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Rogue
3/29/2009, 06:14 PM
Talk about micromanagement. (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/gm_wagoner)


DETROIT General Motors Corp. Chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner will step down immediately at the request of the White House, administration officials said Sunday. The news comes as President Obama prepares to unveil additional restructuring efforts designed to save the domestic auto industry.

The officials asked not to be identified because details of the restructuring plan have not yet been made public. On Monday, Obama is to announce plans to restructure GM and Chrysler LLC in exchange for additional government loans. The companies have been living on $17.4 billion in government aid and have requested $21.6 billion more.

Wagoner's departure indicates that more management changes may be part of the deal. Wagoner, 56, has repeatedly said he felt it was better for the company if he led it through the crisis, but he has faced sharp criticism on Capitol Hill for what many lawmakers regard as years of missteps, mistakes and arrogance by the Big Three automakers.

Wagoner joined GM in 1977, serving in several capacities in the U.S., Brazil and Europe. He became president and chief executive in 2000 and has served as chairman and CEO since May 2003.

Obama said Sunday that GM and Chrysler and all those with a stake in their survival need to take more hard steps to help the struggling automakers restructure for the future. In an interview with CBS' "Face the Nation" broadcast Sunday, Obama said the companies must do more to receive additional financial aid from the government.

"They're not there yet," he said.

A person familiar with Obama's plans said last week they would go deeper than what the Bush administration demanded when it approved the initial loans last year.

Wagoner, in an interview with The Associated Press in December, had declined to speculate on suggestions from some members of Congress that GM's leadership team should step down as part of any rescue package.

"I'm doing what I do because it adds a lot of value to the company," Wagoner said in a Dec. 4 interview as GM sought federal aid from the Bush administration. "It's not clear to me that experience in this industry should be viewed as a negative but I'm going to do what's right for the company and I'll do it in consultation with the (GM) board (of directors)."

Wagoner has been credited by auto industry analysts with doing more to restructure the giant, bureaucratic automaker than any other executive. But given that he has been at GM's helm for so long, many of his critics say he moved far too slowly to take on the United Auto Workers and shrink the company as its market share tumbled.

While GM has improved its cars in the last two years, critics say the company relied for too long on sales of pickup trucks and sport utility vehicles for its profits and was unprepared for a drastic market shift when gasoline prices hit $4 per gallon last year.

During the Congressional debate over whether to give GM and Chrysler loans last year, many lawmakers criticized Wagoner, including Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., chairman of the Banking Committee.

He accused automakers' top management of having a "head-in-the-sand" approach to problems and said Wagoner "has to move on" as part of a government-run restructuring that should be a condition of financial life support for the auto industry.

___

Associated Press Writer Ken Thomas reported from Washington, D.C.

.

Jerk
3/29/2009, 06:17 PM
Will they fire themselves after the bond market implodes?

OUAlumni1990
3/29/2009, 06:37 PM
Dang, I knew I should have bough some gm stock. Likely to shoot up tomorrow.

OUHOMER
3/29/2009, 06:38 PM
I dont know if this is good or not. GM (Wagoner) was leading this thru the union negotiations ,didnt see the light.
Did Obama fire all the banking CEO's ?

Jerk
3/29/2009, 06:42 PM
Well, at least the CEO's have another good reason to never come crawling to the gov't to suck on the public tit.

yermom
3/29/2009, 06:43 PM
seems pretty odd.

wonder what kinda severance he's getting

soonerhubs
3/29/2009, 06:52 PM
I'm not finding anything on the "state-run" website. (http://www.gm.com/) ;)

royalfan5
3/29/2009, 07:10 PM
If the GM Board of Directors would have done their ****ing job in the first place, this wouldn't have needed to happen.

StoopTroup
3/29/2009, 07:21 PM
Well, at least the CEO's have another good reason to never come crawling to the gov't to suck on the public tit.

If the Board of Directors and Stock Holders in these Companies would demand the same thing...we wouldn't have needed to give them the money IMO. I'll never understand how these folks who run companies can sleep at night knowing they didn't make a profit and took bonuses. The idea of having a small salary loaded with incentives to operate an efficient company would fix a lot of this IMO.

Same thing needs to happen on Capitol Hill too.

Curly Bill
3/29/2009, 07:38 PM
This guy proved so adept at managing GM my guess is he's now being considered for a spot on Brack's economic team. ;)

StoopTroup
3/29/2009, 08:47 PM
Ford will probably hire him.

I'd like to see him on The Donald's next Apprentice.

StoopTroup
3/29/2009, 08:49 PM
Matter of fact...wouldn't it be a great idea to get a bunch of Ex-CEOs on that show and watch them go at it?

Get the guy from AIG, The GM guy and a few others...

The winner gets to retire and the losers have to work at Walmart for a year as a greeter.

Ike
3/30/2009, 01:14 AM
I'm not a huge fan of the gov't making decisions about who should manage a company....but on the other hand, I truly believe that anyone crawling up to capitol hill with their hand out should recognize that their job is also on the line.

yermom
3/30/2009, 01:43 AM
Matter of fact...wouldn't it be a great idea to get a bunch of Ex-CEOs on that show and watch them go at it?

Get the guy from AIG, The GM guy and a few others...

The winner gets to retire and the losers have to work at Walmart for a year as a greeter.

i'd rather see them in the Thunderdome

maybe on the Running Man? :D

OUHOMER
3/30/2009, 05:18 AM
I'm not a huge fan of the gov't making decisions about who should manage a company....but on the other hand, I truly believe that anyone crawling up to capitol hill with their hand out should recognize that their job is also on the line.

I agree, But if the gov't can tell them how much they can make, I guess they can fire them too.

Condescending Sooner
3/30/2009, 08:55 AM
I'm sure Obama's cronies have much more knowledge how to run a car company than someone that has 32 years of experience.

JohnnyMack
3/30/2009, 09:23 AM
I'm not a huge fan of the gov't making decisions about who should manage a company....but on the other hand, I truly believe that anyone crawling up to capitol hill with their hand out should recognize that their job is also on the line.

This.

The way I understand it, GM entered into an agreement to take a huge lump o' cash from the Gubmint and was given 60 days to make changes. If GM had taken a loan from a private entity and failed to live up to their end of the bargain how would it be different?

I'm certain many of our party line hacks will come in here and talk about how Obama will run GM into the ground. I think GM was doing a fine impression of the Hindenberg long before BHO got involved.

JohnnyMack
3/30/2009, 09:36 AM
Besides that, the way I read all this Obama said NO to giving them more money.

Scott D
3/30/2009, 11:37 AM
Obama's people are likely deluding themselves if they think the CFO is going to make a behemoth like GM change direction any faster than Wagonner had been doing.

Vaevictis
3/30/2009, 11:40 AM
Put it to you guys this way.

GM had to go to the government for a hand out in an effort to stave off bankruptcy. This means, bluntly, that the CEO has let the company get to the point where it's about to go down the tubes.

If the Board of Directors had been doing its job, the CEO would be out already.

Scott D
3/30/2009, 11:53 AM
I'd argue that the Board of Directors are/were/still the problem, not the CEO. But that's another story for another day.

Vaevictis
3/30/2009, 12:05 PM
I don't disagree.

The fact that they didn't fire the CEO themselves tells you everything you need to know about them.

swardboy
3/30/2009, 12:17 PM
So, if GM would have just gone chap. 11 in the first place, the American taxpayer wouldn't be out a gazillion $'s. Great....

TheHumanAlphabet
3/30/2009, 12:47 PM
I said it before...Barry = Socialism.

SoonerRedHead
3/30/2009, 01:01 PM
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion.
The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is
wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts
they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions,
it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as
to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost
in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from
time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
It is its natural manure."

Okla-homey
3/30/2009, 06:34 PM
Let 'em shake the danged Etch-A-Sketch and start over. If GM emerges from Chapter 11 with just Chevy that's fine. It should have happened a long time ago. The good news is, the UAW and all the retired UAW hacks drawing pensions and exorbitant bennies will be hosed, and that is worth the price of admission. Let those codgers do the Medicare two-step like the rest of the nation's retired blue-collar bubbas.

batonrougesooner
3/30/2009, 06:48 PM
Interesting. One unspoken message to the next GM CEO/Obama figure head could be "Better not negotiate too hard with the UAW or Obama may just fire your arse."

royalfan5
3/30/2009, 06:54 PM
Interesting. One unspoken message to the next GM CEO/Obama figure head could be "Better not negotiate too hard with the UAW or Obama may just fire your arse."

Or the message could be, if you **** up your company so bad you have to run to Uncle Sugar, don't expect to keep your job without showing some sort of a clue. Under Wagoner's, watch GM has been shedding about a point of market share per year. That's with massive and serial discounting at the expense of their current customers resale values. Since the 60's GM has consistently taken the easy way out every time, and at some point that catches up to you. If the taxpayers are bailing out a company, do you want someone who has proven that he can't run a major car company running it?

My Opinion Matters
3/30/2009, 07:04 PM
You know, this whole GM/Chrysler debacle has a pretty simple explanation-the auto industry has changed, American automakers have not.

GM specifically needs to shrink considerably to ever be a sustainable company again.

batonrougesooner
3/30/2009, 07:05 PM
Or the message could be, if you **** up your company so bad you have to run to Uncle Sugar, don't expect to keep your job without showing some sort of a clue. Under Wagoner's, watch GM has been shedding about a point of market share per year. That's with massive and serial discounting at the expense of their current customers resale values. Since the 60's GM has consistently taken the easy way out every time, and at some point that catches up to you. If the taxpayers are bailing out a company, do you want someone who has proven that he can't run a major car company running it?

My point is that government shouldn't be meddling like this. I think it's bad enough that they are throwing all this money at a private company. This is the end result. They think they've bought the right to make these decisions. Maybe they have. But should they? The consequences, both intended and unintended can be far-reaching and severe.

royalfan5
3/30/2009, 07:32 PM
My point is that government shouldn't be meddling like this. I think it's bad enough that they are throwing all this money at a private company. This is the end result. They think they've bought the right to make these decisions. Maybe they have. But should they? The consequences, both intended and unintended can be far-reaching and severe.

If the Gov't is going to be a lender, I want them acting like one, and not just handing the automakers a check and telling them not to spend it all on lollipops and fireworks. Lenders attach conditions to their loans, as long as we are going to pretend this money is going to get paid back, conditions have to be attached.

GrapevineSooner
3/30/2009, 09:07 PM
In a perfect world, Bush would have told the Big 3 that their current business model was unsustainable and that if the Government gave them TARP money, it would simply be delaying the inevitable.

But of course, he didn't.

This is one of the few instances where I can buy Barry O's excuse that he inherited this problem. Of course, you shouldn't overuse that excuse because every President inherits problems from his predecessor.

OU_Sooners75
3/31/2009, 03:13 AM
I said it before...Barry = Socialism.


You should actually learn what that word means.

Our government has been very socialistic since the great depression.

How many times has the government given airline companies hand outs?
How many times has the government given automakers hand outs?
How many times has the government given coal mining companies hand outs?

Simple answer....more times than what has occurred in the last 8 months!

Is Barry helping stave off socialism? No...but he is not what started socialism in this country!

MrJimBeam
3/31/2009, 06:33 AM
The winner gets to retire and the losers have to work at Walmart for a year as a greeter.

Wal-Mart greeter is the easiest job there. Make'em work checkout at the 20 items or less register. Schedule them to always work the day before a predicted ice/snow storm.

swardboy
3/31/2009, 07:17 AM
Interesting. One unspoken message to the next GM CEO/Obama figure head could be "Better not negotiate too hard with the UAW or Obama may just fire your arse."

Precisely....because you know Barry doesn't have the balls to fire the UAW chief! That's his constituency.

OklahomaTuba
3/31/2009, 08:37 AM
Goodbye GM. It was a great ride while it lasted.

I'm sure SUVs and Trucks will be phased out in short order, in an effort to change the weather.

Still love my 2001 Tahoe BTW.

Scott D
3/31/2009, 12:50 PM
Precisely....because you know Barry doesn't have the balls to fire the UAW chief! That's his constituency.

didn't the overlord Rush tell you that Gettelfinger is retiring when his term is up in 2010?

Scott D
3/31/2009, 12:52 PM
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion.
The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is
wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts
they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions,
it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as
to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost
in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from
time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
It is its natural manure."

this post forgot the unquoted part "Buuy Viagraa Ch3ap N00w"

OklahomaTuba
3/31/2009, 01:28 PM
Its all coming together now....

President Obama’s newly discovered prudence with taxpayer money and his tough-love approach to GM and Chrysler would both have more credibility if he hadn’t demanded Rick Wagoner’s resignation, as well. By imposing operational conditions normally reserved for boards of directors, the administration is now bound to the infamous “Pottery Barn” rule: you break it, you buy it. If things go further south, the government is now complicit.

It also means that Wagoner was perceived as an obstacle to whatever plans the administration has for GM. And that’s the real source of concern. If getting these companies back on their feet is the objective, a bankruptcy judge can make a determination pretty quickly about the viability of the firms and the steps necessary to get there. But if the objective is something more grandiose, such as transforming the industry into a model of green production, government oversight and close scrutiny of operations will be necessary. CEOs must be compliant and pliant. It is worth noting that a return to profitability and the metamorphosis of the industry according to a government script work at cross purposes.

http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2009/03/31/government-motor


Karl Marx is smiling in hell right now, like this:

http://www.grouchyoldcripple.com/archives/gm.jpg

StoopTroup
3/31/2009, 01:38 PM
The Kings we ran from in Britain are very similar to the Kings we have here now except we have no place to leave to start a new life in a New World.

Revolution or a Civil War in this Country is a very bad idea.

The last 20 years are as much to blame as anything. What's happening now is that the Pubs aren't doing a very good job in preparing themselves to get put back into power in the next elections in Congress and the House. Their attempts to make this President look stupid and playing the waiting game with him aren't going to work. I was shocked when Pres. Obama announced the Warranty deal yesterday. It's almost like he's trying to see just how much he can get away with.

If more of the Dems aren't recruited by the Pubs to oppose some of this crap...we're going to regret not writing our Senators and Reps.

jkjsooner
3/31/2009, 08:23 PM
The idea of having a small salary loaded with incentives to operate an efficient company would fix a lot of this IMO.


Maybe this would apply to the auto industry. What we've seen in the financial industry is that these incentives have encouraged excessive risk taking. Why not? If you can make the stock prices skyrocket for a few years you can end up with a lot bigger bonuses than if you lead the company through a slow steady growth. Who cares if things collapse and you get canned after making tens of millions of dollars?

jkjsooner
3/31/2009, 08:27 PM
Ford will probably hire him.

I'd like to see him on The Donald's next Apprentice.

Didn't another company with Trump's name declare bankruptcy recently. I'd like to see that guy get his butt fired.

jkjsooner
3/31/2009, 08:39 PM
You should actually learn what that word means.

Our government has been very socialistic since the great depression.

How many times has the government given airline companies hand outs?
How many times has the government given automakers hand outs?
How many times has the government given coal mining companies hand outs?

Simple answer....more times than what has occurred in the last 8 months!

Is Barry helping stave off socialism? No...but he is not what started socialism in this country!

You forgot the big handouts we give every single year to the great farmers of our country.

I have lots of farmer relatives. They've gotten rich from not farming their land. They constantly complain about government handouts to others...

TheHumanAlphabet
4/1/2009, 12:11 AM
You should actually learn what that word means. I know what it means!

Our government has been very socialistic since the great depression. Thank you dems and FDR.

How many times has the government given airline companies hand outs? no idea
How many times has the government given automakers hand outs? No handouts a loan that I am aware of in my lifetime.
How many times has the government given coal mining companies hand outs?
Subsidies yes, hand outs? no idea.

Simple answer....more times than what has occurred in the last 8 months!

Is Barry helping stave off socialism? No...but he is not what started socialism in this country!
We have been going that way, He will make this a European social democrat state.

TheHumanAlphabet
4/1/2009, 12:12 AM
You forgot the big handouts we give every single year to the great farmers of our country.

I have lots of farmer relatives. They've gotten rich from not farming their land. They constantly complain about government handouts to others...

I agree here, was intended to help farm families, to keep the family going. Big farm industry and large farm family co-ops/conglomerates get the most now - not what the intent of the law would seem to me.

OU_Sooners75
4/1/2009, 07:48 PM
We have been going that way, He will make this a European social democrat state.


Okay, you want to blame FDR and the Dems...fair enough. I blame the politicians and the citizens of this nation for not standing by their morals and views!

If you want to blame FDR and the Dems...you must lay blame on republicans as well for the continuation of the socialism...afterall, there have been more republican presidents since FDR than there has been Democrats.