Teams trying to copy TCU scheme?

[adoniijahsooner]

Do any of you guys think teams will use the TCU game tape in order to try find a way to hold us under 35?

[GrapevineSooner]

They'd be nuts not to.

Granted, some of that may have had to do with a lack of execution and focus. But it's clear to me that the pressure did have an effect on Bradford.

[stoopified]

What is there to copy?How to stuff the run by playing eight men in the box and giving up 411 yards and 4TDs passing? If you don't realize that Bob went into stall mode ,then apparently you went to sleep midway through the third quarter.If you DID fall asleep,I don't blame you because I almost did. :)

[badger]

TCU thought their corners could hang with our WRs and they couldn't. I doubt any can. Bradford consistently looked good in the pocket, and that was with a few drops and busts in protection. I didn't really see him getting shaken, as he was still throwing accurate, confident darts in the face of defenders.

I could see some defenses trying to do this, but I think the big plays over and over by the WRs should deter them. We also won't face another D that can stuff the run that effectively. Their DLine was really, really fast.

[fadada1]

one thing to consider is that 8 of 11 starters on defense for TCU were seniors - including their front 4. that's a lot of experience, folks. most teams - even in the big12 - can't say that. fact is, DM can still break any run into a big gain, and leaving your DBacks on an islands with our receivers and sam is just plain stupid.

[adoniijahsooner]

What is there to copy?How to stuff the run by playing eight men in the box and giving up 411 yards and 4TDs passing? If you don't realize that Bob went into stall mode ,then apparently you went to sleep midway through the third quarter.If you DID fall asleep,I don't blame you because I almost did. :)

I wasnt bothered by the 30 yards rushing as much as i was the constant 3 and outs. That is what concerns me the most.

[Flagstaffsooner]

"Type slower guys, I'm trying to write this all down!"
http://images.usatoday.com/sports/_photos/2006/09/20/mack-brown.jpg

[Collier11]

we could have easily scored 50 again even with the bad 2nd qt, teams will blitz more but if they stack the box against the run, SB will pick them apart

[Lott's Bandana]

I hope they ALL do.

[Partial Qualifier]

What is there to copy?How to stuff the run by playing eight men in the box and giving up 411 yards and 4TDs passing? If you don't realize that Bob went into stall mode ,then apparently you went to sleep midway through the third quarter.If you DID fall asleep,I don't blame you because I almost did. :)


^^ my thoughts exactly.

[TheUnnamedSooner]

^^^ Agreed

[JohnnyMack]

I wasnt bothered by the 30 yards rushing as much as i was the constant 3 and outs. That is what concerns me the most.

Think about what our running game has looked like in the past. Think about what you saw last night.

OK.

Wait one more second.

Now, ask yourself why we should expose too much of what we're capable of before the Saxet game.

[meoveryouxinfinity]

Think about what our running game has looked like in the past. Think about what you saw last night.

OK.

Wait one more second.

Now, ask yourself why we should expose too much of what we're capable of before the Saxet game.

Of course, first thing's first (Baylor).. but... what do you expect us to pull out against Texas?

More of the Wildcat/ Wildhog offense? We did some of this last year but, correct if me I'm wrong, we have not seen DM line up under center yet this year.

Why this wont work: did you see what happened to SC when they tried it? It was predictable and made McKnight look like a fool. Not to mention created turnovers and negative yardage plays.

Why it will work: DeMarco is primed for a big game. He is faster than McKnight. Our offensive line is better than SC's. Also, we can catch Texas off guard.

Prediction: Stoops doesn't like it. I have a gut feeling he thinks the formation is gimmicky and, since Sam is so great, why not let him take all the snaps--whether it be passing or handing it off--the traditional way-- to DM or CB. I seriously doubt we line up with DM under center

More of Sam running or utilizing the option pitch?

No way. End of story.

I definitely think Stoops & CO has something up their sleeves. Before the season started they talked about not showing some wrinkles "possibly until the Texas game." That's exciting. We'll see though.

I think we will see a few differences in the game plan vs Texas. More screen passes to the RBs in the slot and more bubble screens in general. Our team speed is amazing. And our ability to get past defenders and pull away from tacklers is spectacular. It's like ALL of our receivers are like Mark Clayton... making their money in YAC. Let them (and the RBs) play one-on-one in open space. If our offense is not faster than Texas's defense, it is certainly more agile. DM has been half a step away from breaking off HUGE runs on many plays this season. It's going to happen... and no better time than the Cotton Bowl, right?

That...and expect to see Jermaine break away from the double team. Where are you #18?

[r5TPsooner]

After OU went up 35-3 it seemed fairly obvious that the gameplan was just to milk the clock and get out of the game with a win and as healthy as we could get. The 1st half lasted almost two freakin hours due to the OU bombing brigade on the TCU defense. I was bored but happy by the 4th quarter.

[The Maestro]

Our running backs better block better for Sam.

[r5TPsooner]

Our running backs better block better for Sam.

Brown wiffed twice. I know that one of those = sack.

I bet he got an earful by the coaching staff when he got back to the sidelines.

[Sherpa]

I'm so sick of hearing the excuse "8 in the box" OSU doesnt' have any problems with 8 in the box. LSU doesn't have any problems with 8 in the box.

I was beginning to think we might actually be the best team in the country, but by the end of the game I realized we have some serious problems.

Our OL is not the best in the country. Its not he best in the Big 12.

[bonkuba]

I'm so sick of hearing the excuse "8 in the box" OSU doesnt' have any problems with 8 in the box. LSU doesn't have any problems with 8 in the box.

I was beginning to think we might actually be the best team in the country, but by the end of the game I realized we have some serious problems.

Our OL is not the best in the country. Its not he best in the Big 12.


Tap the brakes there a little puppy dog.......haha!!!

Come back and play later:D

[sooner59]

It doesn't bother me that it happened like this. For one, a decent test early in the season against a good defense gives our coordinators something so work on so that when we face better teams, we know our weaknesses and can fix our problems. Secondly, when we got up 35-3, everyone in the stadium including TCU could see the change in play calling directed towards milking the clock. We knew we were running the ball and so did TCU. That makes it alot easier to stop. TCU sold out against the run and it got them burned consistantly when when were trying to score. Teams like Texas will not do that.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

doubtful..hard for teams to have a scheme they work on all spring and summer and change it for one game


TCU had speed on the edges because they play a 4-2-5..so teams aren't likely to switch just like they aren't rushing out to play a 3-3-5 like WV did/does.....

A 4-2-5 and 3-3-5 have both caused problems with the extra speed on the edges used to rush....

[adoniijahsooner]

I watched the tape after hearing that TCU likes to tackle the ankles and legs; and sure enough every play TCU was going for the legs. Demarco was trying to guard his knees on alot of these plays, it appeared he was scared.

[BoulderSooner79]

I think there is some truth to the comment that we held back plays so that future opponents (i.e. Texas) don't see them much. After that bubble screen to Johnson went the distance, it looked like we could run that all night with success. TCU stubbornly stuck to the same defense, but I don't think we even tried it again. We shouldn't have to show too much against Baylor either and I guarantee we'll be able to run against the bears.

[OU-HSV]

I certainly am happy with how successful we've been to this point. But it sure whould be nice to get some solid consistent week in/week out running game going as well. We'll need it eventually someday. Seems like Murray to this point hasn't lived up to the standard he set with his display last season. I think the knee injury has messed with him or something.
If some defense out there can stop/slow down our passing game we will need some run game. Period.

[StoopTroup]

I'm so sick of hearing the excuse "8 in the box" OSU doesnt' have any problems with 8 in the box. LSU doesn't have any problems with 8 in the box.

I was beginning to think we might actually be the best team in the country, but by the end of the game I realized we have some serious problems.

Our OL is not the best in the country. Its not he best in the Big 12.

What does a guy who serves as a porter on mountain-climbing expedition know about football anyway?

:pop:

Even after last nights game...TCU still ranks 6th in the NCAA in Total Defense.

OUrs is 15th.

What you saw last night were two really great Football Teams.

TCU didn't deserve to fall out of the Top 25 for losing to us either.

I think they should be at least 25th....they have an Offense...it just didn't work against us.

TCU will be ranked higher than oSu at Seasons End.

[swardboy]

:confused:
What is there to copy?How to stuff the run by playing eight men in the box and giving up 411 yards and 4TDs passing? If you don't realize that Bob went into stall mode ,then apparently you went to sleep midway through the third quarter.If you DID fall asleep,I don't blame you because I almost did. :)


Amen and Amen....

[bosworthsteroidmafia]

DM has been half a step away from breaking off HUGE runs on many plays this season. It's going to happen...


Demarco was trying to guard his knees on alot of these plays, it appeared he was scared.


Seems like Murray to this point hasn't lived up to the standard he set with his display last season. I think the knee injury has messed with him or something.



I agree with all of these sentiments and predict that DM gets on track tomorrow @ Baylor. He's seemed so close to really exploding like we all know he's capable of, but hasn't hit his stride, yet. Compared to last year, he has seemed a little tentative and perhaps a shade less quick/agile. I'm hoping that these first four games have gotten him into playing shape and that he's gaining confidence in that knee.

[Dan Thompson]

I thought the screen pass to MJ was just priceless.

[boomrsoonr]

I don't think Bob will pull out any secret plays unless he thinks he needs them. That is, if he has any at all.

I think the biggest wrinkle for teams this year is our no-huddle offense. By the time teams adjust, we've already put 21 points on the board. Then it's up to the defense to win the game while Bradford and WR (insert your favorite receiver's name here) play catch.

[Echoes]

I'm so sick of hearing the excuse "8 in the box" OSU doesnt' have any problems with 8 in the box. LSU doesn't have any problems with 8 in the box.

I was beginning to think we might actually be the best team in the country, but by the end of the game I realized we have some serious problems.

Our OL is not the best in the country. Its not he best in the Big 12.

Lol. Whoa there, rook. You might want to do some football 101 before you come in here posting.

8 stacked in the box matters, tremendously. Ask Peterson on the vikings. Anyone with an ounce of football knowledge will tell you the defense will dictate what you should do as far as regards to running.

If teams want to stack 8-9 in the box, fine. I'll take our 70 yards of running offense to go along with 411 yards of passing, pretty much in the first half. I would be willing to bet any smart coach won't load the box against us like that. They saw what it did to TCU in just one half.

Make no mistake, we could have hung 60 on TCU with ease.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Echoes and others I have a question...something me and another poster conversated about after the TCU game..

Sure AD faces a lot of D's with about everybody up on the line...But he has been very succesful against them obviously in the NFL...How do they do it?

I think the struggles OU had against TCU(and WVU) had to do more with speed on the D that was in the box more than just the fact of playing that many guys in "the box"

You've got 4 DL, 2 LBs, 3 corners and 2 safeties in their schemes(add an LB and take away a DL in the WVU scheme)....they send corners and safeties off the edges and our TE's and FB were just not moving fast enough to pick guys up....and the OL was losing one on one battles with their DL up front which was surprising....there was one play I replayed where the LG is standing there blocking nobody..I mean there is nobody around him and the rb gets tackled a couple of yards behind him....

Not complaining...I just think there are some things that can be done to have some success running the ball in these situations

[BoulderSooner79]

I think part of the answer is that we do not have a great run blocking line. There is a trade-off between run and pass blocking and we do have a great pass blocking line. But we are improved since last year in both areas. TCU was an interesting case because they seemed to concede we would win the game, but by gosh we were not going to run on them. The teams we care about want to win the game and will not make that trade-off. In the 3rd quarter against TCU, we seemed to respond with an attitude of "by gosh, we will run on you". I thought that was a mistake because when it didn't work I thought our players got frustrated and lost their edge. Then we tried some short passes and all of a sudden they weren't open either and Sam tried to force some throws and almost got picked a couple of times. Maybe that's what the coaches wanted as a learning tool - it's hard to say in a game that has been decided. I would rather see them stick with the game plan of taking what the defense gives because that's what is needed against a strong opponent. Or if we just want to call off the dogs, I'd rather see the second team players in there getting some meaningful reps.

[NormanPride]

Teams don't stack 8 in the box against LSU and the aggots as much as you'd like to think.

Also, lol at "holding us under 35" as a goal.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

watching it live, i thought its one of those games. watching the replay, i thought again that it was one of those games. our offense, whether we like it or not, is skewed to depend on the OL because of personnel. when they are misfiring, its going to be a long, long day.

my personal opinion is that the best running back to have in college is an elusive break people's ankles scat back. they make it so much simpler for the OL because unless all of them miss, he can make up for a lot of blocking flaws. this was why Q was so successful with a young OL. they would put him in space with one man to beat and he would make them look stupid. of course, the biggest issue with these types of backs is the lack of a home run threat which most coaches see as a bigger asset because of the pressure they apply to a defense (about the only coach i can think of that doesn't subscribe to this theory is mike leach and he doesn't believe in a non-forward pass). you see, for me, its yards that matter out of your feature back, not points. if you are a program like OU you can afford to have multiple tailbacks and can find someone to finish off drives inside the 20's, but finding that guy who can chew them up consistently between the 20's is the guy that is tough to find.

so back to TCU, our running backs are severely dependent on their OL executing at a high %. if just one guy misses their block, it escalates teh odds of blowing up the play significantly. however, if everyone executes perfectly, they all have the speed to go the distance. typically what we want to see is that one of our OL is lights out on a given day, 3 are good, and one ranges from average to bad. the key point is that their play is consistent so you can tweak in game to the guy who is playing well.

what we saw against TCU were 2 things - 1 was inconsistency and the 2nd is that someone was tipping the play.

first point, we saw different blockers (cause it wasn't just the OL) whiffing on different plays. that inconsistency made it hard to find anything that was working. you run one way and the guard gets blown up but the other side looks good. you run their way they both get blown up. you run outside, the TE whiffs. you run a delay and the interior gets blown up. i knew they were going to work them and work them in the 2nd half so i was like "game over".

second point, a couple of the tcu players were angling to the hole pre-snap (both linebackers to be exact). it happened on enough plays that i noticed and started watching for it (i was backing up the tivo trying to figure out who it was, but that level of detail was impossible from our craptacular camera angle). of course, it might have just been chuck long calling plays again - can't be sure on that one.

[TopDawg]

We might see a few teams throw in a little of TCU's gameplan here and there, but typically coaches have a philosophy that they think works, and they stick to it. KSU had some success knocking us around in years past, but that didn't mean that we suddenly saw a bunch of other teams copying KSU's scheme.

TCU's got some talent. It sounds like their weakness was at corner and we were able to expose that. If another team has really strong corners that they think can lock us down, I wouldn't be surprised to see them try that scheme from time to time...but it would probably be a scheme they went with fairly often anyway.

As TCU, and other teams, saw...it's a risky scheme. But if you can make it work, it's very effective no matter who you're playing.