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View Full Version : Blake IS a basketball god



stoopified
11/19/2008, 10:33 AM
I have followed OU basketball since the Bliss days and do not ever recall as dominant a rebounding performance by a Sooner as Blake has had in his first THREE games this season'I do not recall Tisdale or King or anyone else getting 18+ boards in a game much less doing it 3 times in a row.I know he can't continue this pace but still....


I understand the #1 pick talk now,before I thought well he is a good college player but so was Sheldon Williams.I am so glad we didn't lose Blake to an out of state school like we did Cartwright,Williams,Hopgood and other Oklahoma big men.

Boomer.....
11/19/2008, 10:55 AM
He is definitely a very impressive player. You never see a big man with the speed, power and agility that he has. Plus he can dribble the ball up the court.

Rock Hard Corn Frog
11/19/2008, 12:15 PM
IMO Blake has to stay at least 3 years (which won't happen) in order to be compared to Tisdale, who was simply so good for 3 years it was ridiculous. I will say even if Blake is here just 2 years he might be the best of the rest...and that includes some damn good players Mookie, King,Adams, etc.

He might turn out to be a better pro than even Tisdale though.

Don't want to hex him though. He has to stay healthy.

soonervegas
11/19/2008, 03:47 PM
If he gets us to the final four in Capel's 3rd year....I put him at even par with Tisdale.

Sooner04
11/19/2008, 03:52 PM
If he gets us to the final four in Capel's 3rd year....I put him at even par with Tisdale.
I respectfully disagree, mainly because I don't believe Blake will be able to get us there by himself. He'll need help from the other cogs.

2,661 points in three seasons. Consensus All-American as a true freshman, sophomore and junior. The greatest player in the history of the Big 8 Conference.

I don't think Blake can get there. Blake's All-World, Wayman was All-Galaxy.

stoopified
11/19/2008, 05:07 PM
First of all I don't think getting to the Final Four is an accurrate measure of how good an individual player is,that is a team accomplishement.Second WT never made it to a Final Four,Elite Eight his junior year was the end of the line as OU was ousted by BJ Armstrong and Iowa.

IMHO measuring the greatness of a basketball player based largely on team accomplisments is a poor measuring stick.It would be like measuring QBs based on NCs.In that case the 2 best QBs in OU history would be Jimmy Harris ,Steve Davis.Likewise if Final Fours are the criteria for individual greatness than King,McGehee are the two best big men in modern OU history.

In football many think Heupel,White (and yes Bradford) are the best QBs in modern history even though Heupel is the only one with an NC.IMHO in basketball the greatest big men in modern OU history are Tisdale,Adams,King, in that order with Blake figuring to be in there after this year.

Sooner04
11/19/2008, 05:11 PM
First of all I don't think getting to the Final Four is an accurrate measure of how good an individual player is,that is a team accomplishement.Second WT never made it to a Final Four,Elite Eight his senior year was the end of the line as OU was ousted by BJ Armstrong and Iowa.
We lost to Iowa in the Sweet 16 of '87 at the Kingdome in Seattle. I can't remember the name of the clown who hit the shot to beat us, but I ran across it on Youtube the other day. Ugh. UNLV was waiting on the winner, and I'm not sure we could've beaten them again. Arman "The Hammer" Gilliam, Freddie Banks, Mark Wade. Tough!

Wayman lost to Keith Lee and the Memphis State Tigers at Reunion Arena. I think Baskerville Holmes was on that team too for MSU. Billy sure would've enjoyed crashing the Big East party in Lexington that year.

King Crimson
11/19/2008, 05:13 PM
Blake is unreal...and we're lucky to have him. But, 2 games into his sophomore season is a little early to rolling out the superlatives.

i ain't going to blame the young people for getting hyped, but don't jump ship as quickly when we don't go undefeated.

stoopified
11/19/2008, 05:19 PM
We lost to Iowa in the Sweet 16 of '87 at the Kingdome in Seattle. I can't remember the name of the clown who hit the shot to beat us, but I ran across it on Youtube the other day. Ugh. UNLV was waiting on the winner, and I'm not sure we could've beaten them again. Arman "The Hammer" Gilliam, Freddie Banks, Mark Wade. Tough!

Wayman lost to Keith Lee and the Memphis State Tigers at Reunion Arena. I think Baskerville Holmes was on that team too for MSU. Billy sure would've enjoyed crashing the Big East party in Lexington that year.You are right it was Memphis who beat us BUT my point is the same ,WT did NOT make aFinal Four.

KC normally I would agree that 3 games into a sophomore season is a little early to put Blake on OU's basketball Mt. Soonermore BUT what he has done against NCAA tourney team opposition is something NO ONE else at OU has ever done PERIOD aginst ANY team.Barring injury I think he will break all single season rebounding records.IF he stayed at OU for 3 years he would own all career rebounding marks and proably be a TOP 10,maybe even Top 5 scorer.

IF OU makes it to a Final Four this year, it will be a team accomplishment just lke Kennedy,McCalister,Tisdale,Bowie made the Elie Eight,Grant,King,Blaylock,Grace,Seiger, and company was a team effort.Brewer,White,McGehee,and crew in the Final Four was also a team effort..No man makes it into the Final Four alone unless his name is BIRD. :)

King Crimson
11/19/2008, 05:29 PM
You are right it was Memphis who beat us BUT my point is the same ,WT did NOT make aFinal Four.

there's no comparison b/ween OU hoops after Billy Tubbs' and Kelvin's success to then.

what Tisdale did for OU basketball is unmeasurable.

we beat the #22 team in the nation *at home* in the first month of the season and we're already talking about this team better than '85? that's ridiculous.

Sooner04
11/19/2008, 05:31 PM
You are right it was Memphis who beat us BUT my point is the same ,WT did NOT make aFinal Four.
I think we're going to have to agree to disagree here. I can't get past the three-time consensus All-American honors. Wayman was as good as it gets, regardless of whether we lost to Memphis by two or beat those dogs by 30.

soonervegas
11/19/2008, 05:57 PM
We can all come back in April and talk about how I was right.....:)

badger
11/19/2008, 06:36 PM
His dunking power is certainly sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet :D

ouwapiti
11/19/2008, 07:30 PM
agree with most of what has been said....although......he's got a long way to go to be a 'back to basket, low post player'...ala tim duncan.....that being said, the low post is probably not his best position given his mobility and ball handling ability...definitely like his explosiveness on the boards....foul shooting has got to improve although it was very good against davidson....if not, the other team will use about 15-20 fouls on him per game

8timechamps
11/19/2008, 08:48 PM
A couple of things:

First, (as was mentioned by King Crimson), beating the #22 ranked team, at home, very early in the season doesn't mean a whole lot right now. HOWEVER, if Curry is as good as everyone thinks he is (and given his performance last year, and already into this year), I think Davidson will be ranked the entire season. You take him off that team, and the game is put away by halftime.

Second, Comparing Griffin to Wayman is reaching at this point. I was fortunate enough to watch WT play in the Big 8 tourny in '85. I think he ended that season close to 60% average in fg. When Bookout had a big season in '04, I thought he could be the next coming of WT (not to knock King), and he was never able to become that player. I don't know how much of that was due to injuries or even the system, but there has yet to be another WT. Blake could be that guy, but I doubt he'll stay around long enough for us to find out.

On a side note, I don't know how much success Griffin will have in the NBA. He's certainly going to have much more difficulty being able to be more physical at the next level.

stoopified
11/20/2008, 10:49 AM
there's no comparison b/ween OU hoops after Billy Tubbs' and Kelvin's success to then.

what Tisdale did for OU basketball is unmeasurable.

we beat the #22 team in the nation *at home* in the first month of the season and we're already talking about this team better than '85? that's ridiculous.I agree that between Bruce Drake and the Tubbs -KS era OU basketball was non existant and WT coming to OU put OU b-ball on the map BUT do you not think Blake is doing the same for the Capel era?Because of Blake(and the coaching of Capel) we are getting top-notch recruits to OU in unprecedented numbers(especially for a three year period).

I have not and do not suggest that this team ranks with the '85-'86 Tisdale team or the '87-'88 NC runnerup team,what I am saying is that it is a great start on the road to that level and COULD be reached this year.Look at my preseason pick(season as I see it,hope it goes),I have OU competing for the Big 12 and going Sweet 16, not going Final Four.

I do proclaim that even though it is only 3 games into his sophomore year Blake has shown the skill level he has to be up there with WT,Adams,King.While Blake will not be a 3-time AA,in fact will not even be at OU for three years he is is showing a glimpse of greatness and over the season I think he will prove worthy INDEED of #23.

8timechamps
11/20/2008, 11:09 AM
I agree that between Bruce Drake and the Tubbs -KS era OU basketball was non existant and WT coming to OU put OU b-ball on the map BUT do you not think Blake is doing the same for the Capel era?Because of Blake(and the coaching of Capel) we are getting top-notch recruits to OU in unprecedented numbers(especially for a three year period).

I have not and do not suggest that this team ranks with the '85-'86 Tisdale team or the '87-'88 NC runnerup team,what I am saying is that it is a great start on the road to that level and COULD be reached this year.Look at my preseason pick(season as I see it,hope it goes),I have OU competing for the Big 12 and going Sweet 16, not going Final Four.

I do proclaim that even though it is only 3 games into his sophomore year Blake has shown the skill level he has to be up there with WT,Adams,King.While Blake will not be a 3-time AA,in fact will not even be at OU for three years he is is showing a glimpse of greatness and over the season I think he will prove worthy INDEED of #23.


There's no doubt that Capel is bringing in recruits that could raise OU to never-before-seen levels (wow, did I just say that?). And, I agree that we will be competing for the conference title this year (and apparently for years to come).

Blake is a stud (I've been more impressed with his rebounding than anything else). IF he gets the help that I think the supporting cast is capable of, this team could make a serious run in March.

We won't see another player with the abilities of Curry. Even though Texas has Abrams, I don't see him as the threat Curry was/is. Even though Texas is ranked higher (and we all know how good preseason rankings are), I think we take the Big XII this year.

My question is, are we good enough to think #1 seed this year?

Taxman71
11/20/2008, 11:11 AM
I think Blake will likely have a greater impact in the NBA player than Tiz, but I don't plan on seeing a better college player than WWT at OU in my lifetime. I was fortunate to attend most of his games in Norman and watch every televised game of his career and I am telling you, he was the best player on the court every game of his career, including the very first one.

8timechamps
11/20/2008, 11:12 AM
I think Blake will likely have a greater impact in the NBA player than Tiz,

Really? I'd love to see that, but I just don't think he'll be able to "out-physical" players at the next level, like he does now.

stoopified
11/20/2008, 11:42 AM
Really? I'd love to see that, but I just don't think he'll be able to "out-physical" players at the next level, like he does now.If you think Blake is only about out-physicalling people,you haven't been paying attention.However that is the way WT played for around 12 years in the NBA and Blake is equally equipped to do the same.He is grabbing boards,and driving with finesseas well,and passing the ball(no offense but once WT got the ball it was GONE).

I agree that Blake COULD be a better NBA player than WT.IMHO Blake is a better ballhandler,plays harder and has a greater skill set than WT and yes I saw him play many times too.I loved WT,Choo,David Johnson and those guys(not McCalister so much).Is Blake a better player than WT?My answer at this point is NOT yet.

What I really love is that we have a passonate BASKETBALL thread going on and football season is still going hot and heavy.I don't recall a whole lot of passionate basketball talk around here even after football is over.

OUmillenium
11/20/2008, 01:06 PM
We lost to Iowa in the Sweet 16 of '87 at the Kingdome in Seattle. I can't remember the name of the clown who hit the shot to beat us, but I ran across it on Youtube the other day. Ugh. UNLV was waiting on the winner, and I'm not sure we could've beaten them again. Arman "The Hammer" Gilliam, Freddie Banks, Mark Wade. Tough!

Wayman lost to Keith Lee and the Memphis State Tigers at Reunion Arena. I think Baskerville Holmes was on that team too for MSU. Billy sure would've enjoyed crashing the Big East party in Lexington that year.

That was the first OU basketball game I ever recorded and I still have it on tape. Watched it at least 100 times.

I think BJ put it into overtime then Roy Marble hit the gamewinner. Other Iowa players included Kevin Gamble, Brad Lohaus(?), and Horton.

Heartbreaker. I loved our seniors that year - TMAC, Choo, DJ, Chuck Watson

OUmillenium
11/20/2008, 01:07 PM
UNLV - Gerald Patio, Jarvis Basnight (missed gamewinning dunk v OU) also

King Crimson
11/20/2008, 02:10 PM
That was the first OU basketball game I ever recorded and I still have it on tape. Watched it at least 100 times.

I think BJ put it into overtime then Roy Marble hit the gamewinner. Other Iowa players included Kevin Gamble, Brad Lohaus(?), and Horton.

Heartbreaker. I loved our seniors that year - TMAC, Choo, DJ, Chuck Watson

what's not to love about Chuck Watson getting a little luv.

that game really pissed me off. almost as bad as the Bryant Stith or Roosevelt Chapman games.



spek.

Sooner04
11/20/2008, 02:24 PM
Now that I think of it, I think Gamble hit the shot.

Tubbs tried the old "run over the guy on the baseline" play on the following inbound, but we didn't get the call. Still, no way we beat UNLV twice. Those guys were stallions. The '87 UNLV team was probably better than the team that won it in '90.

8timechamps
11/20/2008, 03:04 PM
If you think Blake is only about out-physicalling people,you haven't been paying attention.However that is the way WT played for around 12 years in the NBA and Blake is equally equipped to do the same.He is grabbing boards,and driving with finesseas well,and passing the ball(no offense but once WT got the ball it was GONE).

I reread my post, and it came across like I thought Blake was all about being physical. I certainly don't think he's only a physical player. And, you are correct, he has all the tools. I supose my cautious stance comes from watching so many good college players end up mediocre (at best) pros. It also comes down to where he lands in the NBA. I remember a time when Ed O'Bannon was supposed to make a big impact on the NBA (similar size and skill to Blake). He was a stud in college, then a big time flop in the NBA. Some say his work ethic changed, and others say he couldn't fit into the Nets/Butch Beard (remember him?) system. Again, I'd love to see Blake turn into a great pro, but I'll just reserve my excitment until he's at least drafted.



I agree that Blake COULD be a better NBA player than WT.IMHO Blake is a better ballhandler,plays harder and has a greater skill set than WT and yes I saw him play many times too.I loved WT,Choo,David Johnson and those guys(not McCalister so much).Is Blake a better player than WT?My answer at this point is NOT yet.

I guess that's more my point. He's not there yet.



What I really love is that we have a passonate BASKETBALL thread going on and football season is still going hot and heavy.I don't recall a whole lot of passionate basketball talk around here even after football is over.

I'll be honest, After the KS departure, I lost a lot of the interest and enthusiasm that I had. I wasn't sure that Capel was the right guy, so I was a bad fan for a while (cheering at arms length, so to speak).

For some reason, I started to pay more attention half way through last year, and I'm back. I'm not a fair weather fan, as I was a fanatic in the late 70's through the end of the KS era. I guess I took a short time off, but I'm back.

It is different to have this much "action" on the bball board late in the football season. Let alone this week!

Taxman71
11/20/2008, 04:38 PM
Really? I'd love to see that, but I just don't think he'll be able to "out-physical" players at the next level, like he does now.

Having sat on the 3rd row Monday and Tuesday in Norman to see Blake, then the 5th row at the Thunder game last night....I can easily see why Blake will be drafted in the top 5. Blake is way more athletic than any of the guys his size and above I saw last night. Plus, I think he will continue to develop his game. If he can consistently hit from 12 feet in, he could be an all star at the next level.

8timechamps
11/20/2008, 04:48 PM
Having sat on the 3rd row Monday and Tuesday in Norman to see Blake, then the 5th row at the Thunder game last night....I can easily see why Blake will be drafted in the top 5. Blake is way more athletic than any of the guys his size and above I saw last night. Plus, I think he will continue to develop his game.

See my comments above about Ed O'bannon. Again, I think Griffin has the tools, but a lot of guys did in college. I'm just keeping my excitment bottled until he plays a few NBA games. Heck, I know he's better than Najara, and look how he's done. I was bummed when we let him go.



If he can consistently hit from 12 feet in, he could be an all star at the next level.

I don't doubt that he can fine tune his skills to be deadly from that range, the real question is can he do it when he's on the floor with 9 other NBA pros?

Taxman71
11/20/2008, 05:01 PM
Since the NBA came to town, I have realized that the mandatory requirements for an NBA player (with very limited exceptions) to be effective in the league long term is as follows:

1. Size
2. Defensively sound
3. Be physical in the paint
4. Be able to shoot 50% from free throw range and in.

I have no doubt about Blake satisfying the first 3 items above right now which is enough to keep you in the league (trust me, that is all the OKC big men can do right now). Adding #4 puts you in KG territory (and, no, I am NOT saying Blake will be the next KG....but KG is an example of a big man who plays 100% all the time, is violently physical in the paint and can stroke it outside).

Chris Kaman all but dominated the Thunder last night and I could see Blake pushing him around and taking him off the dribble.... and Kaman is a good player. The only big man approaching Blake's strength on the floor was probably Wilcox. He is OKC's best big man when healthy.

8timechamps
11/20/2008, 06:05 PM
As a long time Nugget fan (and living in Denver, going to games for the better part of 14 years), I have a fairly good understanding of what a prototypical NBA forward looks like.

You are pretty much spot on with your four point "requirments".

However, and this is probably where we differ, I still don't know if Blake is physical enough to succeed at the next level. I know he can rebound and be physical in college, but as you know, playing in the NBA is like playing against college all-stars every night.

It's wrong for me to make a comparison between Griffen and Carmelo Anthony...there are few Melos in the world. But, if I compare him to say a Linas Klieza or Nene, it's hard for me to see him playing at that level.

That's not to say this year won't help to develop his skills in a way that makes him the next Melo...just don't see it right now.

soonervegas
11/20/2008, 06:07 PM
What I really love is that we have a passonate BASKETBALL thread going on and football season is still going hot and heavy.I don't recall a whole lot of passionate basketball talk around here even after football is over.

I think there are about 10 of us that are pretty passionate from year to year....lots of familiar screen names. Now if we could just times that by about 1000

stoopified
11/20/2008, 07:06 PM
I reread my post, and it came across like I thought Blake was all about being physical. I certainly don't think he's only a physical player. And, you are correct, he has all the tools. I supose my cautious stance comes from watching so many good college players end up mediocre (at best) pros. It also comes down to where he lands in the NBA. I remember a time when Ed O'Bannon was supposed to make a big impact on the NBA (similar size and skill to Blake). He was a stud in college, then a big time flop in the NBA. Some say his work ethic changed, and others say he couldn't fit into the Nets/Butch Beard (remember him?) system. Again, I'd love to see Blake turn into a great pro, but I'll just reserve my excitment until he's at least drafted.



I guess that's more my point. He's not there yet.



I'll be honest, After the KS departure, I lost a lot of the interest and enthusiasm that I had. I wasn't sure that Capel was the right guy, so I was a bad fan for a while (cheering at arms length, so to speak).

For some reason, I started to pay more attention half way through last year, and I'm back. I'm not a fair weather fan, as I was a fanatic in the late 70's through the end of the KS era. I guess I took a short time off, but I'm back.

It is different to have this much "action" on the bball board late in the football season. Let alone this week!I agree prety much straight up.I understand your caution at projecting BG in the NBA.The first name that comes to my mind about a great college player disappearring in the NBA is Oklahoma's own Sheldon Williams.Stacy King catches a lot of flak for not being a star in the NBA but at least he was a top notch reserve and had some really good gmes at key moments in his career BUT Williams has VANISHED.I don't know if he has been hurt or just sucks as a pro.I can't see that happening to Blake,but I didn't think Sheldon would bomb in the NBA either.

stoopified
11/22/2008, 06:58 PM
Balke has just SICK numbers after 4 games,averaging 26PPG.19.8 RPG,shooting something like 77% from the field(ok he is hooting around 55% from the FT line).Monster numbers.

journeyman
11/23/2008, 01:25 AM
Quite simply, there will never be another Wayman Tisdale anywhere in college basketball. 3-time first team AA who averages 25+ ppg and 10+ boards for a career. Singlehandedly puts a program on the map in such a way that it has stayed for 25 years now. Guys who do that for a year nowadays are one and done.

As great as I think Blake is, he would have to stay for at least one more year, maintain his current season averages, AND bring home the one piece of hardware missing at LNC to compare with Wayman.