Venable Bashers

[yukonmiller]

Get a life. When you hold BYU to 2 TD's and give your offense the ball deep in the opposition territory, I would be looking at the other side of the ball or the man making $3.5MM/YR.

You would think that would be enough to know to call a time out when the play clock is running out or to run it 3 times on 1st and goal from the 2.

[sooner ngintunr]

Re: Venable Bashers;

please STFU.

[TahoeSOONER]

Amen

[MyT Oklahoma]

Good point but unless this thread has become a sport's version of Obama's plans for America.. then let everyone express their opinions and if you don't like them then don't read them.

[pardon the interREDtion]

Couldn't agree more. Defense played well, they were on the field all night and only gave up 14. The offense however showed no imagination at all. Did Madu ever touch the ball? No passes, that I remember, to backs out of the backfield. Give me one good reason why my wife couldn't have called the offensive plays in that game, of course other than the fact that she was probably with you guys at the time.

[soonerchris]

It amazes me. If your a sooner then stand the f**k up and accept what happened. Move on and take it out on the next team. If your a poser then grow up and quit your bitching or leave. I could give a damn how many posts you have

[MyT Oklahoma]

It amazes me. If your a sooner then stand the f**k up and accept what happened. Move on and take it out on the next team. If your a poser then grow up and quit your bitching or leave. I could give a damn how many posts you have

^ This.

[Curly Bill]

It amazes me. If your a sooner then stand the f**k up and accept what happened. Move on and take it out on the next team. If your a poser then grow up and quit your bitching or leave. I could give a damn how many posts you have

Thanks for the lecture, but I'm gonna stay right here and bitch if I feel like it. :rolleyes:

[MR2-Sooner86]

My question is, if Bradford didn't get hurt and it took the 2nd half for him and the offense to get going and in rhythm and the final score was.... 27-14, would people still complain about our defense?

[SOONER44EVER]

The defense played great except for 1 long pass play and 1 drive. The offense.......................not so good.

[soonerchris]

Curly. No prob with that. Guess there's two kinds of gripes. The kind your wife might do just to get you to fix something cause its broken and then the kind where she gripes cuz you didn't do it to her specs. That's what a friends wife does. Not mine!! Umm anyways do you get what I'm sayin?

[misplaced_sooner]

I think the majority of the BV bashers, myself included, give the offensive a pass on this game. If Bradford had played the entire game, the offensive would mostly likely get the most criticism.

I guess the criticism is b/c BVs D has continually came up short in key situations.

Example: BYUs late touchdown. Franks(#1) failed to cover his man, he bit on the underneath guy, b/c that was Halls 'go-to' guy. He lost track of his man. That is a coaching problem....not a talent problem.

To change my opinion of BV, the D is going to have to step up every once in a while and win games. Instead of playing one great game a season, SEE the TEXAS TECH game last year, they need to play 7-8 very good games a season and shut opponents down in key situations in the game.

All that said, Stoops deserves any criticism he gets from booster, media and fans. Big Game Bob has come up big in a very long time.

[Curly Bill]

I'm as big a BV basher as there is on this site...

...but the offense gets a pass? The offense stunk with Sam in there and the offense stunk without Sam.

The defense wasn't great, but just like against Florida the offense gets the blame for this one.

[LawtonBoy74]

Defense kicked *** in this game I was very impressed..but the offense on the other hand hmmmm...Gerald McCoy proved 2nite why he is a 1st rounder and R.Reynolds is a beast, and T.Lewis is a man child..

[CaliBornSoonerBred]

I'm as big a BV basher as there is on this site...

...but the offense gets a pass? The offense stunk with Sam in there and the offense stunk without Sam.

The defense wasn't great, but just like against Florida the offense gets the blame for this one.

I couldn't agree more Curly. I have my "bash bv" moments but this game was on the offense and the offensive play calling. I think the D played great except for Dom who continually looked lost and RR seems to have lost a step in coverage. I wouldn't trade RR's intagibles and leadership for anything though. Kevin Wilson needs to quit being so damn conservative and play to the strengths of the team. Leave a back in to block to give our qb a chance to make a play, throw to our talented TE's in the middle of the field to relax coverage, etc. I am disappointed in the O line and the composure they showed. They looked out of sync all game. The offense couldn't find a groove all night and it's because of the line AND horrendous play calling. I'm don't ranting except to say Gerald McCoy is a stud and this kid is something special.

[sooner ngintunr]

#1 got burned more than once.

We'll be alright.

[CrimsonJim]

I don't give the offense a pass on this game or in last year's MNC. They were the reason we lost both of those games, not the defense.

That being said, the defense had a chance to save the game for us and came up short, again - something that has become all too common under VB's watch. Yes, count me in as another long time skeptic of our defensive coordinator and I will complain till the cows come home, or we once again have a stifling defense of old.

[tulsaoilerfan]

i'm not blaming the defense totally for this loss, but when your offense only gets 13 points, it's still the defense's job to suck it up and hold the other team to 12; how many times can we let other teams convert on third and long because we continually rush 4 and play the soft zone that EVERYONE in America knows how to attack? Pretty damn pathetic if you ask me

[SOONER44EVER]

i'm not blaming the defense totally for this loss, but when your offense only gets 13 points, it's still the defense's job to suck it up and hold the other team to 12; how many times can we let other teams convert on third and long because we continually rush 4 and play the soft zone that EVERYONE in America knows how to attack? Pretty damn pathetic if you ask me

When the offense goes 3 and out over and over eventually the D will have breakdowns. The D played a pretty good game. The offense was offensive.

[LawtonBoy74]

Lets all be honest...we are seeing the situation from hind sight..I bet one million-ga-billion dollars that if someone would have told you that if the defense gives up two touchdowns tonight that we would win the game you would have been excited about it, because you knew the offense would score more than that...So I'm very proud of the defense, considering how long they were on the field

[tulsaoilerfan]

When the offense goes 3 and out over and over eventually the D will have breakdowns. The D played a pretty good game. The offense was offensive.

A championship caliber defense will stop the other team with the game on the line; BYU ran a quick snap count on 4th down and caught the defense not even set for the play; THAT is the definition of poor coaching right there

[SOONER44EVER]

Lets all be honest...we are seeing the situation from hind sight..I bet one million-ga-billion dollars that if someone would have told you that if the defense gives up two touchdowns tonight that we would win the game you would have been excited about it, because you knew the offense would score more than that...So I'm very proud of the defense, considering how long they were on the field

EXACTLY!!!

[SOONER44EVER]

A championship caliber defense will stop the other team with the game on the line; BYU ran a quick snap count on 4th down and caught the defense not even set for the play; THAT is the definition of poor coaching right there

Well if the D had poor coaching what do you call the crap the offensive coaches threw out there? Pathetic? Embarassing? Horrible? Lets jump off the BV sucks bandwagon. The offense is solely to blame for this loss.

[LawtonBoy74]

A championship caliber defense will stop the other team with the game on the line; BYU ran a quick snap count on 4th down and caught the defense not even set for the play; THAT is the definition of poor coaching right there

True, BUT the real coaching mishap is on the offense..countless holding and false start penalties delay of game on the goal line....and BYU's ability to exploit our pass blocking scheme with their blitzes

[LawtonBoy74]

not to mention the bad play calling on the offense in critical situations

[LawtonBoy74]

The only thing I didnt like sometimes from the defense was when we were blitzing especially in those 3rd and long situations... to me it seemed like we could get pressure on Max Hall with just 3 or 4 D lineman

[wishbonesooner]

Did any of you have a feeling we could stop BYU on their last drive? If I was an offensive coordinator, I'd run up the gut on 1st and 2nd down just to get to 3rd and long.

[kingsby]

The defense under BV has been average at best. I don't know why we can't just accept the facts our defense will never win a game for us.

How many times in the last couple of years have we seen teams drive the length of the field and score the game winning touchdown or put a game away in the 4th quarter just as the offense was getting momentum.


1) Oregon
2) Texas (last year)
3) Texas Tech (two years ago)
4) BYU
5) Florida
6) West Virginia

Our defense will never win a championship, not with BV around. Sorry end of story, period.

Our defense only looks good when we are up by 30 points and the other team becomes 1 dimension. If OU is in any kind of close game you can count on the other team scoring late to put the sooners in a bad situation

[btk108]

The run defense was AWESOME....but the pass defense is still a major weakness.

[soonermagic14]

I agree with kingsby....if Vulnerables is such a great DC then why hasnt he landed a head coaching job? we will have our studs on defense well b/c we're OU but so many times they are out of position. Yes, the offense is terrible right now but when is the defense going to step up and win one for us? they say defense wins championships (OU defense in 2000)...didnt we only score 14 in that game?

[SoonernAR]

Despite all those past games, this one can't be blamed on the D. If you would have told me that if we would hold them to 14 pts and lose, I would have taken that bet.

[CK Sooner]

The run defense was AWESOME....but the pass defense is still a major weakness.

I agree. Of course it was the first game and obviously every one needs to get settled, but I think once Proctor and Carter get set at safety then we will be fine. I don't know what happened to Franks last night. He is suppose to be our best DB, but he looked like our worst last night.

[CK Sooner]

Despite all those past games, this one can't be blamed on the D. If you would have told me that if we would hold them to 14 pts and lose, I would have taken that bet.

Exactly, our defense was well prepared. Our offense looked like we were playing against the Florida defense. (before Sam went out too!)

[sooner ngintunr]

I don't know what happened to Franks last night. He is suppose to be our best DB, but he looked like our worst last night.

Thats what I saw too. He gave up a couple of big ones.

[CK Sooner]

Brian Jackson looked like he had a really good night though and Ryan Reynolds looked decent in pass coverage, but he SHINED when they ran the ball. He laid a few good licks and plugged that hole every time.

[soonermagic14]

the corners played well I thought....it was the completions in the middle that killed us

[CK Sooner]

the corners played well I thought....it was the completions in the middle that killed us

Ryan Reynolds did a decent job, but you can put some of that on the safeties. They will get better every game though...

[btk108]

the corners played well I thought....it was the completions in the middle that killed us

Really?....did you see all the completed passes on the sideline routes?

[OklaPony]

Example: BYUs late touchdown. Franks(#1) failed to cover his man, he bit on the underneath guy, b/c that was Halls 'go-to' guy. He lost track of his man. That is a coaching problem....not a talent problem.
Totally disagree. A coach / scheme puts a player in the right place, the player has to make the play. Dom didn't lose track of his man, he released him. That was totally on Dom.

I hate that it happened to him, I think he's great corner... he just made a mistake and that kind of thing happens to everybody occasionally.

[soonermagic14]

Really?....did you see all the completed passes on the sideline routes?

Franks didnt lock it down but I' not worried about him.... Jackson played well

[StoopTroup]

Ryan Reynolds did a decent job, but you can put some of that on the safeties. They will get better every game though...

I was worried about Ryan going into this one. He made some big hits and tracked down guys when he was out of the play.

I'm glad to see him back in form.

[StoopTroup]

Really?....did you see all the completed passes on the sideline routes?

bYu is a good Team. They weren't Idoho St. You knew they were going to make a few plays. We held them to 14 points. Not shabby IMO. Yards and catches don't win games. Points do.

We didn't score. We lost.

[CK Sooner]

Defense good, Offense bad.

That is what we need to work on this week.

[btk108]

I had a coach tell me once.....Defense is the key to winning....if you can hold the opponent to nothing.....the offense can luck one in....

[madillsoonerfan5353]

I'm as big a BV basher as there is on this site...

...but the offense gets a pass? The offense stunk with Sam in there and the offense stunk without Sam.

The defense wasn't great, but just like against Florida the offense gets the blame for this one.


Right on! But we still can't cover middle of the field and when 3 yard passes turn into 15 yard gains that sucks!!! The D done what it could the amount of time it was on the field! Cory Brandon get the blame on the line with most of the ****ing flags!!! My question is did this turn from national title year to rebuild year? :mad: :(

[ashley]

The defense played great except for 1 long pass play and 1 drive. The offense.......................not so good.

My heavens, someone who really saw the game.

[btk108]

I also remember times when the offense stumbled/sputtered and OUr defense took it on themselves to score...and did it well.....that was never going to happen last night. I'm not saying the defense lost the game, I just saying it's not the stellar defense we used to have.

[madillsoonerfan5353]

I was worried about Ryan going into this one. He made some big hits and tracked down guys when he was out of the play.

I'm glad to see him back in form.

On some plays he looked a step behind, but I think that was him not playing a real game for like ten months! On the other note that was one hell of a place to be last night! He'll be back to game speed in a week or two IMO!!

[MacPhatDaddy]

My only concern with the defense is that for the second game in a row they collapsed at critical points in the fourth quarter. Isn't Spring and Summer supposed to be used for conditioning drills so something? It doesn't matter how well you play in the first 3 quarters if you let the opposing team score the go ahead touchdown late in the 4th. It's hard to win that way. Very hard.

[btk108]

bYu is a good Team. They weren't Idoho St. You knew they were going to make a few plays. We held them to 14 points. Not shabby IMO. Yards and catches don't win games. Points do.

We didn't score. We lost.

Yards and catches don't......but they definitely affect momentum.....which we rarely had last night....BYU did.

[JohnnyMack]

Thanks for the lecture, but I'm gonna stay right here and bitch if I feel like it. :rolleyes:

Shocking no one.

[My Opinion Matters]

There's a whole lot of wrong and noob in this thread.

[Curly Bill]

Shocking no one.

Wow, that's really lame even by your standards. :O

[landrun]

Say what you want, but the defense did NOT play good.
BYU had 4 turnovers, one at the goal line where they gave away 7 points right then and there. It would have been much worse if not for those turn overs.

Our defense got toasted for over 300 yards passing again. Hall completed almost 70% of his passes. That's not good defense.

Our dbs have been talking trash this summer and it frustrated me to hear it. They have done nothing to earn the right to be cocky. NOTHING.

Our run defense was acceptable. And McCoy played like an animal.

And we of course, gave up KEY 3rd and longs all night long.

Same ole defense...

[mehip]

I'll gladly be the fat and happy fan of our defensive scheme the moment we start getting quality teams consistently off the field on 3rd and long.

We haven't been able to do that since about 03. Are our Safeties and LBs just slow and untalented or has our scheme been continually exposed to be soft in the middle?

[Curly Bill]

I'll gladly be the fat and happy fan of our defensive scheme the moment we start getting quality teams consistently off the field on 3rd and long.

We haven't been able to do that since about 03. Are our Safeties and LBs just slow and untalented or has our scheme been continually exposed to be soft in the middle?

We are not slow! Travis Lewis and Keenan Clayton are both fast for LBers.

Our scheme on the other hand has blown chunks for years now.

[StoopTroup]

Take it easy Curly. It's just another drive by.


mehip

Join Date: 10/6/2007

Spent time on board: 4 Days and 2:58:20 Hours

15 posts

[wishbonesooner]

I thought the D played an outstanding game against Tebow. They were solid all night except for one thing. They could not get him off the field on 3rd down. That is just weird to me. Last night, we made Hall look alot better than he is. Sooner fans are hard on our team and coaches, no doubt about it. I think if we could see improvement in these situations, we'd all just say Oh Well. But it's that same situation that really has kept us from being as good as the fans of the program want it to be.

[Curly Bill]

Take it easy Curly. It's just another drive by.

I just jumped on an opportunity to defend our players, while at the same time taking a shot at our coaches, I'm gonna jump on all of those I can get. ;) :D

[mehip]

We are not slow! Travis Lewis and Keenan Clayton are both fast for LBers.

Our scheme on the other hand has blown chunks for years now.

Thats my point. Sorry if I wasn't clear about it. I agree 100% with you and I think the coaches have really put these kids in a poor situation time and time again. Last night, those kids played their hearts out.

[mehip]

Take it easy Curly. It's just another drive by.

No drive by. I was just not clear/ironic enough. Personally I think our kids played their tails off but the D scheme is simply lacking on third downs.

[Curly Bill]

No drive by. I was just not clear/ironic enough. Personally I think our kids played their tails off but the D scheme is simply lacking on third downs.

Oh, it's not just on 3rd downs. ;)

[badger]

I thought the defense looked amazing yesterday. This loss is on the offense and all the flags they got thrown :(

[SoonerLB]

I thought the defense looked pretty darned good too, except for Dom! And I imagine that problem will be addressed shortly. We were playing a very good team, and a team that is normally pass happy, so they are going to get yardage. Take away what Dom (or his side of the defense) gave them (points included), and it's a whole different ball game.
We have some serious offensive woes to worry about, such as the offensive line, a rookie QB, and GETTING THE PLAYS CALLED BEFORE THE CLOCK RUNS OUT! It's NOT the defense people!

[ashley]

We are not slow! Travis Lewis and Keenan Clayton are both fast for LBers.

Our scheme on the other hand has blown chunks for years now.

I recommend we make some first fowns and keep the D off the field.. What scheme do you recommend on D. You have to rush 4 most of the time and cover both flats and at leaste two deep. That generally leaves three backers. Pray tell, give us yours.

[Curly Bill]

I recommend we make some first fowns and keep the D off the field.. What scheme do you recommend on D. You have to rush 4 most of the time and cover both flats and at leaste two deep. That generally leaves three backers. Pray tell, give us yours.

I doubt you'd understand it if I did.

...but tell us again how allsome our coaches are. That is the only reason you come here right, to stick up for these guys making millions per year to turn out what we witnessed last night?

[OlRedMagic]

The defense played great except for 1 long pass play and 1 drive. The offense.......................not so good.

If by "played great", you mean allowed more than 300 yards passing from an average offense and a 16 play drive to take the lead and giving up multiple 3rd down conversions, then yes, the defense was OUTSTANDING.

[OlRedMagic]

I thought the defense looked pretty darned good too, except for Dom! And I imagine that problem will be addressed shortly. We were playing a very good team, and a team that is normally pass happy, so they are going to get yardage. Take away what Dom (or his side of the defense) gave them (points included), and it's a whole different ball game.
We have some serious offensive woes to worry about, such as the offensive line, a rookie QB, and GETTING THE PLAYS CALLED BEFORE THE CLOCK RUNS OUT! It's NOT the defense people!

Do you know what you're looking at when you're looking at it? Or are you just lock stepping with the standard line of illogical logic?

[ashley]

I doubt you'd understand it if I did.

...but tell us again how allsome our coaches are. That is the only reason you come here right, to stick up for these guys making millions per year to turn out what we witnessed last night?

Come on Bill that's not good enough. I will assure you I will understand if you have a clue. Give us your ideas, I am waiting and a smart comment does not count, just the schemes you would use. Just remember you only have 11.

[OlRedMagic]

I doubt you'd understand it if I did.

...but tell us again how allsome our coaches are. That is the only reason you come here right, to stick up for these guys making millions per year to turn out what we witnessed last night?

+1000

This was NOT a good performance by the defense. Their offensive line was more patch-worked than ours and they seemed to handle "one of the best front seven" quite easily, especially when the game was on the line. When their best was needed it was nowhere to be found.

[OlRedMagic]

Come on Bill that's not good enough. I will assure you I will understand if you have a clue. Give us your ideas, I am waiting and a smart comment does not count, just the schemes you would use. Just remember you only have 11.

I have a good idea. Since you're so knowledgeable, why don't you go ahead and break down the scheme's used last night for us and explain what you feel is so great? I mean let's go quid pro quo here champ! I'll send you a link so you can download the game and then you can go back and break it down and show us the greatness in play by play fashion. Deal???

[Okie35]

Exactly OP in my prediction I had BYU scoring 14 in the game. Their offense was actually decent. I had no problems w/ our the defense in the game. Offensively on the other hand... :(

[ashley]

I have a good idea. Since you're so knowledgeable, why don't you go ahead and break down the scheme's used last night for us and explain what you feel is so great? I mean let's go quid pro quo here champ! I'll send you a link so you can download the game and then you can go back and break it down and show us the greatness in play by play fashion. Deal???

I never said we played great on D. We did not did a great rush but it is hard to blitz much against 4 wide. As I said, you have to cover both flats and have at least two deep so that leaves three backers so you have to play man with one or two or zone and mix it up. Today's spread stuff puts lots of pressure on all the secondary, especially the corners and backers. the biggest problem I saw was the backers not finding the receivers in their zone soon enough and that is not scheme. If you play too much zone with them then the O will put a speed guy on them and now it is a track meet and the backer will lose. There are few secrets in college ball and you can just do so much. You can play man under on the corners against a two wide set but not much at all against the spread.
Now I am waiting on Bill to find out what he would do.

[SoonerInSpringdale]

Defense gets an A- for this effort. Holding this team's offense to 14 is good. I don't care what you say. Our defense last year wouldn't have held them to 14.

[StoopTroup]

The defense carried us in 2000 when we were beat the heck up. Yes...we haven't seen Defense like that since Teddy Lehman left IMO.

FWIW. Ryan getting hurt in the RRSO last year hurt us badly and seeing him get back in there as a leader last night really gives me hope the rest of the way. McCoy, Beal, Franks, Lewis, Carter and English are all capable of making our D formidable.

Our Defensive guys have known they may face being on the field a lot. It happened last year and they aren't new to it.

I think you'll see them gel once the Offense is hopefully clicking again.

[Curly Bill]

Now I am waiting on Bill to find out what he would do.

Weak...I'm not going to spend the time it would take to explain exactly what should be done. If you have a clue then you know explaining a complete defensive system is just not something that can be done in a few minutes on a message board.

Thanks for throwing that red herring out there though.


...and I never said I knew more about coordinating a defense than Stoops or Venables either. I do know when something is wrong and has been wrong for a number of years. Another red herring you guys like to use: "tell us what you would do?" meh.... Again, that's a weak defense of these very highly paid coaches.

[StoopTroup]

LEAVE CURLY ALONE ! ! !

http://www.podcastingnews.com/content/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/leave-britney-alone-guy.jpg

[ashley]

Did I loose you Bill?

[Curly Bill]

Did I loose you Bill?

Nope, didn't even lose me. :P

[rhombic21]

We only gave up 14 points, but the reality is that it could have been much worse. BYU made a ton of mistakes, and easily could have scored another 10-14 points.

The zone blitz stuff works when you mix it in, not when you run it every freaking third down. Our blitz schemes haven't been effective in at least 4 years because they are ridiculously easy to predict. And when you have a line that is dominating the way ours was last night, there's no need to zone blitz. Just let the front 4 get after the QB and put everyone else in coverage.

Do we ever run man coverage? And do we ever think about showing a blitz and then backing out of it, or giving the players some sort of "kill" option if the QB switches up the cadence and we tip the play? I mean pretty much every third down they would get us to show the blitz, and then know exactly where the pressure was coming from.

I don't know that Venables needs to be fired, but he needs to change his philosophy, and he needs to recognize that the schemes that we've been using for the last several years aren't effective anymore. To the extent that we are able to play good defense, it has largely been a product of having superior talent, rather than having a great defensive scheme.

[ashley]

Bill, now you finally admitted you don't know as much as our DC and Head Coach. That is all I was looking for. How in the world do you know if we should have been in another scheme and it was not the players fault.

[CK Sooner]

Venables on BYU converting third downs…

You've got to get off the field. We've always prided ourselves on that. We were really good at it a year ago and we've got to get better than what we were tonight, obviously.

[CK Sooner]

Venables on question marks like Ryan Reynolds and Sam Proctor having solid games but established players like Dom Franks having rough nights…

I thought there were the two big plays. That was on us. We thought they were in a different personnel group and we made a call that isn't particularly good against what their personnel actually was. Then they threw an underneath route and they ran it for 50 yards. We just lost the guy on the other one.

[CK Sooner]

Venables on the pass rush…

I thought it was good. I thought they were disruptive and they had some opportunities at some other sacks. I thought they were good.

[StoopTroup]

Damn Vegetable Bashers ! ! !

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_isUvlzkZPIQ/R-aEgm0QGzI/AAAAAAAABxw/XQiqlzcjhoU/s320/13659_500.jpg

[StoopTroup]

5 minutes to go Franks gets a pass interference call for pushing in the back.

Bad call.

Awful call. 1st and goal BYU

Check your DVR.

[misplaced_sooner]

Call me a flip flopper, but after sleeping on it, this game doesn't fall on the D and I no longer feel the O gets a pass.

I believe this loss fails on the coaching staff. The O-line was undisciplined, the play calling was terrible in the red zone(for the second consecutive game).

[rhombic21]

Honestly, is there anybody here who didn't think BYU was going to score the go ahead TD after they crossed midfield? I was holding out hope that they'd self destruct as they had earlier in the game, but I had no confidence at all in the defense to rise up and make a big play with the game on the line.

[StoopTroup]

Call me a flip flopper.

Flip Flopper.

[rhombic21]

5 minutes to go Franks gets a pass interference call for pushing in the back.

Bad call.

Awful call. 1st and goal BYU

Check your DVR.
Not quite sure what you're talking about. That was a pretty textbook definition of pass interference. Franks got there way early.

[StoopTroup]

Honestly, is there anybody here who didn't think BYU was going to score the go ahead TD after they crossed midfield? I was holding out hope that they'd self destruct as they had earlier in the game, but I had no confidence at all in the defense to rise up and make a big play with the game on the line.

Thought we might hold them to a FG.

McCoy was stopping the run at the goal-line. The pass interference call on Franks was BS and they caught Dominic, Ryan and Proctor in a mixup in the EZ on 3rd and goal to get that TD.

[StoopTroup]

Not quite sure what you're talking about. That was a pretty textbook definition of pass interference. Franks got there way early.

I'm saying it was a no call.

[rhombic21]

Thought we might hold them to a FG.

Down by 6 with that amount of time to go in the game, they aren't kicking a FG.

As soon as they got that penalty and had third and goal from too far out to run, I knew they were going to pass for the TD.

[SOONER44EVER]

My heavens, someone who really saw the game.

Thanks. I know its a kinda weird thing to do, but I usually try to actually watch the game before I come on here and start posting. I don't think some people who post on here actually watch the games.

[SOONER44EVER]

If by "played great", you mean allowed more than 300 yards passing from an average offense and a 16 play drive to take the lead and giving up multiple 3rd down conversions, then yes, the defense was OUTSTANDING.

Compared to the offense the defense was OUTSTANDING.

[tulsaoilerfan]

Compared to the offense the defense was OUTSTANDING.

IMO they are both equally at fault; no matter how crappy the offense looks, the defense has to make that stop with the game on the line

[tulsaoilerfan]

We only gave up 14 points, but the reality is that it could have been much worse. BYU made a ton of mistakes, and easily could have scored another 10-14 points.

The zone blitz stuff works when you mix it in, not when you run it every freaking third down. Our blitz schemes haven't been effective in at least 4 years because they are ridiculously easy to predict. And when you have a line that is dominating the way ours was last night, there's no need to zone blitz. Just let the front 4 get after the QB and put everyone else in coverage.

Do we ever run man coverage? And do we ever think about showing a blitz and then backing out of it, or giving the players some sort of "kill" option if the QB switches up the cadence and we tip the play? I mean pretty much every third down they would get us to show the blitz, and then know exactly where the pressure was coming from.

I don't know that Venables needs to be fired, but he needs to change his philosophy, and he needs to recognize that the schemes that we've been using for the last several years aren't effective anymore. To the extent that we are able to play good defense, it has largely been a product of having superior talent, rather than having a great defensive scheme.

Did we watch the same game? On the game winning TD, they tried exactly what you wanted by dropping 7 into coverage and only rushing 4 and giving the QB all damn day to find the open receiver; course it doesn't help when 4 guys cover 1. Go back and watch the game again and you will see that wasn't the only time we dropped 7 back into coverage and got burned

[StoopTroup]

Down by 6 with that amount of time to go in the game, they aren't kicking a FG.

As soon as they got that penalty and had third and goal from too far out to run, I knew they were going to pass for the TD.

Looking back...your right. they had squandered a lot of clock and left us with plenty of time to take them with a FG.

Had they been better at running the clock they probably wouldn't have left us with so much. They took a huge risk. I'd say they were crapping their britches when they got set back on 3rd down.

We probably should have taken a time out.

I didn't get a chance to review the end until the replay tonight. DVR had quit at the end last night and I didn't notice.

[Camomaha]

From the outside looking in I have to say that the OU D is not as good with BV as it was under MS. MS D won games for OU, BV D does not. Think back to 00, the D won the game both times vs KSU and vs FSU. Hell, the MS coached D won the MNC for OU that year. They always came up with a play when they had to. The BV version of the D does not, it gives up 18 play drives when it counts. D wins championships.

[wishbonesooner]

We haven't stopped a team from driving the length of the field, with the game on the line, in 5 years. If I'm wrong, somebody point out to me when it has happened.

[StoopTroup]

In 2008 we held Chattanooga to 2 points and 36 yards of Offense.

http://www.soonersports.com/sports/m-footbl/recaps/083008aaa.html

[CrimsonJim]

In 2008 we held Chattanooga to 2 points and 36 yards of Offense.

http://www.soonersports.com/sports/m-footbl/recaps/083008aaa.html

He said, "with the game on the line." ;)

[rhombic21]

Did we watch the same game? On the game winning TD, they tried exactly what you wanted by dropping 7 into coverage and only rushing 4 and giving the QB all damn day to find the open receiver; course it doesn't help when 4 guys cover 1. Go back and watch the game again and you will see that wasn't the only time we dropped 7 back into coverage and got burned

Yes, they finally dropped 7 on that play (after the DL had been on the field for a ridiculously long drive and was tired), but most of the time on third and medium, we came with a zone blitz that they (and everybody else who watched the game) saw coming a mile away, which got picked up and was ridiculously easy for them to pick apart.

[Hotrod3157]

Honestly, is there anybody here who didn't think BYU was going to score the go ahead TD after they crossed midfield? I was holding out hope that they'd self destruct as they had earlier in the game, but I had no confidence at all in the defense to rise up and make a big play with the game on the line.

As soon as we kicked the field goal instead of gettin the touchdown I said to myself we're gonna get beat. I had the same hope that you had about BYU beating themselves with a mistake but we didn't get that lucky. Its the offense's fault that the game was in that situation and the defense was backed against the wall like that. I've got no confidence in the D to make the play when its needed anymore and it hurts me to say it. The offensive mistakes and key injuries are the real reason we lost the game last night. The defense had the chance to line up and win the game for us and they just couldn't get the job done when it was all on them.

This D has got talent at every position and McCoy could have been confused with a Selmon last night. I can see this defense keeping the score down against pretty much anybody we face this year. Its just going to be the Offense's job to win the game because for some reason with all the talent we have the defense can't seem to make the play when its needed and its been a problem for a few years now.

[Crucifax Autumn]

Less predictablility on both sides of the ball is the key. There's just not much else to say. The broken assignments and missed blocks obviously factor in, but when the opposing team knows exactly when the blitz is coming or knows for certain we are going to run a certain direction or pass to a specific part of the field or can see exactly what the blocking scheme will be we're gonna get beat or at the very least struggle.

[MacPhatDaddy]

Championship calibre defenses do not collapse in the 4th quarter. An entire spring and summer to prepare and the defense still collapsed in the 4th quarter. Again. Not cool.

[Texas Golfer]

i'm not blaming the defense totally for this loss, but when your offense only gets 13 points, it's still the defense's job to suck it up and hold the other team to 12; how many times can we let other teams convert on third and long because we continually rush 4 and play the soft zone that EVERYONE in America knows how to attack? Pretty damn pathetic if you ask me

I'd have to agree with this. Although our defense let up "only" 14 points, our secondary got beat all night long. We let their QB throw for over 300 yards and two TDs while completing 2/3 of his passes. We let them get a fourth down conversion on their way to scoring an easy TD when the game was on the line.

That being said, I'm not laying the blame for the loss on the defense. I don't know what the offensive coaches were thinking. We let that LB blitz Bradford from the blind side all evening until we let our Heisman winner get hurt. After the first couple of hits, you'd think we'd make an adjustment. But, alas, we didn't.

I feel sorry for Sam that he gave up tens of millions of dollars to come back to lead us to a national championship and our coaches let him down.

[Texas Golfer]

Compared to the offense the defense was OUTSTANDING.

With all of the arguing on this thread, we finally have a post that I think we all can agree with.

[Jack T.]

We haven't stopped a team from driving the length of the field, with the game on the line, in 5 years. If I'm wrong, somebody point out to me when it has happened.

I am also interested in an example.

[badger]

So a few Venables bashers just walked in the door. A few days later and they're still fuming over Saturday. It makes me wonder what the polls are gonna look like when released tomorrow.

[CrimsonJim]

That will be interesting indeed, badge. I don't think the polls will be kind, but I'm hoping for the best. Fingers crossed.

[Breadburner]

Check the time of possesion.....It will depress you.....

[Jboozer]

I love BV, and the defense looked great the other night. My only complaint is that there was way to much space over the middle. Everyone I talk to talks about how complicated BV schemes are, and with our athletes I would like to see more man to man. our corners shut down their receivers in man, Lewis and Clayton can guard any reveiver. Im not complaining, but I would like to see a little less complication some times so players don't get confused and leave open a reveiver in the back of the endzone for a score.

[Hotrod3157]

The time of possesion is very bad and wore the defense down. Thats both the offense's fault from their mistakes and not getting first downs but also our D's fault for letting BYU convert so many 3rd downs and not getting themselves off the field.