others are claiming we need to huddle because with the meerkat we're not going fast enough to avoid delay of game penalties.

[BoulderSooner79]

I think I hear people saying we should huddle and make sure everyone hears the play and the snap count and we don't change the play at the line. The goal is to simplify things until these guys get in a groove. Again, just my guess and sort of my feeling. The down side is that we could no longer stop the D from substituting. I don't see that as a big factor this year w/o Gresham to create the match-up problems and Sam to exploit them. I'd like to see this myself, but not a strong issue for me. I don't think a major change during the season is going to be successful, but I don't see huddle vs. no-huddle as a major change. If we decided to be a run oriented team right now, that would fail.

The other thing I noticed is that the no-huddle just bothers people for some reason. That was the case last year when it was working to the tune of 60+ a game and I'm not sure why.

[Soonerman08]

I think I hear people saying we should huddle and make sure everyone hears the play and the snap count and we don't change the play at the line. The goal is to simplify things until these guys get in a groove. Again, just my guess and sort of my feeling. The down side is that we could no longer stop the D from substituting. I don't see that as a big factor this year w/o Gresham to create the match-up problems and Sam to exploit them. I'd like to see this myself, but not a strong issue for me. I don't think a major change during the season is going to be successful, but I don't see huddle vs. no-huddle as a major change. If we decided to be a run oriented team right now, that would fail.

The other thing I noticed is that the no-huddle just bothers people for some reason. That was the case last year when it was working to the tune of 60+ a game and I'm not sure why.

You hit the nail right on the head.

[westbrooke]

I didn't get to see the game this weekend (sometimes life gives you better things to do... I know, I was shocked too), so I don't know what developments this game provided beyond the basic box score and scoring summary. But when we last talked about this, it was in the wake of a game where the offense performed very poorly and a significant portion of the motion penalties that are referenced here were called on Trent Williams. So, if our most experienced lineman with extensive familiarity with meerkat playcalling is the one jumping before the snap, that doesn't indicate to me that the meerkat is what's causing it. That's a correlation between more meerkat experience and poor play, not less. And we saw last year that meerkat experience can also be correlated with great play, so, in total, they appear to be independent variables.

The box score did indicate to me, though, that our two most versatile weapons, Broyles and Murray, were beasts and were doing damage all over the field. This isn't to say that we can't split Murray out or call a reverse for Broyles coming from the huddle, and they might still have had great games, but moving these guys around to take advantage of defensive personnel trapped on the field is one of the major reasons for running the meerkat in the first place. Again, I didn't get to see the evidence with my own eyes, but the stats indicate that it worked pretty well.

[C&CDean]

Nah, everybody sucked again. It was a poor game plan, and the OC should be fired. Vulnerables should be fired too. I mean who gives up 10 points to the Big-12 offensive leaders? What a bunch of POS our coaches are...

[King Barry's Back]

Is that offense REALLY called the "meerkat" or is that some kind of inside joke? I mean, there are two or three of those on this board.

[westbrooke]

Is that offense REALLY called the "meerkat" or is that some kind of inside joke? I mean, there are two or three of those on this board.

Hahaha, definitely a board joke. Can't remember who to give the credit to, but somebody described our no-huddle as the "meerkat" because of the way everyone sticks their heads up and looks to sideline at the same time.

[King Barry's Back]

Hahaha, definitely a board joke. Can't remember who to give the credit to, but somebody described our no-huddle as the "meerkat" because of the way everyone sticks their heads up and looks to sideline at the same time.

Yeah, I thought that's where it came from, but heck, everybody on the thread was calling it that -- so who knows?

I live in Germany so I am cut off from the normal info sources -- which means I have to rely over much on this board. (There's good and bad in that.)