Gitmo - so what does this mean?

[landrun]

Someone tell me that they are NOT going to let Khalid Sheikh Mohammed go free?? :eek:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/21/guantanamo.hearings/index.html


GUANTANAMO BAY, Cuba (CNN) -- In one of his first acts in office President Obama has ordered the U.S. government to suspend prosecutions of prisoners at Guantanamo Bay for 120 days, military officials said Tuesday.

Papers filed at the U.S. prison camp said the request is made "in the interest of justice and at the direction of the president of the United States." It seeks a delay in proceedings until May 20.

"The judges will receive the requests and review them, and we anticipate a ruling soon," said Cmdr. Jeffrey Gordon, a Defense Department spokesman.

Tuesday's directive was issued verbally through Defense Secretary Bob Gates, according to a military official.

Obama had vowed to close the naval prison at the U.S. base. While Obama's order does not go that far, it will stop the prosecutions of 21 detainees currently facing war crimes charges.

Jamil Dakwar, a representative for the American Civil Liberties Union at the base, called the move "a good step in the right direction." Gabor Rona, an observer for Human Rights Watch, also called the order "a first step."

"The very fact that it's one of his first acts reflects a sense of urgency that the U.S. cannot afford one more day of counterproductive and illegal proceedings in the fight against terrorism," said Rona, who was in Cuba to watch the proceedings scheduled this week. Video Watch former detainee describe conditions at Guantanamo Bay »

Before midnight, prosecutors in two of the 14 currently active cases had filed paperwork asking judges to grant the 120-day continuance. The military official said prosecutors in all ongoing cases are expected to file similar requests Wednesday.

Among those facing trial at Guantanamo Bay is Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the confessed organizer of the September 11, 2001, attacks on New York and Washington. A hearing in Mohammed's case was scheduled for Wednesday, and Tuesday night's order is expected to be discussed at that time, the military official told CNN.

Earlier Tuesday, the judge overseeing pretrial hearings for a 22-year-old prisoner facing trial for the killing of a U.S. soldier in Afghanistan hinted at the uncertain future for the case in an Obama administration.
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"We will reconvene tomorrow, unless otherwise ordered by the commission," Judge Pat Parrish told those in the courtroom.

The military prison, set up by the Bush administration in 2002, has become a major issue because critics argue it has become a symbol of mismanagement and overreach in the war on terror.

Human and legal rights advocates complained that many of the detainees were being held indefinitely although there were no criminal charges filed against them.

Dakwar said the ACLU believes all charges against the prisoners should be dropped.

"A shutdown of this discredited system is warranted," he said.

The prison camp currently holds about 245 inmates. Officials said nearly 60 detainees have been cleared for release, but no country has agreed to take them. Video Watch what may happen to Gitmo's inmates »

Reports of mistreatment of detainees led many, including Obama, to argue that the facility was not ineffective in dealing with alleged enemy combatants or for gathering good intelligence.

The retired judge in charge of determining which prisoners should face trial told The Washington Post last week that she refused to send one prisoner before the tribunals because "his treatment met the legal definition of torture."
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At his final White House press conference on January 12, Bush was asked whether the military prison and harsh interrogation tactics have damaged America's standing in the world.

"I strongly disagree with the assessment that our moral standing has been damaged," he said. "It may be damaged amongst some of the elite. But people still understand America stands for freedom; that America is a country that provides such great hope."

[SoonerJack]

Those guys held at GITMO were uniformed armed comba....oh wait. Nope.

If you don't play by the rules of war, you aren't afforded the protections of conventions signed in Geneva.

[Whet]

One talking head mentioned Barry would build a new prison for them, in a RED state, where he would not have to worry about the political backlash.

Which state had the largest margin for McCain?

[yermom]

so instead of a trial they are sitting in their cells for 4 months?

i'm not quite sure i follow...

[OklahomaTuba]

So under Bush they get due process. Under Dear Leader, not so much.

Isn't that a human rights violation????

[OklahomaTuba]

Someone tell me that they are NOT going to let Khalid Sheikh Mohammed go free??

If he steps foot on US soil, the ACLU will be defending him so fast, he might as well go free.

With the # of terrorists that leave Gitmo and resume their jihadi day jobs, I give us about 6 months to one year until we are hit again if this happens.

But at least the world loves us now.

[soonerscuba]

Tuba has looked silly the last few days.

[MojoRisen]

It is a fact released prisioners from GITMO resume Terriost Activities. Dick Cheany was on the radio the other day saying that the information gathered initially from these interogations resulted in over 50% of their arrests- these are Terrorist... Now for the right to trial - I have no problem with that really at all, but if they just release these suspected Terrorist - it will be a huge oversight for sure.

We will be like France fighting the Nazi's.... SOL

[achiro]

Forget waterboarding. Tell us what we want to know or shoot them in the heads...OR tell us what we want to know then shoot them in the heads. Not long before we don't need a prison anymore. :texan:

[OklahomaTuba]

ACLU already has their website up and running:

http://www.closegitmo.com

These loons cannot wait to defend the master-mind of 9/11 in court. God help us all if that happens.

[Vaevictis]

Someone tell me that they are NOT going to let Khalid Sheikh Mohammed go free?? :eek:

All it means at this point is that the administration is requesting a continuance so they can evaluate the trials and determine if they meet the administration's standards.


Those guys held at GITMO were uniformed armed comba....oh wait. Nope.

If you don't play by the rules of war, you aren't afforded the protections of conventions signed in Geneva.

Actually, depending on the conditions, the Geneva Conventions do provide some protections for some non-uniformed combatants. I remember going over them a while ago and thinking that there had to be at least some Afghani prisoners that qualified.

[Vaevictis]

Ultimately, my attitude is: if you don't want to give them a fair trial, don't take custody of them.

[OklahomaTuba]

And if we ask them nicely, and let them play with kittens and flowers, they will tell us all their evil plans..

[Harry Beanbag]

Officials said nearly 60 detainees have been cleared for release, but no country has agreed to take them.

This quote should provoke some critical thinking in some people's minds.



Reports of mistreatment of detainees led many, including Obama, to argue that the facility was not ineffective in dealing with alleged enemy combatants or for gathering good intelligence.


This sentence doesn't make a lot of sense. :confused:

[JohnnyMack]

I still don't understand why if you have someone in prison and you suspect them of doing something bad that you don't put them on trial for it.

[Harry Beanbag]

It seems we're kind of in new territory that nobody really knows how to handle. In WWII we shipped POWs to the U.S. and held them until the war was over, no trials for the average Wehrmacht soldier that I'm aware of. Of course we treated them under the rules of the Geneva convention because they were uniformed soldiers under arms for a country we were at war with.

These guys are different, no uniforms and not representing a country. We're holding them like the Germans and Italians, but when do they get released? When is this war going to end? Will they die of old age before then? If we let them go now, most likely they will be still be trying to kill Americans or British or whoever within the month.

[yermom]

we are treading new ground in this deal. Geneva may not apply, but what does?

it's scary to think that Gitmo would be the precedent

how would we feel if we were on the other side. let's say you are in China in ten years for some reason and someone decides you are aiding "terrorists"

you aren't military, you are in a hole forever since you don't need a trial

maybe it's not China, maybe it's any other country and China, Iran or Russia has a military presence there

we need to be setting an example here.

EDIT: wow, i hadn't even seen Harry's post before posting mine

[swardboy]

Hang 'em in the middle of Afghanistan....with Afghani rope.

[JohnnyMack]

Like with KSM, if we have enough evidence why not try him?

[OklahomaTuba]

Like with KSM, if we have enough evidence why not try him?

They were doing just that until Dear Leader told them stop for a few months.

[OUHOMER]

Like with KSM, if we have enough evidence why not try him?

I never did like the idea of just holding any of them without some kind of trial.
Surly when they were picked up they were doing something bad. i would not think we were picking them up on street corners.

I say convict them, then kill'em. or if innocent kick them out the back of a c130 over the mountains with a parachute.

[OklahomaTuba]

Osama is laughing his terrorist @$$ off in a cave somewhere right now.

Closing the site "would further the national security and foreign policy interests of the United States and the interests of justice," read the draft prepared for the new president's signature. A copy was obtained by The Associated Press.

Some of the 245 detainees currently held at Guantanamo would be released..http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090121/D95RQ7A80.html

I feel more secure already! Thanks President Obama!

[Sooner98]

It looks like we, as a nation, have decided that protecting the civil rights of Al Queda terrorists is now more important than protecting our citizens from being killed by them.

I feel very good about this.

[Sooner98]

I'm no expert on the law/counter-terrorism/etc., but I would have to think that giving these terrorists access to high-paid, highly-motivated lawyers on U.S. soil, cannot possibly end well for us. Call me crazy.

[MojoRisen]

The real reprocution of this is that the Terriost will no longer be captured, instead our smart soldiers in fear that we will not do shiate to a captured combatant based on the views of an administration(who assumes we can prossecute Terrorist and afford to no less) will go ahead and just kill them in the war field.

[Vaevictis]

The real reprocution of this is that the Terriost will no longer be captured, instead our smart soldiers in fear that we will not do shiate to a captured combatant based on the views of an administration(who assumes we can prossecute Terrorist and afford to no less) will go ahead and just kill them in the war field.

Hence my prior comment regarding not taking them into custody.

If you don't want to give them a fair trial, just kill them in the field when it's still kosher to do so.

[Curly Bill]

The real reprocution of this is that the Terriost will no longer be captured, instead our smart soldiers in fear that we will not do shiate to a captured combatant based on the views of an administration(who assumes we can prossecute Terrorist and afford to no less) will go ahead and just kill them in the war field.

I'd be willing to guess this already happens more then we know...

...and I'm all in favor of it.

[OklahomaTuba]

Sorry, but killing them all is dumb.

KSM coughed up intel that thwarted multiple terror attacks once they got around to waterboarding the sumbiotch.

[soonerhubs]

Tuba,
It's time you quit complaining about our President trying to save your tax dollars. He has much higher nobler purposes for that money including the funding to murder unborn children in other countries. Get your priorities straight! ;)

[Sooner98]

KSM coughed up intel that thwarted multiple terror attacks once they got around to waterboarding the sumbiotch.

Haven't you heard? It doesn't matter that it saved probably thousands of American lives; waterboarding Khalid-Sheik Mohammed was the single greatest atrocity in the history of mankind. I mean, the poor guy had water poured on his face for, what, one or two minutes?? We as a country should pay a steep price for this unimaginable crime against humanity, and then beg the rest of the world for forgiveness.

[KC//CRIMSON]

FEAR!

[SoonerProphet]

didn't one of our founding fathers defend the british soldiers involved in the boston massacre? i sure enjoy some of these so called "conservatives" ideals regarding justice, the rule of law, and basic rights bestowed by our creator.

[afs]

I never did like the idea of just holding any of them without some kind of trial.
Surly when they were picked up they were doing something bad. i would not think we were picking them up on street corners.

I say kick them out the back of a c130 over the mountains without a parachute.

fixed.

[LoyalFan]

What it ALSO means, Boils and Goiters, is that all that Arab money that poured into Osama Bin Obama's campaign camelbank is being repaid as promised.
Not only will he release those who will then resume their attacks on America but he will assure that the military is hampered by the enemy being able to sit back, reenforce and recruit, while they wait out his timetable for cutting and running.
Also bought and paid for by Arab dollars was the assurance that we'd remain dependent on them for oil, in that there will be no offshore drilling in Alaska or anywhere else previously deemed sacrosanct by the whale huggers.
Alternative energy...my arse! While that is a worthwhile pursuit it cannot happen on a timely basis and cost to Americans will be staggering, further weakening us.
Officials in major cities prepared for riots that would make the Watts Affair look like a Sunday ice cream social in the event that O'a lost the election. The threat was real and broadly hinted at in certain communities. "Oh, you think Democracy is fine but if YOUR guy loses you'll burn, pillage, rape, and kill? Hmmm." This virtually assures that this asshat will secure a second term which will probably be enough time to finish turning us over our enemies. Should that not happen as planned then if another "oppressed minority" President, hand-selected, of course, not follow him those riots will occur. Book it.
The solution? Frankly, I don't know and I despair for my beloved country, our children, and our children's children.

LF

[MojoRisen]

Tuba, you are right... but since we can't gather intel that way in the eyes of some. May as well kill the bastages before they can plot another Terror incident.

Look these guys are Terriost, god forbid Obama has to deal with a real incident, by keeping them in our prisons and providing them rights. They can simply try and run their plans from Prison- much like the California gangs are run from prison.

If we can't gather intel from the Terrorist, kill em when it is legal.

[OklahomaTuba]

The new White House counsel, Gregory B. Craig, briefed lawmakers about some elements of the orders on Wednesday evening. A Congressional official who attended the session said Mr. Craig acknowledged concerns from intelligence officials that new restrictions on C.I.A. methods might be unwise and indicated that the White House might be open to allowing the use of methods other the 19 techniques allowed for the military.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/22/us/politics/22gitmo.html

This is good news.

So much for all that hopenchange!!

[GrapevineSooner]

Greggo Creggo

[soonerscuba]

What it ALSO means, Boils and Goiters, is that all that Arab money that poured into Osama Bin Obama's campaign camelbank is being repaid as promised.
Not only will he release those who will then resume their attacks on America but he will assure that the military is hampered by the enemy being able to sit back, reenforce and recruit, while they wait out his timetable for cutting and running.
Also bought and paid for by Arab dollars was the assurance that we'd remain dependent on them for oil, in that there will be no offshore drilling in Alaska or anywhere else previously deemed sacrosanct by the whale huggers.
Alternative energy...my arse! While that is a worthwhile pursuit it cannot happen on a timely basis and cost to Americans will be staggering, further weakening us.
Officials in major cities prepared for riots that would make the Watts Affair look like a Sunday ice cream social in the event that O'a lost the election. The threat was real and broadly hinted at in certain communities. "Oh, you think Democracy is fine but if YOUR guy loses you'll burn, pillage, rape, and kill? Hmmm." This virtually assures that this asshat will secure a second term which will probably be enough time to finish turning us over our enemies. Should that not happen as planned then if another "oppressed minority" President, hand-selected, of course, not follow him those riots will occur. Book it.
The solution? Frankly, I don't know and I despair for my beloved country, our children, and our children's children.

LFThis sounds like something a homeless man would blather to himself on a subway.

[Dio]

FEAR!


KOOL-AID!

[OklahomaTuba]

This sounds like something a homeless man would blather to himself on a subway.

What a racist comment.

You must live in Ardmore.

[OklahomaTuba]

Tuba,
It's time you quit complaining about our President trying to save your tax dollars. He has much higher nobler purposes for that money including the funding to murder unborn children in other countries. Get your priorities straight! ;)

I know, I know.

Hurting terrorists = bad, they have rights after all.

But killing innocent unborn babies = OK!

Now THAT is Change you can believe in!

[MojoRisen]

If we get attacked, I am holding BARACK I used to be a MUSLIM solely responsible for the GITMO situation.

What is a little water boarding on a Terrorist you had every right to kill, hurt anyone when they give up information that saves lives. They loose all moral high ground when they yell IEIEIEIEIEIEIIEIEE and Jihad at you!

[LoyalFan]

This sounds like something a homeless man would blather to himself on a subway.


Which proves that even a homeless man can tell it like it is.
I'll leave the blathering to you, since you seem unable to:
A: See the forest for the trees.
B: Post an intelligent response; Pro Or Con.
Blather on, Bro.

LF

[Stoop Dawg]

So much for all that hopenchange!!

I know he's only been in office for a few days, but I get the feeling that we're going to get a lot more "hope" than "change" from this guy. NTTATWWT.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20090123/pl_politico/17841;_ylt=Arhi9.JqwPSkLcgjXIpV6B4Xr7sF

[SoonerProphet]

Seriously people, do you watch the news, read, pay attention to current events. They are not just going to open the gates and let KSM and et. al. roam free.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

None of these guys will ever be released. There are dozens of them right now that have been cleared for release but nobody will take them, because everybody knows what they are.

No, we'll shut down Guantanamo and hold them in military briggs around the country. And many of these guys will be tried in military courts like Bush was going to do because information is too sensitive to release to the public. But Human Rights Watch and the Euros will say nothing about this because they like Obama, but they didn't like Bush. And, truth be told, the Euros don't want these guys released either because they have much more to worry about from muslim extremists than we do.

[soonerscuba]

Seriously people, do you watch the news, read, pay attention to current events. They are not just going to open the gates and let KSM and et. al. roam free.What I also find interesting is that people act as if we have thousands of terrorists all guilty as sin just sitting down there. The truth is that there is about 250 of them, 60 of which were cleared by the Bush administration as able to be repattriated, there is no need for an embarrassing mistake to continue when there are much more diplomatic avenues to go down that involve other nations sharing the burden of dealing with these people. Australia and Western Europe could warm to the new administration by taking some.

[Frozen Sooner]

We ever find a place for those guys we held as terrorists on the Chinese's say-so? I remember the Chinese didn't want them back.

[Stoop Dawg]

What I also find interesting is that people act as if we have thousands of terrorists all guilty as sin just sitting down there. The truth is that there is about 250 of them, 60 of which were cleared by the Bush administration as able to be repattriated, there is no need for an embarrassing mistake to continue when there are much more diplomatic avenues to go down that involve other nations sharing the burden of dealing with these people. Australia and Western Europe could warm to the new administration by taking some.

Apparently there are only about 250 of them at Gitmo. From my understanding there really are thousands of them being held at other locations in the ME. However, Obama seems to only be concerned with the 250 at Gitmo.

It's a publicity stunt, pure and simple. I'm not saying it's a bad one either, but for all the press it's getting it really doesn't amount to anything.

[NYC Poke]

What a racist comment.

You must live in Ardmore.


How is it racist? I see homeless people of all races blathering on the subway.

[AggieTool]

What it ALSO means, Boils and Goiters, is that all that Arab money that poured into Osama Bin Obama's campaign camelbank is being repaid as promised.
Not only will he release those who will then resume their attacks on America but he will assure that the military is hampered by the enemy being able to sit back, reenforce and recruit, while they wait out his timetable for cutting and running.
Also bought and paid for by Arab dollars was the assurance that we'd remain dependent on them for oil, in that there will be no offshore drilling in Alaska or anywhere else previously deemed sacrosanct by the whale huggers.
Alternative energy...my arse! While that is a worthwhile pursuit it cannot happen on a timely basis and cost to Americans will be staggering, further weakening us.
Officials in major cities prepared for riots that would make the Watts Affair look like a Sunday ice cream social in the event that O'a lost the election. The threat was real and broadly hinted at in certain communities. "Oh, you think Democracy is fine but if YOUR guy loses you'll burn, pillage, rape, and kill? Hmmm." This virtually assures that this asshat will secure a second term which will probably be enough time to finish turning us over our enemies. Should that not happen as planned then if another "oppressed minority" President, hand-selected, of course, not follow him those riots will occur. Book it.
The solution? Frankly, I don't know and I despair for my beloved country, our children, and our children's children.

LF

Auntie Em.:rolleyes: