Let's be fair...Bama had nothing to gain in the Sugar Bowl...

[Soonerus]

...and Utah had everything....just like T.Tech had nothing to gain in the Cotton and Miss had everything...those types of games are a recipe for an upset ....as happened twice today...

[JLEW1818]

agree, and i lost money on both games

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I think TTech just got outplayed. Both teams looked motivated to me. Crabtree being hurt was a major problem for the Sand Aggy.

[JLEW1818]

I just think it was Texas Tech being Texas Tech. They will never be on the same level as Oklahoma and Texas....FACT NEVER EVER. They can run that offense all decade for all I care, but they will never be a champion in anything.

[TUSooner]

True. I generally like Bama and Saban, and this scenario likely wouldn't happen if these games were played to determine who moved on to the next round. But I'm also enjoying some fine vintage schadenfreude as another red Goliath - and an SEC one at that! - bites the dust.

[JLEW1818]

I'm anti "the underdog non bcs team" and I'm Anti "Rose Bowl Tradition" just me

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

Disagree. Unless you're playing for the national championship, who seriously has anything much to gain from winning a bowl game?

Still, on the other side of the coin, Bama had plenty to play for:

Their playing in the Sugar Bowl this year tied the record (with LSU) for most Sugar Bowl appearances. You'd think that'd be motivation to win.

Bama appeared in the Sugar Bowl this year for the first time since 1993. A convincing win sends a message, "We're back."

[KYSooner]

Disagree. Unless you're playing for the national championship, who seriously has anything much to gain from winning a bowl game?

Still, on the other side of the coin, Bama had plenty to play for:

Their playing in the Sugar Bowl this year tied the record (with LSU) for most Sugar Bowl appearances. You'd think that'd be motivation to win.

Bama appeared in the Sugar Bowl this year for the first time since 1993. A convincing win sends a message, "We're back."

Every word of this post is right on point. It could not have been more accurate.

One more thing that makes me ecstatic about this Utah win, is that the country should stop talking about that darn loss we had 2 years ago in the Fiesta bowl. And Utah had a hook n' ladder too...although not to the same importance.

[catsigater]

One more thing that makes me ecstatic about this Utah win, is that the country should stop talking about that darn loss we had 2 years ago in the Fiesta bowl.

A lot of that talk has more to do with the great season BSU had than it does with the fact OU lost. It sucks to be on the losing end of one of the most memorable bowl games of all time, but there's not much you can do about it... other than win next week.

Of course, we'd rather you live with it for at least one more year. :D

[SoonerInFla]

I disagree. They have disgraced the mighty SEC. Their SEC brethren will not be able to live vicariously through their accomplishments.

[OU_Sooners75]

...and Utah had everything....just like T.Tech had nothing to gain in the Cotton and Miss had everything...those types of games are a recipe for an upset ....as happened twice today...

I disagree.

Saying something like this is like saying we have nothing to gain when we are playing in Bowl games other than the national championship title game.

Bama has not been a very good program in quite a few years. They were representing the SEC and was one game away from the NCG. Yes, they lost their shot, but losing a bowl is embarassing when it is against a Mid Major...or have you forgotten that?

Tech, well, tech was playing a very good Ole Miss team. They had everything to gain if they win that game. They got excluded from the Big 12 CCG because they were the lower ranked BCS team of the three tied. The Cotton Bowl is one of the most prestigous bowl games to attend. More so than the Fiesta Bowl, considering the Fiesta Bowl started in the Mid 1970s. The Cotton Bowl has been around for what, 75+ years?

To say either of these teams had nothing to gain is Bullsh!t to say the least.

But then again, I suppose us losing against Boise St and West Virginia was okay, since we had nothing to gain from it, right?

[MojoRisen]

Yeah, I am tired of that nothing to play for crap... However I can see Crabtree now -"saying damn, I am going to the next level, last thing I need to do is blow out a knee".

Same with Adrian Peterson I have to say it against Bosie...

[Soonerus]

I disagree.

Saying something like this is like saying we have nothing to gain when we are playing in Bowl games other than the national championship title game.

Bama has not been a very good program in quite a few years. They were representing the SEC and was one game away from the NCG. Yes, they lost their shot, but losing a bowl is embarassing when it is against a Mid Major...or have you forgotten that?

Tech, well, tech was playing a very good Ole Miss team. They had everything to gain if they win that game. They got excluded from the Big 12 CCG because they were the lower ranked BCS team of the three tied. The Cotton Bowl is one of the most prestigous bowl games to attend. More so than the Fiesta Bowl, considering the Fiesta Bowl started in the Mid 1970s. The Cotton Bowl has been around for what, 75+ years?

To say either of these teams had nothing to gain is Bullsh!t to say the least.

But then again, I suppose us losing against Boise St and West Virginia was okay, since we had nothing to gain from it, right?


reality check, please...

[Curly Bill]

Count me in as another that does not buy the: nothing to play for spiel. If it's a game, and they're keeping score, which will of course be used to determine a winner and a loser, then there's what you have to play for. Are you a winner or are you a loser?

[Curly Bill]

reality check, please...

How so?

[L-Boy]

I disagree. They have disgraced the mighty SEC. Their SEC brethren will not be able to live vicariously through their accomplishments.


While I generally prefer the SEC to win, my brother, also a Gator alum, works at the university in Tuscaloosa, and if nothing else this will increase his entertainment value for a year.

[Soonerus]

It's just a 19-21 year old deal...

[DMAFB_Sooner08]

Anytime they step on that field...I dont doubt one second that they are playing hard. But you cannot convince me that they are PREPARING as well as they would if they were playing for a NC or to move on in the playoffs. I am still a sucker and like to believe these kids love the game and play their hardest when they step on the field, but am not under the illusion that they prepare through out the weeks between end of season and bowl season.

[Curly Bill]

Anytime they step on that field...I dont doubt one second that they are playing hard. But you cannot convince me that they are PREPARING as well as they would if they were playing for a NC or to move on in the playoffs. I am still a sucker and like to believe these kids love the game and play their hardest when they step on the field, but am not under the illusion that they prepare through out the weeks between end of season and bowl season.


Then that's their own tough fault, and if they lose then they deserved it...

...unlike the premise of this thread that it's somehow unfair.

[DMAFB_Sooner08]

Then that's their own tough fault, and if they lose then they deserved it...

...unlike the premise of this thread that it's somehow unfair.

Life isn't fair and these 18-22 year olds will learn that real fast....and I

Totally agree 100%, I know the ole cliche "you play like you practice" and they dont have anyone to blame but themselves...if in fact they didnt prepare like they should (I have noway of knowing this information). I just like to think that no matter what these kids go out and play hard every time they step on the playin field!!

[KYSooner]

Well lets send this thread in a new direction...

Should the WAC/MWC replace any of the following as a BCS conference..?

Big 10
ACC
Big LEast


...Would have said Pac 10 prior to bowl season, but props to them.

[OU_Sooners75]

reality check, please...

How so?

You are the one saying these teams had nothing to play for. When in fact that could not be further from the truth.

It is not my fault you think they didn't. Saying they had nothing to play for is like saying we have nothing to play for when we do not make the National Championship Game.

Believe it or not Rus, those kids still had their pride and the fact that they were still representing their schools. That in itself is more to play for than anything else outside of the National Championship.

[DMAFB_Sooner08]

Well lets send this thread in a new direction...

Should the WAC/MWC replace any of the following as a BCS conference..?

Big 10
ACC
Big LEast


...Would have said Pac 10 prior to bowl season, but props to them.

I dont believe the conferences as a whole should be replaced, the middle to bottom of the WAC/MWC are not all that great. I would love to see some super-conferences with these top teams in the WAC/MWC though!!

[IBleedCrimson]

I think arguments like this thread topic diminishes the accomplishment of the "underdog." Utah and ol miss outplayed their respective opponents. End of story. And if winningthe sugar bowl or a respected non bcs with the history of the cotton, isn't enough to get a team motivated, that's on the players and coaches. Don't like it? Don't get beat....

My .02

[OU_Sooners75]

Well lets send this thread in a new direction...

Should the WAC/MWC replace any of the following as a BCS conference..?

Big 10
ACC
Big LEast


...Would have said Pac 10 prior to bowl season, but props to them.

I think what they need to do is get rid of the conference ties altogether when it comes to BCS Bowl games.

1. I think the Top 10 BCS teams, regardless of conference affiliation needs to be in a BCS Bowl game.
2. Pit #1 vs. #2 (national Championship game), 3 vs. 4, 5 vs. 6, 7 vs. 8, 9 vs. 10.

If they would do it like this...This year, it would have been...

#1 OU vs. #2 Florida
#3 Texas vs #4 Alabama
#5 USC vs. #6 Utah
#7 Texas Tech vs. #8 Penn State
#9 Boise State vs. #10 Ohio State

[OU_Sooners75]

I think arguments like this thread topic diminishes the accomplishment of the "underdog." Utah and ol miss outplayed their respective opponents. End of story. And if winningthe sugar bowl or a respected non bcs with the history of the cotton, isn't enough to get a team motivated, that's on the players and coaches. Don't like it? Don't get beat....

My .02

Who is to say that Utah was truly an underdog? I mean coming into the Bowl Season, they were 1 of 2 undefeated teams. Whereas Alabama benefitted from playing in the SEC all season and then coming in with a defeat in their last game.

If the BCS would take it further than just pitting #1 and #2 against each other and make it where the other BCS Bowls pit the top 10 together...then Alabama and Texas would have been playing where USC would have played Utah.

Both I think would have benefitted football more than what we actually saw.

[IBleedCrimson]

Dbl post sry

[IBleedCrimson]

Who is to say that Utah was truly an underdog? I mean coming into the Bowl Season, they were 1 of 2 undefeated teams. Whereas Alabama benefitted from playing in the SEC all season and then coming in with a defeat in their last game.

If the BCS would take it further than just pitting #1 and #2 against each other and make it where the other BCS Bowls pit the top 10 together...then Alabama and Texas would have been playing where USC would have played Utah.

Both I think would have benefitted football more than what we actually saw.

I think ppl saw Utah as the underdog the same way they saw Boise as underdogs against us. Those programs simply don't get the name recognition traditional powers like bama get, and if we learned anything this season is that politics matter. It's not fair to those programs who have been consistently good for the last 5-6 yrs but it's the system. I definitely agree this is another example of how we need a playoff. I just don't think u can take away the significance of utahs win. They beat a damn good bama team in almost every facet. Props to utah in a great capper to a great season.

Sry of grammar and syntex is weird I'm on an iPhone

[Josh Eisenteith]

...and Utah had everything....just like T.Tech had nothing to gain in the Cotton and Miss had everything...those types of games are a recipe for an upset ....as happened twice today...

Bama looked like they didn't want to be there at all. They also looked very um, uncoached. If that makes any sense. They missed some fundamental tackles, and coverage.

[wishbonesooner]

Barry said it best, as usual: Bama wanted to be in the natl. championship game, Utah wanted to be in the Sugar Bowl. Saban did a poor job of getting the Tide ready to play.

[OPSEC]

#1 OU vs. #2 Florida
#3 Texas vs #4 Alabama
#5 USC vs. #6 Utah
#7 Texas Tech vs. #8 Penn State
#9 Boise State vs. #10 Ohio State

This actually looks pretty good. I would REALLY watch some of the bowls. Although, after watching SuCS, the 5 v 6 "might" have been the lone blowout.

[1890MilesToNorman]

Another spin on it,

The Bama players felt used and abused, 10's of thousands paying customers plus TV dollars to see them play and they get a measly $500 worth of token gifts. They felt like circus chips performing for growd up chilren! :P

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I think what they need to do is get rid of the conference ties altogether when it comes to BCS Bowl games.

1. I think the Top 10 BCS teams, regardless of conference affiliation needs to be in a BCS Bowl game.
2. Pit #1 vs. #2 (national Championship game), 3 vs. 4, 5 vs. 6, 7 vs. 8, 9 vs. 10.

If they would do it like this...This year, it would have been...

#1 OU vs. #2 Florida
#3 Texas vs #4 Alabama
#5 USC vs. #6 Utah
#7 Texas Tech vs. #8 Penn State
#9 Boise State vs. #10 Ohio StateExcellent! If we're not going to have a playoff, then we should have something like what you proposed.

[Sooner47]

...and Utah had everything....just like T.Tech had nothing to gain in the Cotton and Miss had everything...those types of games are a recipe for an upset ....as happened twice today...

Then we didn't deserve the criticism for losing to Boise State and West Virginia the last two years. But we sure as h*ll got it anyway. Is Bama less deserving of criticism for losing to Utah - I don't think so.

[bent rider]

...and Utah had everything....just like T.Tech had nothing to gain in the Cotton and Miss had everything...those types of games are a recipe for an upset ....as happened twice today...

That they had nothing to gain may have made them less motivated, but may be true for the first 5 minutes but to say they weren't motivated (by personal pride, if nothing else) to stick it back to Utah after the first TD or first 3 TDs, then something is wrong with Saban, etc.

If they really didn't care in that game, then the Sugar Bowl is Exhibit A of what is wrong with the bowl system. Why should one of the 4 marquee BCS bowl games be played by a team that has nothing to gain?

Would they care if it were a real PLAYOFF? Yes, then either they would have been eliminated in the game vs Florida or they would be playing for a chance to move through the playoff system to play OU or a get a rematch with Florida.

[bluedogok]

YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME......

It doesn't matter if it is for the MNC or to stay out of last place.....
Bama and OU in last years Fiesta Bowl didn't have that mindset (it was blind *** luck they made it into the 2007 Fiesta Bowl through Texas choking their way through the end of the season), they were too worried about not being in the game they wanted to be in and not in the game that they were. Just like Cal when Tech whacked them in the Holiday Bowl, all they talked about was being left out of the BCS/Rose Bowl by a Whorn team that lobby'd their way into the game.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Take tOSU in a bet for the Fiesta Bowl this monday!

[BoulderSooner79]

Then we didn't deserve the criticism for losing to Boise State and West Virginia the last two years. But we sure as h*ll got it anyway. Is Bama less deserving of criticism for losing to Utah - I don't think so.

Bingo! I propose no whining in this forum for an bowl game loss outside the title game. There is just no motivation to win and any player thinking about the NFL shouldn't even suit up.

[Jacie]

A whole lot of issues have appeared in this thread. Some more thoughts:

First, as a Sooner I appreciated the flea flicker play late in the game, because it gives someone other than OU fans a taste of being victimized by a trick play in a bowl game, though it would have been really special had the Utes scored on it. Still, it created a replay moment that will be shown for years to come.

Second, I agree with the comment about the $500 in goodies bowls can give every player of the participating teams (do some bowls give less?). The limit should be raised to something a tad more substantial, say $1000/player?

Third, the argument over BCS versus playoff ignores those of us who kinda liked the way it used to be. The bowls were played on Jan. 1 and there was often drama throughout the day if favored teams fell early making it possible for teams in later games (usually OU was one of these) to move up in the final poll and even finish #1. I don't think there was anymore controversy over who should have been crowned champion (by the polls) then than there is today with the carping over which teams should have been chosen to play in the title game. The only thing that has changed is now the process is spread out over a week and someone (not the schools really) is making a lot more money than under the old system.

[MojoRisen]

The fact that these players a lot of the skill players do not show up for the bowl games is a legit factor for some teams in why they loose non meaningful bowl games.

The opportunity to get hurt in the last game before a multi million dollar pay out is the absolute reason why these guys don't show up.

I had a brother blow out a knee in the Oil Bowl played between OU All State vs Texas All state.. He should not have played and Holtz had a heart attack that he did.

[Soonerus]

Just taking up for our Bama brethren....

[jkjsooner]

Count me in as another that does not buy the: nothing to play for spiel. If it's a game, and they're keeping score, which will of course be used to determine a winner and a loser, then there's what you have to play for. Are you a winner or are you a loser?

The thing is, it doesn't really matter how you think it should be. What matters is what 19-22 kids think.

It's not about being a loser or not being a loser. Football is a highly emotional game. As even Switzer has said plenty of times, you just can't get kids to be up for every single game. Human emotions are in play here.

It's not about kids not playing hard. You can play as hard as you want but if you don't have that little extra emotional push, that extra adrenaline flowing and your opponent does you are at a disadvantage.

No matter how much each individual Bama player wants to come out and play as hard as they can, you just can't fool yourself into believing this game was as important as the national championship game. This has always been a concern with 18-22 year olds. Not even the greatest coaches in the history of the game have been immuned to this.

[jkjsooner]

Then we didn't deserve the criticism for losing to Boise State and West Virginia the last two years. But we sure as h*ll got it anyway. Is Bama less deserving of criticism for losing to Utah - I don't think so.

I think you are making the same point as the original poster. By saying that Bama had nothing to gain it is, by extension, saying that we were in the same situation the last two years.

[SEC Fan]

The OU vs. UF game; USC victory; and Texas vs. Ohio State games have all been diminished to over-hyped games for a second place tie; or as I like to call-it: The first place loser bowls.

Fact is that Utah went undefeated in a very strong conference (Mountain West Dominated the Pac-10 in the regular season and Pac-10 went 5-0 in bowls); they dominated a premier SEC team on our home turf; and the do not have a loss on their record.

Utah is #1; the BCS stinks; and it's time for an 8-16 team play-off.

OU, Florida, Texas and USC have all lost one game. Therefore, they are all losers.

Utah is #1

[PDXsooner]

Saying you have nothing to play for is the #1 go-to excuse. Bottom line is if you're a competitor you compete.

[WileyCoyote]

Saying you have nothing to play for is the #1 go-to excuse. Bottom line is if you're a competitor you compete.

^^Ditto....AND ANBODY who really thinks other than THAT.....after all the years/months/days/hours of competing/practicing at this level in this sport....these young men go into these games like they have "nothing-to-play" for is ignorant of the fundamentals of competing/playing in major college sports.....and I am being kind....

I challenge anybody to refute that. I welcome any confirmations.

BOOMER !!!!!!

[Scott D]

Yeah, I am tired of that nothing to play for crap... However I can see Crabtree now -"saying damn, I am going to the next level, last thing I need to do is blow out a knee".

Same with Adrian Peterson I have to say it against Bosie...

I think you're mistaking Crabtree for Malcolm Kelly.


yeah I said it.

[Scott D]

Saying you have nothing to play for is the #1 go-to excuse. Bottom line is if you're a competitor you compete.

I agree nothing to play for/gain is a tired excuse. Even the more acceptable "disappointed or not as excited to be there" excuse is somewhat tired. As well as the "don't have anything to prove versus trying to gain respect" excuse.

[Frozen Sooner]

I'm pretty sure that AD's last play in the Fiesta Bowl was a fairly spectacular go-ahead TD run in OT. I'm sure he was just saving himself for the League though.

[KC//CRIMSON]

Just taking up for our Bama brethren....


Where does this crap come from?

I for one am glad that Alabamuh got it's *ss handed to them.

[BoulderSooner79]

I'm pretty sure that AD's last play in the Fiesta Bowl was a fairly spectacular go-ahead TD run in OT. I'm sure he was just saving himself for the League though.

AD was clearly rusty going into that game, but if he was thinking about the NFL, he could have easily declined to play. His shoulder was not healed, but he played his heart out. Likewise with Lofton last year - he played like his hair was on fire in the Fiesta and I'm sure he knew it was his last college game. If the players don't want to win, they should vote not to go and make room for another team.

[Curly Bill]

Saying you have nothing to play for is the #1 go-to excuse. Bottom line is if you're a competitor you compete.

...and there it is, brief and to the point.

[adoniijahsooner]

That's the difference between players like AD and players like Malcolm Kelly. Brad Childress says they have to tell AD to slow down in walkthrough preparations; and i just see AD looking at him like "wtf are you talking about?"

i think Bama's problem was more a youth thing, and they ran up against a team that was better than them.

[PLaw]

I think TTech just got outplayed. Both teams looked motivated to me. Crabtree being hurt was a major problem for the Sand Aggy.

Yeah, and Bama having 60% of their O-line out of action didn't help.

BOOMER

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Yeah, and Bama having 60% of their O-line out of action didn't help.

BOOMERI meant both Sand Aggy and Ole Miss seemed motivated. Bama didn't look mentally prepared to play Utah, to me.

[Blues1]

I also disagree - I think Bama had a lot to Prove - especially after losing their game to Florida --Plus Recruiting after going down to Utah would make me think IF I was high School senior, especially IF Mississippi or the Bulldogs were knocking on my door...JMHO

[Frozen Sooner]

Where does this crap come from?

I for one am glad that Alabamuh got it's *ss handed to them.

:mad:

[Frozen Sooner]

AD was clearly rusty going into that game, but if he was thinking about the NFL, he could have easily declined to play. His shoulder was not healed, but he played his heart out. Likewise with Lofton last year - he played like his hair was on fire in the Fiesta and I'm sure he knew it was his last college game. If the players don't want to win, they should vote not to go and make room for another team.

I don't know how much of it was rust vs. Boise State daring us to throw and us ramming AD into 8 man fronts play after play.

[BoulderSooner79]

Bama was definitely hurt by Smith's bonehead disqualification. Utah was getting a good pass rush and then the back-up got hurt and they had to shuffle guys to different positions. But the Bama D was intact and they were supposed to overwhelm Utah. Even when they didn't score, Utah consistently moved the ball, chewed clock and flipped field position. They earned it.

I'll bet Andre Smith is real popular on the Bama message boards.

[Sabanball]

Thanks, Soonerus. While you're right, there's no excuse for the way our team played last night. But it's over and all we can do is move on and learn from it.

Good luck to you guys in the BCS title game. A lot of Bama folks will be pulling for the guys in red come next week. You can count on it.

[Sabanball]

Bama was definitely hurt by Smith's bonehead disqualification. Utah was getting a good pass rush and then the back-up got hurt and they had to shuffle guys to different positions. But the Bama D was intact and they were supposed to overwhelm Utah. Even when they didn't score, Utah consistently moved the ball, chewed clock and flipped field position. They earned it.

I'll bet Andre Smith is real popular on the Bama message boards.

You got that right. He and his family.

[BoulderSooner79]

I don't know how much of it was rust vs. Boise State daring us to throw and us ramming AD into 8 man fronts play after play.

Yeah, I think our coaches thought our O-line + AD would overpower BSU. But I re-watched the game and AD missed some holes in the 1st half and didn't follow his blocks. He settled down in the 2nd half, but by then we were 18pts down. His TD in the overtime looked so easy, that I'm sure that's why BSU went for 2 - they knew AD was in the groove and it might be their last chance.

[Blues1]

Yeah, I think our coaches thought our O-line + AD would overpower BSU. But I re-watched the game and AD missed some holes in the 1st half and didn't follow his blocks. He settled down in the 2nd half, but by then we were 18pts down. His TD in the overtime looked so easy, that I'm sure that's why BSU went for 2 - they knew AD was in the groove and it might be their last chance.

Plus It's one thing to lose by One point in 40's score area are another to lose by 14 when you've been number 1 for 1/2 of the Season - Bama has more to cry and be down about than OU --- JMHO