Gee, the automatic weapons crowd just keep making the argument for themselves, eh?

[Tear Down This Wall]

What a great end to a father-son outing to the gun show. Idiots. They'll never learn. Child after child will have to die "accidentally" before someone finally does something about this kind of crap. Fire away, Second Amendment bangers - pun intended.

Oh, and for those of you bound to show me your full cowardice by the way of negspek, say what you want, but spare me the "Reagan would be ashamed on me" bullcrap. Ronald Reagan would in no way have been a part of handing an 8-year old boy an Uzi and you damn well know it.

Grieving father says he gave son, 8, permission to fire Uzi
October 27, 2008 02:18 PM Email| Comments (440)| Text size – +
By David Abel and Andrew Ryan, Globe Staff, and Matthew P. Collette, Globe Correspondent

Dr. Charles Bizilj stood 10 feet behind his son this weekend at a "Machine Gun Shoot" in Westfield, where the third grader aimed an Uzi at a pumpkin in the distance.

As Bizilj reached for his camera, the boy clutched the gun in his arms and squeezed the trigger. The Uzi flipped backwards and 8-year-old Christopher Bizilj fatally shot himself in the head.

“It was all a blur,” Dr. Charles Bizilj said this afternoon in a telephone interview. “I’m still in the grieving process.”

Christopher was accompanied by a trained professional as he held the 9-mm Micro Uzi machine gun at the Westfield Sportsman's Club Sunday afternoon, but Bizilj said he doesn’t think the shooting guide was holding the weapon as his son pressed the trigger.

“This accident was truly a mystery to me,” he said. “This is a horrible event, a horrible travesty, and I really don’t know why it happened. I don’t think it’s relevant that he wasn’t holding the weapon.”

He said his son, a third grader who loved to hike and bike, had experience firing handguns and rifles. But he said this was the first time he had fired an automatic weapon.

"I gave permission for him to fire the Uzi,” Bizilj said. “I watched several other children and adults use it. It’s a small weapon, and Christopher was comfortable with guns. There were larger machine guns with much more recoil, and we avoided those.”

Bizilj, the medical director of the emergency department at Johnson Memorial Hospital in Stafford Springs, Conn., said that his son was “very cautious, very well trained, and very much enjoyed firing.”

When his son pressed the trigger Sunday, it was the first gun he had fired all day. “It took about an hour to get there, and it was something he was looking forward to for months,” Bizilj said.

The annual Machine Gun Shoot and Firearms Expo is a two-day event. Police are investigating whether the Westfield Sportsman’s Club and the group running the event were licensed. “We haven’t confirmed whether either have been licensed,” said Westfield Police Lieutenant Hipolito Nuñez.

The sportsman's club boasted in an advertisement for the event posted on its website that the $5 entry fee was waived for children under age 16 and there was "no age limit or licenses required to shoot machine guns."

"It’s all legal & fun," the advertisement says. "You will be accompanied to the firing line with a Certified Instructor to guide you. But You Are In Control – "FULL AUTO ROCK & ROLL."

Shooting targets for the event included vehicles, pumpkins, and "other fun stuff we can’t print here," according to the advertisement.

Christopher Bizilj was firing the weapon at an outside firing range and was wounded once in the head when the recoil forced the gun to rotate upward and backward, Nuñez said. The boy was taken to Baystate Medical Center in Springfield. He was pronounced dead at the hospital with one gunshot wound to the head. No one else was injured.

State law requires anyone under age 18 to have parental consent and a licensed instructor to fire an automatic weapon. Otherwise, there’s no minimum age to fire such a gun, Nuñez said.

“We do not know at this time the full facts of this incident, and it's being investigated," Nuñez said.

The event at the club was organized by C.O.P. Firearms & Training, an Amherst company that, according to its website, organizes machine gun shoots throughout New England. Officials from that group also could not be reached.

[Curly Bill]

You didn't call us Flying Dickwheels? :confused:

Why not? We like that. :D

[Curly Bill]

....and why would negging you make anyone a coward? :confused:

...I mean if you want to come to my house I will punch you.

[JohnnyMack]

IBJerk.

[Jerk]

IBJerk!

Good call, but I'm not going to even bother with this.

[TMcGee86]

Soooo...

what you're saying is all automatic weapons should be banned because one dip**** let his 8 year old fire one?


Here's a scenario: A father let's his son drive the truck as they are out at the ranch. Son's sitting in Dad's lap, driving over the fields, and accidently hits the gas and the truck lurches forward, hits a tree, and the boy is pinned against the steering wheel and killed.

Should we ban all automobiles?

[Jerk]

Soooo...

what your saying is all automatic weapons should be banned because one dip**** let his 8 year old fire one?


Here's a scenario: A father let's his son drive the truck as they are out at the ranch. Son's sitting in Dad's lap, driving over the fields, and accidently hits the gas and the truck lurches forward, hits a tree, and the boy is pinned against the steering wheel and killed.

Should we ban all automobiles?

You might as well be talking to a rubber ball or a bag or rocks.

[Curly Bill]

You might as well be talking to a rubber ball or a bag or rocks.

...or a wall. :P

[Jerk]

...or a wall. :P

Yeah, I was thinking about getting in, but why bother? I don't have time to come in here and argue every time there is a tragedy involving a gun, or a car, or fireworks, or a bicycle, a swimming pool, pit bull, etc.

Sad story, though. Father is a dumbass.

[Rogue]

Tragic.

[Curly Bill]

We can all testify that this is a tragic situation...

What makes me mad is there's always someone, or bunches of someones, that want to make political hay out of it. I don't know that they see so much the tragedy of it, but the political opportunity they think they can exploit.

[olevetonahill]

I nevar let my Kids around guns. I did let em blow **** up with Dynamite tho.:rolleyes:

[GrapevineSooner]

Soooo...

what you're saying is all automatic weapons should be banned because one dip**** let his 8 year old fire one?


Here's a scenario: A father let's his son drive the truck as they are out at the ranch. Son's sitting in Dad's lap, driving over the fields, and accidently hits the gas and the truck lurches forward, hits a tree, and the boy is pinned against the steering wheel and killed.

Should we ban all automobiles?

What McGee said.

I'm all for the 2nd Amendment and giving people the ability to defend themselves. But I also believe that such rights also bring about great responsibility and with it, strict adherence to all sensible rules of safety.

Violate just one of those rules and woe to be you.

[soonerinabilene]

What a great end to a father-son outing to the gun show. Idiots. They'll never learn. Child after child will have to die "accidentally" before someone finally does something about this kind of crap. Fire away, Second Amendment bangers - pun intended.



By "doing something about this kind of crap" do you mean getting rid of stupid parents who do not have good judgement? Because I am all for that. But it was the stupidity of the dad, not the fact that automatic weapons are available, that caused this tragic accident.

[royalfan5]

I want to know wtf kind of Dr. the dad was. It seems to me to be pretty much common sense that maybe you should make your 8yr old wait a little longer before he gets to fire an automatic weapon. The age for Hunter's safety up here is 11/12ish and that seems like a lot better age to be introducing kids to firearms than 8.

[Viking Kitten]

I want to know wtf kind of Dr. the dad was.


Bizilj, the medical director of the emergency department at Johnson Memorial Hospital in Stafford Springs, Conn., said that his son was “very cautious, very well trained, and very much enjoyed firing.”This is just a sad story.

[proud gonzo]

sad story yes, but how exactly can you blame guns for this? The father is an idiot.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

I want to know wtf kind of Dr. the dad was. It seems to me to be pretty much common sense that maybe you should make your 8yr old wait a little longer before he gets to fire an automatic weapon. The age for Hunter's safety up here is 11/12ish and that seems like a lot better age to be introducing kids to firearms than 8.

My daughter is 8.

She's familiar with my firearms. When I break 'em down to clean, she sits with me. We go over the parts. I explain to her why I'm doing what I'm doing. I've even had her help with reassembling my 870. She knows exactly how to operate it as well as my other firearms. She knows exactly why there's a safety, knows exactly why you never rely on it, and knows that regardless of what the breech tells you, a firearm is always loaded and that a firearm is always deadly.

She's seen firsthand the carnage of what 12 gauge double-ought will do. She's seen the powerful force behind #8 and the pattern it lays. She's seen the quiet, sneaky, yet deadly result of a .22 LR and the concussive death at the tip of a 9mm round.

Not because I want my daughter to become some trophy marksman (though she's got a damn steady hand!), and not because I'm trying to sell my daughter on hunting with me (though I'd sure love it if she did). She knows because she needs to understand the deadly nature of firearms, how to respect a firearm, and how to exist around them. How to demand safety from yourself when wielding a firearm and how to DEMAND safety when around others with firearms. She needs to understand that like with any tool, there is a safe manner that protects her very wellbeing and the fool's choice, ignorance, apathy, recklessness, or all of the above.

This started with her a long time ago. As soon as she was old enough to get to where I keep my firearms. She sees them as a dangerous, yet useful tool. You don't play with daddy's table saw, you don't play with daddy's welder, and you damn sure don't play with daddy's guns. Let me show you why. This blade is finger-removing sharp. The electricity flowing through this wire is enough to melt steel, let alone your flesh. The damage that comes from the end of this weapon will kill you. Period.

Ignorance, such as keeping your children away from firearms in the home until some ethereal, state-sponsored age requirement is met, is not only stupid, it's putting the children you love in harm's way. As a father, there's no way in hell that's happening in MY house. Especially considering my primary duty as a father is to see to the wellbeing of that beautiful, green-eyed girl of mine.

[royalfan5]

My daughter is 8.

She's familiar with my firearms. When I break 'em down to clean, she sits with me. We go over the parts. I explain to her why I'm doing what I'm doing. I've even had her help with reassembling my 870. She knows exactly how to operate it as well as my other firearms. She knows exactly why there's a safety, knows exactly why you never rely on it, and knows that regardless of what the breech tells you, a firearm is always loaded and that a firearm is always deadly.

She's seen firsthand the carnage of what 12 gauge double-ought will do. She's seen the powerful force behind #8 and the pattern it lays. She's seen the quiet, sneaky, yet deadly result of a .22 LR and the concussive death at the tip of a 9mm round.

Not because I want my daughter to become some trophy marksman (though she's got a damn steady hand!), and not because I'm trying to sell my daughter on hunting with me (though I'd sure love it if she did). She knows because she needs to understand the deadly nature of firearms, how to respect a firearm, and how to exist around them. How to demand safety from yourself when wielding a firearm and how to DEMAND safety when around others with firearms. She needs to understand that like with any tool, there is a safe manner that protects her very wellbeing and the fool's choice, ignorance, apathy, recklessness, or all of the above.

This started with her a long time ago. As soon as she was old enough to get to where I keep my firearms. She sees them as a dangerous, yet useful tool. You don't play with daddy's table saw, you don't play with daddy's welder, and you damn sure don't play with daddy's guns. Let me show you why. This blade is finger-removing sharp. The electricity flowing through this wire is enough to melt steel, let alone your flesh. The damage that comes from the end of this weapon will kill you. Period.

Ignorance, such as keeping your children away from firearms in the home until some ethereal, state-sponsored age requirement is met, is not only stupid, it's putting the children you love in harm's way. As a father, there's no way in hell that's happening in MY house. Especially considering my primary duty as a father is to see to the wellbeing of that beautiful, green-eyed girl of mine.

I noticed you aren't having her shoot fully automatic weapons. What I meant by introducing them to firearms, was letting children fire live rounds. Sorry that I was clear about that.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

I noticed you aren't having her shoot fully automatic weapons. What I meant by introducing them to firearms, was letting children fire live rounds. Sorry that I was clear about that.

Maybe I wasn't clear (obviously not, I didn't mention it) that my daughter has fired live rounds.

An uzi? No. I think we can all agree that's beyond retarded.

But live rounds? With guidance, strict principles of gun safety, and the common sense to not put an 8 year old behind a double barrel 12 gauge/fully automatic assault weapon/insert your brand of mulekick here, it can be done, done safely, and serves as a fine introduction to what a firearm will do.

I'm not seeing the problem.

[royalfan5]

Maybe I wasn't clear (obviously not, I didn't mention it) that my daughter has fired live rounds.

An uzi? No. I think we can all agree that's beyond retarded.

But live rounds? With guidance, strict principles of gun safety, and the common sense to not put an 8 year old behind a double barrel 12 gauge/fully automatic assault weapon/insert your brand of mulekick here, it can be done, done safely, and serves as a fine introduction to what a firearm will do.

I'm not seeing the problem.

Fair enough, we can just agree to disagree then.

[1890MilesToNorman]

When the **** hits the fan I want 10's of thousand citizens armed with these kinds of weapons. The reason for the second amendment is to give the right to the citizens to protect themselves from let's say an overzealous government.

Another approach would be for the congress to field a football team and play the Sooners, winner take all for control of the country.

Take your pick. Either way I will be smiling the whole time but I would prefer the football game.

[proud gonzo]

“This accident was truly a mystery to me,” he said. “This is a horrible event, a horrible travesty, and I really don’t know why it happened. I don’t think it’s relevant that he wasn’t holding the weapon.”


"I gave permission for him to fire the Uzi,” Bizilj said. “I watched several other children and adults use it. It’s a small weapon, and Christopher was comfortable with guns. There were larger machine guns with much more recoil, and we avoided those.”


Now, somebody can correct my reasoning if i'm wrong, but by the basic principles of physics, wouldn't it make sense that a SMALLER and lighter gun is going to have more recoil than a bigger gun? I don't mean the amount of force, but the distance of the recoil. Put a fat guy and a skinny guy on two skateboards and have them push off from each other and the skinny guy's going to roll more than the fat guy.

Anyway, I shot an Uzi when i was probably 18 and it damn near walked me backwards THEN.

The father is the kind of idiot that makes all responsible gun owners look bad, and that p*sses me off.

[C&CDean]

I don't share the outrage some of you do for the dad. At all.

I was "firing live rounds" by the time I was big enough to put the stock of a gun under my armpit. That would be maybe 4-5 years old. By the time I was 8 I had shot pretty much every gun my dad owned. This includes 12-gauges, 30.06 rifles, .22s, pistols of all calibers, and even an AK-47.

Guess what? All 5 of my boys have done the same thing. This is just one of those deals where the dad and kid were having fun, and **** went terribly wrong. To me it's no different than a dad pushing a kid in a swing, the chain breaks, and the kid falls on his head and dies. **** happens. To villify guns - or this father is just stupid.

Every single one of you parents out there has put your kids in harms way many times - and probably don't even realize it. Besides, an Uzi doesn't have that much recoil to begin with. He made a responsible choice by choosing a lighter caliber weapon, an accident happened, and now he's gotta live knowing his son is dead. That sucks beyond all suckitude, but he's not a bad dad because of it.

[JohnnyMack]

Remind me never to let you babysit my kids.

[C&CDean]

Remind me never to let you babysit my kids.

No problem. The state will take care of them soon enough.

[Curly Bill]

No problem. The state will take care of them soon enough.

:D