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Okla-homey
11/21/2008, 07:11 AM
Let's take stock so far shall we?

BHO is enlisting former Senate leader and DC uber-insider Tom Daschle as his health secretary.

HRC, a well-known Washington personality, will get State.

His attorney general will be Eric Holder, the Justice Department's No. 2 when WJC was president.

Rahm Emanuel, BHO's chief of staff, is another veteran of the WJC White House.

Change? or Clinton III?

SoonerBorn68
11/21/2008, 07:16 AM
The more things change the more they remain the same. :D

SoonerStormchaser
11/21/2008, 07:25 AM
How dare you question the messiah, sir!

I'll just keep quiet til he starts doing what I think he's gonna start doing.

soonerhubs
11/21/2008, 07:56 AM
Obligatory, "This thread is wrong for so many reasons, but since I can't list any I'll just say there are lots of them in an effort to look clever yet abstract," post. :D

OU4LIFE
11/21/2008, 08:32 AM
racist.

Czar Soonerov
11/21/2008, 08:40 AM
Why do you hate America?

oumartin
11/21/2008, 08:44 AM
heck, throw 25 billion of that 700 billion at em. At least then we would know where 25 billion of that money was going to waste.

Veritas
11/21/2008, 08:51 AM
Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss.

olevetonahill
11/21/2008, 09:07 AM
Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss.

Yup
A man spend 600 Million Bucks to get a Job that pays 400,000 a Year . thats Just ****ed up .
The Only Way this country is ever gonna CHANGE Is If we Have another Tea Party .

ousoonerfan
11/21/2008, 09:28 AM
Yup
A man spend 600 Million Bucks to get a Job that pays 400,000 a Year . thats Just ****ed up .
The Only Way this country is ever gonna CHANGE Is If we Have another Tea Party .


WORD!

Boomer.....
11/21/2008, 09:32 AM
Well, at least the economy is looking better.



;)

King Crimson
11/21/2008, 09:41 AM
commies or clintons?

the hypocrisy of these people is endless.

colleyvillesooner
11/21/2008, 09:51 AM
Clinton III is different than Bush IV.

Definitely a change...

OU4LIFE
11/21/2008, 09:59 AM
Clinton III is different than Bush IV.

Definitely a change...

If by 'Clinton III' and 'Bush IV' you mean 'Bullshiat Pollitician' then I agree.

at this point it's just a pi ssing contest between the parties. Not a single effing one of them cares to really do what's best for this country, and you'll not convince me otherwise. It's been heading this way for YEARS.

colleyvillesooner
11/21/2008, 10:02 AM
Yeah, but he's a different bullshiat politician...

:D

olevetonahill
11/21/2008, 10:25 AM
If by 'Clinton III' and 'Bush IV' you mean 'Bullshiat Pollitician' then I agree.

at this point it's just a pi ssing contest between the parties. Not a single effing one of them cares to really do what's best for this country, and you'll not convince me otherwise. It's been heading this way for YEARS.

Agreed

Echoes
11/21/2008, 10:55 AM
Personally, I don't think HRC will get Secretary of State. We will see though.... and boy Homey, it didn't take too awful long for the criticism to begin.. I figured it wouldn't be a day in office before the walls started melting around us, but it was even quicker then that :)


Edit: Oh wow, I hadn't read this morning (or last night) news. Apparently she WILL get sec. of state. My bad Homey, you are correct.

Half a Hundred
11/21/2008, 11:51 AM
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer...

I'd figure y'all would all be on board for the Clintons being out of this country as much as possible. Seems that while SecState is a high-prestige position, beyond an advisory role, everything has to go through the POTUS first.

Obama has managed to assuage and castrate the Clintons at the same time. I'd say it's a pretty shrewd move.

tbl
11/21/2008, 01:23 PM
Frankly, I'd rather him do what he's doing as opposed to something radically left (as a lot of people were fearing).

OklahomaTuba
11/21/2008, 02:11 PM
Of course, nuthin says CHANGE like having a VP who was in congress for 30+ years.

85Sooner
11/21/2008, 02:17 PM
Frankly, I'd rather him do what he's doing as opposed to something radically left (as a lot of people were fearing).

Something like getting an AG that pardons terrorists, mike rich, and operates in the manner consistent with the Elian Gonzales raid and the Waco fiasco.

sooner_born_1960
11/21/2008, 02:18 PM
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer...

I'd figure y'all would all be on board for the Clintons being out of this country as much as possible. Seems that while SecState is a high-prestige position, beyond an advisory role, everything has to go through the POTUS first.

Obama has managed to assuage and castrate the Clintons at the same time. I'd say it's a pretty shrewd move.
If, in fact, one or both of the Clintons end up castrated, I agree.

Okla-homey
11/21/2008, 03:23 PM
commies or clintons?

the hypocrisy of these people is endless.

At least it looks like he'll be keeping Gates at SECDEF. That's a smart move. No point changing horses midstream.

We'll know more after he takes office. It'll be nut-cuttin' time because for the first time in his life, he'll be held personally responsible for coming up with solutions.

It should be noted also, to date, the post-election stock market dip following his victory is the greatest post-election stock market dip in American history.

Half a Hundred
11/21/2008, 03:33 PM
At least it looks like he'll be keeping Gates at SECDEF. That's a smart move. No point changing horses midstream.

We'll know more after he takes office. It'll be nut-cuttin' time because for the first time in his life, he'll be held personally responsible for coming up with solutions.

It should be noted also, to date, the post-election stock market dip following his victory is the greatest post-election stock market dip in American history.

Gates has probably been the one of the best Secretaries of Defense of the modern era, if not top three. He's done a hell of a job revitalizing the meritocracy of the armed services, and increasing accountability in the higher levels. It's nice when we have pragmatic government officials.

I'd like to remind the honorable counselor that correlation does not equal causation :)

Okla-homey
11/21/2008, 03:43 PM
I'd like to remind the honorable counselor that correlation does not equal causation :)

so IOW, its all W's fault. Got it.

Whet
11/21/2008, 03:43 PM
Barack Obama has selected Gregory Craig as White House counsel, a move that will recall some controversial legal cases over the last few years. Craig has plenty of experience in politics as well as the courtroom, having served as Bill Clinton’s legal counsel during the impeachment hearings. Craig flipped from Hillary Clinton to Barack Obama early in the primaries, and Obama has repaid his support — but Craig’s caseload will raise a few eyebrows:

Gregory B. Craig, a well-known Washington lawyer who quarterbacked President Bill Clinton’s impeachment defense, has been chosen White House counsel by President-elect Barack Obama, according to Democratic officials., a well-known Washington lawyer who quarterbacked President Bill Clinton’s impeachment defense, has been chosen White House counsel by President-elect Barack Obama, according to Democratic officials.

Besides defending Clinton through the impeachment process, an effort that Craig lost, who else had the benefit of Craig’s counsel?

Elian Gonzalez’s father - Craig represented the father who demanded the return of his son after his estranged wife died trying to take Elian to freedom. Most people saw this as a thinly-veiled publicity stunt from Fidel Castro, attempting to embarrass the US. The dispute got resolved when Janet Reno ordered an armed assault on the house where Elian’s family in the US provided him a home.
John Hinckley, Jr - Craig presented and won the insanity defense that allows Ronald Reagan’s would-be assassin to spend weekends with his family now.
Kofi Annan - The former Secretary-General of the UN hired Craig to defend his interests in the Volcker Commission probe of the Oil-for-Food scandal, which put billions of dollars into Saddam Hussein’s pockets while providing cash for Annan’s son, his deputies, and some allege Annan himself.
Pedro Gonzalez Pinzon - A Panamanian legislator wanted for murdering an American soldier in 1992. The Dallas Morning News (http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/opinion/editorials/stories/DN-panama_14edi.ART.State.Edition1.3788f3d.html) demanded that Obama force Craig to drop the case during the campaign, but no report of whether he did is easily available.

Half a Hundred
11/21/2008, 03:51 PM
so IOW, its all W's fault. Got it.

It's a huge issue that no one politician can even begin to claim credit for, for good or bad.

Several administrations' worth of bad policy went into it. No one administration is going to completely fix it right away.

Jimminy Crimson
11/21/2008, 04:27 PM
Gates has probably been the one of the best Secretaries of Defense of the modern era, if not top three. He's done a hell of a job revitalizing the meritocracy of the armed services, and increasing accountability in the higher levels. It's nice when we have pragmatic government officials.

He's risen above his aggy-dom. Good job, Gates!

lexsooner
11/21/2008, 04:43 PM
Obama has selected some very experienced, mainstream people to fill his cabinet and act as his advisors. We should be thankful they are a highly talented group. It's not exactly a shock many of them have roots in the Clinton administration since Obama is, apparently, a Democrat. I'm still waiting for those who claimed Obama was a radical who will change our way of life to express their relief his choices strongly suggest he will be a mainstream President. Still waiting. . . .

Suppose Obama selected a bunch of no names with much less D.C. or international experience. Then his detractors would start even more threads stating they are too inexperienced, unproven, Obama is showing he is on the fringes, it is the blind leading the blind, etc. But instead, his detractors have apparently now forgotten their suggestions he is a radical outsider, and are harping on the fact he looks like a more of the same insider. The bottom line is Obama just can't win with some folks, who are not going to give him a chance and will find fault no matter what.

Harry Beanbag
11/21/2008, 05:22 PM
Obama has selected some very experienced, mainstream people to fill his cabinet and act as his advisors. We should be thankful they are a highly talented group. It's not exactly a shock many of them have roots in the Clinton administration since Obama is, apparently, a Democrat. I'm still waiting for those who claimed Obama was a radical who will change our way of life to express their relief his choices strong suggest he will be a mainstream President. Still waiting. . . .

Suppose Obama selected a bunch of no names with much less D.C. or international experience. Then his detractors would start even more threads stating they are too inexperienced, unproven, Obama is showing he is on the fringes, it is the blind leading the blind, etc. But instead, his detractors have apparently now forgotten their suggestions he is a radical outsider, and are harping on the fact he looks like a more of the same insider. The bottom line is Obama just can't win with some folks, who are not going to give him a chance and will find fault no matter what.


I can't stand the guy at all and still can't believe he won, but this sums up what I've been thinking the last few days. He was screwed no matter which way he went.

In the end I'm an American. Regardless of who is in charge, I want what's best for this country. We'll see what happens.

olevetonahill
11/21/2008, 05:55 PM
Lex . Im like Harry . Im gonna wait and see.
But the Man did Promise CHANGE . and it appears to Be the same ole same ole :rolleyes:

Okla-homey
11/21/2008, 06:12 PM
Obama has selected some very experienced, mainstream people to fill his cabinet and act as his advisors. We should be thankful they are a highly talented group. It's not exactly a shock many of them have roots in the Clinton administration since Obama is, apparently, a Democrat. I'm still waiting for those who claimed Obama was a radical who will change our way of life to express their relief his choices strongly suggest he will be a mainstream President. Still waiting. . . .

Suppose Obama selected a bunch of no names with much less D.C. or international experience. Then his detractors would start even more threads stating they are too inexperienced, unproven, Obama is showing he is on the fringes, it is the blind leading the blind, etc. But instead, his detractors have apparently now forgotten their suggestions he is a radical outsider, and are harping on the fact he looks like a more of the same insider. The bottom line is Obama just can't win with some folks, who are not going to give him a chance and will find fault no matter what.

Might as well get used to it. "W" had that to contend with since that January day in 2001 when SCOTUS ruled in his favor. From that moment forward, "W" was the selected (vice elected) president and the left howled and railed from one end of this country to the other.

The fact is, America split 50-50 for BHO. I too hope, for the country's sake, he does a superb job. But lets please stop with the "he got dealt a bad hand" and lowered expections stuff. The left didn't tolerate it when the right asserted the same things re "W" in the events following 9/11.

The bottomline is, come January, we'll be square in the middle of the Obama recession. Donk Congress for two years now, Donk WH. Then, we'll all hope and some of us will even pray, they make the proper decisions to help the private sector and markets pull us out of our economic tailspin. I'm hopeful because Pelosi sent the Big Three packin' this week telling them, "fellas, don't fly into DC in your private jets, then come to Congress with a tin cup." I don't care who you are, that's moxie right there.

And for the record, BHO remains a radical outsider. But he's apparently a practical one. That counts for something in my book. If he does in fact try to lead from the center, notwithstanding his personal feelings, and pulls some rabbits out of his hat he must pull, I might just vote for him in 2012. I'm already giggling with glee he has reneged on his campaign promise to immediately repeal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell.":D

I can only hope that now that he's getting presidential level national security briefings, he'll mellow on his withdraw from Iraq stance.

Frozen Sooner
11/21/2008, 06:17 PM
Something like getting an AG that pardons...mike rich...

Yeah, **** that guy. He should be in federal PMITA prison.

Frozen Sooner
11/21/2008, 06:20 PM
Might as well get used to it. "W" had that to contend with since that January day in 2001 when SCOTUS ruled in his favor. From that moment forward, "W" was the selected (vice elected) president and the left howled and railed from one end of this country to the other.

The fact is, America split 50-50 for BHO. I too hope, for the country's sake, he does a superb job. But lets please stop with the "he got dealt a bad hand" and lowered expections stuff. The left didn't tolerate it when the right asserted the samed things re "W" in the events following 9/11.

The bottomline is, come January, we'll be square in the middle of the Obama recession. Donk Congress for two years now, Donk WH. Then, we'll all hope and some of us will even pray, they make the proper decisions to help the private sector and markets pull us out of our economic tailspin.

And for the record, BHO remains a radical outsider. But he's apparently a practical one. That counts for something in my book. If he does in fact try to lead from the center, notwithstanding his personal feelings, and pulls some rabbits out of his hat he must pull, I might just vote for him in 2012. I'm already giggling with glee he has reneged on his campaign promise to immediately repeal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell.":D

I can only hope that now that he's getting presidential level national security briefings, he'll mellow on his withdraw from Iraq stance.

1. You seem to have difficulty understanding that the change most people were voting for was a change from the disastrous policies of the last eight years.

2. America was not split "50-50" for Obama. He won by 6.5% of the vote. No matter how you slice it, that's not "50-50."

3. "Obama Recession?" I'm sorry, but what in the holy **** are you talking about? The economy was deep in the ****ter a couple of months ago.

4. How has he reneged on any campaign promises when he hasn't even served a day in office?

Homey, you have a first-class mind. It baffles me why you just repeat whatever the nimrods in the conservative blogosphere say, as you're much smarter than they are.

Jerk
11/21/2008, 06:31 PM
3. "Obama Recession?" I'm sorry, but what in the holy **** are you talking about? The economy was deep in the ****ter a couple of months ago.



Do you want to invest in the stock market now when it looks like capital gains taxes could go up significantly in the future?

SoonerInKCMO
11/21/2008, 06:33 PM
I don't know about Froze, but any hesitancy I have about putting money in the market now has nothing to do with taxes. ;)

Half a Hundred
11/21/2008, 06:35 PM
Do you want to invest in the stock market now when it looks like capital gains taxes could go up significantly in the future?

From the way it looks, no one has to worry about capital GAINS for a while :pop:

Frozen Sooner
11/21/2008, 06:40 PM
Do you want to invest in the stock market now when it looks like capital gains taxes could go up significantly in the future?

Apparently someone did, as the market closed up 500 today.

And yes, absolutely. There's some real bargains to be had out there right now.

Regardless, the performance of the stock market is a trailing indicator of a recession, not a leading indicator.

And if you think that the recent performance of the stock market is solely or even in large part due to worries about capital gains taxes, you're living in fantasy land.

SoonerInKCMO
11/21/2008, 06:42 PM
I guess people think that Geithner dude knows some stuff.

I hope they're right.

Okla-homey
11/21/2008, 06:45 PM
1. You seem to have difficulty understanding that the change most people were voting for was a change from the disastrous policies of the last eight years.

2. America was not split "50-50" for Obama. He won by 6.5% of the vote. No matter how you slice it, that's not "50-50."

3. "Obama Recession?" I'm sorry, but what in the holy **** are you talking about? The economy was deep in the ****ter a couple of months ago.

4. How has he reneged on any campaign promises when he hasn't even served a day in office?

Homey, you have a first-class mind. It baffles me why you just repeat whatever the nimrods in the conservative blogosphere say, as you're much smarter than they are.

I don't even know what you're talking about bro. I don't read conservative blogs. Heck, I listen to NPR. I just think I know the American people. It'll be his recession come January. You watch. And that ain't wishful thinking campaign prognostication. That's this "flavor of the month," People magazine culture we inhabit. The only thing that might operate to prevent it would be if the mainstream media collectively decides to go positive as to their coverage of events in order to prop him up.

As to the election margin; pish-posh. I'm not counting the extra BHO votes in the blue states made possible by assorted shenanigans. We remain a deeply divided country.

In my heart and soul, I beleive the notion that government can "fix" problems of this magnitude was disproved during the FDR administration. You and I both know it took WWII to "fix" the Great Depression. Yes, there'll be a lot of smoke and noise, but the markets will either turn around or they won't. And government meddling, gubmint bail-outs and "increased regulation" aren't necessarily the solution.

Anyhoo, we'll see. This guy we elected is about to enter The Crucible. Let's hope he's up to it. And I say "hope" because he has never been even remotely similarly tested before.

SoonerInKCMO
11/21/2008, 06:51 PM
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/ToddG/chillthefout2.jpg

Veritas
11/21/2008, 09:26 PM
http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y52/ToddG/chillthefout2.jpg
I fricking hope so. But choosing HRC for SoS isn't exactly bolstering my confidence.

Curly Bill
11/21/2008, 10:13 PM
Obama has selected some very experienced, mainstream people to fill his cabinet and act as his advisors. We should be thankful they are a highly talented group. It's not exactly a shock many of them have roots in the Clinton administration since Obama is, apparently, a Democrat. I'm still waiting for those who claimed Obama was a radical who will change our way of life to express their relief his choices strongly suggest he will be a mainstream President. Still waiting. . . .

Suppose Obama selected a bunch of no names with much less D.C. or international experience. Then his detractors would start even more threads stating they are too inexperienced, unproven, Obama is showing he is on the fringes, it is the blind leading the blind, etc. But instead, his detractors have apparently now forgotten their suggestions he is a radical outsider, and are harping on the fact he looks like a more of the same insider. The bottom line is Obama just can't win with some folks, who are not going to give him a chance and will find fault no matter what.

Are you auditioning for JohnnyMack's role as leading liberal mouthpiece?

JohnnyMack
11/22/2008, 10:54 AM
Are you auditioning for JohnnyMack's role as leading liberal mouthpiece?

Werd. I been tied up in Baltimore dis week.

Curly Bill
11/22/2008, 03:49 PM
Werd. I been tied up in Baltimore dis week.

lex seems to have taken it upon himself to stand in for ya.

Can't let us mean ol' conservatives get away with anything. :D

SicEmBaylor
11/22/2008, 03:59 PM
Let's take stock so far shall we?

BHO is enlisting former Senate leader and DC uber-insider Tom Daschle as his health secretary.

HRC, a well-known Washington personality, will get State.

His attorney general will be Eric Holder, the Justice Department's No. 2 when WJC was president.

Rahm Emanuel, BHO's chief of staff, is another veteran of the WJC White House.

Change? or Clinton III?

He was talking about policy change not total/100% personnel change. You have to hire a staff that knows how to execute policy changes or the only change you're likely to see is a change in the administration in four years. It'd be totally irresponsible of Obama not to choose people who have experience.

His picks are so far solid, and I see no cause for concern aside from the possible exception of Daschle as Sec. of HHS.

W. Bush by the way promised change in a similar way that Obama has (though Bush didn't use it as his mantra nearly as effectively) and yet he staffed the White House with former Reagan and Bush-41 people.