Your thoughts on the Birmingham cops

[Osce0la]

5 Birmingham Cops fired (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fc57ZJ8nVpg) after beating an unconscious man at the end of a chase. The man led them on a 22 minute chase before running over the leg of a Hoover cop while trying to dodge a spike strip, and then flipping his van on the access ramp for the interstate. He was thrown out of the van and then the cops beat the hell out of him before realizing he had lost consciousness when being thrown from the van. Crazy video.

[picasso]

Happens a lot. That's why you don't run from cops.

[BornandBred]

Don't run from the PoPo. Easy as that. However, I think firing these guys is about the only way the police department could move forward. I wouldn't be surprised to see criminal charges filed.

[Veritas]

I think someone needs to develop a psych test that would eliminate all of the needle-dick power-hungry asswipes from being hired.

I know...20 cops or so. I know two (2) that would pass the test.

[OUDoc]

Good for the cops, they should be promoted. It's not their fault the guy can't handle being thrown from a van. Maybe he won't run next time. He deserved any beating he got.

[yermom]

meh. compare that to the beating Rodney King got. it was only a few seconds.

Rodney King didn't even injure anyone, AFAIK

i don't really blame the cops on this one. i think they made it into something racial, but that seems silly. i can see them getting suspended, but not really fired

[Veritas]

meh. compare that to the beating Rodney King got. it was only a few seconds.

Rodney King didn't even injure anyone, AFAIK

i don't really blame the cops on this one. i think they made it into something racial, but that seems silly. i can see them getting suspended, but not really fired
Are you ****ing kidding me? You're righteously indignant over waterboarding some turban cowboys intent on killing as many Americans as possible, but you're cool with the cops pounding on a guy who just got tossed from a moving vehicle and is *obviously* down for the count?

[yermom]

first off, dude's guilty. no question.

they didn't kill him, just hurt him. in the middle of all that, they may or may not have known he was unconscious, and once one guy was in the middle of him they probably thought he was resisting or something. at the end of a chase, emotions and adrenaline are high.

there is a lot of difference between that and state sponsored torture and murder

[picasso]

Agreed that some cops are power hungry. My cousin has been one in Tulsa for years and I've ridden patrol with him. We think they act like jerks when they stop us but they have no idea who we are or what we're up to. Not a safe job.

Rodney King, I still think he would have gotten a beatdown regardless of color. 6'7" and resisting arrest is no way to go through life.

And you watch COPS and see these fools fight back or run and they get smoked and then claim they dinnnnt do anything! horseshat. Don't run and don't fight. You'll get clobbered eventually.

[sooner_born_1960]

I, on the other hand, don't have a real problem with splashing a little water in terrorists faces. The cops, however crossed the line.

[yermom]

I, on the other hand, don't have a real problem with splashing a little water in terrorists faces.

:rolleyes:

[TAFBSooner]

I think someone needs to develop a psych test that would eliminate all of the needle-dick power-hungry asswipes from being hired.

I know...20 cops or so. I know two (2) that would pass the test.


But then we wouldn't have many cops. And we need cops.

The moral, as already well stated, is don't run from the cops.

[OUDoc]

But then we wouldn't have many cops. And we need cops.

The moral, as already well stated, is don't run from the cops.

And I doubt he would have been beaten at all had he not tried to hit the cop with his van. Cops take assault on their friends/colleagues very seriously.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I, on the other hand, don't have a real problem with splashing a little water in terrorists faces. The cops, however crossed the line.

I wished we would splash a little more than water on the terrorists faces...

The cops, don't know, but a Black officer supposedly was part of the beat down. Like most people say, don't run from the popo (and at a 100 mph to boot) and you won't be getting into trouble...

[walkoffsooner]

epinephrine), bad ***

[JohnnyMack]

1. Don't break the law.
2. Don't run from the police.
3. Don't try and run over the police.

Seems rather apparent that these officers were quite emotional in this pursuit and didn't show the restraint they should have. I think after seeing their comrade get swiped by this turd that they acted mildly inappropriately, but sometimes **** happens. Again, don't start nothin', won't be nothin'.

[XingTheRubicon]

It's probably a good idea not to run over a policeman in front of 30 other policemen. It's also immeasurably important to avoid running over a policeman in front of 30 other policemen in a state where the police sirens play dixie.

[soonerfan28]

1.Don't break the law
Isn't that exactly what these cops did.
Cops are taught to use restraint. I give them a lot of repsect for what they go through but this was ridiculous. These cops broke the law and charges should be filed.

[OUDoc]

Isn't that exactly what these cops did.
Cops are taught to use restraint. I give them a lot of repsect for what they go through but this was ridiculous. These cops broke the law and charges should be filed.
What law did they break?

[Pricetag]

Was the driver charged with attempted murder? He should have been.

But he was ejected from the vehicle. He was lying face down and motionless. I'd have thought he was dead if I didn't know there was more to it.

These guys do not get to take revenge for what happened during the chase. It blows my mind that so many are behind them for this.

[King Crimson]

know your rights. but running from the popo is always a bad idea.

[badger]

I have a tremendous amount of sympathy for police who just have bad days like this... I imagine they get whined at like they're NBA refs dealing with multi-million dollar athletes all day about stupid tickets, get judged on a daily basis based on the actions of other police from other cities, counties, states, etc., and then someone runs over one of their fellow officers' legs?!

I do not think they should have beat up the person they chased, but I do think they should have chased him and apprehended him before he hurt someone else.

[yermom]

Was the driver charged with attempted murder? He should have been.

But he was ejected from the vehicle. He was lying face down and motionless. I'd have thought he was dead if I didn't know there was more to it.

These guys do not get to take revenge for what happened during the chase. It blows my mind that so many are behind them for this.

i wouldn't say i'm behind them. i can see them getting punished, and reassigned, but not necessarily fired unless there was more to it than that.

[soonervegas]

I counted the abuse at probably 6 seconds. Five seconds after the person was ejected from the vehicle. There was no way they could know real time that just because he was ejected he was no longer a threat. If you factor in the fact that he almost ran over a cop......I don't think it was outside the lines. (and I generally hate cops)

There are much, much better examples of cop abuse than this. If the guys got fired that was too much.

[sooner ngintunr]

**** those cops.

[Ardmore_Sooner]

**** those cops.

**** you. ;)

[Pricetag]

You guys know that you can judge the actions of the officers without having sympathy for the runner, right? I think a lot of folks are thinking you have to side with either one or the other.

Again, the runner was lying face down, and didn't move a muscle after being thrown from the van. It wasn't like there was just one officer on the scene--there were several. There's no way the runner was a threat, period. Furthermore, he could easily have suffered some kind of spinal cord injury in the accident, and the blows he received from the police could have killed or paralyzed him.

The authorities must be as kind as possible and, most importantly, just so that people who aren't criminals will trust them. I'll throw out the kindness part--there's no way what happened there was just.

[OhU1]

Revive him - then beat the hell out of him. Beating an unconscious person is kind of useless. You can't execute an insane person for example, the inmate must be mentally competent first. So the State "cures" said inmate up to the point that he can appreciate the fact that he is to be executed. :texan:

[sooner ngintunr]

**** you. ;)

My wife wouldn't like that much.

[badger]

In a nutshell, both the eluder and the cops were at fault. The eluder ran over an officer and tried to flee the scene, while the cops were at fault for beating the eluder once they caught up to him.

Cops are just held to a higher standard than Average Joe Eluder, though.

[sooner_born_1960]

I think it is yet to be seen if the police are going to be held to even the same standard.

[NYC Poke]

Good for the cops, they should be promoted. It's not their fault the guy can't handle being thrown from a van. Maybe he won't run next time. He deserved any beating he got.


Deserved? Perhaps. That does not mean it should be condoned.

[OUDoc]

Deserved? Perhaps. That does not mean it should be condoned.

I'm tired of pieces of **** making my world worse. That cop who was hit could have been my brother. The POS could have hit and killed my wife and children. He's a piece of **** for running, whatever the reason, and he endangered other people. I don't care that he got hurt. The cops were a little amped-up and hit him a few times. He was unconscious and didn't feel it anyway. They stopped fairly quickly. It wasn't "excessive", it just wasn't smart of them.
I'm tired of worrying about the rights of the criminals in this world. **** 'em. They thumb their noses at my rules, so why should I concern myself with their well-being?

[NYC Poke]

I'm tired of pieces of **** making my world worse. That cop who was hit could have been my brother. The POS could have hit and killed my wife and children. He's a piece of **** for running, whatever the reason, and he endangered other people. I don't care that he got hurt. The cops were a little amped-up and hit him a few times. He was unconscious and didn't feel it anyway. They stopped fairly quickly. It wasn't "excessive", it just wasn't smart of them.
I'm tired of worrying about the rights of the criminals in this world. **** 'em. They thumb their noses at my rules, so why should I concern myself with their well-being?

I agree that he's a POS who deserves to have the book thrown (figuratively) at him. But c'mon. He was thrown from his car and unconcious. So they were amped up? So what? They're supposed to be professionals. It's our ability to keep our emotions in check that separates us from the criminals.

I'll leave alone for now how it's worse simply because it's Birmingham and the tensions that will likely ensue as a result.

BTW, I don't really think what they did was criminal, just phenomenally stupid.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I agree that he's a POS who deserves to have the book thrown (figuratively) at him. But c'mon. He was thrown from his car and unconcious. .


So what! The dumbshi'ite POS should have been wearing a seatbelt. I bet that will be added to the charges.

You know, sometimes our "enlightened" view of violence reduces consequences for criminals. Consequences tend to prevent unwanted behavior. Back in the day, you could get sentenced to the Army where they would make you learn respect real quick. Sometimes a 2x4 instead of persuasion has to be used. Tell that to the OKC pharmacist that thankfully had a CCL.

[KABOOKIE]

first off, dude's guilty. no question.

they didn't kill him, just hurt him. in the middle of all that, they may or may not have known he was unconscious, and once one guy was in the middle of him they probably thought he was resisting or something. at the end of a chase, emotions and adrenaline are high.

there is a lot of difference between that and state sponsored torture and murder

First off, all those alijihad’s in Guantanamo are guilty. No question.

They didn’t get kill anyone, just poured some water on their face. In the middle of all the water pouring one of them may have had a precondition that led to a heart attack. They probably thought there was another attack coming to the US. During war time, tough combatants need to be met with tough actions.

Yep….. Big difference….. :rolleyes:

[Curly Bill]

Shoulda just shot the dude.

[KABOOKIE]

Oh and uh…..

1. Don’t attack the US.
2. Don’t run from the US Military
3. Don’t try to kill the US Military.

After seeing the country attacked **** happens. Again, don't start nothin', won't be nothin'.

[NYC Poke]

So what! The dumbshi'ite POS should have been wearing a seatbelt. I bet that will be added to the charges.

Heh. Prolly.

[Pricetag]

You know, sometimes our "enlightened" view of violence reduces consequences for criminals. Consequences tend to prevent unwanted behavior.
He was sent to prison. If you want to argue that prisons are not harsh enough, feel free, but it doesn't belong in this thread. It is not the job of the police to punish offenders--that is the job of the courts.

[47straight]

I agree it would be very hard to restrain yourself from beating a guy that tried to run over another cop. That's why much effort has to be made to ensure that cops are selected, trained and paid to be professionals to put that aside and do your job the right way, even if you're really amped up.

[OUDoc]

Should they have hit him at all? No.
As I see it, they hit him for 6-8 seconds.
Is that excessive? Maybe, but probably not.
Do I care? No.

[JLEW1818]

I don't give a **** how bad this dude got the **** kicked outta him... Let's say this dude is running from the cops... and the cops get in a wreck and die??? Doing there job.. then what?

This should be a lesson to all future criminals.. but there are so many dumb worthless ****s in this country.

[yermom]

First off, all those alijihad’s in Guantanamo are guilty. No question.

They didn’t get kill anyone, just poured some water on their face. In the middle of all the water pouring one of them may have had a precondition that led to a heart attack. They probably thought there was another attack coming to the US. During war time, tough combatants need to be met with tough actions.

Yep….. Big difference….. :rolleyes:

they did more than pour water on people's faces, and they killed multiple people. they also tortured people that were later charged with nothing and released. not everyone in Guantanamo or other places are guilty, but without a trial or any evidence, there isn't much to prove anything.

the big difference here is that these cops were in the heat of the moment. this isn't something the mayor, then the chief told them to do as part of a policy on how to deal with assailants.

[JohnnyMack]

in the heat of the moment.

GBnyvF8j6bQ

[JLEW1818]

GBnyvF8j6bQ

hahaha.

how many damn episodes do they have now?

[tidalmouse]

The Cops definately went way overboard with the Beating they put on the Guy.It looked like everyone wanted a shot at him.What alot of Folks down here are saying is that the Chief of Police and the Mayor of Birmingham,who is under Federal Indictment for some type of misaproprition of Funds,threw those Cops under the Bus real quick to save their own a$$es.I think they kept a lid on the ordeal until the "Victim" hired a Lawyer.

I'm definately not defending the Cops.They Beat the Crap out of an unconscious Man.

[AlbqSooner]

What law did they break?

The law that is found in the Fourth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. You have the right to be free from unlawful search and seizure even if you did something really stupid like battering a police officer with your car. The seizure of his person by these cops was unreasonable. Put a pair of cuffs on him and take him before the Courts. Even if he is found guilty and sentenced to the maximum punishment allowed by the law for battery on a law enforcement officer that does not include a beating. Not even one punch!

These guys got fired but they and the county (or city) will almost assuredly be sued under 42 U.S.C.A. Section 1983. They and the county have little defense. They deprived a citizen of his constitutional rights while acting under color of state law.

Yeah the guy was stupid as hell to run and yeah he was stupid as hell to hit a cop with his car. The law requires that he be dealt with according to the punishment set out in the statutes forbidding that type of behavior. The law also requires that the cops who deprived him of his rights guaranteed by the Constitution be punished accordingly.

Having done a fair amount of Section 1983 cases I can almost assure you that the cops involved were not breaking their cherries on this beat down. If they got fired it was likely because it was a repeat of past performances on their parts.

[GottaHavePride]

Albq, I understand that, but in context of the Constitution I think "unlawful search and seizure" refers to something like probable cause for a search/seizure to take place at all, not directly referencing the method OF the search/seizure...

And really, if the cops only beat this guy for 5 / 6 seconds, they got carried away. Reprimand them, yes. Fire them? No.

It's easy to Monday-morning-quarterback a situation and say he was "obviously" no threat. On the scene though, you've got an abrupt end to a high-speed chase, an injured officer, one fleeing perp has exited his vehicle and you don't know if he's armed, on drugs, if there are more in the van, etc. etc. You don't have time to stop and say "wait, wait, let's check to see if he's unconscious" - you jump on him and subdue him as fast as possible.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

If we turn our heads from this type of law enforcement behavior, then it won't be just criminals who are beaten, but suspects - some of whom will be innocent suspects.

The courts have the job of punishing criminals, not the cops.

[Curly Bill]

If we start shooting idjits like this instead of beating on them for 5 or 6 seconds, I'm guessing we'd have less idjits like this running from the cops and endangering everyone else.

[Curly Bill]

...you'd certainly guarantee that the particular idjit being dealt with doesn't run again. :D

[TAFBSooner]

Way back when we used to pride ourselves on being a country under the rule of law instead of the rule of men.

Based on this thread I'd better get over it. :(

[Curly Bill]

...or you could just cry a big ol' river.

[GottaHavePride]

Watched the video...

and the guy's lucky that's all he got from the cops. They punched him five or six times. Not in sensitive, particularly damaging areas. They didn't kick him, they didn't use nightsticks, ASPs, pepper spray, tasers, etc. etc. etc. They didn't run his *** over in retaliation.

Again, they just watched one of their fellow officers get run down by this guy and got caught up in the moment. Reprimanded? Yes. Possibly suspended and have a strike placed on their record? Yes. Fired? Ridiculous to me.

[Curly Bill]

...but...but...but...the poor piece of **** and his civil rights. :rolleyes:

[Frozen Sooner]

I agree it would be very hard to restrain yourself from beating a guy that tried to run over another cop. That's why much effort has to be made to ensure that cops are selected, trained and paid to be professionals to put that aside and do your job the right way, even if you're really amped up.


The law that is found in the Fourth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. You have the right to be free from unlawful search and seizure even if you did something really stupid like battering a police officer with your car. The seizure of his person by these cops was unreasonable. Put a pair of cuffs on him and take him before the Courts. Even if he is found guilty and sentenced to the maximum punishment allowed by the law for battery on a law enforcement officer that does not include a beating. Not even one punch!

These guys got fired but they and the county (or city) will almost assuredly be sued under 42 U.S.C.A. Section 1983. They and the county have little defense. They deprived a citizen of his constitutional rights while acting under color of state law.

Yeah the guy was stupid as hell to run and yeah he was stupid as hell to hit a cop with his car. The law requires that he be dealt with according to the punishment set out in the statutes forbidding that type of behavior. The law also requires that the cops who deprived him of his rights guaranteed by the Constitution be punished accordingly.

Having done a fair amount of Section 1983 cases I can almost assure you that the cops involved were not breaking their cherries on this beat down. If they got fired it was likely because it was a repeat of past performances on their parts.

Nods.

[Pricetag]

Watched the video...

and the guy's lucky that's all he got from the cops. They punched him five or six times. Not in sensitive, particularly damaging areas. They didn't kick him, they didn't use nightsticks, ASPs, pepper spray, tasers, etc. etc. etc. They didn't run his *** over in retaliation.
Like hell they didn't. The first guy who hit him was using a baton of some sort. And he used all the momentum of the jump across the ditch, as well.

Either the beating was justified, or it wasn't. I don't think an argument can be made that the officers beat him with restraint. And once again, they don't have the right to do anything in retaliation.

[yermom]

i never said what they did was legal, just that i didn't think it was black and white, career ending wrong

[Osce0la]

The Cops definately went way overboard with the Beating they put on the Guy.It looked like everyone wanted a shot at him.What alot of Folks down here are saying is that the Chief of Police and the Mayor of Birmingham,who is under Federal Indictment for some type of misaproprition of Funds,threw those Cops under the Bus real quick to save their own a$$es.I think they kept a lid on the ordeal until the "Victim" hired a Lawyer.

I'm definately not defending the Cops.They Beat the Crap out of an unconscious Man.

Larry Langford is worthless anyway...I can not stand that man and am so very thankful I do not live in the city of Birmingham.

[Osce0la]

Will this be my first ever locked thread? :fingers crossed: :D

[SoonerKnight]

The law that is found in the Fourth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. You have the right to be free from unlawful search and seizure even if you did something really stupid like battering a police officer with your car.

It is not considered battery it is assault with a deadly weapon and attempted murder charges would apply!


These guys got fired but they and the county (or city) will almost assuredly be sued under 42 U.S.C.A. Section 1983. They and the county have little defense. They deprived a citizen of his constitutional rights while acting under color of state law.


The guy tried to kill an officer! Emotions can get the best of you even if your a cop they are human!



Having done a fair amount of Section 1983 cases I can almost assure you that the cops involved were not breaking their cherries on this beat down. If they got fired it was likely because it was a repeat of past performances on their parts

That is pure sepculation with little truth to it. Politics is playing a role in this!

[StoopTroup]

They should be fired.

They screwed up.

Game Over.

[TAFBSooner]

. . . (good legal analysis by 47straight and Albq) . . .


Nods.

. . . but . . . but . . . that's not nearly as much fun as calling the
perp-then-vic a POS.

[OUDoc]

Why have we become a society of firing everyone who makes a mistake?
we all make mistakes. We should all get fired when that happens?

[Frozen Sooner]

It is not considered battery it is assault with a deadly weapon and attempted murder charges would apply!




The guy tried to kill an officer! Emotions can get the best of you even if your a cop they are human!




That is pure sepculation with little truth to it. Politics is playing a role in this!

Respectfully, you don't have any idea what you're talking about. Step one: look up definition of battery.

[olevetonahill]

Respectfully, you don't have any idea what you're talking about. Step one: look up definition of battery.

Uh Respectfully , I think Soonerknight Does Know what hes talking about
He a Deputy sheriff
jes sayin

[Frozen Sooner]

Uh Respectfully , I think Soonerknight Does Know what hes talking about
He a Deputy sheriff
jes sayin

Well, then he should know that intentionally striking someone with a car is indeed battery. Assault is the threat of physical force against another person. Battery is the willful and unlawful touching of another.

[Curly Bill]

Why have we become a society of wimpified handwringers who want to fire everyone who makes a mistake?
we all make mistakes. We should all get fired when that happens?

FIXED

[Frozen Sooner]

Why do I have a mental image of Doc beating the hell out of a non-compliant patient?

[SoonerKnight]

Well, then he should know that intentionally striking someone with a car is indeed battery. Assault is the threat of physical force against another person. Battery is the willful and unlawful touching of another.

Okay well hmmm...maybe I over simplified it for you. I was talk in generalities and yes I know what battery is and I know what aggrevated assault is!

An aggravated assault, punishable in all states as a felony, is committed when a defendant intends to do more than merely frighten the victim. Common types of aggravated assaults are those accompanied by an intent to kill, rob, or rape. An assault with a dangerous weapon is aggravated if there is an intent to cause serious harm. Pointing an unloaded gun at a victim to frighten the individual is not considered an aggravated assault.

Will the guy be charged with battery or will he be charged with aggravated assault and battery? I don't know the guys still in prison. I saw the video and the perp intentionally ran the cop over so it would be WAY more than a simple assault. Plus it would also be considered and assault on a peace officer which is way different charge than two people getting into a fight. The earlier description for me sounded like someone describing teo people fighting which could be assault and battery or charged with simple battery etc......

When a peace officer is involved it becomes a little bit different! for example look at this webpage and the charges!!!

http://805vigilantes.blogspot.com/2009/04/ventura-jeffrey-fennell-assault-wdeadly.html

[SoonerKnight]

Arizona law for example:

http://www.azleg.state.az.us/ars/13/01204.htm

[Curly Bill]

. . . (good legal analysis by 47straight and Albq) . . .



. . . but . . . but . . . that's not nearly as much fun as calling the
perp-then-vic a POS.

Nor is it as true. ;)

[Frozen Sooner]

Okay well hmmm...maybe I over simplified it for you. I was talk in generalities and yes I know what battery is and I know what aggrevated assault is!

An aggravated assault, punishable in all states as a felony, is committed when a defendant intends to do more than merely frighten the victim. Common types of aggravated assaults are those accompanied by an intent to kill, rob, or rape. An assault with a dangerous weapon is aggravated if there is an intent to cause serious harm. Pointing an unloaded gun at a victim to frighten the individual is not considered an aggravated assault.

Will the guy be charged with battery or will he be charged with aggravated assault and battery? I don't know the guys still in prison. I saw the video and the perp intentionally ran the cop over so it would be WAY more than a simple assault. Plus it would also be considered and assault on a peace officer which is way different charge than two people getting into a fight. The earlier description for me sounded like someone describing teo people fighting which could be assault and battery or charged with simple battery etc......

When a peace officer is involved it becomes a little bit different! for example look at this webpage and the charges!!!

http://805vigilantes.blogspot.com/2009/04/ventura-jeffrey-fennell-assault-wdeadly.html

Fair enough. I was taking issue with your correction of Albq's usage of battery. He was describing the act, not stating the charges. Upshot is that running over a cop is a pretty dumbass thing to do.

I agree entirely that if you don't want the **** beaten out of you, running over cops is a bad way to go about it. I think the firing was justified inasmuch that cops are supposed to be able to keep their cool no matter what's going on, but it ain't like it was unprovoked. Don't start nothin' won't be nothin'.

[SoonerKnight]

Yes, the officer's used excessive force because force is excessive when you use more force than reasonably necessary to subdue a suspect. Also, I work in Colorado and the definition is a little bit different here for example:

18-3-202. Assault in the first degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of assault in the first degree if:

(a) With intent to cause serious bodily injury to another person, he causes serious bodily injury to any person by means of a deadly weapon; or

(b) With intent to disfigure another person seriously and permanently, or to destroy, amputate, or disable permanently a member or organ of his body, he causes such an injury to any person; or

(c) Under circumstances manifesting extreme indifference to the value of human life, he knowingly engages in conduct which creates a grave risk of death to another person, and thereby causes serious bodily injury to any person; or

See in Colorado it would be assault because of definition (c).

We just recently had an officer get ran over when he was going to his personal vehicle someone was inside they saw him and ran out of the vehicle and jumped into the car waiting for them. The deputy tried to stop them but they ran over him before he could get out of the way. I think though he was lucky because it was his foot that was broken and nothing else. Also, he had his weapon out and would have shot but he did not feel that he could do so without endangering the lives of people around him. The perps had a temp tag and could not be traced. It is kinda crazy that our department does not provide a secure place for our vehicles so that we do not have to go through this crap.

[AlbqSooner]

Albq, I understand that, but in context of the Constitution I think "unlawful search and seizure" refers to something like probable cause for a search/seizure to take place at all, not directly referencing the method OF the search/seizure.. .
This would be incorrect. If there is probable cause for an officer to get a search warrant to search for a dead body in your house and he starts opening match boxes, thus finding your stash of marijuana, the evidence would be thrown out because the search was unreasonable. That is, there is no way a body could have been in a matchbox, hence no reason to look into that matchbox, hence unreasonable search.

I have tried these cases in Federal courts in several jurisdictions. I can assure you that cops beating the hell out of an individual or shooting an individual under color of state law except in certain clearly defined situations is considered a violation of the Constitutional rights you have secured to you by virtue of the Fourth Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. The seizure is considered unreasonable. You don't shoot unarmed shoplifters for example.

This POS no longer had control of the deadly weapon (SUV) and no longer posed an ongoing threat to the cops or others (unconscious on the roadside) hence, the use of force of the degree used by the cops was more than was necessary to effect the arrest.

[Okla-homey]

Why have we become a society of firing everyone who makes a mistake?
we all make mistakes. We should all get fired when that happens?

I feel you on the "one strike your out mentality" being lamentable, but, in the case of people in whom we trust to carry a gun and wield the awesome power of the state, we should probably hold them to a higher standard than other gubmint workers.

IMHO, Cops, who have a tendency to adopt a "us versus the general population (who have all done something, we just haven't figured it out yet)" mentality, need to be reined-in from time to time. If these cops aren't punished (suspended and/or dismissed following a hearing if found they broke department policies/procedures) it could encourage future such acts.

I suspect they will all be sued under sec. 1983 in their individual capacities as well.

[soonerfan28]

What law did they break?

Using excessive force.
Here is the Level 4 force the FBI uses.


4. The goal of level four force is self-defense and can include personal and impact weapons. Officers frequently are assaulted, so, to defend themselves and prevent or neutralize such attacks, they resort to personal weapons (e.g., hands, fists, and feet) to hit or kick. Or, they can use impact weapons, such as batons, flashlights, and kinetic energy projectiles (e.g., shotguns that fire beanbag rounds or rubber bullets). In the level two example, if the individual starts hitting and kicking the officer, the officer would be justified in using any of the tools listed in level four to defend himself.
I've seen the video more then once and he didn't look like he was hitting or kicking anybody when they starting beating him.

[Turd_Ferguson]

I've seen the video more then once and he didn't look like he was hitting or kicking anybody when they starting beating him.Dudn't matter. Common sense tells ya he deserved it.

[Curly Bill]

Dudn't matter. Common sense tells ya he deserved it.

Common sense is in short supply here abouts.

[JLEW1818]

Common Sense is not Common...

[Ardmore_Sooner]

Not saying that what these guys did was right, but if someone I worked with got injured by someone stupid, I'd beat the pizz outta them.

[StoopTroup]

Why have we become a society of firing everyone who makes a mistake?
we all make mistakes. We should all get fired when that happens?
OK...

I'll rescind my take on them getting fired.

I think they all should be demoted to Meter Maids and have their weapons and bullet proof vests taken away.

[StoopTroup]

Dudn't matter. Common sense tells ya he deserved it.

I will never argue that he didn't deserve it....but even Posses had to lighten up on the hang em high stuff.

It was a sad day that one...but things evidently got out of hand. :D

[Pricetag]

I'm beginning to believe that the more folks talk about "common sense," the less they have of it.

[Curly Bill]

I'm beginning to believe that the more folks talk about "common sense," the more I have to wring my hands and cry. :O


FIXED

[Turd_Ferguson]

FIXEDwerd

[olevetonahill]

Ex Cop here plus a Combat Nam vet
Trust me I know the Adrenalin issues
they ****ed up . Yes it runs High, Yes ya wanta beat datass
But You Must Maintain. They dint Nuff said
Sorry guys .
Want a true story ? Let me know Ill tell it to you, about My Friend and Buddy that got shot in the head ! :mad:

[TheHumanAlphabet]

So what happened to the officer that was hit. Looks like his ankle was run over.

Too bad the cops threw fists, would have been better to "lose control control" of a vehicle while stopping and running over the perps head IMO.