...You might be a right-wing extremist...

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Should you have a Ron Paul, Bob Barr or a Chuck Bladwin bumper sticker - You might be a right-wing extremist.

Should be be returning overseas military person...

Should you be a gun owner...

Should you be a racist or member of a hate organization...


You might be a threat to the gubment (http://images.logicsix.com/DHS_RWE.pdf) and Janet Napolitano is watching you...

[XFollower]

...You might be a right-wing extremist...

You are pro-life
You are republican
You are a follower of Christ
You are opposed to same sex marriage
You drive a car that you don't have to plug-in
You think "green" is just a color
You aren't in a state of panic that the planet is falling apart
You don't think Obama's poo smells like roses

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Many local folks rejoiced when our own "Dammit" Janet finally left AZ, and made the big leap eastward to become an Obamamama, and took her amnesty act to Washington. Unfortunately, she's now a Bigger Brother than ever.

[soonerscuba]

...You might be a right-wing extremist...

You are pro-life
You are republican
You are a follower of Christ
You are opposed to same sex marriage
You drive a car that you don't have to plug-in
You think "green" is just a color
You aren't in a state of panic that the planet is falling apart
You don't think Obama's poo smells like rosesHeh. Owasso.

[StoopTroup]

...if you use Rush Limbaugh's name as your on-line moniker and the greatest day of your life was the day you got to suck Rush's golden EIB microphone.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I don't recall the Bush gov't. publishing a report detailing "un-American" activities of the MSM, college professors, ACORN, Green Peacers, Democrats, control control lobby, etc...

[OU4LIFE]

A lot of people like to label Ron Paul, I contend that he'd have been a better choice than 95% of people we've trotted out there.

[Frozen Sooner]

Should you have a Ron Paul, Bob Barr or a Chuck Bladwin bumper sticker - You might be a right-wing extremist.

Should be be returning overseas military person...

Should you be a gun owner...

Should you be a racist or member of a hate organization...


You might be a threat to the gubment (http://images.logicsix.com/DHS_RWE.pdf) and Janet Napolitano is watching you...

...if you're unable to distinguish between the statements "radical rightwing movements find returning overseas military veterans attractive due to their combat skills" and "overseas military veterans are right-wing extremists."

[tommieharris91]

...You might be a right-wing extremist...

You are pro-life
You are republican
You are a follower of Christ
You are opposed to same sex marriage
You drive a car that you don't have to plug-in
You think "green" is just a color
You aren't in a state of panic that the planet is falling apart
You don't think Obama's poo smells like roses

Libertarian =/= Republican
Generally, any extremist thinks the planet is falling apart.
A lot of people still drive cars they don't have to plug in.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

...if you're unable to distinguish between the statements "radical rightwing movements find returning overseas military veterans attractive due to their combat skills" and "overseas military veterans are right-wing extremists."

Still the point is...(after your small clarification that doesn't change the meaning)

The left wing extremist/progressivists are labeling a bunch of people who are no possible threat as un-American and anarchists because they may philisophically oppose the direction the country is heading or the amount of debt the governtment is taking on.

[SicEmBaylor]

Should you have a Ron Paul, Bob Barr or a Chuck Bladwin bumper sticker - You might be a right-wing extremist.

Should be be returning overseas military person...

Should you be a gun owner...

Should you be a racist or member of a hate organization...


You might be a threat to the gubment (http://images.logicsix.com/DHS_RWE.pdf) and Janet Napolitano is watching you...


Holy crap, I meet 4 of those 5 criteria.

[sooner n houston]

...if you're unable to distinguish between the statements "radical rightwing movements find returning overseas military veterans attractive due to their combat skills" and "overseas military veterans are right-wing extremists."


How about

"The possible passage of new restrictions on firearms and the return of military veterans facing significant challenges reintegrating into their communities could lead to the potential emergence of terrorist groups or lone wolf extremest capable of carrying out violent attacks." (page 3).

Can you imagine the uproar if they used Blacks or Hispanics instead of Veterans?

But continue to deny away! :D

[TUSooner]

I may be a dunce, but THIS ONE I got right:


This message is hidden because RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone! is on your ignore list.

[soonerscuba]

This is stupid, it's not like America has dealt with domestic right-wing terrorism in the past during Democratic administration.

[Frozen Sooner]

Still the point is...(after your small clarification that doesn't change the meaning)

The left wing extremist/progressivists are labeling a bunch of people who are no possible threat as un-American and anarchists because they may philisophically oppose the direction the country is heading or the amount of debt the governtment is taking on.

Yeah, actually those two phrases are completely different.

And if you think that hate groups and militia groups pose no possible threat, there's some people in downtown Oklahoma City who probably disagree with that.

[Frozen Sooner]

How about

"The possible passage of new restrictions on firearms and the return of military veterans facing significant challenges reintegrating into their communities could lead to the potential emergence of terrorist groups or lone wolf extremest capable of carrying out violent attacks." (page 3).

Can you imagine the uproar if they used Blacks or Hispanics instead of Veterans?

But continue to deny away! :D

And again, that is a significantly different statement than "Military veterans are right-wing extremists."

But continue to twist words away!

[OklahomaTuba]

Many rightwing extremists are antagonistic toward the new presidential administration and its perceived stance on a range of issues, including immigration and citizenship, the expansion of social programs to minorities, and restrictions on firearms ownership and use.

Wow, I never knew so many people were considered right-wing extremists!!!!

Better start shutting down the talk radio ASAP and getting rid of all that racist anti-Obama propaganda attached to people's cars and such!!!!

[OklahomaTuba]

Does the report go on to chronicle how Rightwing Extremists™ (also known as "The Enemy") are known to bitterly cling to their guns and religion?

[OU4LIFE]

Libertarian =/= Republican
Generally, any extremist thinks the planet is falling apart.
A lot of people still drive cars they don't have to plug in.

Not me, I'm plugged. Switched on..I'm a bit of all right, yeah! [/Austin Powers]

[JohnnyMack]

...You might be a right-wing extremist...

You are pro-life YES
You are republican NO
You are a follower of Christ NO
You are opposed to same sex marriage NO
You drive a car that you don't have to plug-in YES
You think "green" is just a color YES
You aren't in a state of panic that the planet is falling apart YES
You don't think Obama's poo smells like roses YES

What does that make me?

[C&CDean]

What does that make me?

A fag?

[JohnnyMack]

A fag?

Meh.

[Vaevictis]

Still the point is...(after your small clarification that doesn't change the meaning)

No, actually read what it says:


(U//FOUO) Returning veterans possess combat skills and experience that are attractive to rightwing extremists. DHS/I&A is concerned that rightwing extremists will attempt to recruit and radicalize returning veterans in order to boost their violent capabilities.

Given that you're an Okie, I'd think you could name two people off the top of your head that fit this profile.

Of course people interested in being ready to engage in violence are going to try to recruit from the pool of veterans. It's just common sense. Law enforcement does it, security firms do it, mercenary groups do it, Islamic terrorists do it, what makes you think American terrorists won't?

[Vaevictis]

I don't recall the Bush gov't. publishing a report detailing "un-American" activities of the MSM, college professors, ACORN, Green Peacers, Democrats, control control lobby, etc...

Left-Wing Extremism: The Current Threat. Published April 2001.

http://www.osti.gov/bridge/servlets/purl/780410-SHVVvq/native/780410.PDF

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Yeah, actually those two phrases are completely different.

And if you think that hate groups and militia groups pose no possible threat, there's some people in downtown Oklahoma City who probably disagree with that.

Never said that - but commissioning a report that lumps the people they lump together in with hate groups, that is painting with an extremely broad brush.

Get my point - or don't. We could nitpick and parse everything each other says ad infinitum.

The point is that the Progressivists are trying to take over even more so than they have already - just as Woodrow Wilson (elitist Princeton President) and U.S. President did in 1912 by imposing the income tax, FDR did with the New Deal, Johnson did with the Great Society. In fact there hasn't been a Constitutionalist in office since before Wilson. They (Obama) will be hell bent to paint those who disagree in bad light...

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Left-Wing Extremism: The Current Threat. Published April 2001.

http://www.osti.gov/bridge/servlets/purl/780410-SHVVvq/native/780410.PDF

Good research, but I noted specific references to groups (some within the U.S. and most outside) and published statements or goals.

I don't see a list of "perceived" and broad loose associations to paint people with as was recently published.

[Fraggle145]

Heh. Owasso.

Story of my life :rolleyes:

[SoonerStormchaser]

Should be be returning overseas military person...



Well, that'll be me around Labor Day...look out everyone.

[Vaevictis]

Good research, but I noted specific references to groups (some within the U.S. and most outside) and published statements or goals.

The report I linked is comparable to the report you linked. Each discusses terrorist activities on one of the ends of the political spectrum.

As far as your interpretation of the right-wing report being overly broad and painting everyone and his mother as an extremist, I just don't see it. In fact, it reminds me a lot of a guy I used to know who used to claim that everything bad that happened to him was due to whitey keeping him down.

If you read the right-wing report with reasonable amount of indifference, you'll find that it's pretty neutral. I imagine that if you go pull some files from the 70's about leftist terrorist groups, they'll read much the same.

[SicEmBaylor]

I think I'm feeling a case of Reno reflux coming on.

It's amazing to me how right-wing extremists suddenly pose a major security issue whenever a Democratic President is in office.

I'm highly highly disappointed in Napolitano and, by extension, the Obama administration. Someone sign me up for the pitchfork and torch brigade.

[Vaevictis]

Of course, I guess I shouldn't be terribly surprised that many conservatives read the report as a broad assault on all conservatives, given how many times I've heard conservatives take the actions of a few Muslims and use that as a launching pad to attack the entire religion.

[Vaevictis]

It's amazing to me how right-wing extremists suddenly pose a major security issue whenever a Democratic President is in office.

Do you think that right-wing extremists are more likely to be active during a Republican (especially the last Republican) or Democratic administration?

[SicEmBaylor]

Of course, I guess I shouldn't be terribly surprised that many conservatives read the report as a broad assault on all conservatives, given how many times I've heard conservatives take the actions of a few Muslims and use that as a launching pad to attack the entire religion.

I don't take it as a broad attack on all conservatives. The problem is, I happen to truly be a right-wing extremist.

[SicEmBaylor]

Do you think that right-wing extremists are more likely to be active during a Republican (especially the last Republican) or Democratic administration?

I think if you truly understood how they think then you'd know it doesn't matter.

[Vaevictis]

I think if you truly understood how they think then you'd know it doesn't matter.

It depends on just how extreme we're talking. Yes, there are some who are going to be active all of the time. But there are others who aren't going to be properly stimulated when a Republican is in office.

The first group has an easier time getting things going when the second group is easier to recruit.

Iraq is a pretty simple case study in this regard. Do you think all of the people who fought us from 2003-Present in Iraq were fighting us in 2001-2003? No -- it took an appropriate stimulus to bring a lot of them on board, be it opportunity, poverty, xenophobia, our political missteps, etc.

Same thing is going to happen here. You'll find that a lot of the right-wing groups will start revving up, and a lot of the left-wing groups will start winding down simply because the political environment will provoke a different set of people.

[Frozen Sooner]

Should you be a racist or member of a hate organization...


You might be a threat to the gubment (http://images.logicsix.com/DHS_RWE.pdf) and Janet Napolitano is watching you...



The left wing extremist/progressivists are labeling a bunch of people who are no possible threat as un-American and anarchists because they may philisophically oppose the direction the country is heading or the amount of debt the governtment is taking on.



And if you think that hate groups and militia groups pose no possible threat, there's some people in downtown Oklahoma City who probably disagree with that.


Never said that

Hmmm.

[soonerscuba]

I don't take it as a broad attack on all conservatives. The problem is, I happen to truly be a right-wing extremist.I have a very hard time believing you are a McVeigh apologist.

[Frozen Sooner]

Anyhow, turning aside from what seems to have just been an unfortunate implication and not the meaning of what THA was saying:

The fairly obvious intent of the report was to identify groups from which right-wing extremists would likely recruit, not to claim that those groups were exclusively comprised of (or even comprised to a great extent of) extremists.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Who gives a **** if Department of Homeland Security is passing memo's about POSSIBLE threats...last time I checked, this is their job. They are not called the Department of Homeland Avoid Hurting People's Sensitivities. I wouldn't have a problem if they published a Memo saying to be aware of Amish revolts..now would it be a waste of time...oh yes but I wouldn't get worked up about it

[JohnnyMack]

Who gives a **** if Department of Homeland Security is passing memo's about POSSIBLE threats...last time I checked, this is their job. They are not called the Department of Homeland Avoid Hurting People's Sensitivities. I wouldn't have a problem if they published a Memo saying to be aware of Amish revolts..now would it be a waste of time...oh yes but I wouldn't get worked up about it

But....but....but that's why people click on drudgereport or listen to Hannity. They need worst case scenarios dropped on their heads. They can't think for themselves.

[SicEmBaylor]

I have a very hard time believing you are a McVeigh apologist.

Eh, that's a can of worms I don't want to open. I'll say this, there is absolutely NOTHING to justify his actions of killing innocent men, women, and children.

[C&CDean]

I have a very hard time believing you are a McVeigh apologist.

I'm right wing. Pretty dang far over there too by most accounts.

I don't consider McVeigh to be right wing at all. Nor do I consider him to be a lefty. I consider him to be a ****ing crazy murderous coward who is playing cards right now at the Styx River Casino with John Wayne Gacy and Adolph Hitler.

[mdklatt]

You can't have freedom without security.
If you're not doing anything wrong you don't have anything to hide.
Questioning the administration is a show of weakness to our enemies.
WE'RE AT WAR!!!111!


Did I leave anything out?

[C&CDean]

Out of what?

[mdklatt]

Out of what?

The standard list of excuses from the right when the Bush administration pulled this crap.

[NYC Poke]

I'm right wing. Pretty dang far over there too by most accounts.

I don't consider McVeigh to be right wing at all. Nor do I consider him to be a lefty. I consider him to be a ****ing crazy murderous coward who is playing cards right now at the Styx River Casino with John Wayne Gacy and Adolph Hitler.


And they're all losing.

[C&CDean]

The standard list of excuses from the right when the Bush administration pulled this crap.

Yeah, except that the only one on your list that is halfway going on right now is the "questioning the prez shows weakness." And that ones a stretch at best. Nobody questioned him giving the order to pop those pirates. Other than waiting 4 ****ing days to attempt to "diplomatically solve this problem." People were questioning Bush's Iraq/Afghanistan dealio. Now that Obama's in there and doing exactly more of the same, it's all groovy. Kinda funny, idn't it?

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

I am actually more pissed that this stuff gets leaked or released, seriously I don't want them to know we are watching out for them. This would be like Bob Stoops telling the opposing team what play we are about to run.

[LosAngelesSooner]

How about

"The possible passage of new restrictions on firearms and the return of military veterans facing significant challenges reintegrating into their communities could lead to the potential emergence of terrorist groups or lone wolf extremest capable of carrying out violent attacks." (page 3).

Can you imagine the uproar if they used Blacks or Hispanics instead of Veterans?

But continue to deny away! :D
You're right. Returning military veterans always integrate will into society and never have any emotional issues or ever consider throwing their loyalties away to join any form of extremist domestic terrorist group.

http://www.jaynadavis.com/images/image060.jpg

To even insinuate otherwise is un-patriotic, socialistic, unrealistic, insulting and ridonkulous. :rolleyes:















P.S. - As a disclaimer, the report doesn't say that ALL returning vets do, nor am I implying it. But to deny that it ever happens, or to suggest that even mentioning it is somehow offensive or that these groups wouldn't love to get their hands on a few disgruntled soldiers with our military's training behind them is just putting your head into the sand regarding the way of the world.

[C&CDean]

You know what's funny? The scoreboard on terrorism worldwide currently reads:

Islamic whack jobs - 19,427
Irish whack jobs - 37
Returning American veteran/s - 1

I'm not sure why people continue to play the McVeigh card in this game.

[SicEmBaylor]

You know what's funny? The scoreboard on terrorism worldwide currently reads:

Islamic whack jobs - 19,427
Irish whack jobs - 37
Returning American veteran/s - 1

I'm not sure why people continue to play the McVeigh card in this game.

Not to mention left-wing domestic terrorists. The right has McVeigh, but the left has produced terrorists for more than 40 years within several terrorist organizations.

[LosAngelesSooner]

You know what's funny? The scoreboard on terrorism worldwide currently reads:

Islamic whack jobs - 19,427
Irish whack jobs - 37
Returning American veteran/s - 1

I'm not sure why people continue to play the McVeigh card in this game.1?

Rrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeaaaaaallllllyyyy?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/traumatised-veterans-have-killed-120-in-us-769904.html


The New York Times found 121 cases in which veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan committed a killing in this country, or were charged with one, after their return from war. In many of those cases, combat trauma and the stress of deployment — along with alcohol abuse, family discord and other attendant problems — appear to have set the stage for a tragedy that was part destruction, part self-destruction. Three-quarters of these veterans were still in the military at the time of the killing. More than half the killings involved guns, and the rest were stabbings, beatings, strangulations and bathtub drownings. Twenty-five offenders faced murder, manslaughter or homicide charges for fatal car crashes resulting from drunken, reckless or suicidal driving.

About a third of the victims were spouses, girlfriends, children or other relatives, among them 2-year-old Krisiauna Calaira Lewis, whose 20-year-old father slammed her against a wall when he was recuperating in Texas from a bombing near Falluja that blew off his foot and shook up his brain.And, for perspective and to keep things fair and balanced:


As sad and shocking as 121 incidents sounds, though, that’s not a high number when you’re talking about well over a million veterans of a five-year-old conflict. As Phillip Carter (http://www.intel-dump.com/posts/1200240519.shtml), one of the lucky Iraq War veterans who has managed to lead a crime-free existence since his return to civilian life, points out,
The article makes no attempt to produce a statistically valid comparison of homicide rates among vets to rates among the general population. Nor does it rely at all on Pentagon data about post-deployment incidents of violence among veterans. It basically just generalizes from this small sample (121 out of 1.7 million Iraq and Afghanistan vets, not including civilians and contractors) to conclude that today’s generation of veterans are coming home full of rage and ready to kill.My only point is that "1" is not only the loneliest number in your post, it's the most inaccurate.

Shoot...just using the OKC bombing alone DOUBLES your number of U.S. Veterans who took the crazy turnpike to terrorist town.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/09/Nichols2.jpg/200px-Nichols2.jpg

In 1988 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988), Nichols enlisted in the U.S. Army (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army) and was sent to Fort Benning (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Benning) in Georgia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_%28U.S._state%29) to receive his basic training. It was during his training at Fort Benning that he met Timothy McVeigh. The two were later stationed together at Fort Riley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Riley) in Kansas (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas).

[Frozen Sooner]

Not to mention left-wing domestic terrorists. The right has McVeigh, but the left has produced terrorists for more than 40 years within several terrorist organizations.

As has the right. For every Black Panther or SLA there's ten KKKs or Aryan Brotherhoods.

By no means do I consider the KKK or Aryan Brotherhood to be representative of the typical right-winger, nor do I consider the Panthers representative of the typical left-winger, by the way. That's just the side of the political spectrum they tend to identify with.

And yes, I'm aware that Senator Byrd was a member of the KKK half a century ago.

[SicEmBaylor]

As has the right. For every Black Panther or SLA there's ten KKKs or Aryan Brotherhoods.

By no means do I consider the KKK or Aryan Brotherhood to be representative of the typical right-winger, nor do I consider the Panthers representative of the typical left-winger, by the way. That's just the side of the political spectrum they tend to identify with.

And yes, I'm aware that Senator Byrd was a member of the KKK half a century ago.

You won't hear me bash Byrd. I love that slobbering constitution wielding geriatric fool. Seriously, I really do like the guy. :D

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Byrd was only in the Klan for the sweet outfits...what self respecting liberal can avoid costume parties...they are FANTASTIC!!

[JohnnyMack]

You won't hear me bash Byrd. I love that slobbering constitution wielding geriatric fool. Seriously, I really do like the guy. :D

You could rape puppies and kill elderly women with a scythe but as long as you defend the constitution you're ok in SicEm's book. ;)

[Vaevictis]

I'm not sure why people continue to play the McVeigh card in this game.

Because some people are acting like it's absurd to think that an American military vet would be recruited by right-wing whack-jobs to do the unthinkable.

I'll be the first to acknowledge that it's an unusual event, but pretending that it's unprecedented and therefore doesn't deserve to be on the radar is just foolish.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Seriously, The Constitution does not cover beastiality or Murder anywhere that I read ;)

[NYC Poke]

And yes, I'm aware that Senator Byrd was a member of the KKK half a century ago.


So was former Supreme Court Justice Hugo Black. And you know what they say: Once Hugo Black . . .

[Vaevictis]

So was former Supreme Court Justice Hugo Black. And you know what they say: Once Hugo Black . . .

Die in a fire.

[Frozen Sooner]

So was former Supreme Court Justice Hugo Black. And you know what they say: Once Hugo Black . . .

(Ahem)

That's University of Alabama School of Law Alumnus Hugo Black to you. ;)

One of the stranger things I saw on my tour of the law school was Justice Black's Ouija board in the library. No kidding.

And yeah, that pun was TERRIBLE.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Harry Truman also paid the 10$ membership fee ;)

[Jerk]

What's new, here? I'm sure I'm on somebody's sh*t list.

And what is the deal with Democrat Presidents and bull-dyke attorney generals?

[Vaevictis]

And what is the deal with Democrat Presidents and bull-dyke attorney generals?

Sticking it to right-wing extremists is the #1 priority, and we all know that a bull-dyke AG will give them Janet Reno flash backs and send them into apoplectic fits.

It's a petty amusement, but enjoyable none the less.

[NYC Poke]

Eric Holder is a lesbian? The moustache should have tipped me off.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

What's new, here? I'm sure I'm on somebody's sh*t list.

And what is the deal with Democrat Presidents and bull-dyke attorney generals?Janet was itching to get outa Arizona for quite a while, and her ship arrived. I would be pleased she's gone, but she's now menacing the whole nation instead of just one Western state.

[NYC Poke]

Janet was itching to get outa Arizona for quite a while, and her ship arrived. I would be pleased she's gone, but she's now menacing the whole nation instead of just one Western state.

Janet Reno was from Florida.

[Frozen Sooner]

He means Neapolitano.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

It's like a hurricane of Misinformation right now

[NYC Poke]

He means Neapolitano.

Oh. I thought we were still talking about bull-dyke attorneys general.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Janet Reno was from Florida.wisdom from a sheep humpin' lib attorney.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Are you arguing Reno isn't from Florida? That isn't um "wisdom", it is what we call a FACT

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Sticking it to right-wing extremists is the #1 priority, and we all know that a bull-dyke AG will give them Janet Reno flash backs and send them into apoplectic fits.

It's a petty amusement, but enjoyable none the less.So, ya going to the nearest Tea Party tomorrow?

[sooner_born_1960]

Janet Jackson was from Indiana.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Marylin Chambers was raised in Connecticut

[sooner_born_1960]

At least I kept with the Janet theme.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Oh I thought, we were talking about sexy *** women, because Janet Reno...wow!!

[sooner_born_1960]

I understand your confusion.

[Fraggle145]

I was raised in Owasso.

[SicEmBaylor]

I was born in Florida.

[Frozen Sooner]

Hey, has anyone pointed out yet that this report was comissioned under the Bush DHS? And that a similar report also comissioned under the Bush DHS except warning about left-wing extremists was released this January?

[Curly Bill]

And what is the deal with Democrat Presidents and bull-dyke attorney generals?

Someone in the administration has to wear the pants. ;)

[olevetonahill]

Hey, has anyone pointed out yet that this report was comissioned under the Bush DHS? And that a similar report also comissioned under the Bush DHS except warning about left-wing extremists was released this January?

Dont confuse em with Facts
Baffle em with Bullshat ;)

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Hey, has anyone pointed out yet that this report was comissioned under the Bush DHS? And that a similar report also comissioned under the Bush DHS except warning about left-wing extremists was released this January?


Typical Left Wing Wisdom!!!

[def_lazer_fc]

And what is the deal with Democrat Presidents and bull-dyke attorney generals?

not sure really but its kinda the same thing as women in republican admins that desperately need to get laid this decade.

[My Opinion Matters]

Heh. Owasso.

I haven't read through the other 5 pages of this crap, but this gets a big :confused: from me.

[C&CDean]

I haven't read through the other 5 pages of this crap, but this gets a big :confused: from me.

Atheists. Bitching about Jesustown Owasso. I'm just guessing here.

[My Opinion Matters]

Atheists. Bitching about Jesustown Owasso. I'm just guessing here.

Thanks, Dean. Anyone that labels Owasso as Jesustown obviously hasn't been here in about 10 years. The only things we worship here are the new Target, JCPenney, and Olive Garden, thank you very much.

[TUSooner]

Who gives a **** if Department of Homeland Security is passing memo's about POSSIBLE threats...last time I checked, this is their job. They are not called the Department of Homeland Avoid Hurting People's Sensitivities. I wouldn't have a problem if they published a Memo saying to be aware of Amish revolts..now would it be a waste of time...oh yes but I wouldn't get worked up about it

Best post in the whole silly thread, which should now be locked.

[47straight]

Hey, has anyone pointed out yet that this report was comissioned under the Bush DHS? And that a similar report also comissioned under the Bush DHS except warning about left-wing extremists was released this January?

Not in this thread, but at the time the anti-bushers on this board sure had a bitchfest about the gubmint monitoring leftist groups.

[Frozen Sooner]

Not in this thread, but at the time the anti-bushers on this board sure had a bitchfest about the gubmint monitoring leftist groups.

So basically nobody likes the government monitoring anyone? I actually don't recall the thread you're referring to (which certainly doesn't mean it doesn't exist-I'm up to my ears in Aspen's Examples & Explanations series right now and most everything else is just falling out of my ears.)

[1890MilesToNorman]

You might be stupid if you ain't a right wing extremist!

Constitution, small government and taking care of yourself are all good things!!

[Frozen Sooner]

You might be stupid if you ain't a right wing extremist!

Constitution, small government and taking care of yourself are all good things!!


You might be stupid if you think that's all there is to right-wing extremism.

[1890MilesToNorman]

They call me extreme and that's what I believe in so take yer best shots boy!!! :P

[Okla-homey]

Well, that'll be me around Labor Day...look out everyone.

Not really...unless you end up shooting some folks while deployed.

[Frozen Sooner]

They call me extreme and that's what I believe in so take yer best shots boy!!! :P

OK, son.

Do you believe in violent overthrow of the US Government as currently constituted?

Do you believe in an inevitable race war?

Do you subscribe to the sovereign citizen nonsense?

Do you refuse to get a driver license because it's another way the trilateral commission tracks you?

'Cause those are some views of actual right wing extremists.

[Okla-homey]

Look folks, this sort of thing was to be expected. We pilloried anti-GWOT types and/or folks who were'nt down with W as unpatriotic or worse. Nowadays, folks who aren't down with O or all this government growth cammied up as "economic stimulation" are being similarly tarred. It's the way we do politics in America. IOW: "my way or the highway."

[Frozen Sooner]

Look folks, this sort of thing was to be expected. We pilloried anti-GWOT types and/or folks who were'nt down with W as unpatriotic or worse. Nowadays, folks who aren't down with O or all this government growth cammied up as "economic stimulation" are being similarly tarred. It's the way we do politics in America. IOW: "my way or the highway."


Hey, has anyone pointed out yet that this report was comissioned under the Bush DHS? And that a similar report also comissioned under the Bush DHS except warning about left-wing extremists was released this January?

?:)

[LosAngelesSooner]

I just like how upset and generally worked into a froth people are getting over rhetoric and propaganda despite the facts, that are clearly contrary to what they are being told, staring them in the face.

[jdsooner]

It would seem that Oklahomans should understand the severity of what right-wing terrorists can do better than anyone. After the Murrah bombing, this is not a funny topic.

[SicEmBaylor]

There are a hell of a lot of things that I would like to say in this thread, but for once I'm going to be prudent and keep my mouth shut.

Suffice it to say, there's a blurry line between patriot and extremist.

[soonerspiff]

There are a hell of a lot of things that I would like to say in this thread, but for once I'm going to be prudent and keep my mouth shut.

Suffice it to say, there's a blurry line between patriot and extremist.

Really?

I completely disagree. So please continue.

:pop:

[SicEmBaylor]

Really?

I completely disagree. So please continue.

:pop:

I disagree with your disagreement.

Continuance concluded.

[Crucifax Autumn]

I agree with you huys disagreeing and think wingnuts on both sides oughtta get their shatner together and mellow out!

[soonerspiff]

I disagree with your disagreement.

Continuance concluded.


pa⋅tri⋅ot   [pey-tree-uht, -ot or, especially Brit., pa-tree-uht] Show IPA
–noun
1. a person who loves, supports, and defends his or her country and its interests with devotion.
2. a person who regards himself or herself as a defender, esp. of individual rights, against presumed interference by the federal government.
3. (initial capital letter) Military. a U.S. Army antiaircraft missile with a range of 37 mi. (60 km) and a 200-lb. (90 kg) warhead, launched from a tracked vehicle with radar and computer guidance and fire control.

ex⋅trem⋅ist   [ik-stree-mist] Show IPA
–noun
1. a person who goes to extremes, esp. in political matters.
2. a supporter or advocate of extreme doctrines or practices.


so therefore I'd conclude a "political right-wing extremist" is one that takes extremely right-wing ideas to the EXTREME...


ex⋅treme   [ik-streem] Show IPA adjective, -trem⋅er, -trem⋅est, noun
–adjective
1. of a character or kind farthest removed from the ordinary or average: extreme measures.


No one said last year that those claiming themselves to be a patriot JUST because they were willing to not question any Bush doctrine were right-wing extremists. Right-Wing Extremists are the very extreme extreme fringe of that political side. So unless you desire to literally overthrow or somehow be extremely subversive through illegal means to todays government, you are not included in this group.

Being a patriot has nothing to do with subversiveness... obviously. Anarchy and being patriotic are clearly different concepts.

I really thought you were smarter than this sicem. :mad:

[LosAngelesSooner]

What about a person who is EXTREMELY patriotic?

;)

[Crucifax Autumn]

I guess my suggestion wasn't taken seriously! lol

[sooner_born_1960]

It seems that most of think being extremely something is a bad thing. I don't feel that is necessarily the case.

[SoonerProphet]

2. a person who regards himself or herself as a defender, esp. of individual rights, against presumed interference by the federal government.

1. a person who goes to extremes, esp. in political matters.



so therefore I'd conclude a "political right-wing extremist" is one that takes extremely right-wing ideas to the EXTREME...


ex⋅treme   [ik-streem] Show IPA adjective, -trem⋅er, -trem⋅est, noun
–adjective


Being a patriot has nothing to do with subversiveness... obviously. Anarchy and being patriotic are clearly different concepts.

I really thought you were smarter than this sicem. :mad:

Seems pretty clear to me. Were Washington, Paine, etc...patriots or subversives. The monarchist considered them subversives...rebels even. How does anarchy enter into the equations? By your own set of defintions one can be a patriot and against the interfence of a powerful central government. Sicem may be a Zima drinking fruit, but he is a sharp zima drinking fruit.

[theresonly1OU]

Here's a concept: Right wing extremists are going to call their terroristic acts "patriotic" because, in their warped mind, that is what they believe they are.

Just like Bill Ayers, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers) noted left-wing terrorist and founder of the Weather Underground, who were responsible for bombings on the NYPD and the Pentagon to name a few, felt his actions were righteous and defensible, when in fact they were pathetically warped and in no way reflect on the true meaning of patriotism.

To infer that "this is what happens when patriotism gets out of hand" is disingenuous. When you get down to it, some people are just plain fu**ing crazy.

[OklahomaTuba]

Nice.
http://i44.tinypic.com/rjhb80.jpg

[47straight]

So basically nobody likes the government monitoring anyone? I actually don't recall the thread you're referring to (which certainly doesn't mean it doesn't exist-I'm up to my ears in Aspen's Examples & Explanations series right now and most everything else is just falling out of my ears.)

I'm fine with it when it's done appropriately.

[OklahomaTuba]

Just like Bill Ayers, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Ayers) noted left-wing terrorist and founder of the Weather Underground, who were responsible for bombings on the NYPD and the Pentagon to name a few..

Must be another one of those dangerous veterans or Christians??

[Pricetag]

I am actually more pissed that this stuff gets leaked or released, seriously I don't want them to know we are watching out for them. This would be like Bob Stoops telling the opposing team what play we are about to run.
Unless he did it and was like, "Stop THIS, mofos." That would be pretty sweet. As long as it wasn't a jumbo, I-formation dive from the one.

[Scott D]

Tuba fails at resizing images he hotlinks.

[tommieharris91]

Nice.
<giant *** pic>

Stop stretchin mah pages!!!

[OklahomaTuba]

heh.

[NYC Poke]

DHS Warns Of Rise in Right-Wing Extremism

The Department of Homeland Security warned law enforcement officials that the recession, the disenfranchisement of returning veterans, and the election of a black president could lead to an increase in recruitment by white supremacist and violent antigovernment groups. What do you think?

http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/wdyt_photo1.article.jpg
Bob Sandor,
Electrician

"Is that so? Well, let’s see what these extremists can do after we’ve bombed their cities to rubble."

http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/wdyt_photo3.article.jpg
Jason Bargiel,
Salvage Expert

“I think the reason has more to do with the earth's natural 10-year cycle of crazy than any other factor.”

http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/wdyt_photo4.article.jpg
Marla Prynoski,
Tax Consultant

“You ask a lot of questions. Get off my property.”

http://www.theonion.com/content/amvo/dhs_warns_of_rise_in_right_wing

[KC//CRIMSON]

Tuba fails at resizing images he hotlinks.


Tuba fails at most things. This wouldn't be the first or last.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Did anyone else send a virtual tea bag to their local congressman? That is what RNC Chairman Steele told me to do!!

[SicEmBaylor]

Seems pretty clear to me. Were Washington, Paine, etc...patriots or subversives. The monarchist considered them subversives...rebels even. How does anarchy enter into the equations? By your own set of defintions one can be a patriot and against the interfence of a powerful central government. Sicem may be a Zima drinking fruit, but he is a sharp zima drinking fruit.

You have it exactly right. At what point does the government's actions become so egregious that individual citizen action becomes justified? The men we call Patriots did some things that today we would claim to never be justified -- in some cases their actions were so abhorrent that most Americans would consider them down right barbaric. And yet...they did what they had to do in defense of INDIVIDUAL liberty.

There most certainly is a blurry line between Patriot and extremist/terrorist and anyone who doesn't know or understand that doesn't understand history.

There comes a point at which unthinkable actions must be considered as the last resort in the preservation of liberty. Do I think we're to that point? Certainly not. But to paraphrase Reagan, there is a point beyond which tyranny must not advance. That's the point when one ceases to be an extremist or terrorist and simply becomes a patriot.

[Vaevictis]

Seems pretty clear to me. Were Washington, Paine, etc...patriots or subversives. The monarchist considered them subversives...rebels even.

They were traitors, straight up. But that said, sometimes treason is the right thing to do.

[SicEmBaylor]

They were traitors, straight up. But that said, sometimes treason is the right thing to do.

Precisely. Then again sometimes so is terrorism. Terrorism is merely a tactic used by a weaker power against a much stronger one. The Sons of Liberty, the Minutemen, etc. all employed a strategy of what was essentially terrorism. Our nation was founded by terrorism, but of course I believe it was completely and totally justified.

That's why I say the line is fuzzy. Extremism is the defense of liberty is no vice. ;)

The ends justify the means -- not the other way around. Hell, it's George Washington's family motto.

[Crucifax Autumn]

OK...Neg me...

SicEm is right in some ways.

In the 80s we backed the mujhahadeen to run the Russias out of afghanibistan..depicted in a Rambo film.

So yeah..during this we trained them in terrorist tactics that they used to drive out the commies.


Seems to me SicEm is right in sayong the cause supports the actions sometimes. I disagree with hoim, but his basic idea that it is ok to be a terrorist if the cause is just stands! lol

[olevetonahill]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_mLKv8vSnAsI/SYU0Hg3mrHI/AAAAAAAAACA/Kq25TR54mxE/S1600-R/dont_tread_on_me.gif

[Vaevictis]

Precisely. Then again sometimes so is terrorism. Terrorism is merely a tactic used by a weaker power against a much stronger one. The Sons of Liberty, the Minutemen, etc. all employed a strategy of what was essentially terrorism. Our nation was founded by terrorism, but of course I believe it was completely and totally justified.

Woah, slow down there. I think you're confusing the part for the whole.

There's a broad class of warfare called asymmetric warfare. This class does include terrorism, but includes other approaches, including traditional guerilla warfare.

The fact that Americans engaged in asymmetric warfare does not necessarily mean that they engaged in terrorism.

To show terrorism, you have to show that the American forces deliberately and violently targeted civilians in an attempt to sway public opinion through the fear of that violence.

Note that collateral damage in the attempt to hit a legitimate military target does not qualify. The civilians have to be deliberately targeted, and the intent has to be cause fear which will lead them to demand or implement political change.

Now, maybe I'm misinformed, but this is not how I would describe the character of the American actions in the American Revolutionary War.

[Vaevictis]

Precisely. Then again sometimes so is terrorism. Terrorism is merely a tactic used by a weaker power against a much stronger one.

And for what it's worth: I wholly reject this notion in the strongest possible terms.

You might be able to convince me that there are some extreme cases where terrorism is necessary, but it is never, under any circumstances, right.

The same goes for torture. They might be necessary, but they are always morally and ethically repugnant and always leave a stain on the character and soul of the person(s) engaging in them.

[SicEmBaylor]

Woah, slow down there. I think you're confusing the part for the whole.

There's a broad class of warfare called asymmetric warfare. This class does include terrorism, but includes other approaches, including traditional guerilla warfare.

The fact that Americans engaged in asymmetric warfare does not necessarily mean that they engaged in terrorism.

To show terrorism, you have to show that the American forces deliberately and violently targeted civilians in an attempt to sway public opinion through the fear of that violence.

Note that collateral damage in the attempt to hit a legitimate military target does not qualify. The civilians have to be deliberately targeted, and the intent has to be cause fear which will lead them to demand or implement political change.

Now, maybe I'm misinformed, but this is not how I would describe the character of the American actions in the American Revolutionary War.

It depends on what you consider a civilian. They routinely attacked the homes of what we would today consider civil servants simply because they worked for the government. We broke into their homes, destroyed their property, terrorized their families, and literally tarred, feathered, and rode them out of town on a rail. They did all of this to discourage other government officials from doing their job and to discourage their fellow citizens from legitimizing the crown's actions by going along with London's edicts.

The destruction of personal property was a form of economic terrorism in sort of the same way that we consider ELF's actions to be terroristic today.

Now, I will admit that the terrorist acts were confined to some of the rougher and more radical groups, like the Sons of Liberty, and you certainly wouldn't see many of our nation's leading figures at the head of the mob to tar and feather the local tax collector but the point remains the same -- our early Patriots often engaged in terrorist activities.

[SicEmBaylor]

And for what it's worth: I wholly reject this notion in the strongest possible terms.

You might be able to convince me that there are some extreme cases where terrorism is necessary, but it is never, under any circumstances, right.

The same goes for torture. They might be necessary, but they are always morally and ethically repugnant and always leave a stain on the character and soul of the person(s) engaging in them.

Well, hopefully we'll always have men willing to stain their character for the sake of their nation and countrymen. I believe deep down I'm the type who would.

[Vaevictis]

Now, I will admit that the terrorist acts were confined to some of the rougher and more radical groups, like the Sons of Liberty, and you certainly wouldn't see many of our nation's leading figures at the head of the mob to tar and feather the local tax collector but the point remains the same -- our early Patriots often engaged in terrorist activities.

Ah, okay, I see more where you're coming from here. My point of view was with respect to the actual government.

I disagree that our nation was founded from terrorism, in the same sense that I don't think Israel was. Yeah, there were terrorist groups that supported both and agitated for both, but the reason they came to be is (in my mind) independent.

[yermom]

Woah, slow down there. I think you're confusing the part for the whole.

There's a broad class of warfare called asymmetric warfare. This class does include terrorism, but includes other approaches, including traditional guerilla warfare.

The fact that Americans engaged in asymmetric warfare does not necessarily mean that they engaged in terrorism.

To show terrorism, you have to show that the American forces deliberately and violently targeted civilians in an attempt to sway public opinion through the fear of that violence.

Note that collateral damage in the attempt to hit a legitimate military target does not qualify. The civilians have to be deliberately targeted, and the intent has to be cause fear which will lead them to demand or implement political change.

Now, maybe I'm misinformed, but this is not how I would describe the character of the American actions in the American Revolutionary War.

the other side of this is that they seem to call anyone in the middle east engaging in "asymetric warfare" terrorists

while i'm not anywhere near the point at which i think it needs to happen, the Declaration of Independence is all about this extremist/patriot thing. the difference is who wins. the winner decides who the bad guy was

[StoopTroup]

The Taliban took complete control over the people of it's region. They performed unspeakable acts on humanity.

Others who did the same...Cambodia, Rawanda, Sudan, Germany, Iraq, Bosnia...I'm sure I missing some.

What I fail to understand is this.

How can the World...specifically the U.N. continue to politic over peoples God given right to live and survive and think. To sit back and watch a Civil War is one thing...but to continue to allow genocide on a massive scale is beyond me. There is a fine line between interfering and saving lives.

America's Constitution was written for not just Americans...but as a doctrine for other Countries who wished to have freedom to use as an example. Like it or not...our Constitution is the best piece of paper written in the last 2000 years.

It's to bad folks continue to think that America is where I go to be free instead of why isn't my Home Country free?

Getting rid of terrorists and genocidal maniacs in their own Country should be number one on their list IMO. It's to bad they can't just ask for the help they need when the proof of such a regime exists.