I'm officially on the bandwagon...

[SoonerStormchaser]

BV needs to go....and soon.

But I doubt that Bob will do anything about it.

[auto]

I am pretty sure, I would fire BV. Not a big fan of calling for coaches jobs, but this is becoming all too common.

[Edmond Sooner]

That last Kansas series just makes me want to go get drunk. Depressing.

[snp]

It's totally his fault that Brian Jackson tripped.
0-10 on 3rd downs
Causing 2 TOs (should have been 3) and 2 forced fumbles
5 sacks
Shutting down the 14th best offense with 2 new starters in 1 week of practice sucks

Yup, nothing positive to take away from this game.

[SoonerStormchaser]

Letting them run through us for half a game like there was no-D whatsoever.
Coming up with bad pass schemes to let Briscoe completely burn us time after time.
491 FREAKING YARDS!!!

[StormySooner-IN]

i've always gone against everyone that wanted to get rid of BV...week after week.

I don't know now. Im starting to consider climbing the ladder to the bandwagon...

[Widescreen]

After this game, I now think BV needs to go. But he'll still be running the defense next year, unfortunately.

[SteelCitySooner]

I'm considering jumping on also and I've never been one to do that before. The missed tackles..not just occassionally but ALL THE FREAKIN TIME is sealing the deal. We have been plagued with missed tackles now for years and it just doesn't seem to improve. argh..

[85Sooner]

Maybe we need a new "BRING BACK MIKE" Campaign......especially seeing as he may need a position next year.

[sooneron]

I officially now want him gone so I can hear you guys bitch about someone else.

[tulsaoilerfan]

Our tackling today was beyond horrible

[aero]

The coaches certainly don't make the plays on the field ( or should I say DON'T make the plays on the field?), but we seem to have good to very good talent each year but seems like continually don't show it on the field when it matters. I don't like blaming coaches when we've had the success we've had the last several years. Especially considering where we were and where we've been year in and year out since BS got here. But that also is an example of something that should be considered. If you look at coaches win/loss percentage, it's uncanny that they were successful/unsuccessful to pretty much the same degree where ever they coached. I'm a firm believer that a coach either has it or he doesn't. You don't often see a coach that was mediocre and then all of a sudden is great. I also think that with the talent we have had we are going to be minimally successful no matter what. I'm starting to think the defense needs a change. I would also say I think BV has given his best to OU and it's been greatly appreciated.

[cheezyq]

It's totally his fault that Brian Jackson tripped.
0-10 on 3rd downs
Causing 2 TOs (should have been 3) and 2 forced fumbles
5 sacks
Shutting down the 14th best offense with 2 new starters in 1 week of practice sucks

Yup, nothing positive to take away from this game.

Damn, shut down? I'd hate to see what you think is a BAD day for this D.

Let me guess, you're on the "it was the offense's fault" bandwagon?

It's not the single game, and single in-game situations that has people calling for his head...it's the dramatic inconsistency where our D does a decent job in some games, but are horrible in others. And today, our defense was horrible, as it was last week after RR got hurt.

Don't fire him, just get him some game-planning help. Great position guy, terrible DC.

[OU-HSV]

BV needs to go....and soon.

But I doubt that Bob will do anything about it.

Welcome aboard

[auto]

I just checked with GoDaddy, FireBrentNow.com is available.

[snp]

Damn, shut down? I'd hate to see what you think is a BAD day for this D.

I wrote that before they piled on 80 yards in garbage time against the second string. And like I said, they did some other good things out there.


Let me guess, you're on the "it was the offense's fault" bandwagon?

No, don't put dumb words in my mouth. I've always been a supporter of BV.



It's not the single game, and single in-game situations that has people calling for his head...it's the dramatic inconsistency where our D does a decent job in some games, but are horrible in others.

Don't fire him, just get him some game-planning help. Great position guy, terrible DC.

I hold Bob accountable for a lot of it and the rest I chalk up to good play by the other teams and some other flukey stuff going on. But I'm not calling for anyone's head.

You're delusional if you are just blaming the DC when Bob has his hand in all the defensive game planning, especially the bowl games.


And today, our defense was horrible, as it was last week after RR got hurt.

Terrible point. How could you expect us to get better when we lost our defensive leader? You think we would magically get better with Harris having 1 week to play MLB?

[85sooners]

come on back mike we have a spot for ya!

[OU-HSV]

I've posted my opinion/thoughts about the Defense/BV situation in other threads this week. So I'll try to keep this short. I agree, it's time for a change.

Props though to the D for the good third down performance tonight.
But now they need to work on first and second downs. And they need to wrap up, as I've said before.
These nickel and dime us down the field plays are killing us.
And quite frankly, KU had more "big" plays on us than texass did last week. And (if I'm not mistaken) that Briscoe guy had more yards against us today than Shipley and Cosby combined last week.
I don't see how we can continue to win games allowing this many yards and points. So, thank God for Sam Bradford and company being able to light up the score board and typically give us enough cushion to win.
(Okay, well I tried to keep it short)

[The Remnant]

2008 OU football minus the offense = ordinary

[OU-HSV]

I wrote that before they piled on 80 yards in garbage time against the second string. And like I said, they did some other good things out there.



No, don't put dumb words in my mouth. I've always been a supporter of BV.



I hold Bob accountable for a lot of it and the rest I chalk up to good play by the other teams and some other flukey stuff going on. But I'm not calling for anyone's head.

You're delusional if you are just blaming the DC when Bob has his hand in all the defensive game planning, especially the bowl games.



Terrible point. How could you expect us to get better when we lost our defensive leader? You think we would magically get better with Harris having 1 week to play MLB?

I agree, Bob has to be held accountable for some of this. He's the head coach, so he's ultimately in control of the whole situation. I just don't get how he could be pleased with the way the D has been performing and the schemes that BV uses.
I'm very curious what goes on behind the scenes between Bob and BV. I mean you'd think as a defensive minded coach, Bob's stomach must be in knots every day thinking about the defensive situation.

[sooneron]

I agree, Bob has to be held accountable for some of this. He's the head coach, so he's ultimately in control of the whole situation. I just don't get how he could be pleased with the way the D has been performing and the schemes that BV uses.
I'm very curious what goes on behind the scenes between Bob and BV. I mean you'd think as a defensive minded coach, Bob's stomach must be in knots every day thinking about the defensive situation.

I'm sure he just tells Brent to take care of everything and is pretty much hand off.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

couple of points...

1. going into the season, everyone was worried about the D. its only natural, i mean we lost 2 players as early entrants - our best linebacker and our most hyped DB. the problem has been that the first several games they performed 200% better than expected. mainly because they pulled travis lewis out of what ever derriere they pulled trey dicarlo out of several years ago.

this defense has suffered a rash of injuries with the biggest one being one no one talks about - english's appendicitis. he is just flat out ineffective out there. and it doesn't look like its physically ineffective, it looks like he just isn't aware of what is going on around him (how many times has he just not recognized that he needed to tackle the QB 2 feet away from him this year?). heck, no one even bothers double teaming him any more because of it which allows them to either double mccoy or chip to the linebacker.

how deep do they have to go before we as fans start to just concede they are trying to get through games? when do we start looking at the fact that linebacker is our biggest weakness this year when it shouldn't have been because we had a kid bail early to the NFL. its quite the dichotomy if you on one hand say "if i were him i'd go to the NFL, its all within his rights, he should go" and then turn around the next year and call for the DCs head because the position with the early entrant is down and causing us to give up yards and/or points.

2. our team as a whole is out of shape. i don't know how else to say it, as this is the first year under stoops that i have seen the entire team this out of shape. we've seen it previously out of guys that felt they were a shoe in for the pros (iglesias and kelly last year), but never the entire team.

3. where would we be if our youngsters weren't popping in and making plays. heck i was impressed with quentin carter today at safety. he wasn't afraid at all to get in there and mix it up. not sure if there was any correlation to holmes playing better but for the first time in forever we had really good safety play. the problem has been that other youngsters have slid down a notch in play (lewis, jackson).

[HopeSpringsEternal]

And yet another point would be that he's had 4+ years to get his act together, yet seems to field the same confused, out of shape, out of position defense each and every year. Enough is enough. It's one excuse or anther. He's got to run out of players to blame sooner or later.

[SoonerBBall]

Is there a way for me to ignore all posts written by Hope?

[OU-HSV]

Is there a way for me to ignore all posts written by Hope?

Close your eyes or don't read them I guess

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

And yet another point would be that he's had 4+ years to get his act together, yet seems to field the same confused, out of shape, out of position defense each and every year. Enough is enough. It's one excuse or anther. He's got to run out of players to blame sooner or later.

strange, if you look at what he started with, the cupboard was left bare as crap by the god of DCs that preceeded him. we had literally no defensive backs in the pipeline when mike stoops left. we had 1 year of pelini who gave us a decent CB in marcus walker who had to start as a true freshman. unfortunately, he was hurt much of his career. pelini of course was the one that looked at our abundance of talent at linebacker and talked brent into tweaking the scheme to be more linebacker focused. they then tilted recruiting to get some defensive backs in the pipeline while relying on our linebackers - the position that they thinned out to get more dbs in the house? linebacker. now the boat has tipped the other way, we seem to have quite the pipeline of DBs, but we now have zilch point nothing at linebacker (with 2 juco AAs being recruiting busts this year).

heck, lets take that little scamper up the middle by that little scat back. 2 guys with a combined what? 6 games of linebacker experience both busted on their assignment. he was out their explaining to them exactly what they were supposed to do. its not like he sat over there clueless about what kansas just did. you know there is a reason that switzer practiced the same plays thousands of times....

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

http://oklahoma.rivals.com/commitlist.asp

do you not see a theme on this list? the fact that we had nick harris playing middle linebacker should tell you everything about our current situation. now if you want to toss him over the hill for his crappy linebacker recruiting over the last couple of years, well, that would be a decent line of reasoning.

[bonkuba]

Sucks to win.......:rolleyes:

[OU-HSV]

http://oklahoma.rivals.com/commitlist.asp

do you not see a theme on this list? the fact that we had nick harris playing middle linebacker should tell you everything about our current situation. now if you want to toss him over the hill for his crappy linebacker recruiting over the last couple of years, well, that would be a decent line of reasoning.
I know what your saying, I'm glad to see at least that BV didn't stick with Crowe or Box if he wasn't seeing good potential there, I'm glad he stepped up to change something there this week. (IMO it was a must do move that may work out great if Nic can catch onto the chane)
In regards to the overall LB situation though, to me there's no reason/excuse to have a lack of LBs or deep talent at LB at OU. I'm not going to blame BV solely for this, as other coaches recruit players too (and I know they somewhat recruit using territories), but he is the D coordinator, so he should have a big say so in what LBs he wants to recruit (or wants other coaches to recruit).
JKM, I know you know more about most of this stuff than most of us, do you know how many of our LBs BV recruited? I'm just curious if he brought all or most of them in or what.

[The Remnant]

They won because their offense gained almost 700 yards, and outscored the other team.

[HopeSpringsEternal]

strange, if you look at what he started with, the cupboard was left bare as crap by the god of DCs that preceeded him. we had literally no defensive backs in the pipeline when mike stoops left. we had 1 year of pelini who gave us a decent CB in marcus walker who had to start as a true freshman. unfortunately, he was hurt much of his career. pelini of course was the one that looked at our abundance of talent at linebacker and talked brent into tweaking the scheme to be more linebacker focused. they then tilted recruiting to get some defensive backs in the pipeline while relying on our linebackers - the position that they thinned out to get more dbs in the house? linebacker. now the boat has tipped the other way, we seem to have quite the pipeline of DBs, but we now have zilch point nothing at linebacker (with 2 juco AAs being recruiting busts this year).

heck, lets take that little scamper up the middle by that little scat back. 2 guys with a combined what? 6 games of linebacker experience both busted on their assignment. he was out their explaining to them exactly what they were supposed to do. its not like he sat over there clueless about what kansas just did. you know there is a reason that switzer practiced the same plays thousands of times....

Blah, blah, blah, blah it's Stoops fault. Blah, blah, blah, it's Brandon Crows fault. Blah, blah, blah, it's bad recruiting. Blah, blah, blah, the cupboard was left bare. He's one excuse after another year in and year out. Bottom line is, he does not produce results. He's incompetent.

[AzianSooner]

BV is a good coach but his talent and experience is not at the level of Chizik or Mike Stoops yet

He needs to go to some NFL teams to gain experiences.... High level experience.

[wishbonesooner]

Two things I can absolutely guarantee:
Mike Stoops will not be returning to the University of Oklahoma
Bob Stoops will NOT fire Brent Venables.

[tulsaoilerfan]

strange, if you look at what he started with, the cupboard was left bare as crap by the god of DCs that preceeded him. we had literally no defensive backs in the pipeline when mike stoops left. we had 1 year of pelini who gave us a decent CB in marcus walker who had to start as a true freshman. unfortunately, he was hurt much of his career. pelini of course was the one that looked at our abundance of talent at linebacker and talked brent into tweaking the scheme to be more linebacker focused. they then tilted recruiting to get some defensive backs in the pipeline while relying on our linebackers - the position that they thinned out to get more dbs in the house? linebacker. now the boat has tipped the other way, we seem to have quite the pipeline of DBs, but we now have zilch point nothing at linebacker (with 2 juco AAs being recruiting busts this year).

heck, lets take that little scamper up the middle by that little scat back. 2 guys with a combined what? 6 games of linebacker experience both busted on their assignment. he was out their explaining to them exactly what they were supposed to do. its not like he sat over there clueless about what kansas just did. you know there is a reason that switzer practiced the same plays thousands of times....

i refuse to believe that the talent isn't there, and we keep hearing that alot of the lb's are having a problem learning the defense; maybe simplification at some point might be the way to go?

[tulsaoilerfan]

http://oklahoma.rivals.com/commitlist.asp

do you not see a theme on this list? the fact that we had nick harris playing middle linebacker should tell you everything about our current situation. now if you want to toss him over the hill for his crappy linebacker recruiting over the last couple of years, well, that would be a decent line of reasoning.

consider it done:D

[tommieharris91]

2. our team as a whole is out of shape. i don't know how else to say it, as this is the first year under stoops that i have seen the entire team this out of shape. we've seen it previously out of guys that felt they were a shoe in for the pros (iglesias and kelly last year), but never the entire team.


I don't really see this out of our offense outside of Murray, and I think that's because I think the knee is still bothering him. Now the defense, yea that's true. They can't use the TOP excuse this week either. OU had the time of possession edge this game.

[tulsaoilerfan]

so now it's schmitty's fault?

[josh09]

BV needs to go....and soon.

But I doubt that Bob will do anything about it.

Ditto. He has the athletes, but hes not gettin it done

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Blah, blah, blah, blah it's Stoops fault. Blah, blah, blah, it's Brandon Crows fault. Blah, blah, blah, it's bad recruiting. Blah, blah, blah, the cupboard was left bare. He's one excuse after another year in and year out. Bottom line is, he does not produce results. He's incompetent.

so are you as a troll, yet...you're still here

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I don't really see this out of our offense outside of Murray, and I think that's because I think the knee is still bothering him. Now the defense, yea that's true. They can't use the TOP excuse this week either. OU had the time of possession edge this game.

really? you don't see the OL about to fall over 1/2 way through the 2nd quarter? taking off plays in the 3rd and 4th?

[stoopified]

I have said before and I'll say it again:IF anyone is so sure BV needs to go call Bob up on Tuesday nite between 7-8PM at 1-877-600-6432 and discuss it with him.

[tommieharris91]

Is there a way for me to ignore all posts written by Hope?

Click on his profile. Then you can add him to your ignore list. You should get this message:



This message is hidden because HopeSpringsEternal is on your ignore list.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

JKM, I know you know more about most of this stuff than most of us, do you know how many of our LBs BV recruited? I'm just curious if he brought all or most of them in or what.

i did a thread about this in the offseason that no one cared about. percentage-wise, venables has never been a guy who hits a lot as a recruiter as a little more than 50% of his guys either transfer or never play a down. the difference is that 1 out of every 3 guys he recruits has been an all american - frickin unbelievable. when you mix that with having to have 3 linebackers on the field all the time and an early entrant you have the mess we are in now...

[Curly Bill]

BV needs to go....and soon.

But I doubt that Bob will do anything about it.

Welcome to the club friend, there's room enough for all. :D

[JLEW1818]

WE HAVE NAKED GIRLS IN THE CLUB TOO!!!!

[Curly Bill]

WE HAVE NAKED GIRLS IN THE CLUB TOO!!!!

Shhhhh! That's a secret. :O

[JLEW1818]

McCoy's dad looks like a tard

[Curly Bill]

McCoy's dad looks like a tard

Did you see the pics posted of his kid brother?


:eek:

[sooneron]

really? you don't see the OL about to fall over 1/2 way through the 2nd quarter? taking off plays in the 3rd and 4th?
Idefinitely saw it in the 2nd half of the ut game. We looked like the whorns of 5 years ago- huffing.

[IronSooner]

One observation that struck me during our 4-hour game today was:

Do you all remember when we would go up against a team, say, Iowa St with Seneca Wallace, and take away their major player? We would go out and shut down their major guy, RB, WR, whatever. We could single one guy out and remove him from the offense. Now we single out one guy and make him a star.

I miss the days when we had an aggressive, intimidating defense that could dictate what the other team did. Now we play a softer bend-don't-break defense, let guys catch the ball, and try to play the odds that the offense makes a mistake. It's aggravating to watch against good teams.

Putting up 35 points in a game should all but guarantee a win. Conversely, giving up 35 or more generally all but guarantees a loss. The latter really needs to stop.

As for whose fault it is, I don't know as much top-level stuff as I'd like to. I just know that our defense hasn't been the same since 2003, and we've had lots of players come through in that time without anything changing. It's not just the players.

[sooneron]

BV is a good coach but his talent and experience is not at the level of Chizik or Mike Stoops yet

He needs to go to some NFL teams to gain experiences.... High level experience.

I disagree, the pros used to come up with the offenses that set the standard, now every college is going after wunderkind OCs that can put a lot of points on the board. Now you have the dolphins running plays that arkie was running last year.

[Curly Bill]

I disagree, the pros used to come up with the offenses that set the standard, now every college is going after wunderkind OCs that can put a lot of points on the board. Now you have the dolphins running plays that arkie was running last year.

Who in the pros would hire Venables anyway?

...maybe as the assistant to some assistant. :D

[achiro]

couple of points...

1. going into the season, everyone was worried about the D. its only natural, i mean we lost 2 players as early entrants - our best linebacker and our most hyped DB. the problem has been that the first several games they performed 200% better than expected. mainly because they pulled travis lewis out of what ever derriere they pulled trey dicarlo out of several years ago.

this defense has suffered a rash of injuries with the biggest one being one no one talks about - english's appendicitis. he is just flat out ineffective out there. and it doesn't look like its physically ineffective, it looks like he just isn't aware of what is going on around him (how many times has he just not recognized that he needed to tackle the QB 2 feet away from him this year?). heck, no one even bothers double teaming him any more because of it which allows them to either double mccoy or chip to the linebacker.

how deep do they have to go before we as fans start to just concede they are trying to get through games? when do we start looking at the fact that linebacker is our biggest weakness this year when it shouldn't have been because we had a kid bail early to the NFL. its quite the dichotomy if you on one hand say "if i were him i'd go to the NFL, its all within his rights, he should go" and then turn around the next year and call for the DCs head because the position with the early entrant is down and causing us to give up yards and/or points.

2. our team as a whole is out of shape. i don't know how else to say it, as this is the first year under stoops that i have seen the entire team this out of shape. we've seen it previously out of guys that felt they were a shoe in for the pros (iglesias and kelly last year), but never the entire team.

3. where would we be if our youngsters weren't popping in and making plays. heck i was impressed with quentin carter today at safety. he wasn't afraid at all to get in there and mix it up. not sure if there was any correlation to holmes playing better but for the first time in forever we had really good safety play. the problem has been that other youngsters have slid down a notch in play (lewis, jackson).
The gapping hole in your entire theory is a little team down south called the whorns. They are working with a new DC and a BUNCH of brand new players, including true and redshirt freshmen. They look great, fast, hard hitting, excited, in position, etc, etc A lot of things that OU isn't, thats coaching.

[tommieharris91]

Who in the pros would hire Venables anyway?


A team with bad linebackers.

[Curly Bill]

A team with bad linebackers.

Yeah, and he could convert players from other positions into LBers and then he would have the lack of experience excuse at his disposal.

[Rhino]

The simple fact is that we had ONE linebacker out there today. Clayton is a hybrid and Harris is a stop gap. Box still isn't healthy enough to be out there and word is he'll be getting a medical redshirt. If Lewis doesn't come back after that kick return, we're in big, BIG trouble.

It says quite a bit about Crow, Robinson, Bryant and Balogun when our free safety has to take over at MLB. I'll give Franklin a pass since he's a true frosh.

If Venables needs to be told to move on for anything, it's LB recruiting not defensive play.

[adoniijahsooner]

Blah, blah, blah, blah it's Stoops fault. Blah, blah, blah, it's Brandon Crows fault. Blah, blah, blah, it's bad recruiting. Blah, blah, blah, the cupboard was left bare. He's one excuse after another year in and year out. Bottom line is, he does not produce results. He's incompetent.

Are we serious? Todd Reesing has just lost his third game yesterday. Colt McCoy's team just scored 56 points today. Pat White and company was a very potent offense last year. USC had NFL players all over the field in the orange bowl. We are in a conference with 9 qbs in the top 15 in passing efficiency, and all we can do is complain about our defense. Until Reesing, McCoy, Harrell, Daniels, Robinson, and others graduate we may just see alot more of the shootouts.

[HopeSpringsEternal]

Are we serious? Todd Reesing has just lost his third game yesterday. Colt McCoy's team just scored 56 points today. Pat White and company was a very potent offense last year. USC had NFL players all over the field in the orange bowl. We are in a conference with 9 qbs in the top 15 in passing efficiency, and all we can do is complain about our defense. Until Reesing, McCoy, Harrell, Daniels, Robinson, and others graduate we may just see alot more of the shootouts.

enjoy your hot steaming cup of mediocrity.

[birddog]

couple of points...




3. where would we be if our youngsters weren't popping in and making plays. heck i was impressed with quentin carter today at safety. he wasn't afraid at all to get in there and mix it up. not sure if there was any correlation to holmes playing better but for the first time in forever we had really good safety play. the problem has been that other youngsters have slid down a notch in play (lewis, jackson).


i agree with you about carter. i ended up watching him on every play and he has incredible quickness. it looks like he'll be able to really help us out back there. and not only was he quick, he was always in the right spot and played fearless.

[HopeSpringsEternal]

so are you as a troll, yet...you're still here

And yet you're so full of **** it hurts. You're the type of guy that has an excuse for everything you **** up. Oh, boss, my coffee was too cold this morning so I won't be able to help you out today. I'm afraid the next moth is gonna suck too. Oh, I woke up this morning with the first morning wood I've had since my prostate swelled up to the size of a grapefruit and I couldn't do anything about it since I got a cramp in my hand, I'm afraid the next month is gonna be bad for me. I'm sure most people around here will eat your BS with chocolate sauce on top of it and tell you how smart you are, but frankly in the end, it's all bull****.

[birddog]

And yet you're so full of **** it hurts. You're the type of guy that has an excuse for everything you **** up. Oh, boss, my coffee was too cold this morning so I won't be able to help you out today. I'm afraid the next moth is gonna suck too. Oh, I woke up this morning with the first morning wood I've had since my prostate swelled up to the size of a grapefruit and I couldn't do anything about it since I got a cramp in my hand, I'm afraid the next month is gonna be bad for me. I'm sure most people around here will eat your BS with chocolate sauce on top of it and tell you how smart you are, but frankly in the end, it's all bull****.

yeah, you offer so much insight to this board. we are so grateful to have you tell us how much you hate venables over and over and over again. thanks!

[HopeSpringsEternal]

so now it's schmitty's fault?

It's everybody else's fault but BV. Don't you understand that?!?!?!?:rolleyes:

[HopeSpringsEternal]

i did a thread about this in the offseason that no one cared about. percentage-wise, venables has never been a guy who hits a lot as a recruiter as a little more than 50% of his guys either transfer or never play a down. the difference is that 1 out of every 3 guys he recruits has been an all american - frickin unbelievable. when you mix that with having to have 3 linebackers on the field all the time and an early entrant you have the mess we are in now...

That's it, worry about All Americans while his defense's surrender points and yardage like it's going out of style and they keep getting *** pounded in big games. Truly unbelievable, you're right there.

[HopeSpringsEternal]

yeah, you offer so much insight to this board. we are so grateful to have you tell us how much you hate venables over and over and over again. thanks!

Yeah, and you're a real winner too, eh? Enjoy sniffing the taint of under achievement as you dangle from the nuts of mediocrity. You're another one of the "winners" that loves his excuses.

[OU_Sooners75]

It's totally his fault that Brian Jackson tripped.
0-10 on 3rd downs
Causing 2 TOs (should have been 3) and 2 forced fumbles
5 sacks
Shutting down the 14th best offense with 2 new starters in 1 week of practice sucks

Yup, nothing positive to take away from this game.

Tripping is a fluke incident. And OU can and will take some very good positives out of this game.

However, when you allow 491 yards, 26 first downs, 31 points it is bad.

Lets look at it this way. What happens if the first INT is caught instead of being an INT? that is 38 points allowed. What happens when the other INT is caught by KU? KU scores another TD. Giving this game a dead lock at 45 each.

OU was within inches of having 2 consecutive offenses to score at least 38+ points.

I will give them this though. The second half the defense started to click a little and started to pressure Reesing a lot more.

Overall I am proud of the team and the defense. But the defense is giving up way to many plays and points.

[Okie35]

It's totally his fault that Brian Jackson tripped.
0-10 on 3rd downs
Causing 2 TOs (should have been 3) and 2 forced fumbles
5 sacks
Shutting down the 14th best offense with 2 new starters in 1 week of practice sucks

Yup, nothing positive to take away from this game.

basically... most of the briscoe catches happened because of individual play... brian jackson slipped once and then another time he messed up the coverage because he thought franks was going to cover the deep middle... ppl just need to relax and realize that this is a good win over a GOOD kansas team... and for the most part we looked good... i could care less about the garbage points like the last touchdown... the only problem i have w/ bv sometimes is he'll run a blitz when its not needed... or run too many blitzes

[aero]

I don't care to get into a pissin' match and I certainly will take any win, but IMO, there is simply NO EXCUSE for the play of the D. Everybody has injuries and has to play inexperienced personnel. OU, as supposedly one of the top programs, should be loaded with backup talent. Look around at other teams. No way should KU gash us up the middle with a 5' 2", 150 lb. back. And yes, we have looked out of shape. Both on O and D. It's great to score points but I don't want to be TT or Hawaii. And its' been our D that has cost us most of our losses and bowl losses the last few years. Chop it up however you want but its funny how a program changes as soon as a new coach comes in. We've plodded along long enough.

[OU_Sooners75]

basically... most of the briscoe catches happened because of individual play... brian jackson slipped once and then another time he messed up the coverage because he thought franks was going to cover the deep middle... ppl just need to relax and realize that this is a good win over a GOOD kansas team... and for the most part we looked good... i could care less about the garbage points like the last touchdown... the only problem i have w/ bv sometimes is he'll run a blitz when its not needed... or run too many blitzes


The fall is a fluke. It does happen, but not that often. It is a footing issue, not a coaching or player issue.

However, when you have a DB check out of the nearest threat thinking the saftey is htere to pick him up. That is coaching and player error.

Sure in a zone, Jackson was only responsible for his part of the field. And the safety was responsible for the deep ball. Problem was, on that play, there was no receiver below him. Which means, Jackson should be coached to stay with the receiver on that play. And even if he does stay with him and a receiver catches a ball below him...The receiver is still in front of him. Meaning he can still make a play on the receiver.

Some of that is inexperience on Jackson's part and some of it was on the coaches.

[OU_Sooners75]

Why cant we play a man cover 2? or even a man on the outsides and zone underneath?

Why does OU have such a complex defense, when it seems the best defenses have basic simpliifed defenses?

Thesea re things the coaches can fix. The coaches put together the game plans and schemes. The players execute them. If the schemes are to difficult then simplifying them is the answer.

Why does it seem BV is incapabale of doing this?

[Blue]

Yeah, and you're a real winner too, eh? Enjoy sniffing the taint of under achievement as you dangle from the nuts of mediocrity. You're another one of the "winners" that loves his excuses.


Heh.

[StoopTroup]

Brent was Coaching his a$$ off in the 2nd half yesterday.

I took one series to bead in on him with my binoculars and he was throwing gangs signs into the defense like it was a Bloods and Crips dog fight for territory...

The funny thing is...

That series you could see Bob kind of looking over at him checking to see what he was throwing at them...

We stopped KU on a 3 and OUt too...

[birddog]

Yeah, and you're a real winner too, eh? Enjoy sniffing the taint of under achievement as you dangle from the nuts of mediocrity. You're another one of the "winners" that loves his excuses.

what exactly leads you to believe that my post had anything to do with venables?

you've done enough to get yourself banned, but i highly doubt you care since you're a troll.

[fadada1]

without going through all the pages:

0-10 on 3rd down is semi-misleading, imo. 0-20 on 3rd down IS NOT misleading. my point is that with all the plays KU ran, to only have 10 3rd down opportunities is pretty darn good.

WE GIVE UP YARDS IN GULPS!!!! this scares the crap out of me.

[mustangsooner]

couple of points...

1. going into the season, everyone was worried about the D. its only natural, i mean we lost 2 players as early entrants - our best linebacker and our most hyped DB. the problem has been that the first several games they performed 200% better than expected. mainly because they pulled travis lewis out of what ever derriere they pulled trey dicarlo out of several years ago.

this defense has suffered a rash of injuries with the biggest one being one no one talks about - english's appendicitis. he is just flat out ineffective out there. and it doesn't look like its physically ineffective, it looks like he just isn't aware of what is going on around him (how many times has he just not recognized that he needed to tackle the QB 2 feet away from him this year?). heck, no one even bothers double teaming him any more because of it which allows them to either double mccoy or chip to the linebacker.

how deep do they have to go before we as fans start to just concede they are trying to get through games? when do we start looking at the fact that linebacker is our biggest weakness this year when it shouldn't have been because we had a kid bail early to the NFL. its quite the dichotomy if you on one hand say "if i were him i'd go to the NFL, its all within his rights, he should go" and then turn around the next year and call for the DCs head because the position with the early entrant is down and causing us to give up yards and/or points.

2. our team as a whole is out of shape. i don't know how else to say it, as this is the first year under stoops that i have seen the entire team this out of shape. we've seen it previously out of guys that felt they were a shoe in for the pros (iglesias and kelly last year), but never the entire team.

3. where would we be if our youngsters weren't popping in and making plays. heck i was impressed with quentin carter today at safety. he wasn't afraid at all to get in there and mix it up. not sure if there was any correlation to holmes playing better but for the first time in forever we had really good safety play. the problem has been that other youngsters have slid down a notch in play (lewis, jackson).


Dumbest post of the year.

[OU-HSV]

Look noobs, I may not agree with everything JKM (or others) are saying as well. But there are better ways to disagree than to call his posts "dumbest posts of the year". Or to get personal about all this. Some of you seem so offended that JKM or some others don't see eye to eye with you and me.
Chill out, everyone is on here to make their points and state their opinions, but if these defensive/BV concern threads are going to turn into name calling threads instead of good conversational threads, I'm not posting in them anymore.
JKM is typically known for bringing in good conversation. So lighten up people and if you disagree with JKM or others, tell them why, don't just say "Dumbest post of the year" and sh*t like that.

[mustangsooner]

Look noobs, I may not agree with everything JKM (or others) are saying as well. But there are better ways to disagree than to call his posts "dumbest posts of the year". Or to get personal about all this. Some of you seem so offended that JKM or some others don't see eye to eye with you and me.
Chill out, everyone is on here to make their points and state their opinions, but if these defensive/BV concern threads are going to turn into name calling threads instead of good conversational threads, I'm not posting in them anymore.
JKM is typically known for bringing in good conversation. So lighten up people and if you disagree with JKM or others, tell them why, don't just say "Dumbest post of the year" and sh*t like that.

How is calling me a noob not getting personal but saying his post is dumb is personal. I think it was a dumb post so that is what I said. I did not say he was dumb cause I am on this board a lot and agree with JKM a lot but this team is not out of shape so I called him on it.

[OU-HSV]

How is calling me a noob not getting personal but saying his post is dumb is personal. I think it was a dumb post so that is what I said. I did not say he was dumb cause I am on this board a lot and agree with JKM a lot but this team is not out of shape so I called him on it.

Everyone gets called a noob around here, that's more of a joking label than anything else and that's not offensive like telling someone dumbest post of the year and then not giving a reason for it.
If your offended by me saying noob then I appologize for that, but as I said, that is a label we're all given at one point or another. More of a "joking jab" term than calling someones post dumbest post of the year without saying anything other than that to support it.

[mustangsooner]

Everyone gets called a noob around here, that's more of a joking label than anything else and that's not offensive like telling someone dumbest post of the year and then not giving a reason for it.
If your offended by me saying noob then I appologize for that, but as I said, that is a label we're all given at one point or another. More of a "joking jab" term than calling someones post dumbest post of the year without saying anything other than that to support it.

I don't get offended at all just kidding with you. I know that JKM is a great poster just don't think that this team is anywhere near out of shape.

[OU-HSV]

I don't get offended at all just kidding with you. I know that JKM is a great poster just don't think that this team is anywhere near out of shape.
It's cool.
The O-line at times looks pretty exhausted, which I guess would be somewhat expected while running a no huddle offense. But you'd think with some of the long drives opponents have had against our D, that would give the O-Line plenty of time to rest.
Anyways, that being said, even if the O-line looks tired at times, they're still blocking well enough for us to light up the score board. And props to the O line for a job well done in the category of run blocking yesterday. It was good to see some of the most solid ground game we've witnessed this year.

[OKC-SLC]

It's cool.
The O-line at times looks pretty exhausted, which I guess would be somewhat expected while running a no huddle offense. But you'd think with some of the long drives opponents have had against our D, that would give the O-Line plenty of time to rest.
Anyways, that being said, even if the O-line looks tired at times, they're still blocking well enough for us to light up the score board. And props to the O line for a job well done in the category of run blocking yesterday. It was good to see some of the most solid ground game we've witnessed this year.

**** off, noob.

[1890MilesToNorman]

There are currently 4 **** on the defense threads going, can we just make one official "**** on the Defense Thread" and get it over with?

Nothing major will change mid season, complain when we win and complain when we lose. If i was an outsider reading all this I would conclude we were 0-6 on the season. :cry:

[SoonerStormchaser]

Brent was Coaching his a$$ off in the 2nd half yesterday.

I took one series to bead in on him with my binoculars and he was throwing gangs signs into the defense like it was a Bloods and Crips dog fight for territory...

The funny thing is...

That series you could see Bob kind of looking over at him checking to see what he was throwing at them...

We stopped KU on a 3 and OUt too...

Wanna bet Bob said something to him at halftime that wasn't too pleasant?




Oh and Hope...you're on course for a mass negging if you keep calling out other veteran posters. It isn't becoming of someone with only 100 posts to be namecalling our long termers.

[fadada1]

NOOBS!
http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/8371/nerdsyo0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/nerdsyo0.jpg/1/w481.png (http://g.imageshack.us/img379/nerdsyo0.jpg/1/)

[OU-HSV]

**** off, noob.

:D

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

How is calling me a noob not getting personal but saying his post is dumb is personal. I think it was a dumb post so that is what I said. I did not say he was dumb cause I am on this board a lot and agree with JKM a lot but this team is not out of shape so I called him on it.

i say its out of shape and give reasoning, you say - that's dumb, they aren't out of shape and your reasoning was *crickets chirping*.

when your OL has their hands on their hips in the first quarter, your out of shape. when your DL by the end of the second quarter can't get push and takes every other play off in the third and fourth quarter against texas, your supposedly bitter rival, you're out of shape. when a wide receiver is out there with his hands on his helmet after 4 running plays, you're out of shape. when linebackers let up on plays because the opposing player is 5 yards in front of you, you're out of shape.

the reason i call this out, is that it is something i've never seen out of a stoops team. ever. i've seen guys fall over from dehydration because they were playing so hard, but up until malcolm kelly last year i'd never seen our players take plays off consistently. you see it this year. a lot.

[Rhino]

the reason i call this out, is that it is something i've never seen out of a stoops team. ever. i've seen guys fall over from dehydration because they were playing so hard, but up until malcolm kelly last year i'd never seen our players take plays off consistently. you see it this year. a lot. Example: Juaquin Iglesias on every running play this year.

[JLEW1818]

Do manny and iggy get drafted ?

[PalmBeachSooner]

It's totally his fault that Brian Jackson tripped.
0-10 on 3rd downs
Causing 2 TOs (should have been 3) and 2 forced fumbles
5 sacks
Shutting down the 14th best offense with 2 new starters in 1 week of practice sucks

Yup, nothing positive to take away from this game.

Thank you. People need to get some perspective. It's not like we've played sorry offenses the past two weeks.

If you use this reasoning then Muschamp is the suck as well. His defense has given up 30+ points two weeks in a row. How dare they let Mizzou march down the field in the waning moments for a meaningless score.

[ashley]

One of the things that makes Bob great is that he doesn't give a **** what we think.

[OUmillenium]

Hey Curly Bill, they are getting it!

[mustangsooner]

i say its out of shape and give reasoning, you say - that's dumb, they aren't out of shape and your reasoning was *crickets chirping*.

when your OL has their hands on their hips in the first quarter, your out of shape. when your DL by the end of the second quarter can't get push and takes every other play off in the third and fourth quarter against texas, your supposedly bitter rival, you're out of shape. when a wide receiver is out there with his hands on his helmet after 4 running plays, you're out of shape. when linebackers let up on plays because the opposing player is 5 yards in front of you, you're out of shape.

the reason i call this out, is that it is something i've never seen out of a stoops team. ever. i've seen guys fall over from dehydration because they were playing so hard, but up until malcolm kelly last year i'd never seen our players take plays off consistently. you see it this year. a lot.

If a linebacker giving 5 yards is out of shape then all stoops teams have been out of shape cause that has been a reoccuring thing with OU defenses. I think that the OL may need a little more conditioning but in no way do I think this team is out of shape as a whole. Heck Loadholt lost like supposidly lost some weight and body fat. I don't see how you say that Nic Harris is out of shape. I think he plays all out through the whole game. On the DL you gotta also remember that there are some injuries on the line and you must play a lot harder when you are injured. I mean seriously you don't see many players that play as hard as Dan Cody did when he was at OU. I also agree about Malcolm Kelly though.

And about dumbest post of the year it was a joke. I read a lot of your posts and agree with you most of the time. Although I have only a few posts I am on this site a lot and do a lot of reading just don't post much.

[olevetonahill]

Although I have only a few posts I am on this site a lot and do a lot of reading just don't post much.

Prolly shoulda kept it that way
Jes sayin

[PLaw]

I don't really see this out of our offense outside of Murray, and I think that's because I think the knee is still bothering him. Now the defense, yea that's true. They can't use the TOP excuse this week either. OU had the time of possession edge this game.

TH91, interesting that the TOP at the RRS was way out of balance, but the total number of plays was 70 to 67. So what's more important, the actual number of snaps of played or the time on the field?

BOOMER

[CORNholio]

Maybe its just the scheme in general. Boone State was the first to discover the weak spots in the D in the upsets they pulled in the early part of the decade. USC in 05 recognized them and showed everyone else how easy it is to exploit them. Every HC that plays OU now recognizes it. It's time to get creative instead of playing the same obvious hand over and over again.

[OU_Sooners75]

There are currently 4 **** on the defense threads going, can we just make one official "**** on the Defense Thread" and get it over with?

Nothing major will change mid season, complain when we win and complain when we lose. If i was an outsider reading all this I would conclude we were 0-6 on the season. :cry:

STFU Noob! :eek:

[mustangsooner]

Prolly shoulda kept it that way
Jes sayin

Prolly shoulda kept it that way but I am not gonna.:)

[starrca23]

Serious question: If we are gonna call for BV's head? Who ar we suggesting he be replaced with? (note: M. Stoops and Chizik are not answers...they are both unavailable) Seriously, we wanna dog him, but can we find someone better at recruiting, player development, and defensive play calling? There are a lot of factors here. I honestly don't think many of us will give legit answers to this question.

[OU_Sooners75]

Serious question: If we are gonna call for BV's head? Who ar we suggesting he be replaced with? (note: M. Stoops and Chizik are not answers...they are both unavailable) Seriously, we wanna dog him, but can we find someone better at recruiting, player development, and defensive play calling? There are a lot of factors here. I honestly don't think many of us will give legit answers to this question.

What about VPI's DC, Bud Foster? You know, Virginia Tech?VT has constantly been in the top 10 in defense for the last 10 + years.
What about Randy Shannon. It seems the door is closing on him pretty quickly?
Vic Koenning (Clemson) probably will be without a job later this season.
Dick Bumpus -TCU?
Will Muschamp -Texas? :D
Joe Kines - Texas A&M?
Tyrone Nix - South Carolina?
Tim Rose - Toledo?

There are bigger and better names out there too. All the guys I have listed are proven top notch DCs that are usually ranked in the top 15 assistant coaches in the country!

[PalmBeachSooner1]

He's gotta go. PERIOD

[Nof49 Sooner]

Let me preface this by saying I didn't get to see the first half of the game (which didn't look good from the numbers), but I actually liked what I saw in the 2nd half.

Here's what I saw that I haven't see enough of recently (and why I've supported changes to the defensive coaching staff). 1) We didn't try to stick with the 4-3 defense. We played mostly nickel D and I saw more broken up passes, actual interceptions, and Reesing having timing problems with his receivers. 2) The TD drive Kansas had in the 3rd where they ran it down our throats, looked more like player error to me, not play calling. Particularly the TD run where Harris and Lewis took themselves out of the play by not tracking the ball carrier. They just ran into the line and allowed themselves to get blocked. 3) Lendy Holmes takes on beating on this board, he played great Saturday. 4) Murray ran hard and didn't go down on first contact (something he's taken a beating for on this board as well).

Bottom line, the team was better in the second half. One thing we've all taken issue with is that BV isn't good at making in-game adjustments. Whether adjustments were actually made at half-time or the players just got more comfortable...we showed improvement. I'd still like to see us go back to co-def coordinators, but I'm going to give BV a break for week since I liked what I saw for the most part.

[SoonerStormchaser]

Then you need to go watch the first half...

[cheezyq]

I wrote that before they piled on 80 yards in garbage time against the second string. And like I said, they did some other good things out there. I didn't realize 3rd quarter was garbage time, where they were putting up 12 yards per play on our D.

No, don't put dumb words in my mouth. I've always been a supporter of BV. Fine, you're supporter of BV. I'm not a hater of BV and I don't want him fired...he just needs help with the game planning and overall defensive coaching. And MOST of the BV supporters on here always blame the offense, which is just plain stupid. It's great that you don't think that way, but the reality is that our defense is NOT GOOD.

I hold Bob accountable for a lot of it and the rest I chalk up to good play by the other teams and some other flukey stuff going on. But I'm not calling for anyone's head. Neither am I. And Bob does need to be accountable, by recognizing his staff's strengths and weaknesses, and doing something about it. The "flukey stuff" you talk about is our players being out of place due to poor coaching, just so you know.

You're delusional if you are just blaming the DC when Bob has his hand in all the defensive game planning, especially the bowl games. Sure Bob has his hand in the defense, but it's been well-documented that he's usually only done so when the team experiences troubles. Perhaps he needs to involve himself more, or perhaps he's too involved and is spread too thin. Regardless, there are OBVIOUS problems with the defense (noted not just by us Sooner fans, but national experts), that seriously need to be corrected. That usually means change at DC, for better or worse.

Terrible point. How could you expect us to get better when we lost our defensive leader? You think we would magically get better with Harris having 1 week to play MLB? Terrible counter argument. I'm not expecting us to be "better" at defense with RR out. But with the "talent" we recruit from year to year, we should have someone in place with the capability of stepping in and performing at least an adequate job. The fact that Nic Harris had to move up from safety tells me that we aren't preparing our LBs well enough to perform their jobs. This argument extends to the offense, too, where we don't have a QB capable of stepping in for Bradford and running the offense.

If you think our defense is fine the way that it is, then you need to lower your expectations for OU as a program into the "lucky to be top 10" range. There are plenty of teams with less "talent" than OU, that are performing at a much higher level than OU on defense. And it's not just us Sooner fans that believe that. The opinion across the entire country is that OU has a suspect defense.

Sure, there are games where the defense plays out of its mind and we shut out a good offense. But there are also a lot of dramatic examples of the opposite. My personal theory is that we have such good athletes and such great speed on defense that we make up for mistakes quickly against lesser offensive teams. However, when we face decent athletes and good offensive coaches who can exploit our mis-alignments and keep us guessing or moving in the wrong direction, our defense gets ripped apart. Good defensive coaches don't allow that to happen. Good defensive coaches get their players in consistently good positions to make plays.

[C&CDean]

You know what? I'm pretty much sick of all the fire BV threads. I'm gonna start closing them down - starting with this one. If you have anything further to say about your hatred of the OU staff, say it in one of the 30 or so threads still open - until I shut them down too.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again - a lot of OU fans pretty much suck. At least as bad as they think our DC does. TIA.