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the_ouskull
5/25/2009, 09:03 PM
First of all, contrary to popular belief, the Clippers ARE taking Blake Griffin, barring a trade-down scenario of some sort that involves Baron Davis' contract.

That's when it gets weird.

It's looking like a forgone conclusion that Memphis is going to take Thabeet at Number 2. That leaves us with a shot at Rubio, but, taking Rubio, a point guard, would force Westbrook to the 2, not to mention bench our best perimeter defender in Sefolosha. (Also, there's the option of Rubio coming off of the bench... something he's not coming to the U.S. to do... And, there's the, "he won't want to play for OKC" thing... Same as Blake. Yeah, I said it.)

BUT...

- Thunder trade #3 overall pick in the 2009 NBA draft to the Washington Wizards for the #5 overall pick, and JaVale McGee. We could then Harden at #5. So, we'd pick up two athletic front court players, something we're drastically lacking, and not do anything to slow the progress of our All-Rookie performer from a year before. (Say what you want, but drafting someone a year after you who plays the same position as you is NOT a vote of confidence.)

Sound okay?

Apparently it's been discussed.

-----

My thoughts...

- While I like the above trade scenario, I'd like to see us take Jordan Hill even more. If we can get a 2010 pick instead of McGee, I'd like that, because there's a chance that we could still get Hill at #5 this year, and pick up what will likely be a decent pick in a much deeper draft next year.

-----

Your thoughts?

the_ouskull

Mixer!
5/26/2009, 01:39 AM
Just spitballing here:


Clips draft Griffin, Grizz take Thabeet
Thunder draft Rubio
Clips trade Davis & Griffin to OKC for Rubio, the Thunder's other first round pick, and whatever else(future picks, expiring contracts).
Thunder trade Davis to Golden State for Ronny Turiaf (or some other team in need of a PG that can send a PF OKC's way).
Well? :pop:

the_ouskull
5/26/2009, 05:26 AM
Trading an All-Star and the number one overall pick, and the only pick in this year's draft that's widely considered a "sure thing," for an unproven point guard, and a lower pick in the weakest draft in a long time.

If anybody not named Isiah Thomas or Chris Wallace would make this trade, it's the Clippers, but I don't think even THEY are that stupid. (If OKC did make a trade to GSW, though, I'd like to see us get Randolph.)

the_ouskull

Mixer!
5/26/2009, 07:25 AM
Well, that kinda was my point - it IS the Clippers. ;)

Eielson
5/26/2009, 10:15 AM
Well, that kinda was my point - it IS the Clippers. ;)

Let's trade them Ricky Rubio for Blake Griffin.

soonerfan28
5/26/2009, 10:22 AM
Trading an All-Star and the number one overall pick, and the only pick in this year's draft that's widely considered a "sure thing," for an unproven point guard, and a lower pick in the weakest draft in a long time.

If anybody not named Isiah Thomas or Chris Wallace would make this trade, it's the Clippers, but I don't think even THEY are that stupid. (If OKC did make a trade to GSW, though, I'd like to see us get Randolph.)

the_ouskull
I think they would take both of next years 1st rounders and Rubio for Griffin. Next year will be a much deeper draft.

badger
5/26/2009, 05:24 PM
are you ever gonna stop signing your posts, skull?

the_oubadger

the_ouskull
5/26/2009, 07:53 PM
Probably not. Everybody has "a thing." I guess that that's mine, 'cause I've been doing it a lot longer than I've been being a d*ck to people. I only really started doing that about, well, I don't remember... when did people around here start getting really stupid? I mean, not just a little stupid, but like, REALLY stupid, in greater numbers than ever before? It's like William Shockley is one of the admins of the board now...

I'm going to have to keep being a d*ck until people educate themselves on the topic at hand, as well as in general, before pressing "Post Quick Reply" or whatever. And, as long as I'm being a d*ck, I guess I'll just keep signing posts. (Also, losing my old avatar didn't help matters any... whatever happened to unlimited free hosting? Geez.)

the_ouskull; just wishing that people were smarter... (You're okay, though, Badg..)

Mixer!
5/26/2009, 10:34 PM
Since the Clippers will likely be a lottery team next year as well, what if the Thunder trade them their #3 pick for the Clips' lottery slot next year?

-or-

The Thunder draft Rubio, then trade him to whoever drafts Harden for him & a future pick(s).

Eielson
5/26/2009, 11:40 PM
Probably not. Everybody has "a thing." I guess that that's mine, 'cause I've been doing it a lot longer than I've been being a d*ck to people. I only really started doing that about, well, I don't remember... when did people around here start getting really stupid? I mean, not just a little stupid, but like, REALLY stupid, in greater numbers than ever before? It's like William Shockley is one of the admins of the board now...

I'm going to have to keep being a d*ck until people educate themselves on the topic at hand, as well as in general, before pressing "Post Quick Reply" or whatever. And, as long as I'm being a d*ck, I guess I'll just keep signing posts. (Also, losing my old avatar didn't help matters any... whatever happened to unlimited free hosting? Geez.)

the_ouskull; just wishing that people were smarter... (You're okay, though, Badg..)


He didn't sign it!

Collier11
5/27/2009, 12:36 AM
BUT...

- Thunder trade #3 overall pick in the 2009 NBA draft to the Washington Wizards for the #5 overall pick, and JaVale McGee. We could then Harden at #5. So, we'd pick up two athletic front court players, something we're drastically lacking, and not do anything to slow the progress of our All-Rookie performer from a year before. (Say what you want, but drafting someone a year after you who plays the same position as you is NOT a vote of confidence.)

Sound okay?

Apparently it's been discussed.

-----

My thoughts...

- While I like the above trade scenario, I'd like to see us take Jordan Hill even more. If we can get a 2010 pick instead of McGee, I'd like that, because there's a chance that we could still get Hill at #5 this year, and pick up what will likely be a decent pick in a much deeper draft next year.

-----

Your thoughts?

the_ouskull

Westbrook was a top ten pick last year, he made the all rookie team, and actually was in the top ten of more categories than any rookie if I remember correctly. They either keep him and dont draft a pg or trade him and I dont see that.

We need two things desperately IMHO, a shooter and a banger down low that will play D and doesnt have to score more than about 10 ppg.

I hope it looks something like this, trade from #3 to the 5-10 range. Draft Harden, Ellington, or Curry. If we dont take a shooter then take Jordan Hill or use the later pick on Taj Gibson perhaps.

If we do take a shooter then I hope we go after a banger in Free Agency as I explained earlier.

If by chance we did trade Westbrook I wouldnt mind using the higher pick on Harden and a lower one on Maynor, I think that kid will be a stud

Past that I really havent looked into free agency too much or draft pick scenarios if trades occured so those are the players I would like to see

badger
5/27/2009, 07:57 AM
I'm going to have to keep being a d*ck until people educate themselves on the topic at hand, as well as in general, before pressing "Post Quick Reply" or whatever.

F***, man, how do ya think I got so many posts?

(come to think of it, I've heard people complain that my posts are lengthy and boring)

Annnndddd.... QUICK REPLY! :D

starclassic tama
5/27/2009, 04:26 PM
i think we will probably end up involved in a trade of some sort, but it WILL NOT be for blake griffin. something like the scenario ou_skull laid out involving the wizards makes sense. i just don't see us taking rubio, but i could be wrong. i just don't understand how people don't think westbrook will be a true point. he had several 10+ assist games this year, that is difficult to do if you don't have some point guard skills.

the_ouskull
5/28/2009, 01:43 PM
Not if you're athletic and your shooters are hot. It's not fun to guard sick, unselfish athletes. But, yeah, I think that he can develop into a quality NBA point guard. Ball handling and defense are what we need from him. He'll develop into a shooter eventually.

Badg, you are lucky Colbert's Threat Down is on and that I don't have time to respond. :D

the_ouskull

Post Script -- Eielson, I signed the post to which you are referring. You really DON'T read the posts that the grown-ups write, do you?

Ton Loc
5/28/2009, 04:01 PM
I have one opinion on the draft that's only worthy of the quick reply. Don't draft Harden. That guy was super inconsistent throughout the regular season and basically failed in the NCAA tournament.

I don't see him turning that around in the NBA.

Eielson
5/28/2009, 04:24 PM
Post Script -- Eielson, I signed the post to which you are referring. You really DON'T read the posts that the grown-ups write, do you?

Yeah, I didn't see it because I'm used to it being completely seperate at the bottom. I guess you win, but please stop making it sound like I'm a little kid and your a big grown-up. I find it a little creepy.

theresonly1OU
5/30/2009, 02:29 PM
Yeah, I didn't see it because I'm used to it being completely seperate at the bottom. I guess you win, but please stop making it sound like I'm a little kid and your a big grown-up. I find it a little creepy.

Exactly what do you expect from a guy who made a sig out of other people's quotes about him? :D

As for the question at hand; I REALLY hope we steer clear of taking Davis or Randolph from the Clips for Griffin; as much as I would like to see him in a Thunder jersey, it isn't worth the headache that taking a contract like that would be worth.

If it were me in command of the ship, I would make it clear to everyone that we are taking Rubio, and that we are looking at any and all trade offers. This way we can shop him for the best possible trade, instead of settling for one from another lottery team.

the_ouskull
6/1/2009, 07:18 PM
That strategy works a H*ll of a lot better when you have the number one overall pick. Anything else, and you're taking who you have fall to you. If Thabeet's available, there's a pretty good chance we'll take him. If he's not, then maybe we take Rubio, maybe we don't. The trick is to have a contingency for every possible situation, and trades worked out with a handful of different teams, and then, when the clock's ticking, lean on them hard.

"Well, we've got two minutes to make a decision, which gives you 30 seconds. GO!"

If a team wants Rubio bad enough, they'll have done the same and they'll pull the trigger. If not, they were working us in the first place. The thing is, Presti's a good GM, and, so far, I trust him implicitly. I want to see how he's going to handle our cap situation and handle bringing in free agents to a small, (so far) unproven market like OKC before I give him a grade or anything, but so far, it's nice.

the_ouskull

the_ouskull
6/1/2009, 07:18 PM
Yeah, I didn't see it because I'm used to it being completely seperate at the bottom. I guess you win, but please stop making it sound like I'm a little kid and your a big grown-up. I find it a little creepy.

Whose abiggrown-up? It's not mine.

the_ouskull

starclassic tama
6/2/2009, 11:05 PM
what do you think about tyreke evans? seems like nobody is talking about him, and he could be the most talented player in this draft not named blake griffin. i don't know a lot about his game, other than he had a good freshman year.

Collier11
6/4/2009, 01:23 AM
Isnt he a SG who isnt a great outside shooter? We dont need that, I dont think we would have a position for him, isnt he only 6'6"

the_ouskull
6/4/2009, 04:16 PM
what do you think about tyreke evans? seems like nobody is talking about him, and he could be the most talented player in this draft not named blake griffin. i don't know a lot about his game, other than he had a good freshman year.

Were you (tears up a lil') asking ME? Well, it's about time someone took advantage of the wealth of knowledge of which I am capable of droppin' on yo' *sses. Removes tongue from cheek before biting it.

-----

Tyreke Evans: Upon first glance, I say to myself, "Really? With the name? It's like people aren't even trying anymore." Then I prepare to answer basketball-related queries... At the end of each section, I'll compare them to someone that we may be considering in our slot... but most often just someone that I'M fond of...

- Athletically, he's a pretty good player, but it's his physical traits that make him seem even more athletic, etc... than he actually is. He's got an NBA-ready body right now, weighing 220 pounds. But, he's listed at 6'4" in socks, which is big for a point guard, but low/mid average for a two. BUT, he's got a wingspan (fingertip to fingertip) of 6'11". This alone makes him worth a middle first-round pick to any defense-minded coach. Couple that with a standing reach of 8'8", and and his strength to the mix...? Yeah, he's a physical project that would get drafted solely on the basis of that, even if he hadn't already been playing the game for years. ( > Thabeet) ( = Blair)

- He's no Durant, but when he gets the ball in his hands, he's looking to score. Make no bones about it. This kid wants to put the ball in the basket. The only problem is, he's got to be close to the basket to do it effectively. He shot 45% from the field, and an abysmal 27% from the arc, which would be so bad, but he averaged 3.4 attempts per game. Think of every time that we were like, "Noooooo sh*******ttt," when Austin Johnson would shoot a three. That's what Memphis fans did more than three times a game, solely because of Evans. ( < Rubio) (At least Rubio has the sense to stop shooting...) ( < Curry) (He should never stop shooting...)

CASE IN POINT: In Memphis' four losses this season, he shot: 4-16, 8-24, 2-9, and 12-25. (The latter a really good game for him, but I'm including it to be fair...) This comes to 35% from the field in their losses. A full 10% worse in games that his team lost. (He also averaged more than four turnovers per game in those losses, but this part is about his shooting... I'll move on.)

- Because of his size, and his wingspan, he's going to either become a top-shelf perimeter defender in the NBA, or he'll be shown the door shortly after the expiration of his rookie contract, barring a trade, another "I can save this kid," coaching project, etc... (Hey, George Karl did it for J.R. Smith... and Nene... and Chris Andersen...)

BUT, if he's not playing defense; I mean, that REALLY playing defense, your body will ache if you don't defend your man harder kinda defense that only John Ontjes used to play. (R.I.P. - "The White Glove") (And no, he's not dead that I'm aware of... I just retired my nickname for him... keep up.)

...by the time he's done with training camp, then teams are going to bury him, because nobody wants an undersized 2 with average athleticism that dribbles too much, can't shoot, and plays lackluster defense as a consistent part of their rotation outside of the preseason. ( < Gerald Henderson)

- I think that #3 is much too high for ANY team to take him, much less us. We'd be drafting him to be a backup, and if we're drafting someone to ride the pine, why not someone who will move tickets and jerseys. ( <<< Rubio)

-----

I'd be very, very disappointed to see us take him unless he's already made huge, huge strides in his game management, shot selection, and ball handling/passing since the end of the season. I doubt that he has.

the_ouskull

Collier11
6/9/2009, 11:40 AM
In a rare, yet intelligent decision by an underclassman, Scottie Reynolds is going back for his senior season

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2009/news/story?id=4245421

starclassic tama
6/9/2009, 04:31 PM
anybody here anything on rubio at the pre-draft combine? was he there? what did he measure in at etc...

All_Day_28
6/9/2009, 11:20 PM
He wasn't there.. He supposed to be flying to the U.S. sometime soon to workout for the Clippers, Thunder, and Kings.

Collier11
6/9/2009, 11:22 PM
why would he work out for us, I thought he refused to play for us?

starclassic tama
6/9/2009, 11:31 PM
that's not true. his agent said he would have no problems playing for oklahoma city.

Mixer!
6/10/2009, 12:49 AM
http://newsok.com/what-impact-would-potential-nba-draft-picks-have-on-the-thunder/article/3375959?custom_click=lead_story_title


JAMES HARDEN

School: Arizona State.

Position: Shooting guard.

Height: 6-5.

Weight: 222.

2008-09 averages: 20.1 ppg, 5.6 ppg, 4.2 apg, 1.7 spg, 3.4 tpg.

Strengths: Savvy offensive player. 3-point shooting. Versatile. Unselfish. Good passer. Solid rebounder. Knows how to score. Efficient. Gets to the free throw line. Finishes at the rim. Creates his own shot. Sets up teammates.

Weaknesses: Average athleticism. High turnovers. Passive at times.

How he'd fit: Harden has the potential to compete for the starting shooting guard spot from Day 1 because of his instincts for the game and ability to score. He is almost the exact opposite of current starter Thabo Sefolosha, whose impact begins on the defensive end and is a work-in-progress offensively. There are questions about whether Harden will be able to defend in the NBA. It remains to be seen if those questions have any merit, but we do know Harden would be protected on the wing with the Thunder thanks to willing defenders Sefolosha, Jeff Green and Russell Westbrook.

Stock report: Up. He might no longer be the consensus third best prospect he once was, but he's so sure he'll go in the top five that he won't work out for any team drafting after the fifth selection.

Chances he joins Thunder: 70 percent.

+/- Wins/losses: 4-5 wins.

BLAKE GRIFFIN

School: Oklahoma.

Position: Power forward.

Height: 6-10

Weight: 248.

2008-09 averages: 22.7 ppg, 14.4 rpg, 2.3 apg, 1.2 bpg, 1.1 spg.

Strengths: Strong. Amazing athlete. Good size. Tough. Hard worker. Exceptional rebounder. Efficient offensively. Great finisher at the rim. Good passer and ball-handler. Good footwork. Unselfish. Plays with passion.

Weaknesses: Outside shooting. Poor free-throw shooter. Average defensively. Average post-up moves.

How he'd fit: The Thunder needs Griffin's interior skills perhaps more than any other lottery team. Nenad Krstic is a pick-and-pop shooter and below average rebounder, Nick Collison is primarily a rebounder and Malik Rose and Robert Swift could be on their way out of town. Griffin wouldn't step in and be a lock down post defender, but his knack for rebounding and scoring in the post would take loads of pressure off Kevin Durant, Jeff Green and Russell Westbrook. The biggest question is what will Griffin's addition mean for incumbent starter Jeff Green? Does Durant move back to shooting guard and Green move to small forward? Does Green move to the bench? Either way, it sounds like one of those good "problems."

Stock report: Up. It's good to be Blake Griffin.

Chances he joins Thunder: 0.1 percent.

+/- Wins/losses: 6-8 wins.

Collier11
6/10/2009, 08:50 AM
NO way that Harden is worth 4-5 wins

All_Day_28
6/12/2009, 04:39 PM
why would he work out for us, I thought he refused to play for us?

Apparently the only team he doesn't want to play for is Memphis because of how his Spanish teammate Pau Gasol was treated by the organization.

Hella Sideburns
6/12/2009, 05:34 PM
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a47/madhops_42/webelieve.jpg

boomersooner28
6/13/2009, 10:16 AM
The more and more I think about this draft, the more and more I hope we trade out of the 3 spot. I don't think there is 1 player above the rest when it comes down to picks 2-8. Depends on need, and we need a lot. Trade down, get extra pick either this year or next.

Collier11
6/13/2009, 01:22 PM
There is no player worth #3 outside of Blake or Rubio IMO, trade down to 7-12 range please

starclassic tama
6/13/2009, 01:38 PM
i'm a fan of taking the best player available in any sport and making it work. what if we drafted harden and he busts while rubio turns out to be a mix between steve nash and manu ginobili?

Eielson
6/18/2009, 08:34 PM
NO way that Harden is worth 4-5 wins

That isn't really saying that much for the Thunder.

Soonerus
6/21/2009, 07:15 PM
I have no idea who the Thunder will take...

soonerfan28
6/22/2009, 10:17 AM
Rubio can distribute, but can he shoot? If he's just a passer didn't we get that last year in Westbrook. I think we need to try and trade the pick for some proven low post help off of somebody's current roster.

SanJoaquinSooner
6/23/2009, 11:34 AM
I live in Kings country. Rubio worked out for the Kings yesterday -- I believe the only team for which he's done that.

The sports radio talk shows, with their sources, are saying that Rubio has underwhelmed the Kings while Tyreke Evans has the Kings doing backflips. Evans outshone everyone who came in to work out.

The Kings are soft in the backcourt and Evans appears to be physical, play defense, and can drive to the basket.


There was a lot of talk before of trying to move up to grab Rubio, but no more. They - rumor has it - prefer Evans.

But Rubio would sell tickets, no doubt.

SanJoaquinSooner
6/23/2009, 04:23 PM
Kings finally get to see Rubio play

By Sam Amick
samick@sacbee.com
Published: Tuesday, Jun. 23, 2009 - 12:00 am | Page 1C
Last Modified: Tuesday, Jun. 23, 2009 - 12:15 am

http://media.sacbee.com/smedia/2009/06/22/22/782-2S23RUBIOOLINE22.embedded.prod_affiliate.4.JPG

Ricky Rubio's second Sacramento visit was much like his first, a covert operation that was seen as mysterious and methodical by some, maddening and manipulative by others.

But there was one significant difference this time around: he worked out.

With just three days remaining until the NBA draft, and the Kings' desire to have more questions about the 18-year-old Spanish point guard answered, he stepped on the floor at the Kings' practice facility and picked up a basketball for the first time since his Euroleague season ended nearly a month before.

It was silly and significant all at once, as Rubio had not worked out for any other team and clearly would not have done so in Sacramento if there wasn't more convincing to do. But with Kings basketball president Geoff Petrie having made it clear he wanted to do more than have dinner with Rubio before deciding where to put him on his list of favorites, the talking stopped and the playing began.

Rubio, who had planned on working out for the Kings last week before he became sick on the trip, took part in an individual workout that included Petrie and coach Paul Westphal and lasted approximately an hour. While the session remained secret at the request of his representatives, he told The Bee it was a necessary exercise that hardly showcased his game.

"It's difficult to show them what I have to do on the court, because there are no teammates and nobody there," Rubio said at the Sacramento airport just before leaving town. "I can't show them what I do on the court. This workout is not my style. I need my teammates around me to play basketball. I was alone."

Rubio, who visited with Oklahoma City (which has the No. 3 pick) in Los Angeles on Saturday, and previously visited with Memphis (No. 2 pick) in Spain, said he was attempting to please the Kings by getting on the floor.

"When I came here, I was sick, so I had to come back to L.A. and then they wanted to watch me on the court, so I come back here to (do) some workouts with them and talk with them again," Rubio said. "But I had like a month with nothing (no playing) on the court, but I'm feeling good. I worked out with the coach in the workout. It was good."

How Rubio's session will impact the Kings' decision, however, remains to be seen. Just one day before, point guards Tyreke Evans (Memphis), Stephen Curry (Davidson) and Jonny Flynn (Syracuse) were the headliners in a mega workout in which they competed for the right to be picked fourth. Evans is believed to have left the best impression, showcasing his length and strength while getting to the rim as he pleased.

The scene was much different a day later, with his one-man workout unannounced and the curtain inside the facility closed. The approach to winning the Kings' favor is clearly different with Rubio, whose four pro seasons in Europe made him a known commodity overseas, and whose Olympic showing with the Spanish team last summer turned so many American heads.

There also remains the matter of his contract with DKV Joventut. A source close to Rubio said the $6.6 million buyout Rubio would have to pay (NBA teams can contribute $500,000) is expected to be reduced to a manageable amount and will not be an obstacle for teams looking to draft him.

The Kings, who worked out Pittsburgh swingman Sam Young on Monday as well, are believed to be deliberating Evans, Rubio, Flynn and Curry for their top pick. If Connecticut center Hasheem Thabeet is there at No. 4, he would receive consideration as well.

Collier11
6/25/2009, 03:21 PM
More and more rumors surfacing that the Thunder will take Rubio...if this is the case and knowing already that Westbrook isnt very open to playing the 2, do the Thunder look to trade him or will he eventually "get over it" for a lack of better words

Sooner13
6/25/2009, 04:17 PM
More and more rumors surfacing that the Thunder will take Rubio...if this is the case and knowing already that Westbrook isnt very open to playing the 2, do the Thunder look to trade him or will he eventually "get over it" for a lack of better words

I think if we take Rubio, it will be Rubio we are looking to trade....

Collier11
6/25/2009, 05:12 PM
hmmm...