Top 50 Football Programs

[OU_Sooners75]

I am creating this thread in response to FmrEmpOUathdept's thread about the top 10 programs of all time.

Though he is entitled to his opinion and the way he does things (if in fact that was his own list), I thought it would be best to create something more accurate.

Before I show the list, let me explain this to you.

Each team must have been a member of the FBS division for 65% of the time since 1930. They also must be current FBS teams (no Princeton, Yale, or Harvard).
All National Championships are that of the AP, UPI, BCS variety. The UPI went from UP to UPI to ESPN Coaches to BCS in its history.
This ranking is heavily favored toward wins and winning percentage. Moreso than National championships.
I gave value to the total wins and national championships.
Added the values for wins, winning % and NCs and divided by 2 to come up with grand total (basic math forumla).Without further blabbing by me, here is what I came up with (it is a PDF file):
Top 50 CFB Programs Since 1930 (http://www.olevetpossehideout.com/downloads/Top50CFBPrograms.pdf)

[OU_Sooners75]

1 Oklahoma 876 627 221 28 0.731735 7 0.722558
2 Alabama 882 621 235 26 0.718821 7 0.713100
3 Ohio State 824 600 198 26 0.743932 5 0.702816

4 Notre Dame 848 589 236 23 0.708137 8 0.697928
5 Southern Cal 875 597 250 28 0.698286 7 0.690833
6 Texas 878 610 249 19 0.705581 4 0.682470
7 Tennessee 877 612 235 30 0.714937 2 0.675809
8 Michigan 833 589 224 20 0.719088 3 0.672554
9 Nebraska 872 593 262 17 0.689794 5 0.672247
10 Penn State 837 583 236 18 0.707288 2 0.657484

[starclassic tama]

miami of ohio at 17? other than that, looks about right. i like crediting the title selection, giving alabama and USC their real total.

[OU_Sooners75]

miami of ohio at 17? other than that, looks about right. i like crediting the title selection, giving alabama and USC their real total.


Not sure if you know or not, but if OU credited themselves with each and every NC from all publications, We would have something like 23 National Championships.

Before the AP came about, the national championships were regional at best.

Kinda like how it is in High School Football nowadays. Just a bunch of biased regional publications giving out a National Championship.

[Crucifax Autumn]

Hell, From what I hear OU is gonna get the Posse MNC every year from now until eternity according to your poll so we can claim greatest ever x forever! lol

[My Opinion Matters]

I made a list similar to this for my own amusement about 5 years ago. I'm not sure what your methodology was, but I came up with almost the exact same result. The biggest surprise is Ohio State.

[SteelClip49]

I have my own reasonings based on what I have researched. I don't agree with teams claiming national titles prior to the Associated Press but if Bud Wilkinson were alive he would tell us otherwise (1934-35) ;)

Like you said, many selectors were of regional base and NOT a nationally recognized, accepted selector. Thankfully the AP and UPI put an end to that.

I like your setup and the fact you started from 1930.

Just out of curiousity, where is Minnesota and Ole Miss on that list? I know Ole Miss has no titles but they do have a decent winning percentage I would think. Minnesota has 4 AP national titles but I know they haven't done much since 1960. Just curious to where you would have both of those two.

Also, I noticed you list Michigan with 3 national titles. In 1947, there was an UN-official AP poll taken again and it favored Michigan over Notre Dame. Technically, Notre Dame is the AP Champion but Michigan won the second AP poll after the bowl games. I just wonder how much merit is their title worth considering it was conducted by the AP yet was UN-official.

[A-M]

I like how you did this. You reasoning makes good sense to me and the ratings look pretty good. Thanks for going to all the trouble to do this.

[Sabanball]

I have my own reasonings based on what I have researched. I don't agree with teams claiming national titles prior to the Associated Press but if Bud Wilkinson were alive he would tell us otherwise (1934-35) ;)

Like you said, many selectors were of regional base and NOT a nationally recognized, accepted selector. Thankfully the AP and UPI put an end to that.

I like your setup and the fact you started from 1930. Just out of curiousity, where is Minnesota and Ole Miss on that list? I know Ole Miss has no titles but they do have a decent winning percentage I would think. Minnesota has 4 AP national titles but I know they haven't done much since 1960. Just curious to where you would have both of those two.

Also, I noticed you list Michigan with 3 national titles. In 1947, there was an UN-official AP poll taken again and it favored Michigan over Notre Dame. Technically, Notre Dame is the AP Champion but Michigan won the second AP poll after the bowl games. I just wonder how much merit is their title worth considering it was conducted by the AP yet was UN-official.

Believe it or not, but college football was being played before 1930.

[sooner518]

Believe it or not, but college football was being played before 1930.

ok, so bow at the feet of your Princeton and Yale football overlords

[OSUAggie]

I didn't take the time to go through the formula, but it appears to be flawed ...

[Sabanball]

ok, so bow at the feet of your Princeton and Yale football overlords


Umm...actually, I was thinking more along the lines of Texas, Oklahoma, Alabama, Notre Dame....etc. And would you believe they even had bowl games back then??!;)

Seriously, I've long believed that if you start with the beginning of the modern era(1950), and only measure from that point, that OU has the best program in college football. But extend that back another generation or more and it is very debatable, to say the least......

[OU_Sooners75]

Umm...actually, I was thinking more along the lines of *Texas*, Oklahoma, Alabama, Notre Dame....etc. And would you believe they even had bowl games back then??!;)

Seriously, I've long believed that if you start with the beginning of the modern era(1950), and only measure from that point, that OU has the best program in college football. But extend that back another generation or more and it is very debatable, to say the least......


Would you believe me that before the 1957 or 1958 season, the NCAA did not allow teams to go to two consecutive bowl games?

And I went back 20 more years than 1950 (we can safely call that a generation) and the proof is in the pudding.

Since 1930, OU has the most wins of any program. They are second to Ohio State in winning percentage. They are tied for second behind Notre Dame when it comes to AP, UPI, & BCS Titles.

There is not much to debate.

[OU_Sooners75]

I didn't take the time to go through the formula, but it appears to be flawed ...


Nothing flawed about it. It is a very basic math (arithmetic) forumla with all teams judged by the same forumla.

[OU_Sooners75]

Just out of curiousity, where is Minnesota and Ole Miss on that list? I know Ole Miss has no titles but they do have a decent winning percentage I would think. Minnesota has 4 AP national titles but I know they haven't done much since 1960. Just curious to where you would have both of those two.

Also, I noticed you list Michigan with 3 national titles. In 1947, there was an UN-official AP poll taken again and it favored Michigan over Notre Dame. Technically, Notre Dame is the AP Champion but Michigan won the second AP poll after the bowl games. I just wonder how much merit is their title worth considering it was conducted by the AP yet was UN-official.

Minnesota has 4 AP titles, that is true, however since 1930 they have only won 51.247% of their games. I will be releasing the 107 schools that meet the criteria for what I did here. Just did not have the time to list all schools that meet the expectations that I had when I was doing this. I will let you know exactly where they ranke when I am finished.

Ole Miss is ranked #26 on that list.

As far as the 1947 debacle...I counted only AP titles that are recognized by the AP. The AP recognizes Notre Dame in 1947 thanks to the fact that back then, the National Championship was given out before the bowls were played.

Had it not, OU would have 8 national titles after they beat Maryland in the 1954 Orange Bowl (1953 season)

[OU_Sooners75]

****, you know what, I guess I should have done all eligible teams. Minnesota should be ranked #47.

[OU_Sooners75]

I completed all eligible teams, something I should have done before I released this.

Anyway...the top 50 is revised and is now correct.

Just click on the link in the original post to see the revised top 50.

For a complete list, click here. (http://www.olevetpossehideout.com/downloads/TopCFBPrograms1930.pdf)

[Sabanball]

Would you believe me that before the 1957 or 1958 season, the NCAA did not allow teams to go to two consecutive bowl games?

And I went back 20 more years than 1950 (we can safely call that a generation) and the proof is in the pudding.

Since 1930, OU has the most wins of any program. They are second to Ohio State in winning percentage. They are tied for second behind Notre Dame when it comes to AP, UPI, & BCS Titles.

There is not much to debate.


Fair enough. Your formula seems accurate. But I'm curious--Could you do a similar calculation going back to 1920, and how difficult would that be? There was a lot of ball played during that decade(particularly some very significant and historic bowl games) Why NOT factor in that time period? Is there a reason for excluding it? Not including the 1890's and the turn of the century I can understand...

[Sabanball]

Would you believe me that before the 1957 or 1958 season, the NCAA did not allow teams to go to two consecutive bowl games?
And I went back 20 more years than 1950 (we can safely call that a generation) and the proof is in the pudding.

Since 1930, OU has the most wins of any program. They are second to Ohio State in winning percentage. They are tied for second behind Notre Dame when it comes to AP, UPI, & BCS Titles.

There is not much to debate.

No. For example, we went to the Orange Bowl and the Cotton Bowl in 1953 and 1954, respectively, and we went to the Rose Bowl in '25 AND '26. As far as I know, those games were sanctioned by the NCAA.

Also, you guys played in the '49 and '50 Sugar Bowls,defeating North Carolina and LSU.

[OU_Sooners75]

Fair enough. Your formula seems accurate. But I'm curious--Could you do a similar calculation going back to 1920, and how difficult would that be? There was a lot of ball played during that decade(particularly some very significant and historic bowl games) Why NOT factor in that time period? Is there a reason for excluding it? Not including the 1890's and the turn of the century I can understand...


I probably can, it would not be an difficult fix. Especially since I would not be including any MNCs in that decade.

Reason is simple....

In the 20s, every single year there were multiple teams that won a national championship:

'20: Cal, Harvard, ND, Princeton
'21: Cal, Cornell, Iowa, Lafayette, William & Jefferson
'22: Cal, Cornell, Iowa, Princeton
'23: Cal, Illinois, Michigan (two from the same conference?)
'24: Notre Dame, Penn
'25: Alabama, Dartmouth
'26: Alabama, Lafayette, Navy, Stanford
'27: Georiga, Illinois, Notre Dame, Yale
'28: Detroit, Georgia Tech, USuCk
'29: Notre Dame, Pitt, USuCk

See why I think it is foolish for any program to add MNCs before the AP?

[OU_Sooners75]

No. For example, we went to the Orange Bowl and the Cotton Bowl in 1953 and 1954, respectively, and we went to the Rose Bowl in '25 AND '26. As far as I know, those games were sanctioned by the NCAA.

Also, you guys played in the '49 and '50 Sugar Bowls,defeating North Carolina and LSU.

I am sure there are exceptions to every rule. But it was not a regularity that a program would go to a bowl game two consecutive seasons. The main reason I have heard is because there was not that many of them back then.

[OU_Sooners75]

Since 1920 things look different....but it allows you, Sabanball, to claim legitimacy! :)

Rank Team
1 Alabama 0.751056
2 Notre Dame 0.747794
3 Southern Cal 0.740387
4 Oklahoma 0.734067
5 Ohio State 0.718981
6 Texas 0.716902
7 Tennessee 0.712505
8 Michigan 0.703700
9 Nebraska 0.701286
10 Penn State 0.677477

[Fraggle145]

All I know is I count 1949. Bud counted it.. .Check the read posted by The VII in his interview with Loren Smith? He said in 1949 when we wont a nat'l title. If bud counts it I count it.

[OU_Sooners75]

Fraggle, I do not see why we dont.

OU had more of a claim to it than ND or anyone else that season.

11-0 >>>> >>>> 10-0

[CrimsonJim]

Yeah, and let's take back the 1953 title while we're at it. I mean, we beat the Terrapins in the Orange Bowl, didn't we!!? Oh wait..........they did the final voting before the bowl games back then. Ok, deeeep breath. Let's stop this madness before we start sounding like Bammer. :eek:

[Salt City Sooner]

Minnesota has 4 AP titles, that is true, however since 1930 they have only won 51.247% of their games. I will be releasing the 107 schools that meet the criteria for what I did here. Just did not have the time to list all schools that meet the expectations that I had when I was doing this. I will let you know exactly where they ranke when I am finished.

Ole Miss is ranked #26 on that list.

As far as the 1947 debacle...I counted only AP titles that are recognized by the AP. The AP recognizes Notre Dame in 1947 thanks to the fact that back then, the National Championship was given out before the bowls were played.

Had it not, OU would have 8 national titles after they beat Maryland in the 1954 Orange Bowl (1953 season)
Unless I'm missing something, using that formula we'd still have 7 as Kentucky beat us in the '51 Sugar Bowl.

[Sabanball]

Since 1920 things look different....but it allows you, Sabanball, to claim legitimacy! :)

Rank Team
1 Alabama 0.751056
2 Notre Dame 0.747794
3 Southern Cal 0.740387
4 Oklahoma 0.734067
5 Ohio State 0.718981
6 *Texas* 0.716902
7 Tennessee 0.712505
8 Michigan 0.703700
9 Nebraska 0.701286
10 Penn State 0.677477


Wow...I really thought factoring in the roaring '20's that Notre Dame would be on top. I'm a little surprised...Thanks for crunching the numbers.

Anyways, it's all good. I still think when it comes to all-around tradition, you simply cannot do better than our two programs. Notre Dame can make a case, but really no one else can.

[OU_Sooners75]

Wow...I really thought factoring in the roaring '20's that Notre Dame would be on top. I'm a little surprised...Thanks for crunching the numbers.

Anyways, it's all good. I still think when it comes to all-around tradition, you simply cannot do better than our two programs. Notre Dame can make a case, but really no one else can.


Notre Dame has not been relevant to the CFB world for about 30 years now.

Their claim to fame stems from religion really. Think about it. How long ago was this country all religious? Which was the largest religion in this country at that time?

See the connection to their success?