injury/block on Box

[picasso]

cheap shot?

I noticed on the playback that the kid who did it was #8 from Tonkawa. Also noticed he's the one who tried to run down Alexander on the 2 point conversion return and shoved Box in the endzone.

I just thought it was a dirty block considering Box wasn't even in on the play.

is I reaching?

[oupride]

not at all, i am extemely p*ssed about it

[oudivesherpa]

There should at least be a inquiry to the Big XII office on this play and the Ref's in general.

[The Maestro]

Has anyone mentioned Box is out for four weeks or is this old news?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/football/ncaa/12/01/box.ap/index.html

[SoonerStormchaser]

Pic,
Not at all...but just like the fumble no-call, the refs had their blinders on.

[TUSooner]

Definitely a cheap and dirty play. I saw that hit and wondered why it passed without a flag or at least a comment. The blocker went right for the knee from the side. Somebody needs to stomp that guy's nutsack.
EDIT:
I guess I should qualify and say "From what I saw on one brief replay, it sure looked like" the blocker went right for the knee from the side. Somebody needs to stomp that guy's nutsack.

[BoulderSooner79]

It's old news about Box and from watching the hit and the way Box reacted, I'm betting it is touch and go on whether he makes the bowl game. Balogun looked pretty good for short time he was in there, but Mizzou will go after him.

[Partial Qualifier]

I haven't read the thread, so sorry if it's already been suggested, but I have an original thought I want to throw out there (before I forget!) -- someone needs to stomp on that guy's nutsack.

[SoonerPr8r]

I agree that guy's nutsack is just begging to be stomped. This would also give the extra bonus of him not being able to procreate which means less aggies in the world.

[PujolsFan]

Does anyone have a vid of the play? I missed the replay, but say Box laying on the ground and my heart sank... remembering what happened in Dallas after loosing our MLB Reynolds.

Hopefully OUr #10 Steps up and plays like a former #10 Linebacker we had a few years back... :)

[8timechamps]

I started a thread about this yesterday...in the middle of the jerk-o-thon. I mentioned that I too watched the game again, and it looked like a clean block (according to the letter of the rule). HOWEVER, it was a cheap/dirty shot.

Given the situation, a straight up block would have had the exact same effect.

Box and Bowling (#8) were going at it the whole game. It was clear his intent was to take him out. This needs to be addressed. But, it probably won't be.

[TXBOOMER]

I hope they take a look at it, if not the big 12, maybe Gundy. It was absolutely intentional. Hopefully AB will be back as stated in 4 weeks.

[BigRedJed]

I watched it several times on the DVR, and definitely thought it looked cheap. Away from the play, and intentionally low.

[olevetonahill]

Anyone got a Vid of it ?

[MamaMia]

Yes; not only was Box chop blocked but it came from the side and not in his line of vision. It takes a real sleazy punk to do that to a fellow athlete.

His name escapes me but the main ref on that crew is from Austin Texas. He and Bibles crew are both notorious for calling games in favor of OUs opponents. When I saw him on the field I literally got a knot in my stomach.

[soonerfan28]

It's old news about Box and from watching the hit and the way Box reacted, I'm betting it is touch and go on whether he makes the bowl game. Balogun looked pretty good for short time he was in there, but Mizzou will go after him.

I agree that Mizzou will probably go after Balogun if he's out there, but I think with the spread style that Mizzou runs that we'll see Quinton Carter playing more and just have Lewis and Clayton on the field so I don't think it will hurt that much. I was impressed with Balogun though.

[soonerfan28]

Bowling has played cheap even back in high school.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I mentioned that I too watched the game again, and it looked like a clean block (according to the letter of the rule). HOWEVER, it was a cheap/dirty shot.

this is based upon me rewinding a couple of times during the game. it was a WR outside of the TE making a block on a linebacker towards the ball - this classifies it as a crack block. crack blocks have to be the most evil kind of block ever, i loved them. unfortunately, they have specific rules:

1. you can't hit anyone not facing you. generally, the same rules with punt returns

2. you can't crack below the knees

[BigRedJed]

I agree about it being out of his line of vision too. It didn't look like Box saw it until the last minute, or expected it. The poke player probably could have gone high on him and damn near taken his head off for a clean SportsCenter-highlight-type block, but instead chose to go low.

To me, it looked dirty. Maybe not a rulebreaker to the letter of the law, but cowardly, and an attempt to take Box out of the game, if not worse. On that front: great success.

[soonerfan28]

And he probably got a high five as Box hobbled off the field.

[cvsooner]

Yes; not only was Box chop blocked but it came from the side and not in his line of vision. It takes a real sleazy punk to do that to a fellow athlete.

His name escapes me but the main ref on that crew is from Austin Texas. He and Bibles crew are both notorious for calling games in favor of OUs opponents. When I saw him on the field I literally got a knot in my stomach.


Randy Christal is the ref's name. It was odd...he needed OU to win or Texas Tech wins the Big 12 South. It was almost like they did what they could to make sure OU won, but not by too much. And losing a player or two was just a bonus. Sad.

[blackbeauty02]

anyone got a video of this? legal or not I thought it was a cheap shot

[wishbonesooner]

He has to come to Norman next year. Let's not forget.

[RacerX]

What's the QTR and time?

[Blitzkrieg]

karma = Lewis next year

[olevetonahill]

What's the QTR and time?

Dont remember the time But it was close to the end Of the 4th

[RacerX]

4th qtr, 14:25 left.

I'll have a video up tonight.

[olevetonahill]

4th qtr, 14:25 left.

I'll have a video up tonight.

Cool , I didnt think it was that early In the 4th .
Course I had had a few Brews By then .;)

[setem]

Over on the Insider Board they have a video and you can even see where the puke player grabs Box's foot to get more leverage.

What gets me is that the pokes are playing this off like it was nothing. Someone even said it was a "legal" hit because it wasn't from behind. IF IT HAD BEEN FROM BEHIND HIS LEG WOULD HAVE COLLAPSED WITH THE HIT AND HE WOULD BE HURT! What a bunch of ****heads!

Where is Sally the Puke now?

http://s33.photobucket.com/albums/d68/montysix/?action=view&current=e01cf93f.pbr

[tulsaoilerfan]

After seeing that again i don't see how on Earth that could be even close to a legal block; totally bull**** and someone needs to hand that *******'s head to him next year in Norman

[PujolsFan]

Looked to me like he dove at Box's knee... plain and simple "take him out" type of block. Totally uncalled for and cheap!!! Carma is a biotch and what goes around comes around...

[soonerfan28]

Weak *** bitch! Had Box been planted that could have been really messy.

[MamaMia]

Randy Christal is the ref's name. It was odd...he needed OU to win or Texas Tech wins the Big 12 South. It was almost like they did what they could to make sure OU won, but not by too much. And losing a player or two was just a bonus. Sad. Yeah, the refs made the team work hard for it. There were a lot of late hits and cheap shots on their part. Stinkin pokes.

[Leroy Lizard]

Chop block. Star defensive linemen are frequently double-teamed. When two players block the same opponent, officials must ensure a chop block has not taken place. In NFHS, a chop block is a delayed block at or below the knees of an opponent (other than the runner) who is in contact with a blocker’s teammate in the free-blocking zone. Such contact outside the zone is an illegal block below the waist (2-3-7, 2-3-9).

Under NCAA rules, a chop block is an obviously delayed block anywhere on the field at or below the thigh of an opponent (other than the runner) who is (a) in contact with; (b) in the act of disengaging from; or (c) has just disengaged from but is still confronting a blocker’s teammate. A chop block is delayed if it occurs more than one second after a teammate contacts the opponent. Also, a high/low combination block by two nonadjacent linemen with or without a delay between contacts is a chop block. When in question, an illegal delayed block is at or below the thigh of an opponent and, as such, is a chop block (2-3-3, 9-1-2p).

http://www.referee.com/more/samples/non_subscribers0903/free_upfront.html

[soonerboy]

I've had a stroke of genius! lets stomp on that guys nutsack!

[VA Sooner]

Direct helmet to left knee... I thought for sure it was going to be an MCL tear. Soonersports reported it as a left knee sprain but the replay I did last night showed it was a vicious hit. #8 needs to be taken out... one way or another for doing that to another athlete. Don't like seeing it done on the playing field with other atheletes... definitely don't like it with our own.

[Collier11]

http://s33.photobucket.com/albums/d68/montysix/?action=view&current=e01cf93f.pbr

[noobalicious]

Screw the sheephumpers

[SouthCarolinaSooner]

Looks like #85 Damian Davis?

He looks like a class act
http://www.nmnathletics.com.edgesuite.net/pics9/200/XY/XYNULPVIWQDGRDX.20080813215006.jpg

[olevetonahill]

I watched 6 times before I decided It definitely Was a Cheap shot.
I want to Put out a Contract on the Mother****er .:mad:

[JLEW1818]

****, every time i see that makes me wanna kill somebody, seems more cheap each time

[aurorasooner]

I watched it back several times before MNF. It was definitely an illegal block but whether it was a cheap shot is debatable. Another missed call to go along with the 2 missed fumble calls by Christal's inept crew.

[BoulderSooner79]

What was the other missed fumble call? Everyone saw the Hunter call to start the 3rd qtr, but I don't remember another one.

[aurorasooner]

What was the other missed fumble call? Everyone saw the Hunter call to start the 3rd qtr, but I don't remember another one. Sammy's recovery of his 1st fumble that was completely missed on the field, which (I think) we had to challenge in order to get a review.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Definition: A block by an offensive player who is usually spread out away from the main body of the formation and runs back in towards the ball at the snap, blocking an opponent back toward the original position of the ball at the snap.
Blocking below the waist or in the back in this situation is illegal.

Examples: An illegal crackback block is a personal foul and is penalized 15 yards against the offending team.

[BoulderSooner79]

Sammy's recovery of his 1st fumble that was completely missed on the field, which (I think) we had to challenge in order to get a review.

Oh, that was just confusion - maybe by the ABC coverage. It was called correctly on the field and it was OSU that challenged. It did become part of the anti-OU slant during the recap I saw on ESPN. They showed that play and said "OU caught a break". You could certainly say it was a break that we got our own fumble, but the wording implied that we caught an officiating break. And then they used the exact phrase when the Hunter fumble call was missed. Geez.

[Williesan]

Guys - I made a pretty clear assessment of the play where Box was injured early Sunday morning before the site started to get slammed with viewers.

Thanks to the video link to the play posted here, I firmly stand by my initial assessment that #85's actions were contrary to the rules and should warrant suspension from the conference. Whether they will nut up and do something remains to be seen. But I firmly believe that #85 Damian Davis's sophomore season should be over.

Here's the link to my assesment: LINKAGE (http://www.soonerfans.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2508444&postcount=8)

Williesan

[Mile High Sooner]

I watched 6 times before I decided It definitely Was a Cheap shot.
I want to Put out a Contract on the Mother****er .:mad:

That would be a Nutsack Contract... right?

[olevetonahill]

That would be a Nutsack Contract... right?

Ya , Reach Right Down thru his throat and Pull em Out thru His tonsils

[Williesan]

Oh, that was just confusion - maybe by the ABC coverage. It was called correctly on the field and it was OSU that challenged. It did become part of the anti-OU slant during the recap I saw on ESPN. They showed that play and said "OU caught a break". You could certainly say it was a break that we got our own fumble, but the wording implied that we caught an officiating break. And then they used the exact phrase when the Hunter fumble call was missed. Geez.

On Bradford's first fumble, there should not have been a need for a timeout for either team, as Bradford was clearly down and in possession of the ball. The fault there lies solely at the feet of Randy Christal and his crew for not blowing the play dead immediately on Bradford being in legal, uncontested possession of the ball, in clear sight and on the ground.

The Charlie Foxtrot occurred when they made no effort to overturn the call, leading to OU's timeout. It was then reviewed and correctly overturned. This fact was never announced on the field by Christal, leading everyone to believe that the call was reversed on the field by the officials (no mention of whether or not OU had challenged the call), leading OSU to call a timeout to get the correct personnel on the field, then calling another one to challenge the "ruling on the field." :eek: :confused:

The Hunter fumble was just a complete whiff by the officials. The ball was clearly out before Hunter was down, and Harris clearly recovered it (and remembering the Oregon game) then he made sure everyone saw the ball in his hands. They just missed it. :mad::mad::mad:

One fallacy to the replay rule is that if a play is run, the replay of the play in question becomes null and void. OSU to their credit lined up and ran a play before the replay official could make the page. That non-call cost OU a touchdown, and could have been a factor in the outcome of the game had our defense not risen up in the last half of the 4th quarter.

In this case, I propose a tweak to the replay rule. Give the opportunity for the replay officials to right an obvious wrong even if a quick play is run. For reference, in hockey, a puck that enters the net and riccochets out before anyone can react to it can be reviewed prior to the next face-off.

For example - In the 1994 Cup Finals, Vancouver seemingly scored a goal that would have effectively iced (no pun intended) the victory in game 4 or 5 turning momentum in the series. The goal judge missed the score, as did the referee so play contuned to the other end... where New York scored the tying goal. The call came down from the replay booth that they were looking at Vancouver's last scoring opportunity and sure enough, they saw the score. This nullified the NY goal, and the game clock was reset to the time of Vancouver's goal, face-off at center ice, play on.

If we have replay, then it needs to be used correctly in the right situations. If it is an obvious incorrect call, don't let a loophole in the rules potentially decide the outcome of a game.

Any takers? :)

Williesan

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

my personal viewpoint is that anything questionable that could change the outcome of the game should be reviewed. its not like its frickin hard to have 2 pagers - one for slow down, i need a longer look and one for i'm reviewing this one. my biggest issue with replay is they have no problem replaying a spot when the official rules a guy down 6 inches short of the goal line on an 80 yard pass, but they won't stop it to take a look on a questionable INT or fumble.

my other beef is with the absolute lack of illegal block penalties that have been called on our opponents this year, specifically on kickoff and punt coverage (and to a minor extent holds on our DEs). i'm one to rewind the tivo when i see a questionable block and its probably 4 to 1 against OU (the holds on our DEs are around 1.5 to 2-1. we get away with quite a bit of holding on our OL).

[olevetonahill]

My Beef with the Replay thing is .
ANY call should Be reviewable :cool:

[BigRedJed]

My beef with replay is that it doesn't make the officiating perfect. I don't even think it makes it better. Actually, the very fact that replay exists changes the way on-the-field officials call the game. It also misses many opportunities to right a wrong, such as the obvious, blatant fumble recovery on Saturday. It was stunning that the right call wasn't made in the first place, and personally I think the umpire probably saw the fumble but wasn't absolutely certain what happened, and assumed replay would catch it if it was legit, thereby nullifying the need for him to call it on the field. Before reply, he might have nutted up and thrown the beanbag.

Lemme ask you this: when was the last time you were watching a regular slo-mo replay, and were AMAZED that an official caught something in real time? When was the last time you saw a replay and it caused your respect for the officials to increase tenfold? Before replay officiating was introduced, I saw that type of thing all of the time. ALL of the time. These days, I rarely do.

It slows the game, it changes momentum, and while it sometimes helps right a wrong call, just as often it only legitimizes a bad call because there is "not enough evidence to overturn." Beyond that, as we have all seen, there are times when it results in a call that is DEAD WRONG.

We played this game for more than 100 years in this country. For almost all of that time, we had highly competent officials, especially at the highest levels of the game, and we trusted them to get things right, most of the time. Now we have replay, and gun-shy officials, and they get things right, most of the time.

Is there anybody here who feels like games have in general become better officiated since replay was added? Be honest now. IMO, there is far more controversy these days surrounding officiating. Coincidence? Maybe. Maybe not.

Heck, in the past several years OU by itself has had a number of calls nearly as egregious as the Keith Stanberry interception call. I would certainly put Oregon and Tech games in that category. How many did we have between 1984 and the addition of replay?

I've never wavered on this: I think replay sucks ***. I would love to see it done away with. Train your officials, compensate them well, review the hell out of their performance each week after games, and mercilessly fire the ones who consistently don't cut the mustard. Trust the ones who do, and realize that occasionally a bad call or no-call will slip through the cracks. Just like they have for more than a century. JUST LIKE THEY STILL HAPPEN, WITH REPLAY IN PLACE.

GET. RID. OF. IT.

[BigRedJed]

Back on topic: I really hope someone steps on that ag's nutsack.

[SoonersEnFuego]

my other beef is with the absolute lack of illegal block penalties that have been called on our opponents this year, specifically on kickoff and punt coverage (and to a minor extent holds on our DEs). i'm one to rewind the tivo when i see a questionable block and its probably 4 to 1 against OU (the holds on our DEs are around 1.5 to 2-1. we get away with quite a bit of holding on our OL).
I see them too. I always rewind the DVR to watch as well. It's not so much that blocks in the back get missed, but the type of block in the back. Sure you can let some of them go if they're away from the play, but the one's this year...have blatently been affecting the plays. It's ridiculous.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Looks like #85 Damian Davis?

He looks like a class act
http://www.nmnathletics.com.edgesuite.net/pics9/200/XY/XYNULPVIWQDGRDX.20080813215006.jpg

I hope we take his punk a$$ out next year! A couple of clothesline blocks would be great... That was a cheap *** hit f'ing aggie.

The refs were stupid as well - I had vision of Oregon with that no call fumble...I hope Stoops files a complaint.

[picasso]

Looks like #85 Damian Davis?

He looks like a class act
http://www.nmnathletics.com.edgesuite.net/pics9/200/XY/XYNULPVIWQDGRDX.20080813215006.jpg

yep, my apologies to slow #8 oSu receiver.

[Scott D]

ok point 1, did you really expect better from aggy?

point 2, Box had been favoring that leg for periods of time over the last three weeks. So it may have been a matter of time kind of thing.

point 3, at least for once with this team a knee injury was actually a contact thing (see Jason White x2, Lance Mitchell, and Ryan Reynolds)

I know point 3 still sucks, but at least with a contact related knee injury you see how it happened, and isn't as freakish as the non contact variety.

[BigRedJed]

In response to your point 2, if that's the case it seems entirely possible that they had spotted that on film and he went gunning for that leg. Which again brings us to point 1.

[cvsooner]

my other beef is with the absolute lack of illegal block penalties that have been called on our opponents this year, specifically on kickoff and punt coverage (and to a minor extent holds on our DEs). i'm one to rewind the tivo when i see a questionable block and its probably 4 to 1 against OU (the holds on our DEs are around 1.5 to 2-1. we get away with quite a bit of holding on our OL).


I'm so glad to know it's not just me. I know the rules have changed over the years, but I see so much holding by every offensive line that it's just...well, offensive to me as a former blocking tight end.

[Scott D]

In response to your point 2, if that's the case it seems entirely possible that they had spotted that on film and he went gunning for that leg. Which again brings us to point 1.

nah point 1 is always moot. you should never expect better from aggy. ;)

[RedstickSooner]

College football needs a penalty system to punish these sorts of plays like the NFL has. Obviously, we wouldn't use cash fines, and we wouldn't have the fruity, asinine powderpuff two-hand touch approach to quarterbacks the NFL has migrated towards, but we could certainly penalize teams that allow players to make cheap shots.

Hand out suspensions to players with remaining eligibility, and if a senior pulls this kind of nonsense at the end of the season, drop the hammer -- pull one scholarship for the following season from the team. After all, we expect seniors to provide leadership.

[Boomer Mooner]

Looks like #85 Damian Davis?

He looks like a class act
http://www.nmnathletics.com.edgesuite.net/pics9/200/XY/XYNULPVIWQDGRDX.20080813215006.jpg


DYN-O-MITE

[Rhino]

FYI, Box is still questionable, but the coaches are optimistic he'll be ready for the MNC game.

[oupride]

Thanks Rhino for the info.

[rainiersooner]

Good lord we've suffered through a lot of injuries this season.

[Soonerbuck1]

He's from Tonkawa! What do you expect?

[Chiliman]

Looks like #85 Damian Davis?

He looks like a class act
http://www.nmnathletics.com.edgesuite.net/pics9/200/XY/XYNULPVIWQDGRDX.20080813215006.jpg

Man, where is that ugly, thuglike lookin' dude from?

[picasso]

hey now. I'm not busting on the way the kid looks, just the cheap shot.