Government Motors

[swardboy]

So help me understand Obama's business plan here:
*Produce cars no one wants to buy....
*Cut the advertising budget in half...preventing product knowledge of the public
*Close over 2,000 retail outlets...Mammoth loss of jobs and reduced points of sale

I'm so dumb...how does this save GM?

[TUSooner]

That plan's according to whom?
:rolleyes:

[OUDoc]

Yeah, I think step 1 is a big assumption.

[OklahomaTuba]

Yeah, we will want to buy them.

Know why??

Cause Obama's new CAFE standards will make trucks and SUVs basically unaffordable to the common man, and the Cap and tax BS will push the price of gas so high that only a the rich could afford to fill their trucks and SUVs up.

Combine that the CAFE and Carbon Tax with the fact that he is trying to restrict domestic oil and gas production, and well you get the picture.

In a few years, we won't have a choice but to stuff our fat American asses into clown cars. AND WE WILL LIKE IT!!!!

And it won't stop the weather from changing one bit either.

[King Crimson]

That plan's according to whom?
:rolleyes:

Rush. he said that yesterday. almost verbatim.

[OklahomaTuba]

King must be a fan.

[OklahomaTuba]

You forgot step 4 & 5:
*Offshore whats left of government motors to China.
*Profit!

[picasso]

You guys really don't think there's one or two folks in charge who aren't happy as hell to have control of those large companies?

I'm holding out hope that Obama isn't.

[OklahomaTuba]

Its some 31 year old law school flunkie from the white house mail room who is in charge of all this.

And no, I'm not kidding.

[OUDoc]

Its some 31 year old law school flunkie from the white house mail room who is in charge of all this.

And no, I'm not kidding.

We saw your post yesterday.

31? He must be an idiot for making himself so young.

At what age do you become competent to advise?

[TUSooner]

Rush. he said that yesterday. almost verbatim.

What a surprise.

I guess now's as good a time as any for this quick 7-step refresher on how to attack the President on the SO.

1. Start with a simplistic, mythical conviction of (1) the total independence and self-reliance of the individual and the related precepts that (2) all government is evil and (3) all government activity (except war, of course) is "creeping socialism" aimed at devouring your personal liberty. This requires ignoring the role of society in human life (see, e.g., misc. writings of Edmund Burke) as well as a complete disregard for any benefits you have derived from the US Government. It takes some doing, especially the last part, but it must be done if your attack is to proceed! Don't skip this important step!

2. Assume the worst about the President, particularly in relation to the iron-clad convictions cemented in place in Step 1. If necessary, consult Rush Limbaugh, other right-wing radio demagogues, or the latest anonymously generated "facts" about the President in your email inbox, for data demonstrating that the President is responsible for any real or imagined evil and is otherwise the enemy of human liberty. The more you actually believe these facts, the easier will be the next steps.

3. Propound the the factual presumptions and creations of Step 2 as immutable truth. Steps 2 and 3 are sometimes called "building a strawman." Build it well, because these presumptions are essential to your attack!

4. This is the fun part: Attack the strawman with white-hot indignation. Rhetorical winks, nudges, and snorts will suffice in the absence of logic, because, face it, most of your audience is already on your side.

5. Resist any temptation to have your presumptions altered by simple facts or any of the many inconvenient realities that tend to plague practical political theory. If this seems troublesome, go back to Step 1. In extreme cases, you may need to listen to several uninterrupted hours of the previously recommended right-wing radio demagoguery. (You might be doing this anyweay, so it's no big problem.) Under NO circumstances should you expose yourself to corrupting influences like National Public Radio or even The Economist Magazine !!

6. If an opponent ever reveals any weakness in your carefully crafted intellectual "Maginot Line," change the subject, starting again with Step 1. Here's a little rule of thumb: Remember, your brain is a hammer, so treat every problem as a nail, and you'll be fine.

7. Enjoy the hours of sparkling intellectual discussions that will ensue!

[Okla-homey]

All I know for sure is GM hasn't made a profit since 2005. Now, we own a controlling interest in it. Yay us!

[OklahomaTuba]

We saw your post yesterday.

31? He must be an idiot for making himself so young.

At what age do you become competent to advise?

Not sure,

but i'd feel better, and the thousands of people who may lose their jobs by this 31 year old may feel better, had this guy once in his life maybe been to a car factory.

Or actually had any experience with a car company.

Or any company actually.

[OklahomaTuba]

4. This is the fun part: Attack the strawman with white-hot indignation. Rhetorical winks, nudges, and snorts will suffice in the absence of logic, because, face it, most of your audience is already on your side.



You do realize he just nationalized our largest car company, right???

[OUDoc]

Not sure,

but i'd feel better, and the thousands of of people who will lose their jobs cause by this 31 year old had once in his life maybe been to a car factory.

Or actually had any experience with a car company.

Or any company actually.

If nothing is done, thousands already lose their jobs, so he can't really screw it up, can he?

Is taking over as CEO of GM? I missed that part.

[OklahomaTuba]

If nothing is done, thousands already lose their jobs, so he can't really screw it up, can he?


Sure, I mean we already spent 30-50 billion on the company, whats a few more thousand jobs or so?? Hows that working out so far for you???

Maybe China will give the union suckers some jobs once Obama sell's the rest of it to them?????

[Dio]

Honest question for those who aren't liberal but don't like Rush- what are good sources of information about what's going on? It doesn't seem like most of the media is questioning anything this administration says or does. Rush might go too far the other way, but he's one of the few people with a platform who aren't lap dogs for Obama.

[OUDoc]

Sure, I mean we already spent 30-50 billion on the company, whats a few more thousand jobs or so?? Hows that working out so far for you???

Maybe China will give the union suckers some jobs once Obama sell's the rest of it to them?????
As usual, you didn't address the question. What's done is done. How can he screw it up anymore than GM's execs did? The company has about zero value right now, besides it's physical assets.

Tuba, are you in politics? If not, why aren't you? This seems to be your true passion and you play the game as well as anyone.

[OklahomaTuba]

Some of my suggestions (and I don't listen to talk radio, don't have the time)

Powerline: http://www.powerlineblog.com
Instapundit (my fav): http://pajamasmedia.com/instapundit
Ace of Spades: http://ace.mu.nu

And Drudge Report is good, but highly selective IMO.

[JohnnyMack]

We saw your post yesterday.

31? He must be an idiot for making himself so young.

At what age do you become competent to advise?

My boss was a millionaire several times over before he ever turned 30.

[JohnnyMack]

All I know for sure is GM hasn't made a profit since 2005. Now, we own a controlling interest in it. Yay us!

This is what should frighten all of us. While Tuba is busy screeching like a howler monkey about things that DON'T matter, we should look at things like this and scratch our collective chins.

[OklahomaTuba]

How can he screw it up anymore than GM's execs did? The company has about zero value right now, besides it's physical assets.

Tuba, are you in politics? If not, why aren't you? This seems to be your true passion and you play the game as well as anyone.

No value???

It has a huge market share and a brand. THAT has a huge value.

I think putting someone like this in this position has the chance to really crap away what's left of the brand equity of this company.

The company should be left to the market to decide what happens, not some 31 year old government appointed hack.

[OUDoc]

GM is unprofitable because they've been so inefficient, not because the product isn't any good. With decent leaders and deep cuts, they can become profitable again.

[OklahomaTuba]

GM is unprofitable because they've been so inefficient, not because the product isn't any good. With decent leaders and deep cuts, they can become profitable again.
Exactly my point.

And given how efficient & profitable the government is, this should work out really, really well.

[TUSooner]

Honest question for those who aren't liberal but don't like Rush- what are good sources of information about what's going on? It doesn't seem like most of the media is questioning anything this administration says or does. Rush might go too far the other way, but he's one of the few people with a platform who aren't lap dogs for Obama.

I'll bite and assume somebody (like Rush) didn't just tell you that the rest of the media are Obama's lapdogs.

Have you ever really listened to NPR? Whatever biases their reporters have (and all reports have some), they are too intelligent, and too proud of it, to be anybody's lapdog. I also recommend The Economist, for which my subscription just expired. :(

[sooner_born_1960]

If nothing is done, thousands already lose their jobs, so he can't really screw it up, can he?

Is taking over as CEO of GM? I missed that part.

The results of these dealership hearing will go a long way towards indicating whether or not the govt. plans on "running" GM. Chrysler, also.

[XingTheRubicon]

4. This is the fun part: Attack the strawman with white-hot indignation.


I'm not even sure who's on point in this thread but that's top shelf right there.

[Vaevictis]

Honest question for those who aren't liberal but don't like Rush- what are good sources of information about what's going on? It doesn't seem like most of the media is questioning anything this administration says or does. Rush might go too far the other way, but he's one of the few people with a platform who aren't lap dogs for Obama.

Try reading the Wall Street Journal.

[JohnnyMack]

Try reading the Wall Street Journal.

http://www.cato.org/

[Dio]

I'll bite and assume somebody (like Rush) didn't just tell you that the rest of the media are Obama's lapdogs.

Have you ever really listened to NPR? Whatever biases their reporters have (and all reports have some), they are too intelligent, and too proud of it, to be anybody's lapdog. I also recommend The Economist, for which my subscription just expired. :(

Thanks- it really is a legit question, and I'm basing the "lapdog" stuff on the absolute gushing "the media" has done about Obama since he started running for POTUS. Look at the reruns of SNL from spring '08- they're nobody's conservatives, but week after week they had sketches about how the media was fawning over Obama (and ignoring HRC). Of course, those sketches disappeared once it got down to Obama v. McCain

[Crucifax Autumn]

The only way to get a clear picture is to watch multiple outlets with a variety of editorial stances. Get ALL the facts and stir 'em together and you end up with something approaching reality.

[TUSooner]

The only way to get a clear picture is to watch multiple outlets with a variety of editorial stances. Get ALL the facts and stir 'em together and you end up with something approaching reality.

This.^^^^^^^

[yermom]

This is what should frighten all of us. While Tuba is busy screeching like a howler monkey about things that DON'T matter, we should look at things like this and scratch our collective chins.

dude, "Asian American" is the preferred nomenclature

[JohnnyMack]

dude, "Asian American" is the preferred nomenclature

Whaa?

http://www.filmsinreview.com/archives/images/2008/04/CharlieChan_paris.jpeg

[JohnnyMack]

The only way to get a clear picture is to watch multiple outlets with a variety of editorial stances. Get ALL the facts and stir 'em together and you end up with something approaching reality.

A great way to do this:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com

[OUDoc]

I like ObaMotors better than Government Motors, FWIW.

[swardboy]

So help me understand Obama's business plan here:
*Produce cars no one wants to buy....
*Cut the advertising budget in half...preventing product knowledge of the public
*Close over 2,000 retail outlets...Mammoth loss of jobs and reduced points of sale

I'm so dumb...how does this save GM?

1. Obama is the one pushing the Fiat connection. Have you seen them?
2. http://adage.com/article?article_id=136552 Obama's task force halved the advertising budget.
3. It's a done deal...2,100 dealerships closing. The one that closed in my area was a great business...not underperforming. It will hurt it's community greatly.

My question was simply how does this all help GM?

[JohnnyMack]

Are you serious?

[JLEW1818]

1. Obama is the one pushing the Fiat connection. Have you seen them?
2. http://adage.com/article?article_id=136552 Obama's task force halved the advertising budget.
3. It's a done deal...2,100 dealerships closing. The one that closed in my area was a great business...not underperforming. It will hurt it's community greatly.

My question was simply how does this all help GM?

don't argue with liberals. You will be called racist, un-American, gay hater, pot basher, "lets keep murders alive, but kill innocent babies type guy"

opps, that slipped

[TUSooner]

don't argue with liberals. You will be called racist, un-American, gay hater, pot basher, "lets keep murders alive, but kill innocent babies type guy"

Go off track much? Sheesh. :rolleyes:

[JLEW1818]

me sorry it slipped out.....

[TUSooner]

1. Obama is the one pushing the Fiat connection. Have you seen them?
2. http://adage.com/article?article_id=136552 Obama's task force halved the advertising budget.
3. It's a done deal...2,100 dealerships closing. The one that closed in my area was a great business...not underperforming. It will hurt it's community greatly.

My question was simply how does this all help GM?

If Barack Obama had run GM into bankruptcy, you might have a point.
He didn't. You don't.

[Okla-homey]

GM is unprofitable because they've been so inefficient, not because the product isn't any good. With decent leaders and deep cuts, they can become profitable again.

There will be backlash though. Right here in T-town, a bastion of liberality in a sea of Red-statedness, I've heard more than a few state categorically they will never buy another GM or Chrysler product, precisely because of these shenanigans. I also hear things like, "it would suit me fine if GM and Chrysler were boarded-up to show other underperforming companies there is no gubmint safety-net. Sink or swim."

[olevetonahill]

We saw your post yesterday.

31? He must be an idiot for making himself so young.

At what age do you become competent to advise?

58 :D

[Condescending Sooner]

There will be backlash though. Right here in T-town, a bastion of liberality in a sea of Red-statedness, I've heard more than a few state categorically they will never buy another GM or Chrysler product, precisely because of these shenanigans. I also hear things like, "it would suit me fine if GM and Chrysler were boarded-up to show other underperforming companies there is no gubmint safety-net. Sink or swim."


Yeah, cause we know liberals hate government involvement in private enterprise.



cough - healthcare - cough.

[swardboy]

If Barack Obama had run GM into bankruptcy, you might have a point.
He didn't. You don't.

It's his baby now, and I don't follow his plan.