Explain to me......

[ictsooner7]

how their coaching staff can come up with a scheme to make their qb look like a world beater and our more talented qb look so bad. Harris was terrible last week and almost perfect this week, picked our defense apart while not having the skill level of Jones. Poor coaching, defensive coaching cost us yet another game. It has been since the a$tm loss in college station 5-6 years ago that I have known we have a problem in pass coverage. I hate to image what a talented offense will do to us, ie TEXAS. 3 and 4 after we play KU, sad.

[Okie35]

Throwing the ball underneath the zone and quick passes. For the millionth time we won't lose to KU. They struggled w/ Duke and Southern Miss for goodness sake.

[Sooner70]

OU will always get everybody's best game, both coaches & players. OU usually brings out the best in most teams because if they need to, they'll play up. The coaches work harder as do the players in preparation. Beating OU is a big deal. It stamps your ticket. In a way, it's flattering, but for a OU fan, it sure sucks when this happens. No excuse, but a fact, this OU team is kinda crippled right now.

[East Coast Bias]

Not to be negative,just honest, I think the luster is coming off of beating Ou. Again everyone now thinks BYU is a good team? Do you guys really think Miami is a world class beater? I think it speaks more to our performance vs. expectations. Look at all the sunshine pumping around here.........

[TopDawg]

how their coaching staff can come up with a scheme to make their qb look like a world beater and our more talented qb look so bad. Harris was terrible last week and almost perfect this week, picked our defense apart while not having the skill level of Jones.

Harris' O-line did a better job protecting him and he has more playmakers around him at the WR/TE/RB position.

Explanation complete.

[canes4ever]

Not to be negative,just honest, I think the luster is coming off of beating Ou. Again everyone now thinks BYU is a good team? Do you guys really think Miami is a world class beater? I think it speaks more to our performance vs. expectations. Look at all the sunshine pumping around here.........

True the OU performance last night was less than expected and several key players were absent but take it from me beating OU is just as fullfilling as ever. Other than FSU there are not many teams I appreciate whipping than OU. We don't play every year but the history of our games is great stuff. Growing up in a small Okla town,Yale Oklahoma,I remember the OU greats of the 50s and 60s. Many a make believe game I was Billy Vessels swivel hipping Dlinemen. Exciting game,enjoyed. Hope your Big 12 season is a success.

[SOONER44EVER]

Harris' O-line did a better job protecting him and he has more playmakers around him at the WR/TE/RB position.

Explanation complete.

I never saw Miami run a draw on 3rd and 14. I think that helped them too.

[wishbonesooner]

Because paychecks are more important than wins and respect.

[Sooner-N-KS]

how their coaching staff can come up with a scheme to make their qb look like a world beater and our more talented qb look so bad. Harris was terrible last week and almost perfect this week, picked our defense apart while not having the skill level of Jones. Poor coaching, defensive coaching cost us yet another game. It has been since the a$tm loss in college station 5-6 years ago that I have known we have a problem in pass coverage. I hate to image what a talented offense will do to us, ie TEXAS. 3 and 4 after we play KU, sad.

Landry didn't look bad at all last night.

[Gresho Murford]

yeah landry didn't look bad and Harris didn't look almost perfect. He had two ints and the rest of the night he was throwing short passes. High percentage passes (see Colt McCoy)

[OUmillenium]

Our coaching staff does not pull out "all the stops" on offense and play to win. They are conservative and play "not to loose". Our RBs didn't fumble and our QB didn't throw and int...but we lost. Heupel must be pulling his hair out at this nonsense.

Wilson had to try screens to slow down the Miami rush and he did but they did not work. He then had to go to draws but went to them too often. Landry should have been allowed to throw more. Murray needed the toss sweep or option pitch. Very disappointed in our run game play calls.

I'm glad we tried to throw to the TE a little.

[primetime43]

I would love to see some mis-direction plays or counter plays. Miami ran the counter a bunch. Kevin Wilson's run scheme is way too predictable.

[TopDawg]

I never saw Miami run a draw on 3rd and 14. I think that helped them too.

Because they had faith in their o-line and playmakers.

[SOONER44EVER]

Because they had faith in their o-line and playmakers.

So did we in the first half. We moved the ball. It was working so we quit doing it.:confused:

[StoopTroup]

So did we in the first half. We moved the ball. It was working so we quit doing it.:confused:

Or maybe their DC made an adjustment?

[SOONER44EVER]

Or maybe their DC made an adjustment?

Or maybe we never threw a deep pass the entire second half?

[KantoSooner]

As per normal, the game was lost by the lines. Our O line was terrible: no protection, no opening holes. Average for a highschool, at best. Our D line penetrated not a bit and didn't contain or stress Harris very much.
Mediocre performance.
Must've been looking ahead to that critical (only half joking now) Baylor game.

[SOONER44EVER]

As per normal, the game was lost by the lines. Our O line was terrible: no protection, no opening holes. Average for a highschool, at best. Our D line penetrated not a bit and didn't contain or stress Harris very much.
Mediocre performance.
Must've been looking ahead to that critical (only half joking now) Baylor game.

Wow. Who were those guys sacking Harris and knocking him down?

[okiewaker]

Beal had a great game. He was all over the place. I think he a couple of sacks and TFLs

[BoulderSooner79]

The number of sacks and QB pressures we got was very good. Miami played a good game and had excellent play calling to counter the pressure.

[prrriiide]

The equation is really very elementary:

Whipple + good talent > Venables + NFL talent.


Beal had a great game. He was all over the place. I think he a couple of sacks and TFLs

One big reason for that was the GK was doubled and tripled all night. I think Miami might have underestimated Beal's talent and athleticism.

[Gresho Murford]

As per normal, the game was lost by the lines. Our O line was terrible: no protection, no opening holes. Average for a highschool, at best. Our D line penetrated not a bit and didn't contain or stress Harris very much.
Mediocre performance.
Must've been looking ahead to that critical (only half joking now) Baylor game.

ha

[TopDawg]

So did we in the first half. We moved the ball. It was working so we quit doing it.:confused:

I think once Broyles went out, Miami decided to dial up the heat, figuring that they'd wait until our other WRs proved to be a threat before dropping more people into coverage. The extra heat from the Miami D proved too much for our O-line to handle, which made it that much more difficult for our WRs to do anything.

[SOONER44EVER]

I think once Broyles went out, Miami decided to dial up the heat, figuring that they'd wait until our other WRs proved to be a threat before dropping more people into coverage. The extra heat from the Miami D proved too much for our O-line to handle, which made it that much more difficult for our WRs to do anything.

I understand what you're saying but if you don't even try to throw to the wrs its assured that they won't be a threat.

[TopDawg]

You talked about how we moved the ball in the 1st half, but then stopped. Well, we moved the ball in the first half by running, not passing. The first drive, when Broyles was in there, we passed. But after that, we only had two significant (15 or more yards) drives.

The first one featured 5 rushes for 56 yards and 5 passes for 18 yards.
The second one featured 6 rushes for 29 yards and 4 passes for 22 yards.

So it's not like we had huge success passing the ball in the 1st half and then went away from it in the 2nd. In fact, if I counted right, we had 16 passing plays in the 1st half and 17 in the 2nd half. But after Broyles left the game, our pass efficiency dropped off significantly. I haven't figured the numbers for the first half, but for the second half we completed 7 passes on 17 passing plays (7 incompletions, 2 sacks, 1 def. pass interference). We had a total of 61 yards (74 passing, -13 rushing) and 1 turnover on those plays. That's an average of less than 4 yards per passing play.

Looking at it now it's clear that the draws didn't work, but the passes weren't working either. Clearly the coaches thought it would be best to put the game in the hands of our defense (not risk a turnover). They gave up 1 2nd half drive. If Brian Jackson hangs on to that INT, he's got a pick 6 and the game is different. Yeah, he DIDN'T hang on to the INT, but all I'm saying is that I don't think the strategy was all that bad. It didn't work, but looking at how (in)effective our passing game was after Broyles' injury, I'm not sure a "throw more" strategy would've worked either.

[SOONER44EVER]

You talked about how we moved the ball in the 1st half, but then stopped. Well, we moved the ball in the first half by running, not passing. The first drive, when Broyles was in there, we passed. But after that, we only had two significant (15 or more yards) drives.

The first one featured 5 rushes for 56 yards and 5 passes for 18 yards.
The second one featured 6 rushes for 29 yards and 4 passes for 22 yards.

So it's not like we had huge success passing the ball in the 1st half and then went away from it in the 2nd. In fact, if I counted right, we had 16 passing plays in the 1st half and 17 in the 2nd half. But after Broyles left the game, our pass efficiency dropped off significantly. I haven't figured the numbers for the first half, but for the second half we completed 7 passes on 17 passing plays (7 incompletions, 2 sacks, 1 def. pass interference). We had a total of 61 yards (74 passing, -13 rushing) and 1 turnover on those plays. That's an average of less than 4 yards per passing play.

Looking at it now it's clear that the draws didn't work, but the passes weren't working either. Clearly the coaches thought it would be best to put the game in the hands of our defense (not risk a turnover). They gave up 1 2nd half drive. If Brian Jackson hangs on to that INT, he's got a pick 6 and the game is different. Yeah, he DIDN'T hang on to the INT, but all I'm saying is that I don't think the strategy was all that bad. It didn't work, but looking at how (in)effective our passing game was after Broyles' injury, I'm not sure a "throw more" strategy would've worked either.

It seems like we didn't even attempt any downfield passes after the first quarter. I may be wrong, but when the D is all lining up within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage shouldn't we try to stretch the field by throwing deep?

[setem]

What game did you watch last night? Landry did his job and did his job very well! I'll take this one off the air!

[SOONER44EVER]

What game did you watch last night? Landry did his job and did his job very well! I'll take this one off the air!

I thought Landry did just fine. I wish they would have let him throw more deep passes. I'm not too happy with all the 3rd and long draw plays.

[rawlingsHOH]

how their coaching staff can come up with a scheme to make their qb look like a world beater and our more talented qb look so bad. Harris was terrible last week and almost perfect this week, picked our defense apart while not having the skill level of Jones. Poor coaching, defensive coaching cost us yet another game. It has been since the a$tm loss in college station 5-6 years ago that I have known we have a problem in pass coverage. I hate to image what a talented offense will do to us, ie TEXAS. 3 and 4 after we play KU, sad.

Jacory Harris was being promoted as the Heisman FAVORITE just 9 days ago.

And to say he looked "almost perfect" against OU is a damn joke! Right?

[TopDawg]

It seems like we didn't even attempt any downfield passes after the first quarter. I may be wrong, but when the D is all lining up within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage shouldn't we try to stretch the field by throwing deep?

Let me start by saying that after watching Stoops' show, I think we should've done some more play action, especially late in the 3rd and 4th. Miami was just running downhill to stop our run.

But I didn't really notice whether or not we were running many deep routes. It could be that we were running deep, but their guys were just staying with us step for step. The coaches probably aren't going to tell Landry to force it downfield, so maybe we tried some deep routes, but they were just covered and Landry had to check down. There were a few times that Landry looked like he was looking downfield but couldn't find anyone open. I'm inclined to think that might've been the case more than once or twice since it didn't seem like our receivers were able to get any separation from their DBs ever.

[PLaw]

Harris' O-line did a better job protecting him and he has more playmakers around him at the WR/TE/RB position.



Explanation complete.

Whipple >> Venables {fixed}

[PLaw]

Let me start by saying that after watching Stoops' show, I think we should've done some more play action, especially late in the 3rd and 4th. Miami was just running downhill to stop our run.



Ya think??

[TopDawg]

Would you also say

"Wilson >> (their DC)"

?

The scores and yardage were virtually the same (Miami had 1 more point and 1 more yard of total offense) so if that means that their OC is a lot better than our DC, does it also follow that our OC is a lot better than their DC?

[prrriiide]

Would you also say

"Wilson >> (their DC)"

?

The scores and yardage were virtually the same (Miami had 1 more point and 1 more yard of total offense) so if that means that their OC is a lot better than our DC, does it also follow that our OC is a lot better than their DC?

No it doesn't follow. When Miami needed a stop, they got it. When they needed a defensive play, they made it. Miami's D was not following a scheme that put them at an automatic disadvantage for the offense that OU showed them. OU needed a stop, and couldn't get it becasue of the scheme of playing an 8-10 yard cushion. The receiver waltzed up to the 1st down marker, turned around and caught the ball while our defender was still 3 yards away. If you want to stop timing routes, mess up the timing. You crack that receiver in the mouth and slow him up off of the line. OU's defensive scheme did not allow that. Miami's strength offesively is the short timing pass. As a defense your gameplan must be to deny the opponent the use of his strength. OU's defensive gameplan played right INTO Miami's strength.

When you add the run blocking schemes for which BV never adjusted, it really allowed Miami to do what they needed to do to move the ball and ultimately win the game. Miami's offensive gameplan denied OU the use of our primary defensive strength: the OL. The gameplan further denied OU of their second-biggest strength - deep coverage. Their gameplan on offense forced the issue of the running and passing games on to the linebackers, and they were not able to rise to the occasion. Due to Miami neutralizing OU's defensive strengths, OU was not able to deny Miami their strength. That is a scheme problem and an adjustment problem. That falls to the DC.

[StoopTroup]

I thought Landry did just fine. I wish they would have let him throw more deep passes. I'm not too happy with all the 3rd and long draw plays.


Or maybe we never threw a deep pass the entire second half?

Maybe they choked up on their bat again?

I mean I thought they should have just let him try a pass at 4th and long at the end of the bYu game too. They haven't for a reason. I'd have to say it's because of what they've seen in practice. Maybe it's that they don't trust that Landry has a very good chance of completing one or that he has to have someone who can reign it in. Either way...there's a reason. I don't like it much either...I say some guys come up big when the game is on the line...

I'd like to know what Josh's thoughts on it were. I'm betting he would have aired it the heck out.

[TopDawg]

No it doesn't follow. When Miami needed a stop, they got it. When they needed a defensive play, they made it. Miami's D was not following a scheme that put them at an automatic disadvantage for the offense that OU showed them. OU needed a stop, and couldn't get it becasue of the scheme of playing an 8-10 yard cushion. The receiver waltzed up to the 1st down marker, turned around and caught the ball while our defender was still 3 yards away. If you want to stop timing routes, mess up the timing. You crack that receiver in the mouth and slow him up off of the line. OU's defensive scheme did not allow that. Miami's strength offesively is the short timing pass. As a defense your gameplan must be to deny the opponent the use of his strength. OU's defensive gameplan played right INTO Miami's strength.

When you add the run blocking schemes for which BV never adjusted, it really allowed Miami to do what they needed to do to move the ball and ultimately win the game. Miami's offensive gameplan denied OU the use of our primary defensive strength: the OL. The gameplan further denied OU of their second-biggest strength - deep coverage. Their gameplan on offense forced the issue of the running and passing games on to the linebackers, and they were not able to rise to the occasion. Due to Miami neutralizing OU's defensive strengths, OU was not able to deny Miami their strength. That is a scheme problem and an adjustment problem. That falls to the DC.

Or, maybe they just had the better players.

"It's not about the X's and O's. It's about the Jimmy's and Joe's."

On the fumble that led to the TD, Matt Clapp just let the blitzing DB run right by him. He was in the right position (scheme) just didn't make the block (player). That was a huge play.

On their last TD of the game it was a blown coverage. The scheme called for the defender to be covering the wide receiver in man coverage, but the DB blew the assignment. That was a huge play.

We had a similar play when we had the ball. They blitzed, blew a coverage assignment, but our o-line didn't protect as well as Miami's and Landry had to rush the pass and it was incomplete. That was a huge play.

I think both teams played pretty equally. The main difference was critical turnovers (the fumble deep in our own territory) and offensive penalties. We had multiple drive-killing penalties on offense. Miami had zero...ZERO...offensive penalties. The only penalty they had when they had the ball was on special teams for illegal formation on a punt.

[StoopTroup]

Or, maybe they just had the better players.



If that's the case...maybe we shouldn't fire anyone. :D :pop:

Well except we need a good recruiter maybe?

[Curly Bill]

If that's the case...maybe we shouldn't fire anyone. :D :pop:

Well except we need a good recruiter maybe?

Since one of the reasons given for keeping BV and BJW around is they are good recruiters, does this mean NOW we can fire them? :D

[Scott D]

Harris' O-line did a better job protecting him and he has more playmakers around him at the WR/TE/RB position.

Explanation complete.

you forgot the part where the previous game was played in a major downpouring of rain, but that'd just be an obvious observation.

[StoopTroup]

Since one of the reasons given for keeping BV and BJW around is they are good recruiters, does this mean NOW we can fire them? :D

Well...only if Bob has some friends to replace them with.

[Curly Bill]

Well...only if Bob has some friends to replace them with.

Than get r done!

[Scott D]

Let me start by saying that after watching Stoops' show, I think we should've done some more play action, especially late in the 3rd and 4th. Miami was just running downhill to stop our run.

Don't think that would have helped a great deal. Watching the game a second time, God himself could have been calling plays but with as porous as one side of the line was in that game He'd have been hard pressed to have more success than we did without using divine intervention.

[Curly Bill]

Don't think that would have helped a great deal. Watching the game a second time, God himself could have been calling plays but with as porous as one side of the line was in that game He'd have been hard pressed to have more success than we did without using divine intervention.

Do we have a resume on this guy yet? We should look into hiring him.

[Scott D]

I heard he's too busy making guest appearances on Family Guy to be interested in coaching college football. That plus he has to keep an eye on his second son playing at Florida. ;)

[TopDawg]

Well, there are two plays in particular where I think it would've worked even if I would've been at QB and you would've been at TE. On our last drive (where we got a FG), after Murray had rattled off a few runs, we gave it to Brown two straight times for nothing. Their LBs were attacking the line of scrimmage at the snap. I think we could've hit 'em up on one of those plays for another first down or maybe TD.

[StoopTroup]

I think I could go with canceling The Family Guy for a few winning Seasons....but some of the noobs might object so I won't mention it again.

[Scott D]

Well, there are two plays in particular where I think it would've worked even if I would've been at QB and you would've been at TE. On our last drive (where we got a FG), after Murray had rattled off a few runs, we gave it to Brown two straight times for nothing. Their LBs were attacking the line of scrimmage at the snap. I think we could've hit 'em up on one of those plays for another first down or maybe TD.

Well if I'd been at TE then we'd have actually had more than 1 catch by Eldridge and 1 catch by Hanna. Then again, they probably should have lined up a TE next to Jarvis Jones all night for as much as he and Cory Brandon were getting flat out whipped by Miami's defensive ends. We could run behind Trent Williams but that only lasted long enough for Miami to stack to that side on Brown's stopped runs. The right side was never open for runs, which is why neither Murray or Brown got more than 3-5 yards at best running behind Jones.

Easy enough for the Canes to dare the offense to throw the ball since especially a deep ball needs a few seconds to develop, and that side of the line without TE/FB help wasn't able to give that kind of protection.

[StoopTroup]

You do know Brody has a broken finger right?

What ever happen to Hanna? I can't explain that. It's right up there with why was Brown a Starter?

[Hotrod3157]

You do know Brody has a broken finger right?

What ever happen to Hanna? I can't explain that. It's right up there with why was Brown a Starter?

I've wondered about Hanna too. For all the preseason hype, he has been an absolute non factor. Didn't he used to date Whitney Hand? Maybe a little trouble with him and Landry :pop: . Who knows hopefully his minor appearance last night will get him rollin for the next few games.

[rawlingsHOH]

I thought Hanna would be a factor in the receiving game.

[KantoSooner]

Well, once again, I'm an idiot for calling attention to our line play in a negative way. Did we get to Harris? Yup. Some of the time. They seemed to open holes pretty much when they needed them, though. And Harris sure seemed to run around long enough to make things happen.
Have fun, I've got to work now.

[Scott D]

You do know Brody has a broken finger right?

What ever happen to Hanna? I can't explain that. It's right up there with why was Brown a Starter?

the finger wasn't so much of a factor. He was thrown to once, and it was on a route that was breaking toward the sideline, not like a Gresham route which would have taken him over the middle.

Also shame on everyone for not giving kudos to Adron Tennell for catching the one ball thrown to him.