Bradford, White, Hybl, or Hypel?

[KYSooner]

If you were starting a team from scratch, who would you choose as your starting qb?

Altough I love Sammy, I would go with White.

[starclassic tama]

well we could start by spelling heupel's name right... i would go with sam no question. he has more physical ability than those and at least equal upstairs.

[Crucifax Autumn]

Sam or Heupel for sure, but for different reasons.

Josh has that pure leadership thing going for him while Sam is more gifted.

White I love, but in the real world if I'm building a team from scratch how can I not consider ability to play through a season without serious injury. If that's not a factor then yeah...his mobility and physical ability put him on top.

This can change this season if Sam shows the kinda leadership that lifts his teammates above their potential.

[JLEW1818]

If i had to have a TD pass to win a game?

Jason White to Mark Clayton. Zero debate in my mind.

[JLEW1818]

and why the hell is my user name in bold?

[OU_Sooners75]

With the offense we run now?

There is no question, Sam Bradford.

As much as I loved watching Jason White play, Sam Bradford is a lot better mechanically than Jason White ever was.

[starclassic tama]

If i had to have a TD pass to win a game?

Jason White to Mark Clayton. Zero debate in my mind.

as long as it's not a 3 yard wide open dump off over the middle to tie a national championship game!

[Crucifax Autumn]

Smartazz! I'd like to see what would happen if we tossed Clayton into our receiving corp this year!

[picasso]

well we could start by spelling heupel's name right... i would go with sam no question. he has more physical ability than those and at least equal upstairs.

I'd go with Jack Milldrinn.

[OU-HSV]

All those guys would be great. But to me I'd order them like this (first choice to last):
Sam, Josh, Jason, Nate.

Sam is just so incredible..even from his very first start vs. North TX in 2007.
And I'll never forget sitting in the stands for that miami game and knowing I was witnessing someone and something special while watching him play. He's always calm and cool, he's always super accurate and I tend to agree with OU_Sooners75 in that his mechanics are more sound than JW's were. So here's my vote for Sam.

(but obviously my vote for Sam isn't disrespect for the other three)

[Boomer.....]

Either Sam or Josh. Jason White pre-injury was pretty darn good though.

[OU-HSV]

Either Sam or Josh. Jason White pre-injury was pretty darn good though.

JW post injury was pretty darn good too you know?! ;)

[badger]

and why the hell is my user name in bold?

Is mine too? It's probably because we paid our seatbelt fines (aka sponsorship dues) and the boldness is a reminder to the mods to send us our sponsorship gift. The ones in non-bold have already received theirs, or have yet to pay their fine :D

Back to the topic at hand, White with knees would be a killer QB and would probably start in the NFL with his work ethic, accuracy and speed. So, for the sake of argument, White w/knees is No. 1. W/o knees is still No. 1, but by a far-less advantage over No. 2...

Sam Bradford, who has perfected the fade to the corner of the endzone. It is perfectly placed, every time. Plus, he is the only one of these four that could effectively scramble for extra yards. He may rise to No. 1 with his performance this year.

Josh Heupel, the only one of these four to win a national championship, comes in at No. 3, but with great respect, as he's helped each of these other three out as a player and/or a coach. He had some excellent deep balls during my limited opportunities to see him (Nebbish and the Orange Bowl were the only games televised nationally to Wisconsin that year).

Nate Hybl remains Stoops' only quarterback to make an NFL non-practice squad roster. However, because of his untimely scrambling attempts (I vividly remember everyone screaming NOOOOO! when he would take off to run), he falls to No. 4 in this very prestigious list. However, it is with utmost respect that he be included in this list, because of his accomplishments on-field. We never lost to Texas under him. We got our first, last and only Rose Bowl win under him (our last BCS bowl victory to-date)

We should also mention Paul Thompson here because he, like these four great QB's, won the Big 12 title too. Granted, we should be sending Fran face and A&M dozens of roses for that championship game appearance, but he stepped up at a time when our team needed him the most.

[OU-HSV]

.......Nate Hybl remains Stoops' only quarterback to make an NFL non-practice squad roster. However, because of his untimely scrambling attempts (I vividly remember everyone screaming NOOOOO! when he would take off to run), he falls to No. 4 in this very prestigious list. However, it is with utmost respect that he be included in this list, because of his accomplishments on-field. We never lost to *Texas* under him. We got our first, last and only Rose Bowl win under him (our last BCS bowl victory to-date)

We should also mention Paul Thompson here because he, like these four great QB's, won the Big 12 title too. Granted, we should be sending Fran face and A&M dozens of roses for that championship game appearance, but he stepped up at a time when our team needed him the most.
That's no joke about Hybl, I remember that as well.


And I'm glad you mentioned Paul Thompson (a.k.a. ENA). He is one of my favorite Sooners in recent memory because of all he did to contribute to the team and the way he seemed to keep a positive attitude. Then, as you said, when the team needed him the most, he stepped up and did an excellent job. Man that Big 12 Champ game was awesome...the 99 yd drive, and so on.

BTW, Speaking of Paul.....my buddy's wife surprised me with two autographed photos of Paul Thompson the other day (one was a personalized one for me and the other was a personalized one for my 4 year old son). She kept telling me that she had something to give me next time she saw me....and she wasn't kidding either. She brought these auotgraphs over the other night. I thought that was pretty damn cool considering she has little interest in football. What a gal huh? (my buddy better keep her around!)

[RedstickSooner]

I think way, way, way too much emphasis is being placed on physical ability here.

Heupel is my first choice without hesitation. I don't think you can overstate the advantage of having a fully qualified coach under center. And if he'd had an arm in the national championship game, the Seminoles wouldn't have even been in it.

Josh had a much weaker offense around him, and made it into a monster. I can't even begin to imagine what he could do with the modern caliber of players we have. Just picture him with last year's offensive line -- it would've been insane.

Picking Heupel doesn't mean I'm not in awe of Jason and Sam, because I am. They both sling the ball like it's remote controlled. However, having an ability to gaze out over the line and see what the defense is, know how to exploit it, and to then command the offense appropriately... The guy was awesome.

[Boomer.....]

JW post injury was pretty darn good too you know?! ;)

Obviously. I was talking about his mobility though.

[OU-HSV]

Obviously. I was talking about his mobility though.

I figured...that's why I gave it a "wink" :D

[BornandBred]

I think way, way, way too much emphasis is being placed on physical ability here.

Heupel is my first choice without hesitation. I don't think you can overstate the advantage of having a fully qualified coach under center. And if he'd had an arm in the national championship game, the Seminoles wouldn't have even been in it.
His head makes him my #1 as well

Josh had a much weaker offense around him, and made it into a monster. I can't even begin to imagine what he could do with the modern caliber of players we have. Just picture him with last year's offensive line -- it would've been insane.
I don't know if he could have improved on the numbers Sammy put up


1) Hoople
2) JW with good knees
3) SB
4) JW with bad knees
5) PT
6) Hybl

[Collier11]

Sam hands down, he is smarter, he is stronger, and he was great immediately, it took Jwhite 3 years to become that good. Obviously injuries slowed him down but Id take Sammy.

[Collier11]

1) Hoople
2) JW with good knees
3) SB
4) JW with bad knees
5) PT
6) Hybl

JW with bad knees was better than JW with good knees, you do remember this right?

[BornandBred]

JW with bad knees was better than JW with good knees, you do remember this right?

He was also working with like 6 years of experience and bad knees, so the comparison isn't exactly fair. I'm thinking the same JW as the last couple years, but with his earlier mobility.

[Collier11]

That woulda been nice but he may not have been the same qb, who knows

[Jello Biafra]

as long as it's not a 3 yard wide open dump off over the middle to tie a national championship game!



don't get me started... we shoulda been running the ball anyway.

[CrimsonJim]

Yea, JW w/bad knees was better than JW w/good knees. It was his lack of mobility that forced him to become such a surgeon with the passing game. Would he have became that kind of passer w/o the knee injuries? We'll never know. Of the four choices as given in the subject:

1.) Sam (Heisman winner and will play pro ball)
2.) Josh (Should have won Heisman and the smartest of the four)
3.) Jason (Heisman winner and would have played pro if not for the knees)
4.) Nate (Well, Nate is Nate)

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Heupel...no question in my mind..

[Collier11]

Yea, JW w/bad knees was better than JW w/good knees. It was his lack of mobility that forced him to become such a surgeon with the passing game. Would he have became that kind of passer w/o the knee injuries? We'll never know. Of the four choices as given in the subject:

1.) Sam (Heisman winner and will play pro ball)
2.) Josh (Should have won Heisman and the smartest of the four)
3.) Jason (Heisman winner and would have played pro if not for the knees)
4.) Nate (Well, Nate is an ex NFL QB and a Rose Bowl MVP)

Fixed

[My Opinion Matters]

They're all great quarterbacks, and they each deserve a great deal of respect for what they accomplished; but seriously guys it's Sam Bradford, and its not even really that close.

[Sooner04]

Seriously, HYPEL? Where in the hell do we find these people?

HYPEL?

[BornandBred]

They're all great quarterbacks, and they each deserve a great deal of respect for what they accomplished; but seriously guys it's Sam Bradford, and its not even really that close.

Sam is as good as Sam is because Hoople is in his ear. Much of the decision making that Sam is capable of now is due directly to his learning from Josh.

I agree that JW's surgical passing abilities were due largely to his lack of mobility, but I'd still say JW with is later passing ability combined with his early mobility is better than later JW. More mobility isn't a bad thing unless you become too reliant on it, which I would assume he wouldn't.

[badger]

Sam Bradford still has time left, so I'm hesitant to put him ahead of Jason White, because he was with the team for six years and all (and I am convinced that if he had knees he would still be playing... and I'm also convinced that while his performance improved after he lost his knees, it was more from his work ethic and experience than anything else).

Heupel with a Heisman would have been great, but Weinke had the better "feel good" story that year... you know that the Heisman is always about the "feel good" story. Look through recent history and you can attach a "feel good" story to practically every single one.

Bradford, for example, was a role model to Cherokee kids.

Tivo, for another example, was a home schooled missionary who circumcised the SEC in his free time.

Leinart was a fat crossed eyed kid... Bush was adopted by his step father so that he had someone to give prospective agent money to... White has no knees... Weinke is old and unsuccessful at baseball... etc, etc, etc...

[soonerfan28]

Sam because he can scramble better then White and Heupel and he's taller then both which makes it easier to see down the field.

[Collier11]

but I'd still say JW with is later passing ability combined with his early mobility is better than later JW. .

well in that case Heupel with a rocket arm or Hybl with better decision making :confused: :rolleyes:

[SoonersBIG7]

BOMAR!!......:rolleyes:

[BornandBred]

well in that case Heupel with a rocket arm or Hybl with better decision making :confused: :rolleyes:

JH had a much better arm until he got bursitis. I've had it, it sucks. Draining it only does so much.

[My Opinion Matters]

Justifiably there is a great deal of romanticism involved with Coach Heupel in the hearts of Sooner fans. He was the face of the team that resurrected our proud program. He's the Crimson Jesus to a lot people, I get that. But I think with our recent struggles on the big stage there's a lot of revisionist history being used. Implications that Josh was more responsible for that teams improbable run to the championship than anyone, even Coach Stoops. I think it's selling everyone else involved with that team short. That title run wasn't possible without guys like Torrance Marshall, Derrick Strait, Ontei Jones, JT Thatcher, and even the lowly punter-Jeff Ferguson. A great team is more than just a sum of it's individual parts. I don't know if I've ever seen a team in my lifetime that exemplified that more.

Sam Bradford hasn't won the big one yet, and that holds him back in some people's minds. I'm not sure how many people really are aware we're watching a guy that could put together the best career for a quarterback in college football history.

[badger]

Maybe we should combine attributes of all five (including ENA) to make the uber OU quarterback?

ENA's speed, Sammie's corner fade TD pass, White's arm strength, Heupel's decision making and Hybl's... um... all-around awesomeness?

[Sooner04]

People do often forget how much the "D" carried us at the end of the 2000 season.

We scored 27 against Tech (7 of which came on a 100 or so yard INT TD return by JT Thatcher).

12 against O-State (2 of which came on the brilliance of Aso Pogi).

13 against Florida State (our only TD on a drive of about ten yards, Heupel also missed a wide open Savage for a TD earlier).

Josh was nails, and never made the crucial mistake. That said, we'd have a few more skins on the wall if our "superstar" recruits of the last seven or eight years had the intestinal fortitude of that 2000 team. Those guys were warriors. Mike Stoops chewing out Ontei for being out of position in College Station even though he made the play that saved the game.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I would take Hybl's arm strength over White's...White's down field accuracy was impressive

[CrimsonJim]

4.) Nate (Well, Nate is an ex NFL QB and a Rose Bowl MVP)
Fixed

Good fix. :)


well in that case Heupel with a rocket arm or Hybl with better decision making :confused: :rolleyes:

And that is why..........Nate is Nate. ;)

[BornandBred]

Justifiably there is a great deal of romanticism involved with Coach Heupel in the hearts of Sooner fans. He was the face of the team that resurrected our proud program. He's the Crimson Jesus to a lot people, I get that. But I think with our recent struggles on the big stage there's a lot of revisionist history being used. Implications that Josh was more responsible for that teams improbable run to the championship than anyone, even Coach Stoops. I think it's selling everyone else involved with that team short. That title run wasn't possible without guys like Torrance Marshall, Derrick Strait, Ontei Jones, JT Thatcher, and even the lowly punter-Jeff Ferguson. A great team is more than just a sum of it's individual parts. I don't know if I've ever seen a team in my lifetime that exemplified that more.

I concede the point. I still take Hoople over all of them, to date at least. I am aware of what Sammy is doing though. I don't need him to win the Big One, I'd like it, but I don't require it for him to make the tops of this list. Physically he's already there, I'm looking for more of a field general. Hopefully this year he'll get to make some LOS audibles and get that opportunity.

[JLEW1818]

I would take Hybl's arm strength over White's...White's down field accuracy was impressive

yep

[Widescreen]

Heupel or Bradford. Heupel is one of the most cerebral QB's I've ever seen. Bradford is getting there in the IQ area but he's more physically gifted. I like White but he had a tendency to have a significant championship game brain fart.

[Collier11]

Jason White threw one of the best and most accurate deep balls EVAR!

[yermom]

i like The Trophy as much as anyone, but i think Bradford is a notch better

he did some sick things last year that with regularity that i never saw Jason White do nearly as consistently.

i think my money would still be on a healthy Heupel. although, at this point, i think statistically Bradford's got the best MNC game performance so far

[Howzit]

Jameel Holloway

[jaux]

Ja_mayel Holloway

fixed

[NormanPride]

Sam would have a NC if our OLine had blocked like they had all year, and that would make him #1 easily. The only reason anyone else is in the picture is because he hasn't won a bowl game yet. None of which are his fault, though.

Man, ENA's playfakes were a thing of beauty, though. I think even the RB got faked out sometimes. :)

[TopDawg]

I think way, way, way too much emphasis is being placed on physical ability here.

Heupel is my first choice without hesitation. I don't think you can overstate the advantage of having a fully qualified coach under center. And if he'd had an arm in the national championship game, the Seminoles wouldn't have even been in it.

Josh had a much weaker offense around him, and made it into a monster. I can't even begin to imagine what he could do with the modern caliber of players we have. Just picture him with last year's offensive line -- it would've been insane.

Picking Heupel doesn't mean I'm not in awe of Jason and Sam, because I am. They both sling the ball like it's remote controlled. However, having an ability to gaze out over the line and see what the defense is, know how to exploit it, and to then command the offense appropriately... The guy was awesome.

This is pretty much exactly what I'd say, while giving props, like 04, to our D for a big part of that success.

One of my favorite things about Heupel was that he just had a knack for making plays. How many times in critical situations did he scramble for a first down? He had a reputation for being slow, but he was fast enough to pick up some critical third downs with his feet in huge games (especially on the road at A&M). Those kind of plays absolutely KILL the will of the opposing D and none of those other guys have had that ability.

In the big games, you're usually playing defenses that don't make many mistakes. Heupel was the kind of guy who would take advantage of every one of them. It has less to do with physical ability and more to do, like Redstick said, with vision and knowledge of how to exploit a defense.

[Salt City Sooner]

That Jay-Z Whats dude was pretty dang good.....

[starclassic tama]

just for kicks and much akin to the 40 yard dash in being overrated, but how would you guys rank their arm strength? i'm not a scout but it seems to me like sam has a really strong arm.

i would go sam > hybl > white > heupel

[Collier11]

Depends how you define arm strength, Heupel and White threw great deep balls but the cross field type passes that require alot of zip, the 15 yd outs and such werent always a rocket like with Sam

[goingoneight]

Bradford appears to be the full package for any offense that Stoops has run in his time here. Strong arm, incredible accuracy, NFL size, mobility, athleticism and all the tools upstairs, too.

White might have thrown for 50 TDs if he had Gresham and three receiving RBs... but he had AD... who's complaining about handing it off for 2,900 yards instead of having to throw for that much more, right? White was everything Bradford was if not a bit more of a ground threat running the shotgun-based option with Q and Works... but consider what happened... he was on the unfortunate end of two bad knee injuries. It is what it is, and this keeps him under Sam Bradford.

Josh Heupel... all upstairs. He came in and lead OU out of the 90's mess and directly to the National Championship by simply being smarter than his opposition. As stated above, imagine if he was standing behing Loadholt, Robinson, Cooper, Braxton and Williams, handing off to three star RBs instead of one and throwing to bigger, faster and deeper WR corps. Oh, yeah, and Gresham for Smith is a trade I'd make, no offense to Trent. The fact that he's still producing TO THIS DAY at OU is a revelation of his dedication to the program when he could be an OC for much bigger bucks right now elsewhere.

Hybl, Thompson, Bomar respectively. Bomar is just one you got a small glimpse of potential, but his style reeked of a guy who would get himself hurt or put the team in a bad position with his decision making. Strong arm and decent mobility was about it. Granted, again... no Gresham, no seasoned WR or OL... who knows. All I know is Sam wouldn't get caught sneaking beer in a pop can into the Ford Center in front of thousands of people and White wouldn't sneak a little cookie jar money from a booster. Heupel was smart enough NOT to take on linebackers head-first and Hybl and Thompson possessed leadership skills Bomar did not.

[My Opinion Matters]

About that offensive line...

I take Wes Sims, Davin Joseph, Vince Carter, Kelvin Chaisson, and Jammal Brown over Loadholt, Walker, Cooper, Robinson, and Williams every time.

[SoonerFah]

I say hands down Heupel. Yes the D took over in 2000, but Heupel was the driving force behind that whole team. (Had he been healthy the whole time, the D may very well have been an afterthought)


Nothing against the other guys, but Heupel just stands above them in my eyes.

[Curly Bill]

Anyone who answers with a name other than Sam Bradford is drunk, on drugs, or more likely both. :P

[Curly Bill]

...and my name is in bold too! Hell yeah!

[Jdog]

If i had to have a TD pass to win a game?

Jason White to Mark Clayton. Zero debate in my mind.

oh yes - three letters LSU

got to admit we had to have it.

[Jdog]

I say hands down Heupel. Yes the D took over in 2000, but Heupel was the driving force behind that whole team. (Had he been healthy the whole time, the D may very well have been an afterthought)


Nothing against the other guys, but Heupel just stands above them in my eyes.

Yep, got to agree - even though Heupel was not my favorite Sooner but - he was the best all round team leader. Matter of fact, as I've said on this site before, I saw him be a jerk to some of his younger fans. He took a rag tag bunch of ex-option QB as receivers, studied their videos and their routes, threw wobble soft passes to them that were scarry accuate - and kicked the Poop out of 13 teams - with no losses.

I got to pick Josh

[OU_Sooners75]

When/If we win #8 with Sammy....Everyone that has posted on this thread to date/time, will be saying sammy!

As much as I admire Coach Huepel, Sam Bradford is a much better product.
In his career, he has not made the mistakes that most QBs have, just like Huepel.

The difference between the two are the teams, not the player! in 2000, OU had one of the best defenses in the history of college football and it showed at the end of the season.

Sam has had great offenses, but our defenses with Sam at the helm have been very average at best for a Bob Stoops coached team.

With that said, 2009 could be the best defense Bob Stoops has fielded here as a coach....Our offense will probably still score above 650 points this year...So if Sammy and crew can win the NC this year...You all will be talking about how it is Sam's and no others!

[OU_Sooners75]

Yep, got to agree - even though Heupel was not my favorite Sooner but - he was the best all round team leader. Matter of fact, as I've said on this site before, I saw him be a jerk to some of his younger fans. He took a rag tag bunch of ex-option QB as receivers, studied their videos and their routes, threw wobble soft passes to them that were scarry accuate - and kicked the Poop out of 13 teams - with no losses.

I got to pick Josh


You do know that Josh in 2 seasons has the same amount of losses (5) as Sam in 2 seasons, right? You do know that Sam has more wins (23) in 2 seasons than Josh (20) does right?

The biggest difference, Josh's 2000 team had a monsterous defense!

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Can't we just take the 2000 Defense with any of them ;)

[OU_Sooners75]

Can't we just take the 2000 Defense with any of them ;)


That would be nice. But If we can have some Sooner Magic, some luck and stay healthy in 2009, This defense has the potential to be the best under Stoops, maybe even the best ever at OU?

:eek:

[yermom]

we say that every year :P

although, that 2001 defense was pretty amazing

[Collier11]

we say that every year :P

although, that 2001 defense was pretty amazing

put that 01 defense with last years team and we roll thru the schedule

[OU_Sooners75]

we say that every year :P

although, that 2001 defense was pretty amazing


You may say it every year, but I haven't.

It is very rare that we have as many guys returning as we do this year. 9 starters are returning on defense. :D :eek:

[Jacie]

As great as the other three were as Sooners, one look at him and you know Sam is the guy we always wished Oklahoma had as OUr quarterback.

[Jdog]

You do know that Josh in 2 seasons has the same amount of losses (5) as Sam in 2 seasons, right? You do know that Sam has more wins (23) in 2 seasons than Josh (20) does right?

The biggest difference, Josh's 2000 team had a monsterous defense!

You're right - I do know those things that you mentioned; But:
all of Heupel's losses were with a first year coach.
Sam came in to a stable program that hadn't had a lossing season in 8 years.

Most 1999 players hadn't had a winning season @ OU?.
Sam's Came in after a bad year when we won a Big 12 championship.

1999 players were all adapting to a new offensive - Capt. Pirate's Offense.
Sam had arguable the best OU Offense line since Bill Sims was in the backfield.

OU's offense in 2000 was the right mix of Capt. Pirate's ninja attack and the big Mangino's running game. They scored points against a lot of very good defenses. It's O, D and special teams played as a complete Team. they were winners. the offense had great comebacks against KU (17 down) NU (14) and KSU (17).

I agree OU had maybe their greatest defense in 2000 - though I think the 85 and the 01 d's were maybe as good-or better.

But Josh and the 2000 team, who started at #19, where winner - and there may never be another Sooner team to have that kind of season. Again I hate to say it - but Josh was a big part of it.

[TopDawg]

So if Sammy and crew can win the NC this year...You all will be talking about how it is Sam's and no others!

I love all 4 of these guys, but even if we win it all this year, I'm sticking with Josh unless Sam shows me that he can make plays on his own when everything else breaks down (and I hope he does). That was one of the things that made Heupel so special and what separates him from the other four in my opinion.

I don't want this to be taken as a slight against Sam because I think he's great. He's a stellar athlete and a great representative of the program and there's no disgrace in falling below Josh in my book. I think Heupel was/is amazing.

[goingoneight]

I don't know, man... I still think Keith Nichol will beat out Sam Bradford for the starting job.

[GottaHavePride]

I love all 4 of these guys, but even if we win it all this year, I'm sticking with Josh unless Sam shows me that he can make plays on his own when everything else breaks down (and I hope he does). That was one of the things that made Heupel so special and what separates him from the other four in my opinion.

I don't want this to be taken as a slight against Sam because I think he's great. He's a stellar athlete and a great representative of the program and there's no disgrace in falling below Josh in my book. I think Heupel was/is amazing.

I take Heupel unless this year Sam starts calling his own audibles and carving up defenses...

[hobbes2702]

Texas fan here but anyone who would choose White is crazy. I was at the USC game and that is one of the worst big game performances I have ever seen

[CrimsonJim]

Yeah, he was just terrible. He only went 2-0 against your Whorns as a starter and saved the '01 game after Nate Hybl was injured. :mad:

[Crucifax Autumn]

*Texas* fan here but anyone who would choose White is crazy. I was at the USC game and that is one of the worst big game performances I have ever seen

When a QB actually takes serious, injurious hits that destroy both knees it has a greater effect on performance than if they fall down and thrash around like a crack baby to draw a roughing the passer call after a defensive player breaths in his general direction.

And if yer gonna bash someone over that performance there's a certain return guy with a family history at OU that's a better target. But I'll thump ya on the head for that one too cause he beat some whorn azz too.

[Salt City Sooner]

You're right - I do know those things that you mentioned; But:
all of Heupel's losses were with a first year coach.
Sam came in to a stable program that hadn't had a lossing season in 8 years.

Most 1999 players hadn't had a winning season @ OU?.
Sam's Came in after a bad year when we won a Big 12 championship.

1999 players were all adapting to a new offensive - Capt. Pirate's Offense.
Sam had arguable the best OU Offense line since Bill Sims was in the backfield.

OU's offense in 2000 was the right mix of Capt. Pirate's ninja attack and the big Mangino's running game. They scored points against a lot of very good defenses. It's O, D and special teams played as a complete Team. they were winners. the offense had great comebacks against KU (17 down) NU (14) and KSU (17).

I agree OU had maybe their greatest defense in 2000 - though I think the 85 and the 01 d's were maybe as good-or better.

But Josh and the 2000 team, who started at #19, where winner - and there may never be another Sooner team to have that kind of season. Again I hate to say it - but Josh was a big part of it.
I'm not sure which other game you might be thinking of (A&M maybe? The Toombs run put us down 10 in the 4th), but the most we were down to KU & KSU was 6 & 7 points respectively (KSU deficit was in the CCG), both in the 2nd quarter.

[OU_Sooners75]

I love all 4 of these guys, but even if we win it all this year, I'm sticking with Josh unless Sam shows me that he can make plays on his own when everything else breaks down (and I hope he does). That was one of the things that made Heupel so special and what separates him from the other four in my opinion.

I don't want this to be taken as a slight against Sam because I think he's great. He's a stellar athlete and a great representative of the program and there's no disgrace in falling below Josh in my book. I think Heupel was/is amazing.


Josh had his fair share of mistakes. Yes, most of the time his decisions were spot on. But he made mistakes too.

Sam has very very very few mistakes. He has made them, but I am willing to venture out and say that Josh had more mistakes in his two years at OU than Sam Bradford has.

And if people want to bring up the leader part...Josh was a heck of a leader, still is. But it was not until his Senior year where he shined the most when it comes to leadership.

If Bradford stays for 2010 as well, I bet his leadership skills will be above that of any QB before him.

This is not a slight at Josh, I loved him as a player and think he is a helluva coach too. I just think Sam Bradford has the better mechanics and abilities than Josh did.

[OU_Sooners75]

You're right - I do know those things that you mentioned; But:
all of Heupel's losses were with a first year coach.
Sam came in to a stable program that hadn't had a lossing season in 8 years.

Most 1999 players hadn't had a winning season @ OU?.
Sam's Came in after a bad year when we won a Big 12 championship.

1999 players were all adapting to a new offensive - Capt. Pirate's Offense.
Sam had arguable the best OU Offense line since Bill Sims was in the backfield.

OU's offense in 2000 was the right mix of Capt. Pirate's ninja attack and the big Mangino's running game. They scored points against a lot of very good defenses. It's O, D and special teams played as a complete Team. they were winners. the offense had great comebacks against KU (17 down) NU (14) and KSU (17).

I agree OU had maybe their greatest defense in 2000 - though I think the 85 and the 01 d's were maybe as good-or better.

But Josh and the 2000 team, who started at #19, where winner - and there may never be another Sooner team to have that kind of season. Again I hate to say it - but Josh was a big part of it.

So naturally this means Josh is better?

LMFAO. Look man, I think both are great Sooners.

But like I have said, What makes Sam the better, he has the mechanics and the ability. He has the talent and the brains.

The biggest draw back on Sam, he is not as polished as Josh was. When he gets another year or two under his belt, he will be just as polished or moreso than Josh.

[Crucifax Autumn]

If he's back for a 4th year he'll be the greatest in NCAA history...Period!

[JLEW1818]

yep

[Vaevictis]

I love all 4 of these guys, but even if we win it all this year, I'm sticking with Josh unless Sam shows me that he can make plays on his own when everything else breaks down (and I hope he does). That was one of the things that made Heupel so special and what separates him from the other four in my opinion.

I sometimes wonder how much of this is Sam and how much of this is coaching.

The staff has to constantly have JW's knees, AD's collarbone, etc, on their mind. I doubt they had any such considerations in 2000.

[TopDawg]

I sometimes wonder how much of this is Sam and how much of this is coaching.

The staff has to constantly have JW's knees, AD's collarbone, etc, on their mind. I doubt they had any such considerations in 2000.

I'm talking more about what Josh did when the play broke down. He could make things happen when there was nothing there. Maybe the coaches have told Jason and Sam not to run, but I think they are/were too reliant on their (admittedly superior) passing skills whereas Josh was content to tuck it and pick up 5 or 6 yards and move the chains.

75: I'm not saying Josh was mistake free, and you make a good point about comparing senior Josh to underclass Sam...but it's a little ridiculous for you to claim that it's no contest if OU wins a title this year with Sam at the helm.

[My Opinion Matters]

Sam is pretty good when a play breaks down too...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l01VR6m5o08

[Collier11]

Sams mistakes are probably more of what we cant see, missing a read here or there. Heupel threw way more INTs but he made every single critical play so those were overshadowed

[BornandBred]

Sam is pretty good when a play breaks down too...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l01VR6m5o08

Is it football season yet? I'm dying here...

[soonersalesman]

Considering where these guys were in their second year. Sam Bradford hands down.

I played football in high school and graduated OU 1976. Watched the Sooners play since 1966. Never saw a quarterback who impressed me in such a short time. Sam just seems to have it all. Josh's head for the game and all the tools Jason White had PLUS knees that haven't been torn apart.

Sam WILL be the best pro QB prospect OU has ever produced if he stays healthy.

[TopDawg]

Sam is pretty good when a play breaks down too...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l01VR6m5o08

No doubt about it.

[badger]

Is it football season yet? I'm dying here...

Doctor prescribed this to stabilize your vitals:
http://s3.amazonaws.com/newsok-photos/522210/medium.jpg

[starclassic tama]

bit of a stunned aggie back there first row third from the right

[soonermix]

i'm going with the one that wins in january

[oumartin]

Justin Fuentes

[badger]

i'm going with the one that wins in january

Durr, two of them win in January so far? :P

[CatfishSooner]

Hybl???? BWAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHA!!!!!!!!!

[The Remnant]

This post is like asking me if I am attracted to blondes, brunettes, or red heads.

[Collier11]

Redheads? No way

[Sooner04]

Redheads? No way
harumph.

[StoopTroup]

I'll go with the ones that won a bowl game.

[soonermix]

Durr, two of them win in January so far? :P

fair enough... i'll take both and mold them into 1 super QB
muahahahahha

[soonermix]

Redheads? No way

FALSE

gotta love the fire crotch

[The Remnant]

Wasn't Ann-Margaret a red head?

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I love them redheads

[badger]

This post is like asking me if I am attracted to blondes, brunettes, or red heads.


Redheads? No way


gotta love the fire crotch


Wasn't Ann-Margaret a red head?


I love them redheads

http://i42.tinypic.com/25ujr08.jpg

[goingoneight]

Back on subject... I have watched six games I have on DVD from 2000 since my original post (hey, I get bored on weeknights) and I have to say Heupel is a coach. That's literally what it looked like everytime he was out there. His footwork was always perfect, but his release, his arm strength, his mobility and also his stats at years' end couldn't touch Sam's. Don't go saying the crystal ball means he's better than Sam. I don't see anyone here claiming Renaldo Works is better than AD.

Josh, going into the MNC game = 20 TDs, 13 (eventually 15) INTs.
Sam, going into the NCC game = 48 (eventually 50) passing scores, 5 rushing scores, 6 (eventually 8 :() INTs.

If I'm picking my All-Stoops Team QB Bradford... I might as well pick my All-Stoops QB Coach Heupel. :)

[JLEW1818]

What if Josh gives sam his left arm? Then Sam can *throw* the ball from both sides???? ah ha! I figured this one out!

[goingoneight]

I'm not saying you'll ever see it, but Sam can already throw a ball left-handed. I've seen him do it in warmups. It's one of those improvisational skills you hope he never has to use... :D

[Sooner70]

Man, that's a tough question. When I think of those guys, each did a great job in their own way. Heupel wasn't the most talented QB of the lot, but he was a great leader. Hybl was just a tough kid. He withstood a lot and would get up & come back for more--reminded me of Jack Mildren's demeanor. Jason White was a real good long ball passer--pinpoint guy. Sam seems pretty cerebral... He really dissects a defense & doesn't get rattled easy. Seems to have that extra sense.

It's like picking from beauty contest finalists.....they all look good. I guess I'd probably go with Heupel because of the leadership & ability to rally the troops when the chips were down....that plus his NC win helps.

[My Opinion Matters]

Tim Tebow

[The Remnant]

Thanks alot Badger.

[ashley]

Bradford, easy. Just ask the experts and the coaches.

[badger]

Thanks alot Badger.

:D When you all mentioned red heads in a quarterback thread, I was surprised nobody referenced that dude sooner. That dude has redder hair than me and is definitely the red haired stepchild of all Oklahoma/Texas area quarterbacks.

[SoonerShark]

as long as it's not a 3 yard wide open dump off over the middle to tie a national championship game!

Jason White was hurt too badly to play up to potential in New Orleans, but our coaches felt there was no alternative. Against, FSU in 2001 in Miami Josh could not really throw either. We have scored 14 or fewer points in three national championship games, winning 13-2 in January 2001. If Jason had his 2004 Orange Bowl health in the 2003 Sugar Bowl we would have won in a score akin to the 2004 Orange Bowl.

[Scott D]

I don't know, man... I still think Keith Nichol will beat out Sam Bradford for the starting job.

the amusing thing on this post is that Keith Nichol is battling to be the #2 on the Michigan State depth chart.

[aero]

This is a great thread. It's kind of funny that as a program that has traditionally been known to be have a great running program, we are talking about some pretty darn good passing qb's. It's great debate because any of them would be good choices. Mine are:

1. Josh. To me, Josh personified the entire team. Maybe not the best natural abilities but he had that intangible asset of being a winner and finding a way to win. To not be denied. Plus, along with all of that great team, brought our program back to the top and essentially laid the foundation for the years that have followed. Obviously, Mr. Stoops should be given his well earned due as the man behind it all but he was fortunate to have those players. If I'm starting a team, he's my qb.

2. Jason. His passing was a thing of pure beauty. An all-time great college qb. It's tough winning a NC. But he was outstanding. He did have one helluva offensive line and a great receiving corps.

2a. Sam. He should move up the list if he continues his amazing career. He has all of the tools and appears to be the real deal. For the first 2 years, I can't think of a qb I have ever seen as good. I'd say Jason ahead only based on his entire career over Sam's as yet to be. He's had a good line in front of him but not on par with Jason's. Same with his receivers.

3. Paul. Win or lose, I'd take guys like him any day. Team player and actually was a pretty good player.

4. Nate. I almost hate putting him down this far because he was a good qb that many years we'd love to have.

Good times.

[stoopified]

Sam is THE ANSWER butJosh,Jason are just a hair nehind.

[engineer24]

For the pros, I'd take Sam Bradford. He's got the best skill set of them all.

However, for college, I'd take Heupel hands down. We coulda played FSU 20 times with half our team injured, and we still woulda won, because Heupel WILLED his team to victory. He might not have the physical skills of White or Bradford, but Bradford/White dont have a clue on leadership skills that are so critical to winning the NC (See Heupel, Tebow, Vince Young for examples).

There's a great video clip of Heupel in the huddle with the offense in the Big 12 championship game in 2000. KSU had just scored, and the game was winding down and OU needed a score to put the game away. Heupel calmly looked at his guys and said "get ready guys, cause we're gonna go out there and score right now and win this game!"

Bradford and White never had the passion/leadership/will to win that Heupel had.

[starclassic tama]

Bradford and White never had the passion/leadership/will to win that Heupel had.

don't agree with the passion/will to win part of this statement at all. heupel may have had better leadership skills than sam or jason, but you can't tell me sam or jason won as many games as they have by not having the passion or will to win.

[meoveryouxinfinity]

Man, that's a tough question. When I think of those guys, each did a great job in their own way. Heupel wasn't the most talented QB of the lot, but he was a great leader. Hybl was just a tough kid. He withstood a lot and would get up & come back for more--reminded me of Jack Mildren's demeanor. Jason White was a real good long ball passer--pinpoint guy. Sam seems pretty cerebral... He really dissects a defense & doesn't get rattled easy. Seems to have that extra sense.

It's like picking from beauty contest finalists.....they all look good. I guess I'd probably go with Heupel because of the leadership & ability to rally the troops when the chips were down....that plus his NC win helps.

Jeupel because he isn't a homophobe.

[My Opinion Matters]

However, for college, I'd take Heupel hands down. We coulda played FSU 20 times with half our team injured, and we still woulda won, because Heupel WILLED his team to victory.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2wc4mx3.jpg

[the_ouskull]

If you were starting a team from scratch, who would you choose as your starting qb?

Altough I love Sammy, I would go with White.

Insightful.

the_ouskull

[picasso]

I would start a team with Tommy McDonalds. He was crafty and makes a helluva Big Mac.

[goingoneight]

For the pros, I'd take Sam Bradford. He's got the best skill set of them all.

However, for college, I'd take Heupel hands down. We coulda played FSU 20 times with half our team injured, and we still woulda won, because Heupel WILLED his team to victory. He might not have the physical skills of White or Bradford, but Bradford/White dont have a clue on leadership skills that are so critical to winning the NC (See Heupel, The Right Reverend Tim T. Messiah, Vince Young for examples).

There's a great video clip of Heupel in the huddle with the offense in the Big 12 championship game in 2000. KSU had just scored, and the game was winding down and OU needed a score to put the game away. Heupel calmly looked at his guys and said "get ready guys, cause we're gonna go out there and score right now and win this game!"

Bradford and White never had the passion/leadership/will to win that Heupel had.

You don't think shutting out Florida State had anything to do with winning the MNC? :rolleyes: Tell me what part of that Josh did. No offense to Josh, he was steady, but if we only score 13 points in any game these days, we're going to lose, and in the BIG 12, probably lose embarassingly.

[the_ouskull]

I also disagree with the original post, for much the same reason that you point out, but your rebuttal makes it sound as if you think Huepel WASN'T a good leader...

the_ouskull

[the_ouskull]

I need to stop drinking...

I agree with the original poster's assessment that I'd take Huepel to start a team, but for different reasons than the one he listed. Right idea, bad example.

I apologize for any confusion that I may have caused anybody other than myself. I deserve it.

the_ouskull

[UberSooner]

I think a more interesting question is who you would pick to sink a 10 footer to take the final skin: Hybl or Bradford?

[the_ouskull]

Have they been drinking?

Have I?

If THEY have, I'd go with Bradford. If I have I'm going with Hybl. I always liked that guy... except for the interception on the swing pass in the flat against OSU, 'cause SERIOUSLY, you didn't see that guy jump the ball, SERIOUSLY?

the_ouskull

[OUthunder]

If you were starting a team from scratch, who would you choose as your starting qb?

Altough I love Sammy, I would go with White.

Bradford. More complete all the way around. His mobility puts him over the top IMO. Plus, he's the smartest, most humble OU QB that I've ever seen play.

BTW...

Hypel>Wienke :D

[TopDawg]

You don't think shutting out Florida State had anything to do with winning the MNC? :rolleyes: Tell me what part of that Josh did. No offense to Josh, he was steady, but if we only score 13 points in any game these days, we're going to lose, and in the BIG 12, probably lose embarassingly.

I don't think we would've made it to the Orange Bowl that year with any of the other guys. I don't think we would've beaten KSU, Nebraska, A&M and KSU (again) with Bradford, Hybl or White.

I hope Bradford changes my mind this year.

[SoonernAR]

Bradford's game is pretty strong, his weak link I would say would be his long ball. Jason White excelled at this and often broke the backs of our opponents with the long throw. Sam will be playing on Sunday's without a doubt tho, he is a better overall talent for the next level.