Private healthcare insurance to be illegal under House plan

[batonrougesooner]

http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=332548165656854

No more new private policies once this becomes law.

[ndpruitt03]

Welcome to the communist nation of America

[Petro-Sooner]

Cant say I'm surprised. Sad deal!

[Sooner_Havok]

Already posted


Say Adios to your private health insurance everybody...
http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=332548165656854

Already put into context




20 SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE CHOICE TO KEEP CURRENT
21 COVERAGE.
22 (a) GRANDFATHERED HEALTH INSURANCE COV
23ERAGE DEFINED.—Subject to the succeeding provisions of
24 this section, for purposes of establishing acceptable cov
25erage under this division, the term ‘‘grandfathered health


1 insurance coverage’’ means individual health insurance
2 coverage that is offered and in force and effect before the
3 first day of Y1 (as defined in section 100(c)) if the fol4
lowing conditions are met:
5 (1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT.—
6 (A) IN GENERAL.—Except as provided in
7 this paragraph, the individual health insurance
8 issuer offering such coverage does not enroll
9 any individual in such coverage if the effective
10 date of coverage is on or after the first day of



In context.

It is explaining what will and won't be grandfathered in.

Here, knock yourself out kid

health care for all Americans" bill (http://waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf/111/hrdraft.pdf)

read it yourself, don't trust other people trying to push their fears and beliefs on you.

[Boomer Mooner]

Already posted



Already put into context

Did you even read what's been posted in this thread? No more NEW private policies, and no more changing of existing policies. Nothing you posted says anything different. The link you posted to the 2 billion page document was nice touch though, and very typical.:pop:

[picasso]

push our fears on you? damn straight. this will be the biggest cluster **** yet by our jacked up government. Yeah, let's introduce a bill that is 1,000 pages long and full of so much pork and control that not one freaking rep has been able to read the entire thing.

wringing hands and fat cats abound.

[batonrougesooner]

As mentioned above. What context is needed? I read it myself. No new contracts or changes to existing contracts. Only existing contracts will be grandfathered in. They will allow you to add a dependant to an existing contract. How nice of them.

[SCOUT]

I haven't had a chance to read the 1,018 pages just yet ;) but this paragraph from the first article is one that concerns me

The legislation is also likely to finish off health savings accounts, a goal that Democrats have had for years. They want to crush that alternative because nothing gives individuals more control over their medical care, and the government less, than HSA's

I am a fan of HSA's and think they could do a fair amount of good towards lowering the actual costs of healthcare and subsequently insurance.

[yermom]

is that where you put money in an account tax free to use on medical stuff?

i think that's a racket, but that's just me

and if this is the way they want it, it's a little scary... it's one thing to say that you can keep your current coverage, but that's a little misleading since no one keeps the same job very long anymore

[SCOUT]

is that where you put money in an account tax free to use on medical stuff?

i think that's a racket, but that's just me

and if this is the way they want it, it's a little scary... it's one thing to say that you can keep your current coverage, but that's a little misleading since no one keeps the same job very long anymore

A health savings account allows you to put money into your own account and spend it on your medical expenses. It is also portable so you keep the money wherever you work. It has a high deductible (it is alternatively called a "high deductible health plan") but coverage for major medical, thus the premiums are lower. I have had one for two years and it is great.

[Frozen Sooner]

A health savings account allows you to put money into your own account and spend it on your medical expenses. It is also portable so you keep the money wherever you work. It has a high deductible (it is alternatively called a "high deductible health plan") but coverage for major medical, thus the premiums are lower. I have had one for two years and it is great.

This is incorrect.

An HSA is not insurance and has no deductible. In order to qualify for an HSA, you must be enrolled in a high-deductible health plan, which IS insurance. You may be enrolled in a high deductible health plan that's coupled with an HSA, which might be the source of the confusion.

An HSA works very like an IRA-you can make tax-deductible contributions up to a certain yearly limit based on whether your health plan is a family or individual plan. As SCOUT said, it's portable. You can also make a one-time contribution from your traditional IRA account to help fund the HSA. You may spend any amount you wish out of your HSA for health-related purchases.

A nice little bonus: once you attain a certain age (I think 64.5, but don't quote me) you can basically spend your HSA money however you like.

[SCOUT]

This is incorrect.

An HSA is not insurance and has no deductible. In order to qualify for an HSA, you must be enrolled in a high-deductible health plan, which IS insurance. You may be enrolled in a high deductible health plan that's coupled with an HSA, which might be the source of the confusion.

An HSA works very like an IRA-you can make tax-deductible contributions up to a certain yearly limit based on whether your health plan is a family or individual plan. As SCOUT said, it's portable. You can also make a one-time contribution from your traditional IRA account to help fund the HSA. You may spend any amount you wish out of your HSA for health-related purchases.

A nice little bonus: once you attain a certain age (I think 64.5, but don't quote me) you can basically spend your HSA money however you like.

My attempt at brevity changed my meaning. Yes, the HSA is an account and the high deductible health plan is the insurance. Aside from your correct clarification, I agree. And yes, you can spend it as you see fit upon retirement age. I believe it changes like other retirement age benefits.

Another little bonus is that you can make a contribution to your account, up to an annual limit, any time you see fit. This unlike the flex spending accounts that are so common.

[Frozen Sooner]

Fair enough. I kind of like the idea of HSAs, I just wish they were available to more people than just those in HDHPs. For example, I'd love to have a tax-free method of saving for LASIK surgery.

[SCOUT]

I believe LASIK now qualifies under 125 plans too.

[Frozen Sooner]

No kidding? I'll have to look into that.

Well, no, I won't. Saving for anything for the the next three years probably isn't happening. :(

[SCOUT]

Page 8
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p502.pdf


You can include in medical expenses the amount you pay for eye surgery to treat defective vision such as laser eye surgery and radial keratotomy

[Frozen Sooner]

Right, but you can only deduct that amount you spend on medical over 7.5% of your income, right? Helpful, but not as helpful as full deductibility. When I'm working, I make enough that LASIK is under that limit-and I generally don't spend that much on medical in a year.

[mikeelikee]

This gubm't healthcare boondoggle is not going to pass. It's losing support almost on a daily basis, as more and more people see it for the power-grab it is. Obamacare = DOA.

[SCOUT]

Right, but you can only deduct that amount you spend on medical over 7.5% of your income, right? Helpful, but not as helpful as full deductibility. When I'm working, I make enough that LASIK is under that limit-and I generally don't spend that much on medical in a year.

When I reference 125 plans, I was referring to cafeteria or flex spending accounts. Corrective eye surgery is now included in those plans. In fact, our vision provider classified it as a covered expense under our vision plan for 2009.

[Frozen Sooner]

Ah, right. Yeah, LASIK was part of the last flex spending plan I had. Unfortunately, I didn't take advantage of it-and my current employer (for only 11 more days in the office!) doesn't offer one.

[yermom]

i was thinking of flexible spending. this other thing sounds pretty cool if you can keep money in it year after year

[JLEW1818]

spend spend spend!! Tax Tax Tax

"Only the 250,000 and higher will see a tax increase!!!"

HA

I believe that when me $hit turns purple and smells like rainbow sherbert.

[yermom]

you mean Shenanigans?

[JLEW1818]

LOL!!!

They claim they are coming out with a new supertroopers in 2010... it better be funny, had 9 years to think of stuff.

[Boomer Mooner]

i was thinking of flexible spending. this other thing sounds pretty cool if you can keep money in it year after year

Yes, it is cool. I have my own business and have to buy my own insurance. A high deductible plan is the only way to go, and really if everyone had something like this I think you could see medical costs come down.

When I go to the doctors office for basic care I tell them up front I will be paying for the service, not the insurance company. They love that because it's another 5 pounds of paperwork they don't have to do. I also only pay about 60 to 75% of what they would charge me if they had to file the insurance claim.

The answer to health care is less bureaucracy, not more.

[OklahomaRed]

You ever notice how Havoc kind of goes away when actual real discussion begins to occur on how the government (screw republican versus democrat - they are all on the take and paid off) is going to take your money (one way or another) and find new ways to subject you to deppendance on the government for your very existence? "Let's all belly up to the government trough and have them feed us, burp us, and wipe our butts for us".

I say put the power back in the state's control and we'll see which state has the best program and survives economically, and get rid of the Federal Reserve Bank which leaves power in the hands of the filthy rich.

[My Opinion Matters]

You ever notice how Havoc kind of goes away when actual real discussion begins to occur on how the government (screw republican versus democrat - they are all on the take and paid off) is going to take your money (one way or another) and find new ways to subject you to deppendance on the government for your very existence? "Let's all belly up to the government trough and have them feed us, burp us, and wipe our butts for us".

I say put the power back in the state's control and we'll see which state has the best program and survives economically, and get rid of the Federal Reserve Bank which leaves power in the hands of the filthy rich.

Havok is not one of the heavy-hitting liberals. See Curly Bill for the complete list.

[The Remnant]

I wonder if Congress will use the same health care as the masses? This is the same group that pushes public education, then puts their kids in private schools to keep them away from the rabble.

[OklahomaTuba]

I read another part where this BS is available to everyone in the US, not just legal citizens.

Guess Brack needs them messicans for 2010 and 2012.

[yermom]

so the orange pickers have to pay 8% if they don't give them insurance? :confused:

they already get free health care :rolleyes:

[The Remnant]

When illegal aliens become citizens they will qualify for all kinds of goodies.

[yermom]

yeah, but we'll get to tax them too

[The Remnant]

They won't make enough money to pay any income tax.

[The Remnant]

It also costs much more to educate ELL students. The education pie is only so big. A bigger slice for them short-changes regular education students. As a result programs that are not mandated are cut. They can't cut salaries because th CTA(California Teachers Association) controls state government.

[JLEW1818]

If your poor vote obama

[OklahomaRed]

No, if you're lazy vote for Obama. If you're rich vote for a Republican. If you work for a living you're going to get screwed either way. Might as well sit back, relax, and sweat. :D

[JLEW1818]

and some people actually thought Obama was poor... hahaha

[jiminy]

This healthcare plan seems insanely liberal, but they have to know it won't pass. I wonder if the intention is just to move the compromise point as close to lefty-loony land as they can.

Hopefully this is not something Obama can just executive order in...

[ndpruitt03]

I've looked through all the other countries with universal health care don't have half the population we do. Brazil is the closest but they also have a large private sector healthcare(40 million people have private healthcare) and they also have terrible hospitals and have low quality doctors.

China is trying to get universal healthcare but with 1.5 billion people it's tough to do. The semantics of providing for that many people is so expensive. Especially without a private sector which is what helps make it cheaper for health care because of that evil capitalism thing.

[JLEW1818]

Cali, a top 3 liberal state in the US, is doing great!!!! :rolleyes:

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

so i read through the thing last night, its actually fairly clear cut compared with the cap and trade fiasco.

a couple of highlights...

there is a lot of language about helping medicaid get more cost efficient - not a bad thing

there is a lot of language about student loan forgiveness for medical students (2 years and you are debt free).

the language on data collection and distribution to other gov't entities is a little eye raising. they only mention hippa once.

the rich tax that they advertised 1%, 1.5%, 5.4% is only for the first year. then it moves to 2%, 3%, 5.4%.

if the plan has 750 billion in assests, they begin to phase out the rich taxes for the first 2 tiers. the 3rd tier is permanent.

this paragraph scares the crap out of me though

Affordable Premium Amount-
(1) IN GENERAL- The affordable premium amount specified in this subsection for an individual for monthly premium in a plan year shall be equal to 1/12 of the product of--
(A) the premium percentage limit specified in paragraph (2) for the individual based upon the individual’s family income for the plan year; and
(B) the individual’s family income for such plan year.
(2) PREMIUM PERCENTAGE LIMITS BASED ON TABLE- The Commissioner shall establish premium percentage limits so that for individuals whose family income is within an income tier specified in the table in subsection (d) such percentage limits shall increase, on a sliding scale in a linear manner, from the initial premium percentage to the final premium percentage specified in such table for such income tier.

if that says what i think it says bill gates could have a heck of a premium...

[JLEW1818]

why can't people just worry about themselves? I was never giving much, and I"m making it fine... JMO

[ndpruitt03]

why can't people just worry about themselves? I was never giving much, and I"m making it fine... JMO

If they make the health care system to where it's optional and you can have private heath care if you want it, that would be the best system. It's what most of the rest of the world has.